I have been criticized by Scientology haters for not laying blame for the abuses and demise of the church of Scientology on L Ron Hubbard. Some have pointed to my refusal to credit the Fair Game Policy (SPs may be tricked, cheated, lied to, sued or destroyed without any recourse to Scientology justice) as being the chief motivating policy behind the evil and criminal deeds Miscavige’s Office of Special Affairs (OSA) and RTC routinely commit against those who refuse to comply with the dictator’s reign. My response was, and is, that 99% of staff, including the Sea Org, have not even heard of the Fair Game policy, so of course they do not apply it.
What then does justify the criminality demanded by Miscavige in the minds of those who feel they must comply? Certainly he lacks the charisma personally to make people want to harm others to protect him and his regime. While providing some assistance to Daniel’s defense preparation, I was asked by some people involved, “what makes these people (OSA) think what they are doing is ok”? It prompted me to do a little soul searching on the subject. I knew that I’d do something similar, perhaps not as over-the-top and vicious, if I were confronted with similar circumstances back in the day. What motivated me to comply? What justified my actions in working to destroy other human beings when I set up OSA and worked through it for so many years?
The answer was HCO PL 12 February 1967 The Responsibilites of Leaders.
Please note that LRH wrote the Policy Letter for the Org Executive Course, and issued it as Admin (Administration) Know How Series 13. He did not make it confidential. He did not issue it to the Guardian’s Office (predecessor of OSA).
The Responsibilities of Leaders is one of the more widely recognized and revered policy letters of the thousands LRH wrote.
While the policy letter sets forth some interesting and insightful principles concerning the subject of power, it has been abused by executives on many occasions throughout the years.
Miscavige used such an abuse as part of his own push toward power in the early eighties. A couple of Mission Holders, most notably one Kingsley Wimbush, used Responsibilities of Leaders as an integral part of a process called “De-dinging.” Wimbush would gather staff and public at the end of the evening in the course room of his mission. He would have them read The Responsibilities of Leaders. He would then insist that properly interpretted the policy required all of those who depended upon his “power” (all staff and public) to flow “power” to Wimbush. He told them that the power flow he desired was money, and he’d pressure the staff and public to fill his hat with bills, the larger the denominations the better.
With this information Miscavige grotesquely violated this provision of The Responsibilities of Leaders: So to live at all in the shadow or employ of a power, you must yourself gather and USE enough power to hold your own – without just nattering to the power to “kill Pete”, in straightforward or more suppressive veiled ways to him, as these wreck the power that supports yours.
Miscavige did so by writing the most exaggerated, alarming and vicious reports about Mission Holders. In fact, he used the Wimbush abuse of The Responsibilities of Leaders to unjustly paint dozens of Mission Holders with the same color. His reports were so “Kill Pete” in nature that he led LRH to believe the Mission Holders were in fact government operatives out to kill LRH.
Ironically, or perhaps predictably, once Miscavige rose to power through such shifts, he eschewed virtually all LRH policy, but for one: The Reponsibilities of Leaders. Apparently, Miscavige recognized how one (Wimbush for example) could get people to do the most irrational and off policy things by fixating their attention on this one policy.
Ironically, or perhaps predictably, Miscavige was obsessed with the very paragraph I quoted above. But, not the line I quoted. The rest of the parapraph, from point 6 of the 7 points about power:
He (the Power) doesn’t have to know all the bad news, and if he’s a power really, he won’t ask all the time, “What are all of those dead bodies doing at the door?” And if you are clever, you never let it be thought HE killed them — that weakens you and also hurts the power source. “Well, boss, about all those dead bodies, nobody at all will suppose you did it. She over there, those pink legs sticking out didn’t like me.” “Well,” he’ll say if he really is a power, “why are you bothering me with it if it’s done and you did it. Where’s my blue ink?” Or “Skipper, three shore patrolmen will be along soon with your cook, Dober, and they’ll want to tell you he beat up Simson.” “Who’s Simson?” “He’s a clerk in the enemy office downtown.” “Good. When they’ve done it, take Dober down to the dispensary for any treatment he needs. Oh yes. Raise his pay.” Or “Sir, could I have the power to sign divisional orders?” “Sure.”
Miscavige crammed me and ordered me to cram others on The Responsibilities of Leaders many times; all in the context of emphasizing the brutal, blind loyalty requirement aspect of it as outlined in the text cited above.
Miscavige and his wife Shelly required RTC executives to read several books on Simon Bolivar (the subject of The Reponsibilities of Leaders policy letter) to drive the point home.
Did anyone notice that one of the first Miscavige “re-issued” LRH books that was released in the late eighties after LRH’s death was the Ethics book, and that suddenly it had 12 pages of The Responsbilities of Leaders added? From thenceforth, DM’s control manual was required reading and a part of one’s hat, not only for staff but for public.
You don’t think it has become part of every corporate church Scientologist’s hat? Well, Miscavige also slipped it into Volume 0 of the OEC, the Basic Staff Hat.
I assure you it was David Miscavige who personally ordered The Responsibilities of Leaders into Vol 0 and into the Scientology Ethics book.
Now, recognize that while this policy was being crammed into the skulls of all Scientology executives, with particular emphasis on the segment that would suggest to some that committing crimes including murder is quite expected of anyone “on board”, Miscavige was busy turning the entire church PR and Marketing apparatus onto positioning David Miscavige as being the ultimate “Power” of Scientology. The guy who should have bodies slayed and disposed of quietly on his behalf by anyone who is “on board.”
As interpretted and applied by Corporate Scientology Responsibilities of Leaders in some ways is more nefarious than Fair Game. At least there were some boundaries with Fair Game. It was couched in the passive. That is “may be” lied to, cheated, sued…..”without recource” to Scientology justice. You also had to be declared SP to receive that treatment, and back in the day you could always get a comm ev to challenge the SP declare. Now, Miscavige only has to look at someone sideways, or express his displeasure about someone, or finger someone for execution – and the bots are expected to rally into action, by whatever means necessary, in order to protect the power they depend upon. Miscavige has slaughtered all Justice lines in the church and for going on twenty years there has not been a straight comm ev available for anything.
By any means necessary, towards anybody regardless of their status and worth, with no recourse possible.
I am not at this stage passing judgment on the wisdom of the inclusion of point Six of the seven points of power in the original policy letter. That may or may not be a debate at some time in the future. Fact of the matter is, to focus one’s attention on that passage exclusively, to make the policy (originally an Admin Know How policy) part of the Ethic of a Scientologist, to make it part of the Basic Staff Hat, while continuously berating all high level executives of the organization to apply it unquestioningly on behalf of the only recognized “Power” of Scientology, resulted in a lot of otherwise decent people doing a lot of ugly things to other people who didn’t deserve that treatement.
Moving On Up a Little Higher 
Thanks Marty,
This clears up a few things for me and pointedly answers the question – How can my friends still in act the way they are. The little person (I’m talking spiritually) is rewriting history without authorization.
His freedom to act without restraint is suicidal and is taking many others down with him. I appreciate your and others putting in some restraints.
Marty, what your pointing to here is true enough. And it may be a large part of the current mindset. But add to that the fact that before DM there was a mindset which allowed and encouraged the type of behavior shown recently in regards to Daniel. Its the belief that organized Scientology is the only chance that mankind has. It encourages blind obedience and unconcienable acts. The end justifies the means. Its narcissistic in the extreme. Its been that way for a long time. Fair Game policy set the tone and worked in concert with an authoritarian structure. I would give the positioning of the responsibility of leaders PL a more recent reinforcement and supporting role.
I dont think LRH’s intention was bad. But his actions were extreme. The results of what he put in place organizationally were not worth the price of the expansion they championed. The current scene evidences this clearly enough.
Worse than Fair Game? Hard to say. Its all extreme and bound to fall eventually. Fortunately the tech will survive.
Interesting and telling.
I remember it well from the ISE book but I never had an SP playing Power-monger…fortunately for me!
Well Marty,
Just be thankful the little cretin probably hasn’t read R2-45 yet!
Seriously though I think it’s a combination of Simon Bolivar and Message to Garcia by another Hubbard, maybe a little of ‘The Charge of the Light Brigade’ and probably ‘The Prince’ that has replaced policy under his Satanic Majesty.
Of course we both know Miscavige is more literal than literary minded because of his low IQ and button on self importance so he probably has one or two people “advising” or more likely duping him which is why some us dare call it a “conspiracy”.
Yeah, I’m a Scientologists of 30 years and never heard of no Fair Game in Scientology before I checked the Internet and heard it from those who can’t stand our high ARC . They know all better than we do, don’t they?
Wow, what a timely post! I was just talking with someone today from an org over the phone, asking questions of them – and this reference was the one given to me regarding injustices within the Church! It must be that is the internal PR line being given to staff, outer-org trainees who go to Flag, etc. Unbelievable. Does anyone have an early edition of the ethics book to show? Also, I saw the IAS event this past weekend (shaking my head in disbelief as I now completely see through the charade, and even laughing at it out loud in the room), I noticed that whereas several years ago Freedom Medal winners always thanked LRH of course, but now each and every one thanks COB first. I’m sure the acceptance speech approval committee makes sure to that it is thrown in there if accidentally left out by the recipient…
Abso-fucking-lutely. In fact “pink-legs” became it’s own slang term on the PAC base (originated by non other than the RTC Reps Mr. Tyrer and Mr. Cuelo) meaning “do whatever needs to be done to handle the situation, even if you have to violate policy, and nobody has to know about it, and don’t bother me with the details, you are violating policy be even putting it on my lines” according to Reaponsibilities of Leaders.
While anyone could read LRH’s story about Manuela Saenz and Simon Bolivar and get that LRH was talking about how she could have applied the points of the policy within the context of THEIR moral code and the political climate of their region, it nonetheless was rather confusing to M9 that article on LOC and understand what I was supposed to be taking from it.
I mean it pretty much is one long story on how it is okay to be criminal as long as you are supporting a power – right smack dab on the LOC course (what USED to be the authoritative course on Ethics on Scientology – and is now “old” and “not used anymore”). It makes sense as an AKH series. It CAN be applied usefully by administrators. But as an ETHICS reference it is SOOOO non-sequiter.
How do you get 20 auditors in the chair? Pink legs. (illegal transfers)
How do you WDAHs back over 200? Pink legs. (deliver touch assists in the HGC)
How do you open all the course rooms at PAC? Pink legs. (have SO orgs Sup each others courserooms just for the hell of it. Not enough sups to open all the course rooms and not enough students in the orgs to need the extra course rooms. But who cares! It’s an order! Pink legs it!
How do you fill up the course rooms with students? Pink legs baby! Cancel all study time and put all staff on recovery call in.
Don’t bother writing a report, that wouldt be pink legs now would it?
This certainly rings true from my experience being on staff in a Class IV Org in the mid-80s, and being public at Class V Orgs in the 90s. Of all of Scientology’s Codes, Creeds and policies which could have been emphasized and held up as examples of the real meaning of leadership and management in Scientology (The Credo of a Good and Skilled Manager comes to mind, as well as Personal Integrity and What is Greatness), it is remarkable that Miscavige chose “The Responsibilities of Leaders” as his guiding philosophy. It certainly helps to explain the trajectory of Scientology organizations these last 25 years.
Marty, I don’t know if you caught this, but some time in the late 80s or 90s, a stand-alone booklet of “The Responsibilities of Leaders”** was produced and sold in Scn bookstores, and was required reading (M-9ing in fact) on the “Key to Life Course”. And who wants to bet that it’s also part of the new “Leadership and Competence” course on the Freewinds that they teach Scientology kids?
It’s really just so twisted. Could you imagine if leaders of Christian churches today started using Jesus’ famous quote from the Bible below, as their guiding principle for their religion, as Miscavige appears to have done for Scientology?
“Do not think that I have come to bring peace on earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s foes will be those of his own household.”
– Matthew 10:34-36
**http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=116119&item=180581674573
I remember that someone in the Int Landlord Office made a little statue/trophy type thing that had pink legs sticking out from beneath a curtain on a black base with a sign that said “Pink Legs.” It was the oddest thing I ever saw in 27 years in the S.O. and I never really knew what the hell it was supposed to signify even though I had read the Simon Bolivar PL many times and love it as one of LRH’s most powerful and interesting writings.
Of course, DM and a few others over the years took LRH’s penchant for turning a phrase to make a point in a creative manner and interpreted it literally without any slightest sense of everything else he wrote in policy or the basics of ARC. Just like fundamentalist Christians or Muslims can use a single line from the Bible or the Koran to justify any evil purpose they want to dramatize, so too have some in the Scientology movement used that bit of the Simon Bolivar PL to justify any damn thing they wanted done to others.
My argument against those who want to blame it all on LRH is that we were all covered by the same PLs but 99% of us never did any of the stuff DM has done, justified by those same PLs.
Does that make DM a bigger being than the rest of us or simply a nastier one?
//My response was, and is, that 99% of staff, including the Sea Org, have not even heard of the Fair Game policy, so of course they do not apply it.//
Huh? Well, I don’t know about the current SO, but I assure you that during the period of time from when the policy was written and when I departed in 1982 both the disconnect policy and Fair Game were widely known and used in the LRH-run Scientology. The Fair Game policy less so because, in my view, most staff had neither the desire or resources to attempt to compromise people who had been “declared”.
As for Kinglsey Wimbush and the whole “de-dinging” thing… you got it wrong there. What Kingsley did was to try and apply a specific procedure to the daily “dings” he observed people getting as a matter of regular contact with others. He tried to persuade me to initiate a similar program in my mission and so I went to Santa Clara and observed the whole process. There was none of what you say… particularly the bit about Kingsley attempting to set himself up as the ‘power source’ and get people to donate money directly to him. Wimbush was declared by Miscavige at the SFO Mission Conference in 1982 for the simple reason that DM and the RTC wanted the reserves held in the Mission accounts. The ‘de-dinging’ thing was harmless and if it was some sort of out-tech then it could have been easily handled without removing a productive Mission Holder who had flowed hundreds of people and millions of dollars up to Orgs and Flag.
I understand you have an unfailing dedication to the image of Hubbard as the source of pure Scientology Tech but frankly for many of us Miscavige was the end point of our misadventure, not the beginning or the journey. Hubbard was the guy who created policies like the disconnection policy and he created the RPF and the Sea Org along with the huge potential it has for abuse… much of it realized after his death, but plenty of the abuses occurring on his watch.
Personally, I don’t see why anyone would demand you blame Hubbard unless they are part of the clique who desire to see Scientology (and I assume all other belief systems and self-help organizations) destroyed. On the other hand, why sugar-coat it? Hubbard created the policies and the very organizations that morphed into the warped and demented senior management groups you, Rinder and many other ex-Scn folks worked for over the decades. While it appears to be true that Miscavige has taken it to an art form whereas Hubbard merely got ill and passed away it’s still his baby, his creation. All of it.
I appreciate many of the things I read here while also finding some of them naive and petty. The bottom line is not that Hubbard was a bad man… because I don’t know that… but that this guy Miscavige is a bad guy and he still has some sort of eerie grip on many of our friends and family. And I don’t see how you can separate the two… Miscavige or Hubbard. Hubbard made it, died, and now Miscavige has hit the thrusters and taken abuse of staff and demands for public donations to stratospheric levels.
L. Ron Hubbard will always be the guy who created the apparatus that David Miscavige uses to abuse people. Good luck trying to keep them separate.
I totally agree but I think there is more than just this point to it, it is really a lot of things together, I know in my case the overriding factor was lack of data to truly evaluate things. In the same style as in Stalin’s USSR, people disappear, or are removed and or disciplined and most people have no clue of why, the only data ever given is by HCO and it is to use someone as a “head on a pike”.
Church management is not just obsessed with image and PR to Public, but internally too. The need to know access of information is really a tool used to blunt one’s ability to reach correct conclusions. Add to this the constant inval, the constant pressure, (Stats, not letting the team down, etc) the shortage of sleep and the fact that so many sane and sterling people seem to accept insanity as logical, (I suspect majority secretly wonders but caves to peer pressure) and you get a pretty powerful mind-bending, peer-pressure based, self-administered control mechanism that truly blinds you .
In my opinion it all boils down to 2 things really: Personal integrity lack of, and the stupid dependence of authority to interpret scripture. These both can be seen in other religious political and even scientific movements, and even in every day micro politics (workplace “the boss said” sheep following attitudes).
Knowing what you know and saying this is wrong, illogical or criminal takes a great deal of courage and responsibility, not to mention self confidence and certainty. For all that they insist on their certainty, they are really lacking appallingly, as evidenced by their willingness to justify such horrid and obvious crimes.
After all if you are wrong it’s your neck sticking out.
LRH wondered in many occasions, “Why is your neck so much more precious than mine?” I think this is really where it all starts. I know it was so for me for a while. Mart y and people here are saying what they see and sticking their necks out, far far out. It is that willingness to say what you see, honestly in spite the risk of being wrong and shot from guns that everyone who wishes to find truth and make it out of any trap needs. It is the willingness to trust your observation but to also admit you goofed when you know you did, most people lack enough of that to prevent psychopaths from destroying so any lives.
I am so tracking on this with you Marty. It is at the heart of why I am behind you.
Your above article is just another perfect example of how DM’s intentions and actions have perverted such a worthy subject, turning it into a force for evil instead of for good. How relatively obscure policies can be emphasized (and used with an intent to suppress), while others which are much more central and core to the subject, can be ignored and forgotten.
When I first saw Miscavige up on that stage after LRH’s death and then on the Ted Koppel show after the Time article in 1991, I remember wondering to myself: This guy is leading Scientology?
And I secretly hoped that one day he would get some case gain and cognite on what the subject was all about — because clearly this guy was misguided. Little did I know how deep his confusion (and, as it turns out, even masochism) went.
What differentiates a “hater” from a “critic” of Scientology?
I ask because I find “hater” to be a pretty strong, invalidating kind of term that gets you into the “Haters! Y’all just jellus!” mindset. I’m assuming that you’re using it to its full potential, as it were… (i.e. knowing fully the impact because it’s a response in kind)
I agree with some aspects of Scientology and not others, but I don’t tend to bring it here, because it’d be the moral equivalent for me of crapping in your sandbox. For me, it’s simply not the place for it.
That kind of mixed agreement may stick me in with the “haters” … but I do appreciate a clarifying / defending response to criticism
Good post. It’s funny, because when I was “flowing power” up the org board, I felt it was LRH I was flowing to, but when you look at it, LRH was gone and of course, the only one left standing was Diminutive Dave. As a Sea Org member, I would blindly flow power up the org board.
I was on mission in the Kingsly Wimbush mission (Stevens Creek) right after he blew from there. De-Dinging was ridiculous. The staff all had to pay heavily to Kingsly for all of their “dings” to him, so they had to pass the “billing” for dings down the org board. It got so ridiculous that public, who “dinged the staff”, had to cook or do laundry for the staff if they couldn’t afford to fork over the cash. I was infuriated.
And then I found out that all the time Kingsly had the de-dinging going he never paid LRH roylaties for the books sold by STC. He kept the royalties as well!! What a bum.
So like DM, Kingsly believed in power being flowed to him, but not to the true power which make Kingsly and DM real SPs.
ML Tom
I’m glad you brought up this subject of how the crimminality and destructive behavior escalated to what it is today in Scientology. I will start by saying I am not an L Ron Hubbard hater. I am also not an L Ron Hubbard adorer either. I just want to bring up personal knowledge that I have concerning Miss Cabbag’s odd behavior of abusing staff. The behavior of attacking staff DID NOT start with Miss Cabbage or Marty R or anyone else. Here is how it started from my eye wittness account. The year was 1982. The majority of International management (Exec Strata and CMO INT) had been removed from post. Out of that group of people there were two of them that really irritated L Ron personally. The two people I am refering to here is John Attack and David Mayo. For those who were around in 1983, there was RTC Conditions Order #1, a Com Ev on about 12-18 people. The exact number that comes to mind was about 18, but on this I could be mistaken but it was an unsual amount of people on the bill of particulars. I was either a member or secretary of that comm ev that went on for months. During this time RTC as well as ASI and CMOI would send up weekly reports to L Ron on the state of affairs with Int Mgmt ..etc. A report was sent to him each week concerning the comm ev and L Ron would often order this or that investigation of the people being comm ev’d. John Attack was the Exec Strata person over Div 6 activities and L Ron pretty much hated John and I understand hate is a strong word but so were the circumstances. To make a long story short, I read an advice from L Ron to Miss Cabbage ordering him to spit in John’s face and tell him that was from L. Ron. Miss Cabbage complyed with his order and reported the result. I saw the advice that came back to the compliance report of spitting in John’s face and L Ron was very pleased to here the news and escalated the situation by suggesting someone should slap the hell out of John Attack. Sure enough, as John was held by others, John was beaten by Miss Cabbage. Similar degrading actions were taken with David Mayo and this soon spread to others deemed to be SP’s. Prior to this it was unheard of at least by me for any staff member to attack another staff member. In fact it was a serious ethics offence to attack a fellow staff member. I knew Miss Cabbage before he was asked by L Ron to attack staff. He NEVER put a hand on any staff member period and I knew him for years prior to his orders to attack staff members. His wife Shelly would also encourage other executives to abuse staff in this manner and if they didn’t they were accused of having their finger falter on the trigger of a gun. In other words, pull the trigger. God only knows what the hell she was talking about but there you have it. It is so important to have the truth known so that people are not confused.
The Blind leading the Blind was meant for DM himself!! My way or the highway is the MO of DM. He really is deaf, dumb and blind. He will crumble like a castle built on sand. Just a matter of time, tick tock tick tock.
The biggest crime DM is committing is that he is leading staff and the public to a dead end road with very little wiggle room out.
He will continue to pervert the tech and order insane orders.
Very interesting.
Concerning those in more passive ranges. like the visitors of an event there is an addidional factor to be looked at:
The fact of being part of a group or being present in a group induces in many an impulse to be in agreement with the others. (to have a common Reality) Therefore a group does have – or can develop – a hypnotic quality.
From that derives a healing question to restore self-determinism:
“What have you agreed with?”
Thank you, Marty, for doing the job you do.
Worsel
David Miscavige is a blind bull raging about wildly in a china shop especially damaging because in his insanty he thinks of himself as a GOD.
He is blind to his own thuggery, his own SADISM, his own DRACHONIAN punishments and abuse while he daily dramatizes his EVIL PURPOSES BY ORGANIZING CRIME, LITERALLY CRIMINALS ACTS DAY IN AND DAY OUT.
Some of his most Sadistic physical abuse has been to veteran Sea Org members~~
1) Debbie Cook, Captain of FSO
For the next twelve hours Debbie was made to stand in a large garbage can and face one hundred people screaming at her demanding a confession as to her “homosexual tendencies”. While this was going on water was poured over her head. Signs were put around Debbie’s neck, one marked in magic marker “LESBO” while this torture proceeded. Debbie was repeatedly slapped across the face by other women in the room during the interrogation. Debbie never did break. And fittingly she was rewarded with what turned out to be a break in another sense of the word.
Read more
https://markrathbun.wordpress.com/category/debbie-cook/
2) Heber Jentzsch, Former President of Churchof Scientology International, in lock down in “SP Hole” for going on 7 years.
Mike Rinder quote:
Heber bore the brunt of much of Miscavige’s ire over the years. I have seen Miscavige strike Heber on at least 10 occasions. Miscavige had dolls made in the likeness of Heber (and me). These were very elaborate reproductions that looked like ventriloquists dolls. Miscavige would make Heber sit with the doll on his lap and Miscavige would address himself to the doll instead of talking to Heber directly. This was to demonstrate the “fact” that Miscavige thought Heber “wooden” and “unresponsive.”
b)
I only saw Heber snap once, when after hours of Miscavige brand taunting and belittling ™, Miscavige squirted Heber’s face and glasses with contact lense fluid and then blew powdered coffee creamer into his face. This is the level of behavior of the so called “leader” of Scientology.
c)But that wasn’t all that happened at IAS event time. Heber, along with myself and Guillaume Lesevre were assigned to MEST work. It was surreal, donning a tuxedo to do an international event and then a boilersuit to do MEST work in the woods next to the Saint Hill Manor lake. And then being thrown fully clothed in the lake (in November). Miscavige then decided it wasn’t good enough to be “hidden” by the lake and moving us to do MEST work next to the Stables where all Saint Hill staff walked to eat their meals. It was there that Heber slipped on a log, fell and quite badly injured himself. Of course, Miscavige blamed that on Heber’s “out ethics”.
Read more
https://markrathbun.wordpress.com/2010/04/04/free-heber/
3)
Mike Rinder
35 year veteran, Church Spokesman, held Watch Dog Committee posts.
Beaten, punched, assaulted, head smashed on table, kicked, made to live out in the brush on Oliver Twist slop, all communication cut off to family and INT base, with only a garden hose to shower.
Read more
https://markrathbun.wordpress.com/2009/09/18/mike-rinder/
4) Marc Yager
Marc Headley reported ~~
I saw another post about DM (David Miscavige) beating up on (mike rinder) Rinder. Well I have personally seen DM beat the living shit out of Rinder at least 10 times over the course of a year. That was only the times I saw it. I can tell you that there were proabably another 10X that behind closed doors. Other people that I have seen him punch/slap and or throw to the ground: Marc Yager, Mark Ingber, Ray Mitoff, Rick Cruzen, Jeff Hawkins, Jason Bennick, G. Leserve. One time a girl from the Film Area was told to run Yager down in her car – and she complied – she drove after him and to get out of the way he jumped over a wall and broke his friggin ankle
That’s right, the “Head” of the Church, orders the Commanding Officer of CMO INT to be run over by a moving vehicle. Miscavige ORDERED it
Read more
https://markrathbun.wordpress.com/2010/05/30/marc-yager-and-the-ias/
While some of the above may be repetitive, I want Law Enforcement reading this site , who have been inundated with reports continue to DIGEST and EVALUATE the scene, to keep reading the facts……
In the normal business world, in any normal world, good people are rewarded for production, bad hats are punished. It is called Carrot and Sticking.
You produce, you contribute, you hold a job, you get bonuses, you get promoted, you are appreciated, the carrots are yours for contributing.
MISCAVIGE IS ONLY STICK, ONLY DIRE THREATS, ONLY DOMINATION, ONLY OVERWHELM
He plays Judge, Jury and Executioner and GOD
DM does not EMPOWER, he uses Drachonian Punishments and a stick ONLY
Hence all of Marketing Gone !
Most of RTC execs ~~ Gone !
CMOI ~~ gone !
CMO Gold ~~ Gone !
Mission Holder Network of any significance~~ Gone !
Good Field auditors ~~ Gone !
etc etc etc
Miscavige being an insane THUG in a leadership position fails to understand that he can command their Labor. He can command their hands.
But he will never BUY or truly COMMAND their Hearts and Spirits.
DM can never buy anyone’s HEART, SPIRIT or LOYALTY.
Who will be the next to blow ?
That is very thoughtful that people that DO TRULY criticize the hallmarks of our modern day Church of Scientology ALWAYS refer back to the exact LRH reference those hallmarks are in direct contrast to.
In my opinion that is the only way to tell the difference between an actual person that knows reform is needed in the church and someone just dramatizing words.
Thanks again Marty for your insight.
It is the responsibility of true leaders to lead the way.
Is DM that? I don’t think so.
Marty,
It is always refreshing to read your posts.
I was in GOWW in the late 1970’s, in the wake of Jane Kember (Guardian WW) and Mary Sue Hubbard (Controller) going to jail. At the time the org was consumed in their legal defense and raising money (Safe Environment Fund) for their legal defense.
Following their conviction and the unmock of the Guardians Office, there were various handlings done on the staff there (I think Mike Rinder was the Mission I/C for the clean up/reorg).
Part of the handling was Group Engram running, which was in vogue at the time. From this we came up with the false datum of “The end justifies the means”.
That datum seems to still permeate the Sea Org.
I think as staff, we had any overts or violations of the law that we committed justified by the fact that our intention was “to help people” and work for the “greatest good”. At the time, 2/3rds of the GOWW staff were in England illegally as there was a ban on Scientologists entering the country. So, at the outset we were breaking the law by being there, but because we felt the ban was unjust, it opened the door for any other action we felt was justified in expanding Scientology.
I agree with your reference of the RESPONSIBILITY OF LEADERS HCOPL. I have confronted SO members with the abuses of David Miscavige and for the most part, even if they agree that the beatings or other abuses are in fact true, they are justified by this PL and “pink legs”.
Also the idea that the higher that you go on the Org Board, the more your “faults” are “magnified” and somehow forgiven.
Mark
There have been various comments, including my own, on how come “we” (“us” on this blog, individually) didn’t look, didn’t resist, didn’t leave earlier. Without speaking for everyone, the trust and certainty in LRH and his tech played a dominant role. It developed from the application of that tech. This is, if you like, the “passive” (endure it) side of the coin.
You bring up the “active” side of the coin. While I still do my own soul searching on this point without completely seeing eye to eye with you on it yet, I do remember the “use” or abuse of this PL. I definitely remember the time when “execs” used it, quoted and demanded its “application ” (in a certain way) in order to gain compliance, tackle nonsense targets in often bizarre and “heroic” ways.
Not everybody has worked in or for OSA or the GO (though I did for 5 years in the 70’s) and still, corporate Scientologists as a whole tend to behave in a similar way. That their actions, their “PR” defenses and attacks (and inaction, when they should speak up) are self-destructive, ridiculous and abhorrent is obvious to everyone looking at it from the outside – not to those inside. And if they do, they often don’t say it or only say it behind a cupped hand.
OSA, seen in proportion with the entirety of “corporate Scientology” seems like a very small group making so much noise to enturbulate the rest of the group to act insanely. And the actions/inactions of Scientologists at large become increasingly insane. Various estimates and calculations on the real size of Scientology exist and one of these figures says that there are only about 50,000 Scientologists worldwide. Let’s take the famous 2.5% of this figure and you end up with 1,250 people. The posted OSA people won’t be that many but take the various helpers from public, lawyers and PI’s and that figure is conceivable. That OSA has become thoroughly suppressive is quite obvious to me even though I have experienced and seen, first hand, only a small fraction of the actions I have read about on this and other blogs and books.
OSA has become the Gestapo within Scientology and uses personnel and ethics lines to control its own people as well. It does act like a SP and order others (HCO, PIs etc.) to enforce certain actions it wants done while remaining “hidden”. It’s actions are not subject to scrutiny by the org and Scientologists at large but only by its own. “The criminal leading the criminals”. It’s an “inner circle” within the inner circle.
What you describe is to me like the reason behind the reasons that was used to make that network a suppressive network – trying to make the rest to look and act more and more like itself.
I’m not at the point to actually “know” but it definitely is conceivable to me.
It is one of the basic questions of critics: would Scientology be any different today if DM hadn’t taken the helm? Is the path of the Independent Movement doomed to end up with the same result?
This kind of analysis is useful in suggesting there is hope for positive change. It also suggests a time in the future where the body of Scientology philosophy might be, for lack of a better word, re-calibrated to its ideal. The crap that has crept (or been forced) in gets put in its proper place.
I, for one, don’t hold that the golden era (not the DM version of the term) of Scientology (say in the 60’s and 70’s) was particularly wonderful or impactful, though it is clear many here do and that’s fine with me. And a “return to the fundamentals” Scientology (including an unambiguous cancellation of Fair Game) would certainly be preferable to the joke it has become today.
This PL had also been pushed in CL5 Org I had been staff. Also with the purpose that we do all without question what is ordered. But as usual people and especially non scientologists interpret policy only word by word.
For me this PL is an essay on 3rd dynamic power lines. These are not anything virtual but actual things. Let give me a sample: I had been sitting next to a registrar 0t7. I had been in the back office writing letters. Had a power line to him that ran through the hallway from my office to his office. If someone did accidentally step on this line he stumbled over this line. We had this line powered up especially on thursday morning.
And maybe cause he has only an literal understanding of LRH he now has only MEST. That is the trap he is in.
That’s a nice generalisation you’re using there Marty – “Scientology hater”. You’re grouping everyone who is critical of the subject of Scientology together under one term, dismissing us as “haters”. The implication being that hatred is such a destructive emotion that any criticism that emanates from a “hater” must be warped, biased, bigoted and without logic.
You surely would agree that LRH did write some words which in the cold light of day sound quite dreadful. At the very least you have to admit that it has been extremely easy for DM to use those words to enable him to behave in the cruelest of ways. To dismiss anyone who sees a link between some of the words of the former, with some of the actions of the latter as a “hater” is unfair.
Would you be happy to be described as a “Church of Scientology hater” or a “David Miscavige hater”? If you saw those terms in Freedom Magazine you would object I’m sure.
Here is some other LRH policy that Miscavige might have mis-used…
“If attacked on some vulnerable point by anyone or anything or any organization, always find or manufacture enough threat against them to cause them to sue for peace.”
Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 15 August 1960, Dept. of Govt. Affairs
“The purpose of the suit is to harass and discourage rather than to win. The law can be used very easily to harass, and enough harassment on somebody who is simply on the thin edge anyway, well knowing that he is not authorized, will generally be sufficient to cause his professional decease. If possible, of course, ruin him utterly.”
A MANUAL ON THE DISSEMINATION OF MATERIAL, 1955
“People attack Scientology, I never forget it, always even the score. People attack auditors, or staff, or organisations, or me. I never forget until the slate is clear.”
MANUAL OF JUSTICE, 1959
“This is the correct procedure: Spot who is attacking us. Start investigating them promptly for felonies or worse using our own professionals, not outside agencies. Double curve our reply by saying we welcome an investigation of them. Start feeding lurid, blood sex crime actual evidence on the attackers to the press. Don’t ever tamely submit to an investigation of us. Make it rough, rough on attackers all the way.”
Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 25 February 1966
There will be more people that will be leaving {blowing}.
Conditions such as the one’s described here rival those of Idi Amin {minus of course the executions of the transgressors}.
It is tragic that David Miscavige is allowed to carry on this way. Eventually, technologically and with advanced electronic equipment {perhaps some that already exists and is in use in the church} someone will eventually video tape DM in a fit of rage and bring the video to the Police and let them decide if he is right or wrong for what he’s doing. There can be ways to do this. Wirelessly perhaps with someone capturing the transmission to a portable disc just outside the INT base?
But concentrating on the fact that he never gets caught is what makes a lot of people feel like it is a hopeless cause.
It is fine to try to save LRH but when you look at other policies he wrote you can see whole-heartedness mixed with brutality. More of this brutality can be observed in the ethics book. The example when he told he beated the bad boy with judo. Maybe it was a solution than but it is certainly not a pattern one gives if one does not want others to act with the same cruelty maybe against innocents as well. Take a look at KSW. The stellar example for “do not look, do not think, obey”.
If I examine only the KR system – which could be good in itself – I observed countless times that people writing KRs in an attitude of the undercover informer OTs are not exception. And there are much more. I used to live in communism so I know the very similarities much better than people grown up in the west. Why are you treated like a criminal by ethics even in a far off mission from Miscavage? The people there does not know about the cruelty of the Big Boss. And how could it be that just a couple of paragraphs that you quote overwrite the volumes they’ve read from LRH?
Scientology as a whole administrative system make people dramatize suppressive regimes. Does not make a difference if it was an intentionally built up that way or not.
And that is the reason why the real great people of history was full of peace against all else. And you should recognise Marty that LRH was exactly the opposite when for example he asked the question “where the peacefullness of the early christians (or maybe buddhists?) led to” referring to their mass murder throughout history (I think this is also from the Ethics book).
My conclusion is that the reason behind people putting up with DM stems from PTSness and robotism coupled with lack of education.
An SP like DM spends a long time learning the art of suppression. Most thetans are good and put little attention on evil, entheta and its mechanics.
Thus almost the only ones educated in evil are evil.
Apparantly Super Power is a powerful deoppression tech. One need hardly wonder why it hasn’t been delivered.
Perhaps if it could be reconstructed and delivered in the independent field we would have a powerful tool against DM.
Hi Steve
I still have all my Scientology books, including the Tech Volumes and OEC Volumes, that I acquired in the late 70’s and early 80’s. What would you like to know?
Marty,
This a very good post and explains a lot.
I never interpreted in Ksw or responsibilities of leader Policy or any other Lrh writing those evil things that critics or non-intelligent people were reading literally in it.
When one applies study tech correctly and always judge the writings of Lrh in Relation to the goal of the philosophy etc…one can easily understand those writing as metaphers and not meant literally, and then it makes a lot of sense and is in fact “common sense”.
It’s the same about a hammer, it’s purpose is to build houses and not to kill people, but some people will only see in it (the sps) a tool to kill people.
You give them a hammer and they’ll kill people, you give them the Arc triangle and they’ll use it to cheat people, you give them KSW and they use it to control other people and use them as slaves. You give them auditing Tech and they use it to have power over people and extort their money.
Didn’t Lrh explain that ?
In the moment I have some huge problems in my life I’m sorting out. Since I decided to get out of the church and now I’m out I was decopressing a lot and also deptsing, so all the problems as an individual I had for the last 36 years are vanishing as I just can apply some simple Scientology tech onto it.
Day by day I’m becoming more OT and all the problems I wanted to handle on the OT_Levels ( problems that were created by my own group, as I constantly was in disagreement the way Scientology was applied) are just vanishing by applying some simple Scientology.
This situation is quite confusing for me as I ask myself what the hell did I do the last 36 years ???????
I had problems that didn’t exist and was sitting on the most precious tools to handle it but didn’t use them !!!!!
Just some basic tools .
That’s quite interesting ! Isn’t it ?
thanks for your help.
Mark, Thanks for this bit of history. Having been involved in the GO re-org, disband, and OSA form-up your observations jibe with mine.
Jesse, Thanks. First, I am sure you are talking about John Aczel and not John Atack. LRH didn’t know John Atack from a ground hog. Part of the picture you are missing is what was being sent directly to LRH from DM out of the then-LA unit Special Project (later to become ASI). That is where the reports concerning “All Clear” were sent – not via the Int base. That is where the grand conspiracy reports were sent from. Including the fact that Aczel and Mayo were clearly on the payroll of FBI and APA.
Good point Tom.
“Including the fact that Aczel and Mayo were clearly on the payroll of FBI and APA.”
Marty, do you mean Aczel and Mayo ACTUALLY WERE on the payroll of FBI / APA? Or that the grand conspiracy reports sent to LRH saying that those two were on the payroll of FBI / APA were LIES?
Just Me
A critic might listen to answers or explanations for their continual barrage of critical questions and commentary, and perhaps those answers might effect his or her views. A hater just keeps pouring it on. Every answer or explanation, or any context provided, merely reinforces his or her hateful viewpoint.
Wow! I am clearly aware of this attitude (though I haven’t heard the “pink legs” – wasn’t at PAC. But the ATTITUDE crossed the Atlantic, boy!
Sugar coat? Read the post my friend. One policy to the exclusion of thousands of others. As Jesse points out – and Chuch Beatty has too – LRH wrote some hateful and aggressive despatches in the early eighties. His wife was going to jail, all board members of the mother church were going to jail, the DOJ had two grand juries outstanding trying to send him to jail. So, perhaps some ‘ends justify the means’ policies were emphasized at THAT TIME. To take an emergency situation, and turn it into STANDARD OPERATING POLICY, is not only suppressive it is a form of mind control. I suggest you work on your differentiation skills my friend.
I’m not a Scientology admin scholar at all, never having been on staff. But it seems to me that messes like the one Marty describes above involve a huge degree of individuation of the group’s members from other groups. Before individuation there was faith, frustration and failure.
Before all that there was high ARC – affinity, reality and communication. Then somewhere along the line, after the high ARC, ‘blind obedience’ (using Loki’s term) was required.
Blind obedience requires high affinity and high reality. But it usually doesn’t involve high communication, at least not two-way communication.
Which leads to the conclusion that if a group’s members are not encouraged to communicate and to disagree and have no means of communicating or disagreeing, this is the mess we always get. As others have said more succinctly: Power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Although every group needs policies, those policies should be subject to its more senior core principles. What are the principles that could have stopped this mess?
Just Me
Dan, thanks for this. You nailed it.
Margaret, Right on.
Right on.
RJ, I think you’ve outliined the totality of his policy schema, exactly.
Within the realm of spiritual knowledge, some Spiritualists have had a rather simple litmus test to determine if a being is benign, or a “demon”.
The test is simply, “Can they do an honest day’s work?”
Within the context of Scientology, LRH explicitly said “Hat, don’t hit.”. The primary discovery underlying this was that a being without a constructive purpose went criminal, and quickly sank in to Treason. And it was the executives above that activity that were responsible for the hats, and post purposes of the activities.
This current scene is nothing more than over-the-top white collar criminality. But then if you are reading this, you already know that… 🙂
O.M.G.
An “essence” of all of this had always been around, even in the 90’s just before I came on staff. “Make it go right”… at all cost. But “pink legs” as a term and policy? Nuttier than a fruitcake.
It totally justifies all the squirel behavior in the orgs because, well, their following policy now aren’t they? There’s your reference, ain’t it? Ron wrote it, didn’t he? Too bad they all have a misunderstood on RESPONSIBILITY!!!! Kinda hard to get much futher in the PL when you don’t have a freakin’ clue. “Of course I know what responsibility is, everyone knows.” Really? Then why bother reading the PL?
Marty, you are so spot on. Dead-agenting has nothing to do with the behavior that I’ve seen over the years. People had the wrong Why. It’s right on right here: Misapplication and Misunderstoods on the ethics tech. And you know what that means.
We’ve created a monster.
Mark, great points some of which I have seen too.
As an aside: now I’m positive you have been a GO Sup in the late 70’s which is where I know you from (the course room was located on the immediate right down the path to the chapel).
Margaret,
Holy Shit! on the Jesus quote.
Jesse,
I am very disinclined to believe that Ron ever ordered anyone to spit in anyone’s face or order them slapped. Based on what I know of Ron from his lifetime of work, his writings, his lectures, and my correspondences with him, I am much more inclined to believe that someone altered his communications or simply fabricated reports.
Marty, I’ve always found it unfortunate, when some says …my friend … When clearly that is not the intention.
Ensifer isn’t your friend at least doesn’t curry your favor, thus why call him friend.
I knew the de-dinging stuff is Kingsley and it had to do with getting rid of the daily and sadly incessant times staff and public were dinged … Times someone either yelled, slammed, made less of, appeared to gossip about you … The stuff orgs and missions found in too much quantity.
It’s impossible for me not to agree with Ensifer. Leadership, good leadership, works tirelessly to use it’s power to the benefit of others, so that they have peace and prosperity.
And, to my mind, doesn’t issue policies which could be used as a means to bludgeon others. Even if only 98% take the policy to that extreme.
Furthermore, ultimately we owe any power we have to ourselves and to our own recognition that we are basically good and therefore trustworthy. That we need not default to aggression, jealousy, pride.
Our lives our ours. To imply or encourage anything else is to ultimately have a flock of sheep and slaves.
Love,
WH.
@ Marty
I concur that the excerpts from the Simon Bolivar policies were added to the Ethics book later. They were not in the 1978 edition. De-dinging found its way to other Missions as well, manifesting as direct, verbal statements that someone was an SP if they disagreed with staff directives / orders / objectives or if they didn’t offer up the prescribed amount of money required for their next course or auditing.
In one Mission there was an earlier instance of a Franchise Holder who did not agree with the introduction of many LRH policies in the Franchise, and extreme disagreement with the new Mission Office WW structure and the “Churchifying” of the Mission. The Franchise Holder quit and left, never to be seen again after a run in with Sea Org staff members of the time.
The Franchise Holder saw the implementation of the policies as destructive to the Franchise agreement and a breach of the charter. This happened sometime in the early to mid 70s.
@ justme
You are right. There are core principles that have been utterly ignored. Senior principles completely violated. Senior elements of the Admin and Group sanity scale pushed completely out of use and continually violated. The principles and SENIOR policies are very much there and written but IGNORED in the crazed quest for power at all costs.
Did this come from LRH? Yes and no.
If it truly was just all following LRH and it is all just because people blindly do what he says, then why are the precepts in the Way to Happiness pushed on so hard? This was one of the last publicly released materials from him and it is UTTERLY and COMPLETELY ignored in this madness like pink legs.
Like Joe, Tom M and Samuel above, and many, many others, I personally didn’t take the so-called Simon Bolivar PL as it has been interpretted by DM, Wimbush et al.
Looking this over, the question of ‘how come’ this policy seems to be able to be used to justify these irrational acts occurring presently is the one that stands out for me.
I think it’s because LRH wrote it. The ‘power’ the issue has emanates from the same source as the Factors, the Qs, the Axioms, the Auditor’s Code, the technique of relieving a Missed Withhold, clearing up By-passed Charge that can shake one like a rag doll, freeing one from overwhelm and providing a workable means to exteriorization and the recovery of awareness of ‘I’ and shedding all the falsity accrued to ‘I’ (the so-called ‘ego’) and the myriad of things that Dianetics and Scientology are routinely capable of bringing about.
Obedience, blind obedience and all manner of outrageous acts, completely at odds with the actual purposes of the subject are only possible because of the power of the subject, when these acts are perpetrated by otherwise intelligent and well-intentioned beings.
Sheep will follow any shepherd. Intelligent beings have to have something more to get them ‘on board’. What is that ‘more’?
It is the promise of Dianetics and Scientology.
Before DM there was the Command Team, Kerry G, Bill Franks, Alex Sibersky, Bill Foster, even Capt. Bill and the Sea Org itself represented by any of its Missions, officers and staff. These too carried out some outrageous acts, all in the name of Scientology and the promise.
I, trained on the OEC/FEBC material at Flag and working under some of the above, first ‘famous’ and then ‘infamous’ names, arrived at a Class IV org and promptly ‘went to work’ with an intention that moved, mercilessly. (The same intention that I ran out in my very first False Purpose Rundown session).
The contradiction of a ‘merciless’ Product Officer, a person who would justify any act with ‘pink legs’, someone who would smash another in pursuit of a ‘product’ with the actual nature of the subject of Scientology and its Aims is one that must be reconciled in order to truly grasp the spirit that any policy seemingly calling for such extremes has underlying it.
If this apparent contradiction is not reconciled then the idiocy of ‘pink legs’ used as a justification for any and all manner of irrationality presents the idiocy that is the fact of David Miscavige’s current organization.
OSA is committing continuous present time acts of destruction, in the name of ‘Scientology’, in the name of L. Ron Hubbard, in the name of ‘flowing power’ to DM and they DO NOT SEE the contradiction to the actual nature and spirit of the subject – spiritual enlightenment and a better, saner culture.
Insanity, used to gain sanity. The computation, the conclusion or stable datum they use, despite its flagrant illogic, is not inspected because ‘LRH wrote Responsibilities of Leaders’.
The only way this policy could be followed in its present interpretation, and contradiction in that interpretation with the vast body of materials, is because it seemingly is sanctioned by L. Ron Hubbard and that is played upon by David Miscavige, relentlessly. DM has NO POWER, save that he steals from the truth represented and the promise of the actual workable materials of Scientology.
DM is the lie, he can be unmocked by the truth. He is being unmocked by the truth. Pour it on Marty. Pour it on, all of us.
Quick fix here – I meant to point out that if LRH was the driving factor here, then how come the precepts of the Way to Happiness are not pushed in with such ferocity? They are not. They are violated continually. So clearly LRH is not being applied or followed any more. That booklet was a series of precepts and precepts very much take precedence over anecdotes from a policy letter or policy letters written at a much earlier time.
I’d also like to add that it is a murky murky time period, from about 1981 on and it more than just a little difficult to truly pin down who wrote what. I remember being astonished at the new “version” of the book Introduction to Scientology Ethics, a compilation of the most twisted use of LRH policies and materials I have ever seen – i.e. crimes and high crimes listed without any reference to original policies, taken from policies that had been superseded, policies that originally stated to which staffs and executives these applied to. Perfect example is that the high crimes listed in KSW are high crimes on administrators and executives ONLY, but that is omitted. And whatever happened to the handling for SP declares where the individual has only to prove that he/she has helped another to have the declare lifted? And what about ethics gradients? And what about the right to demand and receive a comm ev from peers? And it goes on and on and on. I could write an entire book on this and sometimes I think that would be very, very good idea.
Accurate sum up in my opinion, thanks.
Another good point.
Just Me,
At the heart of this mess is a mis-aligned Admin Scale. Goals and Purposes contradicted by interpretations of Policy and Products. Outpoints, illogical incongruities in this scale end in group insanity. The name of the issue that describes this is Group Sanity, 14 Dec 70.
Let’s not leave out Terl’s “leverage” from Battlefield Earth.
Anna,
Brilliant points. The rewrite of the the ‘Ethics’ book, to make it over into a ‘Morality’ book and perverting the intent.
The 10 points of KSW now a part of the list of High Crimes?! That can be used on someone to find them guilty of a ‘Suppressive Act’ because they hadn’t studied the whole of the subject yet.
The rewrite of ‘ethics’ into ‘morals’ has made every person in the church over into police. Thought police even. The diametric opposite to the spirit and intent of the subject of Scientology.
Jim, that is exactly what happened – from ethics to morality. The book, as compiled, begins by defining Ethics, and ends by jamming a moral code down one’s throat.
Because I am trying to remind Enisfer that he is not my superior. He wants to get didactic with me and condescending with FALSEHOODS? He communicates like a holier than thou know best. He needs to come down a few notches and realize he is simply a “friend.”
Bozz, you are spot on too. You’ve captured the valence and attitude of the typical Corporate Scientologist in your first two paragraphs.
Ensifer~I’m curious, what exactly was the de-dinging process you saw?
Hell, what the hell is a ding?
What really stands out to me is just how it all started with David Miscavige… I believe LRH could write something viewed as harsh, but who actually wrote this advice from LRH? It sounds exactly like something DM would fabricate to justify spitting in someone’s face AND to denigrate LRH.
“I read an advice from L Ron to Miss Cabbage ordering him to spit in John’s face and tell him that was from L. Ron. Miss Cabbage complyed with his order and reported the result. I saw the advice that came back to the compliance report of spitting in John’s face and L Ron was very pleased to here the news and escalated the situation by suggesting someone should slap the hell out of John Attack. Sure enough, as John was held by others, John was beaten by Miss Cabbage.”
It all goes back to David Miscavige in this scenario.
Check out the article by Gang of Five over on Scientology-cult. Miscavige was smashing up phone booths with crow bars and bullying girls in the back of vans as part of his “understanding” of power and his lust for it years before the Mayo incident referred to above.
Misavige also got others in Special Unit/Project into writing false reports to LRH so it wasn’t just coming from him. Steve Marlowe did some of it in 1982 when I was his assistant. If memory serves me right that’s where the line: “They were complaining about management but were management themselves” came from.
Miscavige can only put the words “push” and “power” together in one way and that’s power push.
From ethics to morality to insanity…
The perversion of the ethics materials through out of context excerpts, violations of senior policies, and total and complete IGNORING of the precepts of the Way to Happiness, the materials that should have superseded earlier materials and aligned them added to what Bozz said earlier is an underlying why on this whole scene and has been all along.
Bozz said: “It totally justifies all the squirel behavior in the orgs because, well, their following policy now aren’t they? There’s your reference, ain’t it? Ron wrote it, didn’t he? Too bad they all have a misunderstood on RESPONSIBILITY!!!! Kinda hard to get much futher in the PL when you don’t have a freakin’ clue.
Marty, you are so spot on. Dead-agenting has nothing to do with the behavior that I’ve seen over the years. People had the wrong Why. It’s right on right here: Misapplication and Misunderstoods on the ethics tech. And you know what that means.
We’ve created a monster.”
I just had the thought that all of this pain and turmoil may stem from the fact that Miscavige has spent his life trying to hide his low IQ. Crazy as it sounds, the guy’s probably riddled with MUs, confused, probably never duplicated a single word of Scientology, can’t get gains in auditing and does what he does to avoid anyone discovering the truth about him. That he’s just a stupid little man. Wild stuff, eh?
Loki, I do agree that when you’re convinced that what you’re doing is the only chance for mankind, you’ll tolerate any kind of roadkill along the way. Greatest Good et al.
Did you see The Reader? A very depressing film, and I don’t particularly recommend it, but when the character was confronted by the hideousness of her actions, she couldn’t conceive of what she’d done that was so wrong.
Hubbard was not bad, nor was any of his not cancelled policy, but you can take the best writings on earth and reverse it for suppressive ends, alter its importance, misinterpret it or apply it to the wrong conditions. There’s nothing wrong with the Responsibility of Leaders. If I were King in war with my neighboring country, I’d want strong and loyal officers too. I’d apply the PL exactly as written and promote the officers that really kick my enemy and I’d empower them with authority to sign purchase orders and administer justice. If Davey had just followed that PL, his Out Tech wouldn’t have had the slightest chance because of the ferocious objections from the very officers empowered to hammer it out of existence. He wouldn’t have had the slightest chance to micromanage anything because loyal officers with proper responsibility and authority would never let that kind of Out Tech slip through. Any suppressive order he’d issue would be returned to sender with the proper cramming order. The real loyal officers that really defend him and flow power to him would enforce his auditing and cramming and would refuse any of his off policy orders that might weaken him or make him vulnerable to attack. They would back him up if he is attacked and would take the blame for any flaps. They’d also make sure not a single off policy order would leave the desk it was written on so attacks would be minimum. Every day now his Golden Officers Guillaume, Yager, Jentzsch, Starkey, etc, let him down but thoroughly by not taking responsibility and never correcting him. They not only don’t flow power to him but actively let him down and enforce his disastrous orders and thus his demise. Ironically, his only loyal officers are found on the internet effectively hammering out of existence his Out Tech and thus preventing a greater backlash. They’re the ones reading all of the PL without cherry picking some sentences, verbally misinterpreting them and forcefully slamming them down the lines to spread the aberration to all situations everywhere at all times.
“Insanity, used to gain sanity.” Ain’t that the truth.
Great post. What’s behind this is the obsession with onward and upward stats. ‘Make it Go Right’ wasn’t ever meant to be a cycle of threat-invalidation. The point of the Conditions is that they are to be applied without HE&R, yet all that’s ever guaranteed from a declining stat in Scientology is … HE&R!
So the fact that Miss Moneybags was in the HGC for a month and left to go back to her daddy to get more money for a few weeks means that it’s your fault you crashed the HGC stats.
It becomes, You failed, becomes You’re a failure, becomes, You FUCKING FAILURE becomes YOU LET THE GROUP DOWN becomes YOU’RE OUT-ETHICS becomes YOU’VE GOT OVERTS YOU LITTLE FUCKING PIECE OF SHIT.
Service facsimilies at ten paces …
Just as a little more history:
Simon Bolivar was never emphasized in our Cl 4 (now 5) org until the early 80’s. At that time, I was com-eved and though my stats were up, I was assigned Treason for failing to apply Simon Bolivar, i.e. I would not flow power to the stat push, false stats, illegal finance shenanigans. All staff who were not on-board were gotten rid of as CI (counter-intention).
Who doesn’t know the greatest report and stat falsifier in all of Scientology? Whole blogs by sincere beings are dedicated to him.
What has been brought up and posted here on this thread are some of the most critical issues to be faced for former and current church members. It alludes to either “where did LRH go crazy?” or “did LRH go crazy”? I once saw any etymology for the word sanity and I deeply regret that I cannot reproduce it for you (I think it was Funk & Wagnells) right now but it said sanity derived from Latin sanus but was connected to the Greek “dianetik or dianetikos” I don’t remember the exact spelling. Greek friends of mine acknowledge this but the root etymology of dianetics (which was originally said by LRH to mean “through the mind” and was changed to “through the spirit” for PR/Legal reasons) really means “sanity”. That word has so many connotations, humorous and otherwise, that what I just stated says A LOT. Just imagine if LRH had called DMSMH “Sanity and the Modern Science of Mental Health”. White coats would have been coming out of the closet and cattle prods and straight jackets would have been the order of the day.
When we talk about these issues and what is left behind, we are dealing with issues of sanity and well being of all, particularly those who read this blog. It has been proved that Scientology can help people. There are also other things that can help people. Help is help and we all know that LRH had some help issues. He did not get what he wanted/needed.
Marty gets attacked on a non-stop basis. I know, some from personal experience, that that in itself deserves some degree of admiration. It is admirable and noteworthy that he even addresses the issue. It can take up all of one’s time easily. It is also clear he has some important critical issues to share at the appointed time (I too wish it was sooner that later). I never even knew about Marty until years ago (when he was still in) I read about him in Jesse’s initial write-ups on the internet. They were not too complimentary. One thing is very clear to me, however, it that Marty has never been shy or in denial over the fact that he has made mistakes and has even admitted to commissions, etc. He has clearly demonstrated that he is redeemable and by that, I do not mean to imply that he needs more redemption than any of us or anyone else. More importantly, he is actually redeeming a lot of abuse that has occurred in the name of Scientology.
The critical mass here is highlighted by what Jesse wrote about LRH ordering abusive actions. Jesse (whom I know and like from long ago) has made some very informative posts in the past but they were always tainted with visceral emotion or obvious by-passed charged. What he said here is very lucid and tangible (save for the Jon Aczel misrepresentation), but what Marty says gets even more to the heart of the issue. I always knew LRH was third partied about the Mission Holders but it is complete missing data to me as that was the “golden thread” or comm line (abused) that is referred to in the Essay on Management. Like DM did with Cruise, he seems to have brought out the worst in LRH. Sarge and I both agree that LRH was PTS. DM was the SP yet, but I believe there were more behind the scenes.
Whatever the hell happened, and I certainly would like to find out, I would also like to add that everyone has a potentially bright future if one chooses so. If you reduce the movie “The Wizard of Oz” to basic archetypes, you’ll discover that LRH was very much the Wizard and those of us who worked for him worked in Oz (the term “Over the Rainbow” is most appropriate). OSA and company are the Flying Monkeys. DM is the Wicked Witch of the West and Pat Broeker the Wicked Witch of the East. The Winkie soldiers are the Sea Org and the Munchkins are Scientologists. Every individual Scientologist is Dorothy and they need to find brains, heart and courage along the way. Once you throw water (real heart-felt emotions) on DM, you kill him. But, the Wizard can’t get you back to Kansas. You have the power inside of you all the time in your ruby red slippers. The power is inside of you and LRH even said “All the happiness you will ever find lies in you.”
Billy,
I’m sure this will get lost in the responses, yet, a question: do you see outpoints in the present scene with the Church of Scientology?
Fair Game existed at the same time as HCO PL 12 February 1967 The Responsibilites of Leaders. Here are some PL examples:
HCO Policy Letter of 18 October 1967, Issue IV
“ENEMY SP Order. Fair game. May be deprived of property or injured by
any means by any Scientologist without any discipline of the Scientologist. May be tricked, sued or lied to or destroyed.”
LRH:jp L. RON HUBBARD
Copyright (c) 1967 Founder
by L. Ron Hubbard
ALL RIGHTS RESERVED
http://www.xenu.net/fairgame-e.html
THE SCIENTOLOGY FAIR GAME TIMELINE
http://www.lermanet.com/barwell/FAQ-fair-game-law.txt
HCOPL 7 Mar 65 Issue 1
[Widely misdated as 1 Mar 65 but actually 7 Mar 65]
Suppressive Acts -Suppression of Scientology and Scientologists – The Fair Game Law
“A suppressive person or group becomes fair game.
……. The homes, property, places and abodes of people who have been active in attempting to suppress Scientology or scientologists are beyond all protection of Scientology Ethics unless absolved by later Ethics or an amnesty”
“truly suppressive person or Group has no rights of any kind as Scientologists and actions taken against them are not punishable under Scientology Ethics codes.”
[“A webbed report on HCOPL 7 Mar 65, 23 Dec 65 and the subsequent versions and reissues, “Scientology (R): The history of a Policy Letter –
A detailed study or the transformation of HCO PL 23 Dec 65 is webbed and is very good.” You can find it here
http://www.wiseoldgoat.com/papers-scientology/hubbard_policy-letter_history.html ]
Sid~Just a point I’d like to mention.
In the ideal scenario: During a process, a whole lot of crazy reactive upset can happen and as an auditor I would continue the process until it was resolved…not stop when the person was in this state.
I write down most of what’s said while this is happening. I don’t judge the person in front of me as it’s happening as a psycho, emotionally unstable freak. I continue the process and the person comes through it better for having experienced it and released it and all is well, fine and dandy at the end.
It is a process. You quoted a few things out of volumes of things LRH said/wrote (and that’s assuming LRH did actually say/write them). Everything the man said or wrote is up for scrutiny.
His life was a process that we all witnessed to some degree or another.
Why do some people stick on and use/abuse the hostile parts of the process when the vast majority and the end result is non-hostile and positive?
OMG
HCO PL 15 Aug 1967 “DISCIPLINE, SPs AND ADMIN, HOW STATISTICS CRASH:
“One of the ways an SP works to stop an activity or to halt an Affluence is to pick out key personnel and spread wild, false and alarming stories about them.
Another way, often used in conjunction with the above, is to pound a key executive with alarming entheta about staff, divisions or activities. This urges the key executive to take uncalled-for action which upsets things and which may lead to the dismissal of valuable staff.” LRH
In 1986 I read the comm ev that Jesse is referring to. I think there were 12 Interested parties. I have also read the advise that Jesse is referring regarding the order “to spit on John Aczel”. I was a brand new staff member at CMO Int. My thought at the time was that I found it odd that DM bragged about this. Anyone 2.5 or above would not.
“A 1.1 can be accurately spotted by his conversation, since he seeks onto to enturbulate those around him, to upset them by his conversation, to destroy them without their ever being aware of his purpose. He listens only to data which wills serve him in his enturbulations. Here is the gossip, here is the unfaithful wife, here is the card cheat, here is the most undesirable stratum of any social order.” LRH Science of Survival
David Miscabbage is 1.1 on the Tone Scale. No doubt about it.
Sid,
On the quotes from LRH, read the above words attributed to Jesus Christ in Matthew. Were these perhaps used to justify the Crusades? The Inquisition?
Do these words, cancel the entire spirit and message of Christ? Can they be taken out of context to that vast body of message? Should they be understood and aligned with that message?
It’s trite I know, but could it be with these quotes you miss the forest for the trees?
Sincerely,
Jim Logan
Ensifer-
A great post. Thank you.
Nice one Dan. I spent some time recently trying to get into the minds of the average Anonfag (just for the lulz you understand). This phrase kept coming up: “the tech IS the abuse”. In other words, it isn’t the people perpetrating the abuses, but the writing themselves. So… a policy letter is capable of standing up and hazing staff? Or beating up Marc, Mike R or Guillaume? By the same token, I guess the Koran jumped into a plane and flew itself into the WTC.
“DM is carrying on what Hubbard started” is another one. No doubt LRH had a temper, but anyone who actually knew him would know he was compassionate a man as you could ever meet, who genuinely loved to help others. (Right Sarge?). If you study policy with intelligence you will surely get intelligent results. If you are dramatizing Ser Facs or evil purposes surely the same policy will be applied very differently.
Having said that, it is hard to argue that KSW#1 is not anathema to critical thinking, and encourages thought-stopping to some degree, unless you take it purely and only in the context of applying auditing tech purely as written. Just my 2c.
Yeah, that “valence” hits a little too close to home for me. Maybe I need to plan a roadtrip south?
But reading all this helped me accept a little responsiblity myself. My last line of “We created a monster” was very intentional. Everyone’s agreement to go along with “command intention” fed the beast that is now David Micavage. It was so subtle in the begining, my begining. Lack of tech, ethics, admin training and I was blind to it all… until it snowballed into that which has become “Chariman of the Board.”
I know I fed the beast.
I don’t doubt what you say, Jesse, but who was writing the LRH despatches? By 1982, Miscavige was already deep into his cabal to take over. Plus, he’s such a degraded asshole that his Napoleon valence would just love the idea of spitting in another’s face “on orders”, of course.
One more thing, with knowledge comes responsibility. LRH created a system of knowing but it is now as much mine as it is yours as it is LRH’s. To echo what Dan says above, it’s never occured to me to read something the Old Man wrote and go out and spit in another person’s face.
Holy cow, sounds like fiction.
I think some people need to wake up and smell the history.
LRH was born in 1911, in the Western States where a man could still be shot dead for a minor infraction (such as verbally insulting a lady in public) and nothing would be done about it. In the South people of color were being suppressed beyond belief.
He was still a young boy when the First World War ended in which 8 million Russians lost their lives along with many millions of Englishmen, French, Germans and other nationalities. Take the entire current populations of USA’s largest cities – metropolitan NY, LA and Chicago, add them together and you still haven’t come close to how many people died in The Great War.
He was still a teenager when millions of American men, women and children were callously thrown off their land or out of their homes to roam aimlessly in the Great Depression, then came the Second Word War and of course the holocaust.
After the war, in the 50s and 60s, beating misbehaving children was still the norm and kids solved their differences in schools with their fists, emulating their parents. Psychiatrists were electric shocking and lobotomizing their victims. The CIA was killing foreign leaders. Religious leaders, heads of movements and even US presidents were being shot down. Gun toting law officers were raiding churches (Washington D.C.).
“Child abuse” as a real term wouldn’t be coined for some time, beating kids wouldn’t be outlawed for many years yet. And this is the so called civilized world, the West. All the above and worse is happening elsewhere in the world to this day.
So, if 50 to 60 years ago now (the 1950s and 60s) LRH wrote something which in effect said: “hey somebody attacks you, somebody starts a fight, make sure you finish it”, I for one say fair enough because that’s the way I was raised in the 1950s and 60s. “Never start a fight but if someone else starts one make sure you finish it and get in the first punch if you can” and that was my mother talking!
But things are different today, thank goodness.
The world has changed for sure.
As LRH said in the data series: “Humility is the heart of review”, and if LRH was alive today or a social personality was at the helm I believe, after review, Scientology would have changed along with the world at large. Heck, I believe it would be and should be leading the way in bringing increased humanity to the world.
But Miscavige, the Pol Pot of religion, has taken Scientology back to year zero and kept it in the middle of the last century with his mafia tactics.
It was interesting to read the resulting product and viewpoint that some have had on this policy. I guess when certain sections are inculcated in ones mind a slant can be expected.
The main thing I got from this PL was the importance of creating a game and allowing those who support you to contribute to that game. DM violated this long ago with the destruction of the management echelon. In the beginning, it was a beautiful, creative and brilliant structure which showed the true strengths of our management leaders and their purposes were clear, clean and genuine in regards t the expansion of Scientology (tech).
As LRH predicted and as irony would have it DM created his enemies by violating the exact policy he tried to enforce and the game has turned to getting him.
Just Call You Mary,
OK, Mary, at the same time that these policies existed so did thousands of taped lectures and issues. They still do. What, pray, is your point?
Metaqual~The Wizard of Oz analogy absolutely blows charge for ME. Whoa! Thanks.
Marty did not group “haters” and critiquers” about Scientology together.
I see outpoints anywhere, dear Jim Logan.
Thanks for sharing this Marty.
While LRH wrote this single policy, that didn’t mean that an executive or staff member were to apply what he says in this policy to the extreme and simply ignore all other policies written.
An executive and staff member has to learn to play the piano. That means use ALL policy in order to handle a situation.
Taking this policy to the extreme for a Class 4 org – Pink Legs could justify falsifying all stats “in order to please the Power”, when in fact, nothing pissed off LRH more than false stats from an Org. I know DM uses this Policy to justify his PR stats that he makes up. But the average org and staff member back in the day, would not ignore all other LRH policy in order to “flow power to the leader.” If they did, they were handled in ethics.
Then it gets down to a more basic common principle of right and wr0ng which we all learned growing up from our parents and did not need an LRH policy to tell us what to do.
Breaking the law of the land is wrong and we were taught that at an early age. Beating someone up just because they look at you funny is wrong in addition to being against the law.
We didn’t need an LRH policy to tell us this.
I think it is a real shame that honest hard working executives and staff members ignore the basic common sense they learned from their parents and teachers so long ago and instead contribute to the insanity that DM pushes on everyone.
I think they justify it in their mind that it is “the Greatest Good for the Greatest Number of Dynamics”. Scientology – DM’s brand – must survive above all else.
Cool, a reply that makes sense. I think the tools LRH gave us are fitting tools for livingness and life. I could not have survived without them but then I had to use them as well. I had learned the TR’s and knew how to use them as an auditor but come to everyday life, how do you just keep saying “Do Birds Fly, Do Fish Swim” when you are talking to your mom? Funny, but Meshell helped me get through this one.
Marty you are correct, it was John Aczel. I’m pretty sure I am not missing much as to what was sent to L Ron during the time period I am refering to. Prior to ASI fully coming into existence there was the Special Unit. Eveyone who was part of the Special Unit came to the Int Base as ordered by L Ron to do the weekly reporting. I don’t know what time period you are refering to. During this time period you were nowhere near the Int Base so I didn’t expect you to have that information. I am shocked by your assertion that Mayo was somehow on the FBI and APA payroll. You of all people know Scn paid Mayo a HUGE settlement to wrap up the suit RTC et el brought against Mayo! Noone hears from Mayo today as he was paid to keep his silence by RTC and CSI, not the FBI and APA. Why did RTC and CSI pay Mayo in the end? I know why, because he could proove he co autored the dreaded NOT’s Level materials. How did he proove that to be a fact? His name or initials were on every page of the NOT’s materials.
As stated above, I was on the comm ev for David and John that went on for months. We NEVER found any evidence of ANYONE at the INT Base associated with the FBI. The FBI was not interested in SCN then just as it is not interested in SCN now. I suspect then like now they had more important things to do.
I’m sure we could debate the facts if you wish however the points you responded to from my ealier post was not the point of the post. The point of my post was to give an eye wittness account of how or what caused the escalation of criminal activity and staff abuse in Scn and the Sea Org. I know finding out the TRUTH is not something that always makes someone happy or feel better. It’s still the truth.
These have been my observations as well at the class v org level in regards to staff. I think the public , especially the OLs may also be stuck in a status equals beingness fixation. If an OL actually confronts the truth and says someting about it it does test their credibility and the credibility of the tech because they missed it too for all of these years. It does certainly take courage and confront to keep ones integrity in. But only truth as-ises as long as they not-is, they will be trapped, regardless of the level of their case.
And WE are ALL part of this ongoing process, IMO. The EP (end phenomena) of the process has definitely NOT been reached.
Humble Servent you can believe whatever suits you. The subject of religion is primarily a journey of faith, not fact. If religion was a journey of fact, it would be called science.
Thanks for this reality. I was off lines during this period of time and got back on right at the tail end of it, meaning I was aware of it but not really. I later joined staff at SNC and left when it got too Hitlarian with call-in, fundraising and recruiting. I joined Div. 6 staff to get others up the bridge not all this other BS.
Mid 1970’s to 80’s and 90’s
Dallas Mission
I saw the resultant abuse of the Simon Bolivar Power Policy in the late 1970’s with the Dallas Mission.
Aberration can be contagious.
It can permeate the culture of a group.
It is easy to wear blinders when other group members are also.
In my opinion, the altered importance of the “Responsibilities of Leaders” Policy Letter resulted in a person’s own integrity becoming sacrificed. The right to safely, openly question what one observes got shot down with the over-emphasis (altered importance) of this PL.
A Scientology “thought stopping” culture developed in order to “flow power”. Other aberrations such as “blasting”, “yelling”, abuse, and weird ethics cycles came out of this “flow power” culture.
There is nothing wrong with allegiance. However, allegiance does not include giving up one’s personal observation, one’s self-determinism and one’s right to ask honest, hard questions.
In the late 1970’s, there was a very rapid expansion of Scientology with the Mission network. The Dallas “Mission of the Southwest” grew from around 8-12 staff to between 50-70 staff from 1976-1978. These were full-full time staff living in quarters making around $15 week in pay, working bell to bell everyday. “Full-full time” means both Day and Foundation hours; i.e. Sea Org hours. The Mission was located in an old, old apartment house located at 4845 Swiss Avenue. Div 6 and some administrative offices and the kitchen were on the first floor. The courserooms and auditing rooms were on the second floor. Staff bunked on the third floor. The dedication of staff was stellar. North Texas summers get humid and hot. There was no substantial A/C on the third floor. Often staff would sleep on the roof to cool down at night. There were times of only oatmeal for breakfast, while beans and rice were lunch and dinner. The weeks of beans and rice on a 16 hour workday made for a dangerous environment if you smoked (grin). Many Scientologists were made during this era. Many of these Scientologists helped to make Scientologists in later years. Some of these original staff members are still on staff.
A lot of “history” emanates from this Dallas Mission.
Rick and Vicki Aznaran came from this Mission. At one time, Vicki was the 2-D of the Mission holder, Dean Stokes. Later, they split up. Rick and Vicki re-established their 2-D and went west. More on the Aznarans at the August 6, 2010 entry…
https://markrathbun.wordpress.com/2010/08/06/the-land-of-milk-and-honey-and-virgins-galore/#comment-41495
Greg Barnes was sold a DMSMH book at his apartment by staff street booksellers in 1978. At one time around this era, Greg had a relationship with Bennetta Slaughter (this is years prior to Bennetta marrying David Slaughter and eventually founding AMC). The Dallas Mission evolved over the years. Lisa McPherson worked in Div 6 in the early 90’s when the Dallas Church was located near Royal Lane and Central Expressway.
The rapid expansion of the Dallas Mission in the late 1970’s has some contributing factors which often get overlooked.
The Dallas “Mission of the Southwest” had two full-full time Div 6 booksellers (and more part-time booksellers) who sold Dianetics and Scientology books door-to-door or on the streets to new public. One staff bookseller sold over 10,000 books to new people, and another sold over 8,000 books to new people within a 2 year period.
Every week for many, many weeks, more than 10,000 OCA Personality Tests were distributed around the area. (OCA – Oxford Capacity Analysis) Public would fill these out and mail them in. Div 6 would then call the public to schedule a time to come in for their free personality profile. This was a “greased line”. The evaluative skills of reading these OCA graphs were very well studied (even past drug use could be seen by looking at different traits on the OCA). The Div 6 reg line was continuously drilled. Melanie (who later became the 2-D of Dean Stokes) delivered an Introductory Lecture which had impact. She was well liked and kept Div 6 alive with a stable stellar stat of New Signups every week. The Comm Course and then HQS were smoking, full of life. Later, Melanie was pulled off this Div 6 hat by Dean. Stats slumped.
NED started coming on the scene during this era. The Bridge was laid out differently around this time. Reel to reel taped lectures (with no transcript) were often hell to deal with, but people were very gung-ho.
This late 70’s era had a cultural meme which contributed to this rapid expansion. There seemed to be a cultural thirst for more understanding about life. Books like “I’m OK You are OK” and transactional analysis were popular. The Moonies and Krishna dissemination efforts were often seen at airports and around town.
Simon Bolivar
With the emphasis on the Simon Bolivar Policy, things really got weird. Dean used to repeatedly push home the Simon Bolivar Power Policy, almost nightly. As a group of 50-70, many of us went blind to some of the blatant weird characteristics and slave labor instigated by Dean.
Dean couldn’t sing worth a toot, but in “order to flow power” staff would endure hours of his entertainment and pretend to enjoy it. As a group, we lost our integrity of what was real.
I saw innocent staff get butchered with invalidations and evaluations and humiliations and “blasting” verbal yelling. I saw a person get gang-stripped naked by force. The people who did the gang-up stripping were all very good people at heart. I knew them and I liked them. I saw 2-D’s get torn apart or people forcibly removed because they dared to question. Staff who had questions or doubt would often be confined (sleep and eat) to a small room for weeks to write O/W’s and do conditions. The aberration was contagious. The staff were great people, but everyone kind of got swept up in the weirdness.
I am a real advocate of “asking important questions”. Auditing Procedure asks important questions. The Simon Bolivar Policy demonized the right to question.
The duping of people…blind allegiance.
Our government and society utilize their version of “The Responsibilities of Leaders Policy Letter”.
A prime example of how Americans have been duped is the subject of 9/11 Truth. Americans are supposed to patriotically support the government version of 9/11, despite it violating the Laws of Physics and despite the mountain of forensic evidence that explosives were used in all three of the World Trade Center tall buildings (The Twin Towers and Building 7).
Marty, I hope you’ll answer this question from Just Me!
Thanks for the insight into DM’s thinking and how he inculcated people with the belief that it was right to do what protected and built him up. Much appreciated.
“Ensifer” started more people on the path of scientology than probably anyone else who posts here. And as he says his disillusionment with what the vehicle for enabling scientology was becoming, predates Miscaviges influence.
Hubbard himself says that he was a whole track psychiatrist * and gives plenty of warning to examine what he says for its usefulness, and to separate his opinion from exact and effective process.
The above concept, that there is great truth, and possibly some flaw, in the subject even as conveyed directly by its founder, is in my opinion one of the basic failing points of the church and of the subjects gaining wide acceptance.
Refusal to acknowledge Hubbards mistakes is perilous. Mistakes may be an unconfortable word, but looking at the history of scientology, shows that it never stopped “developing” until Rons death. As much as I love L Ron Hubbard, it is my responsibility to create the future around me. And that requires that any loyalty to him be secondary to what I can actually observe. Circumstances can and do affect the applicability of portions of the subject.
*
* SOP V Long Form – Step 5 Additional techniques
@Tara and @Jim
Firstly, thanks so much for your reasonable responses to my post.
Critics are concerned that LRH wrote too many policy documents which promoted very unethical behaviour. It is not just one or two which can be slanted this way or that, depending on the comprehension of a Greek translation.
LRH is in fact quite clear when he talks about how critics should be handled. There is very little room for interpretation. It is written in English, it is written within the last 60 years so the meanings are not ambiguous, and it is very clear and direct.
I understand it is very difficult for Scientologists to accept this, but critics believe that DM is in many ways following LRH policy on handling enemies of the church to the letter.
Hey Mr. Rathbun, I have been reading your blog for month, and got a lot out of it. This post is clearing quite some confusion. I’m stuck on the LOC for years, and could not figure out how to use “The Reponsibilities of Leaders” to find my hat in life. I don’t know if I will ever complete this course (the last LOC sup at my local org has been quicksilvered into OSA) but I now understand why many graduate I have seen are not so successfull.
I have been told LOC is “not pushed” currently – you should do your basics.
I guess the LOC will be re-released one day, DM annoucing that “if you didn’t get the win you expected from LOC, it is not your fault: it was compiled by some stupid uncompetent f**ckers…..
I don’t want to steal the job of LRH biographer, so I will let him complete DM’ speach.
Thank you for all you do.
Warmest regards.
This is an incredible post today! Look at the comments it triggered. Very informative with some brilliant observations!
Corporate Scientology has become a “Quote” religion. Quotes are king. Compound that with an apparent “natural law” that the “Senior Quote” always wins over the “junior quote” and you can direct the mob any way you want. Quotes are quick to learn and give you a stack of (quote) cards. Viola! Instant hatted – permanently. New wisdom is gained with new quotes.
The various interpretations of LRH’s “real intentions” (I tend to believe they are always based on such quotes) are mind boggling – some I’ve heard and so some I’ve only read about. It’s a “war of quotes” – you find as many Pro’s as you can find Con’s on practically any point you wish to take up – with both, Scientologist and critic endlessly quoting quotes. I dare say that NEITHER has understood what it’s all about.
Even a casual reader of the subject, left to his own interpretations, would probably give you an incredulous look if you told him that Corporate Scientology actually believes (and tells itself) to be conducting its business according to those writings. After all, they are continuously quoting it.
And if you don’t believe what I’m saying: I’ve got a quote that proves it!
//I suggest you work on your differentiation skills my friend.//
I read your post again and it still reads the same. You see Hubbard as an embattled victim of the government or the evil DM , who took his written policies to an extreme. You also claim that policies written and acted on by Hubbard and his top execs years before DM was out of diapers or you were involved in Scientology were not widely known about or abused.
I disagree. Of course this isn’t my blog, it’s yours and you have every right to frame my comments in any light you desire… or just ignore them altogether. My point is that the negative experiences of thousands upon thousands of former Scientologists aren’t about Miscavige, you, or any of the abuses committed during your era. Whether it was forced disconnection or Fair Game tactics employed by the GO or the tossing overboard of CL VIII students or the RPF… many of these reprehensible things were occurring while Hubbard was in charge and with his awareness. So it is “sugar coating” in my view when you paint the source of these policies as a mere victim.
//Because I am trying to remind Enisfer that he is not my superior. He wants to get didactic with me and condescending with FALSEHOODS?//
I’m uncertain what falsehoods you’re referring to. The ‘de-dinging’? I only know what I saw and I saw none of the things you and others mentioned. On the other hand I did see DM and the RTC swallow up hundreds of thousands of dollars from Wimbush, Samuels, Surrey and a few other Mission Holders in one fell swoop. You’re the guy who used Wimbush as an example of a misapplied Hubbard policy letter, not me. Or are you suggesting that I’m lying about the common knowledge throughout the staff and public of Fair Game and Disconnection?
As for being didactic, isn’t that the entire point of your whole blog? To convey how you “saw the light” while simultaneously assuming you have the seniority to instruct others on how to attain your vision? Perhaps not, but that’s how I see it. And I think you do a decent job of revealing some of the more egregious excesses of the current CofS as well as creating enough turbulence for current Scientologists (who violate the “no look” restrictions on the internet) that many will depart after reading this blog.
I agree with WindHorse… I am not exactly your friend. But I do honestly believe your blog, experiences and revelations are highly valuable in the efforts to extract as many people as possible from the clutches of the CofS.
Great data and I got an understanding of an ignorant viewpoint that I’d observed when trying to tell someone the church was corrupted. Thank you!
I have been filling in some gaps of time by listening to LRH lectures….I heard this one yesterday, and the opening statement LRH made in 1952 seems to be of interest here:
5110C09a Statics and Motions and Axioms 1-14
“Thank you. Well we are going to get right down to work here, or up to
work. That’s the best..there are a certain number of things which you
have been given…possibly as your technique of Effort Processing.
Most of them are right, but one of them is wrong, and I am going to
cover that right away.
The boys have got you squirreled up a little bit on ARC. The
definitions being handed out on ARC is, just between ourselves….bunk.
You see, ARC is still ARC, and don’t doubt that for a minute. What
happens is that ARC sags in to Belief. As soon as the apparent absolute of a belief starts entering in to ARC there is unfluid understanding. And it doesn’t become understanding at all, it becomes belief. Belief on the lower ranges, to an organism which has to be in motion to support itself, is of course apathy, because belief is no motion, and ARC is motion.”
I highly recommend listening to the entirety of this lecture…
Your Humble Servant,
I too was just about to say that IMHO, LRH, who was one of the most prolific and creative of writers, surely wrote many things he expected a sane Thetan to comprehend in the spirit in which it was intended and not take as literal, and those things he intended to be literal…that a sane Thetan being would be able to temper his actions according to what would be ETHICAL.
In the CofS such as it has become, there are those now who interpret this ‘Fair Game’ policy to be a free for all for criminal actions and behaviors of any kind, committed by any Scientologist against another being on this planet…and to be able to committ these actions towards anyone who even looks at them sideways…be they Scientologists, in or out…OR persons who have never been a Scientologist at all…and to be able to do this and remain somehow ‘above the law’…
Surely LRH would NOT have gone all willy nilly and destructive towards people just because a person expressed doubts or made a critical comment. I just cannot think this. As I see him as a man who actually greatly loved people and had a huge sense of humor! I think in many cases, if someone might be considered to be an ‘enemy’ of Scientology, he would have had more sane Thetan OSA agents doing better investigation(and they would naturally have been more sane just being around LRH)…which would include actually inviting that person to sit down and talk in many cases…and doing some ‘conflict resolution’ type of communications before declaring a person actually an SP.
I don’t think that LRH was a weak person or afraid of conflict, and there is evidence that he had a deep understanding of most cultural, personal, political, & religious ‘differences of opinion’ and was not especially bothered by such things. IMHO, He just wasn’t the sort of man to be afraid that another person’s critique of him or his view point would really harm him or collapse Scientology. I see him as so much more and as a much stronger being than that! Definitely tolerant and impervious to individual opinion or critique. I think he laughed alot at his own and others human foibles…and had the sanity NOT to declare people right and left as SP willy nilly….
I formed this opinion about LRH a long time ago, based on one of my most favorite writings ever written by Him…and that is His discourse on ‘What is Greatness’. From this you can see the depth of His character, His love of mankind…His tolerance and level for being merciful and forgiving.
To imagine him sending out his ‘guard dogs and OSA hounds to destroy the life of one good young woman who mispoke and said the wrong thing at the wrong time…who unaware was saying it to the ‘wrong people’…
No way would he point in her direction and say…’destroy her life…and destroy her children…take from her everything…utterly ruin her. In fact, it was when I read his missive on “What is Greatness”, that I realized he never would have done this!…Perhaps he would have been more likely to say…go speak to that little monkey…see what she is about, be her friend and see if she might like to know more about REAL Scientology…he would have been more inclined to first try to turn percieved ‘enemies’…into ‘friends’…and then perhaps even see if he could turn them into potential Scientologists. The entire premise for Scientology was to ‘help’ people…not ‘destroy’. I think LRH was more likely to look at people as potential ‘friends’….not enemies.
There is a difference in the way things are done now. It seems to be that anyone…inside or out, Scientologist or even of another faith & culture, if they so much as make an offhand remark…or ask a question, express a doubt…or think differently…it is ‘OFF with their heads!’…and their little dog, Toto too…
A Psychopath interprets philosphies and laws to fit his own agenda. He has his own set of rules to live by, and you can be certain that HIS rules are always self serving. A 1.1 thinks others are all out to get him and everyone is a potential ‘enemy’….even those who have done his bidding and ‘served’ him for many many years. The minute he thinks they might recognize who and what he really is…then he wants to destroy them and everything that might expose him.
This does not sound like LRH, nor his intentions for Scientology at all.
I had a similar thought to yours while reading this post.
Hey Tara ~
Kingsley wanted me to look at selling the ‘rundown’ at my mission in Fresno so I went over and took a peek. Realize, Santa Clara was producing $50K to $100K per week in income at the time, so I was curious. Essentially (it was nearly 30 years ago so forgive my hazy memory) it appeared to be a process of locating and “blowing” minor snarks, attacks, put-downs, failed acknowledgments and so forth that occurred throughout the day or recent past.
I observed nothing like demands that power be pushed to Kingsley or that people needed to be fined or give him extra money. I can’t vouch for anything after that (roughly 1981 or early 1982).
I think he just looked at the dictionary definition of “ding” and came to the conclusion that people can be adversely affected by small slights that occur over time. Duh. I passed on the idea because it seemed to be superfluous to what I was doing at the time… selling auditing and basic courses.
I find it interesting, NOTICING, that you seem to feel you need to bring him down a notch. My words not yours, my impression.
Noticing of course from many notches below you.
“friend”.
(My 1.1 tone of course, acknowledged in advance.)
You seem of late to be exhibiting some of the characteristics of the organization you oppose, shutting down opposing views, and encouraging agreement, not with reason, but with subtle appeals to social conditioning. (No Entheta here! Unless of course its about davey) My view of the middle path seems to be a bit different than yours.
There can be danger in having powerful, charismatic people in position of influence, even if benevolent, as by their very nature they shut down the process of examination for those they influence.
Hubbard did, hopefully unintentionally. You do also.
Samuel,
I was a Sup and the D of T. You are correct.
Mark
AH-HA! and spot-on!
I have often wondered why there is no more individual evaluation, “orders query of”, just obey, blind compliance expected of public and staff. What LRH did say? do?, write? that lead to the current scene how blind orders, arbitraries, perversions, won the day and became senior to purpose. I figured DM must have some LRH ref. to put so many at total effect and keep him as COB now I can understand the single, only one, viewpoint at work. Thank you for the soul searching and for spotting the correct ref.! BINGO Marty!
Don’t have time to read all the above at this moment so if anyone has already made the following point I apologize.
Policy is the agreed-upon actions that work so that everyone can go in the same direction toward the goal, whatever.
Pink legs is everyone setting their own policy as to what needs to be done to handle whatever situation they feel has come up, whether it has anything to do with the goal or not, so long as it seems to “protect” the leader, his image, his power, etc.
This makes the two things opposed, and if policy helps build an organization, then pink legs will certainly destroy it.
Great article and this makes a lot of sense. We had at least 2 study orders of the Responsibility of Leaders reference, not to mention having to read it on the Basic Staff hat and in the ethics book. We also had to read (word clear) the “Message to Garcia” reference numerous times. And of course the “backflash” definition in the Admin dictionary was used to settle disagreements. In the SO, these references are used in a destructive way to shut off any independent thought or questioning of authority.
Evident that this leads to suppression eventually. For what is the definition of “truly suppressive”? Depends entirely on viewpoint.
This is one policy letter but I suppose this is not just an isolated frame of mind of the person (LRH) behind it.
Marty, I was around for the whole time period you described and I agree with your take on things. I’ve had plenty of my own interactions with DM and yes indeed, he expected unflinching loyalty – TO HIM. He had RTC order us low-life Int people to M9 “Responsibilities of Leaders” more than once and it was obvious that our cognition was meant to be along the lines of having unswerving loyalty to Little Fueher. The other “reference” that would frequently be ordered M9ed was “Message to Garcia” by Elbert Hubbard which was all about just taking an order from an authority and carrying it out exactly with no questions asked whatsoever. This was also an expectancy from DM and his RTC.
The other thing that I recall having to repeatedly M9 was the famous Chapter on responsibility which basically is intended to get one to realize he/she is fully responsible for their own condition. Although there is nothing wrong with any of these references, there was an unspoken spin put upon them by RTC when demanding compliance to orders from their COB. In the case of the “Responsibility” Chapter, if you showed the slightest sign of disagreement or bewilderment (or whatever) in response to a command, you were not taking full responsibility and were therefore “motivating” and had “missed withholds.” Period.
COB himself took this to absolutely ridiculous levels. I recall seeing him rushing into a room full of trainees, and when one appeared a bit startled at suddenly having COB almost run into him, DM shoved a finger in the trainee’s face and said angrily “MISSED WIHHOLDS!” Off that guy went to sec checking. I suppose the poor trainee was supposed to stand there serenely like a Buddha in order to be spared such a vicious evaluation. The ingenious thing about this gag is that it puts the followers’ attention strictly on THEIR missed withhold indicators and completely blank-out the fact that DM was dramatizing those indicators 24/7/365. The net result was a bunch of followers “pushing power” to DM, doing whatever he said with no backflash and being so introverted on never dramatizing their own “missed withholds” that they would completely omit to observe the MWH indicators of the little tyrant himself.
And of course the final element in all of this is the fact that the power that the followers were granting to Miscavige was the power they wished to grant to LRH out of the goodness of their hearts. That is the capping insult from Miscavige in all this. Those people were there out of a desire to serve LRH and his mission, and David Miscavige hijacked that love and devotion through his mind-controlling machinations and hoarded it all for himself — to the detriment of those good people who were only there because they wanted to help LRH and his humanitarian mission — NOT to serve David Miscavige. Hell, I didn’t join the SO to cow tow to Miscavige. I wanted to give back what I had gotten from the Founder. I’m sure a lot of “ex’s” would agree with me on that point.
Thanks again for your post.
Can you clarify your comment.
People, this is Scientology. Everyone always thinks the abuses are local, due to some misinterpretation or another.
Show me an org where abuse of staff did not take place.
John Aczel was the mildest mannered person I ever met in the S.O. English, educated at Cambridge. His passion was poetry. He loved cats. Kind of eccentric but very intelligent and a very, very sweet person. I considered him a very good friend. He was commended by LRH for good work he did with the missions. He got caught up in that whole insane third party scene with the missions that occurred in 1982, probably generated by DM with his false reports to LRH. Aczel got caught in the middle of it and was not strong enough or bright enough to speak up and defend himself. Not that he needs defending here, but just to give a personal viewpoint of someone I still consider a friend. One of the many still in the S.O. that I miss.
I would like to think that if DM was never there this whole scene would not have happened but looking higher up in the current structure to the source of this mess leads me to see it otherwise.
Who is CST really ? Who are the Lenske brothers and Emory Meade?
When did this whole corruption of LRH tech really start.
Remember that if it is too late on the chain it won’t erase but rather grind on.
Any way her is a site I have looked at that gives some answers to the scenario for your consideration.
http://sc-i-r-s-ology.com/index.html but before you look at that this short Rod Serling Twilight Zone episode on youtube may help cushion the shock for the would be sheeple. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WudBfRa0ETw
My earlier post was written without proper reflection.
While I still agree, in part with some of Ensifer’s post – I am reminded of a wonderful post by Karen#1 on Jeff Hawkins blog. People were attacking LRH and his policies, saying he was/is responsible for the current mess.
She pointed out that LRH is dead. Attacking him will do ZERO in exposing what is going on now … as I type to those unfortunate souls locked away at Hemet. To the staff members who give their time and effort thinking they are helping when sadly they are only allowing dm to continue to line his coffers and live like a king.
I admire that unwavering intention of Marty to expose dm and bring him down along with Corporate Scientology.
Marty is smart and willing to change viewpoints as well as open to other wisdom teachings.
Therefore, I’m going to trust that when/if the time comes that some LRH policies can be revisited Marty will do so with wisdom.
First dm and Corporate Scn must be dismantled.
That is my interest. The debates about LRH – becomes a huge distraction.
WH
Marty,
I’m glad to see you confronting the *why* of CoS turning into an oppressive entity. And I give a good amount of credence to what you say historically, as you were actually there for a good part of it.
However, some facts don’t seem to jibe. For example, Ron DeWolfe claimed that he was harassed for decades, and was estranged from his father, as from most of LRH’s family. His first wife claimed that he kidnapped his daughter to force his wife to sign a paper recanting her earlier accusations of his abuse. There were children that were locked up in chain lockers on his ship at his command, as well as people “overboarded”.
As I’ve said before, I think there are good parts of the “tech” worth saving. However, I still believe it is necessary for you, as well as other Independents, to confront the truth about LRH’s character, his abuse, and his paranoia for you to succeed.
Hell, a couple of posts ago you and your buddies had me “pegged” as some sort of government agent provocateur. While I appreciate your assertation that I’m smarter than OSA (and most other non-intelligent life forms, I might add), you are exhibiting the same paranoia as LRH.
I’m not a Scientology “hater”, but I do think that there is ample evidence of LRH’s life and character for you to realize that he was a complex character, and put on a very different face for “shore story” purposes.
Use the tech to your advantage, but LRH isn’t the sort of cat *I’d* choose to be my “spiritual leader”.
Hi;
Regarding the PTSness of Lrh;
Several years ago, 15 or so, I had a comm cycle with Alan Waters, and he related a incident which was quite interesting. Unfortunately I cannot remember the exact time the incident occured, but when it occured can be determined by looking at the SHSBC tapes where the lectures on Goals/Problems/Mass ended and the lectures on Study began. That was the period to which Alan referred.
According to Alan, who was a major player in Scientology at the time, very major, LRH was lecturing on his research on GPMs. At this specific time, there was a media request to interview LRH, and film the course room etc. Apparently LRH was quite excited about it, believing the interview was to be theta and proLRH. However, it was not, it was viscious, and LRH was personally hurt by it. Alan said from that day on, LRH had changed, he was not the same. When everyone on the SHSBC came back for the next lecture, supposedly carrying on with GPMs, LRH never talked about the GPMs, and never talked about them again. Alan realized years later that LRH went effect at that time, and probably PTS, and without any handle for himself, probably never came out of it entirely.
This would be in mid 60’s I guess. Time coincidence to some of the policies mentioned on this thread may be interesting.
I don’t know how true this is, but I was also curious as to why GPM research ended so abruptly when I did the SHSBC some 35 years ago.
(OMG, has it been that long?!!)
(OMG, yes it has!!)
I guess just curious when the Responsibility of Leaders section was added in there, and to see other changes that you have noticed, more or less.
Beautifully stated, Meta.
Erwin,
I fully agree ! 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂
A copy of RTC Conditions Order #1 was on the internet the last time I looked. I was a member of the Comm Ev (along with Jesse and others) and can add a little regarding it. I remember the order from LRH being “spit on John Aczel for me” (nothing about the face). Of course, in true cowardly Miscavige fashion he gathered a small gang, had them first chew tobacco and then together go and spit on John (a mild mannered middle aged man) in the most sadistic manner possible. I was in the comm ev room when the “gang” left and then returned and Miscavige was just over joyed with himself.
On the other side of things, don’t doubt that LRH was too holy to play rough. Ask Ron Clifford if LRH grabbed him on the film set, pushed him against a wall and flicked a cigarette ash down his shirt, or the Script Girl (Mary, my ex wife) about being screamed at, nose to nose, causing her to cry herself to sleep on more than one occassion.
In my opinion, LRH could play rough to make a point but Miscavige is just a weak, cowardly, sadistic, sociopath who gets off on dominating and
hurting others.
Jesse,
Marty,
More of that stuff please. It starts to make sense !
On the payroll of FBI and APA a false report or fact ?
He made it up.
Mat, Thanks a lot for this. I recalled the Aczel advice the same way – but you were actually there. I was in LA on All Clear. Thanks also for what I consider a very straight differentiation between LRH and DM. Hope all is good in the great Northwest woods.
Guys like Alan Walters, who think they are bigger than Texas, have a way of tranferring their own shit onto others.
Marty,
Great article and analysis, experienced the Simon Bolivar PL as the most important operating basis and didn’t realize it had been jammed down the throats pretty extensively and widely. It also makes it a total justification for Dear Leader to be amply rewarded and be way above the rest. As reverse head on a pike, those who apply Simon Bolivar to him are also very openly amply rewarded and become “favorites”, creating a “good old boy” network of sorts and power irregardless of organizing board form. Perhaps his motto or mantra is that you have to use the power or lose it, he’s very proud of having taken seniors down and grabbing power.
As this PL is of the AKH series (admin know how) which is 3rd Dynamic power formula, constantly applied perhaps it’s the wrong formula for Mestology to apply after the 90’s where overall stats started to decline. It is totally dead and confused currently, witnessed by dwindling memberships, more Goldenagerod declares and application of the wrong formula will never get it moving up higher.
If you credit Ron Dewolf you are doing yourself a serious disservice. He was nutty as a fruitcake. His attack on LRH and his Estate in 82 was so over the top that indpendent surveys found that despite unprecedented entheta being published about LRH, most folks sympathized with him in the matter.
I don’t know about everyone else, but I distinctly remember clearing the phrase “Fair Game” in my studies in the Church, in the early 1990s. I also read the supposedly canceled Fair Game “old” HCOPL right there in the courseroom, as part of clearing the phrase. Do people not study LRH anymore? Or do they not clear their words?
Correct whys open doors for handling.
I agree.
Casablance Tejas.
Whoever you are, I’d love to meet up some day. You were there and you have very accurately painted a portrait of any given day in the life at Int. Thank you for that.
Yep – I remember.
Ouch. Did you have a degree?
Very well spoken – you may only add his excellent black, british humor, which I really enjoied when working with him in Mimeo till 96/97
Dan – I concur 100%. He was a seriously good evaluator. One of the best.
Sid,
You just proofed LRH to be the noblest warrior in the history of mankind. You dug up the worst you could and pointed out it’s horrible association whereas in fact it’s about the kindest thing you can do to really help your enemy. LRH said to manufacture threat to effect peace, not alter facts or evidence to cause hate and blood. He said to sue for discouraging enemies, not win or physically destroy enemies like just about every other religion and country would. He said to continue until the slate is clear, leaving no BPC at either side, preventing future fights, something even Buddhists can learn from. He said not to tamely submit nor manufacture evidence but to expose actual evidence of real crimes to the press, just like we now expose Davey’s blooded hands, curbing the crimes, preventing more overts and making it rough to attack us. He gave Scientology the very tools that made it the only religion in the history of mankind which has never ever resorted to guns, ever! Even the worst squirrels haven’t done so yet.
Ensifer, I’ll repeat my advice after your latest comment. I never said, nor suggested that LRH was a “victim”. When I say hone “differentiation” it is that type of labelling and identifying I am referring to. As to Falsehood, you said something to effect that most folks knew all about Fair Game as if it were an extant policy. You were talking pre-1982, and my entire post STARTS in the year 1982 and I’m talking about my experience since then. Yet, you are start right out of the blocks saying I was wrong. What you observed pre 82 was not the same as what happened post 81.
I dont understand what you mean by did I have a degree.
I also find it interesting that two of my posts remain awaiting moderation while this one which I posted separate so that you could more easily moderate it out, went through.
Perhaps you are checking the LRH reference I posted?
My apologies if I seem prickly, my intent is to notice and mention.
Ensifer is someone known to me to wear the hat matching his cattle.
Isn’t it insane how ALL the other establishment and organizational policies of LRH’s, and marketing and PR and comm cycle information, have been ditched for this ONE little group of words out of a single policy? The time has come to know the technology yourself–that way you can’t be fooled.
If one focuses on 1/100th of the advices and policies for handling such, and applies them to the exclusion of the rest.
EISM — You captured and stated it perfectly. Thank you.
Ensifer~So it was a process he came up with and then somebody went into a session-like setting or interview and de-dinged them? Let them tell about the times they’d been dinged?
(In the early ’90s we were producing around $30,000-$70,000 a small group of us…till the vultures caught wind of it, that is.)
Jesse, I am reading a book that makes a very interesting point about how civilization loses when Science (objective) and Religion (subjective) are made mutually exclusive balliwicks. Kinda makes sense to me not to draw an indelible line between the two. I think that is what the Old Man was doing – helping to bridge that gap.
Marg,
I was somewhat more naive.
When I saw his Satanic Majesty on Nightline I was thankful that this guy wasn’t involved with the actual day to day management of the Church!
Jesse, You mis-read my comment. I never said the FBI associations were fact. They certainly were put in the reports at Special Project. And, no, Special Project reports were not available to then-RTC at Int. You are wrong about Mayo. He was settled with because had the case gone to trial trademarks and copyrights would have been weakened considerably.
Great post Mark. Thanks – I was trying to convey something along this line, but you really spelled it out.
+1 Mat.
Fabulous post Haydn. Context is so important.
This is true to me and I believe to most anybody in Scientology:
“Those people were there out of a desire to serve LRH and his mission, and David Miscavige hijacked that love and devotion …”
Your various examples brought back some memories – I’m talking about CLO EU under Walter Kotric. The typical and often repeated messages were “Message to Garcia”, “Definition of Backflash”, “Definition of Responsibility” and once at a muster Walter repeated what COB’s expectations were for the Translation Unit – TU – that was slaving away day and night to get the next release ready on time despite. This is close to verbatim I’d say: If I (COB) give you the manuscript for a book 30 minutes before an event I want it done on time (this was in response to reports that the manuscript provided to the TU changed so often or arrived so late that it made it practically impossible to get them done). There was not a single peep of complaint and it stopped any “justification” for not getting any nut order done.
There are other “famous quotes” that once had or might have had validity but were continued into time immemorial because they suited the senior or senior org: (paraphrased) “Successful orgs do what Flag tells them to do”, “Flag knows better than the local org”, “The GO is the most successful organization on the entire time track (early GO time)” … all backed by the old man himself – so, can’t argue, can you?
EISM,
Totally agreed, confirmed & very spot on.
I mean, do you have a degree is some field of study? As to the order of moderation, I am busy and when I get back to it I take them in the order they appear in line on my screen. No, I’m not researching your refernce (whatever it was). Man, you’ve got some serious dub in going.
Sid~You’re welcome.
So maybe the policy should not have been written. And maybe if it weren’t written, then David Miscavige or anybody else for that matter wouldn’t do such despicable things. Right? 😉
I really have no problem accepting that LRH made mistakes and you know, if he were here today, I might just tell him to take that back! Damn it! Because look what these idiots have done with it.
But, he ain’t here!
And as much as I’d like to be perfect…ehhe…I can say I haven’t followed those policies rotely but I can’t say that if a child molester who lives around the block starts stalking my daughter that I’m not going to “fair game” him out of town or maybe even into his grave. I’m not going to call the police on my other neighbor who smashes his face in. Or maybe I’ll flow power to him; I’ll bail him out of jail if he gets caught smashing the guy’s face in.
Could you blame LRH policy because I did?
So again, it goes back to why some people use only the “bad side” of the religion or technology. I do not think LRH was responsible for that because he wrote it down or said it.
It’s interesting how a single word can make a world of difference – leave out “face” and that statement doesn’t even mean actual spitting to me – what a literal moron Dementos Magnos is – though equally evil.
In all this “debate” and hints on “was LRH nuts” I guess most of thee and me ain’t gonna find out beyond what others say or remember. And do I care? Not really – sure, I’m interested. But it ain’t gonna change the picture I have of this man from the hundreds of lectures I heard him give. After all, that was him and he left a definite impression on me as to who he was. And that makes me the greatest authority on who LRH was (to me, that is).
Christ, Dave, are we to not have viewpoints or communicate them? Are we not to see an outpoint and communicate it for fear of becoming “a leader” and thus a “corrupting influence” on others? Not everyone’s a lemming, man, and not everyone needs the Nanny-state to take care of their “wellbeing”.
Marty’s what he is, jagged edges’n’all; I certainly don’t agree with everything he says, but he’s hosting this tribal council of ours and he lets people have their say (some may say too many given some of the manure he allows to be posted).
Hold your space.
R2-45 I think I found it: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/showbiz/bizarre/3206935/Tom-Cruise-films-stunts-at-the-worlds-tallest-building-in-Dubai.html
One of the first things I read, once I started to read Scientology related matters on the net, was Russell Miller’s “Bare-faced Messiah”. I immediately went onto the Scientology web-sites to find Miller’s crimes and to my big surprise found none. The book made me conclude that LRH was a genius and a malignant narcissist (not mutually exclusive) from day one. I recommend the book because it is very sobering to anyone, who wants to add perspective to their whole Scientology experience. If you add everything up (this thread has been the most interesting one yet, Marty, and that says a lot) you cannot help come out with the conclusion that LRH was a deeply flawed man, who was nowhere close to being the OT he wanted to be regarded as. Where his creations, Dianetics/Scientology, will be in the future, given this, you’ll only know as time evolves.
Tara ~
Yeah, something like that. There are a number of references to the whole thing if you just Google his name. It’s possible that Wimbush took it to some weird extreme towards the end of his “tenure” as a mission holder, I can’t say one way or the other though. Last time I saw Kingsley was that wonderful evening when Miscavige decreed him an SP from the podium and sent a team to the mission to apprehend the checkbooks.
🙂
Billy, Scientology is not supposed to be like “everywhere”, we used to have some policy and Standard Tech and Admin.
The ARC remains high, by the way, and is getting higher as we gather up. You are welcome here if you can talk and listen. I know it’s hard sometimes but this is a different blog. Believe it or not it’s a blog of Scientologists.
And Sid, I do realize critics are not child molesters, but I would suggest that with false reports and exaggerated BS on the lines, created fear, legal threats, etc. that anybody can be made out to look like one.
Great comparison, Margaret.
This other quote from the bible comes to mind when someone or some group misinterprets words of wisdom for their own exclusive benefit or power:
– Matthew 23:13-15
With DM deliberately misinterpreting (it seems impossible he could be that stupid?) the legacy from LRH, he sure is working hard to create for the poor sheeps still bowing down into the dust in his honor.
Mat,
Very good points. LRH had ethics presence like no other. There was one occasion at La Quinta where I messed up. He came in to the Rifle galley and came up inches away from me and yelled. I don’t remember what he said as the pure intention blew me away 3 ft behind my body, but I really got it. That was the only time and I still remember it well, it was well deserved but totally shocked at how much power simple wrath and intention contained, much more than physical martial arts which I studied.
I could only match that kind of a stunt with a unknown ( previously anyway) training drill of the Alexander The Great and some other elite Macedonians used to do and apply back when: which was a human catapults story. But not R2-45 for Alexander. Open enemy castle gates from within, yes.
Bodil, Thanks. I think to emphasize Miller as crucial to an analysis of LRH as a man is an invitation to spectatorism, at best. I think it is far more fair and far more accurate to judge a person by the body of his work (his product).
Ok, now I wonder as to why my having a degree is relevant? I was relating what Hubbard said about himself and how to approach reading and listening to what he said. No I do not have a degree. I did graduate high school by the skin of my teeth though. F in physics, and calculus due to my preference to read what interested me rather than do class work.
What I say should be considered as it is, not because I do or do not have certain authority conferred by degree.
As to dub in, I think I logically assumed that moderation would be in order of posting, but, counter intuitively it seems to be in reverse order. My mistake. Never assume anything because then you make and ass of u and me as the old saying goes. Mostly me it seems.
I am being reminded of my church experiences here. Unduplicated, evaluated for, and put on the defensive. But I am sure I have caused it.
Sometimes marty you are a bit arrogant. But I too now know my place. Thank you for making it clear.
Ensifer~Thanks.
(I was on hiatus from about ’77 to ’87) 😉
Hey Mark, looks like Halloween was good!!! Hehe, saw your painted pictures and now, hey, you got a clear cut message for those serious guys as to how life should really be: Insouciante and caring at the same time.
//What you observed pre 82 was not the same as what happened post 81.//
Well, I don’t want to beat a dead horse… okay, maybe just a little bit. Still, I don’t see where you and I are going to agree on this point, nor does it really matter. I will state though that it seems to me that the history of Scientology can’t fairly be broken into two eras and do it any justice. Whether you intend it or not, some readers of your blog get the impression that you are defending Hubbard and casting him as a victim of Miscavige. For many of us who have watched this train wreck from a distance over the very years you were one of the engineers, you now appear to be trying to separate the egg from the yolk after the scrambling process is over with.
Apologies for the metaphor, it’s an old habit that annoys some people but is endlessly entertaining to me. Personally, I just want the people I care about to leave Scientology as soon as possible. If they were more critical of Hubbard’s hand in their current “stressful” situation and actual prospects for anything even remotely approaching an “OT State” then I think the task of cutting the umbilical cord (Oops… metaphor alert!) would be easier.
Last thought – you mentioned in another response that it’s hard to judge a person based on a narrative by someone else, that their body of work is essential in understanding them. I agree. I’ve openly said that while I have read enough to know that Hubbard neither created or discovered the “tech”, rather he re-parsed the work of others and created a long form syllabus for the use of his work. I admire him for that anyway. He created a hell of an impact on a lot of people and despite the vast array of anti-Scn web sites, there are plenty of folks who honestly improved their lives using his books and procedures. I ought to know, I used to send them to you Org people by the boatload.
@Dave Adams
Thanks.
Jesse,
I wasn’t privy to the bulk of this stuff you refer to by being there. I did get what I got of it from my ex-wife. One thing I do know, that’s those NOTs materials in question. They are unmistakably L. Ron Hubbard. YES, David Mayo compiled them into HCOB form, he even wrote several to do with CSing/pgming. His initials are on the issues as are the initials of those who compile issues in RTRC. However, the tech, the data, the theory and practice are all LRH.
That DM attempted some sort of purge of David Mayo’s valid contribution is something else entirely.
Marty,
I always like this quote from William James from his work, The Varieties of Religious Experience: “In the natural sciences and industrial arts it never occurs to any one to try and refute opinions by showing up their author’s neurotic constitution. Opinions here are invariably tested by logic and experiment, no matter what may be their author’s neurological type. It should be no otherwise with religious opinions.”pp 17,18
Marty,
It’s funny how the criminal mind works.
Reading the book ‘The Secret History of the CIA’ by Trento.
You read about “Sasha” a Soviet Agent who managed to ingratiate himself with the Abwehr and later CIA by “exposing” actual lower level operatives in the White Russian community.
In fact he managed to make JJ Angleton so paranoid that he wrecked CIA’s own Soviet analytical department by making him suspect that anyone who spoke Russian must be a double agent.
Especially after Philby’s defection.
To sum it up “Sasha” managed to deflect attention off himself by accusing others of being moles or setting them up with disinformation.
Sid,
Consider this, I am a Scientologist. I apply Scientology tech. I have studied and apply Scientology policy. Yet, you, an apparent critic are not being handled by me in the manner interpretations of the references you quote would suggest.
JUDGEMENT.
Here’s another LRH quote on robotically applying any Scn policy – ANY policy:
“The more thetan you have present, the less policy you need and the better things run. Only a thetan can handle a post or a pc. All he needs is the know-how of minds as contained in Scientology. That was all he ever lacked. So, given that, sheer policy is poor stuff, as it seeks to make a datum stand where a being should be. That’s the whole story of the GPMs. So why not have live orgs?” Policy Letter 23 Oct 63.
Now, one would have to understand what GPMs are, how they work and how they are taken apart, in order to really fully grasp the above. In other words, one would have to understand the technology. In the absence of a grasp of that, and its purposes, then the scenario of putting a datum where a being should be, a being observing, evaluating and coming to a valid judgement, might just follow.
That scenario seems to me to be the one you object to. Me too.
Jim
Guess Marty knew his viewpoint would take some bashing on
this thread. Kudos.
MARTY
” I am not at this stage passing judgment on the wisdom of the inclusion of point Six of the seven points of power in the original policy letter. That may or may not be a debate at some time in the future. ”
I’ll have to re read this PL before such a debate. Been a long time,
and its fascinating to know how this was used and the whole “pink legs” thing which is completely new to me.
ERWIN CROUGHS
” If I were King in war with my neighboring country, I’d want strong and loyal officers too. I’d apply the PL exactly as written and promote the officers that really kick my enemy…..”
Trouble is, scientology is a religion, or at least a philosophy with core ideas of helping people and granting beingness, and empowering others. Not a military training text.
Then their are the quotes SID brought up.
Its interesting to be discussing this here, after years of existing on
“natterboards” where critics describe the likes of me as squirrels
for not wishing to apply all the PLs and picking and choosing what we wish to use.
But really its a matter of intellectual and moral integrity, and
of study tech. We study something and make it our own. Of course
we have the power of choice of rejecting it also, not so often mentioned but fundamental.
” A thetan has things beyond matter, energy, space and time
which can deteriorate. His power of choice, his ability to keep two locations separate, his belief in self and ethical standards are independent of material things. But these can be recorded in the time track as well and one sees them recover when no longer influenced by the time track.” HCOB 15 may 1963
The OP was very descriptive of a third dynamic engram repressing
the power of choice.
Bobo,
Good story. It’s just that. GPM research continued to a done. It’s a myth in certain circles of the wild and wooly zone that it didn’t. Unfortunately, those same circles picked up in the middle, what went to the end and the middle is…well, not so nice. Youch.
Thanks Jim. There is a lot to learn from James. I recently saw LRH refer to him favorably in lecture I read.
Authorship was not even a consideration. The evidence was so black and white and thorough it was the least of our concerns.
You know Jim, when Detroit org Fdn was first opened, I remember that first night. The staff were in the tone level of Action. It was one of the best nights of my life. Everything worked as advertised. The ED was a “pitiless” product officer but not in a low toned way. He was pitiless in the tone of Action and it was frigging fun.
To me it is a matter of Science of Suvival: Every person at any tone level will interpret any policy differently. “Fail Game” would be taken differently by someone in Tone 40 as opposed to someone at Tone 1.5.
As a Pro Cram Off when I find 2 staff who interpret a PL or HCOB differently, I have them M-9 it on each other.
It is just tone level and case. Definition of case is the way a person responds to his environment. My advice to all is to look at LRH’s Tone level and decide to read an LRH issue in his tone level and you will understand it as it was intended.
Spit in John Aczels face? Not in a million years. It was falsified by DM and he brags that LRH wrote it and he happily executed the order (1.5).
ML Tom
I’m an engineer? And I’m “you Org people”? I give up on this comm cycle, got work to do.
Brilliant Haydn, just brilliant.
ML Tom
Jesse,
This is what Chuck seems to bring up quite often as well.
First of all I can’t imagine the Ol’man ordering such a thing as it would be a such a gross violation of the policy on ethics gradients.
Secondly:
Did you or Miscavige verify this as a correct legal order.
You know per the ‘How to Defeat Verbal Checklist’.
I write this because I know personally that many “R” mults, mercs,advices, and even LRHEDs were later proven to be false.
Also if by any chance that it was an order that was actually written by Ron did anyone on the Committee bother to query it?
Since it did violate actual policy.
Since as you know by reading the PL ‘Seniority of Orders’ that policy is senior to orders.
I know that I personally received an order supposedly written by the Ol’man that I disagreed with so I directly queried and it turns out that he’d never actually written it.
Also if you actually know that such an order did actually exist why didn’t you keep a copy of it and post it here?
So we could see it for ourselves.
Instead of creating a ‘Hidden Data Line’.
Ex Int Staff Member,
Beautifully put. Thank you.
From a fellow EISM.
Kevin, this is earth. Show me the perfect human being. Show me this hidden standard – lest it remain hidden. And why would that be?
If you are stating that LRH was a product of his environment, and his writing have less and less credibililty/relevance as time goes on, then I am right there with you!
It also violates policy on continually handling emergencies or dangers after they’ve been resolved and the tech on arbitraries.
Also as an aside:
After all the craziness of the early ’80’s with the GO going down and the plethora of EOs that followed that there were several full amnesties issued after the scene had quieted down.
Yet the Church today hasn’t issued a single general amnesty per ‘Amnesty Policy’ since 1993 despite “unprecedented expansion”.
Doesn’t anyone think this is odd?
It’s true that the Ol’man could get ruthless and at times seem brutal (worse than Cap’n Bly) when under duress but once he handled the scene he was willing to forgive.
You know what LRH would say? I believe he would say: “Do not send to find for whom the bell tolls” I have had the word.
1.1
The very first thing I learned in Scientology was the idea that some data is more important than other data and could be called “senior data” and could be used to improve conditions. Unfortunately, I was later encouraged to ignore that idea, like everyone else in the church. Thanks Marty for this great post! I always thought the “pink legs” stuff was not suited for an ethics book.
ENSIFER
“I think he just looked at the dictionary definition of “ding” and came to the conclusion that people can be adversely affected by small slights that occur over time. Duh.”
I have read by somethere there who is a high trained C/S that Kingsley did an eval and from that came up with de-dinging. Read mostly good reports about it, and a couple of negative ones. Never
heard about the flowing power and money stuff. Don’t think that has ever been mentioned on the net before Marty posted about it. I’ll
ask Bernie Wimbush on the ivy forum for more data.
Marty,
I agree that LRH’s work is more important than some minor missteps in his life. However, Sarah Northrup was once portrayed as the world’s first clear (and that was supposed to be the DMSMH definition of clear). She’s too part of his “products”. So are all the OTs, who later on have fared very poorly in life or committed serious crimes. Before you embark on a huge commitment (including time and money) to go up the Bridge, shouldn’t you, as a consumer, educate yourself as to how other people before you have fared, good or bad – and shouldn’t you check the credentials and character of the person making the claims. My biggest problem with LRH is not his body of work (it is spectacular in my opinion). My problem is the over-promise of the subject, and that cannot be pinned on DM.
Billy,
Ummm, well I sorta was asking if you had some to elucidate. No matter. Next question, did we make out at some point and is that why I’m ‘dear’. And lastly, seeing these outpoints ‘anywhere’, do the pluspoints come to view?
Jim, the notorious smart-arse.
I hope you can someday get in session and experience for yourself how amazing and wonderful it can be.
7 ELEMENTS OF A CULT
1) A centralized form of leadership that rules with unquestioned authority
2) A body of convictions, beliefs, and practices set forth boldly as “the truth”
3) A compelling presentation of the group vision to prospects that is inviting and challenging
4) A series of manipulative socializing sessions to instill psychological dependence on the group
5) A definable process of group dynamics used to unethically control and manipulate members
6) A history of abuses of authority by group leaders freely using deception and fear tactics
7) A history of psychological and spiritual abuses of group members that destroy lives
Any of this sound familiar?
I agree Eisner,
I personally reviewed several cases who had been “de-dinged” and from what I remember it was sort of a “PTS handling” on steroids.
Most of it involved “subtle suppression” of some kind that “prevented” the person from spending all his money on Scientology.
Like for instance the guys wife may have said that they needed the money for groceries or something like that and all of a sudden she became a “suppressive” for suggesting it.
Leaving the PC with a surfeit of wrong PTS items that usually took several hour to correct because there was so many of them.
No lie.
One guy actually claimed his plant (the one with leaves and all that) was “suppressive” because it didn’t cooperate with him!
(Twilight Zone music please)
People were labeling other people “SPs” because they weren’t nice to them or because they got mad at them once.
Most of these items were absurd!
Worse they made a lot of PCs falsely PTS or obscured their actual SPs.
That said.
It seems that “de-dinging” has been accepted as “Standard Procedure” in the current Church of Squirrelotology by the number of SP declares issued secret or otherwise.
Tom,
Just between you and me, and the internet, when needed, I can breathe fire along with the best of Product Officers. Running the epurp on FPRD handled the twist in my intention. The intention now is clean.
I know exactly what you mean with the Detroit Action tone story too. I’ve experienced similar and those are some of the best moments so far.
Not to mention Soltan Gris’ tactics as derived from Loony Tunes eminent guru Bugs Bunny mixed in with Lumbar Hiist’s priceless words of wisdom.
Oh wow!
Another GO Techie on board.
I vaguely remember your name mentioned with fondness in the GO area I worked in.
Lenske? Emory? See, these are names I’ve never even heard of before. Who knows. All I know is what I know and can certainly accept responsiblity for that.
William Johnson,
OK, now YOU opened the door and me, well, I’m the one walking right through.
William, do you know why parents call their Williams ‘Billy’? Well, because otherwise it would be Willy. In English slang that would mean you would have had to go through school as Willy Johnson. That’s tantamount to Richard Wanker, that is Dick Wanker. Or Peter Putz.
Hmmmmmmm?
Far from it, the man developed out of this world technologies (yes, plural) but still had to exist in the real world, a vicious one at that, and yet some people see fit to criticize him in 2010 for not living by current standards though he was born a century ago, has been dead for a quarter of that and helped bring about, in at least some measure, those very standards.
I remember well when the Kingsley Wimbush tapes hit the field. I listened to them and although I saw that there were some valid points, one being that if an area does not do well there is suppression, I also saw and cautioned others that it was going to end badly. When I told a mutual Class VIII friend this, she asked “how could that happen?” I told her that untrained Scientologists have a proclivity toward hobby horsing and I could see this getting crazy. It was already bad enough that if you raised a valid objection to an order that you were accused of “back flash”, now you would be a ‘dinger’. I could see staff being required to be give money to their ED or seniors to show their support and crazy reg cycles ensuing. She thought I was being pessimistic.
Then I heard stories of supervisors in missions having bells that they dinged if someone was late to course or if someone looked BIs. The GI’s rose as public were threatened with being considered suppressive if they did not push power to their org/mission. Even a Class VIII I respected was involved in the chaos. It was insanity but it seemed to me at the time to be mostly at a local level in Northern California. (I could be wrong here, it may have gone nationwide.) It needed to be stamped on hard. People were raving that it was great because the GI stats were up, up, up! What they didn’t think about were the consequences and the refund stat would later go up, up, up.
This above squirrelling was all DM and crew needed to begin their reign of terror. What should have been handled with some Ethics and Cramming was handled with a howitzer that decimated the field. Even people and missions that did not indulge in ‘dinging’ tech were shot.
As is pointed, in Marty’s article and the many comments here, the situation of hobby horsing policies and particularly this one, is very serious now. In my opinion, hobby horsing has been and always will be a problem in any subject or discipline. It takes intelligence and judgment to sort out relative importances. It also takes experience and knowledge of the subject. I don’t read L. Ron Hubbard in a monotone. He covers this fairly well in study tech although few seem to grasp this. It’s even in how to give a *rate check-out. The main tenets of Scientology can be found in the Axioms, Maxims and rules. For example, if you get an order to injure someone from a senior, it should be queried and written up for the destructive order it is. Your senior might come back at you with “pink-legs” (btw, never heard of this before) or you are counter-intending command intention, however if you understand PTS tech, O/W tech, and have a command of the axioms you would realize that it would be a more serious offense to comply.
I do not disagree that all the abuses can be traced back to something L. Ron Hubbard said or wrote. However as many have pointed out the large majority of Scientologists never took “Fair Game” as a license to hurt others. In fact, I think applying “Fair Game” is a great way to create further problems for the applicant and sure fire way to become effect of who/what he/she were attacking.
One reference out of many that is available.
Axiom 58: Intelligence and judgment are measured by the ability to evaluate relative importances.
Corollary: The ability to evaluate importances and unimportances is the highest faculty of logic.
Corollary: Identification is a monotone assignment of importance.
Corollary: Identification is the inability to evaluate differences in time, location, form, composition or importance.
In my opinion the axioms are where the heart of the subject lies. Not with the abuses of DM or even LRH.
L. Ron Hubbard summed up the Axioms of Scientology (58 of them)
The above (referring to the 58 Axioms) is a summary of being which can be used to create, cause to persist or destroy.
HAVING AGREED TO THE MECHANICS AND RETAINING THE AGREEMENTS, THE THETAN CAN YET MAKE INNUMERABLE POSTULATES WHICH, BY THEIR CONTRADICTIONS AND COMPLEXITY, CREATE, CAUSE TO PERSIST AND DESTROY HUMAN BEHAVIOR.
From Scientology 0-8 by L. Ron Hubbard
Marty and Jim
As another sample of redefining “ethics” into “morality” I offer the Churches current definition of “overt”.
This from “the Flag Land Base News” of recent issue.
On the back of the cover, at the bottom, is a “glossary”. In it is the stated definition of “Overt”, and I quote;
“OVERT: a harmful act or transgression against the moral code of a group is an “overt act” or “overt” When a person does something that is contrary to to the moral code he has agreed to, or when he omits to do something that he should have done per the moral code, he has committed an overt act. An overt act violates what is agreed upon.”
In contrast, here is the definition from the “Dianetics and Scientology Technical Dictionary”. (1975 edition)
OVERT ACT: 1. an Overt Act is not just injuring someone or something; an Overt Act is an act of omission or commission which does the least amount of good for the least number of dynamics or the most harm for the greatest number of dynamics. (HCO PL 1 Nov 70 III ) 2. an intentionally committed harmful ACT committed in an effort to resolve a problem. (SH Spec 44, 6410C27) 3. that thing which you do which you aren’t willing to have happen to you. (1SH ACC 10, 6009C14)
WW
Wise words Martin!
Loved your analogies.
High five homey 🙂
ERWIN CROUGHS
“LRH said to manufacture threat to effect peace, not alter facts or evidence to cause hate and blood. ”
Well Marty, you opened Pandora’s box here. Sigh.
Erwin, you’ve caused me to adopt my critical valence which is not my favorite, but have you heard of Paulette Cooper?
The only reason she isn’t in jail is that the FBI raid found that LRH
had ordered extreme fair game on her and this led to falsifying
letters implicating her in bomb threats to government.
I’ll leave you to research that.
Talk about rose tinted spectacles! One must view LRH as he was, not as you would like him to be. He had flaws, was human, and a
genius.
Dan and Mike, I agree with you completely. John Aczel couldn’t hurt a fly and was a great evaluator. He was holding WDC Mission Network and WDC LA Day at the time he got smeared by false reports from DM I am sure. I was embarassed when I heard that DM had actually spat at Aczel. He was an interested party on the RTC Conditions Order #1 if I recall and unjustly so. Spitting became the “cool” handling for people on the decks in trouble. I had to dodge one from Gary Conley at the time who was the IG MAA when I was on the decks for “disaffection” because I disagreed with the RTC Conditions Order #1 Comm Ev and was eventually sent to the RPF in Pac. John was a good man and I too would like to see him out.
Isn’t that were gays are on the tonescale acording to Ron; ) ? Or was he just projecting :).
A agree William makes to big a sweep in generality. However above nasty jest holds a vicious truth and reminder of a past that wasn’t tolerant for homosexuals and curtailed their FREEDOM and even had them hanged and or jailed for acting out their preference.
So part of the writing has become “out of date”, as are some outrageous claims about curing some types of diseases with the tech . Or the thing on radiation and sexual transmitted diseases.
Others texts hold their ground. Like the thing about sex and pain. If you read that like I do you see that it just states that sex and pain can be tools of control wich is true as alsoo lieing to people is a tool of control wich is alsoo true.
As for the reactive mind versus the analitycal mind. I see that a work-model or one way of aproaching the subject of mind, not to be taken as absolute. Philosophy never deals in absolutes and I know what I just said may be a generalization of sorts.
CD
Bobo,
I don’t know where you get the idea that “GPM research was abruptly ended”.
Christ!
RDs like ExDn, SPRD and the FPRD are all based on GPM research.
Not to mention CC and OT II.
Where ya been?
… and that’s his ‘social’ tone.
Poor Ronnie,
A true product of Mk Ultra.
At one time the guy was a dedicated Scientologist.
BTW did any of the so-called critics notice that the poor man retracted much of what he said in later interviews and was not very pleased with Russell’s over the top screed.
Got it, thanks!
You studied or word cleared “fair game” in the 1990s? What on Earth and where did you study, Bryon? Under DM? I’ll be darned and agree with Billy on that one. I didn’t study an anything in the 70s, 80s or later about Fair Game. It was just briefly in force and cancelled in the 60s.
You guys know that declaration, do you?
http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/legal/a1/appeal/decl-rathbun-1991-08-13.html
In my humble opinion, like some other policies, fair game wasn’t by LRH but by some weirdo. Is Capt. Bill Robertson around? Did anybody ever ask Ken Urquhart about the source “Fair Game”? He might know more.
Listen folks, “fair game” was cancelled decades ago but if you feel that it is still around then ’cause lowtone people (also those who never had anything to do with the C of S) like to retaliate against those they do not like. I see it in the wog world all the time. Lots of fair gaming going on there. Ask some politicians or corporate managers, and they tell you how many folks are fair gaming them.
Nibbs was an oddball. I always wondered why Diana Hubbard also carries the Dewolf in her name. Is that another Dewolf? How many Dewolves are there?
Good choice not blaming LRH. He’d never approve of DM’s actions.
Do think that DM has the overview and control over all these people or do you think that somebody runs DM?
Steve Hall gives insight as to who created the RPF. Wasn’t LRH.
http://www.scientology-cult.com/the-rpf.html
Smack! Bang! Crash!
I just love a good fight. Love it.
But, I like understanding more.
None of us is so great in understanding that we can’t work on our differentiation skills. None of us. Proof? We’re still here.
We all differ in our ability to observe , analyze, evaluate and to communicate. I like Marty’s stuff for the most part, but see flaws. I like Ensifer’s stuff for the most part, but see flaws. I’ve put stuff on this blog that made a lot of sense, and I’ve put stuff up that got me bitch-slapped for being knuckle-headed, which made me think and re-evaluate and make corrections.
I was around pre-82 and most of us knew about disconnection and fair game. Since not everyone suddenly disappeared from Scientology that had studied pre-82, that knowledge would have persisted. Thus, a much larger percent of staff and public would have continued to know of its existence. 99% is hyperbole not fact. And if we are to be concerned with falsehood and fact rather than pure entertainment, then that figure bears revision.
From what I read early on, Kingsley got hit with a tsunami of black PR. I’ve never known black PR to subscribe closely to truth as an abiding consideration. The black PR machine of DM was eating up opposition with astonishing ease. Separating fact from fiction became a nightmare. What to believe? Not so easy.
As for reminding others they aren’t my superior, I’ve yet to meet anyone who is inferior. Everyone offers me something me something to learn.
Slamming one another around and drawing blood can sure be entertaining.
However….
Michael
Another comment as I find this thread so absorbing.
Take any org in the world and just assume that the entire public and staff could and would gather to have an open talk about what happened to their org, what went wrong and why and how to handle. Assume they actually did.
Do you know that they still would be missing what is present on this blog: the unbelievably wide range of people taking the podium – old-old timers who were there who fill in gaps, tech trained and admin trained guys providing all kinds of viewpoints, public, staff and SO heroes (and probably some bums in each group as well), LRH haters and lovers, believers in a better world and cynics that try to throw a wrench in the gear and whatever else this world has to offer, mixed from all parts of the world, covering all parts of Scientology’s time track.
Marty, you got quite an eminent crowd here. Look at the combined experience, knowledge and viewpoints. It’s here for everyone to have and feast on and learn.
I for one learn from you all. From the keen and smart to become keener and smarter and if a comment is dull and useless I simply toss is away (just as you should do with my comments 🙂
Hi Marty;
Regarding the ‘Simon Bolivar’ PL;
In my opinion, in any PL where LRH is discussing handling of people who are ‘difficult’ or ‘resistent’ in some way cannot be read alone. It gives, or could give, a false impression.
When someone is reading that Simon Bolivar PL, and others of that ilk, with the intention to apply it to some scene, they should also be VERY familiar with those HCOBs/PLs where LRH comments about using ARC, leaving the door open a craaaack, ARCXen people attack, good neighbours policy, the purpose of ethics, clean hands, and so forth. There are probably 100s of LRH insights into how to apply the Simon Bolivar PL properly.
Taken by itself, it I don’t see how it can be viewed as anything but destructive. It is the primary reference used by OSA to commit the crimes OSA commits. That PL makes it ‘okay’ to violate policy, to violate common sense. I don’t think LRH ever intended it to be used that way. Maybe I’m wrong … I know he was not an angel … but still …
Personally, I think a lot of the PLs that are seen on face value as encourging ‘bad behaviour’, LRH wrote with specific situations in mind. If LRH is to be criticized for anything, it would be because he never put that data into the PL, giving it context, or never ‘retired’ the PL once the climate had changed. Given the hat he wore, he may well have simply had no time to go second guessing and reviewing PLs. Maybe he expected us to be able to use our own good common sense and figure it out for ourselves.
Murder better than mass implanting. I in my stultified way would have opted to be murdered any day than implanted effectively. What my bitch is, is how we can not keep from commiting overts against our comrades on this mad ball planet despite knowing the road to freedom is there.
Ensifer, I read your blog and enjoy it. But on this one I have to agree with Marty. Being a new, young staff in Salt Lake. Steve Surrey Msn Holder/John Balken ED. The Wimbush stuff was brutal. The ED took the most volatile staff member and made him the D/ED. Mandatory meetings daily for de dinging. Screaming, yelling. Being forced to give money for our seniors. I recall a Wolfe Range for the ED was one forced “flow to power”. Since I didn’t really see Surrey I can’t say if he was part of this but it’s hard to imagine Balken doing this on his own.
Those of us who disagreed were ganged up on. One staff member who had attested to past life clear was kept up all night and screamed at until she “gave up her withhold” of not really being a past life clear.
This so weakened the staff that after the SF msn holder conference happened and the Finance Police came in it just seemed more of the same.
That’s right – and the door would snap shut and lock when the second hand of the clock would hit the “12” for roll call. Only course room I ever saw with this kind of synchronization of “clock” and “lock”.
This is all a tough call, judging the character of LRH. I’ve personally seen people in chronic fear get through the Grades and come out the other end very much a different, happier, more confident person. To me, that speaks volumes above the things LRH set up which I do not agree with.
It’s his work that counts as the millenia tick by. Not his flaws.
Terril, please cite your source for “LRH had ordered extreme Fair Game on her”.
Raindog, comment of the day in my opinion. Thanks.
Bobo, GPM research ended abruptly because it was complete.
Alan and quite a few others followed a blind alley.
Using the word “realize” suggests that Alan’s ideas were correct which I disagree with.
LRH did talk about GPMs later in the Class 8 lectures and made it clear that they were rapidly handled on the grade chart.
He discontinued research into Actual GPMs after it became obvious that they were implants.
Some of the people involved have not been very forthcoming with data so my best guess is – LRH ordered a mission to go through actual GPM folders and look for similarities in “actual” GPMs to determine whether or not they might be implants. Otto Roos appears to have been involved.
From the results of that mission LRH spent several months plotting out the actual implants as can clearly be seen from the dates at the top of the LRH handwritten OT2 platens.
OT2, as released, runs out all “actual” GPMs if fully run.
Unfortunately Pre-OTs are pressured to “complete” OT2 rapidly so that they can pay for auditing on OT 4 and 5.
If they are quickied on OT2 and OT3 then it will take them a lot more OT5 auditing at high prices to be ready for Solo NOTs.
My confront of EVIL has come up over the years. DM is not a nice person.
Yeah, sounds like the haters.
Totally valid point. That is DIFFERENTIATION.
And the application of policy (or anything else) will hardly ever be better than the Intelligence of the person applying it for intelligence is the ability to recognize identities, similarities and differences.
No, I never did. That is a hidden standard in my view. I don’t and never did look to others to emulate in order to attain to higher states of awareness and understanding.
WJ,
I don’t think Hadyn’s saying that Ron was a “product of his environment” at all.
He basically stated that many of his writings were contemporaneous.
I suggest you actually read what he wrote without injecting you own idee fixee’.
One of LRH’s legacies is providing us a means of analyzing and evaluating data. Not all data are equal; some are much more important. LRH envisioned a pyramid of data, with those higher up explaining all data below. You see this with his datum “survive” as explaining all actions in the physical universe. And then he found data that was even more important which evolved from Dianetics to Scientology.
He moved us out of the realm of man and into the realm of the spirit. He gave us logics and pre-logics and axioms and the data series. He explained obnosis, observing what was obvious. He talked about integrity and making the information your own. In study tech we learned how to look at an idea and see how it was that way and how it wasn’t. Always comparing. Always applying.
The big lesson in Scientology was how to apply data to life. How could you apply this datum? Where did it fit? How did you gain ARC-understanding with the datum?
LRH wrote and spoke millions of words. He covered so many subjects and aspects of life. He wrote that newspaper would work well in cleaning a car. He wrote about life being basically a static. He wrote about how to evaluate what was important and what was not.
He expatiated on fixed ideas, and how fixed ideas prevented one from learning and from living successfully.
And that DM could distort the importance of “Responsibility of Leaders” is such an indictment against those who adhere to DM’s organization. To turn this concept of supporting power into a fixed idea that justifies overts and overrides responsibility and undermines personal integrity is just jaw dropping.
My inclination is to just start disparaging those who fell for it. But my Tweetie Weetie is sitting on my right shoulder going, “No, no, no, no,” so I’ll refrain and go sing a couple of refrains of “Bringing in the Sheaves,” instead.
An exasperated, drawn out, “God!” can be heard in the distance as the writer leaves the room, singing some Christian tune so out of key as to be unrecognizable.
Michael.
But please note that XDN and FPRD contain no mention of opterms.
The method of running involved in XDN totally violate the rules stated earlier of running actual GPMs. Perhaps LRH could have written it up more clearly. XDN and FPRD are ways of addressing the way a thetan builds up the charge. Please note that they do not involve or address GPMs.
When he developed XDN LRH considered GPMs history fully covered and run out in a properly run OT2.
Beautiful. Clear. Very well stated. Exactly!
Great post!
JustCallMeMary
Well…. Have a look at..(and I quote the issue exactly)
HCO POLICY LETTER OF 23 DECEMBER 196
(replaces HCO Policy Letter of 7 March 1965,
Issue I. This was originally misdated as
1 March 1965)
and from it I quote…
“A Suppressive Person or Group becomes “fair Game”.
…….
By FAIR GAME is meant, may not be further protected by the codes and disciplines of Scientology or the rights of a Scientologist.
……….
The homes, property, places and abodes of persons who have been active in attempting to suppress Scientology or Scientologists are all beyond any protection of Scientology Ethics, unless absolved by later Ethics or an amnesty.”
First… notice in paragraph number three, that this actual quote from the actual policy letter is worded somewhat differently from the one you quoted above. Perhaps no big deal but read it carefully!
Secondly; I draw your attention to the fact that the issue does not promote or suggest any action against the “Suppressive Person or Group”. Neither does it promote nor condone any illegal activity. It simply states that they “are all beyond any protection of Scientology Ethics”.
Also in the “definition ” of FAIR GAME above it it states : “may not be further protected by the codes and disciplines of Scientology or the rights of a Scientologist.”
Unfortunately I cannot find any issue called ” HCO Policy Letter of 18 October 1967, Issue IV” in the OEC volumes issued in 1969. There is no original issue with that date either. I would like to see a copy of that issue if possible.
Just getting “all KSW” on it. ( from my viewpoint)
WW
Jesse,
Geeze… You had to go and stir up my morbid memory of RTC CONDITIONS ORDER #1!
I’ll never forget when we, security, received all the interested parties to watch and “keep secure”.
Let’s not forget the * Advice to the Running Pgm I/C where * stated David was to run till you could no longer see his head! That was in reply to the RP I/C reporting to * @ progress with the new pgm and how the runners wore a deep rut or groove into the ground around that cottonwood behind the garage!
Let’s also not forget the verbal and physical abuse those folks received!
I also couldn’t understand why 2 non-RTC STAFF Matt Pesch and Jim Cupp were assigned to the Comm-Ev?
Boy, MORBID memories this has stirred up for me… And others obviously!
Hey David Miscavige, since you stopped by to read this post with the rest of us, tuck your shirt in cuz your thong is showing!
BTW…. Where is your wife Shelly Miscavige and our great friend HEBER JENTZSCH!!!!!
–Jackson
dora,
Interesting stuff. Names and all. I just wrote a comment about not having read this about Wimbush. I stand corrected.
Michael
Hi Marty;
This comment is off the topic of this thread, but I’ve never had trouble with ‘science’ and ‘spirituality’ being exclusive.
I figure that ‘we’, or a ‘god’, or whatever fills in the blank, created the physical universe some way, and what we study in science is how ‘we’ did it. I can’t see how any subject that concerns us isn’t spiritual in it’s very essence. All we are doing in the advancement of science is ‘uncovering’ our postulates.
Interesting time track. It made me wonder who interfered with this power org and who influenced Dean so much on his narrow application of Responsibility of Leaders?
If we’re gonna cherry-pick quotes as JCYM did, we might as well include this one:
“But you don’t have somebody that’s been around three years and turn up suddenly to be an SP…..
You should upgrade your idea of what an SP is. Man, meet one sometime! A real one! A real monster…. Well, in all the time we’ve been around here we only had one SP that I know of. One real SP that was on staff…. And I don’t know of another single SP that we’ve ever had on staff. Isn’t that interesting. You see all these SP orders and so on… Don’t throw it around carelessly, because this is an–a very exaggerated condition, SP.”
— L. Ron Hubbard, LRH Recorded Lecture “About Rhodesia,” July 18, 1966
If “Fair Game” might only be applied to a “real SP”, it doesn’t sound like it could rightly be applied very often at all. And even then, it sounds like it would be an individual action someone might take on his own responsibility, outside of the Scientology Justice system, at his own risk of being found liable for breaking the laws of the land.
My current conclusion regarding Terril is that he seeks to disdain LRH somewhat in order to promote the “Freezone” which implements Bill Robertson’s psychotic “upper OT levels”.
I occasionally suggest that LRH may have made an incorrect decision based on the data available to him as sometimes distorted considerably by those with vested interests.
I am one of the few people here who have actually met LRH and looked straight into his eyes.
I trust that being. I have not met anyone comparable.
He never claimed to be GOD and was not.
Isn’t this wonderful! A real debate with awkward questions being asked and answers demanded. Whatever else we may think, we certainly couldn’t have done this in the CoS.
When I was ‘in’ I had heard of ‘Fair Game’ but wasn’t aware of its use against critics. However, I was of the mindset that that there were ‘SPs’ who wanted to stop us clearing the planet and if they got run over by our fire engine, then serve them right for getting in the way.
I have read a lot of material on LRH and have my own views on what sort of person he was, but I won’t air them here for several reasons. Partly because I never met him (unless my whole-track ‘recall’ is accurate) [he added cryptically] and prefer to hear from people who had direct experience with the man.
But in any case, he isn’t here now and the subject he started is being thoroughly trashed by others who are here and are the ones we want to be concerned about IMHO.
And while I’m here, I’ll just throw this into the pot – although I don’t have much personal experience of the person, based on the many descriptions and first-hand accounts, I am pretty sure that David Miscavige is a thoroughly nasty piece of work, borderline insane and his actions are clearly extremely destructive to the CoS, Scientologists and the subject in general. But, he is only one person. He would not have any power if he didn’t have many, many people following his orders and going into agreement with things that they must KNOW are not right.
Yes, I went along with the flow, because I wanted to achieve ‘Total Freedom’ or whatever it was I was looking for. Yes, I compromised my own integrity and justified away all the little outnesses (and some larger ones) because I bought all that BS about trying to build with broken straws and the staff needed auditing more than anyone and all that other crap.
But I was never in a position to see what went on behind the closed doors of Int. I was still ‘in’ when I heard the ‘Musical Chairs’ story from Marc Headley and I was deeply shocked. I didn’t know if it was true or not (it certainly sounded very convincing), but I thought to myself “If it IS true, then something is VERY wrong in the heart of my church”. I cannot believe that if I knew half of the things that went on at the Int Base that I would have stayed for one second longer in the CoS.
I was in the SO myself so understand the pressures that people are under and the overriding sense of duty and purpose. But surely all these guys like Heber, Guillaume, Marc, Ray, Norman, Karen and all the rest, must surely know what is happening is so terribly wrong and actually destroying something that they swore to protect? So why is it that these people, all of them OTs, continue to support Miscavige by staying there?
And another question for Marty. You have said that Miscavige manipulated LRH by feeding him false reports and convincing him that the FBI were after him etc. How is it that LRH was so easily duped? I mean, this is the guy that wrote the book on SPs and how they behave. Literally. Isn’t he the one that said “Look, don’t listen”?
Axiom142
You think the time frame is important to the written message but when you actually read it and compare it to any other existing judicial system or try to think up a better one, I’d be happy to hear what you come up with. His handlings for enemies destroying Tech or Religion were incredible smart (except cancelled or misapplied policy) leaving the least BPC or liability to future attacks and ending most conflicts. I yet have to find a single issue he wrote (and didn’t cancel) for which I can figure a better alternative. Talk me down.
Does KSW1, the paragraph that says more or less “In each case, an executive who could not or would not assimilate straight Scientology, was found” ring true here?
It sure does ring true for me.
It is interesting that this thread continue to provoke more and more discussion. Fair Game and Suppressive TRIGGER a lot of reaction in society and fence sitters. I think before Fair Game can be even considered as a topic, one needs to understand suppression and how LRH and Scientologists view suppression. Look at the definition from the dicitonary:
sup·press Verb /səˈpres/
Synonyms:
verb: repress, quell, smother, stifle, quash, restrain, subdue
Forcibly put an end to
Prevent the development, action, or expression of (a feeling, impulse, idea, etc.); restrain
Prevent the dissemination of (information)
Prevent or inhibit (a process or reaction)
Partly or wholly eliminate
Consciously inhibit (an unpleasant idea or memory) to avoid considering it
Prior to 1950, LRH was a darling of the press and yes, he presented himself as a dashing figure when he could in a clear attempt at self-promotion (but if you do not promote yourself, do not expect others to), but when he released Dianetics, he was attacked and suppressed. Why? Others sought to SUPPRESS him. That is a fact. Some like Joe Winter and Joseph Campbell had personal reasons – they didn’t like past lives or resented LRH’s authority as the developer of the technology; but there were also vicious attacks that had more to do with what LRH referred to as vested interests.
In our current culture, we have all sorts of suppression in matters regarding to money and politics and war. Congress simply suppresses decent legislation and blames it on the other party. Many people have been hurt for no good reason and there is inadequate policing of suppression in the environment. Suppression and abuse are synonymous. If you assume that LRH was culpable of suppressive or abusive acts, focuing on them does not address the principles he authored about suppression and how it can be remedied. This is the major point. He wrote valuable information that is useful to individuals and cultures. People who try to STOP LRH are reacting as if LRH can, did or would stop them. They need to learn how to deal with suppression to and sort themselves out.
As a Scientologist, I occasionally heard stories that made LRH sound unappealing. I heard about overboards and hosing of the Class VIII students at AOLA. Those were for “high levels” of OT I was told. It was not for beginners. What I learned with Dianetics was awesome and so was going exterior. What could be better than that? And LRH brought it to me. When I joined the Sea Org, I heard stories that were maybe a little more daunting. I had “run out” these sort of incidents in Dianetics and was not afraid of these. When I got to the Apollo, I learned these things pretty much didn’t happen any more because yelling at incompetent officers on the bridge to “Recall!” didn’t work. LRH thought he could get them to perform by remembering their abilities on the whole track. I learned that LRH could be harsh but I tended to encounter his pleasant and friendly side. I also knew it was up to me to perform and interface in such a way that I would not incur his wrath. Following such a path could often make you unpopular with the crew who sometimes reacted like nasty suppressives in this respect. In retrospect, I have to say that LRH was a stern task master but he treated me better than any other crew or Sea Org member. The only exception might be those who audited me using LRH’s technology but then they were extensions of him. If you do not like LRH as a person or as a spiritual leader that is fine. Instead, I invite you to study him as a phenomena and do not get emotional in your study. I think the wholesale of slaughter of LRH as a real person with feelings, etc. can be attributed to a non-scientific attitude in addressing what the man was and what he was really doing.
One other thing. LRH’s life was peppered with a deep study of occult magic(k). One of the requisites to studying magick is that you get yourself extensive psychotherapy and clean out your own house. Only then will you be able to approach the subject. LRH created his own therapy but if you really want to study what LRH was about, work out your own emotions and get some real valid psychotherapy. You will know it is valid when you are not reacting like a hyena.
Terril (if it actually is Terril Parks and not an impersonator),
I have reviewed every single document reproduction available online related to Paulette Cooper and Operation Freakout. So far, I have yet to see a single one authored by Ron Hubbard.
Kindly provide an exact, accessible citation or retract this canard.
Michael A. Hobson
I think ultimately we will need to take a very honest look at everything LRH wrote. We should credit him for his fantastic discoveries and also note when we think he didn’t make his points well. He wrote some absolutely great and vital stuff about executives and the group in the early and mid 50s. “The Responsibility of Leaders” is convoluted and frankly, sometimes just wacky or nuts. And very woggy at times. Ron was obviously “going through something” at this time. I had to study this PL at various times over 35 years . What exactly IS the point? Nowhere does he mention the Leader’s ultimate responsibility in making correct decisions that lead to the group’s increasing survival. That’s how I evaluate a leader that is worth flowing power TO. The Leader having KNOWLEDGE, using compassion, communication and smarts.
All this bullshit about bodies, money, etc. There are a couple of useful things in this PL, but most of it is really nutty stuff that staff members have to pretend to understand and be glad we’re done with until the next time it shows up.
martyrathbun09 | November 2, 2010 at 9:40 pm | Reply
Terril, please cite your source for “LRH had ordered extreme Fair Game on her”.
Really cool of you to ask! I don’t keep well ordered tabs on critical
material but I will do what you ask. Best I recall the best ones, and there are many, are boring court transcripts.
When we met you asked what was my relation to LRH. I answered that I only have a relationship to the tech. I’m not well trained enough to criticise any tech or advance it. Didn’t know LRH. Had
great gains from tech and love it and promote it constantly. Did OEC/FEBC and consider myself qualified to make comment or criticism
on policy. Not that thats a particular aim. Most of it I like.
On this I recall Jack Nicolsons comment in the film with Tom Cruise, a few good men, ” You want the truth, you can’t handle the truth.” That applies to some here.
I have three Intro to Scientology Ethics books. I’m a book hoarder 🙂
The 1968 edition (reprinted 1983) from DK doesn’t have Responsibilities of Leaders. It does have Anti-Social and Social Personalities, Conditions, Conditions Formulas, Ethics Codes (the rather short form), Petition, Rewards and Penalties plus Safeguarding Technology.
The 1989 edition from DK is the first one with bucket loads of extra stuff including the vastly expanded list of offenses. Someone had culled every single reference from policy and tech regarding any possible thing that could be considered a High Crime and added it to the list. It has Responsibilities of Leaders as the last chapter (8).
The 2007 GAK edition from DK has it as Chapter 5. There seems to be a reference in the copyrights to a 1998 edition as well which I don’t have. Must have missed that one.
Responsibilities of Leaders is in the 1991 OEC Vol 0 on page 629. I never had the very original (thinner) set of OECs, and I must have donated to the org my 1986 OEC 0 special Xmas gift to staff from RTC as I don’t have it anymore. So I can’t tell if the PL was in those earlier volumes or not.
Right, does LaoTze’s, Jesus’ or Buddha’s thinking “have less and less credibililty/relevance as time goes on?” I don’t think so.
“L. Ron Hubbard, the former science fiction writer who publicly resigned in 1966 from leadership of the Church of Scientology, continued to give orders to its leaders into 1977, a Washington court has been told…..
Sorry it is so long…I can give you complete court references if you wish.
“I know I fed the beast.”
Me too. There, I said it. Now I can’t unsay it.
Now I feel better. I didn’t expect it, didn’t even think about feeling better, but I do.
Translation for Terril and Davey:
King=Religious Leader
War=IRS suit
Officer=Manager/Director
Kick Enemy= win suits, end harrasments and down stats
Martin,
I think you got the essence of the man there. I also think that the REAL responsibility of a leader is not in that PL, but in this statement from LRH:
“To lead is to serve and gives one only the right to serve.”
I can’t find the reference to cite right now, perhaps someone else knows where it is written.
AnonScio: her name is Diana Hubbard-Horwich. Even minimal Goggle skills should have told you that, pal.
Michael A. Hobson
Miscavige nick-named the WDC Chairman, Marc Yager “Santandar”, who was the covert enemy of Simon Bolivar per the Responsibility of Leaders policy. All of WDC had to read books, word clear the policy and write essays about how to apply the points of power regarding DM and forward the essays to his wife/assistant Shelly (who is still MIA)…
Miscavige once called me “robotic” when I reached for an LRH reference. Meantime, we were supposed to M9 word clear all of HIS orders and transcripts of his meaningless, long-winded meetings that went NOWHERE as he changed his mind every 1/2 minute and would wind up with no conclusion – other than “you’re all a cluster of SPs who are just trying to do me in!”
RJ: at such a time as you are able to provide documentation that Ron DeWolfe was ever subjected to CIA Mind Control (MKULTRA), please do so promptly. In all these years, your comment is the very first time I’ve seen anyone make that particular accusation.
Dox or GTFO!
Michael A. Hobson
Tom,
A small quibble here – the word “responds” means to me an action a person takes knowingly, with awareness and decision involved. “Reacts” means it is more of an involuntary, mechanical kind of thing. Like “action-reaction”.
Thus “case”, to me, refers to how a person “reacts” to his environment, rather than choosing his “response”.
Maybe I’m too picky with my words?
Not sure when/how I picked up using this distinction, but it works for me.
That’s my story, and I’m stickin’ to it! Until I change my mind.
AND then there is something in ‘science of survival’ about what to do with people below 2.0 on the tone scale – that is 1950s LRH
“There are only two answers for the handling of people from 2.0 down on
the Tone Sale, neither one of which has anything to do with reasoning
with them or listening to their justification of their acts. The first
is to raise them on the Tone Scale by unentrubulating some of their theta
by any one of the three valid processes. The other is to dispose of them
quietly and without sorrow.”
The decision about who is below 2.0 on the tone scale is made by whom… Here is the genus of KSW
A few of many URLs re Paulette cooper.
Bullshit Marty!!!! 99% of staff, to include SeaOrg members do not know about the disconnection policy???? PROVE IT , PROVE IT, if you can??? I am sure you can not prove it, there for you will scrub this comment, as usual you wont let the truth – the real truth – through!!! you will censor my comment as you ALLWAYS do….grow a sack rathbun, let ney sayers have a voice!!!
I didn’t ask for “a few of many URLs”. I asked a specific question and would like for you to answer it if you might.
Do you hold a degree?
Muchas Gracias Ralph.
I loved OT II.
Sid, I disagree on this one point – what LRH meant by “critics” is not what I today think of when I hear or read the word. Mostly two different species.
Case in point – every single person posting on this blog, possibly with the exception of the occasional OSA troll, is a “critic”of the “Church of Scientology”.
Thank you Amy. You and Mat are ON today!
William, non-responsive. Re-read the question.
Thanks Splog.
Holy Shit, Batman! That was not a step but a leap on the gradient.
Ditto on ‘comment of the day’.
Terril wrote: “When we met you asked what was my relation to LRH. I answered that I only have a relationship to the tech.” But you have no qualms of accusing of commiting felonies. Yes, you are quite right about the Nicholson comment – starting about 2 1/2 feet back of your computer keys.
Thanks Mike. We’ve got Johnson playing the game now too.
Sweet.
Amy,
Succinct and a perfect ‘slice of life’ with Davey.
Great and important clarification.
I’ve touched on it. My final answer is in the book. Requires, and deserves, a lot of context.
@Jesse & Marty: I think it is relevant at this time to direct attention to David Mayo’s account of how he stumbled onto the the very gross tampering with Ron Hubbard’s comm traffic in late 1981. According to him, Pat Broeker (with Hubbard at La Quinta and later Creston Ranch), was absolutely conspiring with David Miscavige to corrupt that comm line. These two had, in the name of Hubbard personal security, severed all other means of communicating with him. Therefore, they could order anything they wanted in Hubbard’s name, without fear of him ever discovering they had done so.
It seams very clear to me that even “R Advices” from that time forward cannot be trusted to have actually been authored by Ron Hubbard. Even, if Hubbard actually authored an R Advice saying that John Aczel should be spat upon, only God, Pat Broeker and David Miscavige know what was actually told to Ron to make him do such a thing. The Third Party law at work should have been plainly evident when David Mayo was removed form his post of Senior C/S Int.
Michael A. Hobson
While I don’t like the casting of personal aspersions, since Terril is so fond of casting them at LRH, I believe your assessment of Terril is pretty much on the money.
Yeah.
I second that motion!
I don’t think you have to submit to your original inclination or your Theetie-wheetie. It took place over 30 years. It did not happen overnight.
Right on. bound to piss someone off at the beginning, hope to heal our wounds by the end… I was privy to not only “fair game” in the early eighties, but some of the atrocities that had been comitted before it was cancelled, and a few after. All by the way under l Ron’s watch. Pardon me, and I mean no ill intent, the concept of “Source not having a case” was flawed in the beginning. I doubt there is anyone reading this that has more respect for L Ron than I, no matter how much time was spent, nor how high up the bridge anyone got, than me. But “fair game” was flawed, no matter whether it was revoked or not. L Ron had a case. As we all do (or did). Now to try and bring those back ready to declare me… Fuck Miscavige. All of us, every one of us, during this entire process had freedom of choice. So the fact that Miscavige may be applying a cancelled policy is no excuse for the bastard. It is rather convenient that the application of a cancelled policy was acted upon after it was revoked. And still is. Ron and others are rolling in their graves. Feel it? Thetans have bodies. And then they drop them. But they are still Thetans. DM, do you feel that? It is not just indigestion…
Always, in all ways,
-Dave
Wow!
Thanks WJ!
You’ve described orthodox Science to a T.
Not to mention the Democratic, Republican Party and the CIA.
Well done!!!!
You da man!!!!!
Thanks, Marty, for the clarification.
Just Me
Anna, thanks for the Admin and Group sanity scale reference and your other comments. Appreciate it.
Tschus,
Just Me
Marty,
thanks for bringing up this important topic which seems to touch many hearts and minds, one way or another.
I believe that the whole subject of obedience or compliance is completely “spoilt” for everyone by countless bad experiences and deeds since the inception of time. An excellent leader is able to keep people in a very high mood, out of their bad experiences. But as soon as a bully ( mentally or otherwise ) takes the power he triggers his juniors into unfavorable roles like “slaves”, “people desiring praise”, “people accepting degradation”, “ass lickers” and so on.
Furthermore, anyone can do anything with an LRH text. Burn it, eat it, criticize it, follow it with this or that intention. Too bad that LRH left some 30 million words. There are no limits as to how these could be implemented one way or the other. Somone could even use the “responsibility of leaders” policy to rid himself of all responsibility as a leader !
To those who question LRH : yes, I do understand your worry as to what the independant field will do with LRH’s texts about fair game etc. And I agree with your objections against these writings, having been on both sides of the not so fair game myself.
I would like to write about the independent group called Ron’s Org ( RO ), founded by Bill Robertson ( no, I am not affiliated with RO ). This group has existed since 1983 or so. During the years they have taken a lot of OSA harassment for sure ( e.g anonymous calls to authorities that a RO convention is a terrorist group or a drug dealer meeting, extended fair game against RO leaders, multiple infiltrations and much more. Not without side effects though – these OSA actions brought about Heber’s detention in Spain, a raid in the Co$ Org in Munich, Germany, as well as hostilities from Russion authorities towards Co$ ).
You see, RO faced all these attacks ( and is probably still facing them ). So what did they do – did they start a major war of retaliation against OSA or Co$ ? What did RO do to those who left ? Or who criticised them on the net ? Did RO resort to fair game ?
No. They decided that their goal was to deal with the spiritual aspects of LRH’s texts. They got legal advice ( needed due to legal threats from OSA ), they put some security measures into practice, they informed police and other authorities, but little more than that. They were not interested in battles of any kind. And until today it has served them quite well. They still exist after 27 years – which is quite something if you know OSA !
Let me also tell about Scn missions in the 1970ies. These were usually started by highly trained auditors. They had the purpose of making people happy and successfull – and not the slightest interest in wasting their time with harassments etc. That wasn’t their business. And they expanded their groups like mad ( see other reports on this blog ). Mission holders used to be glad that they were ( usually ) hardly interfered with by management or belligerent guardian office staff. This all changed completely when D.M. put those missions under stiff control.
Various independent groups or ( most of them quite small ) or standalone practitioners have been established by now. Here is an incomplete list : http://www.freezoneearth.org/links.html. These guys have neither the intention nor the resources to organize wars against people of different oponion. They want to do their thing, and let others live their lives. They don’t believe that hunting others down will save the world. They have seen the evidence that it doesn’t do Co$ any good.
So the fair game policy and similar texts are actually out of use by LRH adherents -the only exception being Co$. It is them who are monitoring the web, facebook, independents of any color, critics of any kind, press and media, and whoever else. And they take action ( foot bullets included ). This needs people and LOTS of money – provided by clueless Co$ followers.
Which brings us back to the subject of obedience … Hanna Arendt, a Jewish philosopher who had fled Nazi Germany, wrote down what is truly missing in current Co$ practice : “Nobody has the right to obey”.
And that is the responsibility of juniors ( in my humble opinion ).
You too, Jim. Thanks for that Group Sanity reference. I’ll look it up.
Just Me
@RJ: I hate to burst your bubble, but Ron Hubbard himself created a “Hidden Data Line” with his top secret “Founder Advices” or “R Advices” which the vast majority of Scientologists were not allowed to see under any circumstances – save a few instances where the viewer was required to be bonded for vast sums should they reveal that either the contents or the fact they had viewed them.
Michael A. Hobson
With an opinion like that, there’s no need to be humble, IMHO.
Overdriver,
I think you are missing one crucial element, it has to do with language. If you lived under communism then I’d say English is not your home language?
English is a weird language – very little of it is literal (except very simple sentences). When you say something more complex, it gets more abstract and the reason is that English is a mixture of every other language out there, it just soaks them up like a sponge.
In English, to describe something exactly is hard – take Einstein’s work. The original German is very condensed, the same thing translated to English is much longer (and really hard to read too). English speakers express themselves in very non-literal ways, and we do it all the time. Mostly we don’t even realize we do it until a foreigner comes along who can’t understand what we mean.
LRH was a writer and a very good speaker, he really knew how to use the language and assumed other people did too – he wrote mostly for the average man who had a decent education.
Maybe that’s part of the problem – assuming the reader knows what you are talking about and understands the intent. There’s also the Tone Scale and what it has to say about how people interpret your words.
Tone 3.5 says “Good grasp of statements. Good sense of humour”.
Tone 1.5 says “Accepts alarming remarks literally. Brutal sense of humour.”
LRH usually assumed his readers were at least 2.5. It’s quite a reasonable thing to assume as the subject of Scientology is designed to create that. When he describes the incident with judo, he doesn’t mean you should beat people up all the time. He’s speaking English, he means you are supposed to deal with something dangerous in an appropriate way, and the thing about judo is just one example. (And 12 year old bullies are often best handled by other 12 year olds hitting them back.)
The point is that non-English speakers (and English speakers lower than 1.5) often don’t grasp the actual meaning and the only sense they can make of it is to take things literally. Of course you get the wrong meaning when you do that. I think all human languages do this more or less – English just does it MUCH more than any other Western language.
Does all of that make sense?
martyrathbun09 | November 2, 2010 at 11:06 pm | Reply
“I didn’t ask for “a few of many URLs”. I asked a specific question and would like for you to answer it if you might.”
Oy vey!!
So GO files are not enough? Legal quotes not enough?
Like who was in charge?
I’ll search further, ask around.
Note that Paullette is alive and well. I’ll ask her to come and post here.
Hobson,
Ya want dox:
http://michael-robinett.com/declass/c000.htm
Also I’ll get a contact I know to send you 138 Banker’s Boxes full of them.
You know as well as I do unless you are a moron that names are redacted from all dox obtained by FOIA.
Also Gottlieb under orders from DCI Helms destroyed many of the incriminating files.
However some weren’t:
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB222/index.htm
There are those enuff dox for you.
You lil’ dox Nazi.
Now get the fuck outa here
And WTH is so important it has an entire auditing rundown devoted just to it.
Last time I checked The Bridge, I didn’t see a “Responsibilities of Leaders Rundown ™”. Or a “Grade X – Pink Legs”…….
Dude, ONE single citation to fact. You haven’t provided it. Have Paulette post here? Can you get any more non sequitor? Report to Ron’s Org for objectives brother.
Perfect sense.
Well then Marty stop pissing about answering futile comments like this one and get on and finish the bloody book!
Actually it’s Diana Horwich Hubbard you pretentious and obnoxious know best.
And to answer your question anon which Hobson failed to answer because he was too busy trolling.
Yes.
Ron had another daughter by the name of Alexis.
Ensifer,
I’m reading what you wrote…and I’m reading what Marty wrote. And then I read again what you wrote…and then I read again what Marty wrote. Here’s what I see: I don’t see you being didactic or trying to come across as superior to Marty or anyone else, just stating your observations and opinions, just like Marty does or anyone else who’s being honest and straight forward. Well done.
I said: My problem is the over-promise of the subject, and that cannot be pinned on DM.
Marty replied: No, I never did. That is a hidden standard in my view. I don’t and never did look to others to emulate in order to attain to higher states of awareness and understanding.
Marty, I have nothing but admiration for how you deliver Scientology. It’s the way spiritual enhancement should work. However, you’re not following LRH policy on this matter (good for you). Per LRH policy you pay up front and if you want your money refunded you will be expelled. Even when LRH was in charge, people were to evaluate whether or not they were to follow his path (based on over-promises of what could be achieved) – and put up the money (even then a sizable amount) – or sign a billion year contract – up front. Therefor I have a problem that Clear and OT were over-promised. Lots of people never regretted their journey even if they didn’t obtain what was promised (I being one). Lots of people did.
ROFL!!
Darn the luck, eh?
Marty- IMHO this is the most important, relevant, revealing, TAing, etc. post to date. I will take the time tomorrow to read and reread each of the comments. Even with multiple business and household activities (distractions?) I still feel the LFBD.
This one goes down in history.
Thanks for all you do.
ML, Tom
You’ll also note Slog and Marty.
That the original (not old) edition has “willful misapplication” listed as a High Crime which isn’t in the altered (instead of new) editions.
Terril,
We went over this several months ago.
When the actual dox revealed that the “R” was someone name Randy who was on staff at the NYGO.
How many times does this canard have to quack before it is duck soup?
CD,
Valid post, mostly. But I want to pick up on the first sentence about gays. I think the smiley means it’s a tongue-in-cheek comment, but I can’t be sure.
The 1.1 vs homosexual reference comes from Science of Survival, written in 1951. Read some history about how homosexuals were treated back then. The treatment of Alan Turing was in that time period.
Ron never said gays were 1.1, he said that a 1.1 will indulge in deviant behaviour such as homosexuality and several other examples. That’s very different, the two things are not the same. Maybe, just maybe, that reference was to some degree a product of the time. I wasn’t around in ’51 so I can’t comment about what being homosexual was like then, but I do know from history that most of the Western world considered it some kind of horrible deviant behaviour.
Compare SoS to what LRH wrote many years later about homosexuals, about how it was about as important as sneezing. Somehow not many people quote the later one but by god you’ll find 1000s quoting the earlier Science of Survival.
Holy Crap.
Multiple definitions, the first of which is: they changed what? next: I can’t believe they changed it to THAT. see also: anything D.M. says.
Kingsley Wimbush did indeed require/expect his mission staff members to pay him money out of their weekly pay out of the mis-interpreted “flow power to power” policy. Just ask the people who were staff at the time; they’ll be sure to grimace. Whether declaring Wimbush SP or “handling him with Scientology” is not the point; he was guilty of committing high crimes and had to take resposbility for them. He decided to leave Scientology, yet he was an abuser of people and never made up the damage. When Wimbush left Stevens Creek, they expanded and became a Class V org, and even briefly achieved Saint Hill size in 1990, though they weren’t able to maintain it (this is a separate story though and occured about 8 years after Wimbush’s SP declare).
Wimbush also invented his own “de-PTSing” tech of “de-dinging”. It was intended to deal with the effects of “subtle suppression”. Call it what you want, but it simply wasn’t LRH tech. You can read more about it here used in a business context:
http://www.buildfreedom.com/tl/tl12a.shtml
I think it would be in the best interest of real Scientologists of the world if all the instances of David Miscavige’s additions, subtractions or alterations of L. Ron Hubbard’s books were pointed out in a list.
Personally, I would like to be able to see L. Ron Hubbard’s books as he intended it.
Marty, I think you can help us out in that area.
Marty, thats true. But the GO and OSA have always focused on exactly those references. That 1%. They were the guiding principles in their hat packs.
I know you view and defend LRH based on the whole body of his work. Rightly so. But the 99% of his work which did not lead the way into this mess is not to blame.
Unless LRH were incapable of accepting criticism, he could handle taking responsibility for the effect some of those policies have had.
And i believe he galdly would if it opened the door to a handling and kept the focus where it now needs to be in order to slavage his life’s work.
From what I saw there were two parts to the KW Thing: the “flow power to power” part, and the de-dinging. KW had apparently done some sort of eval and found that Scns were “PTS to themselves”, by continuously invalidating each other, something labeled “subtle internal suppression”. (Well, IMO he was onto something here but was way off on the Why.) At my mission we were told to twin up and run this “process” on each other, of getting off times we dinged others and times we were dinged, to some kind of De-PTS EP.
The “power to power” was more destructive. It was about money. I heard stories of public being locked in a closet with three regges until the guy forked over the money. At my little mission there was screaming, yelling,foot stomping and chants of, “we’re fed up and we”re not going to take it anymore!” (from the movie ” Network”) Everyone was labeled”out ethics”. I myself was a pretty new public and was forbidden to come into the mission as I was declared “PTS A to J” (ha ha, that one always cracks me up!) Any “PTSness” (ie; failure to kiss ass and/or pay up) was dealt with ruthlessly. One poor sucker got tossed out of the front door by staff members, and got a broken arm as a result. Pretty wild times, lasted a few weeks up until the mission holders meeting.
Possibly Kingsley was trying to correct something he saw was wrong in Scn; the general state of PTSness that actually was happening. Possibly Miscavige used him as a scapegoat to take control of the mission network, I don’t know. I wasn’t privy to this kind of info as some others were, being a new public.
The significance of these posts is relative to the amount of this I see:
Ralph, wow! And thanks. That info makes me reflect on my own OT2 experience, which was the most explosive, charge-blowing auditing I’ve ever done. It was like pushing a spade into the ground and hitting the main underground powerline that lights up the whole state. BA-BOOM! After that, there just wasn’t much left. Of anything.
Just Me
Dean was most often an egotistical asshole on a “power trip” in my opinion. …and in the opinion of many other ex-staff. The “flow power to power” type idea protected him, despite some of the weird arbitraries, staff humiliations, oddball projects or “musical chairs” which he would instigate.
It was the staff and public and LRH tech about life and the mind which grew that Mission, not Dean.
The reason that the Mission expanded is that raw public got books and were disseminated to, and also public were serviced well by a tremendous team of staff. The place practically ran itself. Staff worked hard, but the place was a lot of fun and people were winning. When Dean started screwing with a workable system (entering arbitraries), then things started to get “unfun”.
A funny story when I was first a public on the Comm Course having already read some of the basic books… I had requested to see a registrar so I could talk about getting some auditing. I had to wait…several days…always hoping that the registrar could see me that night after course. I wanted auditing. I wanted the reg. I could not wait to see the reg. Finally, I got to see the reg.
Ironically, now-a-days, a public wears garlic and carries holy water along with silver, wooden stakes, and a cross in order to keep the IAS reg away.
Hayden, I LOVE your comment above. Thanks for that.
Just Me
Marty, I have a question that may have been answered
Ralph,
You know as well as I do.
He doesn’t mention GPMs but refers to R6 specifically in the XDN lectures when he discusses handling purps.
Note I wrote further research on GPMs.
Not the actual running of GPMs per se.
Remember that purposes are sub goals and the route he used to uncover the GPM was SOP Goals.
So you could consider it further research on “GPMs” in a general sense since purposes are sub goals.
Why did you delete the URLs I provided?
Its an insult to ask me to do objectives. I very possibly did more than you. 3 times drilling, being drilled, running, being run. All before I was OT.
Its the church of miscavology putting OTs back on there.
Why you supporting this?
Why are you being rude?
Why are you invalidating me and my case?
You are making yourself look bad here.
Take a leaf out of Karen’s book, she always grants beingness no matter how hostile the person she responds too.
You are making the subject look bad.
Please take my response as constructive criticism.
I am a friend, but not sure if you can understand that.
I’ve got no dog in this race, but I’ve seen her referred to online as Diana Meredith DeWolfe Hubbard. Back in the day, she was married to Jon Horwich, with whom she had a daughter, but they have long been divorced. She was later married to John Ryan, but (I believe) they are also divorced. I don’t know if she has married again. Others here know her much better and can answer this question with more authority.
Just Me
Joe,
I don’t think there is a point to the PL, not a major one at least. It’s an interesting commentary on something Ron had recently read that he thought might be useful. The clue for me is the short prologue right at the very beginning, and if I’d written it, I’d have said this:
“Hey guys, here’s an interesting book I just read, I thought you’d like it. It’s all about Bolivar and how he cocked up right at the point he really shouldn’t have. It’s interesting to look at Bolivar in the light of all our PL’s and see how he got it all so wrong, so go and read the book for yourself. Meanwhile, here’s 5 pages about what I think of it. Use it, don’t use it, it’s still interesting. Cheers”
The Simon Bolivar policy letter is an excellent piece of organizational philosophy, designed to imbue members of a group with the strength of the idea of working together as a strong team to accomplish its objectives.
Power is an illusion and an agreement, often blindly subscribed to which then corrupts many and thus it is misapplied by the corrupted mind.
A true hater cannot see anything other than their own hate.
Good point Dan. And it’s why I respected you, you did NOT use policy to justify any type of inhumane irrational behavior.
In the summer of 1995, I recall a group procedure that was implemented, which was to isolate and root out any off policy group agreements, and when I was at ASI, we had a couple group meetings to isolate such group off policy.
I wondered what the Int Base orgs were coming up with, in the summer of 1995, when they did this group policy that was off policy hunting and ceasing.
It was during these group sessions at ASI, where I heard a bit of the “bad” old days of excess at ASI from the ASI staffers who spoke VERY cautiously about the bad old days when DM wa s COB ASI.
This Responsibilities of Leaders policy history, application, and group transferring of respect to DM, after LRH died, needs a lot more discussion.
I myself, noticed, when I moved up the org echelons, to ASI, in 1992-1995, that DM somehow saw ALSO himself as taking on LRH’s “Boots in the Sky” lecture role, or assuming this role that DM took upon himself.
“Boots In The Sky” is also I think, another of those LRH references that DM has used to justify his excesses.
Because I am not your anti-LRH press agency. I asked you a simple question, to document a single, sweeping indictment you made of LRH. You responded by posting a number or urls that do not answer the question. I may be makin myself look bad, but you are assisting me in making a point far more important than how I may look.
OK, here’s how stupid I used to be. When I first read the Simon Bolivar policy – probably in 1973, over and over again, because I couldn’t understand it – I finally concluded that the point of it was that LRH thought women should take bullets for their menfolk. And that Manuela was really stupid was because she couldn’t get Simon to marry her.
My reaction was, “Well, that’s bullshit.” And then I forgot about it and went on to the next tech bulletin on the checksheet.
Please tell I wasn’t the only person who once thought that’s what it meant!
Just Me
Yes becoming Aware I am afraid it is a steep gradient but we can’t leave this whole matter for just Marty and Mike to resolve alone when you are looking at something much more sinster .This will require some real kickass OT’s regrouping and putting petty squables aside in order to concentrate a strong beam of intention at the target shall we say.I have seen it done before with startling results and this is all the real manipulators are afraid of.
That’s exactly right Marty.
That’s been my experience too.
Come on Terril, provide what Marty asked.
Your credibility is on the line.
I was around in the Fair Game days and horrible things were done to people because of it. LRH wrote Fair Game. His wife, Mary Sue, implemented it when she was head of the GO. Mary Sue was involved in Fair Gaming Paulette Cooper and I can not believe LRH did not know about Operation Freakout. The GO as you probably know was plotting to have Paulette Cooper imprisoned on false evidence. The other plot was to drive her insane. Can you imagine Sea Org members plotting to drive someone insane? Well, this is the kind of behavior Fair Game encourages. And LRH wrote it. And his wife was implementing it.
I get my “facts” from Wikipedia. I would like to believe the information is incorrect. But there are court documents supporting this.
Marty, if you know that the article in Wikipedia about Operation Freakout is incorrect, please let me know. And if so, Wikipedia needs to be corrected.
I would like to think that DM hijacked my religion, but he seems to have had a good teacher in our Founder.
For all the good LRH did (and there was much of that) he seems to have had a dark side and this is frankly disturbing to me. I wish it weren’t so. I really do.
Gee I hate to burst your patronizing bubble here but all you had to do back then was demand to see the actual order, directive, advice, PL or FO before you complied and you were shown it.
Also since the above didn’t apply to lower echelons. How could they be considered a “hidden data line”?
I mean you expand the term beyond all meaning and consequence.
For instance by your definition.
The fact that there are confidential OT Levels could be construed by a complete moron to be a “hidden data line”.
I suggest you read the PL again.
That’s 24 April 1965 Issue I.
RJ, Soup’s on. I was waiting for him to produce that one, but he couldn’t even do that.
Marty,
What evidence did you see that proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that LRH solely authored the NOTs materials?
Marty,
I have a few questions that may have been answered in another post I missed, but just to be completely clear I wanted to ask them directly to you (if you have the time). Sorry if this was asked and answered before and I didn’t see it.
1. Is it true that no action is ever taken by anyone in OSA, SO or any other dept./div. as serious as to declare someone as an ‘SP’ or to use the tactics of ‘Fair Game’ …without the knowledge and order always given by David Miscavige himself FIRST?
2. Is there a procedure within the policy to make sure actions would not be taken to declare someone an SP and ‘Fair Game’ them based on false reports or assumptions… to safe guard the individual as well as Scientology BEFORE any action was taken? If so, what specifically were they?
3. Is it only DM who ulitmately decides if someone is an SP, or is there a committee who discusses this too?
ARC,
MissBridgett
This was Mountain View Org in 1991 or 1992. Boy, I guess it was really stupid for me to clear ALL my MUs. I was clearing many hundreds of words, and it was quite a slog, but I came out the other side much brighter. I didn’t know I wasn’t supposed to find the phrase “fair game”. It was in a chain of definitions I was going through. I’m sorry if my word clearing offends you.
I posted on this earlier and don’t have to repeat the long story. I heard the audio tapes where L Ron Hubbard dictated nearly every word of the NOTS bulletins.
@RJ: I want dox specifically about Ron DeWolfe having been a subject of MKULTRA, since that is what I specifically asked you to provide.
RJ says “Also I’ll get a contact I know to send you 138 Banker’s Boxes full of them.”
Your alleged 138 banker’s boxes are entirely irrelevant to the point in question, unless they are all about Ron DeWolfe. Furthermore, they are of no use to supporting your assertion in an Internet discussion, unless they are all scanned in and archived on some accessible web server like Wikileaks.
RJ says: “You know as well as I do unless you are a moron that names are redacted from all dox obtained by FOIA.”
If that is the case, then you have not seen Ron DeWolfe’s name on any of those dox, now have you?
Hoisted by your own petard, RJ.
I’m calling bullshit on you for this particular claim.
Michael A. Hobson
Oop’s…hit the wrong key and sent half of a sentence and it got posted! HA!…see rest of post somewhere below…. 🙂 🙂 😉
I met Ron Dewolf and I’d say he was subject to MK Ultra or went to the private sector to recieve a few dozen ECT treatments on his own.
I also remember Fair Game coming up but do not remember where. Perhaps it was on the EPF in the mid 80’s.
Joe, I fully agree. It would be ridiculous to assume that all 30 million words that LRH wrote are of the same quality. He cancelled a number of texts himself after he considered them stale-dated.
It sems to me that he was able to change his valence ( = role ) quite quickly. If I look at the policies for the guardian office ( all about war against the enemy ) I feel him being in the role of a general, describing strategies and tactics.
When writing about auditing he had taken the role of a case supervisor. The bulletins of the art series show an artist or a person interested in culture and beauty.
Time is said to prove everything. And now, 25 years after he left this world, we can already get an inkling of what worked better and what didn’t. I would bet if he came back and looked at the current scene he would cancel some of his writings right away.
Exactly. When I was demoted from the Int RPF to the PAC RPF, John Aczel was on the PAC RPF, and I interacted with him, chatted with him many times. He father was a friend of the French impressionist painters, his father was a painter of flowers, a huge collection of painting just of flowers. John met several famous French and leading painters, in his early days. John and his brother still share their father’s portfolio of paintings, so John today, even though he still works at HGB Estates Org, DOES have a nest egg if the Sea Org upper DM bots don’t squeeze it out of him.
John absolutely is a mild mannered Wally Cox type person, with humor. He’s Oxford graduated, well spoken.
I personally think that LRH’s prior years understandings of the conflict between Central Orgs and franchises, which is covered in Div 6 OEC Vol, those conflicts of orgs and franchises (orgs and missions, due to the mission members being LESS constrained in a number of areas), and the prejudice against Mission staff who DON’T have to toe all the policy lines that orgs and org staff have to follow, is why LRH tended to buy the anti mission reports that DM sent up to LRH.
The balance and tension between missions and orgs was actually sorted out by all the LRH finally coming done against the personal excesses of the mission holders, and for sure THAT whole subject is due a book by someone who isn’t prejudiced on the two sides (missions versus orgs), but who’ll do the WHOLE story.
LRH was sensitve NOT to be have Scientologists think he could be fooled by his report lines. There’s the one tech film, where the actor Jeff Pomerantz speaking his lines in the film, mentions how LRH was NOT fooled by any of the sloppy reporting.
But I think, I agree and think Ken Urquhart has some of the best understanding of LRH, and we have to realize, I believe, that LRH was human, and could make mistakes, even though LRH wrote and covered the ground of the exact zones that despite his writings and thoughts, he STILL made some mistakes, and in particular, on this Mission handling of 1982. IT was too heavy, it DID have long range repercussions which I don’t he EVER heard of the fallout of the negative effects, other than he was given the data that the bad out ethics mission holders were “handled.”
My handling, had I been allowed to offer up the policy, would have been to REMIND one and all of what LRH had ALREADY written in OEC Vol 6 about HOW to reconcile the Mission (Franchise) versus Org conflicts, and NOT to trounce the Franchise Mission people.
It’s gonna TAKE YEARS, in my opinion, if ever, to make the Exec Strata think tank people (re-read LRH ED 339R, because LRH DID say Exec Strata was to be the “think tank” for Scientology), capable of fixing these big longterm fuckups that Miscavige laid on Scientology.
I’d just like to add, even though I am NOT a Scientologist, that LRH DID write LRH 339R Int, and THAT reference HAS MORE solutions LONG TERM which are completely underappreciated by ALL CONCERNED!
I so wanted some of the “got bucks” Scientologists lounging around at Flag and the Freewinds to goddamn come HELP out at the upper levels of Scientology, and take a shot at becoming REAL Int Headquarters staff, and take on the roles of Exec Strata or WDC.
There is SO MUCH admin writings to put all these Miscavige years of horrendous mistakes and abuse right, if someone were to take the years to learn thost admin writings and do them sanely.
It’s a long term project to salvage upper management and the admin echelons, in my opinion.
I proposed a couple years ago, that Exec Strata members be put on 5-10 year projects, studying the WHOLE LRH cannon, and maybe 4 years of college also, and continued study in all related outside world knowledge related to their zones.
I think it’s totally underestimated what all it takes to become the real “think tank” for the movement.
The John Aczel incident I felt was a turning point also, but I think there is more history also, and I think DM was jockying against the tough guy attitude that both Kerry Gleason and Bill Franks (both who were junior to Alex Sibersky at Boston during that do or die mission, which they succeded at, and my first wife Ann Halblom told me how Alex was the mentor of Franks and Kerry, and it was well known that Alex and Bill F were chums for life, and Kerry was like their younger brother).
The history of this “tough guy” mentality, DM was also faced with this earlier generation, and Kerry and Bill Franks BOTH had plenty of face time and PLENTY of despatch traffic with LRH, and both Bill and Kerry were somewhat incensed, my opinion, with puny little DM coming on the scene and being their nemesis.
The DM story and how DM revved up himself into the dynamo asshole Napolean Stalin he’s become, needs a lot more filling in, and some sharper writing about.
But I’m so glad you who lived next to DM are taking up the history and telling what you firsthand saw.
Thanks so much to Jesse Prince for writing here, and Marty for discussing this.
Actually, in Hubbard’s Last Will, her full name is given as DIANA MEREDITH DEWOLF HUBBARD HORWICH.
( http://home.earthlink.net/~snefru/deathoflrh/1979.html )
Well now, seems I was mistaken.
Michael A. Hobson
Yes – I fed the beast too! You know, it actually feels great to say that.
@RJ: I suggest you drop the name calling and personal remarks as they are both uncalled for, unprofessional and abusive. I have not subjected you to any such abuse, even if that were a valid justification.
Michael A. Hobson
Hi Marty,
I see it as a credit to you that you allow these posts through. 🙂
I’m curious as to why you opened ” Pandora’s Box.” ? Good move IMO,
but maybe you didn’t see how it would go.
I’ve asked on ESMB and WWP for those more expert than I to give better data Re Paullette . I’ve been reading critical material for a decade and don’t keep it all at my thumbs and fingers. I’m more interested in promoting scn.
“I may be makin myself look bad, but you are assisting me in making a point far more important than how I may look.”
I don’t want to make you look bad. You did that. Our tech promises gains and improvements.
For me and I know others, Ken U wrote an essay on this point, the key scn datum is granting beingness. When you post caustic comments you violate that. I love what you are achieving. I submit that taking more heed when posting, of the concept of granting beingness, would assist your,
mission. I’ve had the pleasure lol! of trying to limit or negate the attacks of prima donna techies on other techies. Years of it. Some success, much failure. But I committed severe crimes. Was there and communicating. 🙂
MARTY
“but you are assisting me in making a point far more important than how I may look.”
C an you say more? Don’t get the point of what you are saying.
Re “At Cause” I have no issues re my credibility. Its been bashed for a decade from all sides and I’m still here communicating.
Jessie,
The culturally ingrained tendency towards violence existed in Scientology management even before the time period where you observed it to commence. In the early 70’s I first-hand witnessed and experienced the following:
Fistfights and wrestling matches between Scientology org staff, written up to and known about and tolerated by Flag management.
Headbutting by an ED to his Deputy ED, causing significant physical injury with very light ethics applied to the ED by Flag management.
There were dozens, if not hundreds of threats of physical harm to me by my Divisional Secretary at the org, known about and tolerated by the top of the org board.
In response to something I said, the OES of the org grabbed my thumb and bent it back real hard, causing damage to the nerves and ligaments that took years to stop hurting and gave me permanently. He was an ex-Green Beret, martial arts expert and a psychopath who was known about and tolerated. He got no ethics penalty for this incident.
I saw this same OES exec pick up the Director of Training, who was half his size and literally fling him 8 feet across the room, slamming him into a wall, all because the D of T disapproved the OES’s wife’s LOA.
I saw the ED of the org, a bully who constantly intimidated others with threats, promoted to a senior exec at FOLO.
I experienced and witnessed HCO staff call ‘HCO Bring Order’ unneccessarily on me and other staff and use physical intimidation to enforce compliance.
I witnessed a GO World Wide exec read an LRH telex where LRH said that he was going to personally pound some guy’s head in, I think it was either the IRS or the FBI or possibly a specific news reporter he was referring to. Forgive my foggy memory, it was a while ago. I had no reason to think it was a counterfeit telex, it was at a mini-event at the org.
HCO staff came to my home while I was on a CSW approved vacation to try to get me to come back for an ethics cycle. They threatened to break my door down and physically take me in.
This was all witnessed or experienced directly by me in just 5 years time on staff. Again, this was the 1970’s, so it’s been around a long, long time. Miscavige just escalated it, made it acceptable, expected and glorified while poisoning others with the same sick op basis and innoculated them against perception and personal integrity by tricking them into thinking it was the correct estimation of effort to get a taste of the deliciousness of power.
LL, I understand how you feel. I went through the same ( long ago ).
But then I realized that I had been rather stupid to expect a perfect angel who would appear out of the blue to save me and the rest of this world. What an infantile idea !
I realised that I had given LRH the status of an ally ( a person who is always right, no exception ). And I realised that I had the right – and the responsibility as well – to make up my own mind.
So this turned out to be a step towards self-determinism. I decided to never apply certain LRH texts. I cognited that “life is in me” ( even if I didn’t like everything about LRH ) and that I make my tomorrow.
And some months later I started my own independent auditing office.
@Marty: I have no doubt the man was a hateful whack job. I don’t think anyone who has read his book could fail to see that, except another hateful whackjob. How did he got to be such a whackjob? Well that seems like a useful question to get answered accurately.
But RJ has made a highly specific factual claim he can’t back up, so it’s B/S.
Michael A. Hobson
Just Me-
I procured my first copy of the Into to Ethics book somewhere around 1978-9. Good stuff. However when I read the DM altered version of RON’S book sometime later with the Simon Bolivar policy inserted I quite distinctly recall thinking to myself, “What the hell does this have to do with that?” At the time I didn’t notice its fraudulent insertion, though.
I’m proud to be in the same camp Just Me albeit along a dissimilar line. This was the point of my LFBD today. ML, Tom
Jim,
For your info, Bruce Hines told me he listened to the LRH briefing tape to Melanie Murray, which contains the gist and details of what NOTs is.
NOTS Intro Bulletin 1, the original, is a compilation of the briefing tapes to Melanie.
Melanie is still in good standing in LA region.
Bruce Hines is public and can verify this.
LRH gave briefings about NOTs to Melanie, is the point, from which the NOTs Bulletin 1 original Intro bulletin, was written, and likely lots MORE of the original and later NOTs bulletins were subsequently compiled.
Whoever compiled the original and later editions of NOTs, would have had access to those LRH briefing tapes to Melanie regarding NOTs.
I SO wish we had ALL of the LRH stuff available, but again, I think it was wise, or whatever, of LRH to have ordered the compilations branch personnel to sift through his briefing tapes and notes, etc, and compiled the materials, since like Dan has said many a times these last couple years in Dan’s postings about the compilations, LRH long ago turned over compilations to others.
Which is another reason, I think think the idea of having an organization is still somewhat a good idea, since WHO is going to ever sift through all that raw LRH material and do proper compiling and repair of the fautly compiling?
I can say it’s not my problem, but I do hope Scientologists sort this out, because misimplementing LRH’s written or spoken words I don’t wish on anyone.
Flourish and Prosper, from The Way Happiness, comes to mind as a datum of applicable comparison to this policy. Theres a number of things to consider I guess, but in the end what leads to survival, help, happiness.
Food for thoughtful comparison:Flourish and Prosper, The Way to Happiness.
You are right Raindog.
And I would add that the Data Series teaches one how to spot departures from simple axiomatic truth. All kinds of bad effects result from that.
Exhibit A: The CoS today.
Apparently Data Evaluation is a lost tech and the vast majority of Scientologists don’t know the difference between an outpoint and a why. They don’t know there is always a “Who” an “Ethics Why” and an “Admin Why”
And we see Outpoints like the “altered importance” of one policy (Bolivar) being thought of as a “why”??? Why? Data Series is a lost tech.
Shouldn’t be much question about the “Who” but again, some with personal agenda’s and issues and who also can’t evaluate data would pin it on LRH.
These people have no training in the tech of auditing and really just don’t know the subject or it’s source and therefore blame LRH out of their…er…lack of knowledge and the obvious abuses they read about. And quite often just because they like to hate.
The ethics and admin why(s) are posted here if interested:
http://www.freeheber.com/index.php?title=The_%22WHY%22_For_Scientology
“I’ve asked on ESMB and WWP for those more expert than I to give better data Re Paullette”
Terril,
What’s the matter? Not 100% certain about what you stated earlier?
Don’t tell me that you are looking to the clowns on WWP or ESMB to find the data to back you up?
You shouldn’t have stated anything like that about LRH unless you were already 100% certain of what you were stating was the truth.
Says something about you doesn’t it?
But that’s ok, I know where you picked up that standard level, that goes only a lot on ESMB.
Loki,
Powerfully true words.
That DM bragged about spitting on John Aczel shows how stupid DM is, if DM thinks John Aczel is some kind of mean menacing bad person.
John and Roger both were unbelievable polite and kind people, still are.
DM could get away with his behavior only due to how he presented the events to LRH, so that LRH did NOT see the truth of the situation.
That John stayed in the Sea Org all these years is NOT for DM, but for LRH, I would bet my life!
Here’s John, outside the Anthony Building, two years ago.
John Aczel is very kind person.
After reading Sarge’s most recent story about his first day at Creston — which revealed Broeker’s “I will kill you” threat — somehow, at this point, I wouldn’t put any level of deception or fraud past Pat Broeker.
And with Broeker so deeply embedded into the comm-line between LRH and everyone else from 1981-1986 (and with the excuse/justification of “keeping entheta off LRH’s lines” and apparently even a literal “kill Pete” mentality), it seems very possible that Broeker may have falsified reports to LRH … as well as authored quite a bit under LRH’s name without LRH’s knowledge.
Your full-a-shit, Hobson.
I distinctly remember you posting GTFO because I didn’t provide dox to prove my speculation that Ronnie DeWolf was mind zapped which is purely speculation and opinion which I’ve stated several times as you not so kindly pointed out.
As far as I know the First still applies in this country until otherwise rescinded.
Also your response to anonscien was over the top as well.
The guy asked a civil and valid question although it may have been based on erroneous data.
It was still a valid question.
Therefore I suggest that you apply the Golden Rule to communications on this board.
Unless you want others to respond in kind to what I consider your arrogant responses.
AT CAUSE
Your diminution, of others as clowns is a violation of the precept “granting of beingness.”
“But that’s ok, I know where you picked up that standard level, that goes only a lot on ESMB.”
” Lord forgive them for they know not what they do.”
Nearly a thousand tech success stories. On ESMB:-
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=24
Martin-
In the long run The Way to Happiness may become LRH’s best known and universally revered work.
You’re right Terril, I shouldn’t have referred to those on WWP or ESMB as “clowns”.
To do so was a degradation against clowns.
Clowns actually do something positive in the world.
I also remember the term of the “Fair Game PL”.
Jim, I enjoyed reading your post .I read Responsibility of Leaders PL in 1971 and took the time to hunt down and read LRH’s recommended book The Four Seasons of Manuel by Victor Von Hagen while I was also on staff.I did comapre notes and what LRH wrote and what Victor Von Hagen wrote and came away with a moderated view.
My view of that Policy was and still is that you would apply that in a real power condition which DM never attained in reality as the church has been shrinking ever since he got his soiled paws on it.
So I don’t see how he ever merited applying any part of it from his false position .
Marty,
It would only take that ratio of good ingredients to bad in order to spoil any otherwise marvelous tasting dish. I think LRH meant exactly what he said in those references above. Those methods do work for their stated purpose. I don’t advocate them as written, but they achieve their purpose. It seems like LRH didn’t care about having public’s agreement (PR) about whether or not he should use those policies. I imagine that he considered he was in a war and there were going to be casualties. Unfortunately, I don’t think he thought the whole bad PR thing through enough and would do it differently if that opportunity was available to him.
Back when I was still a believer, I’d have an occasional thought that maybe LRH actually predicted all this nonsense that’s happened with the church. Needed it as randomity for a game. Wanted to test the waters and see how everyone dealt with it.
Now when that same thought comes to me, I think instead of a test, maybe it’s for his amusement. I don’t know what it is, but it’s sump’n.
Okay Marty, I know about the FBI and APA references and I know from whom and where they came from, LRH! In the fall of 1982 I was brought from FLAG to the INT Base to assist L Ron and Special Project Ops to repair and correct Int Management which included CMOI. When I arrived at the Gold Base I was briefed by Miss Cabbage and Vicki Aznaran. Part of the ceremony of my appointment involved doing a non e formula with L Ron and Annie Brooker. There was no need for me to do a non e formula to anyone else present at the time because they would find out who I was and why I was there soon enough. As the despatches between L Ron and myself increased I learned that Special Unit was fucking up to as far as L Ron was concerned. So one of the first renovation projects I knew of at the Int Base was to convert two of the rooms in the middle Villa’s into a conference room complete with hanging micorphones. This confernece room was set up exclusively for the expressed purpose for what was then calld Special Unit to have their weekly meetings. I remember this well because sometimes I would have to put someone on the business end of an e-meter to verify information being submitted. Special Project Ops was Miss CAbbage and yes he was fucking up to. I became his auditor, cramming officer and word clearer. Session data from Miss Cabbage and others were sometimes sent to L Ron during this time. Not to contridict what you may remmeber, of this you would have no memory because you were not there. Mike Rinder was there but not close. He may remember something about this.
Marty:
Very well done. I always feel like you have the upper hand and don’t try to make others wrong.
I am amazed about this Ensifer man, “he’s taking Marty up on the flap”. What flap? There isn’t any, unless he means a bunch of Scientologists running around like chickens with their heads cut off. Oh, is that really an eyesore to some? Considering the church’s recently enhanced reputation, I don’t think so.
Once again Marty, right on! You tell em’!
Hi RJ;
I guess I was out in left field.
I think part of the mythology that the GPM line was left incomplete is because that is how it appears on the SHSBC. Tapes began to be pulled off the line leaving most of us wondering how it all turned out.
Whatev.
Hi Ralph;
Interesting, particularly that I am at this very moment reviewing the OT II materials. I was unaware that OTII tech was the cumulation of the GPM line, this and the CC tech.
Thanks for the insight.
I hate to suggest that Scientology tech might apply to some of you, but I think some of you have actual misunderstandings on the Simon Bolivar Policy. I understood it very well and found it essential to operating in or around LRH. It was definitely his policy. I saw people who got too interested in the pink legs and they went appetite over tin cup. If you REALLY want to understand LRH, you have to, IMHO, understand him in terms of POWER. He was a POWER and one that we have not seen on this planet. Forget the OT III accoutrements and what some might call half-baked theories. He had POWER and he could make his postulates stick. Much of this POSTULATING comes right out of Magick, Theory and Practice but LRH’s whole approach was far different than Crowley’s and he made innovations and was far kinder and gentler. I have said it before, but in my opinion LRH’s involvement in the Babalon Working was the prenatal engram of Scientology. It explains so much of “why things didn’t work” and I do not mean for a second to suggest that the tech does not work. I am talking about the bigger picture. This, however, brings us to another problem and this goes back to understanding LRH as a phenomena and who he really is, etc. And I must compare it to the current craze or frenzy over the Mayan Calendar and what will happen at the end of 2012. Most of the people who are interested, publicize or even study the Mayan calendar are woefully unqualified to even approach the subject let alone comment on it. Just shut up. The world is not going to end and most would be far better off learning a new trade or how to more effectively use the internet. This is the problem with LRH. Most people are not even qualified to have a serious discussion about the topic and the volatile points that are being brought up here. Emotions and opinions GET IN THE WAY. They are valid and you are entitled to them but they get in the way.
I have travelled a lot of dark occult pathways in my post-LRH pursuits (and no…..I am not a practicing occult magician who wear robes, etc.) and I have pissed off a lot of serious and high level occultists in secret societies and even whole groups of them. Why? It is because I understand that kernel of truth that LRH represented and utilized (if I hadn’t experienced LRH I would never have discovered it). You see, when you reach a certain level of “pocketed” or hidden truth, gargoyles come out breathe fire at you as it is guarded knowledge. If you have the key, you get through. If not, you are burned up not unlike the Simon Bolivar suggests. I could tell you an interesting story in this regard about Mary Sue on the ship but this post is getting over long. Crowley’s mysterious “Book of the Law” stated that someone would come after him that would unlock “The Key of it All”. LRH fills this prophecy in many regards but it is not that simple. With help, I have competently decoded this book but not utterly and completely but to a much larger degree than any of the secret societies have. They are no longer too pissed and have given up to some degree. What I have found out about the key is that LRH was not the whole thing but he was a large part of it. They key is multi-faceted and goes in many directions like a prism. LRH held it in his hand so to speak and that was real power. Key = Ki = Chi = breath = life = theta. In this respect Chi Gong = breath work = theta work.
I have been working on this for over twenty years and have acquired a lot of specialized knowledge. I guess at this point it is appropriate, so as not to create too much mystery (there is already enough of that in the universe) to identify myself so you will have more context and can take the journey deeper if you wish. My name is Peter Moon and my website is http://www.skybooksusa.com. This is only one of the reasons I wanted to maintain anonymous. It had to be revealed in context. My first book (in which I am only a ghostwriter and publisher) created such havoc in government circles that an entire tv show called the X-Files had to be created to deflect and redirect the information I was disseminating. It was not even my information. I was only the messenger. And for those who are curious about my Chi Gong teacher (I mentioned some time back), you can go to http://www.bodyenergetics.tv His name is Roosevelt Gainey and he is in Brooklyn, New York and you can see a demo of him throwing one of my fellow students without hitting him. Mind you, this is a very tame throw. I have seen him do far more substantial throws. Meeting him and acquiring him as a teacher was my great reward for all of my work. He is the only one I have met since LRH who I really felt I could learn from (in terms of a whole body of knowledge as opposed to learning a trade or instruction).
As a last comment for tonight, Marty is also in possession of a big kernel of truth and also LRH’s legacy (that is why he has attracted the attention – otherwise, no one would care if he had just a happy little counseling practice). This is why the fire-breathing watch dogs come out. And do you notice that these particular watch dogs we are talking about are not DM or his flying monkeys? They are not even part of the conversation right now as they and their victims are sacrifices and/or collateral damage. And while I do not yet know Marty personally, I can tell you that it is obvious to me that he is more powerful than the watchdogs or is at least capable of overcoming them. And here is another secret about how to overcome a real mad dog who is bothering you. When he goes to bite you, you grab his jaw and rip it downward. Dog’s bottom jaws are weak and they break. Once you have done that, the dog had not bite, can’t eat and is as good as dead. This is good practical advice if you ever get attacked by a dog. They can’t bark either but only whimper. This is why some of the posts do not go through….the entheta has been silenced by the ripping of the jaw.
Dave:
I am reading what you are writing here about this OK, and this is POST what I wrote Marty I thought was the direction this alleged conversation between you and he “on the matter” is going.
I see your point. I see your point very clearly. I understand that there are people in Scientology that you still feel as though you care for very much that you would not like to see anything else bad happen to them. So what is the matter with that Dave?
Marty did not say that LRH was likened to a victim of David Miscavige. LRH Says about the tech “Those who twist it, invalidate and pretend that something else is meant, are seeking to deny you not just the road out but the armor of knowledge that will guard you.”
What can Marty do about every single person in the church that needs a helping hand out if there is more than he can handle. Why don’t you go and help them yourself since you are so certain others lack the true integrity to do so to your liking?
What a nice, totally correct indication, Marty. Your article has answered a ton of questions. We finally have a chance at getting off this stuck “Fair Game – the root of all evil” flow.
Thank you for this – it certainly would make sense if it did happen. I am sure that Nibs deeply loved and admired his father. For him to say and do what he did with no outside influence simply defies logic. Nibs would have been a prime target for PDH.
Dear Jim L,
I’m not sure what you may have heard or read about the creation on the NOT’s materials but I will share with you what I know about the creation of these materials. Any person that was trained as a NOT’s Auditor in the summer of 1979 until the early fall of 1982 were either trained my me as the NOT”s course supervisor, or interned under me as the NOT’s intern sup or were surely crammed by me as the Flag NOT’s Cramming Off. David Mayo is the person that trained and supervised the release of NOT’s to the Advance Orgs internationally. When NOT’s was first released there was just over 20 issues. As L Ron and David Mayo went along more bulletins were written on the subject. The concept of NOT’s came from the auditing David Mayo was giving Ron and the auditing Ron was giving himself. David Mayo would be at Flag acting as Snr C/S and when situation would come up that were not specifically covered in the materials David would work out a handling, make the Flag auditors appply it and within days a new hcob would be issued by L Ron with the exact same or similar handling. My point being L Ron and Mayo worked hand in hand in the creation of the NOT’s material. Without Mayo there would be no NOT’s material.
Ditto Marty.I did some auditing for his mission while he was there circa 1794.He told me how one day on the Apollo on the deck he saw LRH and began to say hello to him but his voice became very loud then nearly blew LRH’s head off when he saw how big LRH’s space was in talking to him. This was vintage Allan Walters taking any opportunity to hear himself talk.Boy what LRH had to put up with!!!!
OTDT, Thank you for sharing this. I joined the SO in the summer of 1976. Prior to that the only class 4 org I ever worked in was SFO Fdn and I was not aware of any physical violence against staff. I don’t doubt your account though. Others have told me things that use to happen on the ship. I try to stick with what I know about in discussion, silly me.
Hi Bobo,
Anything on the BC that dealt specifically with the R6ew, CC and Power was pretty much pulled from the course in the late 60’s early 70’s because a lot of auditor trainees were not clear.
(on the original BC you coaudited R6 until Ron developed power, R6ew and the CC)
You could still study ’em if you were Clear or above.
I don’t know Michael, when I read this blog it gives me a headache! I don’t understand why some people think L Ron was weak and easily decieved. L Ron was a lion of a man! He authored the policies on the multipule viewpoint system. How can anyone in thier right mind think L Ron was unaware is beyond me.
As I recall, basically LRH said that there isn’t anyone who doesn’t have a dark side. Except LRH went one better and stirred up his own case with research so that the rest of us could go free. Now we criticize him for having a messed-up case? Even with all that, he left us enough to really get the show on the road.
I agree with you Marty. But I do wish someone like Omar Garrison … or even Dan Sherman (before DM got his teeth into him) … would have been able to write an in-depth LRH biography where the author would have appreciated LRH’s life’s work as part of the narrative.
It feels to me that that is something that is sorely missing in this whole thing. It sure would have been useful had it been available when the Internet came ’round. I do hope someone does a thorough and balanced biography before too long.
Also, I hope you do a behind-the-scenes article on the Omar Garrison and Dan Sherman stories …
“You’ve described orthodox Science to a T.”
RJ, you beat me to it! I was gonna use that line. 🙂 (Especially when you include propagandists like James Randi et al.)
Ah, thirty years to observe. Thirty years to analyze, evaluate, and compare. Thirty years to look at that wide body of work and life and make choices.
That evil encroaches gradually begs the question of recognition. At what point does one become aware of the encroachment? At what point does one say, “This is evil. This is wrong.”?
I really can’t submit to either inclination or TW. My inclination shrank years ago in the laundry. My Theetie-wheetie left for another man. I only mock them up to shirk responsibility. “It’s their fault,” I say, with a sigh of relief. “I didn’t do nuttin’.” Magic. Sleight of mind.
Just because I lie to myself doesn’t mean I don’t know it.
I couldn’t find a document related to Paulette Cooper, which was authored by L. Ron Hubbard either.
However, that doesn’t mean that he had no knowledge of her and Operation Freakout.
There is evidence that he was fully informed about the GO operations against Paulette Cooper.
Consider the declaration of Tonja Burden:
[…]
6. I personally delivered messages concerning “Operation Snowhite”, “Operation Goldmine” and “Operation Freakout”, and other Scientology covert operations.
7. I personally delivered messages concerning the above operations to Hubbard, Mary Sue Hubbard and the Guardian’s Office and I personally filed messages concerning these and other operations in Hubbard’s personal filing cabinet.
[…]
source:
http://www.xenu-directory.net/documents/burden19831107.html
and the affidavit of John Mclean
[…]
On or about July 14 while standing on the quarter deck of the ship just outside L. Ron Hubbard’s dining lounge, I overheard a conversation between L. Ron Hubbard and his wife Mary Sue.
This conversation dealt with one Paulette Cooper, the authoress of an anti-Scientology book, “The Scandal of Scientology”. Mary Sue was telling Ron of the fact that Paulette Cooper would be hit from all fronts with lawsuits from Scientology. Mary Sue stated that she felt that Paulette Cooper talked and wrote too much about Scientology.
Mary Sue stated that she would totally destroy her credibility and that no publisher would ever touch her again, and resultantly, she would never get another book published. It was also stated by her Scientology would sue, and keep suing Paulette, until she broke.
She also said that Paulette Cooper would be sued everywhere the book was published. Mention was also made of a suit, either instituted at that time, or to be started in England re her book..
[…]
source:
http://www.xenu-directory.net/documents/mcleanj19730515.html
“dispose of them quietly and without sorrow.”
This one always gives me a chuckle.
Libran, did it ever occur to you that LRH simply meant “choose not to audit them”? It certainly is more in keeping with the message and tenor of the rest of the book. But I’m guessing that you haven’t read “Science of Survival”, but are only quoting from it. Is that right?
“disconnection”? I thought we were talking about “fair game”.
Oh, never mind. It’s just one big undifferentiated mass to the “johnny d ney sayers”, isn’t it?
Nicely stated Han Solo. You are wise friend of Jedi. 🙂
I think you’ve nailed it on the head Marty.
Like I said earlier, Marty, different tone levels interpret differently.
ML Tom
@Terril Park:
None of the GO files to be found online have Ron Hubbard’s name on them as author. Not One.
If you think otherwise, link to exactly which documents you think do.
None of the “legal quotes” (what do you mean by that? I’ll presume you mean official judicial findings) say Ron Hubbard was the author of Operation Freakout against Paulette Cooper (which is what you seem to be referring to as “Fair gaming” of her).
If you think otherwise, link to the exact documents that support that, please.
We are not interested in the opinions or propaganda spin from a bunch of people who display considerable malice towards Ron Hubbard. If this accusation you made is a true fact, then please provide exact, relevant documentation to prove it.
What is so hard about this request, Terril ?
Michael A. Hobson
MissBridget, I must agree! But my agreement is based on listening to some of his Congress lectures from the 1950s.
LRH was extremely tolerant of wide differences of opinion, and in those lectures showed zero “ser-fac-y” attitude at all.
I recall one in which he said he had elected psychiatrists as opponents almost arbitrarily, on a whim, having been one himself in the past and so understanding where they were coming from.
His confront and acceptance of people on the sub-zero scale was exceptional. All in all his descriptions of auditing these kind of cases was in complete contrast to the attitude which has developed in the Co$, which is to find just about everyone not qualified to receive auditing for one reason or another.
Terril Park said: “The only reason she isn’t in jail is that the FBI raid found that LRH had ordered extreme fair game on her…”
Terril, I’ve read the docs seized in the FBI raid related to Paulette Cooper, and didn’t see anything authored by LRH. I also found this series of pages by Bernie here http://bernie.cncfamily.com/sc/cooper_lawyer.htm related to P.C. and “Operation Freakout” to be balanced and enlightening.
But who is (still) claiming that LRH authored anything to do with Paulette Cooper? I’m curious where you are coming up with this.
I agree Margaret. When I read Sarge’s account of Broeker’s threat, it was obviously “inspection before the fact” as I understand it, and no wonder it stuck in Sarge’s memory.
No dear sweet Hobson.
I was merely pointing out that the dox you demand would not prove one way or the other whether Nibs was a victim of Mk Ultra.
So demanding dox would be a pointless exercise in futility.
Much like waiting for your friend Godot
Or merely an effort to make me wrong.
However I’ve given you links to thousands of pages of documents relating to Ultra and other “off the books” projects the CIA was involved in that are available for your perusal.
So peruse!
Sarge, Jesse, Mike and Marty hopefully you can all chime in and clarify this?
I would like to get a better understanding of the actual source of LRH advices around the 1981/2 period onwards. I am questioning the authenticity of Advices during this period, as it appears that there is a possibility at least, that the traffic to Ron may have been tampered with in some way, and that possibly, some communication originating from “Ron” may in fact have been forgeries. I do not know that this is the case, but hopefully you guys can clarify it for me.
As far as I recall the traffic at Int that was going to Ron was relayed via the RTC Office by Susie (Laplain – please correct me if I have given the wrong terminal) which were picked up by either Rover or PB. The replies that came back went through the same office and then were distributed as the routing determined.
I am not sure, but I gather that the reports going to R from Special Unit etc were going via a different channel or did they go out of the same comm centre?
I know that reports going up lines were read by the likes of Marlowe (before he was busted), Vicki and Jesse, but also by DM.
So here is the issue I have. If DM and PB were such good buddies, and PB filtering the traffic at his end, what was stopping PB from having the traffic altered or even not delivered? What about the stuff coming back, was it always R recording and sending the tape/s, R’s handwritten response, or was it just typed and signed R? The first two would be hard to forge, but the last would be very easy to forge. If that was the case, then PB could fabricate whatever advice they wanted and who would be any the wiser?
I seem to remember that Susie would type (at an unbelievable speed) from audio tapes? I also recall that should would do stuff for DM?
Also if DM had his own channel, to and from, then he could have fabricated whatever advice he wanted and again nobody would be the wiser, especially if he and PB blocked any comm from getting through that may have challenged anything.
I think it would be good to document what all of the channels to Ron were at this time to understand whether or not there was the possibility of the communications being meddled with or not, and if so who had the capacity to do it?
Atcause, you are an arrogant prick! Terril has been doing so much in the Freezone and does not deserve this attack.
OTDT,
I was never on staff, but around many Scientologists in the 1970s, and it seemed to me I heard echoes of a developing “fascist” subculture within Scientology organizations.
I never attributed this to LRH policies, and still don’t. I thought it was in the nature of some human beings to act that way and (mis?)interpret policies and then (mis?)apply them that way. Perhaps to use “policy” to justify their actions. It was one of my perceptions that kept me a bit distant from the org scene.
TLLL~ 😆 I can totally see the poor public in this garb. 😆
I did the hang around thing in hopes I could work at the Baton Rouge mission…and I lived in New Orleans at the time.
Clearing the Planet is only true for Scientologists. Yet, Scientologists as a group (COS), have attempted to enforce their form of Salvation upon a Planet that has no need, use, or want for a very costly and intellectually problematic cosmology. COS declared war and Culture rose to accept battle. COS wants world domination. This is insane. COS is being broken on the wheel of history due to it’s violent insanity as epitomized by DM. I hope the Indies will split off Planetary Clearing from the Tech. So long as world domination via mass processing or deleting those <2.0 from society remains a principle of existence, Scientologists will remain at enmity with the world. Sanity is peaceful co-existence. Sanity is not an insane group led by an insane man dictating terms to the world. Tom Cruise showed what doctrinaire Scientogy looks like. Or am I incorrect?
Valkov, please check out Casablanca. I wrote something to you regarding the book of poems.
Has any body ever read Dr Frankenstein ?
Dr F was a genius, if not quite right in the head, the monster he created was a mindless destroyer, fulfilling Dr F ‘s darker side with no intelligence or moral conviction, who destroyed who im the end?
Thanks for posting this, WW. It has been along time since I read it, and I recall it now. It never did promote any action against the person. Irecall an incident from the 1970s where a new Scientologist “took the law into her own hands” and damaged some property of a person in some Ethics trouble at the Detroit org. What she did was an overt act then, and is still an overt act today. Also against the law, to vandalize another’s property.
The wonder is, this apparently needs to be pointed out to some of today’s so-called “Scientologists”!
Damn Marty – You’ve hit a nerve on this post. I’ve not seen so much rough and tumble.
Johnny d – I think you are being a little too literal and missing the point, just a bit. Well maybe a whole lotta bits.
Raindog~That (Axiom 58) is exactly how you can tell the CofM is in an absolute state of confusion. Thanks for posting it.
368 comments already. Wow! In music, there is such a term as deep cut-“In radio programming, a deep cut is a song which commercial radio stations rarely broadcast. It is taken from the fact that on vinyl albums, popular singles are usually found early on in the record and lesser-known songs buried “deep” into the record” (got definition off the internet)
We are into the deep cuts here.
Kingsley Winbush spoke at our Mission when I was new. I remember hearing about the pushing power thing. I remember about the Broekers when LRH died. Then they were gone. For those of us far removed from the Sea Org. We have bits and pieces. And there has been so much mystery. Scientology wasn’t supposed to be filled with mystery. Another example of it becoming it’s opposite. Thank you Marty for spurring on this discussion and to all those who are contributing. You are shining a light. And I am getting such gain from this. It’s huge.
The End of Shelly’s ‘Frankenstein’
“Walton discovers the monster mourning over Frankenstein’s body. Walton hears the monster’s adamant justification for his vengeance as well as expressions of remorse. The destruction of Frankenstein had not brought the monster peace – rather his crimes increased his own misery and alienation, finding his own emotional destruction in the destruction of his creator”
Good point Hans. And splog and Hans, I would say that the point of the Bolivar PL would probably be that a leader and a subordinate need to flow an appropriate amount (and type) of power to each other to survive. Ron is usually very direct and I wished he would have stated his ideas here simply and directly and with a “Scientology slant”, that is, emphasizing ARC and true survival as the points of the stories.
Yes, cultural and historical context is extremely important.
The 1940s through the 1960s were also the eras of totalitarian Communist takeovers in China and Korea and the brutal Korean War with it’s introduction of NorthKorean “brainwashing” and the credible threat that Communism was intending to “bury” the Western “Free World”.
It was also the era of Senator Joe McCarthy’s “witch hunt” for communist “enemies” and communist “sympathizers” within the USA. His House Un-American Activities Committee(HUAC) was the much feared kangaroo court he used in Congress. Many people lost their jobs and were blacklisted from getting work because they allegedly “knew someone who knew someone who might have been a Communist”!
HUAC became a target of the same college students who protested the VietnamWar and the military draft.
Communism was seen as a real threat, and paranoia about it was whipped up by the likes of McCarthy. The threat was largely seen as emerging from Asia as well as the Soviet Union, because of the growing populations of some Asian countries, notably China.
This was all there in the background, when LRH was giving his early lectures. Some of his remarks and expressed viewpoints need to be looked at in that perspective.
“I met Ron Dewolf and I’d say he was subject to MK Ultra or went to the private sector to recieve a few dozen ECT treatments on his own.”
As evil as MK Ultra may have been, not that many people went through it. (a couple hundred) Marty, did Nibbs tell you that he had been a test subject? In the absence of such reliable proof it would be more accurate to say that Nibbs simply had his own psychological problems for unknown reasons. (though his childhood was not particularly stable and this was a likely a contributing factor)
Secondly David Mayo working for the FBI? The Federal Government could not apparantly find Ron while he was hiding out, and had Mayo been an informer, he could have most likely located Ron for them. It sounds like Ron got increasingly paranoid as he got older, and someone fed him a story, they knew he would believe.
I just want to say that IMO even if you never met LRH, you can certainly know him through his lectures particularly, and in a less “personal” way through his writings. I won’t let anybody tell me that I did not know LRH. Hell yes, I did. Just sayin’
I agree Marty.
The data I’ve gotten second hand pretty much confirms what you say about Nibs.
Also rumors that he may have been in contact with good Ol’ Jolly West ,Mr Mk Ultra himself prior to hitching his wagon to Flynn and Assoc and Russ Miller.
Was LRH Dr Frankenstein ? is DM his little monster?
Let’sLook, re; your funny story about trying to see a reg, have you seen the new definition of “IAS Briefing”? How times have changed!
“IAS Briefing” means the public comes in nicely dressed, listens to the phony “wins” of the IAS, then hears about the “catastrophe requiring immediate handling” for which “we need your donations to pull it off”. When it’s all over, public go home wearing nothing but their Briefs, because the IAS reges have made them cough up everything else they owned, right down to their shoes. The reges quote the Standard IAS Senior Policy, based on”Command Intention”: “Strip, or go to Ethics!”
Also sounds like Wimbush pioneered this approach…. and DM got rid of him because he did not want any competition….
Oh, my God – you opened a box, and I don’t have time!
First, this PL is a story – LRH is a writer, for God’s sake, and he told an interesting story to put a point across. On various tapes, Ron will tell a joke and then say “Joke!” because there are people who are very literal and will take his jokes as the gospel. This PL is not a joke, but it is a story told to make a point, not to OK killing people or sleeping with hansom young lieutenants. I mean, I never heard the term “Pink Legs” used, but I sure could see idiots using it as a really cool way to justify destructive acts in the name of “the cause.” ARC and Theta trump policy, everyone. “Pink Legs” is not theta! It is not an optimal solution to a problem.
Here’s the point: the PL title is “The Responsibility of LEADERS” not “The Responsibility of FOLLOWERS.”
DM and Kingsley Wimbush commanding their minions to flow power to them is EXACTLY the wrong flow. They have to EARN it. They have to LEAD. They have to TAKE CARE OF THEIR PEOPLE. If they do, they are worthy of respect and their position. If they have to ASK for it, they are not worthy.
The point of the PL is that Bolivar DID NOT TAKE CARE OF HIS PEOPLE. He did not flow power down to his generals and aides, or respect them. And they killed him/exiled him/tossed him out. This PL applies to DM, but he sure does not get it. His best are leaving, and the game is GET DM. DM will end his days in jail or in some run-down trailer park. Some leader! What a cussing idiot DM is.
No one owes anyone anything, other than proper agreed-to exchange. Loyalty is earned. It is EARNED. IF it is earned, then it behooves a member of the team to flow power to the leader – to let him or her do a great job, do a great job yourself, ease their burden, forward their/your agenda, etc. Just like if you work for Ford, you should drive Fords, and if you work at Starbucks, you should drink Starbucks.
But none of us need a license to survive from anyone – we flow power WILLINGLY. It is OUR origination to do so, because we WANT to help, and we WANT the group (and ourselves) to survive. If “flowing power to a power” must be enforced, the leader has failed.
EXIntStaffMember posted: “COB himself took this to absolutely ridiculous levels. I recall seeing him rushing into a room full of trainees, and when one appeared a bit startled at suddenly having COB almost run into him, DM shoved a finger in the trainee’s face and said angrily “MISSED WIHHOLDS!” Off that guy went to sec checking.”
COB evidently spotted the poor guys “crime” – “Being there”. So to survive around COB, it was apparently necessary to learn how to “Not Be there” when COB was around. Avert your eyes and do not look upon the Face of the Living God! But what kind of “survival” is that???
atcause –
Just something I want you to consider, if this post will go through:
For many years I considered myself a true hardcore Scientologist, long production list, three different countries, many happy students and pcs.
I sacrificed a lot for my cause, don’t really feel like sharing the details.
I am on ESMB and I am here and some other places too.
I don’t know much about Terril Park and I know even less about you.
I generally like people, a lot, but your comments made me wonder WTF is your problem? Chill, have some pizza, kiss someone. Just an advice, before you post again. P.S. There is a list of smart ass things in my head I heroically convinced myself not to post, just because I am not interested in out smarting anyone. Respecting others who are sincere in their motives and sorting things out together is my interest. Cheers.
Not to mention college Fraternities.
Bodil,
What you have left out of your equation is that all the “products” of Scientology have been co-created, with many others in addition to LRH, involved in the co-creation.
I don’t recall his exact wording, but LRH wrote to the effect that “I am 100% responsible for setting down the tech, you are 100% responsible for it’s application”.
Anyone can help me out with this reference?
Strong and sane!
Marty already handled this; Atcause, it seems like you are piling on just for the joy of kicking Terril.
Terril spends much time on various sites – even on hostile sites – promoting the tech and posting wins from scientology.
Atcause,
Terril spends much time on various sites – even on hostile sites like ESMB– promoting the tech and posting wins from scientology. He catches a lot of flack from critics, but he persists.
As he points out above, he has a VFP – he has posted nearly 1,000 posts of scientology wins on ESMB alone.
Do you have a comparable VFP?
Very interesting. Around 1980 several european orgs experienced the same way a new culture of violence, stat push and slave labor. Simon Bolivar policy was indeed heavily used to create this blind allegiance.
Dear Jesse,
Just one to bring up a point I consider important here, and that is the possibility (how ever remote) that it was not even LRH who issued that order. Based on various accounts, including yours elsewhere, I know of many first hand observations of DM, Starkey and others being able to falsify LRHs handwriting and signature.
I also noticed that at the time Pat Broeker and DM where the only channels of comm to and from LRH, we know by then they were both in collusion. So anything issued at that time is suspect to me. It is very hard to know what was LRH orders and what was DM or PB fraudulent issues. I think there is a strong possibility they begun falsifying things then.
I’m not saying this is what happened, I’m not even saying this is what most probably happened. I”m saying that it is a strong possibility that this was not LRH. I’m not saying he is perfect and made no mistakes either.
It could be DM and Pat wanted to 3P LRH underhandedly this way. I have personally being subjected to a very malicious black PR campaigned orchestrated by someone I trusted so much. This person seemed to most people a saint, expert PR earns trust immediatly, and the 3P is very underhanded; destructive actions portrayed as originated or caused by me, little comments “in my defense” you could not pinpoint as bad PR directly but which definitely colored my image statements “while being concerned with my well being” or due to how much the person “cared” it would be almost impossible to label their statements or actions 3P. However this is exactly what resulted.
On further inspection it was unmistakably a well thought out BPR camapaign very malicious and unprovoked. This person acted in very calculated way to portray me in very bad light and make me responsible for sabotage of something not only I had nothing to do with but no knowledge of but done while destroying something I had worked hard to build, others were convinced this person was saving the day and I was some evil devil. Not the first time this happens either and I only discovered the truth by a fluke.
Very insidious and calculated. If you met this person today, you’d think you met a great amazing person, but in fact this is a very devious individual. If this happened to me it is not unlikely it happened to LRH. This person and DM have much in common, down to the obsession with appearance.
DM very possibly acted to created BPR for LRH form that early point and justify himself.
May be LRH did order this based on false alarming reports, may be LRH was dramatizing an ev purp, just like you and I have on occasion. All a possibility and all should be considered.
I know John Aczel well, the thought of that diminutive little coward hitting him is very upsetting. Not only is John very dedicated and very smart and a gentleman (if eccentric and strange in someways), he is still in there working as hard as ever and remembers LRH so very fondly.
John was defended by LRH several times and I have seen the glowing commendations LRH personally issued to him, including the award for doing the right thing in spite of orders to the contrary.
Soderqvist1: As far as I have seen, there is no paper in existence that show that Hubbard ordered GO to Attack Paulette Cooper, but I have seen a trace of it!
Nancy Many says that she was head of the covert intelligence operations out of the Boston intelligence unit during Snow White and Freak out. She once followed Paulette cooper. When orders came to break and enter cooper’s psychiatrist’s office and copy her file, Nancy refused to do it and lost her position. Within a week of the operation being successfully completed, Hubbard sent a telex personally congratulating the team. Later, she worked directly for Hubbard, setting up the move into Japan and working with Mary Sue and Diana. Hubbard personally ordered Nancy into the RPF when she was 5 months pregnant.
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=354015&postcount=5
Soderqvist1: spitting in John’s face, and how credible it is that Hubbard literally ordered such a thing has been debated here, and Russell Miller’s introduction to spectatorism has been mentioned. Btw, is 8C through spitting possible?
Chapter 18 Messengers of God by Russell Miller
Page 305: A few months later, Diana upset her father in some way. Hubbard reeled off a long reprimand to the messenger on duty, adding at the end of it: ‘OK, go and spit in Diana’s face.’ The messenger was a little dark-eyed girl called Jill Goodman, thirteen years old. She ran along the deck to Diana’s office, burst in, spat in her face with unerring accuracy and began shouting her message as Diana let out a scream of fury. Mary Sue, who was in an adjoining office, burst in as her daughter was wiping the spittle from her face. She grabbed Jill round the throat as if she was going to strangle her and also began screeching. Jill started crying and when Mary Sue let her go, she immediately rushed off to tell the Commodore. Another acrimonious husband and wife row followed, which ended with Mary Sue throwing her shoes at the luckless messenger Hubbard despatched to chastise her further.
http://www.clambake.org/archive/books/bfm/bfm18.htm
The Pl is tremendously constructive and powerful. LRH was the first to provide exact context and fortunately never cancelled it. I can’t believe such a tremendous discussion by smart people can develop while missing the whole point of the PL. We still accept, attack, justify or talk about the literal explanation of segments out of context whereas LRH himself specifically starts the PL with:
“I have written it this way, using two actual people, to give an example of magnitude enough to interest and to furnish some pleasant reading and I used a military sphere so it could be seen without restimulation of admin problems.”
It’s not difficult at all to translate the command lines, power, authority, killing, flub catch, tactics and strategy of a war to the admin lines of an expanding activity.
JD
Marty said Fair Game not disconnection.
He said most staff and public not “99%”.
You are like Hobson seeking “proof” of their own straw man.
Most staff and public wouldn’t know about Fair Game because the Policy has been canceled and they are not allowed on the Internet.
Now go and grow a brain.
I am a member of ESMB.
I am not a clown.
I am doing some positive things in my life.
There are Independent Scientologists who know me and thanks me for what I do.
For you to state othervise, without even known me, is a generality.
ML
Wow!
OTDT, thanks for posting this.
ExIntStaffMember:
Thank you for so clearly and articulately stating what Miscavige does and dramatizes.
Perhaps this one action of “Flowing Power” and cow towing to Miscavige in the biggest reason the “Church” is in the state it is in.
Sue Wilhere stated to the St. Pete Times newspaper.
David Miscavige IS Scientology
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Marty, Your name is still on this Pro-Church of Scientology website. (bottom left side)
http://www.liveandgrow.org/
Church Leadership:
Mr. David Miscavige – Chairman of the Board – Religious Technology Center
Mr. Mark Rathbun – Inspector General – Religious Technology Center
Rev. Heber Jentzsch – The President of the Church Answers Your Questions.
Hi Steve
I have looked in my 5th Edition (1978) copy of IES. The table of Contents are as follows:
The Purpose of Ethics p7
The Anti-Social Personality p9
The Social Personality p16
The Conditions p23
The Table Of Conditions p24
The Conditions Formulas p25
Formulas for Conditions Below Non-Existence p41
The Ethics Codes p45
Petition p62
Rewards and Penalties p65
Safeguarding Technology p71
Glossary p75 – p79
I have just had a look at the pope of not-scientology’s revamped IES. Now 393 pages (not including the glossary).
If you have the current version, I think you can work out what changes have occurred. It appears that there were two other editions after 1978 (namely, 1989 and 1998) before the (393 page) 2007 edition. Whether either of these contain The Responsibilities of Leaders chapter, I couldn’t say.
Well done Han Solo,
to recognize LRH for what he was has been a step toward ‘self determinism’ for me too. The good of Scientology can and should walk with his own merit out of the personality and deeds of LRH. Lets take the good and make it ours, and discard (not hide) the bad, as not ours.
Doing othervise is a failure in our own responsibility. If we blindly follow LRH, and the outcome is negative, should we then blame LRH? That’s irresponsibility. Lets be responsible in our lives. Gread wisdom and good Tech can be found in Scientology, thanks to LRH and some other contributor. But to take LRH as a model without acknowledging that LRH failed to apply some of the basic principle of Scientology to his life is a step into a cultish mentality and irresponsibility.
Some of the Scn principles hold true for you? Use them!
You can make people happy with the Tech? Great, go for it!
You don’t agree with LRH on something? Then don’t.
To hell with LRH and his shortcomings, chainlockers, rants and evil. Horray to LRH for his wisdom / good tech / hints who can be used to make our lives better. And to hell with those who want to portray LRH as the Saint he was not, or the evil man he was not.
We should be interested in the positives and be able to recognize and discard (not hide) the negatives too.
If LRH failed to apply some Scientology principles to his life, (and it seems so from what Jesse wrote – not recognizing 3th party, ordering physical punishment, not having the accuser confront the accused), we should spot it, acnowledge, and know we can do better.
Great post -Common Sense!
I believe many of those who have left comments here tried to communicate the thought you expressed so simply and effectively. In my view its all those that wrote in so many words “look at it from another side too”, “don’t go to extremes” etc. etc.
LRH kept repeating, explaining, taking different approaches to many topics and principles in Scientology because the initial communication didn’t get through immediately. On the PDC lectures he actually pulls this gag to demonstrate this point and gave a One-Sentence explanation of what a thetan’s problems with MEST were and how to solve it – but nobody would get it (me neither 🙂
A lot of communication is often needed to communicate something simple. Now there are many who do the “explaining” here – yours is a really good and simple one.
So because people know something that you don’t, they’re low-ARC? What kind of twisted idiot logic is that?
The way this blog posting and it’s comments can best be summed up is this way the important part is in bold.
Randy: Stan, why did you do that? I would have proudly died for that rabbit!
Stan: Dad, you said “hand over the bunny” so I did
Randy: No! That’s NOT the way we’re remembering it!
Sinar,
Agreed, this has been one of the most interesting blog and comment board in a while. Must have something to do with Election day 2010.
As for Matt’s post regarding R experiences, I can also attest from a 3rd flow back on the Apollo, that yes R could get very pissed when one made mistakes, but he never hit anyone nor sent one to “the Hole”, or “probationally” decalred one verbally. And he normally would vlean up any mess afterward.
Samuel,
Bingo.
What this post and the ensuing comments demonstrates is the need for multiple viewpoint management. All of the different viewpoints expressed here show how differently we see the exact same event. Some of us had positive experiences, some of us had negative experiences, some in between.
When Pat and David managed to channel their viewpoints to LRH, Scientology took a very bad turn. Certainly, LRH was under attack. He even came near dying. Being near dying doesn’t place you high on the tone scale, and the lower a person’s tone the less rational his/her responses. Some of his orders at the time certainly didn’t come across as high-toned. Spit in someone’s face? Beat up Mayo? Wasn’t Mayo the guy chosen to audit LRH at death’s door?
“Blasphemy!” you say? Well, you can’t have it both ways.
When you have evidence that something did happen and evidence that it didn’t, you have to sort through all the viewpoints available to come to a better understanding. Maybe what happened was a hybrid of all those experiences.
I have a morbid curiosity with LRH’s dark side. I have a great respect for his capacity to understand and communicate what he saw. I don’t need his life whitewashed and justified to appreciate his accomplishments. But there is this tendency to whitewash and justify in an effort to prove his work valid. His work and his life are two different things. Neither needs to be lied about or distorted. The two things can be differentiated.
Those who fail to understand history are doomed to repeat it.
Seeing an event from all viewpoints is necessary to fully understanding it. No matter how broad and critical one viewpoint might be to the event, it is still just one viewpoint.
And being critical of another viewpoints because it doesn’t agree with our own doesn’t lead to increased understanding. Evaluating the communications from that viewpoint as to exact time, place, form and event increases understanding. Just saying, “You don’t know,” or “You’re an idiot,” or “Your information is false,” doesn’t improve understanding without supporting analysis.
Often, those involved in an event understand it less well than those outside looking in. The nose-to-the-wall phenomenon. Their viewpoint is too narrow, to short-sighted. Their interest is heavily vested. Their tendency to be human and make themselves right too strong.
We aren’t in this mess because we’re fond of the truth. We’re in this mess because we’re a bunch of alter-ising thetans who want to be right. Our case is a tribute to our nature.
And getting out of this mess might take a bit of humility, a bit of willingness to see where we alter-is, see where we are making ourselves right. Not just on the first dynamic but on all dynamics.
Michael
Just Me,
Sorry girl, I didn’t get that. What I got was a bit of an ARCX that the romance didn’t work out. It wasn’t a ‘lived happily ever after’ story and I was so enamoured with Manuela that my 19 year old heart broke for her and Simon.
Oh yeah, the other thing I got that stands to this day regarding the delegation of ‘power’; sometimes a truly able guy has to hand over the reigns to a less able person and bite his tongue on the results the less able guy may get. Let him find his own legs and stand up. I apply that when I guide flyfishing people. They cast in the bushes, miss the rise of a salmon, can’t put the fly where they need to and all sorts of blundering. It’s painful for me to watch but I do what I can to assist and otherwise let them get on with it.
Of course I’ve read it since and got more, but I NEVER got that I should throw my own common sense to the wind and follow some peckerwood cause he sat on a throne of his own invention. Maybe that’s why I’ve got such a wonderful set of Golden Rod issues. Right or wrong, on the Welcome to the Sea Org tapes LRH mentions that in the course of action in the SO, if you aren’t getting a Comm Ev now and again you ain’t doing anything. He suggests that getting in ‘trouble’ is the hallmark of an active being, and mentions he hasn’t been in anything but for some ‘quadrillion’ years. That one I took to heart and over Responsibilities of Leaders 🙂
Han Solo,
I am right with you on “Nobody has the right to obey. ” The world was sickened by what the Nazi followers did when they were “just following orders.” The Nuremburg Trials rightly allowed no such excuse. What got me looking at the Truth Rundown was seeing Tommy Davis screaming that “SEA ORG MEMBERS FOLLOW ORDERS!” There is such a thing as right and wrong. When political law (law set by a power, or by the majority rule) is contrary to natural law (the protection of the inalienable or god-given rights of the individual), it is our duty to DISOBEY.
What a topic, Marty! This kind of discussion, disagreement and multiple viewpoints of hard truths is just what is needed.
Miss B,
I’ll cut in and attempt to answer #2 above. Yes, there is policy and procedure to follow. It is laid out in the OEC volumes, particularly OEC Vol 0 and 1. There is also recourse to be had should one have been falsely labelled, laid out in the same volumes.
Fair Game is cancelled. The procedure for handling a person labelled SP is not. It is steps A-E. However, DM has altered these steps too in his versions of ‘policy’. He also practices Fair Game.
Today, I have personally observed and experienced the relative impossibility of getting virtually any of the laid out policies on the subject of PTS/SP applied in the present CofS. Recourse is non-existent. A-E is squirrelly beyond any pale. Justice does not exist there. The policies are superceded by such things as ‘pink legs’ described above, ‘command intention’ DM’s latest randome capriciousness, and just plain idiocy.
Initially, if you would read the first policies that presented the Justice Codes (these were, among several more of the same period, 7 March 65 Issues I, II, III in the original OEC vols as opposed to the squirrelled up altered later DM versions) you would find that any and all SP declares had to be approved by LRH as ED Int before going into effect. While the admin was on lines, the person had the chance to correct the scene and the declare would be held if they did. Such things are covered these policies. Again, NONE or virtually none of these policies are applied in today’s Church of Miscavige.
Terril,
You got the dox or not. Show one or the other and this will be completed.
We had a similar attitude in our org, only we didn’t call it “pink legs”. We called it “over dead bodies”. Sounds like it could’ve been from the same reference, though, doesn’t it?
The truth is the truth Ralph.
DM thrives off of like minded people who thrive off of him. The reason why the church never aspires to greater heights and ridiculous services like “The Basics” are released to people.
“The Basics” is not even a standard grade chart action and it even sounds like something that Tom Cruise and DM concocted themselves to serve the public notice with.
They are PTS. There is no new tech that LRH wrote to DM since he died. LRH Did his research and moved on. Seems like the SP’s are Fair Gaming DM. An interesting revenge wouldn’t you say?
I know you are busy, looked it up myself and found the answers to the above questions.
tks,
MissBridgett
All these experts in the field.
XDN the purpose of which is freedom from cruel impulses and chronic unwanted conditions, such as a person that feels like throwing people off of roofs once a week would benefit tremendously from XDN processing. And also FPRD no doubt.
But, looking at the church and the way it Fair Games people, aren’t these Fair Gamer’s from the church suffering from a cruel impluse to do something to another human being resulting in a chronic unwanted condition? Of course they are. The church is well knowing for sending out their best men during times like these. FPRD Cases to handle the public.
Jim,
Thank you so much for your answers. You made things much more clear. I did not know there was recourse for being falsely labelled as an SP and had ‘Fair Game’ tactics used against you via the Church! Does this include the CofS actually making restitution for wrongly (when is it ever right anyway?)..attacking someone and destroying their life and family?
I also find it fascinating how few people were actually declared a real ‘SP’ when LRH was at the helm, it appears by the lower number of SP declares then, that he was actually reluctant to declare people as ‘enemies’ and perhaps would rather try everything possible and apply all positive Scientology tech before ever taking this measure. There is a drastic, alarming…and ‘telling’ difference when compared to the ever increasing numbers in the hundreds of supposed ‘enemy SPs’ that DM declares, seemingly on a daily basis! (and stranger still that so many of these new ‘SPs’ have spent many many years in service as high level well respected Scientologists themselves. It is just one symptom of what is going on within the CofS now, as Marty and others mentioned.
Thank you so much again Jim, I appreciate that you saw my questions and took the time to answer.
ARC,
MissBridgett
Jim,
Oop’s, In regards to recourse and restitution, I know as you said, it is virtually non-existant now, but I was very interested that it DID exist and there may have been a procedure for recourse when LRH was in charge. I did not know LRH personally, but through his writings I think I have gotten to know him and his intentions. He was a powerful Thetan being, and also very human, with a great love of mankind and a huge heart and sense of humor. He just wasn’t so easily offended. And I really like that he was tough too, someone like that who balances toughness and discipline with fairness and has an understanding of his own and others humanity and ability to make mistakes and learn from them…who also can laugh at HIMSELF!…is someone you can trust to have your best interests in mind too. I feel certain he would have laughed at the very thought of a little monkey like me…ever being considered an ‘enemy SP’…and assured that if he knew what had happened to me and my son and that so much money and effort was used to try to destroy a funny, kind and smart little gal like myself…heads would roll!
I wish LRH was here today. But I am grateful for Marty, Mike, Karen, Amy, Jeff, Sam, YOU…and so many others that are here now.
xo
MissBridgett
Je m’excuse, this comment was written before an answer got posted, but somehow fell under Jim’s answer! I meant it for Marty, as I know he is incredibly busy. Tks. again Jim for stepping in with answers!
This is a pretty established fact Jesse, that David Mayo was part and parcel of the NOT’s research and development. At least in more enlightened circles. I am well aware of this being the truth for one.
In spite of all the mess the church is in I am sure glad the NOT’s came out though, aren’t you?
Terril kicked himself by making statements regarding LRH without yet producing the evidence to back it up as Marty requested.
He says he gone to the “experts” on ESMB but we have yet to hear back from him with what Marty requested.
Why doesn’t he produce what was asked of him?
If he was wrong, he needs to admit to his mistake publicly and move on.
As for piling on, it is Marty who is being piled on and I’m tired of seeing it. When the man is in the right, I’m going to back him up, no matter what. I’m not going to sit and wait for someone else to back him up. His battle is my battle also.
If you want to see real “piling on” of the insane variety, just go to ESMB or WWP and make a pro-LRH or Scientology tech statement.
Yes Terril spends time on ESMB mixing with the haters on that message board. Apparently he’s picked up their low standards for what passes as truth. Unfortunately for him, Marty called him on it here.
There are certain facts. Paulette Cooper wrote a book attacking COS. The FBI raided COS and seized documents including those of ” Operation Freakout” plans to frame Paulette Cooper. Below I’ve linked copies of these documents and other related testimonies. In the subsequent trial of the Snowwhite affair LRH was listed as an unindicted co-conspirer, and then went into hiding.
Now you asked for specific proof that LRH initiated these, I assume
knowing that in the final settlement of all cases of PC v COS ,
where its thought PC recieved in excess of $5,000,000, Paulette
gave an affidavit which I quote in part here.
“However, I never had any real evidence or reason (other than the word of my lawyers) to believe that Mr. Hubbard was in control of the activities of the Church of Scientology, and my attorneys never presented me with any evidence that such was the case. It is clear to me, on the basis of my conversation with Mr. Flynn on this subject, that the allegations concerning Mr. Hubbard’s control over day-to-day Scientology activities had no basis in fact, but were being made solely for strategic reasons in pursuit of a default judgment.”
City of clearwater hearings 8 may 1982, Paulette Cooper testifies
and enters documents re “Operation Freakout” seized by FBI raids on COS.
http://home.snafu.de/tilman/krasel/cooper/frk.html
A page of related documents.
http://www.xenu-directory.net/critics/cooper1.html
Everything about that photograph, Chuck, says “gulag” to me. How terribly sad that the best and the brightest of their generation are now so broken, so trapped; left to clean toilets in the grime of east Hollywood.
Good to get your input, Mark.
Those justifiers are Whole Track dramatizations, used over and over by groups with a mission of “cleansing/saving/rescuing” a society.
The sad part is some asshole always infiltrates the group and the next thing you know, instead of reforming the financial sector, Jews are thrown into gas chambers.
Well put!
Thank you for your comments here which I sometimes found very inspiring.
There’s no question DM will – or has – pulled in his own demise. It’s only a question of time. This is not a new story; we’re on this same merry-go-round lifetime after lifetime. The Implanters did their job well and we’ve been even better at abdicating our responsibility.
My earlier statement stands: nothing I’ve ever read or heard from LRH has ever made me anything other than happier, stronger, more at peace, more in communication and more responsible. So that’s the entirety of my experience, and all I can speak to. Others chose to take a handful of references to justify their BS.
The Old Man had a purpose and he fought like hell to get it done. Was his case on the lines? Yeah, it could be. The guy lived up and down the Tone Scale. Big fucking deal.
My error was to accept the interpretations of those who secretly seek to destroy what they’re pretending to support, and succumb to Group Think.
I’m going to try and remember this for next time.
This is so true, Tom, and reflects why most of us don’t think of adopting Gestapo tactics to get a product. The higher up tone you go, the more fun you’re having, the less serious you are, but those stuck in literalness will hear the words and get none of the playfulness behind them.
That’s the biggest load of BS I’ve ever read, WW, and thanks for pointing out just how degraded the situation’s gotten. If I didn’t agree with the morality code in the first place, it’s NOT AN OVERT ACT! If the moral code of a Nazi says Jews needed to be gassed, and I don’t agree, you’re telling me I’m the one committing the overt???
I’ve always personally loved that last definition: that thing which you do which you aren’t willing to have happen to you.
It forces you to be pan-determined.
@Anon:
Terril originally wrote: “The only reason she [Paulette Cooper] isn’t in jail is that the FBI raid found that LRH had ordered extreme fair game on her …. “.
Your data fails to demonstrate that specific claim.
Michael A. Hobson
I don’t think LRH was weak and easily deceived. I just think Broeker and Miscavige knew the system, and how to abuse, circumvent and manipulate it, for their own power-grab purposes. And they did it at a time that LRH, his family and the upper echelons of the CoS were at their most vulnerable, being under such broad and serious attack.
Hi Ralph, Thank you for that precise synopsis .I did my OT2 before the advent of Nots and it was beyond what I thought was possible in that I was getting answers to questions I hadn’t dreamed of asking.
This era of Scientology is my core realtity of what Scientology
really is in that you either were trained , could audit and knew what you were doing on the level or it went over your head and you missed the full gains to say the least.I see this” Group Engram Running” on Marty’s site as a major event as we are in now is peeling the layers off the devolution of the tech and admin .I don’t see why there cannot be a full resurgence of powerfull OT’s being made again with all the people who have been denied that tech that are coming forth.
I want to thank you for having your site as a positive beacon for for me to refer people to as well as the Wise Old Goat’s site that gives accurate and helpfull data.
Terril, at the risk of repeating what others said, I knew a person who was on staff at Wimbush’s mission, and she was devastated, depressed, and upset. She is the one that told me about Wimbush’s greed and how he drove in expensive cars while the staff starved and were working like slaves. She was dropped off a some mall to sell books or get creamed – she and others – and she of course gave the money to Wimbush and got virtually nothing. She described exactly what Marty just posted about “flowing power to a power” – Wimbush. She told me this in 1982, 1983 timeframe. This was supported by others as well.
I remember the while dedinging craze that was going around. There was a special meeting near CC back at the same time where they were “training” in it. Dedinging – subtle PTS-ness. Just a little slight – a “ding” – can bring you down. What absolute bullshit.
Wait, is your metaphor about Thomas Jefferson, Isaac Newton or Jesus?
Thomas Jeffeson owned slaves.
Isaac Newton believed in black magick (the occult).
And Jesus came “with a sword” and a whip.
Was Isaac Newton the anti-christ?
You pretty much summed it up Larry.
Actually at one time one couldn’t be an exec until they completed FPRD.
Before that before a person was considered a product of the FEBC on the Apollo they had to be completed on the Ls which addressed the same thing on XII.
Funny thing is Miscavige hasn’t had either of those actions and yet he’s supposedly “leading” the Church.
Also he’s probably not even done a Full Hat (ya know the Satanic Majesty or Evil Diabolical Ruler Full Hat though its hard to tell) never mind an OEC/FEBC.
Valkov,
The ref is from the May 62 HCOB ARCXs MWHS.
A very astute observation GH.
Myself I always viewed the Bolivar PL as a Parable of sorts.
Not something that was rigorously applied like say Int Rundown procedure or some other touchy tech procedure.
I couldn’t imagine and probably the Ol’man though I can only speak for myself couldn’t imagine anyone being stupid and idiotic enough to follow the path of Simon and Manuela!
Nor totally accept literary license such as “pink legs” as holy writ!
And I’m sure he wouldn’t have anticipated the altered importance given to the PL which is one of thousands he wrote.
ATCAUSE Said:-
“Yes Terril spends time on ESMB mixing with the haters on that message board. Apparently he’s picked up their low standards for what passes as truth. Unfortunately for him, Marty called him on it here.”
I’ve been banned from posting success stories on OCMB, Factnet,
Enturbulation.org [ now WWP] and beliefnet. The latter for violating
copyright of all reasons!
ESMB is the best source of new people coming to the
Freezone/independent field. Possibly this blog may exceed it, but I don’t know if Marty can staticise this even, as many will wish to stay under the radar. For example someone who contacted me had been
connected to an FZ auditor via someone else who posts here.
ESMB does have some “haters”, they are in fact a small minority.
There are far more Freezoners and most of the rest even if critical of COS and even the tech respect our right to believe and practice what we wish to.
You snipe at my alleged low standard for truth, yet you havn’t investigated this issue at all it seems. I guess you need to see a bit more truth. As is commonly held, ” The truth shall set you free”.
Fortunately Marty allowed my post and you can see the documents
of “operation Freakout “, which lasted 4 years, which the FBI found when it raided COS. This happened under LRH’s watch. You seriously think he didn’t know and approve of what was going on?
Then here is another quotation from Nancy Many’s book linking LRH with Paulette, followed up by a quote from the affidavit of
Tonja Burdon also linking LRH to Paulette.
Finally, LRH’s acts and character do not affect whether the tech works.
——————-
Originally Posted by Nancy Many in My Billion Year Contract, pages 62-63
“Meanwhile, we were getting more pressure than I had ever experienced before to get a copy of Paulette Cooper’s psychiatric file from her psychiatrist’s office in Boston. There were at least five phone calls a day to JW, pushing him to get the files. It ended up that the only way to get a copy was to commit a B and E, two of them actually, one to get the file out and copied and one to get it returned. It came to me as the head of covert operations to get it done. I didn’t even need to think of it; this was not listening to a casual conversation at work, pulling papers out of the trash, or even copying things—this was against the law. And personally, I had seen this woman and she just didn’t match the energy and hatred coming from on high in Scientology to hurt her. I refused.
I simply lost my position, and two others did the job. The file was copied and sent up-lines. Within the week, the Boston Intelligence Department got a telex relaying a job well done to the intelligence team in Boston from L. Ron Hubbard. There was no doubt in my mind as to where the heat to do something like that had come from.”
——————–
From Declaration of Tonja Burden:-
8. Prior to February – April, 1976, when Hubbard left Clearwater, Florida, I carried numerous messages between Hubbard and others concerning Paulette Cooper. These messages concerned operations to attack and destroy Paulette Cooper.
There’s a whole side discussion I could get into, but not relevant to the main point. Gulag, I agree. And in my 6-7 years on the RPF, I more than once reflected on the similarities of RPF to Alexander Solzenitzen’s books, and to Natan Sharansky’s book, both were Russians in the Soviet Gulag system. Natan outwitted the best KGB interrogators, I loved his book the best for that. I always just toed the line because I thought we were producing real OTs and doing the world good by it all. John Aczel’s one of the first 100 or so Sea Org members.
Here’s a photo of Wally Burgess, taken the same morning as the photo of John Aczel. Wally likewise was one of the first 100 or so Sea Org members. The gray haired lady is Sheila Chaleff, another LONG term ex Guardian’s Office person and long term Sea Org member, she works for OSA Int today.
Photos courtesy of Doug Owen of Los Angeles.
Want to clarify. I wrote: “Scientology wasn’t supposed to be filled with mystery. Another example of it becoming it’s opposite.” After “opposite” I should have written “in the church”
Pardon me SS.
That is a stupid question even though to some it may seem rhetorical.
Ron never created Miscavige.
Marty’s post reveals that Miscavige seized power (probably with the help of other suppressives and those he and they duped into believing that some kind of “leader” was required despite what it said in policy) by willful misapplication of the power formula.
In short even to suggest that what Miscavige or any of his advisors is doing has any relationship to Scientology is ridiculously absurd.
What he has done has been done for thousands of years prior to the subject’s arrival and is what happens when those with malicious intent take control of a subject or organization and pervert it toward their own selfish ends.
So stop looking to a work of fiction for your “answers” and wake up and smell the coffee.
No you are not correct.
If you think that Scientology is about creating mass FEMA type camps where “clearing” will occur than you haven’t actually studied the subject and are guilty of the same overt act that it’s soi-disant “leader” and his elitist “friends” who seek world domination have committed.
Valkov,
You’ll note that Ron was a FOI (Former Intel Officer) as well (which is why I didn’t object too much when “ex”-spies where allowed on AOLA lines back in the ’80’s) which gave him an edge on predicting where cats would jump in subsequent attacks to the subject (an edge that seems to be lost today under Micky D Miscavige and his incompetent OSA goons) because of his ability to utilize intel.
Good point about the “Amazing Randi”.
Here we have these stern men of “Science” at psy-cop led by a cheap stage magician, huckster and illusionist.
There’s a parallel there somewhere…..
Wait a minute!!!!!!
🙂
Actually they had Fletcher Prouty ready to roll on a bio of the Ol’man and then someone put the kibitz on that for some reason which I suspect had something to do with the fact that Prouty being a trained Intelligence officer would have detected Jerry “all we gotta do is allege” Armstrong’s play on discrediting the Ol’man.
By the way hobgoblin Hobson.
This is purely speculation on my part and is not supported by any dox.
Futile indeed!
More like an insightful commentary with cutting questions aimed with laser-guided precision.
But in your typically panty-waisted dilettante fashion your analysis is partly correct and Marty SHOULD stop talking about how all the answers are in his mythical book and make it a reality!
I might even buy one. 🙂
Ax
Nice summary Byron.
You rock dude!!!
High 5!!!!
Jesse,
I’ve never thought for one minute that the Ol’man was weak and easily deceived though others have implied or suggested otherwise.
However, you have to admit that Ron was distracted by his own research in regards to wrapping up the upper levels.
Also I personally worked on a project initiated by Ron to standardize the DCSI so that a Pre OT would achieve certainty on the State of Clear now and in the future.
(Very few know this but the RD was only intended to be delivered at a SH or AO so that if a past life clear showed up who had done the clearing course or advanced courses in an earlier life they could be easily be rehabbed.)
Not only that but he had several fiction works he wanted to complete.
Never mind all the noise and distractions still being created by various Government agencies urged on by a variety of opportunists who sought total control of the Organization.
It’s a wonder that the Ol’man spent as much time as he did on what was basically admin.
I mean Jesse weren’t you guys supposed to be there to pick up the slack in that area?
It seems to me that a lot of former execs want their cake and eat it too.
(I’m not saying you are one of those Jess)
They wanted the power and control but they wanted no responsibility for it.
Like when some weasel like Miscavige ordered something they “complied” without question or bothering to query the order or direction.
Myself I was never a paragon of virtue.
But at least I questioned any action that I didn’t agree with and if some dick head told me to do it because Ron said….
I damn well demanded the order in writing and if I still didn’t agree I even queried the Ol’man himself.
Seems to me that few did.
Even Mary Sue who I loved dearly fell into that trap as well.
At least we’re trying to recover whatever integrity we have by actually writing about our experiences.
And personally I think you’ve done a great job on that point Jesse which is why even if I don’t agree sometimes with what you write I still respect you.
Anyway I hope what I’ve written makes sense to someone other than myself.
Ml
RJA
Peter Moon. FFS i shoulda guessed that, your past posts suddenly make sense. Thanks for dropping the anonymity, someone with your kufe experiences shouldn’t need to hide behind a screenname.
Paging J. Swift to the black phone… here’s your chance Swifty, you’ve been studying Mr. Moon’s written works on this subject matter far deeper than anyone else in our circles. Hope u see the above post, cuz I’d like to read your take on it as a followup to your past analysis after having a chance to digest it.
I think it comes down to tone level. I think it’s very sick the way others treat each other. It makes for a very unsafe environment. Esp within a church, whether public or staff. Most of what I have seen is a failure to grasp the tech, and bring the group, (composed of individuals), more uptone. The ‘enemies’ become the ones that insist on having their own self-determinism, with low toned ones trying to control them, very much a lot of case being inflicted on others – aka group think. Forcing ralities, forcing people to stay on staff, etc. Completely opposite to what scientology was all about. No policy should be allowed to give permission to break laws. Policy is not run as itself, but as a combination of study. Ie: how many places does it mention a beings rights and self-determinism? How important an individual is? How much his self-determinism MUST be maintained if only for the tech to work? And how many places does it say follow the laws of the land?
CHAPTER TWENTY-SEVEN ; COLUMN Y
Method Used By Subject To Handle Others
…excerpt:
[think about how scientologists treat each other in the sea org or staff to public, and especially to each other, and sometimes public to public].
The methods of handling others could be assigned to three general categories.
The highest category would be one of enhancement, where the individual seeks by example and good reasoning to lift the level of those around him to the point where they will partake of the projects of living with him. This would extend from 4.0 down to 3.0.
The second category would be that of punishment drive, or domination. Here the individual uses alarm, threats, and the general promise of pain unless compliance is given by the others around him. This area extends from 2.0 to around 1.3.
The third category is that of nullification, wherein the individual seeks to minimize individuals, to be more than they and so to be able to control them. This category would rather see a man sick than well, because sick men are less dangerous than well men according to the “thinking” that takes place in this band.
I view the church GROUP AND THEIR THINK, as the 3rd catagory. At best, in the 2nd. These types shouldnt have been on staff. The tech is twisted with the low toned to ie: the greatest good greatest number for the GROUP, not the individual’s dynamics, as was written. To the point that the 1st & 2nd dynamics become so nullified, so well below non-e, those persons cant begin to see another persons dynamics, or hats, and so how can they be a good group member to begin with. How can they see someone else’s goals and purposes, and so respect that?
Terril you are a real Data Miner. I was bussy lately with matters concerning myself. I think “Hubbard didn’t know about the bad stuff going on” can be send to the realm of myths.
Kevin
I cannot show you such an org but the mission that I started in, and became staff in, and eventually the ED, did not remotely carry out ” abuse of staff” in any form whatsoever. In the early 70s our mission was totally high ARC and fun. Our staff were paid a wage and received an award of 1 1/2hours of auditing a week into our account.
This was pretty much right up until the mission was “stolen” by Scientology Missions International, and they started dramatizing their cases on us, some time around 1978 – 79. (Which was in total disregard for the agreements that the franchise had with Scientology and LRH previously.)
Besides our mission, I have read other posts previously on this blog that indicate that we were not the only one by far.
WW
Michael,
I have been thinking much about how to express this, and your post somehow helped me put it together.
Each of us, and LRH is no exception, stands with each foot in a different Empire – one foot in the Empire of Eternity, the other foot, in the Empire of Time.
Call them the Kingdoms(or Empires) of Wisdom and the Kingdom of Survival. Another image that expresses this is the Roman Janus figure, looking in two opposite directions at once.
The Co$ went the way that pretty much any temporal church organization goes when left to it’s own devices – downscale. The living truth flows out of them, and they can become just empty shells, form without substance, no longer imbued with the Ruh(Breath, Spirit, Theta) that Metaqual refers to in his post. It happened very dramatically in the history of Christianity, the result of the collision of Theta and MEST.
A temporal form cannot really contain the Breath of Life, it can at best focus it and channel it. And it doesn’t just run on automatic forever. And the Breath of Life creates and fine-tunes the channel and keeps it alive. If the channel is wrongly formed, or becomes twisted, the flow of Life becomes turbulent rather than smooth and full of grace. The ray of creation comes upon gaps it cannot bridge on it’s own, in it’s descent down the octaves of material existence. It requires living beings to breathe into it in present time to keep it going.
“Politics is the Art of the Possible”
Once LRH set his foot down in the Empire of Survival, there was no way he was going to remain pure and unsoiled. Once he decided to create a lasting temporal organization for the transmission of his work, an organization that could contain and pass on his Empire of Wisdom after he was gone, he was done for as an untainted being. Inevitably, sooner or later, the task would require him to make decisions catering to what it was possible to accomplish in the time he had and the materials he had to work with, not what ideally might be wished for in a best of all possible worlds.
It has been said, in politics you work to achieve the “best result possible, not the best possible result”. You work towards an Ideal Scene, yes, but the World is likely to get in the way at times.
How would LRH be any different? He was operating as a human being. So did LRH have a “dark side”? Or was he, like any one of us living in the world and trying to survive and create a MEST legacy in the time stream, at times caught between a rock and a hard place and forced to cope and make decisions that in the ideal scheme of things were less than optimal?
Ho hum. Does Tonja name who was chained? I was in the RPF when she routed out and I have always been curious as to who was chained because I think I would have heard of it. I never considered her a credible source but I cannot definitively say she is lying. She definitely hypes up events for her own advantage. But who really cares? It is over twenty years ago and we all know that Scientology and Scientologists do not agree with “wog mores.” Personally, being on LRH’s lines, I think he considered his time to valuable to be dealing with Paulette Cooper. I know the G.O. did a number on her. I read Paulette’s book when I was on the Dianetics Course. It was pathetic and a bad misrepresentation of what Scientology was. It was, however, her reality.
I was at Chi Gong today and my teacher was stressing how this is for health but everything that serves your health also has martial applications. That being said, he stated that if you have to defend yourself, don’t bother. Just attack. In other words, if someone sticks their hand or fist in your face, unprovoked, just break it. Then you don’t have to worry about defending.
Moral of story. If you attack someone or something, do not be surprised if they attack back.
It has pretty much been established that organized Scientology, with and without LRH, indulged in institutional abuse. Ever heard of Blackwater and traced the Government’s connections? And the new outfit Obama used to replace it? There are far more reaching abuses than Scientology before and after DM. If we are truly moving towards an Age of Aquarius society where no one receives abuse then that is a very beautiful idea. This theme is really beginning to bore me. I suggest those who still have issues with abuse to run them out with Dianetics or perhaps get a prepcheck on “abuse” on maybe some list repair. This goes back to people having emotions that disable clear thinking. I think the only way to end the endless rantings about abuse is to acknowledge the abuse. I would hereby like to ACKNOWLEDGE all the abuse that ever occurred in the name of Scientology. My only question is: How come no one rants and raves about all the abuse done by Ewen Cameron and MK-ULTRA? It or its offshoots were far more than a few hundred. I’ve met a least that many personally and that is only the tip of the iceberg.
Mr Fancy
You said:
“Use the tech to your advantage, but LRH isn’t the sort of cat *I’d* choose to be my “spiritual leader”.”
Hmmmm.. that “use the tech to your advantage” part sounds like something Ron Hubbard said repeatedly. I’m glad you agree with that part.
The part where you say ” LRH isn’t the sort of cat *I’d* choose to be my “spiritual leader”.”
Ron Hubbard never suggested that anyone choose him as the “spiritual leader” of Scientology. As far as I know LRH would be very disappointed that anyone would do such a thing. He advised that one “keep their own council”. So… You are right on track with that one too! You perhaps have a different intent in saying these things but on inspection it sounds like you are more in agreement with LRH on these issues than agin’ him.
LRH never said he was perfect, as far as I know. He was simply offering a workable technology to free beings from the traumas of life and help people to change their lives for the better and reach their potentials.
By his own statements, any policies he wrote were written in the interest of assisting these purposes. To use any policy to harm is obviously opposed to LRHs goals for mankind.
WW
Metaqual. You certainly have lots of interests. Do you garden?
Huckleberry
You do realize that I posted this to point out what a load of crap the “new” definition is… Right?
WW
“My only question is: How come no one rants and raves about all the abuse done by Ewen Cameron and MK-ULTRA? It or its offshoots were far more than a few hundred. I’ve met a least that many personally and that is only the tip of the iceberg.”
My best answer: The two mentioned never claimed to be a religion offering a path to enlightenement. People tend to emphazise the “being a religion”bit or dramatize it. One suprisingly is still suprised that “the most ethical beings on the planet”dabble in such abuses. Actually outrage is more the word these days. These are the times that churches topple over and rightly so.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Ewen_Cameron
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_MKULTRA
just get copies of the books issued in the 70s.
atcause,
You are sounding like a clown now. There are hundreds of contributors to ESMB who spent decades working to help other people while they were active in the CoS. There are people there who actually worked with LRH to help create a ‘better bridge’. Did you do this?
And, there are many members there who were speaking out about the abuses committed within the CoS long before they had the safety in numbers we see now. And certainly long before it became fashionable for people to publicly proclaim their ‘independence’.
If I were prone to couch-jumping and woo-hooing, I might be tempted to say “You don’t know the true history of ESMB. I do!”.
But I won’t. Instead I’ll just suggest that you check your facts a bit more thoroughly before making such sweeping statements.
Terril posts success stories from LRH tech and when they contact him they get connected with Bill Robertson squirrel groups.
That, in my opinion, is a criminal bait and switch.
His “product” is pulling people away from Scientology.
I do not really understand his agenda fully. What I observe is that he repeatedly puts down LRH in covert ways and forwards a squirrel group based on Bill Robertson’s psychosis.
This is utter crap. Tonja Burden did nothing of the sort.
Happened under Hubbard’s watch? Do you know how much suppressive squirreling is going on under your watch?
Clowns actually do something positive in the world.
They expose things like………..well you are a smart one.
Now that I’ve had some time to calm down I realized something about all of this. There is a missing datum that is causing massive amounts of dub in concerning how reports were sent to L Ron towards the end of his life. Jim Logan touched on it and the subject of John Azel being a brilliant evaluator helped to complete a picture for me. There is no man or system of things I know of that ever prevented L Ron from doing exactly what he intended to do. In an eariler post I mentioned a room that was constructed with hanging microphones for the purpose of recording weekly staff meetings of what was then known as Special Project. Every meeting was fully recorded. Every report or statistic refered to in a report plus all of it’s supporting evidence plus the original tape recordings were packaged in banker boxes and transported to L Ron on a weekly basis. So what was Special Project? Special Project was a sea org mission with the purpose of restructuring and reorganizing the old G. O, CMO Int, and the Scn Pubs organizations. I guess L Ron never did overly concern himself with keeping up on his royalty payments for the books and tape series that were being sold in all of the Scn Orgs. More often than not, L Ron would let the Orgs use the money to expand. The L Ron that I knew was not a materialistic man. In fact there are tape lectures by him where he says the man that has the least material things is the most free. This ended when his legal problems increased internationaly during the years that followed the final convictions of those involved in the 1977 US governments raids of several Orgs. Ron needed money to pay for his own defense team. Scientology could not foot the bill and still try to get it’s tax exempt status.
The sepetration of L Ron from Scn Orgs started with pressure brought about by US Government Agencies and the Judical System. When L Ron said the FBI was after him he was not wrong and I can only imagine he felt paranoid at times.
Part of the mission purpose for the Special Project was to fully establish L Ron’s estate which included establishing his ability to legally collect royalty payments, it also included collecting back royaltypayments as well. Again from what I can tell beyond keeping stats going in the right direction and establishing orgs internationally, L Ron had no real use for money on a personal level. All that changed and now he HAD to have money to keep himself out of jail or worse.
So L Ron along with Annie Brooker fired a mission called Special Project. Miss Cabbage was the mission i/c. Others who were part of the mission included Norman Starkey, Pat Brice, Terrie Gamboa and others.
L Ron is the author of Sea Org mission tech and for those of you that know what it means to go on mission, this is not a social event. The mission goes in with total “ethics presence” (trans. put the fear of god in the locals). They go in, accomplish the purpose and get the hell out. Making friends with the locals is often not part of the operation. When the mission leaves an area the locals are glad they are gone with promises to never cause a situation that necessitates another mission. The mission’s first target is often to publicly remove the head of the organization. After that the rest of the locals just stand around in shock and fear. I joke about this but this is an over simplification that I hope adds humor. smile goddamit it only goes on from here.
I have to give credit where credit is due. One of the main reasons Miss Cabbage was selected by L Ron as the leader of the Special Project is because he had a very good track record as a mission ops. A mission ops in sea org terms is the person who aggressively directs the mission to rapidly accomplish the purpose and get back to base. Miss Cabbage’s brother was also an excellent mission ops. I think between Miss Cabbage and his brother they prooved themselves to be the best at mission tech.
L Ron was very demanding when it came to mission tech. Failure was not an option you ever wanted to experince. Not to toot my own horn but I accomplished many missions under the Miss Cabbage brothers (no disrespect to Ronnie). Some of them included Kathy Rinder, Mike’s ex. She had a reputation for being an excellent missionair and we travelled coast to coast accomplishing missions in the U.S. Together we never had a fail mission. I never had a fail mission otherwise either.
Annie Brooker was the first Inspector Gen’l in RTC and she is the person that would directly assist L Ron with the weekly traffic sent from all of Int Mgmt, GO, Special Project, whatever. Never Pat Brooker. When a despatch was sent from L Ron to anyone at the Gold base he used the symbol * (star). If the despatch was from Annie on L Ron’s behalf her symbol was + (plus). I don’t know what happened to Annie, I guess she just gave up on life. For those who would argue, sometimes L Ron would use the symbol #. The speed at which L Ron and Annie would analyze handle the volumes of traffic submitted was extrodinary. No detail was missed, everything independently verified.
Anyway I think I have rambled mysef to a point and my point is this. The single most disappointment I experience in dialoge conderning L Ron and the state of Scn is the same fault inherent in the subject itself. That fault is the inability to admit any fault. Somehow the ideology of Scn has no ability to evaluate the good with the bad and reconcile forward. L Ron understood dicotomies. OT 2 was devoted to it. The christian and muslim bibles begin with the god of the word explaining his nature by stating he is the dark and the light, beginning and the end. How can a person have knowledge of the light if they have no perception of the dark. How do we learn what is right without a perception of what is wrong? How can understanding and comprehension be accomplish with out using comparisons?
I appreciate the life of L Ron if for nothing else it has us all here talking. If Scn could admit it’s short coming and honestly evaluate a better solution I don’t think there would be much that could stop it. That’s how L Ron was , he just got old, but never unaware.
Thanks Jesse!
A very well written summary of the scene.
Also gives more reality how Miscavige was able to bludgeon his way to the top.
Thanks again.
Ml
RJ
I agree that we did have trouble admitting culpability back then but at least when pressed we did.
Miscavige on the other hand has put that flaw into overdrive!
*sigh* So you are the chosen one or something ?
Jesse, thanks for that write up. I suspect you got something out of it as well.
I agree that the need lies in being able to be responsbile even for the bad effects we create, admit mistakes and make corrections. That allows growth.
LRH does not need to be shielded. That would prevent, pervert or retard the needed obnosis so mistakes are not repeated and his actions and writings are fairly evaluated.
Ultimately, I believe history will be kind to him.
Tried gardening one time. Did not work out too well for lack of time and getting into it. Takes a lot of “being there” to garden.
Nobody gets too upset about Catholics paving the way to heaven. Everyone knows they are phony and just accept as part of our culture. You are right about religions toppling though.
I hereby acknowledge all the abuse that ever occured in the name of Ewen Cameron, MK-ULTRA, the evil psychs, big pharma, the 5th marcabian invader force and Mr. X…
Oh and i also acknowledge that the X-files, though it was a pretty cool tv series, was clearly only an attempt to distract from the truly explosive information that is in your book.
satisfied?
Marty I don’t know Tonja, but her affidavit was also presented to the clearwater hearings. Your statement she didn’t do what she said
needs backing up. I looked for evidence of that and couldn’t find any, but did find that she also was targeted by the GO, see section
of affidavit below. You also say Nancy many didn’t describe things correctly?
You asked:-
“Do you know how much suppressive squirreling is going on under your watch?”
I know of some non standard actions done by some. I don’t
consider any of this suppressive. I know about them because of people writing what amounts to successes from them. However Its
not relevant to describe them as under my watch. I host a couple of Freezone forums and post success’s there as on non FZ forums. I
only post successes from standard tech applications, for the most part. I have though posted a few successes of the upper bridge of Rons Orgs. Very few. I don’t get them as I only read english and
most of their successes are in other languages.
I’m not a KOT for the FZ. I just connect people up to standard tech terminals. And very occasionally to Rons Org people. There are not many of them in the english speaking world. Also at times connect up old friends who’ve lost touch.
I suggest you discount Ralph Hiltons statement. I’ll address that in another post!
—————
38. My friend, Jane Peterson, who was also a Guardian Office
staff member and left Scientology, has received numerous death
– 12 –
threats, both oral and written, since she left Scientology and
this is very upsetting and frightening to me also.
39. I am aware that many similar operations were conducted
against Tonja Burden while I was working for the G.O. I am aware
that a G.O. agent, Bill Broderick was placed in a position to spy
on Tonja Burden and that the G.O. acquired an apartment in Tonja
Burden’s apartment building to spy on her and harass her. This is
common practice of the G.O. against its enemies.
Signed under the pains and penalties of perjury this 21st day
of May, 1982.
Carol Garrity
SUBSCRIBED AND SWORN TO BEFORE ME
THIS 21ST DAY OF MAY, 1982.
(CARRIE B. STEWART)
NOTARY PUBLIC
@ Loki. You are so correct and were able to simply state what I nearly had to write a book about. L Ron does not need to be shielded. I feel that subtracts from his legacey. The notion that Miss Cabbage had any influence on L Ron is absurd. We all feared and respected L Ron to his face and otherwise. If L Ron looked at Miss Cabbage in a cross way Miss Cabbage would collapse to the floor in a pool of his own urine. If Miss Cabbage thought L Ron had a beef with him he would cry like a little girl. Please find one commendation L Ron Specifically issued on Miss Cabbage. When Miss Cabbage and others failed to get the all clear for L Ron to live in his home at the Gold Base, L Ron cut ties with Miss Cabbage and everyone else for about two years prior to his death. The rest of the story should be discussed by people that were there and are willing to share the information.
Jesse, thank you for taking the time to write that. It made LRH and those days and your viewpoint so vivid.
Marty, thank you for many things — including this thread. It has been amazing.
Mosey, thank you for helping moderate all this and for everything else you are contributing. It’s amazing to me that someone so new to Scientology is to essential to its future.
Love to you all,
Just Me
Ralph Hilton | November 3, 2010 at 10:06 pm | Reply
RALPH Hilton
“Terril posts success stories from LRH tech and when they contact him they get connected with Bill Robertson squirrel groups.
That, in my opinion, is a criminal bait and switch.
His “product” is pulling people away from Scientology.
I do not really understand his agenda fully. What I observe is that he repeatedly puts down LRH in covert ways and forwards a squirrel group based on Bill Robertson’s psychosis.”
We of course we’re allies and I always tried to refer people to you.
Then you with covert methods deleted my forum, then as now the most active and largest yahoo FZ forum. You did this not because
I approved of Rons Orgs, which you then agreed with, but because Some people were also on another forum with Pierre Ethier who had criticised your technical abilities.
After some years, you appeared to be contrite and I invited you back to my forum. You then publically threatened me and I put you on moderated status. You after a while then privately threatened me and I unsubscribed you.
Terril, you are a goner on this blog. If we needed black propaganda services, by innuendo, on L Ron Hubbard we’d link to Miscavige.
Jesse,
If this thread is still active I’ll mention that aside from what has been covered here, the basics of these NOTs materials are evident from taped lectures in the early 50s. Mayo wasn’t a Scientologist at the time.
It is not my intention to minimize Mr. Mayo or his help to many and contribution.
It’s so sad. I used to see the SO old guard walking down Fountain and wonder what had happened to them. Even back then, before I knew the truth – and the full scope of what really happened on the RPF – I knew it couldn’t have been just aging bodies. There was such hollowness to them; gulag-style. Thanks for the heads-up on Sharansky’s book.
Correct
Thanks for letting my posts through. I know it wasn’t comfortable for you. Sorry I can’t post again, but never did much anyway. Will
still read, and be a supporter.
I didn’t intend to bring up critical matters particularly, but Erwin Croughs post below which I quote a section of seems one who would eagerly embrace ” Pink Legs.”
” The truth will set you free”. Hope I at least got Erwin thinking.
“LRH said to manufacture threat to effect peace, not alter facts or evidence to cause hate and blood. He said to sue for discouraging enemies, not win or physically destroy enemies like just about every other religion and country would. He said to continue until the slate is clear, leaving no BPC at either side, preventing future fights, something even Buddhists can learn from. He said not to tamely submit nor manufacture evidence but to expose actual evidence of real crimes to the press, …….”
I have no problem believing R and MS would’ve sued her, but that’s within the realm of the laws of the land and very different from the allegation of fabricating evidence.
Terril, ok, you don’t have to be banned. But, for christsakes don’t be an anti-LRH propagandist; there’s plenty of them out here. You are respected for connecting people up with Scientologists for services. There aren’t many who do that.
Who makes the decision that someone’s 2.0? Hmmm, I’m going to say the person themselves …
Thanks Marty.
In my book you’re a stand up guy.
Standing up to the 800 pound gorilla.
Way cool 🙂
I’ll post as I wish, and you don’t like it and block it thats fine with me. This is your space. 🙂
Old Fox, I have had the same questions since late 90s when I visited (being in the S.O.) the Veritas site then, mirrored later in the site you mention above. It was the first time I heard of CST and that they own the copyrights of all materials and some trademarks. RTC is a licensee of the copyrights and the owner is CST. Marty says DM has everybody under his control but this is not satisfactory for me as an explanation. There are documents on the Net documenting that RTC is NOT the owner of the copyrights of LRH materials.
This is sinister story and a very dark one IMHO. Thanks for bringing it up. It would be good for any government and the Global Enslavers to have a DM leading Scientology as he “leads”. It serves their purposes. The outpoints here are many. They require some thorough research and enough free communication between us.
ESMB may have lots of readers but most of the posts are done by the same 15 or so “squeaky wheels” on the board. I could make a list of the posting names here.
Most of which are not critics but haters of LRH and Scientology tech.
Terril – How does being banned from those message boards make you right about what you stated about LRH?
I don’t see where you provided the proof Marty was asking for. Quoting someone’s book is not proof of anything. What’s in the book could be lies and crap.
But I’m sure it would be believed and held up as “proof” on ESMB in a second. Spending time on ESMB, I’m sure that is the standard you are use to.
( There’s some things that Ralph Hilton expressed about you in this comments section that you need to address. )
There is yet another matter that a few people need to clear up from the outset.
The Church of Scientology is the only church in the world, in history that employs organized crime to defend its religious beliefs. That fact alone separates this organization from any other.
Any competent lawyer, lawyer in training, lawyer in interning completely duplicates the kind of ethical gold mine the Church of Scientology presents itself as.
I know this may be a rather difficult point of view for some to assume, it is my own viewpoint as well.
Huckleberry, I will tell you what happened to them.
The answer lies in the reference The Free Being.
That John Axel was spat in the face by DM following an order or advice of LRH is the epitome of HOW WE ALL LEFT SCIENTOLOGY GO BY THE BOARDS.
Force (I don’t have to believe you Jesse that the advice DID come from LRH, you have not proven yourself here as to what was happening there and who those advices came from) IS DM and John Axel (because I have worked with him) is the epitome of the other 50% of the characteristics of a Free Being, the Intelligence or the Dedication attributes of Theta, Patience, Tolerance and such stuff.
That DM (Force, the 50% of a Theta Free Being) spat John (Intelligence, the other 50% of the Theta Free Being) is the ONE incident that can epitomize what happened to Scientology and Theta and how it became what it became.
LRH had both attributes of a Free Being. Once LRH was gone those two 50%s divided and never reconcilled ever since, DM representing JUST the Power/Force aspect and John AxelS representing JUST the Intelligence/Tolerance/Patience/Devotion side of Theta.
That we all sit here now and discuss is a good thing but Life requires the other 50% which Miss Cabage as Jesse calls him represents. And he has the power of spitting and controlling John AxelS but he does not have their “Intelligence/Heart” anymore.
This blog has exhibited some Power and Force Attributes. Marty exhibits quite some of those while keeping the rest of the 50% (Intelligence) at a very high point.
But it cannot be just Marty. All of us now need to push on the Power/Force 50% and exhibit some of that. Otherwise there’s gonna be some more spitting on faces and more chit chatting about it here.
L Ron Hubbard is the Original, David Miscavige copied the dark parts within the church and amplified it. What bugs ne that while Scientologist atribute great awarness in the founder they can not occupy the viewpoint that he knew about bad stuff carried out in the name of Scientology too. Like a goverment or a bad company the COS has used it shredders.
CD
There once was a fellownamed Davey Miscavige.
At cost of others he liked to have Havingness.
They resisted his reign
That made him Insane
And now he is as OT as a Cabbage
Terril:
I agree with Marty. I try to respect you myself as someone that tries to connect people up with other people for the purpose of mutual benefit through the application of LRH technology. I see nothing wrong with field auditing. It happens. It takes place.
To jump to the conclusion that you are forever banned? To me that is just 3rd party from someone that a person of your technical training and expertise resorts to as fact?
I said I agree with Marty. I never said I was as gullible as he might be considering the big happy person that he is.
Valkov,
I see what you say about dual kingdoms. In my experience, it isn’t quite that easy. There are interim universes where beings congregate that are neither pure spirit or pure MEST. Some of these are where you get the notion of heaven and hell. There are even theta societies which preserve records and knowledge. Sort of theta librarians for the same reason we have libraries.
The physics of MEST parallels and reflects the physics of theta, but at the lower end of the spectrum, being far more fixated. So similar rules apply to each. At some level creation and destruction become irrelevant. Because you can create anything, destruction loses its relevance.
Good and evil are rooted in the concepts of creation and destruction. Evil is bringing harm and destruction, good is adding support and construction. That is oversimplified, but workable enough here.
To grasp the nature of this entire thing requires a willingness to confront the very best and the very worst life has to offer, on all levels in all universes. To truly understand anything, you have to be willing to duplicate it, you have to be willing to BE it. To understand evil, you have to be willing to be evil.
According to the axioms, what you are willing to confront will as-is; what you are unwilling to confront will persist. We are willing to confront goodness and pleasure, so we end up as-ising these things. We are less willing to confront evil and pain, so we end up with an abundance of this.
That you are willing to confront, be and understand evil does not mean you must now dramatize evil. You have a choice. At high levels of KRC you have knowledge of evil, you take responsibility for evil, and you control evil.
Of course LRH had a “dark side.” We would not have Scientology if he didn’t. To grasp the breadth of existence requires that the researcher have a “dark side.” But that is merely the willingness to experience evil.
This MEST universe is designed to keep us trapped. It was put in place by those who wanted control and power. And any attempt to get free from this universe just stirs up those mechanisms that keep us trapped. And getting individuals to try to become free just puts them in position to dramatize those mechanisms which oppose freedom.
So, you provide people the means to go free and they will immediately start dramatizing those things which prevent them from going free. How frustrating is that? How much effort and force do you have to apply to overcome these dramatizations?
You can stop a person from dramatizing by shock and fear. You just make the consequences of not complying worse than the consequences of dramatizing. It’s raising the necessity level. It’s like a claustrophobic person being forced to crawl through a long tunnel too small to fit his shoulders or face a terrible death.
In an ideal world, you would not have to force compliance. You would work with beings of high ARC and KRC who would automatically do what was right. But, we live in a world where we tend to dramatize the trap when we pursue enlightenment. That, of course, is a generality, but it sets the stage for the problem facing LRH or anyone else who would bring enlightenment.
Michael
Michael, your narrative about confronting evil, the “how to” of it, was nicely stated and useful. And certainly timely. Well Done.
Theo, I get what you’re saying but no one is spitting in my face and getting away with it. The closest I came was getting one of those squirrel “SRAs” (Severe Reality Adjustment, which just means you can shout and abuse someone with impugnity) from a favored DM minion.
I wasn’t SO, but public and I was OT and I wasn’t going to put up with shit like that. I shouted back even louder.
Hold your space, man!
OK, thank you Marty.
Valkov,
I never thought the violence was coming from any intention of LRH either. But I spent years in a corporate environment in New York and years in the Wise sector and I never experienced any violence, it was unacceptable and unheard of. Thinking it over now, I believe that it was the intensity of purpose that pushed people into it. They would take LRH statements out of KSW or the like and use them as a foundation to justify whatever estimation of effort they deemed necessary (threats, intimidation, physical violence) to ensure they could get compliance to forward the overall objective. Once it was deemed OK or perceived to be tolerated, it became contagious like a disease.
Jessie,
I too was on staff at SFO Fdn from the early to late 70’s! I don’t remember you for some reason, but then again the warrantee has expired on certain segments of my memory. I also trained at Flag in 1976 as an outer org trainee. I’m wondering if we knew each other. Drop me an email: beetlejuice at hush mail dot com.
Jim,
That’s true. I’ve listened to the OT hatting lectures from the 50’s and in PDC, Creation of Human Ability and other series LRH laid it all out there at that time. It’s also in the more esoteric and advanced writings in the Kabbalah but written more cryptically with symbology and different ways of perceiving and addressing said phenomena.
It looks to me like LRH revisited the subject and enlisted the help of Mayo to get it piloted and written up.
Powerfully written.
Metaqual,
Interesting theory about ripping the dog’s jaw down, but did you ever experience the power and speed of a doberman or german shepherd or rottwieller’s snapping teeth and jaw while they were attacking you? Good luck on reattaching your fingers to your hands. I suppose you could try it with the left over stumps, with enough practice.
The first time I read it I thought it was an exercise to increase my vocabulary, like…ten fold. The fiftieth time I read it, it increased my understanding of the value of power.
OTDT,
Yeah, it was. Ain’t I the cat’s meow? I never realized that I would become so important that Amazon would send me an offer to take %25 off all their toys. But they just did. I think I’ve arrived.
What I got from the Simon Bolivar issue was the importance of delegating power to others, rather than worrying about it being flowed to me. In a group, if you surround yourself with good people and trust them and flow power to them, they will automatically and naturally return the flow of power.
What I got from it is the simple idea that it is the leader’s responsibility to use the power correctly, that is, to delegate it to those who will use it for good.
I wonder if anyone ever screamed back at LRH?
What year was it that LRH grabbed Clifford?
See Force, “shouted back even louder”, now that’s what I mean it’s what we (and I don’t mean you Huckleberry) have been lacking here, sheer force, Enough with Intelligence. We have enough of that. Now somewhere LRH mentions that ethics has to do with the handling of force. I will look it up and find that lecture. It will be interesting reading. Thanks buddy for shouting even louder! My hat is off to you, Force, Sheer Force will do what Intelligence couldn’t. That’s DM specialty, of course to a wrong end because there is no Intelligence there.
At Cause,
I take exception to your comments about participants on other for a. People are critical of CofS because it has done and continues to do quite a bit of damage to various individuals. While it is true that some people are pretty scathing in their criticism of Scn tech and that some of them dismiss it completely. I don’t agree with that dismissal, but it does not prompt me to denigrate them. They have a right to their opinions. And, point of fact, people on ESMB and other fora DO help others. They network, they help people find places to stay, they even give financial support to one another. Seems to me that those of us who find some value in Scn tech and wish others to respect that should also respect the beliefs and stances of others.
That’s the ideal that the Sea Org represented whenever I would encounter them in the 70’s.
They bash Marty, LRH and Scientology tech on those message boards.
Do you condone this?
“Scientologist atribute great awarness in the founder”
Awareness of the truth of life and the truth about the track and this universe not necessarily every single thing every single other person in the church is doing.
That is truth
But It went on for 6 years or was it seven.
Me too.
OTDT~It did also gel for me this stable datum: “Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?” 😉
Claire,
I don’t have a problem with anyone being critical of the church of scientology. Nobody has been more critical of them in the past than me. ( or pissed off at )
I do have a problem with their black PR of LRH and blaming what members of the church of scientology have done over the years on LRH and Scientology technology.
Please understand, LRH, Scietology tech and the church of scientology are 3 different things.
“In my book you’re a stand up guy”
So the next time someone over at ESMB starts unfairly bashing Marty, you will stand up for him won’t you?
Now that you think he’s a “stand up guy”.
One reference on this is a two part lecture called “Force”, but I can’t remember where it’s from.
CD, from one of your links below, the MKULTRA one:
“Canadian experiments
The experiments were exported to Canada when the CIA recruited Scottish psychiatrist Donald Ewen Cameron, creator of the “psychic driving” concept, which the CIA found particularly interesting. Cameron had been hoping to correct schizophrenia by erasing existing memories and reprogramming the psyche. He commuted from Albany, New York to Montreal every week to work at the Allan Memorial Institute of McGill University and was paid $69,000 from 1957 to 1964 to carry out MKULTRA experiments there. In addition to LSD, Cameron also experimented with various paralytic drugs as well as electroconvulsive therapy at thirty to forty times the normal power. His “driving” experiments consisted of putting subjects into drug-induced coma for weeks at a time (up to three months in one case) while playing tape loops of noise or simple repetitive statements. His experiments were typically carried out on patients who had entered the institute for minor problems such as anxiety disorders and postpartum depression, many of whom suffered permanently from his actions. His treatments resulted in victims’ incontinence, amnesia, forgetting how to talk, forgetting their parents, and thinking their interrogators were their parents. His work was inspired and paralleled by the British psychiatrist William Sargant at St Thomas’ Hospital, London, and Belmont Hospital, Surrey, who was also involved in the Intelligence Services and who experimented extensively on his patients without their consent, causing similar long-term damage.
It was during this era that Cameron became known worldwide as the first chairman of the World Psychiatric Association as well as president of the American and Canadian psychiatric associations.”
Yes, true, Psychiatry never claimed to be “religion offering a path to enlightenment”. It only claimed to be a Healing Profession whose members were medical Doctors who had sworn to the HippocraticOath: “First, Do No Harm!”
Yet, Cameron was somehow chosen to be the head of 3 major Psychiatric Associations – the World Psychiatric Association, the American Psychiatric Association, and the Canadian Psychiatric Association one as well.
This seems to indicate other psychiatrists of the time thought well of him and supported his ideas and practices.
Perhaps CCHR is not that far off in tying Psychiatry to the Nazis, who performed many painful, inhuman expiriments on living subjects.
What does this say about their Ethical standards?
Yep, so true…Great minds do think a like.
Since waking up I have come to value truth so much more than before. And I thought I valued it very much then.
I guess a better way to say this is that I understand the concepts of relative truth and absolute truth so much better. There is a great deal of difference between the two truths.
I would love an indepth discussion of these at Casablanca.
Thank you Jesse,
Just in case it is not clear, I’m not unaware of LRH’s shortcomings nor do I expect I will find none in addition to what I already saw.
I’m also not shielding him in any way. I too agree, he needs no shielding, his work and what it has done for so many stands on its own.
However, I did want to ensure that since we are discussing how this may have happened with various perspectives the one I brought up was taken into account. I consider it is important for me to use Data series and evaluate data correctly. It is the least I can do for my own understanding and the memory of my very human, flawed but non-the-less brilliant and very well loved friend LRH.
Great suggestion Ralph, Super Power in the Indie field!!!
Good summation, Michael. I particularly like your point about how the promise of freedom kicks off dramatization of the barriers to freedom.
It sounds sinister to say the MEST universe was created to keep us trapped. I prefer to think it was created because a thetan loves to have a problem to solve.
In this universe evaluations of good and bad are monitored by the command to Survive.
Didn’t I say that? Once LRH decided to create in the MEST universe, he necessarily partook of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. There was no escaping it, for him or for us. I guess that could be called “having a dark side”. Here, we are creatures of light and darkness. Anything else is a pretense. But the other foot stands always in Eternity, beyond those kind of distinctions. You know, like an immortal being worrying about how he’s going to survive? That’s a good joke…. but considerations of “Good” and “Evil” are monitored by the consideration of “Survival” on all 8 Dynamics.
The Fall of Lucifer.
Sometimes one must be “dark” to survive, or help another dynamic survive. That’s all I was saying. One can rationally decide upon and take a dark action, in order to achieve some aim having to do with the survival of some dynamics one considers important. But then one has fallen.
Valkov,
I don’t disagree with what you’re saying. I agree. In the physical universe where survive is the primary purpose, good and evil can defined in reference to survival.
As for this universe being a trap, it was not a trap designed with evil purposes necessarily. If you look at some very, very, very conservative religious doctrine, dancing, smiling, being happy are all signs of being in cahoots with the devil. Anything other than conformity is looked on as evil. You must obey the dictates of God. And those dictates are defined by those interpreting that religious sect.
Very early on track there was no religion, per se. Thetans pretty much created what they wanted. And they shared their creations. And these creations were admired. Then someone noticed that his creations weren’t as admired as much as other’s. So the concept of good and not good developed. The concept of acceptable and unacceptable developed.
The rule of creation is that every creation contains the potential for is opposite. Whenever you create X, the potential for Not-X exists. Whenever you create admiration, you create the potential for Not-admiration.
When the concept of acceptable converted to the concept of unacceptable, groups began to form to enforce “acceptable”. What was acceptable was right. What was unacceptable was wrong. It was all pretty primitive to begin with. Other groups and individuals fought against these enforcements.
And some hellacious theta fights ensued. Lots of chaos. Some of this stuff ended up in the Bible as the story of fallen angels. But that Bible story really was a much later dramatization of this earlier stuff by many universes.
So, you have groups of beings who were trying to enforce order and rightness. And the problem was how to get those who wouldn’t agree to agree to these standards of order. It’s like a religious family trying to get their daughter to stop smoking and fucking. She has to be crazy because she is influenced by the devil, so sending her in for electric shock treatment would be for her own good. Making her obey would be for her own good. The intent was to enforce order.
But beings who didn’t agree to all this enforced order and standards of rightness just laughed and said, “by whose authority? Go fuck yourself.” So Authority was created to validate this movement to order away from chaos. And any disobedience to those standards of order, good and right were sins against this Authority who was now credited with creating all that existed.
But those in disagreement would create a bunch of stuff to prove that there was no CREATOR OF ALL. Thus a primary target of bringing order and compliance was to somehow hogtie a being’s ability to create. How could you sell this idea of Creator when it could be so easily disproved?
Let me interject here that I am not trying to say there is or is not a Prime Creator or God, I’m just saying what was happening as I remember/know.
And this battle has continued through universe after universe clear up to this day. Somewhere along the line those who were creating experiences for others to enjoy were recruited to create experiences to trap beings and bring order. Thus implanters came into fashion and persisted as a profession. Prostitution is not the oldest profession by far.
There are all sorts of offshoots of this scenario, with all sorts of ramifications and branches. Things get altered and twisted. Purposes get misaligned and turned back on themselves. It gets complex.
And the complexity leads to disagreements over what happened. You will find people arguing, “That’s not the way it happened. It had nothing to do with religion. That evil thetan Bolux kept shoving red balls into my space and wouldn’t stop, so I had to destroy him.” There are all sorts of individual stories and histories.
And we all wanted some of the crap to stop. So we found ways to try to stop.
But theta has a way of going exterior to anything, thus no longer controlled (stopped.) So more and more effort was brought to bear making sure a thetan could not go exterior and would remain interiorized into the “system which was good and orderly.” But, it just doesn’t work that way. Some of us don’t agree to this system.
And if I am stuck in a system to which I don’t agree and someone has shoved me in and back in every time I manage to get out, then I would say I was being trapped. This universe is designed to keep us locked up. It may parallel theta intentions and desires and aesthetics in a lot of ways. It has to or we could not be tricked into agreeing.
All agreements to this universe are based in aesthetics, such as beauty and pleasure on one harmonic or another. Every implanter starts with agreement, moves through disagreements to form resistance and mass then moves back to agreement. So, a trap will always end with apparent agreements.
Look at the CofS as it stands today. It’s a trap that is based on agreements which were altered with disagreements to become a new agreement. Those involved think they are agreeing to something they are not. Their choice has been subverted by lies. Thus, a trap.
Oh well, got to go. Can’t do the entire history of theta in a comment. Look at how many volumes it took Durant to scratch the surface of human civilization. He said something like, “Every form of government tends to perish by excess of its own basic principles.” I’m sure I altered it, but…
Michael
Mart, Jess, Jim, Chuck, and all the other contributors: Thank you.
This has been one of the best post I have read on the subject. Really. Lot of truth, lot of as isness.
Paolo
Wow, I get what you’re saying. But, history is only, well, history. I’m trying to focus on just one or two points, having to do with LRH, “darksides”, “case”, and “flaws”, as they relate to the concepts and evaluations of “good” and “evil”.
Jesses’s latest posts earlier in this thread speak to them very well.
I am saying that 1.) “darkside” does NOT= “case”, which does NOT = “case”, which does NOT= “flaw”, and does not necessarily = “evil”, either.
There’s a lot of “maybe this, maybe that” in discussions of LRH.
Maybe he was flawed. Maybe he acted from case sometimes, Maybe he had a darkside, etc etc. maybe maybe maybe
Well, a person who does not have a dark side is not a complete person. And a person who does have a darkside, in the sense in which I mean it, is not flawed.
A person who apparently had no dark side, would be flawed, would be perhaps just half a person in fact.
So I am saying, perhaps LRH wasn’t flawed, when he did some of the things some are outraged about. Perhaps he wasn’t acting from “case”. For those who want to dichotomize a person’s character, yes, you may say he had a “dark side”, and sometimes used the abilities contained therein. But that alone does not make anything he did “evil” – except as you consider it so. I do expect common standards of decency to be applied, however.
I am saying, why this rush to somehow “explain away” some parts of LRH? And that it is not really necessary to do so, until all have spoken, and all the available evidence is in.
I’ve amassed a fairly complete LRH library over the last year, with nine editions of “Intro to Scientology Ethics” (ISE), and five editions of OEC Vol 0 (Basic Staff Hat).
The 1970, 1973, 1975, 1976, 1982 and 1985 ISE editions DO NOT contain “Responsibilities of Leaders”. The 1989, 1998 and 2007 ISE editions DO contain “Responsibilities of Leaders” (along with a massively expanded list of SP Acts).
The 1974 (1st US Printing) edition of OEC Vol 0 does NOT contain “Responsibilities of Leaders”. The 1976, 1980, 1991 and 1999 DO contain “Responsibilities of Leaders”.
I read a letter from Prouty which confirmed what you wrote. He was apparently just as baffled as to why and who put the kibash on the whole thing.
http://www.freezone.org/timetrack/data/Prouty.htm
Some additional good background on LRH’s military career, which I’m sure you’ve seen RJ:
http://web.ncf.ca/cj871/prouty.html
Valkov,
The more amorphous the definition, the more amorphous the argument. Voltaire said something to the effect, “If you would argue with me, define your terms.” Of course, I’m not Voltaire so my standards are much lower. I don’t mind moving back and forth, vacillating, exploring multiple sides, testing the validity of definition. Nor do I mind exploring those things for which there is no terminology, thus no definition.
Which might well be the case for some matters of LRH and for actual OTs. Human ethics and morals have certain considerations and expectations that don’t really apply high on the tone scale. “The one foot in the empire of eternity” aspect leaves us without adequate definition or terminology. And we often can’t agree on what we’re floundering to describe and explain–even when we both might well be looking at the same thing. And using definitions from “one foot in the empire of time” or the empire of Earth or the empire of hell would be unfair because the description and definition would be incomplete. For example, looking at a woman’s feet and describing her as ugly because the feet are unwashed and have callouses, when someone who could see the entire woman would be amused because you just called the most beautiful woman who ever existed “ugly.” Not that I’m using this analogy for LRH, just using it as an example.
That said, this entire issue is something each of us has to work out. Or not.
Michael
Ensifer,
Your description of the “ding” concept seems about right. However, the other part of it was pushing power to those who’s power you depended on. I was in the course room and there was a glass jar on the supervisor’s desk where we were expected to flow cash (power). The sup’s would then flow cash (power) to seniors above them. Wimbush never came into the course room demanding cash – it was much more subtle than that, via the glass jar on the supervisor’s desk. Or you could flow cash to other terminals as you saw fit. It also was not only cash, you could do things for (flow power) these terminals, pay a PG&E bill, wash a car, etc, etc.
The money did flow. I remember the C/S ending up with a Mazda RX7 (a nice car at the time). Wimbush got a beautiful home in Los Altos? Los Gatos? – I don’t recal, but is was nice place in the costal mountains. A cylindrical shaped house with rooms that flowed off of a central core. I was one of the people that helped move him in.
My point here is that Marty is escentially right – the money did flow through “pushing power”.
Wimbush was a mouse of a man. I never had a lot of respect for him. But he had a damm good staff and they were the ones that boomed Stevens Creek Mission.
That’s all.
As far as I know the Ol’man never never really cared one way or the other about having a Biography written on him.
In fact he considered it a waste of time.
I think he made this known in an HCOPL entitled ‘Quality Counts’.
So I’ve always found it hard to believe Jerry’s story about this.
I’ve also found it hard to believe that Ron would turn over his 201 to Armstrong especially with all this derogatory information in it.
So my impression is that Armstrong forged much it to destroy any alliance the Church had with Garrison and turn him against Scientology.
Of course this only pure speculation on my part.
As I wrote Garrison wouldn’t have been aware of the operation whereas Prouty having worked in intelligence for many years would have spotted it for what it was:
Character Assassination based on Black Propaganda.
I do understand that. I onley blame the founder of what he did himself or ordered to be done and knew of and did nothing about.
And that is not insignificant.
atcause | November 5, 2010 at 3:23 am | Reply
“In my book you’re a stand up guy”
So the next time someone over at ESMB starts unfairly bashing Marty, you will stand up for him won’t you?
Now that you think he’s a “stand up guy”.
I’ve done it so many times that I and everyone else is bored with it.
On the subject of the Responsibilities of Leaders PL. That was run in on staff and to some degree public at the Southwest Mission in Dallas back in the early 80’s. I remember it well. This post has blown that piece of charge for me.
“Enforcing” Responsibilities of Leaders is not unlike enforcing the Code of Honor. It don’t work.
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