Order your copy at Amazon Books here: What Is Wrong With Scientology?
Excerpt from Chapter Seven – Confessional:
In this wise, a new moral code is imposed upon individuals, covertly and against their own determinisms. It is exacerbated by repeated questioning about the individual’s failure to report on other Scientologists. After a while, a corporate Scientologist modifies her behavior accordingly, in order to avoid more security checks. She not only edits her own behavior and thoughts, she attempts to do the same with Scientologist friends and family members, so that she does not get into trouble for overlooking such transgressions of others. Thus, a process that was originally intended to free a person from the self-imposed mental prison she has created by her own inability to live up to what she considers right and ethical conduct becomes reversed. The preclear is instead forced to agree to a new mental prison, imposed by the organization based on what it decrees to be right or wrong. In short, the process replaces a person’s native judgment with a new judgment of its own. In practice, it is a dark and painful operation, making a person less self-determined and more other-determined.
It seems that the only solution open to corporate Scientologists to cope and carry on within their culture is to become moralists. Moralists who enforce on self and others morals which have been implanted. If corporate Scientologists police their own conduct fastidiously enough, and interfere enough with the behavior and conduct of their fellows, they reckon they might be spared the cost, embarrassment and pain of being ordered to further batteries of security checks. In fact, that is the only behavior that does avoid continual, expensive, and degrading security checks in corporate Scientology.
This is yet another example of Scientology Inc.’s reversal of end product. Confessional technology was developed with the purpose to help an individual recognize she is the cause of her own destiny – and it has a long history of realizing that purpose. This priceless technology has been twisted and corrupted to the point where now the individual winds up with her destiny blueprinted and dictated by the church.
These blueprints are enforced through a related – and now similarly corrupted – technology of Scientology: the technology of ethics.
Order your copy from Amazon Books at, What Is Wrong With Scientology?
related stories:
What Is Wrong With Scientology?
Moving On Up a Little Higher 
Just bought it and shared that I did on FB …
If everyone on this board buys it today — this will get the book at the top of the amazon new books page and they will market it …
Or something like that. A friend of mine wrote a Buddhist book that did really well as a result of lots of people buying it the first day of release!!
Seriously — buy it.
Love,
WH
Done!
Good idea. Also promoting it on my FB page.
Thanks Martin, the first in the UK.
Thank you WH – you are amazingly on the spot.
Wow. Simply terrific writing. Can’t wait to get the book
Okay….bought my book! We are looking forward to reading it and sharing the data with our family members and friends…..Lisa
Just ordered my copy!
Great data WH. Reporting compliance!
Just bought the book! Looking forward to start reading:-)!
Love,
Anat
Yeah! So glad it’s finally available. Ordered mine. Can’t wait for Tuesday! Wish it were on Kindle so I would have instant gratification.
You better get a good tax man, Marty. You are going to reap a fortune, and WELL DESERVED for your efforts on behalf of your efforts to KSW.
Leaving for the weekend, but first thing Monday AM, I am here with my debit card…..Can’t wait to read every page.
Done indeed! Kudo’s for speed Marty. Thanks for the added little preview above, nice! Will take it wherever I go.
I ordered my copy.
Just bought it! Thanks, Marty! Can’t wait to read it!
I have a confession to make. 😉 I have secured my copy (and for a few near and dear others.)
Happy Independents’ Day indeed is approaching!
Thanks! My copy is on the way! I am staggered at that A to B cycle!
You have to be the only person on the planet to announce that you are writing a book and have it selling on Amazon a few days later! That was like, MAGIK! POOF!
Our copies are now ordered.
Do we need to bring them to the 4th party for autographs, or will you have some there with you?
Les
I JUST BOUGHT MY OWN COPY
Okay, I bought a copy & I’m looking forward to reading it!
Just ordered my copy!!!
Congratulations! and *THANK YOU* This book by Marty Rathbun should be in libraries. Library project. Every library. Worldwide!
Just bought two copies.
But Marty, I still want mine signed by you… 🙂
Hi Simple, you beat me by two comments. Well done! We’ll have to meet to discuss at some point.
::cheering:: ::applause:: ::leaping:: ::jumping:: ::dancing:: ::grateful:: ::exhilarated:: Congratulations! V*V*V*W*D!!
My new book is on it’s way! Posted on FB. Can’t wait to read it. By the way, the GAT FPRD sucks! The old one was GREAT!
Bought it and shared on FB!
Done
Got mine! Who’ll be the first to review it on Amazon??? The race is on! (But clear those MUs too kids!!)
Great price Marty. Affordable. Thanks. (Of course some priceless data in it — just from your preview pieces.)
Awesome! I just ordered it and can’t wait to read it!
Congrats… The excerpt is great! Am eagerly awaiting the ebook/Kindle version.
Bought my copy! Looking forward to reading this one!
Just bought 3 copies. More later.
Congrats Marty … Take a win … you published a book … no small feat 🙂
Yes, Congratulations, Marty and Mosey! We ordered our copies, can’t wait!
Bought my copy. Excerpts are great (and tantalizing!) VWD Marty for getting it done and up there!
Ordered and on the way. Can’t wait to read it.
Vic & Vicki
What does “Thank you, your order has been placed” mean?
Just ordered it. Can’t wait to get it!
Got mine! I added the “Clint Eastwood” Star Collection so I could get free shipping. Somehow, “The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly” and “Hang ’em High” seemed appropriate! 😉
+1
Just bought my copy! Your hard work will be rewarded and most of all appreciated-I even sprung for quick shipping. Bill
just bought 2, one for me and one for my wife!
To all the enlighted readers of this blog:
Don’t forget to write a ***** customer reviews in Amazon.com.
Kool-Aid drinkers and OSA bots are going to write * bad reviews. (I have read some out of reality * customer reviews of “Blown for Good” by Marc Headley forwarded by Marty).
“Great price Marty” —- $17.76
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1776_in_the_United_States
People buying books because they want to without being “regged”now that’s intresting, don’t you think David Miscavige.
Say hi to Tom for me
ps. per my wife, NOW we have the FULL library! 🙂
Thanks Marty, you just gave some understanding thru your above excerpt.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Sense_(pamphlet)
It was first published anonymously on January 10, 1776, at the beginning of the American Revolution. Common Sense, signed “Written by an Englishman”, became an immediate success.
Common Sense presented the American colonists with an argument for freedom from British rule at a time when the question of independence was still undecided.
Check it out!!!!!!!!!!!
History repeats itself as “they” say.
Thomas Paine——
” Paine published Common Sense anonymously because of its treasonous content”
You SP you, you are all SP’s under DM.
Bought mine. Nice choice of price Marty – 1776. Independence again!
David Lingenfelter
the white rose———
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Rose
The war is on free thought, not force via weapons.
17.76 is a perfect price. Declaration of Independence in 1776 and here we are declaring independence for $17.76. Keep on keeping on great things are on the horizon
You now have copies in Hawaii!!
LOL see we were thinking alike 🙂
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthroposophy
Shoot, I missed that altogether. Nice.
Excellent essay Marty. I just bought Jeff Hawkins new book on kindle and will gets yours too as soon as it is available.
Here’s my 2 cents on what the huge, inherent flaw is in the Scientology ethics/morals/”justice” system.
First I have to state that I very much do agree with two of the foremost definitions of ethics; that one needs to make rational decisions regarding one’s survival across the dynamics – I think that almost all sane people would see this as a truth, and that any group to thrive and survive needs to remove counter intention and other intention from its environment (i think this is true for all groups including a seventh grade classroom or a professional sports team, and that the lack of this function can slowly or even quickly doom any group’s purpose).
Having said the above, the problem that has always been there in Scientology is that the above datums have been very ELASTIC, that is to say, their terms have been defined by the “power” at the time and have always CHANGED depending on the power’s purposes and have been defined differently for different people. Some brief examples. Since I got into Scientology in 1970 I have observed many, many attempts by staff in the org to convince someone that their purposes outside of Scientology were “other intention” to clearing the planet, for example pursuing a music career or any career in the arts (and I’ve seen HEAVY pressure and inval/eval applied here that overwhelmed a young person to get them to join staff or the sea org). But of course this datum would NEVER be applied to Chick Corea or John Travolta, as THEIR artistic careers (since they are celebs) have been determined (by somone) to be of value to clearing the planet. So, consequently the INDIVIDUAL’S viewpoint or choice in one’s OWN decision making means little when confronted with the decision about their life made by the SUPERIOR individuals (ironic use) as to what is survival across the dynamics. Thus the individual is always put at effect of and under the control of “the group.”
Similarly as to what is rational or “out ethics” by an individual. Yeah, yeah, LRH does say somewhere that ethics is something that the individual puts in on himself, unless it becomes a “justice” matter for the group, but again the parameters of what is or isn’t considered out ethics enough to be punished is ALL up to exterior sources. LRH was very “liberal” if I may use that word on decisions about the 2D from the early days even through most of the 60s (you can see HCO PL 2D Rules, read what Hawkins has to say about the SO on this in the mid to late 60s). But then the “rules” or morals changed and the hammer came down harder and harder. Maybe LRH learned more about how important this all was over time to the survival of the group or maybe as he got older and in the bad health he was in, he couldn’t have sex anymore himself, so dramatized it on others and started writing a LOT about being out ethics in this area (while surrounding himself with pre-pubescent cute chicks in hot pants to serve him and be his messengers, also dramatizing some wierd power these nymphettes could excercise over older males – sound a little kinky? I think so.)
And so the subject of Scientology ethics (which initially made a lot of sense in my opinion) got very, very wierd, a subject which has started to resemble old time Judaism or Islam in its harsh morals and consequences, all excercised to CONTROL the behavior of the members of the group by intimidation, peer pressure and don’t forget, PUNISHMENT/banishment, etc.
One copy on its way to NYC
By the way, great spot-on excerpt; completely accurate.
Congratulations Marty, on completing this book. It is a great accomplishment, one I am sure took a lot of work.
Thank you for doing this.
Got mine, Ralphie. POW! This should send DM, the Diminutive Moron, to the moon and beyond. You’re the greatest
Got mine too!
Max B.
+1
Just ordered mine, but also want an ebook version – any version; I can convert formats. Then I can pass on the paper book to a friend I’m working on. Best wishes for a best seller.
Sinar posted it on the Indie Scientologist facebook page a few hours ago and I just ordered it from Amazon.com!
Love that “1-Click” ordering.
Just ordered my first batch., Free shipping ! Delivery 26th June.
Right. I’m sure Marty just snapped his fingers and…
He gave the kids a purpose, a hat, value, dignity and a role that counted. Geeze Christ does anyone know how HOT it was in those climates? They wore shorts because the temperatures were intolerable! I see nothing wrong with empowering children. In the states we have the most suppressed situation on top of children. they are FORCED to go to school. They are DENIED the right to contribute, laws passed against it! These laws were created during the depression so men with families to feed were not passed over by kids for labor. Why shouldn’t a kid be permitted to relay a simple message to someone older? It does not enturbulate me when children have power over others. I know it is taboo in a lot of countries but this is suppression. We used kids 14 years old to fight in the civil war. Now they cannot work until they are 18 in most states. This civilization was built on the backs of teen aged women. My perception of Hubbard’s interaction with young people is the opposite of yours. I do not see it as kinky sexual. This implication is coming from your view.
Frankly Joe, You’re idea that women between the ages of 12 and 16 could not possibly have any value beyond sexual amusement contributes to a lot of misery in this world.
Very impressive writing and analysis. Ordered my copy.
Gary, I”m hoping you’re Gary Moore…..the same one I knew in Boulder, CO in the early 70s. Yes? Matt Plahuta
Ordered mine!
+3+…:)
Yes, but wait to read the book before writing a review. Nothing looks worse than writing hot air about something you haven’t yet read. The CoS does garbage like that – write gushing praise even if you haven’t read one iota. Keep it genuine and write authentic reviews on the material once you’ve actually read it. Leave it to the OSA phonies to write reviews about a book they aren’t even allowed to read.
Right on Oracle. And in the absence of any allegations in 40 YEARS,
it’s ludicrous and damned unfair to allege that LRH was other than clean with the messengers.
Order completed. One copy for us and one just in case any under radar friends want to check it out. Congrats, Marty, on the milestone of having this published.
Ordered. Thanks for not promoting this and then making us wait six months before it appears. Now, get to work on the next book. [teasing]
BTW, no giving the proceeds away to charity or something. Enjoy the well-deserved windfall yourselves.
Simply stunning in it’s simplicity Marty.
Ordered the moment I read this.
I intend to blab about this to
practically everyone I know!
Thanks again & again & again!
Calvin.
Love the added significance of the $17.76 price, Marty. What a perfect tie in to the overall concept of independence from the corrupted church and its lunatic king. I’ll be sure to get my copy before Independents’ Day.
Wow. That was quick. Good job on delivering a final product, and what a passage – healing through understanding indeed!
Got a couple, should be here by June27 according to Amazon. Waiting also for Kindle. Can’t have too much “What’s Wrong With Scientology?”
I wonder if DM has ordered one yet?
Marty, thanks so much. I just placed my order. Can’t wait to read it. On the subject of moral codes, I was always astonished that the Int base as a group seemed to be totally oblivious to the most fundamental LRH tech. LRH says right on the Academy Levels that it is fruitless to sec check someone on anything but their own moral code. The only overts that matter to a being and from which he will derive case gains by getting them off, are transgressions against whatever moral code the individual happens to have subscribed to. The Church only sec checks staff against DM’s own imposed moral code, not their actual moral code. He is literally so stupid as to defy the imagination. He literally doesn’t get any part of Scientology. Never has, never will. Sucks to have the mental acuity of a pigeon.
Oracle, you need to become better informed about all this by reading first hand accounts of the messengers. They were not just “delivering simple messenges.” Actually (and “factually”) it was understood (so ordered) that they were to be treated as if it was LRH himself delivering the message and so a grown experienced SO member had to put up with kids screaming and insulting at him/her. Read the accounts of how one messenger just spit in Diana Hubbard’s face on orders. Nothing wrong with kids having power over adults? (in SCIENTOLOGY? Where the adults are TRAINED in LRH tech and have high case levels? REALLY?????). Try getting your ethics handled by a PROFOUNDLY ignorant and uneducated teenager in an SO service org. And these teens are not only uneducated in almost every subject outside of Scientology; the shocking thing is almost none of the ones I’ve encountered know anything about Scientology, such is the lack of their training. And of course there is the usual phenomena of adolescents being EXTREMELY easy to use thought control and extreme peer pressure on to do almost anything (which is one reason Miscavige loves to recruit young second gen Scientologists for the SO).
And as far as any attitude about young women having any other purpose other than sexual amusement, I’m trying to claim JUST THE OPPOSITE of what you are apparently accusing me of. Don’t tell me that young good looking teenage girls in short pants and tight tops aren’t going to push 2D buttons when giving orders. When trying to control people, you ALWAYS push the obvious buttons. It’s why the MAA locks the room and sits near the door and takes on a “serious” expression. It’s why you’re made to wait for the MAA to see you. ETC ETC ETC.
Did you mention 14 year olds being allowed to fight in the Civil War as a GOOD thing?????? Actually kids can work before they are 18 in the USA. But there are restrictions on how many hours they can work because for a long, long time (and unfortunately this is still happening throughout much of the developing world), children were forced to work backbreaking hours with little pay and no chance for an education. Thankfully that is no longer the case in most of the Western World because of strict laws against child labor. Just read your Charles Dickens on that point. One treats children WELL when they are NOT used for simply the pleasure or the service they can provide for adults – and that includes fighting wars or slave labor (and are also educated so that they themselves can be independant and productive young people).
Ours is now on the way. VWD to you Marty.
Tom and Linda
Nice D/A, Oracle.
Just got back from a nighttime 5k run, if you can believe that — but as oon I saw this — wow! I bought a copy. Been waiting for this moment. Didn’t know it would be tonight. Yeah Marty!
Great excerpt from the book.
So true also. This is a mercy.
mer·cy/ˈmərsē/
Noun:
An event to be grateful for, esp. because its occurrence prevents something unpleasant or provides relief from suffering.
Just ordered it. Looking forward to the read.
I mean, “What Is Wrong With Scientology?”, is the proper title.
Just ordered mine. Will order a second when the kindle format is available.
You should get a email from Amazon, with a tracking number so you can see when it is coming. When you order from Amazon, it always says “your order has been placed”.
Just ordered my copy. I would like to get it autographed by you Marty. How can we do that? Send it to you?
As of 12:28 AM Sunday, Marty’s book has reached #210 on Amazon’s bestseller’s list, and #1 on the subject of Scientology. Wow.
What I do not understand is
Why don’t you call the book:
What is wrong with the CHURCH of $cientology?
Someone who does not bother reading the book is given a wrong impression, right?
On it’s way!
Just ordered my copy.
Our order is in!
Could be we are the very first in Italy!!!!!
Didn’t even read the article… too excited.
Thanks Marty
Claudio & Renata
PS Back reading the article
Hi Marty,
Congrats on the release of your book. Looks awesome!
Amazon won’t ship it to Taiwan for some reason. It may need to be turned on in your seller account.
Phil de Fontenay
Just ordered my copy. Thanks in advance for your commitment to preserving all that once was, and will again be, Scientology in it’s KSW form!
Done !
and shared on Facebook 🙂
Ditto. By the way, are we required to M9 it and is there a deadline? No worries, for this I’d be happy to and I’ll beat any deadline…..!
Great excerpt too Marty – you know your Come on – I blew down on that already!
Yes, I meant You Are idea.
I’ll check it out Phi
Oracle: Didn’t you mean … YOUR idea that women etc 🙂
Great Randy … keeping this up will eventually get Amazon to feature his book in their lists … and as suggestions when people buy scientology books!!
BTW — how do you check for this — I could never remember when my friends Buddhist book (“When the Buddha Walks into a Bar…” – first went on sale)
Thanks
WH
Joe: You appear to be collapsing time here.
The short short messengers were the original messengers ON THE APOLLO. I doubt SERIOUSLY if any of those messengers spit on Diana.
Seriously.
Messengers have not worn short shorts since the Apollo. Meaning, not since 1975.
On the Freewinds they wear bermuda shorts and many are older than 15 by a long shot. So – your 2D button thing doesn’t really work here.
You lose a great deal of credibility when you wax vitriolic. Try tempering your posts a bit. You have a message that is valuable, just gets lost and ignored under what comes across as angry hobby horsing.
WH
Perfect!
Steve, priceless / hilarious!!!!!!!Always a bullseye, pal.
HEY people!! Remember to register your protest against
the insane abuse of Scientology / Scientologists, if you
haven’t already done so.
You even get a # number to boot!
Check out Scientology cult .com or Steve Hall Indie 500 list
Calvin….. Independent Scientologist
…………….Indie 500 no # 301
@Joe Pendleton: I totally got your point. Thank you.
Wrong, john! Follow the blog & READ the sub title, pal.
For hundreds of years every ship in the British navy was run essentially upon the orders of boys, called midshipmen. You can see a good example in the film, Master and Commander. Tough fighting men of every age called them “sir” and there was not much problem with them. They were in training to become higher officers, hopefully one day to captain their own ships.
I know dealing with DM bots is infuriating. And dealing with teenage DM bots is possibly even worse. However, I the actual problem isn’t their youth. It’s that they are being corrupted by a sociopath and given suppressive orders. Carrying out suppressive orders makes one a member of a suppressive group and you can’t reason with a suppressive group member which is why we call them DM bots. They are robotic to the SP.
Mike Rinder was a Messenger for the Commodore. Indeed he did go forward to personally command various organizations including CMO CW, OSA Int and CMO Int.
One of the key ways people become robots is through transgressions committed upon the orders of the SP or SP group — I’m talking about forcing them to apply black Scientology to others. I know this because I saw it happen to my ex-wife, Sue. A staff member is ordered violate their own moral code in doing so and thus relinquish their personal integrity. After that, it becomes impossible to reason with them until one day, hopefully, they come to their senses and recant what they have been doing. Once they do that, they start doing the steps of A to E whether they realize it or not. They are natural and organic — not some stupid dogmatic arbitrary steps. That’s why it’s amusing to me when I point out “hey, these are the actual steps you are already doing” and in come the trolls with all kinds of problems. All I want to do is help speed people along with the steps they are already naturally and organically executing because I think it helps people to know where they are.
DM’s small robot army is prevented from ever coming to their senses by never allowing them to write up the correct overt acts — the overts that actually violated their own moral codes. For example, there’s no way any Ethics Officer in the Church would ever be allowed to get off an overt of following suppressive orders from David Miscavige — that is shouted down as “black PR” on Dear Leader.
One of the failings of our crap educational system is it does not teach kids anything about some of the most important subjects necessary to living, like what is personal integrity and how do you maintain it?
I think it’s easy to assume young people are easily manipulated and corrupted because they don’t have enough experience yet to defend their personal integrity.
But the real problem is there is a CHILD PREDATOR in our midst named David Miscavige. We have to do something about him to really solve the problem.
Mine is Ordered.A bit delayed due to outside the USA/
Marty,
will your book be available on german amazon soon?
Ordering from US in germany we have to wait up to 3 weeks!
Should I write to german Amazon and put their attention that there is a new Hot book?
Do you know (or anyone else) how Amazon handles this?
(There is plenty of books on the german Amazon store in foreign languages, too.)
Thanks for the release!!!
Joe — probably a waste of time at this point, but a few things you should know. First, the Messengers in the early days (ie aboard the Apollo and in the early years ashore) did nothing other than deliver verbatim communications from LRH. That was their role. He would tell them exactly what he wanted said to someone and they would go deliver that message — there are specific “Messenger TR’s” for this purpose. The CMO Uniform on the Apollo was chosen by the Messengers themselves (as I recall, it was out of a Sears catalog). And there WERE male Messengers and they wore white shorts and shirts too. “Hot pants” were what every girl wore in the 70’s — it was definitely too hot to be in long pants on a ship without air conditioning in the Caribbean. Now, the CMO morphed into something else in the late 70’s — beginning when LRH was no long with the Aides, FB and FSO. The so called “hot pants” uniform was left behind when air conditioning became the norm in Clearwater. LRH had a handful of people with him and some messenegrs were NOT with him and were in Clearwater, acting as his “eyes and ears.” I was one of them.
It is absolutely correct that as the CMO became more and more remote from LRH — it became less and less what I describe above. LRH formed the Watchdog Committee within the CMO. The early messengers were in many case more trained and experienced than most others. No longer true today, and of course now RTC has become the young punks who have never done anything themselves but are in positions to order everyone else around due to their “God-given” authority.
Much has been made of the Messengers in hot pants. I assure you, when they were choosing their uniforms, they werent thinking about what people might say about them in years to come. They were thinking about a) looking “cool” and “hip” and b) feeling cool in the heat. Were the girls good looking — most of them were. Did they flaunt their sexuality when on a message run from LRH — I didnt see it. They were all business. Serious business.
Joe, A lot of times you bring some good viewpoints to the table but on this post I’d have to disagree.
I think if you looked at ANY generation you would find beautiful youthful teens. In or out of Scientology, the body is in prime condition. We use the term “veal” to describe these young things. I have to say that I was never the super hottie but I sure had my share of men looking and even commenting when I was that age. In fact, it was quite introverting when it happened. The fact that messengers were able to hold their communication lines without getting their buttons pushed does not mean that it was LRHs 2D peccadilloes being dramatized. Really??? This sound more like some dramatization of your own!
As for labor laws. I believe the point T.O. was making had more to do with children who could (allowed to) fight in the Civil War should be allowed to contribute. Yes, there was a purpose for the labor laws but they have been abused to the point of stopping. Like many things in our country, an idea that introduces a higher quality of life at one point may be the noose on our necks at some later time. So as not to get into politics, I’ll let you extrapolate your own examples. But generally, all systems should be re-evaluated from time to time to ensure they are still beneficial, effective and affordable. The SO and church have gone to the opposite extreme on this as well to the point that it really is abuse.
Just like an individual needs to have Dynamics (plural) so do children. There needs to be a balance. When the 3rd becomes more important than all others, it will fail. But, think about it…imagine what all the youth of today would be like if they were allowed to contribute. What if they had purpose? How could that affect the out of control crime statistics? Scientology is the only thing that has been corrupted. Hopefully when we find ourselves in positions of epic failure we look, evaluate and change…in a new unit of time…towards the ideal.
I posted this book on FB yesterday. I have only 2 FB friends that once were in scientology. The rest are either HS friends or buddhists. I posted this just now:
”What is Wrong with Scientology?” isn’t JUST a book about what is wrong with Scientology but also a terrific study into what makes a group a cult, how does a well meaning group become a cult. Why do those IN a cult miss the point — like the “Truman Show” — seriously, a good read.”
I think this book is going to proof people up concerning cult-like thinking. NOT just corporate scientology but in their own lives. How they start incrementally start to think like the “crowd” and stop realizing that ultimately everything in their lives is up to them.
We tend to think we DONT think like the crowd when we are agreeing with the crowd we like. Pick your crowd and see how many thoughts are just crowd-think 🙂
I didn’t get an advanced copy 🙂 — but from the excerpts I’m betting my little FB blurb is right.
WH
Steve — Absolutely right. But the purpose of those sec checks had nothing to do with case gain for anyone. They were intended to introvert people into assuming a moral code that would be acceptable to Miscavige. If you ask someone 100 times on a meter “what evil purpose or destructive intention do you have towards COB” and don’t let them out of the room without an answer (because the “auditor” is not there to audit the pc, he/she is there to “get the goods” and they know they had better come back with something or they will be on the chopping block) you will end up with someone who mocks up evil purposes in order to get out of the room, and then convinces himself they are real. And by this method, you can bring a whole group into line and to operate on an enforced “moral code” that would otherwise be abhorrent to them. This is Black Scientology.
Meant to say, Scientology ISN’T the only thing that has been corrupted.
Nice vacuum filling!
Correction: 2 FB friends who were once in CORPORATE scientology. They are independent and free thinking now.
WH
@John. The public at large won’t make/has not made the distinction between the subject and the organization. I suspect Marty titled it to have reality from that perspective. Thanks Marty, fully expecting your efforts to make big ripples in the pond out there.
🙂
Three copies ordered. Is that OK? LOL …
I just bought two copies. It will make an perfect gift for someone.
And there we have the facts, with no speculation necessary, from one who was actually there.
If they only “regged” for books, that would be delightful. They intimidate and threaten with ethics actions as not buying in high volume is an obvious bad indicator.
I just got a copy and rated it and made a positive comment on amazon, it helps!
Thanks Marty.
Steve,
You’ve made an excellent point, in this and in various posts and articles, that DM’s group is a Suppressive Group. You’ve described clearly the natural path to take to rid oneself of the taint of this association. All the conditions forumulas flow from observation of the steps one takes to raise up in survival. They are not from “whole cloth”, but from observation.
Adding to your comment on morality, and the overt and covert ways an SP will coax one to violate their own sense of right and wrong, is the idea of the shifting of meaning of “morals”, that is, the redefinition of the moral codes of the group from something approaching the intent of a moral code as a survival conduct, to the use of these things to entangle one in the mechanics of the Overt/Motivator sequence. Morality is relative. Ethics is native.
DM has made it an “overt” to communicate across the Dynamics. It’s an overt to sleep, it’s an overt to have a family, it’s an overt to have open communication lines to the society, and to be, do and have across the Dynamics. He established a MORAL code of some hundreds and hundreds of “suppressive acts” which are used to characterize the most basic activities of life and living as “suppressive”.
Then, he uses this to introvert one into false transgressions, false withholds, false problems, false upsets and so runs the Introspection RD in reverse to nullify other beings.
There is a single Ethics Code expressed in the entirety of Scientology – the Code of Honor. It trumps any policy, any Offenses and Penalties, and is UNenforceable save by the individual. “Therefore, as a rule, while engaging in any collective social or organizational activity,.you have to foster individuality.” HCOB 27 Oct 78.
I wasn’t even staff but I had one of “those” sec checks when I was on VII. It was gruesome. Five times thru a tailored check, end ruds, thought I was done and then back in for more. I think DM must have been on the base watching at the time (as it was during the basics release) and was convinced I had not yet come clean. When I was finally way caved in, the C/S sent me home to try and clean up the damage in solo sessions.
I thought if I heard “COB” one more time I would run screaming from the room. I told the auditor I had never been personally comfortable calling Mr. Miscavige by COB as it sounded too informal for a man of such stature and could he possibly reword the question using his actual name. I think the win of the auditor taking pity on me and rewording the question allowed me to F/N and get out of the room and out of the process.
Oh goodie — got my first FB comment about Marty’s book — “I might have to check this out” — and I encouraged him to do so with more info about the author, that I know him etc …
WH
Mike,
It is completely Black Scientology. HCOB 9 June 60, THE BASIC ASSUMPTIONS OF SCIENTOLOGY VERSUS OVERTS. That is VERSUS overts. The basic assumptions of Scientology include that a being is basically good and freed from false valences, he will act ethically. DM couldn’t be more diametreically opposed to Scientolology than he is with his continuous harassment of beings with ec Chekcs..As a classic SP, he wrong targets.
An informative and helpful comment as usual, Steve.
When you state, “One of the failings of our crap educational system is it does not teach kids anything about some of the most important subjects necessary to living, like what is personal integrity and how do you maintain it?” I, of course, have personal experience and strongly agree.
Having taught in public high schools for the past 15 years I can attest to what you say and also to the fact that kids are pretty much desperate for anyone who can help fill them in on these important topics. And to the degree I was able to help kids with this, was treated with awesome warmth and respect by them.
An appreciation of truth and personal integrity are in great demand amongst the young today, and contrary to the nay-sayers, I suspect it has always been so. Including the early SO.
Thanks again for your sane and helpful comments,
Vic K.
Oracle,
You are absolutely right. When young people, children, teenagers are not permitted to contribute they lose self-respect and therein are the seeds of criminality. If they are only contributed to, the being’s flows get messed up, the exchanges across the Dynamics aren’t in, and so Bank collapses and dramaization ensues.
They don’t have to be put in a “coal mine”. But certainly some sort of means to do something FOR another has to be in place. All manner of societal and family ills resolve when the children are given responsibilities to do some sort of chore, cutting the grass, taking out the garbage, helping around the home.
Simple stuff. Obvious stuff, and when neglected or ignored – I think a woman scorned would be an angel compared to the fury of a teenager who only inflows.
Mike Rinder, Karen B, Oracle, Thoughful, others:
Thank you for your feedback on my posts. I was never on the Apollo and have no first hand knowledge of what I was talking about; based it on others’ experiences, some horror stories I read on posts. Obviously some enlightenment needed on my part and some agreement from me on some false data when I should have gotten MORE data on the subject.. Probably shouldn’t have even mentioned something that I didn’;t know enough about. My point really was that the shifting morals in the 2D area of the CoS occurred in a very similar way they do in most societies and religions (though in warp speed) and that these moral judgments were made from a point exterior to the individual who would NOW have to live those morals that were enforced on him by this exterior source. Thus not a rational decision made by the individual himself as a free being.
It is now #100
The book has broken the top 100!
you know OSA wil be ordering a bunch of copies, and word clearing it and Miscavige himself would have been on Amazon today.
I wonder if Marty gets a list of his buyers? lol That would be hilarious. Credit cards need names for payment.
I waited to post that comment just in case they didn’t think of that already prior to ordering their copies.
Yvonne — OMG. Didnt realize the “What have you done to COB” stuff had been exported to the public too. Though it’s really no surprise.
Today, the biggest crime in the RCS is to have a thought about “COB”. Any thought. Other than he is the anointed one, so close to being perfect that it’s not worth arguing about — and soon to reach perfection in any event.
Meanwhile, the reality is that he is a scared, vain, petty little man desperately trying to cling to power by using the technology of Scientology to try to control and dominate people. Truly a real life Wizard of Oz. And as the curtain is drawn back, his wizardry is exposed for what it really is.
It sucks to be Miscavige.
Inside information: copper stocks about to go straight up and vertical.
Joe — thanks. Appreciate your willingness to respond in this way. You are a good man. It’s a function of this blog to make information known and let people decide for themselves what they want to believe. And I agree with you 100% about the shifting morals on the 2D. Today the RCS put the Quakers to shame with their moralizing on the 2D. Complete lunacy. And its funny, LRH said that the aberration of the 2D is not the acts, but the enforced withholds. The more you make rules about what is acceptable, the more you aberrate people. I hear now that marriages are forbidden at Gold — for fear that women will then become pregnant! That is the reductio ad absurdum of 2D “moralizing.”
Sorry Marty, didn’t mean to speak of you in the third person, and can’t edit the comment.
The book looks great and the intention to help comes through loud and clear as always!
Same with UK Amazon, Marty. I’ve gotten a couple of complaints from friends of mine in UK and EU not being able to buy it on the UK Amazon.com site.
Got ours!
Scott,
Amazon is still building the page for my book, more elements are appearing by the hour; I expect the UK and EU store availability soon.
Rinders comments are true .
I have had that expereince and wasen’t able to be releaved from sec check, it went on for weeks ,and weeks and for me I became unsure of who I really I was tormented.
I have to agree with Karen I think its very true how she writes it .
They weren’t all bad I know a few that were there at start and came through, and still didn’t change their view on LRH.A lot was experiences with good and bad.throughout.
Something obvilousy has serioulsy been missed with Dm in early stages on his case before LRH died and after , KNowing now the true style of this man man what he has become .Wonder when he last had a session and who controlled it.?
My message is with errors it should read ? This mad man sorry /
I ordered this book over amazon quite easily within the uk without any problem at all.
+1
Yes well names of credit cards are used on internet orders on many things aswell as amazon . Good question who is going to try and hack that for sources of names of buyers if at all?
Yes, Yes, Yes!!
Mike,
I always appreciate your messages–concise, informational, on point, rational, relevant, persuasive, and theta. Never a hint of the venomous, rambling diatribe that is often found in those you are responding to. We can always count on you not to repeat hazy impressions, overblown stories, and tales told by others as though they were certain facts. We can always count on you to accurately relay your knowledge and observations, often with a good sense of humor too. This is very valuable. Thanks.
Yes, I have just ordered the book. Predicting great first day sales.
Ordered! Yay! Thank you for this anxiously anticipated book! And thank you for the birthday gift!
interesting using the corporate Scientologist in the feminine.
Steve and Jim, great comments.
Great LRH quotation, Jim. Thanks a lot!
David Miscavige – Here you go:“The way to stop any mutiny is the traditional way to stop it. This is the traditional way. And that’s simply have everybody come in and say what he’s mad about. Listen to him and give him an answer of one kind or another. People won’t mutiny. They went into communication.
“Now, we call this blowing the engram or doing almost anything. We could call it a lot of things. But the truth of the matter is that the barriers are built up by various cuts of communication. And they are destroyed by the setup of communication lines. Barriers cease to exist the moment you set it up.” ANATOMY of GAMES, 21 Dec 54.
Couldn’t buy it on amazon.co.uk and there was no kindle version 😦
Very accurate description Mike. For those who were on the service lines or closer lines, it was more like 6 week checks instead of 6 month checks!
Good on you Joe for being able to step back FROM and look AT a viewpoint.
Good Lord. Imagine the wasted time and effort, not to mention breaking the law. The patient is dying of cancer and they have been scurrying around putting band-aids all over its body. But the game has changed. Marty just kicked it up a notch with this book, bound to be widely read, reviewed and used to shelp so many sort it all out.. Its a blast of fresh air for the subject, finally. LRH still has friends with honest goals of a better world. Its the perfect gradient and introduction for a public driven into disgust on the subject. Well done IG. Your still wearing you hat.
Okay here is my little bit of entheta for the day…Went on Amazon and bought 2 copies last night. Got an email when I woke up this morning that my card was denied! Huh? There is no shortage on that card. I guess my CC’s have learned to ridge on the word “Co$”…mercy.
Using card #2 today I’ll break through this stop today 🙂
Marty, will you be coming out with a version for the Kindle??
Control was the key and is the objective in my opinion regarding Scientologists, Sea Org members and their 8 Dynamics.
By making it an “overt” when someone is trying to survive across the 8 Dynamics and then denigrating that person for committing an “overt” on one of their Dynamics by making them stand up in front of the entire group and announcing that what they did was “wrong” and “evil”, you are enforcing control over the entire group.
As it was said by Jim Logan, all of a sudden, sleep is an “overt”, taking time off is an “overt”, eating is an “overt”, sex is an “overt”, even sex with your own spouse is an “overt”. Getting pregnant and having children is an “overt”. Caring about your family and their well being is an “overt”. Raising your children and taking care of their schooling and upbringing is an “overt”.
This isn’t just prevalent in the Sea Org and Scientology, but in many religions in my opinion. Many religions “shame” their followers for freely following their survival on the 8 Dynamics.
All in the name of “greatest good” since the expansion of Scientology is by far the most important thing on the planet so of course anything that increases its size and scope is more important than an individuals own life and personal freedom.
It’s all a bunch of crap in my opinion.
This type of control is very suppressive and destructive to individuals and their freedom and well being.
Why can’t individuals enjoy their lives while at the same time helping others and increasing happiness around the world at the same time?
After all, isn’t that survival across all 8 Dynamics?
Just to check in here, I will be ordering my book this Friday. Can’t wait to get it and read it.
PS: FU Miscavige
Excellent, Jim.
Here we have years and years of individuals doing just that. Talking freely and blowing the engrams.
Unfortunately for those trapped in the church of miscavology, they have to step outside the cult to even grasp the fact that communication is occuring.
Barriers of their own creation.
Yes, hopefully later this week – but uncertain exactly when at this time.
The best $17.76 I ever spent.
An aside note on a group of individuals who desired freedom.
They met about that time in 1776 in a place called
“The Green Dragon Tavern” agreed that some things had to change,
resulted in the United States of America. Only good things can come of this,
thanks M&M
Should be on UK soon – Kindle later this week or the next week.
we have to wait up to 3 weeks
I mean waiting for the shipping.
Looking forward to find it at amazon.de 🙂
Very cool Marty. I’ll let my EU people know and have them promote it!
Nice catch. Thanks for the links, too.
Thank you.
The people that had trouble were in Switzerland, Denmark and the UK. UK might be handled now. I’ll check with the others again.
“All in the name of “greatest good” since the expansion of Scientology is by far the most important thing on the planet so of course anything that increases its size and scope is more important than an individuals own life and personal freedom.”
This is a stupid computation coming from a mind of a ser fac individual.
No one will survive without symbionts.
Living on all 8 dynamics is a symbiotic activity whereas Miscaviges whole universe (circuitry?) is parasitic.
When people have to surrender their civil rights to be O.K. with the group
you have a bad situation. People have rights in this country. Those rights must be surrendered upon entering the Sea Org so the people can be exploited by David Miscavige. It is human trafficking:
“The recruitment, transportation, transfer, harbouring or receipt of persons, by means of the threat or use of force or other forms of coercion, of abduction, of fraud, of deception, of the abuse of power or of a position of vulnerability or of the giving or receiving of payments or benefits to achieve the consent of a person having control over another person, for the purpose of exploitation.
Victims of human trafficking are not permitted to leave upon arrival at their destination. They are held against their will through acts of coercion and forced to work or provide services to the trafficker or others. The work or services may include anything from bonded or forced labor to commercialized sexual exploitation. The arrangement may be structured as a work contract, but with no or low payment or on terms which are highly exploitative.”
People are recruited into the Sea Org under terms of fraud and deception. They are not told they will have to leave their civil rights parked out on the street. They are not told the Church of Scientology is a company owned by David Miscavige. They are not told they are employees of David Miscavige.
There is low or no payment or exchange beyond what would be provided at a homeless shelter. Bed food and clothes. More freedom at a homeless shelter. Policing people as to their personal relationships, humiliating them in front of the group, punishing them for sexual thoughts or deeds, is in fact, a form of sexual exploitation. They are maintained in a condition of vulnerability, with their “eternity” held in the hands of others with more power. And there is an abuse of that power.
Link for quotes: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_trafficking
Ha ha! It is probably the only book David Miscavige has ever purchased!
I can just see them up there figuring out how to buy something off of Amazon! Setting up an internet account with help from In Comm. Searching for someone with a debit card. Posting a security guard to wait for the mailman so nobody else opens or sees the book. Smuggling the book through the hallways under heavy guard, weapons drawn.
🙂
Mike,
My mom was in the SO and was on the ship for a while, and thought it might be cool for me to join the SO and become a messenger. That was something I did not want to do at all. But, as I mentioned before, I did do a short non-SO stint at Flag in the Archives project, under PJ Severtson (right after Dan Auerbach was removed from post as RAV – Ron’s Audio-Visual). This was 1977. It was incredibly high-pressure, and the CMO kids were definitely “serious business.”
The printing presses going all night long with staff on all nighters , revising that HCOPL that just got found forbidding all Scientologists from entering book stores.
Oh yeah!! I was on a “refresher” once for a full month.
On has a withhold been missed has anything been suppressed has anything been invalidated?
They were putting buttons in on buttons!!! Over and over for hours…
It was like chinese torture..
Revisions to note that Hubbard foretold of Amazon.com and considered it an on line book store.
The structure of the SO, the use of messengers, and all that is fine for military organizations such as the British Navy circa 1790, but I have to say this: There is no place in Scientology for the SO. I respect the hell out of the SO members current and former who dedicated their lives to the expansion of Scientology (members who include my mother, father, and some very good friends), but it is my opinion that the SO fundamentally was a mistake, or perhaps was a pilot that should have been discontinued around 1975-1980.
The rift between SO and NSO is so huge, and the perceived difference in dedication is so severe, that it has no place in a free church. I can’t tell you the incredible invalidation I personally received at the hands of SO recruiters who basically told me I was out ethics on the whole track for not joining… when in the same breath, these idiots were recruiting bums from Skid Row to join the SO because they claimed to have never taken LSD or to have ever seen a shrink (this last was from ASHO circa 1982).
The CMO post above made me revisit my little stint in 1977, and again in 1984, as NSO staff at SO orgs, and the years since have made one thing very clear and brought into focus this one thing: Never have I seen so much incompetence married to so much arrogance as I have seen from members of the Sea Organization. NEVER.
I can go into Time, Place, Form, and Event, but I will spare y’all for now.
Now please don’t take this as a personal attack to the ex-SO members of this blog or the Indy Community, because I am not saying that all SO members were arrogant, incompetent pricks. I AM saying that the SO rewards the hell out of incompetent arrogant pricks, and look who is at the helm. If anything, the fact that Mike Rinder, Marty Rathbun, Chuck Beatty, Mark Hamilton (especially Mark H. – one of the truly nicest guys I know), Jim Logan, and the rest of the gang are out after years of service proves my point – incompetence stays, and competence tries like hell to buck the system, and eventually leaves.
So, as far as I am concerned, as long at the SO is extant in the Church of Scientology, the church will continue to die its long slow death.
But, Steve, my Rant notwithstanding, excellent post! As a former contributing young person, I know young people can contribute, but I have to say that we need to good mentorship and education as well, and I never saw any of that on staff. The young folks were thrown into the fire.
Congratulations to the Author! My book order is in and can’t wait to read.
Bought mine. Can’t wait to read it and post a review.
SunnyV,
Thank you for clarifying!
When I wrote that, I did not think I need to clarify it, because writing about a book before reading it, it’s not a review. However somebody did it.
Ijustwantthebeatingstostop | June 24, 2012 at 8:50 am |
I just got a copy and rated it and made a positive comment on amazon, it helps! Thanks Marty.
In regard to Black Scientology – is there not a lecture relating to this subject or perhaps relating to both Black Scientology and the fact that an SP will come along and try and destroy the Church… and isn’t this the lecture that DM removed from the re-releases?
I’ve heard some forum discussion about such a lecture but have not yet been able to figure it out.
If this is true, can anyone expand on what specific lecture it is?
Tony, I’d be willing to bet that hundreds (if not thousands) of people who just read your post above, are feeling a slight twinge of restimulation of the times they endured that murder routine. I never experienced hours of it at a time, like you did, but I had enough of it over 30 years to feel the twinge. Introverting, to say the least, when it’s not done with high ARC.
I was going to ask my wife to order the book today, and whaddya know – she beat me to it. We’ll have our copy in a few days 🙂
So, the book is about corporate Scientology. Than the title is a bit misleading. I still do not believe that things would go that far with a proper technology. But I welcome the book.
Marty’s book has reached #33 on Amazon’s bestseller’s list!
Marty, who is the publisher and/or the ISBN number? I would like to order a couple of copies through my local bookstore instead of Amazon. It will bring it to their attention and they may decide to stock it on the shelves, which I know are sometimes browsed by sheep from the local Ideal Org.
It had somehow gotten misfiled in the OT26 folder.
And by the way, TODAY ONLY, OT 11 – 22 package preorder price 255,000!
Awesome, Marty!!!! I ordered my copy and also e-mailed the Amazon link to a lot of people so they would order too.
Mine are now on the way fastest. From the look of things this will be a blockbuster. Congratulations in advance all involved.
Hi WH, you search the main Amazon site for Marty’s book, then scroll down a couple screens to the Product Details section, and see the Amazon Bestsellers Rank. On last check it was at #143. Still #1 in books on Scientology.
Looking forward to the book on Kindle. I may be all wet here, but Marty you referred to a book coming out about a year ago that seemed to have another theme or topic-line as I recall. Is this the same one, or are there still others/another in the pipeline?
As to the messenger thread, if I may, when I was on the Apollo, the messengers (both girls and guys) were either on post or they were not. When on post, they were the direct word of Ron: you were speaking to him directly, in point of fact (ditto what Mike said). I experienced this many times, and it was something one would be unlikely to forget!
And when they were off post (not wearing their hats as messengers), they were like kids anywhere; fun, free, laughing etc. I had a number of very good friends as messengers – off post that is. But when they were on post, oh boy!
IMHO, attempting to align this, and these kids etc. (short pants, the 2D, bla bla bla or anything else for that matter) is just pure hyperbole and/or fixed ideas.
Now, if I’m allowed, for my 2cents on what Marty has proffered here, I offer the following:
The concept (and use, personally) of ethics is generally foreign to beings. Ethic’s “second cousin – twice removed,” Morals, is nothing less than fixed 3rd dynamic laws or rules (as well stated by Marty) that have little to do with ethics.
The awareness characteristic of Department 3 is Perception, so it follows that if one has their ethics “in,” they will also have perception. Unfortunately, this does not always follow.
Additionally, per LRH, Ethics are also reason. Therefore, if one has one’s ethics in, they will also be “reasonable.” Unfortunately, in most of its usages in the past I have very rarely seen “reason” represent itself properly in the form of ethics!
Rather, ethics is a completely individual thing. So personal, so intimate it is, that it factually cannot be easily cleaved or separated from the being. And this is where the actual use of confessional technology comes in: to separate out the most private and unduly self-mandated constrictions on a being’s life. Where one uses precision laser-like commands to peel away even the most hidden and stubborn alignments to doing oneself “in.”
Confessionals, as Marty now discusses, and as have been talked about long and hard on this and other forums, have factually nothing to do with freedom from self-imposed manacles, but rather are a further imposition of control and specific article of managed behavior, from a maniacal need to maintain order. Which also crosses the line from a personal activity to one of supposed “justice.” Yet another lie. All the exact opposite that LRH was going for.
The long tale of how thetans have become so wrapped up in their own considerations, as well as their incredible apparent need to maintain their own “slavery” (through their own actions or that of others…), as to need a variety of crow-bars to even attempt to get them out and looking, is an amazing story in itself.
Truly, any audited (or non-audited action, such as ethics done in some other-determined manner) are but servo-mechanisms and relative-assists to the being’s own true nature as the ultimate source of all illusions and conditions, both subjective and objective.
When one has reached a state where ethics can be completely applied by the being alone (such as LRH’s statements in RJ68, where trained auditors have the ability to assign themselves their own conditions), the need for confessionals and all of that falls completely away. For then reason and full perception prevail, without the need for inspection or introspection; one’s tech is in use fully, and, as stated, the need for any ethics (internal or external) falls “natively” away.
However, LRH (in Study Tape #9, Training:Duplication) says that beings before now, have never had pure duplication or pure judgment. But with the proper view and education of the right materials, they finally can.
“If” they will let themselves! 🙂
Just released, and already at #33? POB’s copper grounding rods must be sizzling .. LOL
I had a few intensives of that too Tony on a wierd “call back”…..
“on regarding the (name of a person Flag didn’t like) has anything been suppressed, has anything been suppressed…….ad infinitum!!
Oh my fucking gawd……….and after a few sessions of that I had the thought that my needle must have the characterisctic of being cast in concrete by now! Then I busted up laughing at my own thought in session and when the auditor was sorting that out I began to realize how insane it all was (and what I was paying for at a dear price).
By that time I knew that would be the last time I would be in session at Flag …(or any other CO$ auditing room) and that was enough to produce what felt like a floating TA at examiner. I have never been back!!!! Life is good ….. really good after that last cog!
# 1 on Amazon’s Movers and Shakers list:
Movers & Shakers in Books
Our biggest gainers in sales rank over the past 24 hrs. updated hourly.
1.Sales rank: 143 (previously unranked)
What Is Wrong With Scientology?: Healing through Understanding
by Mark ‘Marty’ Rathbun
5.0 out of 5 stars (6)
Paperback
Price: $17.76
In the Sea Org I was sec checked when they were looking for someone else’s crimes! Seriously, I was sec checked on what I knew about another staff member! “Has _____ mentioned anything to you about leaving staff” type of questions. An entire sec check dedicated to ______. And I was charged for it in my “freeloader debt”. That was creepier than if they were looking for my crimes! I kept saying “WTF is this?” . The sec checker kept shaking her head in an understanding way. Creepy!
Oracle,
The basic case, precedent setting for the past century and a half, on this is Watson v. Jones. The “jurisdiction” of the court does not extend to a voluntary association. The S.O. is one such association. You join, you agree.
This case is an excellent study to understand the protections afforded such groups. They are a key component to the religious freedom of the United States. And this case was BEFORE that amendment. It’s an amazing piece of jurisprudence.
Hi Marty, Ordered the book first. – have now read the excerpt from the book. Such a key out!! This is SO WELL DONE! Real Scientology – used by persons of good will to free and restore self-determinism vs this other squirrel thing the Church is doing. You wrote: “Thus, a process that was originally intended to free a person from the self-imposed mental prison she has created by her own inability to live up to what she considers right and ethical conduct becomes reversed. The preclear is instead forced to agree to a new mental prison, imposed by the organization based on what it decrees to be right or wrong. In short, the process replaces a person’s native judgment with a new judgment of its own. In practice, it is a dark and painful operation, making a person less self-determined and more other-determined.”
From this quote from your book alone, I can see where the Independent movement is going. It’s the intention, the purpose. To free, and restore self determinism is the right road.From this moment on, I will ensure I stay on the correct one.
Here’s the link to see Marty’s Book as #1 on Movers & Shakers List
http://www.amazon.com/gp/movers-and-shakers/books
Wow Jimmy,
Talk about “extending an olive branch”! You just gave David Miscavige a relatively easy way out of this whole mess.
You’re a big-hearted guy, Scotsman.
2Cents, admirable,sagely and thought
provoking post!
Thank you————Calvin.
I joined and only agreed to volunteer work, scedule, and the uniforms. I had no service except for product zero and sec checks, in six years. I was able to cut a check for my freeloaders debt before I left the Org when I left. That is how little service I got. I invested in real estate before I went in so I had rental income. I had my own space too . Cheated on the uniforms but I won’t go there. Never ate with the herd. Probably why I never really got enturbulated. I was on public’s lines 100% of the time. Never knew what was going on in the Sea Org until I left and read the net. I had a lot of fun until the day I got pissed off and left. I also wrote a lot of KR’s in the Sea Org whenever I got miffed. I also gave people money to blow when they wanted to leave. My desk was the “go to blow” desk. I still communicated with people who were declared too. I disagreed often and continuously. The first guy that yelled at me I smacked hard. No one ever yelled at me again. Except the dominatrix Jenny Linson. I didn’t even start on her because I knew I’d have to take out her whole posse and probably end up with jail time. So I permitted her to ser fac on me twice. I did not surrender any rights. That was my Sea Org experience. I even used a laptop! Kept a little wine cellar under my desk. I did indulge in some power abuse when I asked the public (men) to massage my feet while I talked to them. But they always came back by to inquire how my feet were doing and bring me gifts. That was my Sea Org experience.
A little late to the party-getting a copy too!
I didn’t waste my time filling out those pesky “gift reports” either. That would have been like doing taxes, reporting my booty status to who for what? Get real!
Paperback: 170 pages
Publisher: CreateSpace (June 21, 2012)
Language: English
ISBN-10: 1477453466
ISBN-13: 978-1477453469
This information is on Amazon.
Something that may interest the readers of this blog:
http://www.wired.com/business/2009/05/wikipedia-bans-church-of-scientology/
They never learn ….
Sunday after 5 pm Amazon Movers and Shakers Book list
Marty is number 1
The public at large won’t make/has not made the distinction between the subject and the organization. I suspect Marty titled it to have reality from that perspective.
Spot on, Doug. Marty titled the book to communicate to precisely the correct awareness level. The broad public isn’t quite up to truly differentiating between the subject of Scientology and the organization yet. I think that attempting to communicate that differentiation in the title would have been out R for most non Scientologists, and may have cut the reach for the book.
Good call.
Why you greedy little … LOL
Wouldn’t Davey have to get a thetan transplant or something, to even think about taking Jim up on his offer?
Marty, please post when available in Kindle. I want to have also an eBook. That way I can carry it with me and show people.
Thanks for the link to that report, Brian. I’ve posted it to two Indie FB groups now.
Congratulations Marty, may this be the first of a long list of publications by you that shed light where it was dark before.
Judging by the cover…
Aye Les, freely communicating and blowing the engrams. When those who are barriered realize they create them, I’m sure they’ll enjoy the return of the power of source. That’s what you and I and all our friends are “up to” aren’t we, helping return the power, and it’s as simple as opening up comm lines.
See you shortly buddy 🙂
You rebel, you! I love it 😉
The excerpts are very well written. Love the fact that the viewpoints have an explanation of the ‘how’ as opposed to just saying the Church practices black Dianetics without showing how for instance,
Hope to see it on Amazon.ca (Canada) soon.
Scotty,
There is precious little chance of David Miscavige recognizing that in those brief words are the actual solution to the present time situation he bats at insanely. His insanity is understandable, thanks to the incredible work of L. Ron Hubbard. So, despite the slim chance, and the comm lag for any actual Scientology to come home to that thetan, he could quell the mutiny by simply applying 3D engram running and OPEN the comm lines. He chooses to know best and closes them at every hand and so isolates himself as the “only one”.
Fuck the prick.
Us mutineers are applying the tech. So we grow, we cohese, we are Associated Terminals. What a rag tag bunch of hard ass, dedicated, tenacious, funny, and happier by the minute son’s a bitches we are. In a kilt or no.
Got it!!! Marty, I do hope when you post the next thread that you keep a link to your book front and center for all to buy as new eyes will be coming to the site every day. Thanks and best of luck with the book and beyond!
Sorry, should’ve clarified that the Amendment was the one that extended the Federal cases and law to the “several states”, this was the 14th Amendment. Perhaps that will set this in context for you.
Thetan transplant! Ha!
just got the track on that “I’mmmm schizophrenic…NO i’m notttt!…”
No PTS here.
I checked the library of congress and Marty I couldn’t find your book there yet! But I found Amy Scobee’s. Two copies!! (THEY filed it under: Scientology:
Corrupt Practices)
http://catalog.loc.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?Search_Arg=scientology&Search_Code=SUBJ%40&PID=16RvFRRnD3RqAxrq68fpWHUh7BA&SEQ=20120624214015&CNT=100&HIST=1
Good job Wikipedia. Thanks for reporting, Brian.
I.e., the extension of the Bill of Rights to the states. That’s what you were originally referring to I understood.
Kind of off-topic, but not — Wikipedia has banned the Church of Scientology from editing articles about itself:
http://www.wired.com/business/2009/05/wikipedia-bans-church-of-scientology/
Amazon mover & shakers Best Book list ( updated every 24 hours)
Marty #1
Rock On !
Can’t wait to get my copy, Marty! Considering your vocabulary I may have to run around with a dictionary under my arm while reading your book :)))). Thanks in advance for major key – outs :).
Marty’s book is number one in “Movers and Shakers” in Books on Amazon! Congrats Marty.
Ok, just ordered it – yeahhh…
LOL 🙂
Interesting indeed… unprecedented in fact.
It is an older article, 2009, interesting factoid itself. I wonder if they “Miscabitch” were ever released or just bought new IP’s? I would guess the latter.
Oracle, seems like you were never in the SO. Joe wasnt making a general statement about the potential worth of young workers. He was making a specific point regarding the Messengers. If you had been in the SO, you would understand the extremely abberated and outrageously silly situation that pertains with these little mosters ordering about highly experienced and trained worthy adults as if they were in fact LRH when in actual fact they are snot nosed little brats just a few years out of their diapers.
I hope you all noticed this happened three years ago.
“So I permitted her to ser fac on me twice”
In my my eyes, this is a caustive viewpoint. You were willing effect, thus not abberative.
OT= cause over thought, matter, energy, space time. Thought being the one. Self determined thought as well.
Some ant is crawling over me, oh go ahead I say, crawl away. Or, I smash the little bugger. Depends on one’s consideration at the time. But maybe a bunch of people saw you smash the little bugger, they ALL say you are cruel. But maybe ALL say well done. But maybe you let the little ant crawl over you and a bunch of people saw it and said “smash that little bugger”. Or maybe they all said “let it be, it’ll walk off”.
Groups are funny. It’s hard to raise above a group in decision making.
Takes time
Good post. Thanks Grasshopper. You know you bring up a good point — the inability of the SO to change gears… apply any other conditions. They actually treat the public like they are in a lower condition, which is a wrong indication and totally false. They should be oriented toward helping, or at least following and contributing to the motion (isn’t that what CCH #3 is supposed to teach one?).
I have my own theories about this, but I do recognize that for a time LRH and Scientology really were under attack and really were at war. Of course, there is always the question of the chicken and the egg… which is actually responsible for creating which? A bedrock principle of the PTS/SP tech is finding out if the victim is doing something to create the antagonism in the first place. That certainly is true today; yet the DM bots are indoctrinated into the idea that the 4 dynamic is a kind of zombie horde bent on stopping and destroying “any movement such as ours” (reference to RJ-67).
Staff are indoctrinated to regard the world as a “bank-dominated mob” — reference KSW.
When you compare this kind of viewpoint to the basic situation of a suppressive person, the shoe fits. SPs regard everyone around them as an enemy bent on destroying them. So they have to shut those people down in order to survive.
The CoS, while on the one hand know better, yet on the other the crazy contra-survival actions they take (such as treating anyone who refuses to join staff as an enemy… which IS a false assignment of a condition) actually stop people from moving up the Bridge. When you assign someone a wrong condition, the result is to lower their actual condition and that is reverse Scientology by definition.
So when you step back and look at the group you have characteristics that describe an SP: is incapable of self criticism, thinks it is surrounded by enemies and actually takes steps to harm it’s own 4th dynamic, the family of man, habitually selects the wrong target, speaks in generalities (biggest expansion ever!!!), alters to worsen communication when acting as a relay, and the list goes on. It’s also got a hell of a lot of overts which is part of how an SP becomes one. An SP is focused on stopping and unmocking. LRH says a person goes mad when they start to focus on stopping… It might be interesting to discuss at what point did the Church of Scientology go mad? Was there a point?
If there was a point and we could spot it, we could perform some exciting experiments with indicating that to Kool Aid drinkers. “The Church as a group piled up a ton of overs and finally turned suppressive on ____ (date) when it _________ (time, place, form and event).” Just an idea.
Coming soon
and a group is two people, husband and wife for example.
Thoughtful, had LRH not created a tertiary SO org comprised of easily brainwashed and controlled youths, each with the power of LRH invested in their person, I do not believe that the complete take over and suppression of the Scn religion from within would have been nearly so easy. It may have been a useful expedient for LRH’s convenience at the time, so he could complete his researches, but i think it was a mistake. It is disgusting that the highest trained auditors and C/S’s, even those trained by LRH himself, have not the slightest recourse against some 14 year old CMO snit. A 12 year old Ensign holding the Queen’s Commission may have been able to whip a green deck hand at will, but if he tried the same stunt with a senior rating, thought nominally still under his discipline, he would have soon found himself, one way or another, in a world of hurt. There are no analagous balances within the SO world.
Great point Jim. The only things that are NOT currently transgressions in the Church are breathing, donating money, self abnegation, suppressing others, and worshiping His Holiness Double Rainbow Saint Miscavige. Anything else can get you in trouble.
Got the memo on FB. Thanks Marty.
Thanks Mike. And I think it bears expansion — since there is so much false data on it — to recap how LRH intended a security check to produce improvement: the only overts a person really feels bad about are violations of his personal morals.
Let’s take an imaginary guy who is promiscuous. His overts would likely not be on “seducing a woman” since to him, that’s not an overt. That’s what he feels is the right thing to do. You could brow beat him and he would pretend remorse, but he’d go right on seducing, seducing, seducing.
This is just a hypothetical example — the auditor would have to find out what the guy’s actual moral code was. But in this case, if the guy’s actual moral code was “seduce women” then an overt would be failing to seduce a woman. Asking him about that would split open his case and spill all the things that he grieves about. You’d pull the details off and the regret would come off. He’d stop fretting over the ones that he let slip away and stop hating himself so much. He’d start to feel better about himself and better about women… and then comes the remarkable thing. He realizes maybe it’s not right to seduce women in the first place because they have feelings too. And in the end, we get the real product of a more ethical person.
Doing it any other way is as you said, Reverse Scientology. And by the way, the incidence of out-2D at the Int base was pretty high wouldn’t you say?
I realized today that the whole of COS in PT is really one big sales job on keeping one involved with the COS. It all has been perverted to one big “handling” jig, to keep one donating and involved. But until one stinks his head out to see other viewpoints, one is stuck in the COS.
David Lawrence website possiblyhelpfulfadvice is good.
You’re right Jimmy, would that it were otherwise than what you say tho.
I like you newcomer.
🙂
Whoa!! Twisted!!
Grasshopper, i believe the vast majority of SO members are not arrogant. In fact, they are the most suppressed of all Scientologists. Nearly all arrogance in the SO stems from the CMO. Arrogance and a fine nazi like temperment are carefully bred into those poor lost souls. Those who must deal much with Messengers, soon adopt thier (DM’s) valence, like the CO or Dir I&R of a SO org . But most of the footsoldiers are pretty decent. Anyone on a misson, however, is another matter. They usually have CMO riding them, so they also may go into the DM valence. Seems like Scientology had its greatest expansion with a competent and caring WorldWide managment structure in place before the advent of CMO. So, i think an SO without the militant and ignorant power of the CMO (ie, the Messenger in front of you commands the same respect/power of LRH) can be a fine and useful thing.
Well, his IS broke, you know.
David Miscavige has supplied the U.S. Giverment with false reports. That is a crime in itself. There is no corporate structure except on paper. There are no checks and balances. The verbage and concepts are just that. The Church of Scientology is a company owned by David Miscavige and he has full control. He has pre written resignations and board of directors imprisoned in a trailer or worse. People ARE recruited into the Sea Org under fraud and deception. This is perfectly in context with me and I have no confusions about it to sort out. The situations meets the criteria for Human Trafficking. This is the way it is. Every thing else is smoke and mirrors.
….and somehow I don’t think LRH treated non-SO people like peon jerks. He just granted beingness, period. There is sooooo much BS that SO members started to do on their own, against policies and Flag Orders. Demonstrating competence does not equal arrogance. Tone 40 does not have arrogance or anger as part of it. I don’t recall any policies that say an exec should be a nasty, scowling, self-important holier-than-thou individual. If actual Tone 40 was learned and used no one would need to resort to any of the undesirable personality traits and evilness.
Oh, in addition, just to mess with the SO/NSO thing a little more, we started getting told what jerks we were (veteran SO members, hard workers, etc.) and what horrible Scientologists we were by Miscavige, who would then tell us that Tom Cruise is a better SO member than anyone else. The whole group has become so filled with false data and evil methods of control that it is nothing that LRH ever intended it to be, IMO. I wasn’t there at the beginning but from what I have read I tend to agree that there were some things wrong from the start, but not as much as there is now!
Oh yeah—and I just got my copy too. Anxious to read a little more about this! I will put my feet up and read, and destimulate. 🙂
Thank you! You cleared up some misconceptions I had in this area. I finally “got” it.
If there was a point and we could spot it, we could perform some exciting experiments with indicating that to Kool Aid drinkers. “The Church as a group piled up a ton of overts and finally turned suppressive on ____ (date) when it _________ (time, place, form and event).”
Steve, although I didn’t really see it at the time, the turning point for me came around the time of the 1977 FBI raids. After that point, the atmosphere around the PAC base began to slowly become less and less friendly or safe, and became increasingly rigid and unsafe feeling to me.
Gradually, more and more areas of the base became restricted to S.O. only, and there was generally a less free and open feeling in the air. I began having less of a desire to hang out at the orgs for purely social reasons (although I didn’t immediately stop doing that).
As I said, it didn’t all happen at once, and the shift was gradient, but if I had to pick a point, I’d say that was it, for me.
It wasn’t long afterwards that I ran into my first major disagreement with tech delivery. It was the very next year, in fact, that I had a knock-down-drag-out fight with the LAF DofT over the inclusion of Board Technical Bulletins in my HQS course pack.
Little did I know at the time that that would be only the first in a long chain of ARC breaks over Standard Tech and all sorts of other worsening conditions in the organization. I would never have thought in my wildest dreams that it would go on for another 35 years. Who would have ever thought that so many of us could tough out those abominable conditions for such a long, long time?
As you said, the organization went mad at some point, and became suppressive to its members. Its entire mission today, is to stop people from attaining the benefits and goals of the spiritual technology of Scientology. The group I signed on with so long ago, is no longer there. They’ve been replaced by a group of people who more resemble the degraded militaristic culture of North Korea or the old Soviet Union, than the church I once cherished.
No, those who once breathed life and wonder into that group are now on the outside of DM’s fortress walls. Thank God that I’m out here with them. Thank you, all of my dear friends, for still being here.
Its a win: for Amy’s creation, the sub-category: corrupt practices (of Scientology). Is there any question? Your book will fit right in there. Wait a minate…oh I see, it could mean something else…
No, I don’t believe that. Not for long…
Arrrggghhhh, mate!
I lov you Amy!
Hot off the press!
Wikipedia Bans Church of Scientology
BY RYAN SINGELEMAIL AUTHOR 05.29.09 2:18 PM
Wikipedia has banned the Church of Scientology from editing any articles. It’s a punishment for repeated and deceptive editing of articles related to the controversial religion. The landmark ruling comes from the inner circle of a site that prides itself on being open and inclusive.
In a 10-1 ruling Thursday, the site’s arbitration council voted to ban users coming from all IP addresses owned by the Church of Scientology and its associates, and further banned a number of editors by name. The story was first reported by The Register.
This is slightly off topic but is just more of what is wrong with Church of Scientology
Very nice product, Marty. And your production has quantity, quality and viability. Thanks so much. I’ve ordered the book.
You make me smile with the full library 🙂
Good points CB. I wouldn’t say I went effect, willing or unwilling. I just put it in a time warp and directed it in the future onto another dimension.
Eventually, someone else slapped her for me.
Mark Rathbun, I asked you this before! Perhaps you’d
grace me with your answer THIS time?
…..What’s the atmosphere like in the Rathbun abode
right now? Share, pleeeeeeeeease?
( excited ) Calvin!
2:30 am Eastern time, the book is no longer in the top 100 on Amazon’s Movers and Shakers. I wonder what’s up with that? Some of the other books that were in the top 10 are still there.
#1 best seller on Amazon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 http://www.amazon.com/Best-Sellers-Books-Other-Religions-Practices-Sacred-Texts/zgbs/books/12761/ref=zg_bs_nav_b_2_22
Here we are Captain Bob. We are not sailors, we are Captains.
Hahahahaha! Thanks for pointing this out, Ronnie. I can’t believe I missed the $1776 connection! Perfect!
BTW Marty, I ordered a couple of books yesterday and will write an Amazon review after reading it. Thanks for caring enough to do this. And yes, I will try sending your book to a few people who are still sipping the cool aid, but are also starting to smell the coffee. Maybe they will toss it, but they won’t read it if no one sends them a copy either, so what’s to lose?
Once, when I was out in L.A., and in the Sea Org, I was standing in line for lunch at the cafeteria. The Captain of A.O.L.A was in line behind me. Ivan. Of course I sensed him there. He was a gigantic being. He says to the back of my neck, “You went to private schools all of your life didn’t you?” I thought of all the time spent growing up in juvenile hall in the South Bronx. We did have study time. It was a private school. Not anyone could attend. “Yes, I did” I said.
I probably just pretended to be in the Sea Org. Two toes in and eight toes out.What the hell, it’s only one universe. Nevertheless, my stats were up continuously. I was a huge value to the Church of Scientology. After six years I left with 110 commendations. There are plenty of people that join for real and are on the same terms as everyone else that don’t have the production record I had. If you had read this blog full time you would have seen my posts about the CMO. How their power was to be entwined with delivering messages from Hubbard. And they have not been delivering messages from Hubbard for a long time. I know about the Sea Org. I know about the CMO. I know what Joe was implying. I am guilty of a lot of things but not stupidity and blindness.
Also, I had to take care of myself as a kid. As a “snot nosed little brat” I was dangerous. I would rather see those kids obnoxious and arrogant than beaten into submission and in poverty with power. Hubbard was a big being, They did not threaten him. They did not threaten me either.
I had a nice comm cycle with Amazon.com about the book. The shipping time turned to be to EU 4 – 5 weeks. I asked if they could ship bigger load to UK as UK has very fast delivery to EU. I wrote the book is going to be bestseller in UK and EU. They offered to ship faster with the low shipping price. Now they have sent the book to me without any shipping charges and it will arrive around 9th.
When are they going to start selling it in Japan ?
FYI Marty, Co$ has been banned from Wikipedia! Enjoy 6 months of no harassment there regarding your book! *thumbs up*
Thanks!
Marty,
Book ordered. I know it will be a fantastic read, especially for an old timer like me. Don Miguel Hidalgo y Costilla, http://www.bookrags.com/biography/miguel-hidalgo-y-costilla/, a priest hero of the Mexican Revolution, would be proud of you.
Well done, amigo.
I think after this, we may yet see the collapse of Corporate “Scientology”.
Viva la Independencia!!!
Some of you may need a translator for this.
Alex
Some years back I had a “perfect” case for Mail Fraud, one of several requisites to a RICO charge. I’d studied the line of cases, thrown in plenty of Wollersheim, some Allard, Hernandez v. the Commissioner, and the list of them. I had the perjured DM affidavits, the re-instatement and dramo of “fair game”, the fallacy of millions of dollars of “freeloader” debt and the violation of the laws on “peonage”, et al.
Confronting reality, the existing scene and the resources, willingness, and viability of a legal case, I had to re-evalutate. Sure, I was “right”, there were clear cut issues (heck, I even looked at the FTC and its power granted under the Commerce Clause of the Constitution, and issues of “passing off” with the corruption of the Trademarks).
Rightness is the correct estimation of effort. I chose to polish up my Tech applications, study hard every day, and get “back in the chair” since RESULTS are the Correct Relative Importance.
The future lies in the 10 points of KSW. RESULTS. That’s what counts in this game. All else is for that purpose, that goal. Otherwise this is just the latest on a chain of one valence versus another valence out of some long since dead GPM. Scientology has the wonderful aim of NEW games, and better games, and a bettered ability to create and play this whole thing, in one’s own estimation.
I certainly don’t want a Games Condition, that obsessive must play, must WIN! sort of thing, among my fellow Scientologists.
????
I’m really trying to be polite….
🙂
Good job Tony.
Left field, say hello to Calvin.
It might be interesting to discuss at what point did the Church of Scientology go mad? Was there a point?
If there was a point and we could spot it, we could perform some exciting experiments with indicating that to Kool Aid drinkers. “The Church as a group piled up a ton of overs and finally turned suppressive on ____ (date) when it _________ (time, place, form and event).” Just an idea.
That’s a real interesting question, Steve. As I look back at my life in Vancouver, Gaurdian Office recruters were taking OEC/FEBC executives and replacing them with untrained newbies who hadn’t even finished Staff Status II. The premise and PR line was that the GO was playing a more important game. This occurred in the mid 70’s. The org had been booming much like Toronto at the time. It went from over 100 staff to less than 40. The two major “whos” at that time were Brad Everett and Hilarie Rockl. I recall one time Brad came into the org and I asked him, “who are you here to rip off this week?”
Shortly after that is when I got my first SP declare. I had the audacity to write KRs on their off-policy actions.
Long story short, LRH personally got the declare lifted when I put all the info on the SO 1 line.
But the org never recovered.
There were several years there where dissemination was “stopped” to handle legal and the org fell apart. Definitely not the whole story, but a key turning point where fighting the enemy became bigger and more important than just getting some folks up the bridge.
Les
Hi;
Yup, mine is on the way too! I think I may order a couple for some friends I know who are on the way out of the CofS.
Thank you.
It’s based on book sales — from what I was told by my friend who published his book a few months ago. So, put something on your Facebook page if you have one to remind folks.
Not all motion is created by corporate scientology – best not to give them too much (assumed) power 🙂
WH
Jim Logan really, really gets Scientology philosophic principles. He honors me with his friendship and camaderie.
Hi Mike;
I used to do confessionals at Narcanon. The individual would be C/Sed for the usual confessional forms, but I always queried and wrote my own list of questions on these characters. It was hilarious for me to sit there before sessions knowing what I knew about this persons criminal history, thinking up questions such as, “Did you ever fail to take advantage of another?”, “Did you ever miss an opportunity?”, “Did you ever mislead another for your own advantage?” and so forth. I used to laugh myself silly writing them up. These really ran very well, and the pc would be laughing because they never expected these kinds of questions. Once we were all done with handling their pre Narcanon moral code, then I’d create a list of questions for their life in Narcanon, such as “Have you been successful in hiding something from us?”, “Are you pretending?”, and so forth, then after all those were bled dry, we;d do the usual confessional forms.
Working with these characters in such a manner was a real eyeopener for me.
b
Ordered mine. Looking forward to it.
Thanks Marty.
Hi Grasshopper;
You are absolutely spot on re; your comment about SO/NSO relations. As you may recall, I audited in the SO AO HGCS, both of them, as well as in the HGCs at ASHO DAY and ASHO FND. I auditied thousands of hours in those places.
The senior terminals in those areas, especially at AO, were very suppressive to the NSO. We were ‘tolerated’ because we were a necessary evil, ‘suppressed contempt’ describes the situation.
The individual SO auditors were very aware of what was going on, and each and everyone of them took personal offense to how the NSO were being treated. Often they’d actually apologize. Some even wrote up KRs, but it was never handled. Many times the SO auditors would be getting bonuses, while the NSO would not have been paid for six or seven weeks. I had SO auditors, and to be honest a couple of the HGC SO staff offer me money to help out. I wrote up a KR to RTC on this and other outpoints, which all the SO auditors got hold of and read and came up to me congradulating me for writing it and hoping it would resovle the scene. It never did. I doubt if RTC even got it.
I also know that at ACR, Advance Course Reception which manages the solo level up to OT III, also had a degrading view of NSO.
What was being ‘missed’ was tha the SO couldn’t do it’s job, and had to hire ‘mercenaries’, a termed coined by an AO DofP, such as myself to do it for them. The majority of auditors were NSO, and the majority of C/Ses were NSO. Personally, I think their suppressed hatreds were due to that.
There were SO in the area who were very thankful for our input, and made it clear they disagrreed with the contempt dramatizations.
b
Hi;
I remember well the influx of ‘DBs’ into ASHO F, I was really surprised. I knew the recruiter reasonably well, she ganged up on me on several occasions to join the SO. I liked her.
I heard ‘rumours’ of things that started going on in SO berthing during that period, and a few SO members commented to me they wondered what the hell ASHO F was doing.
She disappeared immediately after this fiasco was undone.
Marty, no need to post this……please see my email re reported Wendy Honnor resignation.
Steve,
Very interesting concept you brought up.
“It might be interesting to discuss at what point did the Church of Scientology go mad? Was there a point?”
My first thought was that absolutes are unobtainable which would apply to the organization as a whole. But individually there is likely a point. For me it was the circa 1982 Mission Holders Conf. in San Francisco. Could be fun to do a process of “spot the point where the CO$ went mad (for you).” You could date locate if things got dicy!
At any rate, spotting and blowing the charge would have benefits for all! Especially when it comes to the fact that so many of us carried on past that point for years. It was another 24 years before I gave myself a “THAT’S IT! – I’M DONE!!”
Another good question ……”Has anything been overrun?” to LFBD, FN, COG, and of course last but not least ….V V G I’s
Very spot on Jim. Thank You.
Tony,
You exemplify the “Manners” HCOPL. Good on ya! My edges are a tad rougher at the moment!!!
Not sure where/how people are getting this “news”, but it is three years old. It happened in 2009.
Alex,
Corporate $cn. is already done as it produces no VFPs. What remains is only an apparency of the former entity. There is no life left in it.
I just ordered my copy from Amazon.co uk and it will be delivered in 2 days, free delivery. No problem in the UK.
Mike, curiosity a crime? Huh?
Being interested in people a crime?
Being high toned a crime?
SHOW ME WHERE LRH HAS WRITTEN THIS!
What the fuck has this got to do with building
ARC? OSA sure has left a shitload of decompression to be dealt with, if you ask me?
The game is getting boring, give it a rest, pal!
I’m having a hard time controlling myself. I’m close to losing it.
LDW. Thanks for this point. “a key turning point where fighting the enemy became bigger and more important than just getting some folks up the bridge.” This, as it turned out, was a key point for even myself in ’79, a good public producing member moving on the bridge. To help them fight the enemy (supposedly), agree to put the bridge aside for years, become a moral criminal, which resulted in really no real gain for anyone. Not to smart, tho at least it enabled me to stay out for years.
Then expereince witess that I know and took part in was Lot of us from Europe did a handling on that many years ago in beginning
of 1982 and onwards when cracks appeared / people disappearing / and EO’s started to appear in Staff Baskets and mission holders were getting wiped / and sec checks appearing left right and centre.
Some of us that had just left the church from DK / arranged a location in a flat fhat was open for any one to find out what then was going on with the Church / and with Mission Holder’s /and a hot line to ring.was established.
We didn’t have internet then so it was word of mouth and past on.
Back then It was extremly successfully and the disconnection from the church was already operating / and notfication of disconnection was openly discussed/and copies of ones disconnection went to the church.This was in DK /BRD /Switerland Sweden / Australia/ and other location including some terminals within the USA . . Its certain lots have happened since and many have had there ways of making things known faster and very well indeed and I am sure also found ways of blowing the charge with the tech . Its certain it works.
The Indepts and Ron’s operated an open invite for data to any one. this was within europe back then and regurely kept groups forming informed all the time.
Margaret, it’s news to nearly everyone who’s only recently escaped the suppress of the corporate church. Remember that most of us were wearing self-imposed blinders, and knew only as much as the church management allowed us to know.
Yes, this is definitely ‘news’.
AAAAARGGHHH!!! pop!!! Fizzzle crakkk!
Pow! POW! PSSsss-s.s…s (smoke!!…)
For F*&^#Ik’s sake …DON’T just do something!!
…………. STAND THERE!!! you F*6%# useless
pieces of vomit caked ant brains. Get me a new
SET OF DOUBLE THICK Teflon baked, Scotch
marinated, boy sized, Marty – proofed rods NOW!
Whaddaya expect me to stand around just waiting
for his next F6%$3@ Co*7^ K -SiUY%^g Salvo to
f*&%)@G slam into me????
I’ll F&*%^#G show him & his F^%&&^ Indie squirrels
HEY YOU! Bring me that F*&##@$g whole CASE
of Triple malted Whit’sit Loch Lomond oblivionSP
Scotch! NOW!!!! WHATTT? You f#!^%&g deaf??
Sputter!!! Bleep! KRakk–k fiz@#$IYT clik-klik -pip
——-fweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!
Klik-klik burple- sputter– weeeeee kajik-kajik,
trolla-la-la-lahhhhh! SPvalenceonsongnowatlast!!
AHHHHHHH! that’s better!
COB
Save your attention for more uptone games,
Califa.This shit gets spattered onto you, if you stick around for the rest of it.Been there!
Calvin
they didnt threaten you? seems you have forgotten the small little event called the CMO/DM take over of Scientology. Glad to know of your complete agreement with this event.
Applause! Applause! Good for you Jim!
Hey! I’m from the Bronx! Tremont Av near West Farns Sq, but briefly lived on Southern Blvd. I always appreciate your posts; they’re so right on. Now I know why 😉
Yes, Matt. That’s right. And with Randy Smith just below that’s 3 of us old timers from Boulder here. (Randy Payne’s been out for a while too. I’m sure there are plenty of others!) Can Knutson and the Bresnihans be far behind?
You are clearly far more educated, devoted and enlightened than I am.
🙂 Thanks for getting it.
Tony, Marty really cares about you, you
know? So do I actually! We have had our
fun together, remember? Tell you what,
why not drop me an em at my address.
You may even end up surprised, On?
Calvin billboardpostings@neomail.co.za
I get both you gals. I’ve always known why.
I have no idea what you are talking about…
You are either OSA or a total nut job in my humble opinion.
Gary, Would you please contact me? I’d love to talk with you. email me @ mattplahuta@msn.com
Calvin — Calm down. Nobody accused you of a crime. I commented that your comment was out of left field. You seem to believe that Marty owes you some sort of duty to respond and inform you about his personal life because you post on his blog. That’s just weird man.
And BTW — I don’t need to find something written by LRH to tell me what opinion I should hold about anything. Assigning responsibility to someone else for your opinions and expression is just silly. If you cannot think for yourself and need to hide behind an “LRH quote” for everything you do or say, you are not doing yourself any favors.
Are you blaming my faults on OSA? Why not on CMO? I was CMO longer than I was OSA. Why not blame them on LRH? I worked for him directly for years….
You are a strange fish Calvin. Have you ever wondered why you get such reactions to your comm?
Tony — he’s a bit mixed up and his comm is strange. Doubt that he is OSA.
Pingback: Incompetence Married to Arrogance | The Sea Organization « 31 Factors
All that can threaten a person has been encoded in red on white. The code has been passed on for others to hack through this operating system. I have seen nothing about CMO in red of white. There is plenty about suppression written. It is about ptsness. The CMO are far off purpose. They have not been Commodores Messengers for decades. The Commodore has moved on to greener pastures. The power they demand is a con. They were granted that power WHILE IN SERVICE TO THE COMMODORE DELIVERING A MESSAGE FOR THE COMMODORE. You can look at this illusion any way you want to. I do not see the source as “CMO”. I see the source as a suppressive person surrounded by many pts. Whatever their post titles were don’t effect me. But it would seem we are BOTH in complete agreement with the event, since neither of US cared to take over the running of the activity. Where were we when this “take over” happened? Yes, my fingerprints are all over the crime scene. I permitted it to happen to the extent I myself did not want to own it. I still don’t want to own it. I do not want to be responsibile for human trafficking. I don’t want to contribute to people dropping babies off in nurseries to be raised by other people. I don’t want to contribute to people abandoning their lives for some form of eternal martyrdom and sacrifice. I don’t want people sent to the RPF. I don’t want people working for 25.00 a week. I could go on and on as to why I do not want to own it. And I see my part in the theater. And I am not gong to blame the entire matter on small group of children playing follow the leader. It took a lot more than that to bring this theater to it’s current condition.
Oracle. I can’t find your last comment but it was about responsibility. Well Said!
Mike, thanks, really, for every bit of comm.
Let’ say I ask you how things are around
home since the little guy arrived?
I’m just being sincere and really love to know!
Is that strange? when asked by someone you
already know, in person? Or only, by someone
you don’t (Know personally)
Your response tells me either:
a) you accept me, and simply answer.
b) you don’t,
and get defensive or suspicious.
c) So what, your’e quite secure, and answer anyway.
Answer c) is where I believe we would like to
settle for an enjoyable relationship to develop.
My comm. is easily accepted in my parts of the
world ( S Africa) without Q&A or suspicion. In
fact, this very experience amongst us suggests
that there may be some ways to go to achieve
better duplication between nationalities.
Would that be a fair assumption, Mike?
I have some excellent comm, with some of our
fellow bloggers, here, Mike and I believe it all
comes down to granting of Beingness.
We do, most decisively, come from enormously
diverse backgrounds and cultures, and this
can & does complicate duplication, quite often.
But I think the INTENTION to duplicate, overides
most of this, by my experience, anyway.
Can you simplify this, any further, Mike?
Then why not take up my invitation.,Tony?
Contrary to your stated views, I’m neither.
Go on Tony, you know the suspense is
eating you. Boldly find out for yourself!
You’re an OT, aren’t you?
p.s.(clue) ; a stranger, is just a friend,
you haven’t met yet!
Calvin.
Thanks lizabeth. 🙂
That is a really interesting question. It is really hard to say. I think there has always been an element of craziness and know-best in the church, probably since Foundation days. The question is, when did the craziness pull the Church over across the line to mostly evil (or, really, contra-survival). That would be, to me, the point when the church went mad.
The span of time between Operation Freak-out, Snow White, the 5% per month increases, the FBI raid, the take-down of the GO, the declaration of Mayo, and the mission-holder conference blow-out in the early ’80s is about a 10 year span.
These all contributed to the decline and subsequent madness of the church, but the church was, in my opinion, mostly good during this period.
This is a process, Steve! Here I am lock-scanning my involvement and observations from 1970 to 2000!
Here’s what I think: The Battle of Portland was to me one of the church’s finest hours. But it also was the first time I saw the IAS come down HARD on people, and caved them in, to the point where they went into apathy and handed over all their money. The IAS is a huge contributing factor to the madness of the church, and the IAS came on HARD starting in ’85.
I think the date sometime in 1991. After the “Battle in Los Angeles” and about the time of the Time article and subsequent crazy response of buying full-page ads in USA Today for weeks. I think the response to the Time article through the Church (and especially Mr. David Miscavige) over the edge. This, to me, was the tipping point.
I’d love to hear your thoughts on this!
I agree. The majority of SO members are the best, brightest, and most dedicated people I know, whose only fault is that they are pigheadedly stubborn sometimes and will NOT quit. It only takes a few to spoil the whole thing. But I do not like the structure of the SO, and the SO should be replaced with something else – actually it is: The independents.
Steve (Thoughtful)
Of course “sec Checking in David Miscavige’s world has nothing to do with freeing beings. He probably never ever imagined that that was its original intention. The other use, as I understand it, that was somewhat valid was to uncover potential areas where the organization might run into toruble because of a person’s actions. That aspect was to protect the organization against something suddenly flapping that some person had done unbeknownst to the organization. However, the auditing aspect of the cycle was seemingly always to be in place for the benefit of the “PC”.
Like many, I was subjected to “suppressive sec checking” at AOLA, under the supervision of SMI. One of the things that became very obvious very quickly was that there was no auditing being done at all. I even stated that “I don’t know who, or what you are trying to audit, but it certainly is not me.”
It was invalidative, suppressive interrogation. Looked like auditing on the surface, but was seriously twisted into a tool of suppression and punishment.
And this all comes from a guy who just earlier had my biggest blowout in Scientology on the FPRD. It was handled brilliantly, and proved to be delightfully liberating.
The same tool that can produce so much good has been twisted to the delusional benefit of a sociopath. He doesn’t even realize that with every modicum of Theta he enturbulates, he shackles his own Dynamics further.
Eric S
And, it was a New York Minute.
Hi Bob – I remember that very well. My mom was NSO at AO, and it was, as you note, a challenge every day she was there. Actually, she was worse than NSO, she was an ex-SO member, which really pushed the buttons. She was “freeloading” again, instead of being there on the “same terms and the rest of us.” She was purged out with the rest of the NSO around 1984-85.
The claim was that using NSO was an “unusual solution” which it was. But to my mind this highlighted one of the flaws of the SO, which is that it is a huge jump from being a contributing church member to being 100% dedicated and committed to the SO, and the model was to kill the middle ground.
I think this thinking is what led to the massacre of the mission network. The missions were not church property – they were mostly independent of the church from an admin point of view. A number of the mission holders from the era (including the mission holders of my home mission) were asked by Ron to be charter members of the SO, and they turned him down. I don’t think Ron had any problem with it, but there was a huge cultural difference between being at a mission and being at an Org, and especially in the SO. Since the massacre, there are no real missions anymore. The massacre was an SO operation, let by the brat Mr. David Miscavige.
Hi Ronnie – I was at Pac when the raids happened, and it was a traumatic experience. I remember that the Feds reminded me of High School vice-principals, except that they had chain saws.
Life on my project was unbearable. I was up for 36 hours straight trying to do what I could to secure the tape archives. Someone thought it would be a wise idea to tape a label on each tape box saying something like “Religious Scripture” or artifact or something like that, to try to prevent the FBI from impounding the tapes. The archives were less than a block away from where the heart of the raid was.
There was also a lot of insane ideas as well, and conspiratorial, irrational thinking. One such was that the FBI could mount a huge magnet in a truck and drive around the building and erase the tapes. I called bullshit on this, but naturally was told to shut up.
It is amazing that the church survived at all considering how insane some of its executives were.
Pingback: Allender and Miscavige: Peas in a Botox, Roids Pod | Moving On Up a Little Higher
I just finished reading it…. And it was perfect! You covered every major point that everyone (whether Scientologist or not) NEEDS to know about Scientology and the Church, and you did it in a very easy-to-understand way.
I purchased both the hardcopy and Kindle versions and posted 5-star reviews on Amazon. Well done Marty!!!
Reblogged this on 31 Factors and commented:
Buy and read this book.
Marty, in his simple and straightforward style, presents the differences between a philosophy of individual self-determinism and a Corporation gone mad, Hell bent on domination and control.