I received a report that IAS was pressure regging for vital projects that the church’s anti-psych arm CCHR (Citizens Commission on Human Rights) is working on. CCHR hack Bruce Wiseman is doing briefings on the vital necessity of killing some federal health budget. The reason? It includes funding of facial recognition technology research to detect and prevent terrorist attacks and mass murders.
Now, certainly there are abuses with facial recognition – most notably by criminal commercial identity theft operations. But, to attack the technology of micro facial expression qua micro facial expression technology is pure caveman regression. Unfortunately, the impetus for such regressive activity is woven into the woof and warp of a ‘science’ that was once heralded by one pundit as on par in terms of importance as ‘the caveman’s first discovery of fire.’
Let me illustrate how ironic, and regressive, this mentality is.
I spent seventeen years as an Inspector General, including seven as the Inspector General, within the church of Scientology. In spite of impressions folks might have about that activity given the importance media has placed on the abuses I have exposed and confessed to, I became skilled at rapidly and accurately getting to the truth of various matters utilizing discoveries of L. Ron Hubbard.
In any given day I was called upon to determine the truth underlying several situations. That usually entailed having to rapidly determine who was telling the truth and who was lying. The environment made that a rather difficult task given that Scientology managers used LRH tech themselves rather artfully to deflect attention, redistribute blame, and stay out of trouble. Scientology management was a breeding ground for accomplished liars.
How I navigated that swamp was by understanding and utilizing LRH technology better than the expert artful dodgers. While David Miscavige was fixated on the e-meter, treating it much like a lie detector, with the oft-repeated ‘put him on the meter’ order, I preferred not to use the meter. When I did, I wound up relying more on facial and body indicators than on meter phenomena. After all, indicators take precedence over the meter (all that you know when the meter reads is that the meter read; arc break f/ns, the meter reads on the auditor first, etc., etc.).
In the course of my in-depth study of everything L. Ron Hubbard ever said about the tone scale, indicators, and investigation (the Data Series and beyond), and out of survival and success pressure, I began to discover things for myself. One of the most important things I discovered were common facial and body indicators – that are nowhere covered in the writings or lectures of L. Ron Hubbard, but are completely and utterly consistent with what he did write and lecture about. In fact, application of what he did write inevitably led to the recognition of those indicators.
One critical indicator I noted over and over was the fake smile – curling of the lips, while the eyes remain cold as ice. In the late nineties I was called upon to train a young crop of security officers for RTC. Miscavige caught wind that I was imparting such data along with their training on application of the tone scale in investigations. I was actually training them to increase their peripheral vision so that they could note how 1.1’s were so adept at showing their true emotion the micro second that you took your eyes off of them. Miscavige went ballistic accusing me of ‘squirreling’. That made perfect sense to me, since he was probably the first person I spotted the fake smile, and the masked true emotion, on. After all, he could serve as the poster boy for it.
But, this is not a criticism of David Miscavige. The problem is far deeper than that in Scientology. No doubt, many Scientologists outside of the corporate walls would have – and have had – the same reaction to me evolving Scientology like the science I consider it to be.
The impetus for this essay was our watching of a TV series that someone recommended to me called Lie To Me (available on Netflix) starring Tim Roth. Incidentally, I can’t recall who recommended it – and I would appreciate it if whoever it was reminded me. While the show is fiction, it is based upon the established science of micro facial expression reading. I found a number of the indicators that the psychologists have now catalogued and standardized in their training were the very ones I recognized and used while utilizing and expanding upon LRH tone scale tech professionally. In other words, other fields of the mind are expanding on tone scale tech, while being deprived of LRH’s discoveries by Scientology’s cult-like, insulatory practices.
I recommend the series to anyone who is familiar with tone scale technology as developed by L. Ron Hubbard. See how consistent micro expression tech is with tone scale tech. See how far back in the stone ages tone scale tech is in comparison to micro expression tech. See how far micro expression tech could go with a grounding in tone scale tech. See how the protagonist uses his tech – naturally applying the auditors code, and beyond, by among other things, parking Scientology-brand ‘judgmentalism’ at the door. I think you might get a greater appreciation for my mantra to integrate, evolve and transcend. You won’t be disappointed even if you don’t see the tech parallels I am making, because the series is very entertaining in its own right.
Every day I see more evidence that the way out and up for Scientology and Scientologists is to integrate, evolve and transcend. In the meantime, Scientologists are campaigning for segregation, devolution and regression. Wake up. The way out is the way up.
Moving On Up a Little Higher 
The best comment of the whole post:
That seems to be a thing that is increasingly killing corporate Scientology these days — on numerous occasions, they’ve spouted lies about what’s going on when the truth would actually serve them much better. In other words, they are so “accomplished” at lying that they can’t tell the truth even when it is in their best interests. Sick.
I’m interested in the CCHR fundraising you mention at the top of the post. Would you be able to clarify two things that, in my reading of what you wrote, seem to be running together? At first, you’re talking about facial recognition to detect terrorists. That is a particular type of computerized image processing that can select a face from a couple frames of a security camera video feed then attempt to match the face against a database of known criminals. There have been a number of contracts issued to do this, but they are typically either paid for by local police (in the case of the NYC subways) or federal (airport security). I’m reasonably sure that this would not be part of the federal budget.
In the next paragraph, you talk about “micro facial expressions,” which are a very different thing from facial identification. I recently came across something about this fascinating field and did some research on it. Apparently, there are people who can detect very brief (1/20 of a second) movements of certain muscles in the face and can thus function as very efficient lie detectors. However, it appears that the number of people with the ability to do this is very rare — fewer than 1 in 10,000 people can do it. And it also appears that because of the speed by which these reactions occur, standard video cameras (24 frames per second) would not necessarily be able to capture the detailed footage to try to do this automatically. What I read suggested that people studying this area do not believe that computerized detection of microexpressions is feasible for several years at the very minimum, and that it may be unsolvable for decades.
In either case, CCHR is lying (which should surprise no one on the outside). But it might be helpful to those in contact with people still “in” to have more details of exactly what CCHR is talking about so that their lies can be exposed with detailed and careful facts. Any clarification on exactly what they’re talking about would be helpful. Thanks.
I think the two fields you allude to are interconnected. I don’t know about the video technology controversy. I do know I can spot micro expressions on video and they make liberal use of video analysis on the show.
‘Lie to Me’ was my favorite program, but it didn’t last long. Apparently the network needed to make room for another ‘reality’ show.
I’ve seen any single episode of “Lie to me” and I loved it.
Too bad it was suspended.
Of course there is a parallel to the tone-scale and what you say is interesting. But I wouldn’t say that the tone-scale is “stone age” in comparision to Ekman’s approach.
And there is a issue about “body language” in use with the tone-scale in the older “Scientology: 0-8” edition. It’s short, but it gives some insights.
I think it wasn’t written by LRH himself – I can find it, if someone likes to have a look at it (I’ve seen it once in Bulletin format, so I am sure I have it somewhere).
I think Paul Ekman did a great Job.
He is an interesting person and he also wrote a book with the Dalai Lama with the title “Emotional Awarness”.
I think his work can be of some benefit for Auditors (and in the day-to-day life).
Yes, this two fields are interconnected.
I also think that hardware is fast enough to recognize facial patterns in real-time. The only problem can be the quality of the film and incomplete software. But they’re working on this project for some time already.
Yep, good show. Mariette used to watch and and I thought there could be a writer who was familiar with the Tone Scale working in the show.
Oh man, SUCH a good show! The episode where he pulls “the long con” as an inmate in prison without his team knowing was amazing.
Also, the episode guest-starring (ironically) Scientologist Jason Dohring as a teenage sociopath was pretty phenomenal. Also, Season 3 Episode 6 involves a cult that is shades of SCN.
Re: integrate, evolve and transcend, lack of
The more one looks, the more one sees how obvious this is in the current church. It wasn’t that long ago when I felt that the knowledge and data of Scn was somehow superior than anything else on the planet. While this may be true for some things, but on other things it is equally untrue.
Along this line I recently spotted yet another paradox…LRH and the church often assert that Dn and Scn are scientific (e.g. based on axioms, logics, predictable, testable results, etc), yet reject modern day science and its methodologies. I consider the hallmark of good science to be honesty, openness, high communication, collaboration and objectivity; humility is a bonus. Good science evolves, it is a process. Perfect? Far from it, but workable (where have I heard that before?) The church wouldn’t last a day in this environment and they know it.
So, with a classic RCS snarky ser-fac you get public statements pooh-poohing the Internet, or some medical advancement, or any type of scientific advancement. At least they are trying and doing something about it, trying to improve conditions. What has been RCS great contribution to the human endeavour? From where I sit they are resting on good works of one man (and others). With each backward, antiquated comment they push themselves further and further from the accepted reality. “I’m sure that fancy ‘lectric car is just dandy, but no thank you, my trusty Studabaker suits me just fine”.
Whatever I see or hear can fundamentally be explained with Scio.
This has nothing to do with arrogance or know-best but the issues
can be and should be enhanced both ways when needed.
But the mentality of the Corp Scio is a make-wrong of everything
outside the church (see Tom Cruise video in his black turtleneck).
To deny all other knowledge is to deny Scientology as LRH based
his research/discoveries on what had been established by scientists
and philosophers already. The latter do not stay stuck in a discovery
unless their grade IV is completely frozen up.
I don’t know exactly the year, but at some event the big Squirrel Buster David Miscavige tried to make wrong the Dalai Lama because he wrote a book with the “Psych” Paul Ekman. He has shown the Picture of the Dalai Lama, I don’t remember if he has shown the one of Ekman. However, nothing about the content of the book was revealed, only the “psych button” was pushed, a try to make less of the Spiritual Leader of Tibetan Buddhism.
I wonder if someone remembers this event.
The show “Lie to Me” is in itself very interesting and educative.
There was also one episode of a sociopath (played by the Corp. Scientologist Jason Dohring).
It was very interesting, as Dr. Lightman (played by Tim Roth) had difficulties to “read” this guys expressions.
Interestingly it aligns with LRHs PTS/SP tech and also with the work of Martha Stout in her book “The Sociopath Next Door”.
I don’t remember the event you mention, but there is a video on youtube with Paul Ekman, where he discusses his relationship and endeavors with the Dalai Lama.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Ekman
I loved the show “Lie To Me” and watched it faithfully. I used the information I learned as an adjunct to the Tone Scale. The series ended far too soon to suit me!
ad·junct: Noun A thing added to something else as a supplementary rather than an essential part.
Marty you reminded me of a passage I read where LRH did not use the meter but comm lags. As a passionate observer would it be so out of the question that Ron did indeed integrated body language as well when he developed auditing?
Sorry. Forgot the video link:
This is a fantastic blog. This is the type of stuff that I truly love. I love the Data Series as it’s truly remarkable and life saving tech, along with the Tone Scale.Along with the Tone Scale, I too use facial and body indicators and have for years. I’m glad Marty that you made mention and differentiated between the metered phenomenon and body indicators. I would see covers of magazines with TC on them and say, “There’s something wrong with this guy. I can see it in his eyes and right here, right between the eyes.” My friend would poo-poo it and go on about how much money TC donated. My thoughts were it didn’t matter how much money you throw at something, evil is evil. I can see it in Miscavige’s photos as well. These are just minor examples of that ability and I’m happy that you validated that. I’ve seen that nano-second truth of a 1.1 and it can be bone chilling to say the least.
I now have “Lie to Me” on my Netflix list. It’ll be a good watch.
Thanks.
I mean this was an RCS Event and the one who spoke was Miscavige.
Marty
When I first got into Scientology, around 1960-1970, I of course first did the Comm Course. Had a ball. I came in for months after I had finished it to do more and to help others, as experienced “twins” were always handy.
At one point the Mission Holder/ED asked me to supervise the course. I had NO other training and NO auditing at that point.
Having done hundreds of hours of TRs, I already had sharpened my ability to observe. Especially in doing TR0 bullbated, as the coach, I was watching my “twin” very closely for any kind of reaction.(once I got the big stuff “flat”.)
As the Comm Course supervisor I honed those skills further. It got to the point that I could tell the instant that a person’s attention shifted, or they became disinterested, or even had a thought. I could say something and see whether or not that “read”, both during the drills, and also in life.
In TR1 and TR2 I It got to a point where I could almost see the communication, and the carrier wave that it was being sent on. I could describe the path that it took, in most instances, and where it landed, if it landed. I could tell if the person meant it or “was just throwing it out there”. I could watch one person acknowledge another person and tell whether the recipient actually got the acknowledgement, and felt acknowledged by it.
I was training others to also notice these subtleties. It was the coaches that I concentrated on, because they were the “auditors” in the “coach-student” relationship. The idea was that I would work closely with them, and they, in turn, would train their students up to the level they had acquired. One of the big problems in training students is that it is the ability and duplication of the coaches that often puts a ceiling on a students gains in training, hence I worked hard on improving the abilities of the coaches. (and every student is a coach from time to time in a turn-about training system.)
When It got to auditing with a meter, I found that I almost felt that the E-meter was unnecessary, and often inconvenient to use. I know its value, and it makes these subtle changes visible to people who have not developed, or do not trust, their ability to see them without it. But I was disappointed to see auditors training that had more attention on the meter than the PC. That was the way they were being trained, as though the E-meter made observing the PC unnecessary.
Anyway, the reason that I got into all that is to show that I really get what you are saying. The other thing is that with a view to that depth of skill, students can be trained to be much better auditors.
The drills are there, it is just how you use them.
Eric S
Oops, that should have been…1969-1970.
Some of his questions (around 14:30) are well answered in the classic book on the tone-scale “Science of Survival”.
As usual, Marty, great read!
You would become a billionaire on the World Series of Poker!
Marty, great post today. Everything you said has such value and use. I read an article recently on how to tell if someone is lying and I had opportunity to put it to use and it worked! My friend lied through her teeth to me. Here are some of the things that liars do, per the article. (Sorry can’t remember the author). They talk fast…. faster than normal. They hold their eyes open without blinking and look right at you (a forced TR 0) and after they think you bought it, they blink a lot to make up for the seconds of no or not many blinks. And with their hands they will do gestures of palms up and moving out to their sides facing the heavens. Also palms up with shoulder shrugs. And of course there is the assertions of innocence and the red herrings to get you to Q and A and move your attention elsewhere. And there is the telling of tales that get more and more wild and big as they say too much in their effort to lie. My friend did just that too.
You are right. The way out is up. We do need to integrate. I had someone approach me from Corporate COS wanting to “be my friend” and said that they only want to have OT’s as friends. I dropped her like a hot potato over this elitist snobbery. It is just like when people say “I won’t be friends with Blacks, or Latinos, or Asians ” and it smacks of Nazi ethnic cleansing. The insular church will die eventually from this self-enforced segregation and the lemmings will follow DM over the cliff to death.
I know an “old timer” who could never get used to the meter as he learned to audit watching indicators and was doing great with pcs winning.In life his eyes and look are quite powerful , lying to him is an exercise in futility ..strong bs detector.
I loved the show , but couldn’t help think that knowingness was a great part of it and the physical signs confirmed. Maybe it’s because that’s the way I go about it….Less scientific but efficient .
Check out DM’s micro facial expression right after the statement by Ted Koppel… “…. death of the Church’s founder, L Ron Hubbard”
look at segment 28 to 31 seconds
What is that??
Brilliant.
Not sure how many nails are left in the draw but I am very glad that your hammer is finding them…😉
Marty & SKM – these two are related but quite different in intent. The security use is facial recognition to match a database of images. Eye size, cheek bones, ear size, relationships of eye, ear top, etc. The micro expressions also views the face but is more a view into the person, the intention, the emotion, the reaction. Current video is adequate for recognition but not fully programmed for emotion, expression interpretation, etc. I am sure they are working on these. Hope that helps to clarify the similarity as well as differences.
These entire subject as Marty described is and could be very useful for all in handling personal interactions. It becomes second nature to notice that the words, “tone 40” type intention and physical indicators of the body don’t match. The apparent contrary facts sticks out loudly once you are used to doing this. Closer to micro expressions is the concepts covered in the following video by Pamela Meyer – how to spot a lier.
someone is going to go apoplectic at today’s announcement from The White House that federal money is going to fund research into the brain.
That will give the fund raisers in CCHR a good button to extract more money.
Great article, Marty, and comment, Eric S. I have used similar techniques in auditing & training auditors for years, but had to evolve them for myself, as an extended application of TRs and knowledge of the tone scale.
I recall years ago I was auditing a guy who threw the cans down and refused to pick them up. I was able to locate the source of his upset by noticing a certain nose- wrinkle he would do when I was getting close with my questions – and we resolved the upset, without the meter.
Since watching some episodes of the Lie to Me show, I recognized the “disgust” expression they describe, as what I had been using, to “assess with the body”. But I hadn’t identified it at the time I used it, for what it was in relation to tone scale. And I also realize that I had just scratched the surface of that whole area of study.
LRH frequently hammered the point in his lectures to auditors that you “Must observe what is going on with the PC!!” And TRs, knowledge of the Tone Scale and PC Indicators are, of course, irreplaceable tools.
But the integration of these with other developments, like these micro-expressions, would be a wonderful addition to the craftsman’s toolbox.
I for one plan to look into that field further, to do just that, and I thank you Marty for drawing my attention to it again.
And I would like to add that my confidence in the workability of the auditing tech is not threatened one iota by the suggestion to Integrate it with “other tech”.
Would a good chef scoff at trying a new way to saute vegetables, so that their freshness and taste is better preserved?
Should an experienced Mercedes mechanic reject the idea of using a newly developed tool to tune the engine more precisely and rapidly?
Not if one actually CARES about doing the best possible job.
“It includes funding of facial recognition technology research to detect and prevent terrorist attacks and mass murders.”
For those who think that the impetus behind the implementation of Facial Recognition software by the US Government is to actually stop terrorism. I would suggest that you spend some time digging into the purported terrorist events like the 9-11 attacks, the Oklahoma bombing and numerous smaller events like the Shoe Bomber and Underwear Bomber. They all smack of government involvement. When an enemy isn’t available, Governments often have a need to manufacture one.
Right now Homeland security is purchasing 1.6 Billion (yes with a “B”) rounds of ammunition. This 5x more ammunition than they’ve used in the last 10 years in Iraq.
I’m no fan of CCHR, they foster an absurd and ridiculous hatred for all mental health practitioners that are not Scientologists. But… if some yahoo from CCHR wants to attack Facial Recognition being part of a government healthcare program I say “more power to him,” I hope he raises public awareness.
“The environment made that a rather difficult task given that Scientology managers used LRH tech themselves rather artfully to deflect attention, redistribute blame, and stay out of trouble. Scientology management was a breeding ground for accomplished liars.”
HOW TRUE !
My son who never became a Scientologist told me one day:
” Dad you always win any discussion, with any people with the way you argument. But this win is only at that moment. As soon those people have some time to reflect about your argumentation, you may have lost and the people don’t want to discuss anymore with you because you have such a great rhetoric.”
In the first moments he told me this I took it as a compliment until I realized what he really meant.
Since then I stopped to use all the training I had in sales, recruiting trs etc…and life became easier and people like to talk to me again, without me having any computations anymore in normal talks.
This was a long way to get rid of that training !!!!!!!!!!!!
Great post Marty !!!!!
Naomi, I just posted a comment yesterday on another blog in response to a question by Sapere Aude, which was “Don’t you know when you are being mislead or lied to – even if slight enough that it doesn’t really matter?” This was part of my reply:
“I was a word clearer for some years and got pretty good at observing indicators, which was why (IMO) I could do unmetered word clearing with a greater success than some people assumed was possible without an e-meter. I have been thinking that this ability to read people (which I first learned as a word clearer) was a result of observing verbal and non-verbal signals (indicators), but now I’m wondering if that is the whole of it – I’m thinking it isn’t.”
What I meant on the last part was that besides the verbal and non-verbal indicators there can be, as you say a knowingness.
But the main thing I wanted to say is that, similar to the person you mentioned, I preferred having all my attention on the student (indicators) and was very successful with just that piece of tech and no meter. (although I do see the additional and superior advantage of a meter at times). This approach came in handy when the ratio of students to word clearers in the 1996 GAT evolution was so high that I needed to practice what I thought of as “fast flow word clearing” (to myself, LOL), i.e. I could handle many more students in less time that way.
Re “body language”, here’s an excerpt from HCOB “Obnosis and the Tone Scale” 26 Oct 73 III:
“You can get a good tip on chronic tone from what a person does with his eyes. At apathy, he will give the appearance of looking fixedly, for minutes on end, at a particular object. The only thing is, he doesn’t see it. He isn’t aware of the object at all. If you dropped a bag over his head, the focus of his eyes would probably remain the same.
“Moving up to grief, the person does look “downcast.” A person in chronic grief tends to focus his eyes down in the direction of the floor a good bit. In the lower ranges of grief, his attention will be fairly fixed, as in apathy. As he starts moving up into the fear band, you get the focus shifting around, but still directed downward.
“At fear itself, the very obvious characteristic is that the person can’t look at you. People are too dangerous to look at. He’s supposedly talking to you, but he’s looking over in left field. Then he glances at your feet briefly, then over your head (you get the impression a plane’s passing over), but now he’s looking back over his shoulder. Flick, flick, flick. In short, he’ll look anywhere but at you.
“Then, in the lower band of anger, he will look away from you, deliberately. He looksaway from you; it’s an overt communication break. A little further up the line and he’ll look directly at you all right, but not very pleasantly. He wants to locate you—as a target.
“Then, at boredom, you get the eyes wandering around again, but not frantically as in fear. Also, he won’t be avoiding looking at you. He’ll include you among the things he looks at.
[…]
“Being able to recognize the tone level of people at a single glance is an ability which can give a tremendous advantage in one’s dealings with others. It is a skill well worth the time and effort to acquire.”
“The Way Out Is The Way Up..” I can’t agree more.. This motto was my lifesaver when I exited the new religious movement I had been involved in for more than 30 years. Facial recognition technology is a rapidly evolving field. A frontier in science. There is a lot to be learned from it, and it can be used for noble purposes that make this planet a better place.
Yes indeed there is need to integrate, evolve and transcend. I know from my own experience that this can be a lonely path, at times!. But in the end, the rewards are infinite. Segregation, devolution and regression just don’t feel good. Every body of my body reacts to them. I believe they are toxic to the health of the body, mind and soul. Integration, by contrast, brings oxygen into a person’s life. It satisfies a natural, deep-seated need that we have to keep exploring new lands of knowledge. And transcendence connects us with our true self, and frees us from the chains of narrow-mindedness.
Applying ‘integration, evolve, transcend” you cant’ go wrong. If I may ad one, I would ad : “Enjoy” Life is short, it needs to be enjoyed. Muscles in the face were made to smile, from a point of satisfaction reached within. Our heart was created to be felt and expressed. Our ears and eyes were created to hear and see beauty and share it with others. I have come to understand that there is a “feeling” part in life, which is very profound. Im not talking about fleeting emotions. But deep somewhere, life exists as a feeling, Love is in every molecule of this universe. That has been my experience, and that’s how I long to live my life.
Love to you all
Totally agree with: “Every day I see more evidence that the way out and up for Scientology and Scientologists is to integrate, evolve and transcend. In the meantime, Scientologists are campaigning for segregation, devolution and regression. Wake up. The way out is the way up.”
Don’t you think the 1.6 billion dollars of rounds would be a more sane target for attack?
Excellent video, thanks.
Interesting comment, ThetaPotata.
Anyone who was ever puzzled with the 9/11 demolition of the (3!) WTC buildings may find here some interesting data:
Use all you learned about Data Evaluation and make your own conclusions.
Yes, Marildi. I know that one, but I didn’t mean this.
However, LRH encourages us in this HCOB to advance our skills in the direction of recognizing the tone-level.
Can you sum it up – few people likely have four hours for this. I don’t.
I’ll do it later tonight. Have to help my little brother for school now.
Namaste!
Bhuddist are always in for “games”, it’s subtil, The new pope Franciscus I do like. Prop 8, even “Dirty Harry” want’s to shoot it down
Thanks, SKM. The final paragraph of the excerpt I quoted is what struck me the most, where LRH states:
“Being able to recognize the tone level of people at a single glance [at a single glance (!), i.e. body language] is an ability which can give a tremendous advantage in one’s dealings with others.”
I looked over an older version of 0-8 but couldn’t find anything like you referred to, except in the Behavior and Physiology Scale, where LRH talks about things like wavering of attention, inability to concentrate, increased respiration or shallow breathing, etc.
You gotta love TED talks… I’ve long since stopped wondering if you’ll be doing one soon… It’s just a matter of time now…😊
Beware of them indeed, Ill bet you never have seen an Anon do that
“One critical indicator I noted over and over was the fake smile – curling of the lips, while the eyes remain cold as ice.”
Thanks Robert for the DM interview segment. I noticed him shaking his head side to side like the Pamela Meyer in the other tape mentions. Also when Ted asks about the church’s insert in the paper USA today where they lampooned the Times article, DM goes into Eli Lilly being behind it etc and says triumphantly, “Eli Lilly never denied anything or called to correct anything we wrote” etc. Well that same argument that is now being used on him when books like Marty’s, Amy’s, Jeff, Nancy, Jenna, Lawrence and others make strong statements about DM and his crimes. He has never once sued for slander or libel or made any statement to correct those allegations.
Maybe when I was drunk because I do not rember reminding you. i am a huge fan of that show though. I stand corrected if i am wrong.
‘The impetus for this essay was our watching of a TV series that someone recommended to me called Lie To Me (available on Netflix) starring Tim Roth. Incidentally, I can’t recall who recommended it – and I would appreciate it if whoever it was reminded me. While the show is fiction, it is based upon the established science of micro facial expression reading. I found a number of the indicators that the psychologists have now catalogued and standardized in their training were the very ones I recognized and used while utilizing and expanding upon LRH tone scale tech professionally. In other words, other fields of the mind are expanding on tone scale tech, while being deprived of LRH’s discoveries by Scientology’s cult-like, insulatory practices.”
I am curious if anyone can spot from micro facial expressions where DM was lying in this video.
Also, I haven’t watched it since it was originally broadcast, but from a brief look at it just now, it seems to me hIs overall tone level was at strong interest, probably his social tone.
On the DM tape here, he mentions Vicki Aznaran suing him for 70 Million dollars. Does anyone know what happened with that law suit?
We, I must remind the Anons, Ex-Scientollogists and the Independamnts to put the full original clips online. DO IT YOU……swerawords
REG Cycles.
The sun rises and sets with REG cycles in Scientology Inc.
I did a very realistic IAS Reg cycle.
received, This is as real as it gets.
Damn you, swallow your pride and hook up with Anons and learn from them “how to Internet” Or ask your young sons and daughters, they know how to Internet and probably know Anonymous or are Anonymous.
I would agree that the ammo is bigger deal right now. The facial recognition stuff will probably take years to implement. My message is that our personal freedom seems to be under attack in the name of “protecting us.”
There is another side to this (“Yang if you will”) and that is the concept of “the Government is out to get you,” this can definitely definitely be abused itself. Spend an afternoon watching Alex Jones videos and you’ll see he’s mocking up a world of complete oppression by twisting facts e.g. “the US Soldiers in Afghanistan help the grow the opium.” Upon closer scrutiny, you find out the US Soldiers don’t stop the locals from growing it, well that isn’t the same thing (Alter-is.)
I’m not sure of the context that Bruce Wiseman was targeting the Facial Recognition. But if it’s just an attempt to scare the crap out of you so you’ll donate money to the IAS. I would say that the chances of those donations actually being used to fight the Government on infringement of personal freedom is next to nil.
I can’t see why these tell-tale muscles cannot be incorporated in understanding.
Reblogged this on 31 Factors.
Nice intentions.
Lying is an interesting subject. It is taught in Scientology that tone level dictates function. But I have found purpose dictates function. I know some “low toned” people that have never lied to me. And never will. And I have known high “toned people” that were pathological liars. Learning about sociopaths was a key piece of information for me.
I have been fortunate in my life that people seldom lie to me. But I have noticed one thing about social lying. The more important someone thinks you are, the more lies you hear. I am only important to someone who sees me as a client or customer, so that is the only lie basin for me to fall into.
The less important I am, and I really couldn’t be less important as I have never had workers or juniors under me, the more people are forthcoming with the truth.
I worked in Beverly Hills for a very savvy company and the owner was from Israel and hugely competent and aware. Whenever he needed to find something out in some area he responsible for, he never went himself to look. He would send me. He said he would never get a straight answer because people would be afraid of him.
Once he sent me to the head of the Contractors Union in Hollywood to tell him if he didn’t pull his union workers off a construction site, where they were harassing non union workers, I was going to slap a restraining order on him. He burst out laughing. He laughed and laughed. Then he made a phone call and that was the last of it. I was so unimportant to him as a mere “property supervisor” , I think he thought I was “stupid enough” to actually do it.
There is a lot of power in nothingness. Slaved often have far more freedom than their master. When people look down on you they don’t expect anything from you. They don’t see any value. I only get lied to and scammed on exchanges where someone views me as a value.
I have to say there are very few scammers in the Freezone / Independent Movement. And the few times I was scammed it WAS a co operative effort.
The person scamming me was in a very low condition and it was screaming obvious they had no command over the ethics conditions while professing to be “100% K,S.W. bleeding heart holy devoted” to the tech.
It was obvious they were not and I quickly made excuses for them. I CHOSE to believe on the theory “The purpose is right”. Well, it wasn’t.
They were in the GPM category of “help me” here while I “fuck you up.” .
Anyone standing in front of you is a screaming testimony of their purposes. Just look.
Now I just have a policy that anyone propped on my lines has to be in a condition of normal or above.
And all my problems have vanished.
Anyone who truly has the purpose to go OT, will be on their way to OT or manifesting evidence they are working in that direction. As Marty so kindly posted on one of his threads:
“So anyway, Scientology is well named. It is the road to truth. It is a study of the truth. And total truth is total power. And when the guy hasn’t got any lies left in him he’s OT. And all the mechanics of OT work out too. So, the subject is very, very well named.” – L. Ron Hubbard, Class VIII Course
Isn’t it amazing that all someone really needs to do to be an OT is to sort out the truth from the lies within themselves?
It’s not doing anything else.
The biggest liars are the ones with time problems. It’s all about NOW and THIS MINUTE and NEXT WEEK and THURSDAY before 2:00. Got knows a Sea Org member can’t have his ruds in. Being homeless except for a church issued bed you get on a night to night basis if you are in favor, is one fucking present time problem. Just for starters.
I just have the idea that today, is really all about where I am going to be standing a thousand years from now. And it really is. I’ll be there alright.
And I want to find myself in a very, very good place.
There is a witty saying going around on Facebook that sums it up. “Do something today, that a future you will thank you for.”
I do feel for the Sea Org Members no matter how they have been twisted. I have met some of the most holy, incredible people on Earth in that group. And my protest reads on the Internet are mainly based on that love. I have found them to be the best of the valuables and all that is possible in good nature , to see, feel, and experience.
Abusing those people’s trust and faith as David has done, is the most repelling of all wastes I have stumbled across. He will never have that kind of treasure placed at feet again.
And for all of Hubbard’s skill, genius, magic, charisma, brilliance, wisdom and promise, 10 million dollar Bonnie View Mansion stands vacant. And I think I understand why.
There is a biblical puzzle of great advice: “And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered.”
“Numbered” meaning, able to count in as something that matters.
Homeland Security is not buying 1.6 billion rounds right now. They plan to buy the rounds over the next five years. They purchased 94 million rounds in 2012. The ammunition is for training and field use by approx. 100,000 border and security guards — this has nothing to do with Iraq or war.
What they are really taking a lot of heat for is their plan to beef up purchases of hollow point ammunition, which is a great deal more expensive. As far as I can tell, their overall budget has been cut, not increased.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/03/29/homeland-security-buying-pricey-ammo-as-department-wide-cuts-take-hold/
Marty: “I spent seventeen years as an Inspector General, including seven as the Inspector General, within the church of Scientology.”
Not sure what you mean…did you spend 10 years as an inspector general for some non-Scientology related activity?
Great post, other than that question.
Amen.
Here is a first-hand report that is being passed around in promo emails from CCHR, of Wiseman’s pitch:
police state detail:
a new government program now being implemented – teams of government psychologists will patrol airports, concerts and sports events with police dogs.
They are trained to seek out terrorists that are identified by “micro facial expressions”.
This was THE first video that was made that I was in, after I escaped out. I have a message to Mike Rinder in it. I still think it was an excellent idea, at the time. Mark Bunker put this on the Net, and I was declared immediately after, without any “Ethics handlings”..”Comm Ev” etc. This IS the “church” of $cientology. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxpHWev4tiU
87-96 – IG for Ethics and Security RTC
97-04 – Inspector General RTC
PS: “Every day I see more evidence that the way out and up for Scientology and Scientologists is to integrate, evolve and transcend” To Transcend takes a lot of courage…and is worth it ALL. DO IT!
This is heart of matter “integrate, evolve and transcend”. I agree. I have done that without being a part of the church. When Marty says “breeding gound” he is correct, it is, one bad example setter usually follows another.The Church of Scientology is a GOLD MINE of 1.1 people. I learned what a true 1.1. was by being on staff and meeting several, one whom was the ED of the church I belonged to. I laugh as I write this, in spite of my lack of knoweldge at the time. I couldn’t wait to get the hell out there. I have seen JUNKIES that have more ARC for people than some of the auditors my church as turning out! 🙂 They are so phony faced the people in the church! 🙂 They are so out of it! 🙂
…or perhaps the show missed too many withholds on the executives at Fox.
OK, I’ll try to sum it up for those who have little time.
The movie is about the “ground zero” 4th dynamic incident from 9/11/2001.
The definition of the term “ground zero” is as follows:
“The point on the earth’s surface directly above or below an exploding nuclear bomb.”
(In many dictionaries the definition changed after the incident.)
If you don’t have so much time to look the 4h movie (I’ve seen a shorter version once, maybe I’ll find it again), please have a look at this short movie, specifically at the moment around 0:59 – 1:05 (m:s).
You’ll see that the steel spear was pulverized to dust – it just vanished.
It’s unexplainable with the “official” media anouncements about what caused the collapse of the buildings.
Please have a look at the following video, it’s fairly short:
This is a short movie about nuclear explosion tests.
(It’s not included in the 4h video, it’s a different source)
In the 4h video, Dimitri Khalezov explains how it was possible to collapse the buildings with a similar technology. He also explains how the bombs got there (before the towers were build) and why they’ve been there all the time.
He also shows scientific evidence why many of the official statements are pure lies.
Last but not least, because this opening post of you is about facial micro-expressions, here comes a video of the then president of the USofA:
(It’s not included in the 4h video, it’s a different source, but makes for a good excersize in the facial expressions reading).
I forgot to put in the first video, where I wrote:
Here it is:
Sorry, I incidently linked a whole series of clips.
Here is the correct one:
Scientology command on what parishioners have to believe politically has been driven for decades primarily to oppose anything that comes close to funding any mental health programs. This is why you see so many Scientologists continue to become right wingers, insult the President continously and kneel at the feet of Ron and Rand Paul (and continue to quote Thomas Jefferson against government spending, forget liberty and free speech).
Bruce Wiseman is a huckster who will con every Scientologist out of every penny they have if he can. I have been conned numerous times in life, but always subscribe to the Science of Survival datum of learning my lesson after I crash into mest. Scientologists who continue to be conned for decades? Continue to hand over ALL your money and go belly up in your credit balance. You deserve this for your decisions to give up all of your self determinism and the way you have treated any independants. It’s the exchange for your actions. Enjoy.
Marty, LOL! around the sixth paragraph in I was thinking….I’ve got to go find a video clip of Tim Roth reading micro emotions ( I couldn’t recall the name of the TV show). Then, the next thing I knew there you were writing about it. Another great post! Thanks.
I really liked your post, Oracle.
Another Bruce Wiseman Leak:::::
(Bruce Wiseman is the figurehead of CCHR Western US.
Bruce Wiseman is a medal of Valor Winner.
Bruce Wiseman is an OT VIII)
——————————————————————————–
From: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
To: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Sent: 3/21/2013 9:50:34 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time
Subj: Bruce Wiseman's briefing at the Fraser Mansion.
Bruce Wiseman, IAS Freedom Medal Winner and President of CCHR US, was in town last week making Congressional visits.
He then gave a briefing last Friday night at the National Affairs Office. Below is a data summary from the briefing.
raw data:
number of pro-psych bills being pushed through Congress at this time – highest ever (at least 5)
law suits against big pharma has triggered massive shut downs of psych research centers world wide – dozens
state level mental health funding chopped by recent financial sequester
psych funding terminated from Blue Cross Blue Shield in Florida
police state detail:
a new government program now being implemented – teams of government psychologists will patrol airports, concerts and sports events with police dogs.
They are trained to seek out terrorists that are identified by “micro facial expressions”.
funding for thousands of unmanned drones to be used by law enforcement in this country
PR
Number of black PR hits against Scientology – rising drastically
conclusion:
The enemy is now on death ground; this is a concept from the book The Art of War by Sun-tzu. It describes soldiers in battle, who when surrounded and facing imminent death become empowered and ferocious as they desperately fight for their lives. And that this is a war that will not have a treaty with concessions exchanged between sides. One party will be left standing in the end. And that the end is not so far off.
So in 2013 we are stepping into a year of unprecedented expansion coupled with powerful new technical releases that will shake the timbers and send the screaming squirrels around the bend. And just for a sprinkle of randomity our arch enemy is on death ground mounting their final charge.
Get the picture?
As our VM Tent is particularly visible, accessible and vulnerable, I am sending this out to a select group of VMs, particularly, Clears, OTs and other competent Scientologists
so that you may assume responsibility for this situation. But the truly positive and exciting side to all this is that with the new TV and Internet ads bringing 1 million visits a week to the Scientology web site, so the traffic at the tent will be out the roof.
The tent goes out every Sunday starting March 31st. On Sunday the 24th we are having a planning and coordination meeting at the Fraser Mansion at 10 AM.
I look forward to seeing you there.
Ok, the camera is shaking throughout. What is the point? And what does all this have to do with the original post and discussion?
marildi: DM’s social tone?… Strong Interest? Mmmm… Looks more like DM is very happy LRH is out of the way i.e. dead, and that he is now in charge…. is covert gloating one of the tone levels?
I can’t stand to watch his face a single second.
Great post.
I watched this show and I enjoyed it a lot. Other good shows to watch on Netflix: “Breaking Bad” and “The Walking Dead”. Not very educative but entertaining and addictive as hell..
Ah, I see. Thanks.
“In the meantime, Scientologists are campaigning for segregation, devolution and regression.”
Those are special interest groups. Hubbard was on top of that too. Hubbard explained one of the reasons for the existence of groups by writing”
“They are not there to make a better society, but to have mutual support for some special idea”.
In addition to having a reason for existence that was selfish, Hubbard also wrote of groups:
“Groups tend to perpetuate the conditions which they are formed to combat.”
The loudest screamers about other people’s “out ethics” and “out tech” have been the most out ethics squirrely people I have had the discomfort of meeting.
If you shake their hand, count your fingers. If you swap a kiss, count your teeth.
I probably should have said “acute tone” rather than “social tone”.
But you may be right – if DM’s consideration was that LRH’s death was “good news”, he could even have gone up to 4.0, per the following.
“Today one’s environment might be happy. This environment would assist one’s tone, pulling one slightly up the tone scale. Or when the environment is very happy it has the occasional result of making the individual’s activities and conduct momentarily those of a 4.0, even if he is ordinarily considerably aberrated.” (Science of Survival)
p.s. A little further down the page is this:
“Good news, sudden successes, the envisionment or attainment of new components of survival make for a pleasant and happy environment.” (SOS)
It was settled some years later.
Marty, sometimes it’s all in the title and everything that came after that was just a way to get to the last paragraph. IMHO, this is one of those times.
The Way Out is the Way Up.
[……]
Every day I see more evidence that the way out and up for Scientology and Scientologists is to integrate, evolve and transcend. In the meantime, Scientologists are campaigning for segregation, devolution and regression. Wake up. The way out is the way up.
……………..
In recent yrs I have observed many folks waking up to many things. Some of those people go back to sleep but many just keep waking up a bit more with each passing moment. They begin to actively climb the ladder where the rungs of the ladder are KNOW and the spaces in between are DON’T KNOW. When a person grabs that rung of KNOW where they suddenly realize that they are CONNECTED to EVERYTHING, that they are indeed ONE with EVERYTHING…Man O man! That’s when they really start to wake up! That’s when they really begin to integrate, evolve and transcend! It’s up the ladder w/rockets!
Hi Randy
Yes, and you and others have made the point that the tone scale is also involved. That is another aspect, some of which seems to be observable by much finer “theta” quality perceptions.
I was quite interested in the show “lie to me” for a time. I found the whole idea of a technology for isolating and identifying “tells”, that are presented as being fairly consistent in humans, very interesting.
At one point I was no longer interested in the show “lie to me” because I found I was not actually learning the skills from the show. I realized that the actors playing the parts were in fact actors, and, if the data presented is true, then there would be no way that an actor would be able to purposefully recreate those micro-expressions. If they could then the technology is quite limited.
This is a similar problem one encounters when training subtleties of auditing. However good one is at “coaching with reality” there is simply no training ground like actually auditing.
The only place that I have found, where one can closely supervise a real “auditing-type” situation, working with the coaches, to improve their skills in observing what is going on with their “student auditors”
Because of my experiences that I noted in my earlier post, I also would like to refine and broaden these skills. I also would like to look into it further.
Eric S
Yep! Right again Marty. On every count.
Four common tells:
1. Typically, in a person who is lying, his or her micro-expression will be an emotion of distress, characterized by the eyebrows being drawn upwards towards the middle of the forehead, causing short lines to appear across the skin of the forehead.
2. Look for nose touching and mouth covering. People tend to touch the nose more when lying and a great deal less when telling the truth. This is perhaps due to a rush of adrenaline to the capillaries in the nose, causing the nose to itch. A lying person is more likely to cover his or her mouth with a hand or to place the hands near the mouth, almost as if to cover the lies coming forth. If the mouth appears tense and the lips are pursed, this can indicate distress.
3. Notice the person’s eye movements. You can usually tell if a person is remembering something or making something up based on eye movements. When people remember details, their eyes move to the left if they are right-handed. When right-handed people make something up, their eyes move to the right. The reverse is true of left-handed people. People also tend to blink more rapidly (“eye flutter”) as they’re telling a lie. More common in men than in women, another tell of a lie can be rubbing the eyes.
Watch the eyelids. These tend to close longer than the usual blink when a person sees or hears something he or she doesn’t agree with. However, this can be a very minute change, so you will need to know how the person blinks normally during a non-stressful situation for accurate comparison. If the hands or fingers also go to the eyes, this may be another indicator of trying to “block out” the truth.
Be careful about assessing the truthfulness of someone’s statement based on eye movements alone. Recent scientific studies have cast doubt on the idea that looking a certain direction can help pinpoint someone who is lying. Many scientists believe that eye directionality is a statistically poor indicator of truthfulness.
4. Do not use eye contact or lack of it as a sole indicator of truthfulness. Contrary to popular belief, a liar does not always avoid eye contact. Humans naturally break eye contact and look at non-moving objects to help them focus and remember. Liars may deliberately make eye contact to seem more sincere; this can be practiced to overcome any discomfort, as a way of “proving” that truth is being told.
Indeed, it has been shown that some liars tend to increase the level of eye contact in response to the fact that investigators have often considered eye contact as a tell. Clearly, only use eye contact aversion as one indicator in a general context of increasing distress when being asked difficult questions.
Did anyone here think Hubbard was the member of a group?
He was the Commander of a few groups,not a member.
He was a “visitor” of a few groups, he might have been a member of the Explorers club. He led the explorations he mapped out. The members paid the expenses.
His followers sold memberships at one time, but Hubbard never bought one, and he cancelled the “membership” game, in policy.
He wasn’t a member of the notorious Ordo Templi Orientis (O.T.O.).
He does not describe himself as a member of the Navy , he was an “officer”.
Hubbard has never claimed he was a member in a tribe of Indians. He said he was made a “blood brother”.
Look at David Miscavige, what group member is he a part of? “Chairman of the Board” is a single person, not a group member. Just because he leeches off the Church as if he was a Sea Org Member does not mean he is one. He is not a Sea Org Member. He is a commander of Sea Org Members, he bosses them around he is not one of them. He is not a member of the Church of Scientology, he is “Chairman of the Board”. He is supposed to protect and manage their interests, that is what he gets the big bucks for as an administrator. If he was a MEMBER also he would have conflict of interests. He gets paid the big bucks NOT to have conflict of interests anywhere in the game. Not with the staff, the public, or anywhere else.
Still, there are people out here selling memberships in groups overtly and covertly. They want to be group members even though they know Hubbard was not one himself.
That’s fine. But it sure isn’t part of any K.S.W. or Scientology. Except for the memberships sold (against Hubbard’s policy) to the Church, or the volunteer commitments made by people to become Sea Org Members.
There ain’t no Sea Org out here and nobody is housing for and caring for and feeding and providing for, “members”.
Out here we have “Family members” and that’s about it.
Third dynamics are comprised of associated terminals also.
What did Hubbard say about this?
Here is some K.S.W. to think with!
HUBBARD COMMUNICATIONS OFFICE
Saint Hill Manor, East Grinstead, Sussex
HCO POLICY LETTER OF 23 NOVEMBER 1969
INDIVIDUALS vs GROUPS
The wide survey done in accordance with LRH ED Int I August 1968 “Broad
Public Questionnaire,” the results summarized in LRH ED Int 37 of 23 November
1969 “Reform Mailing Result” gives us two valuable data:
1. DO NOT LECTURE OR DISSEM TO SOCIAL OR PUBLIC GROUPS. (The full list is in these 2 LRH EDs.)
2. DISSEM TO THE INDIVIDUAL WITH PROBLEMS NOT THE GROUP, OR INDIVIDUAL WHO HAVE SOLUTIONS.
(My note! NOTICE THE CHURCH IS VIOLATING THIS ALL OVER THE PLACE RIGHT NOW RESULTING IN GROSS OUT P.R. FLAPS)
Public and Social Groups
Public and social groups, from governments to garden clubs, are organized around some agreed upon solution and were organized because of and to support some fixed solution such as an ideology or a quick buck or a dominance system.
In such a case you are talking to and at an idea fixed. It fears anything that might shake its pet aberration. Indeed, by addressing it directly as a group by a lecture or a mailing you can solidify the consistent antagonism it feels to anything different to its ideas.
Such groups are also a mutual protection society and their members are to a greater or lesser degree personally defensive but collectively aggressive.
Such groups can usually be neglected in matters of dissemination.
They can be approached only within the framework of cooperation when your aims and theirs seem to or can be made to seem to. have something in common and only then if you don’t try to “sell your wares” to their members. Even a mutual support idea is a touchy matter and has to be very smoothly handled with top PRO.
To a nation at war, for example, everyone not of that nation is a potential enemy and allies are traditionally barely tolerated and suspiciously so at that.
In a “dog eat dog” world, such as Man is continually told it is, political and social groups have other foundations than a simple wish to assemble or to make things go right.
Thus a mailing list to a governmental, public, social or professional (non-scientific) group is a WASTE OF TIME, and can even do harm.
This includes any list of individual members of such groups.
They are not there to make a better society, but to have mutual support for some special idea.
We also long ago learned this cynical axiom: “Groups tend to perpetuate the conditions which they are formed to combat.” For example the Beers groups “to bring legal rights and better treatment to the insane” in 1905 advocates as the “mental health” associations of today which advocate easy seizure and mayhem while still
talking about the late Clifford Beers.
Nobody ever heard of polio until it really got anti-polio groups.
Deficient in technology to accomplish their ends and dependent at last on the evil they fight to gain support, the group types listed in LRH ED 14 1 Aug 68 are found to fix into a solidified idea that brooks no challenge and which imagines anything else is a challenge to it.
So don’t waste your time except to fix up an alliance and do that only by discussing points of close agreement in purposes not your own subject.
Exceptions will of course be found.
We sent these mailings to check reform codes. We also found it is worthless to dissem to specialized groups.
We also had this datum earlier. A franchise based its whole dissem programme on approaching and working with specialized groups and went broke promptly.
Groups can also be unpopular in the extreme as witness certain governments.
A certain percentage of the poor response told us to attack the American Medical Association and American Psychiatric Association.
The Individual
The bulk of the individuals on the planet are “unaligned”. This is about 92% of the population! This figure is taken from countries involved in heavy insurgent attack.
The commotion of “mobs” one reads about in the press, the “opinion of the people” are usually propaganda nonsense gotten up by specialized groups who are less than a thousandth of the population.
They are staged and pushed by newspapers who are solvent only on funds that make them pro- or anti-. Newspapers represent so little
of “public opinion” they are seldom generally liked.
Supported by specialized groups they pretend to “public opinion” in order to increase the impact of the message of special interests.
Billionaire Nelson Rockefeller, favorite son of US big interests,
mud-balled on a flying tour throughout Latin America almost everywhere he stopped got the most placid US and the most violent European press on the same incidents one ever read.
Neither one represented any “public opinion”.
In the hard reality of insurgency campaigns when propaganda is at highest intensity, when all the chips are down 92% just aren’t on either side. They simply wait to see who is winning if they have any ideas at all.
This tends to say 92% of a population do not belong to groups. The figure is not too far wrong.
This gives us a new insight into the one out of twenty in any purposeless gathering who suddenly objects to Scientology.
YOU COULD HAVE HIM IF YOU INVARIABLY ASKED “ALL RIGHT, WHAT IS YOUR SOLUTION TO THINGS?”
You would probably get a harangue about fascism or legal rights (my note! OR “K.S.W. used to harm attack and suppress) .
Lord knows exactly what you’d get but it would be the idea fixed of some specialized group.
Newspaper reporters are usually serving by direct orders, specialized groups. “The Vicious Catholics and the Heroic Protestants” “The underhanded Left and the holy Right.”
By the natural selection of firing any reporter who isn’t a devoted advocate of the special interest group behind the publisher any disaffected newspaperman isn’t on that paper long.
Freedom of the Press as it is laughingly called does not extend to Freedom of reporters! The unaligned reporter is left to take up other lines of work. The closest you can come is to control the publisher or to indicate alliance with the paper’s interests to the reporter.
The Special Interest Individual is a member of a group united by an idea fixed. He has a SOLUTION. Any other idea he considers a potential enemy of his solution.
Thus his comm will occur, hidden or exposed, to forward special interests. When the comm is hidden it becomes disinterested or vicious as it is over the top of the withhold of his alignment with a special interest.
Comm is possible only by discovering his special interest and indicating alliance with it. The comm then will probably be a bit grudging but it occurs.
However, this leaves us about 92% of the world’s population with whom comm is possible, especially on a personal basis.
In this 92% one has a uniform factor, a common denominator of personal survival.
The special interest fellow would comm only on his 3rd dynamic special interest and sometimes even commit suicide on the Ist dynamic to defend that special interest.
But 92% have some idea of personal survival and therefore can individually comm about things that would increase their survival potential.
Summary
We can repeat “Disseminate to those who have problems not those who have solutions.”
Thus there is little point in disseminating to a university as it has solutions for everything.
There is every point in disseminating to a student as he has the problems.
But even here many students also have the solution-to get a degree to magic carpet them to life and the buck or are in the process of espousing special interest groups.
So one can say one can usually disseminate to a student who has PROBLEMS.
There would be no point in disseminating to a police force. There would be every point in disseminating to a policeman who has problems.
There would be no point in disseminating to the War Ministry but every point in disseminating to soldiers who have PROBLEMS.
The only “risk” one runs is some special interest group believing their prey are being stolen from them.
One can easily make the error of believing special groups are interested in general betterment.
With Earth as it is, prey is a better word than patient to describe a psychiatrist’s special interest attitude. And “prey” is a better word than “citizen” to match the thoughts of some government agencies.
Now it so happens that people don’t like to be “prey” and they resent the large majority of special interest groups the moment they discover they are such.
It opens the door widely to dissemination to get a clean look at the fact that upwards of 92% of a population are not on the side of anyone. The large majority of these have problems.
Thus dissemination can occur.
We who are simply trying to make individuals better and so improve the society,without any other axes to grind or drums to beat thus have the majority potentially on our side.
L. RON HUBBARD
Founder
What is this third dynamic based on? “Knowing how to know”.
So anyone pushing on you “Well you shouldn’t know this and you shouldn’t know that” and, ” I know it better than you ever will” and “You can’t possibly know” and “It is better to know less” and “Know only what I permit you to know” “it’s not good to know that” is simply misplaced in this third dynamic. All of the above is chopping comm lines. See S.O.S. I am turning the blog into a library already.
Marildi, please see this article and the comments.
http://www.scientology-cult.com/look.html
By the way, if you read Hubbard’s OEC Vols, he mentions “Customers” and “Public” and “Scientologists”.
David Miscavige shifted ALL OF THOSE (very covertly) into the category of “MEMBER”.
Thereby shifting function. And alter ising function. A major WHY on the Church being as DISFUNCTIONAL as it is!
Thereby opening the gates to various atrocities. Such as “We are all members! We are all part of the same group! The burden of delivery belongs to EVERYBODY! The burden of making OT’s is on ALL MEMBERS!
“You can’t have the next OT level until you…….” “You can’t have the new rundowns until you……….. ” All Members = we are all here for the same function.
Get real! WHO is a “member” of the IAS? I ask you. Who? Where is that group? Why, it’s over here and over there and in the Sea Org and out the Sea Org and, why’s it is everybody and nobody! “Well, if you are MEMBER you OWE your help right”!
There are no more customers or public in the Scientology arena. And if anyone wants to be one they are shunned as a “consumer”. Any policy by Hubbard that mentions customer, or public, has been made null and void in function.
There are only MEMBERS now.
Marty, were you connected with the International Finance Ethics Officer? Have you been the senior? Or was this person not connected?
I haven’t seen Lie to Me, but considering that it’s a tv show and everyone in it is acting, it would seem to be a logical conclusion that good actors, who are essentially professional liars, can convincingly act like a truthful person or a lying person. Isn’t that how con artists work, by being really convincing liars? Just a caveat to keep in mind.
Thanks Mike for data on Vicki Aznaran. Did they make her sign a gag order to get her millions? I wish she had held out and written a book to expose it all.
Thank you for this, Karen! Good grief…they’re running “stats” in our government. Why am I surprised? I’m not–it’s just pathetic to read.
Thank you for posting this. Tory/Magoo
My god, these guys are so far removed from reality
it isn’t even funny. How red would they get the day
they finally wake up?!
The way out is the red pill. There is no spoon.
Your post reached me and made me smile. 🙂
Nothing.
It was my reply to ThetaPotata’s comment:
The 4h video also explains why the shaking shortly before the building collapses (actually turns to dust in high percantage, how?).
You’ve been in the sea org when this 4th dynamic incident happend, so it could be that you didn’t register it’s impact on the society (also here in oversees).
It has only insofar to do with the opening post, as it talks about deception.
+1
Marty, I don’t see anything “out-tech” Scientologically or questionable in the least about the idea “facial recognition tech” or “body language tech”. And I agree that there could be enhanced understanding gained by studying both. In fact I remember LRH remarking that before the e-meter became widespread, he used a whole system of PC indicators he had developed that included, among other things, changes in eye color! I thought that was fascinating.
I think that your applications of the tone scale are perfect. While doing the mood TRs I used to look up every definition AND DESCRIPTION I could find of every tone level in various LRH writings in order to really understand what it was I was supposed to create.
And I love your “mean eyes” above a “smile” observation and also noticing what they do when “no one is watching”. Oh yes.
Miscavige WOULD hate that one. Oh yes.
…..As Mr. Miyagi say to Karate Kid, “Eyes, eyes, always watch eyes!”
Here is a statement that jumped out at me, screaming and waving red flags. It explains a lot:
“The environment made that a rather difficult task given that Scientology managers used LRH tech themselves rather artfully to deflect attention, redistribute blame, and stay out of trouble”
Therein lies the explanation of why you (Marty) are where you are, and why the kool-aders are where they are, doing what they are doing.
You actually realized at that time that “others” are living, self-determined beings. This is something that I found to be missing in most staff. Even when regging a trained OT, the approach was that the person is an abberated jumble of considerations, counterintentions, reacitve barriers, out-ethics, etc. that needs to be “handled”. No credence is ever to be given to any reasons why one is not calling Visa/Master Card/Amex to raise their credit limits to ungodly levels to allow going into ridiculously deeper debt.
It’s ironic. They sold you a course with all sorts of promises of how ultra-rational you will be at survival on all dynamics. Then upon completion, when you’re doing the mandatory routing-form visit to the reg, try telling the reg “I am not going to cough up another 10K in debt on top of the 40 I already owe because it is not the greatest good across my dynamics”. All of a sudden, you apparently have not gained all that much ability.
No granting of beingness whatsoever.
You obviously were aware of who you were dealing with. And maybe that is why Davey got so pissed. If you are able to assume, to whatever degree, another’s viewpoint, you are on the way to being of no use to COB. He needs robots.
You wrote ‘You’ve been in the sea org when this 4th dynamic incident happend, so it could be that you didn’t register it’s impact on the society (also here in oversees).’ What indication do you have of that? What is the point?
No. I was L. Ron Hubbard’s Legal Executive (responsible for litigation impacting on him – which was considered all church litigation at the time) when that post existed. It was created by Int Finance Dictator who answered directly to L. Ron Hubbard, and at times to Pat Broeker and David Miscavige.
(oversees = overseas)
The point is, the impact on the fourth dynamic was huge and I don’t know how much of it you were able to see for yourself. I don’t know if you was outside in some city to see the faces of people (for 2-3 weaks at least). I don’t even know if you had the chance to see some of it on TV.
And not only Miscavige used the incident to implement new agendas (in his case “The Wake-Up Call” and “Straight up Vertical MESTification of Scientology”.)
So, no indication? I am still trying to understand where you are going with all this in relation to the topic at hand.
Maybe I misunderstand what you mean with indication.
What indication you mean?
I only think ThetaPotata made a great point: it is worth diggin a little to some of the fourth dynamic incidents.
The topic is about deception. And the people of the world were made to believe that 2 aluminium airplains have been responsible for the turning of 3 WTC buildings into dust.
Gotcha. I think we are going in two directly opposite directions.
I don’t know, because you haven’t shared your views about the “official” statements.
If you think that 2 aluminium planes could have caused it, than yes, we live in two different universes.
But I also respect that you don’t want to speak openly about it.
The post began with reference to Scientology’s proclivity to mock up and fight conspiracies – something that I believe my next book will demonstate well have been the seed of its bane. This 911 thread seems to have materialized in support of nurturing that seed.
I understand what you say.
However, don’t forget that Scientology itself was taken over by deceptive conspiration.
So, conspiration is no theory in itself.
But it’s true, LRH went this road and it was because of this, that he had a lot of troubles. But was it all mocked-up? Not really.
The pursue for truth is natural for human beings.
More than 50% of the american population doesn’t believe that the “official” statements surrounding the 9/11 incident were true.
So no need to blame it on “Scientology Culture”. To the contrary, I think the percantage of Church Scientologists is far smaller.
So only because you think, that conspiracy “theories” were not good for Scientology it doesn’t mean that all of it is pure imagination.
Given the scientifical evidence, I just refuse to believe that 2 aluminium airplanes can turn 3 building into dust.
Thanks.
Well done video. Funny also if it wasn’t based on what is
happening in the church. In ABLE INT if Dick Story (as an
example) failed a reg cycle he was going to cramming. The
watchword was; cram every failed close! And Dick could
easily sit for 8 hours straight and work over the prospect
until the money was handed over. It was actually amazing
to see.
You are flat out wrong on this statement: ‘However, don’t forget that Scientology itself was taken over by deceptive conspiration.’ Scientology went the route of L. Ron Hubbard. You are right that conspiracies are not often ‘pure imagination’. But, very often they take a person’s eye off the ball – just as they’ve done on this post and thread.
So in your opinion the Broeker/Miscavige connection was not a deceptive conspiration? The furneal of LRH? The weird speeches?
And Miscavige “sorting out” LRHs communications the last some years of LRHs life?
This was a conspiracy, big time (no matter how many people were involved).
” You are right that conspiracies are not often ‘pure imagination’. “
Thanks.
Initially I wanted only to reply to ThetaPotata. You asked me for a brief summation. It wasn’t my intent to make it that long.
I like your post and I also contributet directly to it.
If you believe Broeker and Miscavige introduced ‘conspiracy’ to Scientology for the first time, you are capable of believing anything.
Thanks.
“If you believe Broeker and Miscavige introduced ‘conspiracy’ to Scientology for the first time, you are capable of believing anything.”
No, I don’t.
I only say, this conspiracy was used by a sociopath. to take over the the Church.
My name is Catina Alarcon, I worked for the Ability School in NJ for five years and I resign from The Church of Scientology as of today. My reasons being, that the church does no longer support individual rights and freedom of speech. My many friends got declared who are fine people and I will join them.
I’ve hesitated to comment on this post as I didn’t want to possibly throw the conversation into a different direction … Marty’s latest comment to SKM clarified things for me:
“You are right that conspiracies are not often ‘pure imagination’. But, very often they take a person’s eye off the ball – just as they’ve done on this post and thread.”
CCHR in the 70’s worked HARD to close down the various state-run psychiatric hospitals. Whether CCHR was instrumental in accomplishing this or whether it happened due to government funding being cut and psych drugs being more prevalent I don’t know.
What DID happen though was a radical increase in the homeless population as these patients were now out in the streets.
But back to Marty’s comment to SKM — wherein he said:
“You are flat out wrong on this statement: ‘However, don’t forget that Scientology itself was taken over by deceptive conspiration.’ Scientology went the route of L. Ron Hubbard.”
In speaking with friends about Scientology — I have to remind them and myself that what we have railed against (dm, corporate scientology, disconnection, no children in the SO) came from a source — LRH —
You just can’t get a cherry tree from planting an apple seed.
Doesn’t matter how many conspiracies one talks about. It has to do with the source.
So – Bruce Wiseman speaking on behalf of CCHR against ANYTHING just reminds me the result of the last “great” CCHR campaign – closing down state-run mental hospitals.
Does that mean I think psych drugs are great. NO. Does that mean I think facial profiling might be abused? Of course. Did I benefit from my years in scientology? Of course.
And even IF there is a provable conspiracy beyond the illuminati that is hell bent on taken my very soul … I have chosen NOT to live my life in fear because one thing I know for sure …
I am going to age and die. Regardless what I believe. What happens after I die? Once I had rigid conviction about rebirth as a scientologist, that shifted when I became a Tibetan buddhist, and its shifted again.
I just don’t know.
Marty continues to shine a light on the scientology “sacred cows” and while some might howl and yell — I think it’s terrific.
Christine
It was handed to Broeker and Miscavige on a silver platter.
“You obviously were aware of who you were dealing with. And maybe that is why Davey got so pissed. If you are able to assume, to whatever degree, another’s viewpoint, you are on the way to being of no use to COB. He needs robots.”. Well said Gorillavee! So true!
Hey Christine,
the out-of-context quotes you used do not actually represent my attitude.
I am not a “conspiracy hunter”, but it so happens, that if someone wants me to believe that 2 aluminium airplanes can turn 3 building into dust, I will raise an eyebrow.
This is the right decision.
Congratulations for choosing the freedom of thought.
Simply dishy, thank you for your bravery for posting this in this forum. It has always been my view that the condition of Scientology is an extention of Ron the man.
He codified and created amazing life changing procedures. On the other hand, he imprinted into his doctrines war against real or perceived persecutions.
Some feel that a thorough look at Ron’s mental condition to be: suppressive or a distraction to one’s own evolution and not necessary to further evolve.
I think it is essential to the understanding of the present condition of a fractured church.
So far I hear a lot of Scientology has caused this or that. But I hardly hear Ron caused this or that.
It is almost that the use of the world Scientology somehow protects Ron from direct criticism of it’s present state.
The organization is the shadow of the man who created it.
To those who worship Ron, but say they don’t, criticism brings up resentment.
To those that hate Ron and you bring up his genius you also get resentment.
Ron was a bit of all the characteristics that he has been portrayed with.
That is the mystery to solving the present condition of Scientology: Ron himself.
yep , I know the feeling , I can only last a few seconds before I have this urge to shake him silly .
Thanks OM. Made me think about the datum: what you resist you
become.
The church has become socialists in their use of free medical services.
It has become conspirators after all their beliefs in conspiracy theories.
After all the use of sec checking they are lying to their teeth.
With the church based on spiritualism they are as MESTy as anyone
can become.
All that attention on becoming OT they are just MEST oriented.
Resisting the Interpol and the Nazi connection they are in many
instances acting out some Nazi traits themselves.
They are so afraid of gov’t control but assert total control over
their Sea Org member and staff and a lot of control over their
public.
Resisting squirrels they have become it. They even hoard enormous
amount of money (I guess for a rainy day, or maybe DM is going to
South America and start a new country).
You could go on and on.
Of course everything is for the greatest good so it is totally OK.
And it is is seeing Ron for who he is, that will free people to expand and evolve. Because Ron booby trapped other paths with an only way arrogance.
Acknowledge his personal arrogance and elitistism that is inherent in Scientology, and then move on to “other practices that will only key you out.”
Welcome in the Free World !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Eric: “I realized that the actors playing the parts were in fact actors, and, if the data presented is true, then there would be no way that an actor would be able to purposefully recreate those micro-expressions. If they could then the technology is quite limited.”
I wondered about that too, and thought of a famous Seinfeld show where George was trying to teach Jerry how to lie successfully.
Worsel, superb article!
Havn’t seen it before.
Really like it.
SKM: They are not out of context but directly from Marty’s comment to you. I just split up his comments into two sentences … commenting on one and then the other. His comment to you was a complete thought. I commented on that.
As for the 9/11 story — I had someone explaining this as an “inside” job to me before the dust literally settled in NYC.
But I believe you have taken offense where none was intended. I didn’t point to you and say you were some conspiracy nut. I simply reconfirmed what I believe Marty had said in a comment to you.
However, Marty’s point was well taken. Rather than comment on anything else I posted about — you took offense at being labeled a conspiratorist and put this back on 9/11 and those 2 planes.
How is this NOT a diversion?
Christine
Is this:
simply dishy hcopl # 1 ?
Well, I am glad you had a cognition about something Marty said.
If you read my other comments in the above thread, you’ll see that it is also my view, that too much emphasis on conspiracy is “contra-productive”. And I mean it. There is lots of enturbulation going on on the internet. Someone without the skills of obnosis and basic logic can be overwhelmed by the amount of data (and the way it’s presented).
So the statement…
“You are right that conspiracies are not often ‘pure imagination’. But, very often they take a person’s eye off the ball”
… was all I wanted to know, actually.
It is my believe, that the neglect of any conspiracy is in the same order of stupidity as the other extreme “everything is conspiracy”.
Both can lead to total oblivion.
I think the biggest problem for LRH was not that he was able to spot some of the sources of suppression on the planet (I am sure he did), but the bigger issue was, that he (as it seems) never really learned to handle his temper and he tried to fight the suppression instead of concentrating more on the “flourish and prosper” principle.
But you know, we will never really know with what he was confronted in the early beginnings. We are not in his head. It’s easy to say, he could have done this thing or that thing better.
He wasn’t even Clear until 1965. Did you know that?
My point is simply, we shouldn’t be oblivious to the fact that suppression (and organized suppression = “conspiracy”) exists.
Suppression vs. Suppression didn’t work well for LRH.
The answer to suppression is not counter-suppression, nor is oblivion.
LRH made mistakes? Yes, of course – fighting suppression can lead to potential trouble source. (The more dynamics involved, the bigger the game.)
And yes, LRH involved the whole third dynamic in this “game”.
That’s why I once said on this blog, we need to go exterior to the whole time-track of the Church of Scientology.
Sorry, not appropriate, That would be SDOB #1 ? More of a technical reference.
I don’t know what part of Scientology you experienced Brian. But it is wasn’t the same part of Scientology I did.
The Board of Education is a bobby trap, but a lot of people dance around the red tape. Credit cards are a booby trap. We celebrate Independence Day, yet we replaced the British with the Congress, who tax us far more than the British ever dreamed of taxing us, while we party and bar b que on the 4th of July.
People can no longer own land in America. It is all owned by the government and rented back to citizens under the banner of “property taxes”.
Yet, people go to school, own credit cards, party on the 4th to celebrate independence, and buy homes. And many make the best of whatever comfort and opportunity they create beyond and around the “booby traps”.
We worship and obey these government traditions and rituals as if they were holy. All of that can be accepted and coped with and even wallowed in, but the Scientology, which at least bought me to a point were I could see the rest if for what it was, you hold up here like a unique virus?
I would think arrogance would be packaging it all with the founder , labeling it with a convenient label, and setting that out on the counter for sale with warning instruction only.
I really mean integrate the life affirming good parts of Scientology with those techniques found in celebrated and honored traditions that bring a being the rest of the way: Total Freedom
“Seeing Ron for what he is” because of some funky old video………….?
Maybe you are a bit of an elitist?
You write: “See how far back in the stone ages tone scale tech is in comparison to micro expression tech. See how far micro expression tech could go with a grounding in tone scale tech.”
These days, there a number of emerging technologies lift the veil on domains of life previously explored only through wisdom, by a few sages.
For example…the AMI (Apparatus for Meridian Identification) marries in a unique manner the most ancient principles of energy medicine and Chinese wisdom and medicine together with modern science. Developed by the California Institute for Human Science in Encinitas, the AMI maps the body-meridian synergy and measures ailments in a person’s body and also automatically gives a diagnostic, and then proposes expert food/nutrition treatment.
12 years after I was tested with the AMI (I was very sick at that time and no doctor knew what to do with me), I can say that what this machine found out was 100% accurate. And yet none of the top traditional doctors I consulted with, and who criticize this machine, was able to diagnose me.
The underlying concept is a close correlation, which they have scientifically demonstrated, between the electrical conductivity of the meridians and the flow of Ki or Chi in these meridians. What the AMI does is monitor the electrical conductivity and capacity at specific accupoints at the tip of the fingers and toes. It measures the electrical conductivity, capacitance, and polarization of skin tissue and fluid, to evaluate the functioning of the acupuncture meridians and their corresponding internal organs.
Using the AMI, the practitioner can see the conditions of all internal organs, whether your KI energy is deficient of excessive, conduct an objective analysis of your autonomic nervous system. You can also monitor the effects of meditation, exercise, acupuncture through continuous monitoring of the autonomic nervous system. You can also measure the activity of the Chakras and see which ones are functioning well and which ones are not. This machine, you cannot buy, you have to go there to their lab to be tested with it. See more about the AMI athttp://www.cihs.edu/AMI/ami_info.asp
You can’t buy the Ami (you need to go to Encinitas to get tested with it), but there is one machine that is quite similar, which you can buy. The “Meridian Energy Analysis Device” uses the body’s electric conductivity to measure resistance based on acupuncture and meridian points. You can test for nutritional deficencies, allergies, weak internal organs, and much more, and then the computer can tell you what supplements, herbs, or drugs will do the best for that particular patient The technology is also based on Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM). The machine is basically capable of doing what the ancient Chinese medicine practitioner found out when taking your pulse and meridians, of formulating a diagnostic, and of providing a treatment.
http://www.findhealer.com/mall/telstar/K006.php3
Of course the FDA does not like these machines..;)
In spite of the scientifically demonstrated effectiveness of energy medicine and of these machines, there is plenty of resistance not just from the FDA, but also from established religions. These approaches are discounted as “oriental” and “not scientific” and allopathy is preferred, at great cost and great damage to people’s health.
Should religions not be vehicles to broaden people’s horizons and enlighten how people lead their lives? Instead they often seem to obscure the freedom to make choices.
One more reason to emphasize how important it is, as you say, to integrate and evolve.
There is only benefits to be had by opening up to all that makes us a more healthy, happy, fulfilled, more complete and enlightened! Every religion, every scientific approach, may have a little something for each of us. To painting a painting it takes many colors and many brushstrokes. Same to fulfill a human life. It takes many exposures to many currents of all colors sounds and shapes!
Love to you all
Oral the good parts of Scientology are not in question. But I see you are in the category of resenting me for criticizing.
I may be an elitist OralMysticism, but I have never harmed anyone, or instructed or institutionalized the harming of those that think I am wrong or an idiot.
But if you are convinced, beyond a doubt, that he was unaware of the goings on in the GO then I understand your view of me.
But you see, my view is that he did know and it is fair to bring it up. Not just fair but essential to free thinking and critical reasoning.
Oral, is it ok to be critical of Ron?
If not, why not in your view?
😛
Oh man, Karens video brings back some memorys. Thank god I am no longer prey to the regs. I am a patron though, but not really proud of it. By the way, could someone tell me what lol stands for?
That is a false report. I do not resent you for criticizing. I thought you were more learned and aware about dishing out wrong items wrong whys and wrong indications. Hubbard spoke in hundreds of hours of lectures and wrote thousands upon thousands of words. I do not “see Ron for what he is” because of a 9:50 minute old video.
That’s how you do the math. Not me.
It seems you resent me for using a different method of mathematics. One where I can include a wider range of symbols.
How would you feel if I could “sum you up” in a 9:50 minute video?
Brian, you said, “And it is seeing Ron for who he is, that will free people to expand and evolve. Because Ron booby trapped other paths with an only way arrogance”.
I disagree. I believe we booby trap ourselves by insisting on making Dieties out of human beings who die after having discovered and disseminated important and valuable truths which profoundly change people’s lives.
In KSW Ron said, “We will not speculate as to how I came to rise above the bank”. He’s telling you right there that he HAD a reactive mind.
On the other hand, he knocked himself out for his dream of irradicating it, and people were grateful and helped and in awe of his abilities so they made a kind of deity out of him, and he let them. He didn’t put that much effort into dissuading them. Maybe he thought their idolitry useful at the time. I don’t know, I never met him.
I can’t recall the name of the reference now, but somewhere he pleads with people to not just simply ever accept what he says because HE has said it. Instead he urges that they understand it and then if it doesn’t work for them they should reject it.
So the apparency is that he is giving out mixed signals and messages. Here’s my take: As to the Tech, I go with his “Think for yourselves” message all the way. There is no doubt in my mind that when applying the Tech he knew that robots would not and could not audit people and clear the planet.
However, as to organization, I believe he used whatever he could to get what he wanted done, DONE, and if people wanted to think of him as a God, he let them think that.
But this is just my opinion, and we may never really know. And so what?
Is it really important, or just significance attached to the true essential importances?
We are trapping ouirselves by our own altered importances.
Frankly, I strongly think LRH always knew within himself what was important and it certainly did not include people worshipping him and following him out of slavishness.
He did the best he could, and that IMO was a hell of a lot. He had a reactive mind, like all of us. Enough said.
Well said. And also well done on your “ability to maintain a position in space” (definition of “power”).
Some people are even critical of butterflies. But how does it help to inspect and see the things for what they are?
Being critical of something only inhibits your ability to BE it.
Spare your fingers the walking. I know what’s coming next. I “misunderstood”.
Welcome and congratulations, Catina.
“See how far back in the stone ages tone scale tech is in comparison to micro expression tech. See how far micro expression tech could go with a grounding in tone scale tech.”
I wouldn’t say the tone-scale is in the stone ages in comparison to micro expression. The later isn’t even in the known of what makes people thick. The theta spect and its different reactions on the different points of the tone-scale are not even taken into consideration.
Knowledge of the micro-expression tech can teach the different indicators and a skilled Scientologist could refine his tone-scale skills.
At the other side, knowledge of the tone-scale could help the micro-expression tech to understand why people on different tone-scale levels react differently on specific buttons.
Ron’s approach was to raise the tone-level to new realms, that’s why he developed the initial tone-scale (in the DMSMH the scale from death to immortality / pain and pleasure) in the first place and then in SOS he further developed the scale to help with auditing on different tone levels.
Even the running out of an engramic incident goes trough the different tone-levels.
The same approach is not given in the micro-expression “tech”.
Both technologies have lots of potential to complement each other, for sure.
Unless things have changed very recently, CCHR is begging crew. Their stat is income. Go on, ask your the next CCHR staff member that gives you a briefing, what his stat is. The “agendas” they present are to get people restimulated enough to pay up.
CCHR is a Special Interest group admittedly (human rights). What they do not say is that the “special interest” is actually INCOME.
“The Special Interest Individual is a member of a group united by an idea fixed. He has a SOLUTION. Any other idea he considers a potential enemy of his solution.
Thus his comm will occur, hidden or exposed, to forward special interests. When the comm is hidden it becomes disinterested or vicious as it is over the top of the withhold of his alignment with a special interest.
The only “risk” one runs is some special interest group believing their prey are being stolen from them.
One can easily make the error of believing special groups are interested in general betterment.”
L.R.H.
Thanks.
Power ain’t important to me. I prefere harmony. 😉
You fell for that one. “It’s all about criticizer suppression.” I am criticizing also. Math abilities. I trust I will be given wide berth in my assessments.
If I wanted to be something other than myself I wouldn’t be me. I sure as hell don’t want to be a butterfly. They start out as mini snakes a.k.a. “worms”. Then they grow wings and legs and hair on it and blend in with flowers, they feed off the flowers.
LOL = laugh out loud
You’re indeed critical of butterflies. How dare you 😀
Re: Sapere Aude (April 3, 2013 at 12:29 pm) “these two are related but quite different in intent.”
Even though both are related in the sense that both are pattern recognition technologies applied to human faces, in pattern recognition theory they are considered different not only due to the intent but also due to the technologies needed in each case.
“Facial recognition” is mainly a static pattern analysis, while “micro facial expressions” is a time series pattern analysis.
Both use an underlying facial discrimination algorithm, which separates the boundaries of the face from the environment. Once the face is discriminated, facial recognition uses static pattern analysis algorithms and a set of features (extracted from the face) to compare with other faces.
Micro facial expressions analysis does something similar (to the above) in order to get the boundaries of the same face off the successive film frames.
But, the similarities end here. Now, micro facial expressions analysis uses a different set of features (extracted from successive faces) to which apply time series pattern recognition analysis. Both, the set of features and the algorithms, are based on intentions reflected by the human face.
The Hubble telescope is showing us that there are more hundreds of billions of relatively earth-sized planets out there with the potential for sentient life than we can comfortably conceive of down here on our own, tiny little blue dot in space.
Many of these hundreds of billions of planets have probably existed for billions and tens of billions of years.
That’s a lot of real estate and it’s a lot of time to create all sorts of games.
To think that a dude named Ron Hubbard has, for the first time ever, created the only workable tech for spiritual advancement, and on this very tiny blue dot in space is…….well………..let’s just say that for some, the world is indeed still flat.
I remember reading in one of lrh text where he said acupuncture etc. was primitive hogwash or some such thing. It was the first time I disagreed with anything lrh said, so It stuck with me.There is also facial diagnosis of physical conditions, also connected with certain emotional traits. I dont know exactly where I am going with this and it is probably off the subject a bit but I always have to put in my 2 cents worth
Marty, when you wrote
“See how far back in the stone ages tone scale tech is in comparison to micro expression tech. See how far micro expression tech could go with a grounding in tone scale tech.”
Did you actually mean the tech of of spotting (PC) indicators, how to recognize them, interprete them and so on?
It’s not clearly stated and I don’t want to make wrong assumtions.
SKM: “I prefere harmony.”
I noted that as well. And that’s what makes you powerful. 😉
A mis-representation of the facts here: “the new TV and Internet ads bringing 1 million visits a week to the Scientology web site” 1 Million visits does not mean 1 million new Scientologists. LRH says: “Truth must exist before lies and truth blows the lie away as it is later on the chain”-RJ37. So, the CCHR is a very sick group of people to know the truth about church expansion and then “publicly break ground” with this information. The Sea Org in New York are looking like they are having a hard time keeping the people that are *in* the org actually *in* the org every time I go by. 🙂
Thanks, Worsel. I didn’t quite follow the reasoning in that article since someone in the hostility range (for example) of the tone scale is above 0.0 but does not emanate “affinity or warmth” (the addition of “or warmth” indicating which definition of “affinity” was meant). And from my observations of DM (some of them fairly up close) I really got that his chronic (not acute) tone was in the hostility band, either overt or covert, .
“Other practices” is the Church taking a snapshot of a split second of Marty’s life, and posting it on the Internet to define him. A mugshot.
You are doing the same thing with a 9:50 minute video of Hubbard.
You are actually on the same page, yet you are here writing out general C/S programs like this one for mass audiences.
“Acknowledge his personal arrogance and elitistism that is inherent in Scientology, and then move on to “other practices that will only key you out.” Brian’s program C/S for all that read this thread.
Another practice that will “only key you out” is smoking opium. Perhaps you need to write a sub program now to clarify?
And you are harping on Hubbard’s arrogance?
Scientologists tend to consider themselves expert in the art of predicting human behavior. Utilizing Scientology tech on that score would take the average Scientologist hours, days or week to accurately predict an imminent act of violence, or even to detect a lie with certainty. As Oral Mysticism says, ‘do the math.’
Seems that’s the way it goes. Hubbard wrote about this 1951. It’s 2013 and someone didn’t get the memo yet. I’m sure that’s Hubbard’s fault on some level.
By the way, Dick Story is a fine man. I do worry about him these days.
Also, when this video was shot, that was in another century when “being proud” was considered a great quality. A good indicator.
It is social taboo to be proud in this particular time frame in society. It is considered arrogant and elitist. I just watched Mitt Romney walk right out of the history books because he was a proud man. Don’t think Obama isn’t proud. He is proud because of victories that were not even possible for Mitt Romney to have. But he keeps it turned down to very, very low volume.
You go watch other videos from this time period. I shudder to think what people would make of Johnny Carson on the tonight show.
Personally, I think a proud man is a lovely man.
Ok Oral, forget about my mention of resentment. That was not nesseccery nor supportive of my thought for me to assume.
Here is my thought:
1) is it a vaild inquiry to critique whether Ron was involved directly in violent retribution against critics?
2) does the good he has done in Scientology excuse him of criticism if he was involved?
Being critical to spew hate is not my definition here. It is critical thinking, allowing oneself to see, look, inspect, investigate, research anything anytime anywhere.
That is my usage of criticism gentlemen.
MaBű, do you know how they have figured out what specific intention is indicated by each of the different facial expressions? This is interesting data you posted and you got me curious. 🙂
I think the more important question is, does that have any bearing on whether the technology works or does not?
Laughter! I have a tattoo of one spread all over my left front shoulder. I got that when I was a gnarly little parasite draped in beautiful vines.
CCHR is such bullshit. They increase the number of Psychs
like increasing the number of Police increases crime. I was threatened with being BEATEN UP if I didnt donate by a Top CCHR fund raiser then threatened with not getting up the Bridge ( extortion.)
if I didnt pay up to CCHR first. That was it for me dont give these NAZI Cronys anything. Your stats will go up !
1) I think he was very much involved in retribution towards critics. Maybe he had some wrong items and wrong indications put on him too.
I don’t think it was very violent. I didn’t see any street fights, mug shots, or hospital photos of victims.
“Violent” to you, might mean the M.A.A. standing at the copy machine with a ream of Golden rod.
They fucked with Paulette Cooper in the sneaky way she fucked with the Church. She snuck in as a “customer” when she was really a journalist. They both played the same game. Did she or did she not take a big fat payoff because she won the “I’m the biggest victim” game? Did she or did she not take home a consolation prize? She DID profit off the experience as she originally intended. HUGELY.
Personally if someone comes propped into my house as someone here to “help and assist and contribute” and turns out to fuck me over, I will shape shift real quick.
I’ve been fair gamed left right and center. Am I taking it like a blow up doll? No. Is it bothering me? Not at all.
I’m not sure how it is working out for them to be an SP on my lines. I’ve got the bullets coming at me, I’m in charge of how they are spending their ammunition and where they are using it. Are they at cause, or effect?
I don’t have a problem with violent retribution when provoked. If someone would have kicked David’s ass a long time ago we wouldn’t have the situation we have today. If someone pushes me I push back harder. I’m not doing any gig as a holy man. And the people fair gaming aren’t either. I never hit first. That is as holy as I get.
You’re the one out here selling “I’m holier than Hubbard, I have higher standards.”
I can shape shift from holy to unholy in a New York Minute.
2) In my case, I have only prospered from my involvement with Scientology. But then again, I’m not a blow up doll. He assisted things that assisted survival, he inhibited things that inhibited survival. He was a loose cannon once or twice with that. Do I focus on the few mis steps to support some special interest of mine? No. Do I worship the body? No.
Feel free to whine about his overts and video persona and your assert your holiness.
Just don’t try to push a bag of “morals” tricks on me and sell it as a science.
The Holy Man
At first glance,
a church under every rock,
propped against every tree.
Lighted crosses in the night,
One is convinced the HOLY MAN
has a few more tricks up his sleeve.
Is it possible to love
in spite of all?
Well, that was true for me.
“People are “Created”
by the “Supreme Being”.
Because of him I’m me.
God is not YOU,
You are not God,
Don’t know. Only believe.
Heaven not here,
it’s over there.
Turn the other cheek.
Love your neighbor.
Don’t fight back.
Jesus parted the Sea.
Unattainable goals
that give us hope but
never set us free.
I only deny the Holy Man
is holier than me.
T.O.
lol = laugh out loud
Lars, I always like your comments and I mostly agree with this one except I don’t think Scientology fundamentally (not sure what that means exactly) explains everything. It either does or doesn’t. And it doesn’t explain the mechanics of how a postulate works. I’ve been fascinated with that for some time and I see that Marty is also as per his last post The Tao of Physics. I don’t know of any real Scientology explanation of this, black on white, clear and exact. I don’t know of one.
We have it direct from Steve “Sarge” Pfauth posting right here on this blog that on the day after Ron Hubbard died, whilst everone else at Creston were in Grief, David Miscavige and Pat Broeker were laughing and making jokes.
Michael A. Hobson
Independent Scientologist
You do leave me curious about one thing Brian.
Who / What would oppose violent retribution?
I can only think, “Someone who is out to fuck someone over.”
Good point Marty as the truth of all of this is a spiritual path with happy people as the outcome. When measured in those terms I completely agree with you.
But Scientology became other things besides,”this is the session” and “thank you your needle is floating.”
It became a world view colored with enemies. It became an only way. And it crushed critics. That is a million miles away from VVGI’s, but identical to the organization called Scientology. Ron’s organization.
Due reflection on Ron’s contribution to the chaos of attack attack philosophy is important. Constructive journalistic research of Ron’s contribution, I believe, is part of the healing.
It is also part of my view it is part of the denial to not do it.
But auditing, helping others to get on with life……….. wonderful.
And that is the difficulty in this discussion that I bring up.
Lives have been saved and lives have been destroyed in Ron’s name.
Oralmysticism and Paulette Cooper each have a valid view of Scientology.
Bringing these two disparate (contrasting) views together is the trick.
And the only way that can be done is with a truthful and accurate historical and religious/philosophic research and study.
Ad hominem attacks on me, or my path, for bringing it up, is the measure of the denial. In my opinion.
Thank you Marty for a good question.
I remember that excellent article. Thank you, Worsel. I think that whole Int Base environment is in Sacrifice and DM is in Controling Bodies.
My point Aqua was meaning that Ron denigrated other paths. I am sure there are thousands of ex Scientologists that had to get passed feeling they were doing something wrong when they started investigating other practices.
It was drummed into all of our well word cleared heads that Scientology was the only road out.
Allowing ourselves to say,” hey, Ron was wrong, I am free to research other practices and BTW I think mine is better.”
That is what I mean by booby trap. He put himself far above and stated time and again how WE Scientology! have the only road out.
Funny, I have never met a fully freed Scientologist. How can it be the only road out if no one has gotten out. I’ve never understood that logic. Maybe because it is not logical.
SKM, you are basing some really alarming conclusions on some stray comments made by a Russian, on a footage of 2 unrelated nuclear tests and on Bush’s inactivity? Where is the Data Series? The above video gives too much credence to Bush, it assumes there was anybody home. Bush is a criminally insane moron. Bush violated 12 points of the US Constitution and committed over 60 separate crimes (felonies against existing and active laws). Bush can’t even speak English. Bush was a puppet, he wasn’t supposed to act until he was told how to act by his handlers. I don’t even want to get into Russians’ eternal xenophobia and their attitude toward America as their enemy #1 or into the unrelated nuclear tests. I kind of got on the roll here because this smacks of chaos mongering.
Good for you Catrina! You’ve got more friends over here than you had back there. As you probably know friendships in the Church, are those the Church decides for you. Life gets better when you can choose your own friends. I am glad you have not forsaken your friends or permitted the church to convince you to turn your back people who are good people.
“You obviously were aware of who you were dealing with. And maybe that is why Davey got so pissed. If you are able to assume, to whatever degree, another’s viewpoint, you are on the way to being of no use to COB. He needs robots.”
I agree. My guess is that Marty’s just Being There, Observing and Understanding what he was seeing would have been missing MissedCaviges withholds every day. In my experience, a person of his ilk is very much in fear of having some of their true intentions found out. So they attack the people who might see them as they are as a way of mis-directing possible attention away from themselves.
The question seems to be, “What are you looking at?” If you look at a being, even in a hostile mood, there is affinity – even if expressed in a hostile wavelength. You can feel a being that is hostile. If in sub-apathy or on the minus tone scale, you will feel nothing there.
Aside from Chapter Six of “Problems of Work” you will find some more data in “Scientology 8-8008” in the chapter “The Emotional Scale and the Subzero Tone Scale”: “This subzero Tone Scale shows that the thetan is several bands below knowingness as a body and so he will be found in the majority of cases. In our Homo Sapiens, he will be discovered to be below zero on the Tone Scale.”
I had a hard time working with the tone scale until I realized how few persons are on the plus scale as a being. I had had the concept most everybody would be found there, whereas it is the other way round.
Just for a test, open a newspaper and look if you find any traces of thetans without affinity or responsibility. Or compare it with “How would they have acted if they had some affinity or responsibility?”
Gretchen~~
To answer your question. The Internet has developed its own slang.
LOL means “Laughing Out Loud”
LMAO means “Laughing My Ass Off”
ROFL means “Rolling on the Floor Laughing”
Marildin,
First, they set up experiments where human research subjects are likely to have emotional micro facial expressions. They film the experiments with high-speed cameras. Then human experts in micro facial recognition watch the videos and find and classify the micro facial expressions (i.e.: they mark the start, the end, and label the emotion of each micro facial expression they are able to spot). In this way, they made a database with labeled micro facial expressions.
They also include in the database facial films with other kind of rapid facial movements.
Then they experiment with different kind of features and different kind of algorithms to find out which combination of features and algorithms and algorithms’ parameters are able to get the best (or at least a good enough) pattern recognition and discrimination.
>>The facial recognition stuff will probably take years to implement.
Nope:
http://mashable.com/2013/04/04/kinect-depression/
This is not even bleeding edge. The bleeding edge is terrifying technology.
Do you really want the government to be able to track your every move, if they decide you are an unsavoury type for whatever the reason-de-jour is going to be? |
And then, there is this phenomenon:
http://www.youtube.com/user/CheckpointUSA?feature=watch
You think this is anything less than preparatory training for population control .. ?
You are kind of like a “morals broker” selling your wares among st a group that has other priorities? And that makes us “immorals” on some level? And if we see Hubbard was “immoral” we will be free?
That is exactly what you say. I mean, I get it. That’s just a whole nother train track . And I “loose” if Morals does not matter”. Damn that is one hell of a beautiful ser fac. Keep on keepin on brother. I know exactly what you are running because I did that shit myself when I could not be more creative. The fanatics and fundamentalists are on the same page. “Morals” paddling. But we are interested in test results not superstition.
Trust me, there are people that fall into Scientology that believe in things they don’t undertstand.
And then they suffer.
As I see it micro expression technology and tone scale technology is two entirely different technologies. The tone scale has spirituality woven into it, micro expression is a pretty brain oriented technology, but that doesn’t make it bad, necessarily, it looks pretty precise.
Where is the spirituality in micro expression technology? How do you spot a thetan below zero or above 4 in micro expression? Just asking.
And if Stevie Wonder couldn’t get the message across, Why is L. Ron Hubbard such a failure?
I disagree. The video shows me a paranoid kid with apparently nothing more productive to do than harass border patrol personnel.
The arrogance of people who “already know all about it” is something LRH talked in the study tapes about (the so called first barrier to study).
Thanks for clarifying.
Using the tone-scale for that purpose is indeed less efficient than the micro-expressions.
However I think that the tone-scale is not reducible to that purpose, hence it is not easy to compare both things in a statement like the one above.
Hahaha!
I knew there was something to it.
🙂
Comparing Paulette Cooper and Oral Mysticism is like comparing apples and oranges. The former never tried Scientology and only ever fought it. The latter partook of it and understands its processes – and probably better than most understands its dark sides. So, on the question I posed, the former has nothing to bring to the table while the latter has a lot. Obsessing with Ron’s alleged crimes is non-sequitur to the topic at hand.
In the HCOB “OT MAXIMS” LRH speaks about the danger of power.
But thanks.
Understood. Thanks.
I watched the video and found it very insightful, especially the part about lying being a cooperative activity. How true that when we have something we want, a strong desire, we become party to the lies that promise fulfillment. Scientology plays to this perfectly. Ron promises many things that we want to believe so much that we find excuses for the lack of evidence and block out the discrepancies from our universe.
This is also very apparent in dating. We want to believe that we are the special one, so we overlook all rational and objective indicators that it might not be a good match.
Okeedokee guys, I get your points of view.
Thank you for the communication.
What border? The one 100 km’s away from the real one?
Watch out for the black helicopters.
MaBű – Thank you for the additional detail. I knew some of the subject but not near the detail of how it was done.
Thank you Oraclemysticism for your reply.
you have a lot of experience, thanks for sharing it with me.
I think a person with non violence as a philosophy would oppose it. I think society in general has opposed Scientology’s attack dog mentality.
I am a supportive critic. I am child’s play compared to what society thinks of this movement and it’s propensity for violence. It’s history has consistently demonstrated this fact.
I get that my view is not agreed with. I am ok with that. Clarity over agreement.
One last thought: why would Ron write in Bolivar that those supporting power should do away with enemies and not let power know what they are doing?
My view is that he would never have to lie in court because he would not know.
And if he did not personally engage in violent retribution, he gave the green light for others to do it for him. That is even worse than doing it yourself in my view.
I have put forth my views. That is all I can do.
I believe a pulling of the third dynamic overts are in order, for healing.
Peace Out Bros!
Hi Michael, you look very good in that pict.
Yes the postulate is a very interesting subject/word. I actually
went over this in a previous comment here a while ago. IMHO
it goes back to Axiom 1. BUT it also has to be in tandem with
the tone scale. In other words way up to really take effect in the
physical universe. Ron did not mean (IMHO) that a clean decision
is the same as a clean postulate. Nor did he mean the scientific
definition of postulate. Postulate does not have mechanics
involved as it is far removed from the PU. Even the word’s
“philosophical” definitions under mechanical does not fit. Tone 40
and the word intention fits. BUT how can you explain in earth
terms what emanates from a spirit more than in earth terms.
LRH came as close as you can come. Plus with the Scio axioms
it all makes sense with something that essentially does not make
sense.
I would like John P. (this is not attacking you, as i really like
your comments) explain how an average college student
could after about 50 hours of auditing be able to read minds,
transfer thoughts to others, know what people would do
physically before they did it, be able to overcome time, live
for a long time (and never feeling better) without food or sleep,
and be able to do it over and over and verify it in the physical
universe, be able to beat a pro chess player even though hardly
knowing how to move the pieces. Well, all that comes from wins
I had from Scient. auditing. Must say though that most of these
abilities did not stay. It was a temp key-out for about a month
but it made me stick with the subject as I wanted others to have
similar wins.
Recently have had wins with animals (horses, dogs) trying to be
as tone 40 as i can in my interactions with them (I am no horse
whisperer). Of course as Dan Koon mentioned also trying to be
as good of an example as possible what a Scientologist is all about.
I am mid OT IV and have had tons of FPRD plus did the cl VI
Internship in 1975 and then auditing maybe 30,000 hours.
“One last thought: why would Ron write in Bolivar that those supporting power should do away with enemies and not let power know what they are doing?
My view is that he would never have to lie in court because he would not know.”
No. It’s because you keep bullshit off the plate of executives.
You need really to understand Power as a flow. Don’t take the narrative too literally if you really want to get the concept of the 3d power formula.
Thanks, MaBű. That’s exactly the kind of thing I wondered about, and it makes that technology credible. Awesome how much data you have accumulated! 🙂
Karen andSupere Aude, Thanks for the definitions. I am not very computer savvy.
Otto
A few things that I would like to comment on here.
Yes, I agree that tone levels have spirituality woven into them. But “tone” is likely the very carrier wave that bodies use to communicate internally and externally, for the most part. It appears to be emotional tone that determines the body’s response to various situations. Emotional tone sets the “tone” of the actions taken.
I would also hazard a guess that it is more “emotional tone” than “the brain” that produces micro expression. I am pretty sure that you are looking at a sub awareness level when you look at micro expression, likely even body entity based. (note that body entities have the characteristics of Theta also.) Reason does not seem to come into it.
However, you ask: “Where is the spirituality in micro expression technology? How do you spot a thetan below zero or above 4 in micro expression? Just asking.”
Well, it is possible that you can’t, but consider this. Do you consider that you could tell anything about the being living in a house, by looking at the house and garden? ( You are just looking at raw MEST. Where is the spirituality in that?)
I suggest you might be able to surmise quite a bit, if you look deeper than just at the fact there is a structure and some plants. Look for the QUALITIES displayed. This is where you will get a glimpse of the qualities of the being who creates it.
The state of a being tends to be reflected in the environment that he creates. A confused or chaotic being will have a confused and chaotic mind, and a confused and chaotic environment. It may be very obvious or very subtle, but when you look at how a being handles his MEST, you are looking at the beings “operating state”, getting a glimpse at his “emotional tone” and perhaps even his spiritual awareness.
(It is easily demonstrable that, by nothing more complicated than having a being put order into his environment {his MEST} you can help him bring order into his thoughts or mind, and bring himself up-tone.)
Did that do anything to help give some possibilities for an answer to your question?
Eric S
The C of $ and CCHR do not deliver whats promised.
The real story is D.M. is out of Scotch and its the Publics fault.
Yes, I’m familiar with the tone scale data in both POW and the 8-8008 chapter on the sub-zero tone scale, where LRH says that there are two positions for any individual on the tone scale – the thetan-plus-body tone and the position of the thetan himself. But, as he also stated in that chapter, and as you too have observed, most thetans are in the sub-zero range – so that in itself would not make DM unusual.
Actually, I get that we are discussing two different things. Where I stated that DM’s tone level (in the interview with Ted Koppel) seemed to be at strong interest, I wasn’t referring to the thetan tone level. And to be frank, I don’t see how one can perceive a being’s/thetan’s tone level on a video or from a photo – only the thetan-plus-body tone, because body indicators are the only things being transmitted in those media, at least as far as I personally am able to perceive. In person might be a different story.
You also wrote: “Just for a test, open a newspaper and look if you find any traces of thetans without affinity or responsibility. Or compare it with ‘How would they have acted if they had some affinity or responsibility?'”
Both affinity and responsibility are plotted on the thetan-plus-body scale (on the Chart of Human Evaluation) – and can be positive or negative, i.e. “warmth” or no warmth, responsible or irresponsible, depending on the specific position on that scale.
Do you realize that this footage was obscured from vision and the world before Anonymous spread it all on the internet.
CCHR is a cover group. A
ll you have to do is ask them who they represent and what is their purpose..
“Pink legs” are “bullshit”?
Make a person sane follows the same route to making a person insane.
per L Ron Hubbard
“Scientology management was a breeding ground for accomplished liars.’
It depends on who the executive is and what the game is about.
The narrative is not based on a monastery.
Thanks, but not really. My point was that the tone scale has so much more in it, than micro expression, and that the two technologies are entirely different.
CCHR is a real fucked up organization bleeding your well earned dollars out of your pocket for David Miscavige expensive Scotsch Habbit.
Deliver more story plox
We’ve got 3 seasons over here love
And thank you for your communication Brian. I did get your points. I did not get so noisy from lack of ARC for you. It saddens me to know you discount all of the value I know it is possible for you to experience.
I’ve got a weed growing in my back yard that is wholly innocent. That is more or less all it has to offer. Obviously as life forms mutate into higher forms of talent skills and abilities, there is more room for more flaws. Great men have great flaws.
We walk into buildings everyday and use them without regard as to the ethics and morals of the architect down to the groundskeeper, that put the building there and maintain it. The building is there, it works as shelter, so we make use of it. We drive on roads without regard as to the people that paved them. We sit down to eat glad for the food not knowing if the farmer that harvested it, has bodies buried out in the field.
When someone gets murdered in a house, we don’t tear the house down. If someone jumps off a building, we don’t tear the building down. If someone jumps off a bridge, we don’t tear the bridge down. If a bird shits on the crop, we down burn the harvest down. If a few ears of corn rot, we don’t waste the entire lot.
You can be forgiving of the people that apply these kinds of sensibilities to the field of knowledge and exploration of the supernatural.
OT 8
http://www.dalailama.com/news/post/104-how-thinking-can-change-the-brain
20 Jan 2007 (Sharon Begley, Wall Street Journal) Dalai Lama helps scientists show the power of the mind to sculpt our gray matter.
Although science and religion are often in conflict, the Dalai Lama takes a different approach. Every year or so the head of Tibetan Buddhism invites a group of scientists to his home in Dharamsala, in Northern India, to discuss their work and how Buddhism might contribute to it.
In 2004 the subject was neuroplasticity, the ability of the brain to change its structure and function in response to experience. The following are vignettes adapted from ‘Train Your Mind, Change Your Brain,’ which describes this emerging area of science:
The Dalai Lama, who had watched a brain operation during a visit to an American medical school over a decade earlier, asked the surgeons a startling question: Can the mind shape brain matter?
Over the years, he said, neuroscientists had explained to him that mental experiences reflect chemical and electrical changes in the brain. When electrical impulses zip through our visual cortex, for instance, we see; when neurochemicals course through the limbic system we feel.
But something had always bothered him about this explanation, the Dalai Lama said. Could it work the other way around? That is, in addition to the brain giving rise to thoughts and hopes and beliefs and emotions that add up to this thing we call the mind, maybe the mind also acts back on the brain to cause physical changes in the very matter that created it. If so, then pure thought would change the brain’s activity, its circuits or even its structure.
One brain surgeon hardly paused. Physical states give rise to mental states, he asserted; ‘downward’ causation from the mental to the physical is not possible. The Dalai Lama let the matter drop. This wasn’t the first time a man of science had dismissed the possibility that the mind can change the brain. But ‘I thought then and still think that there is yet no scientific basis for such a categorical claim,’ he later explained. ‘I am interested in the extent to which the mind itself, and specific subtle thoughts, may have an influence upon the brain.’
The Dalai Lama had put his finger on an emerging revolution in brain research. In the last decade of the 20th century, neuroscientists overthrew the dogma that the adult brain can’t change. To the contrary, its structure and activity can morph in response to experience, an ability called neuroplasticity. The discovery has led to promising new treatments for children with dyslexia and for stroke patients, among others.
But the brain changes that were discovered in the first rounds of the neuroplasticity revolution reflected input from the outside world. For instance, certain synthesized speech can alter the auditory cortex of dyslexic kids in a way that lets their brains hear previously garbled syllables; intensely practiced movements can alter the motor cortex of stroke patients and allow them to move once paralyzed arms or legs.
The kind of change the Dalai Lama asked about was different. It would come from inside. Something as intangible and insubstantial as a thought would rewire the brain. To the mandarins of neuroscience, the very idea seemed as likely as the wings of a butterfly leaving a dent on an armored tank.
Neuroscientist Helen Mayberg had not endeared herself to the pharmaceutical industry by discovering, in 2002, that inert pills — placebos — work the same way on the brains of depressed people as antidepressants do. Activity in the frontal cortex, the seat of higher thought, increased; activity in limbic regions, which specialize in emotions, fell. She figured that cognitive-behavioral therapy, in which patients learn to think about their thoughts differently, would act by the same mechanism.
At the University of Toronto, Dr. Mayberg, Zindel Segal and their colleagues first used brain imaging to measure activity in the brains of depressed adults. Some of these volunteers then received paroxetine (the generic name of the antidepressant Paxil), while others underwent 15 to 20 sessions of cognitive-behavior therapy, learning not to catastrophize. That is, they were taught to break their habit of interpreting every little setback as a calamity, as when they conclude from a lousy date that no one will ever love them.
All the patients’ depression lifted, regardless of whether their brains were infused with a powerful drug or with a different way of thinking. Yet the only ‘drugs’ that the cognitive-therapy group received were their own thoughts.
The scientists scanned their patients’ brains again, expecting that the changes would be the same no matter which treatment they received, as Dr. Mayberg had found in her placebo study. But no. ‘We were totally dead wrong,’ she says. Cognitive-behavior therapy muted overactivity in the frontal cortex, the seat of reasoning, logic, analysis and higher thought. The antidepressant raised activity there. Cognitive-behavior therapy raised activity in the limbic system, the brain’s emotion center. The drug lowered activity there.
With cognitive therapy, says Dr. Mayberg, the brain is rewired ‘to adopt different thinking circuits.’
Such discoveries of how the mind can change the brain have a spooky quality that makes you want to cue the ‘Twilight Zone’ theme, but they rest on a solid foundation of animal studies. Attention, for instance, seems like one of those ephemeral things that comes and goes in the mind but has no real physical presence. Yet attention can alter the layout of the brain as powerfully as a sculptor’s knife can alter a slab of stone.
That was shown dramatically in an experiment with monkeys in 1993. Scientists at the University of California, San Francisco, rigged up a device that tapped monkeys’ fingers 100 minutes a day every day. As this bizarre dance was playing on their fingers, the monkeys heard sounds through headphones. Some of the monkeys were taught: Ignore the sounds and pay attention to what you feel on your fingers, because when you tell us it changes we’ll reward you with a sip of juice. Other monkeys were taught: Pay attention to the sound, and if you indicate when it changes you’ll get juice.
After six weeks, the scientists compared the monkeys’ brains. Usually, when a spot on the skin receives unusual amounts of stimulation, the amount of cortex that processes touch expands. That was what the scientists found in the monkeys that paid attention to the taps: The somatosensory region that processes information from the fingers doubled or tripled. But when the monkeys paid attention to the sounds, there was no such expansion. Instead, the region of their auditory cortex that processes the frequency they heard increased.
Through attention, UCSF’s Michael Merzenich and a colleague wrote, ‘We choose and sculpt how our ever-changing minds will work, we choose who we will be the next moment in a very real sense, and these choices are left embossed in physical form on our material selves.’
The discovery that neuroplasticity cannot occur without attention has important implications. If a skill becomes so routine you can do it on autopilot, practicing it will no longer change the brain. And if you take up mental exercises to keep your brain young, they will not be as effective if you become able to do them without paying much attention.
Since the 1990s, the Dalai Lama had been lending monks and lamas to neuroscientists for studies of how meditation alters activity in the brain. The idea was not to document brain changes during meditation but to see whether such mental training produces enduring changes in the brain.
All the Buddhist ‘adepts’ — experienced meditators — who lent their brains to science had practiced meditation for at least 10,000 hours. One by one, they made their way to the basement lab of Richard Davidson at the University of Wisconsin, Madison. He and his colleagues wired them up like latter-day Medusas, a tangle of wires snaking from their scalps to the lectroencephalograph that would record their brain waves.
Eight Buddhist adepts and 10 volunteers who had had a crash course in meditation engaged in the form of meditation called nonreferential compassion. In this state, the meditator focuses on unlimited compassion and loving kindness toward all living beings.
As the volunteers began meditating, one kind of brain wave grew exceptionally strong: gamma waves. These, scientists believe, are a signature of neuronal activity that knits together far-flung circuits — consciousness, in a sense. Gamma waves appear when the brain brings together different features of an object, such as look, feel, sound and other attributes that lead the brain to its aha moment of, yup, that’s an armadillo.
Some of the novices ‘showed a slight but significant increase in the gamma signal,’ Prof. Davidson explained to the Dalai Lama. But at the moment the monks switched on compassion meditation, the gamma signal began rising and kept rising. On its own, that is hardly astounding: Everything the mind does has a physical correlate, so the gamma waves (much more intense than in the novice meditators) might just have been the mark of compassion meditation.
Except for one thing. In between meditations, the gamma signal in the monks never died down. Even when they were not meditating, their brains were different from the novices’ brains, marked by waves associated with perception, problem solving and consciousness. Moreover, the more hours of meditation training a monk had had, the stronger and more enduring the gamma signal.
It was something Prof. Davidson had been seeking since he trekked into the hills above Dharamsala to study lamas and monks: evidence that mental training can create an enduring brain trait.
Prof. Davidson then used fMRI imaging to detect which regions of the monks’ and novices’ brains became active during compassion meditation. The brains of all the subjects showed activity in regions that monitor one’s emotions, plan movements, and generate positive feelings such as happiness. Regions that keep track of what is self and what is other became quieter, as if during compassion meditation the subjects opened their minds and hearts to others.
More interesting were the differences between the monks and the novices. The monks had much greater activation in brain regions called the right insula and caudate, a network that underlies empathy and maternal love. They also had stronger connections from the frontal regions to the emotion regions, which is the pathway by which higher thought can control emotions.
In each case, monks with the most hours of meditation showed the most dramatic brain changes. That was a strong hint that mental training makes it easier for the brain to turn on circuits that underlie compassion and empathy.
‘This positive state is a skill that can be trained,’ Prof. Davidson says. ‘Our findings clearly indicate that meditation can change the function of the brain in an enduring way.’
Congratulations, Catina. Enjoy your new freedom and your many friends.
Perhaps your purpose as prosecutor and investigator and crime fighter is the other side of some coin you have already spent. Where else would you be able to know about that if not with an auditor? You can use Scientology to know about yourself instead of knowing about someone else.
Michael, I’ve thought about that too and it seems to me that LRH inferred the mechanics of a postulate and his inferences were exactly what quantum physics now talks about as regards the role of observation by “Consciousness”. That is to say, a postulate is basically a decision (per defs in Tech Dict). Likewise, observation by Consciousness is also a decision (to “measure”) and the result of that decision is a coalescence or condensation of energy; similarly, a postulate (thought or decision) also results in an energy manifestation (even a concept is defined as “a high-wave thought”). Furthermore, in a “continuing postulate”, which is the definition of a consideration, we have the condition of create-create-create, i.e. a continuous creation of a particular postulate.
Not long ago I was thinking of the datum in NED that “postulate off equals erasure”. That basically says that when the create-create-create ceases, so does the continuous creation of the postulate. This is also described as an as-isness. Even the physical universe is described by LRH as being continuously created (or we could say continuously re-created) because of continuously created postulates/considerations (Scn 8-8008) – or in QM terms, continuous decisions and condensations.
Remember that, People can suprise you, for the good or the better, cold eyes are ……………. I hop I do not have cold eyes
Oracle, I do believe that you have some wrong info here. The policy letter that introduced the idea that you are responsible for any outness or crime you fail to report was the HCO PL Knowledge Reports. It also removed any distinction between staff, public or customer. I thought it was written by DM based on the date it was issued, but Mike Rinder (as I recall it was Mike) corrected me on that misunderstanding, and says that it was, indeed, LRH that wrote it.
Finding that out really messed up my — DM did it all — theory. I consider the policy letter Knowledge Reports to be one of the more insane policy letters ever issued. It makes all customers and public = staff and SO execs. It makes a public Scientologist responsible for the behavior and actions of the PES AOLA, for example — that is patently absurd. Public have no statistics for ethics protection, so they are simply clay pigeons, and on it goes. Under that policy letter there are no public, no customers and failure to write reports = you are equally guilty of whatever you failed to write up. IMO that is just plain oppressive and is exactly what was going on in Nazi Germany and in many a totalitarian culture based on fear and threats.
One who is knowledgable about the Tone Scale and noticing where potentially someone they encounter is on the Tone Scale would certainly stand to gain from any additional useful knowledge and/or insight that enables them to more accurately perceive and classify. I don’t necessarily feel that one applying knowledge, insight, discoveries outside of what LRH wrote in regards to reading people’s mental/emotional state a la the Tone Scale automatically means a squirrelling of LRH Tech. No more than taking time out of your day to meditate the old fashioned Buddhist way means you’re squirrelling Tech on TRs. I think it comes down to whether one set of tech works along side another or instead functions to interfere, dilute or otherwise serve to diminish.
One always has to consider source of such knowledge, in and about reading people’s mental/emotional state, and weigh in with their own logic and scientific appraisal of the usefulness of such knowledge (actually this goes for all, both LRH Tech and non). This includes whatever limitations this knowledge has in application as well as the possible misuse and misapplication of such knowledge. The science of reading a person’s mental/emotional state, is of course limited to the abilities of the reader as well. You don’t want “OMG! I asked that person what time it was and they wiggled their nose to the left and…I KNOW NOW THEY’RE AN SP!” or similar nonsense. I think whatever knowledge and scientific discoveries that are out there in reading body language and facial expressions should be taken as a rough guide that will hopefully lead you to a more accurate analysis. But by no means an absolute 100% accurate method of judging and/or stigmatizing others.
As for electronic facial recognition software being used in the process of intel gathering, well I can almost guarantee you such technology is already in full unabated use by certain divisions of certain governments and has been covertly, and in some cases not so, for some time. There is currently commercial software that does the same, and many people suscribe to it under the idea of social networking and organization of personal data. The TV show Person of Interest is not that far off from reality as one would hope. I’m no fan of this technology due to it’s high potential of abuse of the rights and freedoms of law abiding citizens. Just because we can doesn’t mean we should. Irregardless the tech is there, it’s going to be used whether we are aware of it and condone it or not.
gretchen – Glad to help. You may want to keep handy the following:
http://www.webopedia.com/quick_ref/textmessageabbreviations.asp
– you will find yourself magically more computer savvy.
Yep Marty, the way out is the way up.
Here’s some young men who haven’t been subjected to the wholesale New World Order system of things. Enjoy!
If you think they are ‘entirely different’ then I believe your chances of finding the unification theory – or whatever it is you think the hubbell telescope is going to show us – are slim and none.
Gern – In the US, the border enforcement authority of Border Patrol, DHS (Dept of Homeland Security), etc., extends 100 miles from any border and from any ocean water/land area. Whether any of us feel it is correct the fact is that is the true jurisdiction. If this kid doesn’t want this interraction he can stay 100 miles away or move.
Don’t get hung up on where the physical international border is – what is applied here is the jurisdiction border which extends inland 100 miles. I am sure this kid knew it as he very exactly described where he was as though he was justified. This “kid” is not moving on up to anywhere and that is the purpose of this post.
need to post tjhis because I can, and I may nod agree but he deserves covarage, not many people understand that about me
Cute, we need to study the mind or the spirit, ‘the niracle of love by the Eurithmics
Have you been reading my mind? That’s exactly my think. Not to mention that one would think that the engineer who designed the human genome would probably posses such knowledge and more. I think we are in the stone age. Here we are with our silly little silicon based clumsy computer technology thinking we are so advanced. LOL just LOL
HCOB Staff Member Reports 1 May 65
TO:
REMIMEO
STAFF MEMBER HATS
EXECUTIVE HATS
(Note, it does not say “public hat”. “public hats” are defined under P.C. and Student Hats as the PURPOSE of the Org is to SELL and DELIVER TRAINING and AUDITING to the public. Their HAT is to buy training and auditing and move up the bridge)
” 21. Knowledge Report. On noting some investigation is in progress and having data on it of value to ethics.”
This is in basic STAFF VOLUME 0. STAFF volume.
You are NOT supposed to write a K.R. on ANYBODY unless an INVESTIGATION IS IN PROGRESS.
Where / how is this info I have wrong? This is how it was when I got involved in Scientology. And the essay “knowledge Reports” was not in any copy of the Ethics book I first bought.
Did you notice, the ethics book has gotten thicker, and thicker and thicker through time? The more Scientology “expands”, so does the ethics book! The more clears that get made, the fatter the ethics becomes! Heeeeeyyyy, something doesn’t add up here!
Laughter!
I DO get your point. By adding the essay “knowledge reports” to the ethics book, it places the hat of “cop” and “spy” on all Scientologists.
One of the sickest uses of this was a p.c. at the base who furiously wrote kr’s on her husband with out even giving him a copy! They would all be waiting for him when he arrived at the base. She used the Church as a tool to dominate her husband.
Like everything else in Scientology, it can be used to assist things that assist survival and inhibit things that inhibit survival and the other ways around by someone who chooses not to be sane.
K.R.’s should by the very name, KNOWLEDGE, help people to know how to know .
But you get people in this theater that are NOT here to know how to know and actually work very hard to make sure people DON”T KNOW.
There are threats in the essay “Knowledge Reports” such as “you will be an accessory if you don’t write up a report” etc etc. It also says “permissiveness is suicide” yet we have the CDEI scale where he suggests the opposite.
I really don’t know who we wrote that essay for. I did not see it in his writing. For all I know it was a dispatch sent to the CMO during an investigation. I don’t even know when it got included in the ethics book and what printing / edition. It is so out of context with other writings it’s like there is missing data . And how the hell did the Org Board chart end up in the ethics book? What the hell made that a biblical piece of ethics? What the hell is the bolivar fairy tale doing in it? Suggesting Manuela fuck her lover’s friends behind his back for favors right after the chapter on conditions? How is anybody going to fuck for favors if everyone is writing KR’s? You can’t even apply the principles of Bolivar if you are writing KR’s.
This book is a product of David Miscavige. The alter is and opinion in it extends from cover to cover. Very creepy. Very fat with “special interest” fumes all around it.
I suggest people go over to Ebay and get one of the originals.
I meant, I don’t know who HE wrote that essay for.
Aristotle’s ” Nicomachean Ethics” is still considered a valuable piece of literature, and here goes David stuffing the Ethics book with an Org Board Chart! And a “fucking for favors” reference!
Otto
Yes, I agree that “the tone scale has so much more in it, than micro expression,…” but obviously i do not consider they are entirely different. I do get however, that that is how you feel about it.
Another point about micro expression and its relationship to theta, that I noticed, is that I figure that one could easily consider that when the needle on an e-meter responds you are looking at what might be considered a “micro-expression” though perhaps only observable through the use of electronic feedback.
I would posit that with the use of an e-meter as a feedback tool, to monitor the electrical phenomena going on internally, while at the same time carefully observing the person being monitored (with micro expression in mind), one could likely become very precise at detecting many of the needle phenomena through micro expressions that show up.
That thought has actually “brought in my indicators”. I will have to keep that one in mind when I have people on the meter. I suspect that even putting ones attention on this, as a meter operator, would almost certainly enhance the auditor’s observation of the preclear, and thereby improve his ability to duplicate the preclear, and potentially improve session results.
Of course, once the skills are developed, they can be used in any social encounter to improve communication.
Thanks for the food for thought.
Eric S
Cat Daddy
Very interesting indeed!
That is all very real to me. I am of the “use it or lose it” school. I also extend this with a liberal dose of “function monitors structure”. (the body tends to become what is needed to carry out the activities demanded of it. For instance, weight training produces muscle mass so that it is easier to lift heaver things, repeatedly slamming your finger in the door produces scar tissue and callouses in order to limit damage in the future.)
It is interesting to have “scientific evidence” confirm this. The only thing that stopped them before now was their own fixed ideas.
It is the same thing that is crippling the current regime of the Church of Scientology. To the degree that they will not look at or acknowledge anything “new”, they are unlikely to find anything “new”, and thus will be unable to change or adapt to a changing environment.
Eric S
You might find this interesting also. Did you ever see Hubbard’s original Condition of Enemy and Treason? It is in the earlier books.
“Condition of Enemy
When a person is an avowed and knowing enemy of an individual, as group, project or org, a condition of enemy exists.
The formula is:
1. Examine oneself and one’s mind or have it examined to be sure that ones’ attitude is not based on prejudice or aberration or mere similarity to something else.
2. Decide if one’s reaction to the individual , group, project or org is based on one’s personal fear or the urging of others or on actual menace.
3. Assume the Condition of Doubt and apply it’s formula.”
L.R.H.
The original treason:
“Condition Of Treason
When one knowingly takes the pay or favours of a group’s or project’s enemies while appearing to be a friend of or part of the group or project, the Condition is Treason.
1. Deliver a paralyzing blow to the enemies of the group one has worked against and betrayed.
2. Perform a self damaging act that furthers the purposes and or objectives of the group one has betrayed.
3. Inform the group, project or org one has betrayed of one’s previous betrayal and 1 and 2 above and petition each member for forgiveness .
4. Abide by their reaction or decision.”
L.R.H.
On L10 a person handles his urges to do himself in. On the original treason formula you had to dramatize them to move into a higher condition! “perform a self damaging act” . That is treason to ONESELF.
The thing is, on these conditions people do have to draw a line and get purposeful with assisting things which assist survival, and inhibiting things which inhibit survival. That is sanity.
Well, what if you get someone that can NOT INTEGRATE these formulas with other datum so the purpose and reason becomes clear? They just “do it because Hubbard said so”.
As you can see, a lot of people, especially Sea Org Members and Scientologists, have a serious problem INHIBITING things which INHIBIT SURVIVAL.
And that is exactly the weakness David Miscavige plays upon to run his games.
And that is why the field of Corp. Scientology had turned into a looney cult.
1. You have a group of people there that “believe” in things that they don’t understand.
2. You have Miscavige taking advantage of all of that.
And the fanatics, who don’t understand and don’t think, and integrate and can’t apply, are running around inhibiting things which assist survival, and assisting things that inhibit survival.
You show me someone wallowing in lower conditions. I will show you someone who is inhibiting things which assist survival, and assisting things which inhibit survival.
This is how undesirable conditions are created.
This is what Hubbard was talking about when he said “Total permissiveness is suicide” But how does this translate to the fanatic who can’t integrate or connect dots with knowledge?
“If Hubbard didn’t give his permission, I can’t do it.” “If nobody in the church gives me permission to fight back, I can’t.”
You see how you can give 1000 people sitting in a auditorium a few lines of truth on a index card and each one of them is going to take it in, in a different way?
The Ethics book issued by David Miscavige demands “allegiance”. NOT ETHICS. It is not a book. It’s a letter of demand! A “rule” book. That is so far away from the subject of Ethics I can’t begin to tell you.
In truth, all one needs to know about ethics, one can gleam from Hubbard’s definition of sanity. Assist things which assist survival. Inhibit things that inhibit survival.
That’s it. That is a personal obligation for anyone that wants to make the world a better place. Now you go back outside and take a look at the world, and you will see that it is quite full of mostly ethical people that are quite reasonable and stable.
The pressure put upon these people at election time, just to know they are making the right choice, to vote for the man that will assist things that assist survival, is quite apparent. Who votes for the man who makes it clear he is going to assist things which inhibit survival?
Nobody.
The Church bitches about schools. They didn’t make a better system. The Sea Org members at Flag sent their kids to the public school. If their own kids didn’t matter enough to build a better system, why are they out here flogging “wogs” for the workable system they have?
The Church of Scientology can not be grateful for anything this world has to offer at this time, unless it is check, cash, or credit card. Even then the “member” giving it is regarded as a parasite.
Look at the people leaving that can’t be grateful for all of the Scientology going on out here in the world by the Freezoners and Independents. For all of the hard work Marty has done.
There is this INGRATITUDE for anything outside of the walls around that culture that is almost hateful. Everything is viewed as a “menacing particle”. There is no ARC to the world.
No, that did not come from Hubbard.
He wrote:
“Income comes from:
1. Outflow.
2. Expert handling of people.
3. Book sales.
4.Good Affinity Reality and Communication with the World.
5. Good Service.
The Church does not expertly handle people. Outflow to anybody. Offer Good Service , and it is totally ARC broken with the world. The books have been used to cancel the certs of every auditor.
And this is WHY David has formed begging units like CCHR, IAS, ABLE, IDEAL ORGS, etc etc. And instead of providing any valuable exchange as Hubbard listed above, they are restimulating people.
And for sure the corp Scn’s attitude is based on prejudices and aberrations and mere similarities to other Scientologists and former worlds. Exactly what Hubbard warned about in his original enemy formula.
Eli
Hi.
Yes, it is always a danger for most any technology that those of ill intent will use it for ill. That is what they intend in their use of every tool.
However, with that in mind, I can definitely see the benefits of this tool. I see this tool in somewhat the same light as I do some of Scientology technologies. They also can be used (misused) to harm, but when used appropriately, can assist in the freeing of beings.
Eric S
I’ve watched Marty get attacked for the most fundamental message that translates through this blog. “There is a lot to be grateful for.”
Pointing out the good things and books and people, even music, we can be grateful for. Trying to give people suffering from losses, a little havingness and ARC with the world. Coaxing them to reach. Pointing out things they can have ARC for. Pointing out how the rest of the world belongs to them too and how they CAN HAVE from it. And, they have every right to have!
This scared the hell out of people indoctrinated in the idea that there is nothing outside of a Scientology Organization or group to be grateful for.
This is really the darkest side of the whole culture and how it comes to create viscous people.
Laughter! I think he got declared for running CAN HAVES, havingness assists, locationals, and bring up people’s ARC for the world! How is that for people that fall into Scientology and don’t understand what it is?
You see, just as I said, Lars, you give no explanation of the postulate phenomenon just as you were taught. Why? Because a postulate, a self-created truth is a product of a different universe and we just don’t have the words. That is incorrect. The creative thought is a product of a different universe but it impinges on the PU in the most physical and mechanical way. It comes in on energy level. The exact mechanics are completely unexplained in Scn.
Thank you, Marildi. That is really something but not, adequate, very clear and it is even misleading or contradictory to the notion that in the Theta universe there is no time. So create-create-create is always the same instant of creation.
Monte writes, and I agree: “Marty, this blog has evolved into a remarkable forum. You and your creation serve as a beautiful demo of the law of attraction. It is uplifting to visit and engage here.” In the 2 months since I’ve known this site I’ve seen it grow in the aspirational qualities of the content and conversations. Its comforting that people who leave new religious movements find their own way to be inspired, lead noble and inspired lives, and keep “climbing higher”.
I know from personal experience that its tempting to keep[looking back at the religious movement one left, and to endlessly rave and rant. But this creates more misery (I’ve done that and my anger was destroying my mental and emotional health). At some point one has to move on and find one’s path “out and up”. The challenge is in discovering and embracing a new journey is more balanced, inclusive, accepting, harmonious. A journey rooted in humanness and empathy. A journey filled with harmony, beauty, peace. A journey that nurtures the soul, the mind and the body. A journey where we can find our true self. A journey that brings an inner smile into our life.
Monte further writes that we can “discuss and debate on your blog….. without having a need, want, desire or compulsion to change one another’s mind or interfere with another’s trajectory in life, we can come together to openly, and void of onerous restrictions, wonder about all manner of stuff. Thus, stretch our perspectives for all they’re worth.”
That’s also my experience. If you can keep growing this blog in the direction it seems to be organically growing now, it will keep becoming an even more valuable space. Like a garden where a person can go every day and read some inspiring new writings, get exposed to new ideas, see new perspectives and get nurtured by clarity coming from all kinds of different angles.
I think you are right. And that seems to leak into lower orgs as well.
Yes, I really liked him. I was the one who used to cram
Dick and he was one of the easiest cramming cycles I
ever did. He knew the Les Dane book inside out and could
tell me in an instance what paragraph he had violated. I
sometimes sat behind a pony wall and listen to his reg
cycles and have to admit I was in awe.
Dick is a tough man and a survivor so don’t worry.
Bravo Catina! A step you will find rewarding and probably a new beginning.
I reviewed the bulletin and it does seem that harmony factors in with power:
“THE POWER (defined as light-year kilotons per microsecond) OF A THETAN IS MEASURED BY NOTHING ELSE THAN THE DISTANCE (defined as spherical spatial length) AROUND HIM IN HIS ENVIRONMENT THAT HE CAN CONTROL.
“And that is the power of a thetan; the totality of it, believe it or not.
“WHEN A THETAN EXERTS THIS POWER UNCLEVERLY, HE BRINGS ABOUT DESTRUCTION…
“GOOD CONTROL: Harmonious alignment.
“BAD CONTROL: Disharmonious alignment”… (HCOB 10 Aug 82)
And you’re welcome. 🙂
Watch out for your constitutional rights! You enjoy a great deal of freedom in your society right now; that freedom is being taken away, year by year, because .. of course .. people such as yourself are letting it happen.
You see “paranoid conspiracy freak”, I see “slow cooked frog”.
You do realize that you are describing the death of the American constitution, and justifying its eradication from society as a means of protection from tyranny?
I would hope you’d re-evaluate this position. There is absolutely *NOTHING* right about stopping American citizens 100 miles from the border, and – without probable cause – seizing them, searching them, etc.
Godwin’s Law is important, but do you really think “your papers, citizen” is something you want happening 100 miles away from the borders? Hmm… some serious lack of confront going on here, guys ..
On the one hand, complain loudly about the lives of Sea Org members, but on the other hand: its okay when the government is the tyrant? Yikes.
I know someone who posts on this very blog who I would say has a pretty good chance of actually discovering the unified field theory. Stay tuned and when he does it I’ll say I told ya so!
Marildi, you brought up an interesting point once on Geir’s blog that has relevance and may be of interest to those interested in a QM structure, or equivalent structure with theta pictures and mass.
In essence we were talking about the thetan as a probabilistic state – a potential – and the mind as the condensed (energy / mass) state of some of the recordings of theta. The recordings would be in the probabilistic state until restimulated by the mest environment at which point they become energy, or until dredged up as memory by the thetan.
Michael’s question as to the mechanism of the postulate led me to consider the thetan probabilistic / condensed state in that vein.
A thought on that comes from the analogy of a tuning fork: one side set into vibration sets the other side into a sympathetic vibration which reflects back onto the first side, re-energizing it and continuing the vibration. With a tuning fork we call that resonance. Now consider the thetan probabilistic side as one side of the fork and condensed energy as the other side. The probabilistic side, stimulated or restimulated sets up an energy condensation that then reflects back onto the probabilistic side, keeping it in “existence”. Maybe that is why an engram can tend to key out after 3-10 days – like a tuning fork, some energy is lost on each cycle and gradually it diminishes to a zero output.
Mest waves and particles have a similar behavior: they will stay wave-like or particle-like until they randomly change (rare) or (predominantly)are influenced by another mest condition to change (like a double slit experiment causing a wave condensation or particle condensation depending on how it is recorded). In the past I have called that phenomena “quantum inertia” – the tendency of a mest wave or particle to continue on its condition as a wave or particle until acted on by some external influence.
The effect of the “reflected energy” may be the mechanism that would also explain quantum inertia – the two states (probabilistic and condensed) are like the two arms of a tuning fork, each one reinforcing the other, but also able to alter depending on an “influence”. That inflence could be external (one slit / two slit, for example), or “internal” i.e. a random change during the probabilistic state. Those random changes occur – that is the nature of probability – but in the case of mest the random change is rare and the common change is due to the external influence.
If we contrast that to “life” (theta) we see the difference between theta and mest. With theta, the condensed state follows the “will” of the probabilistic state, not the reverse as with mest. Theta, as potential, “decides” and can postulate i.e. create a condensation in the mest universe. That postulate, as a condensation (mass or energy) can then reflect back on theta-the-potential (probabilistic state) in the same manner of the tuning fork, potentially keeping a condensation in existence for a period of time. A “continuing postulate” would then be a consideration that kept the “condensed state” (the mest form of the postulate) continuing. That continuing postulate could either be created-and-known, or created-and-unobserved by the thetan.
Again, in contrast to mest, this would be like saying that theta has (from its probabilistic state) more ability to start or end the condensed state than external influence has the ability to start the restimulation / condensation cycle on theta. To expand on that, we know that environmental conditions can cause an engram to go into restim and have an effect on the being: the engram has condensed into energy / mass. With an average person that restimulation will diminish and disappear typically within 3 to 10 days. A Clear can spot that restimulation and cause the restimulated energy to quickly diminish to zero. That would be one example of “being cause” over the mechanics of m. e. s. t. as regards the first dyn.
By similar mechanisms of activation or restimulation, physical universe quanta condense to wave or particle based on external force, external condition (one slit / two slit), or external energy. The wave or particle condition then reflects onto the probabilistic state (along with other external phenomena) to influence the next condensation cycle. That would be the mechanism of quantum inertia.
This model would demonstrate the distinct difference between theta and mest: the theta probabilistic state can have more influence on the condensed state than a condensation (from momentary restimulation) can have on the probabilistic state. On the other hand, with mest, it would be the condensed state and external conditions (one slit / two slit) that would predominantly define the next state and the probabilistic state would have the weakest influence (random outcome is less likely).
In summation, the condensed state of mest quanta predominantly reflect inwards on the probabilistic state and continue the condensed state. Life “postulates” outwards, condensing the condition desired by the probabilistic life force.
This is an area extensively researched by Grinder and Bandler in Neuro Linguistic Programming. Google NLP submodalities for more data.
And quite frankly, this is why hundreds of Scientologists are under the radar, off lines, out of communication and off the bridge even with people out here to help them. They just don’t want this kind of suppression on their lines again.
Neither the tone scale nor the micro expression has anything to do with my theory. My theory http://www.crestroy.com is an attempt to describe theta mathematically. Something LRH actually predicted was doable. And my theory has has nothing to do with Hubble either. The data from Hubble just indicates that my theory might be correct.
“I am going to age and die.”
You do not have to cause your body to age and cause it to die.
Great Catina! You have a lot of friends out here where you
can breathe easy. You have many friends from ABLE also
in the free world!
He already did. He defined it mathematically as zero.
And I see a glass half full kinda guy getting what he’s postulating.
Gern – Don’t both giving me a lecture. I purposely don’t live within that area. At the same time I understand that is the law. I did NOT justify anything. No lack of confront on my end so please don’t dub in anything. Just because you don’t see each American citizen on this blog jumping up and down is now reason to dub in. This is a blog by Marty and the subject is moving on up. This is not a political blog.
I suggest you please re-read this chain of comments. You have gone off on some made up idea that we, here in the US, don’t have confront, etc etc. Why don’t you just stay on the subject. You know NOTHING about me so don’t cram some made up reality my way. It is about as wanted here as any transgressions by politicians. I participate in many ways and on other blogs for any comments I have in the political arena.
If this was a perfect world we would not see a history of death, destruction, entire nations at war, etc. Just demanding one confront something other than the subject of this blog isn’t helping anything. If you wish to bring about an enforced change in this system I suggest you move, become a citizen, and then complain however you wish. Just being forceful isn’t the answer – not in the SO, not here and not in the political arena.
typos – should be “Don’t bother giving me a lecture”
Thats kinda theetie-wheetie, with all due respect. Maybe you’re not concerned by the actions of other agents on the freedoms and constitution of society. But it is an incontrovertible fact that the Church of Scientology isn’t the only criminal cult in the game. There are many, many, many other Groups with Intention, enacting their desire on the populace, either one body at a time, or ten, or twenty .. depending on the queue size in many cases: and if there is ever to be a truly new age of enlightenment, for any of us, it will be once the strata of cause and effect of these agents are made visible, clearly and with conscientious intention to *improve* the scene, rather than in fear, denial, or whatever other Black Panther mechanism we, here and now, may dramatize.
I can utterly respect your desire not to fill your Blog with conspiracy nutcase theories and all that entails, Marty; I can, however, ask that the parallels between what the Church is doing, and what the Federal Government of the United States, is doing, be made – especially in a quorum whereby actual discussion of the 3rd-dynamic scene is being made with the intent to improve.
Look, I long ago integrated myself, as a trained Scientologist, into society. I have made a long Eval of the scene, and what I know to be true is that there are very definitive Facsimiles and Computations being enacted on the stage; individuals, as well as groups, have a reactive mind, this mind can be controlled, it can be manipulated. It is a true function of the ‘natural order’ of Society that groups rise to control other groups – beyond what we have witnessed collectively together in the Church, these same issues nevertheless arise in broader society. People do criminally use Help to Control others, with Communication, for their own Interest. We live on a torrid ocean of upheaval, spiritually, when it comes to which Words are ruling the conscious present time awareness of awareness unit.
The US Federal Government, as it always does with the technology it has on its hands and in its midsts, has weaponized Scientology.
That is really the point.
I encourage you to question this theory and investigate, but for heavens sake: do not just knee-jerk into an identity/difference/similar computation about it: this is exactly the nature of the trap.
I admit that in hindsight, I am dropping the wrong valence on this conversation, Sapere Aude; no question from me that there is more clearing to be done on my particular 3rd-dynamic condition.
I have the understanding that this blog, and the community forming around it, desires actually to make some form of change about the conditions of the world around them. Scientologists, who are actually wearing the hat, are gathering here to discuss what is up, in a manner which involves indeed a great deal of freedom.
We are fortunate in this sense.
But imagine if this were to happen: DM goes bezerk, blows shit up, the whole Church goes Waco. There is a potential for it to happen; some would say, thankfully, that there are also reasons it cannot happen in present time.
However, imagine that the hatred of Scientology by general culture, today, gets bumped up a notch or two.
Are you going to feel so comfortable being stopped in the middle of nowhere, 100 miles from the border, in an utterly indefensible position, and being secreted away because of a stamp, or key, or forum post, or whatever .. that you might have made?
Perhaps those of you, like that ‘kid’ Marty refers to (he is a Reverend, by the way), who are Citizens, have no fear here. Or no worry, or concern.
Or would rather postulate that it is all benign and ‘legal’ therefore okay.
But lets wait and see. I don’t see any other attempt to reduce the hatred of Scientology. Today Islam, tomorrow who knows ..
I really rather sing this song about Scientology, personally:
Where MEST and Theta collide, we find the ties that bind, and its name is Word. It is my personal conviction that any discussion of Words in restimulation is to be a wonder! What word never made one bigger? The lovely beauty to that not-understood question, is that the answer is: none at all, and yet all at one.
Michail, thanks for the aditional data on GWB.
Actually I didn’t conclude anything.
I leave it to anyone who wants to see the video.
The only thing I repeatedly stated is,that 2 aluminium planes can’t cause 3 buildings to turn into dust.
When I first saw the incident on TV (9/11/2001) this was because a female friend of mine called me hysterically and asked me to turn on the TV. I did and when I saw the pictures, I wondered why this controlled demolition on the twin towers. You know, I saw a lot of controlled demolition of buildings when I was a kid, it was interesting to me to look on the impressive destruction of huge buildings when I was a kid. So I knew that it was one before I heard that this was caused by some kerosene or all the other official stories. It’s just impossible. The way the WTC was build you wouldn’t even collapse it with the usual method (TNT), let alone kerosene.
It may seem like chaos mongering but it is not my intent.
When a friend of mine who left the Sea Org in 2007 told me he left because his wife was pregnant and they wanted her to make an abortion I also thought he is shitting me and that this is some kind of chaos mongering (this was the first time I heard something like this).
When I then heard Miscavige is beating up his staff (on TV when Mike Rinder was interviewd 3 years ago), again – but I liked Rinder and I missed him for some years on int events, so his reports interested me.
You see, only because it sounds or looks dramatic (or unbelievable), is not necessarily a lie.
2ndxmr: “If we contrast that to ‘life’ (theta) we see the difference between theta and mest. With theta, the condensed state follows the “will” of the probabilistic state, not the reverse as with mest. “
As you know, I’m just a beginner on the subject of quantum physics but I would say that the above statement about “will” and your whole model seem to align with the excerpt below from Scn 8-8008 (in the section “Thought, Emotion and Effort”), especially if we consider the stimulus-response nature of facsimiles as following the laws of mest. (In fact, LRH states that mental energy is really no different from physical universe energy although of a finer, higher wavelength.) The excerpt below also takes into account Michael’s point about postulates not existing in time.
Start of excerpt:
————————————————-
“Thought is the highest level attainable. It is of two varieties; one is clear thought established by will which is from 10.0 up on the tone-scale, to well above 40.0; the other is thought established by counter-efforts as in homo sapiens and governed entirely on a stimulus-response basis. The first could be called self-determined thought; the second could be called reactive thought.
“Self-determined thought expresses itself as will and consists of the making of postulates based on evaluations and conclusions. Will does not exist in time when it is at this level. Homo sapiens’ will, as Schopenhauer once remarked, is stubbornness taking the place of the intellect. Will-power in homo sapiens is most ordinarily demon-circuit power. Free from the body and its ridges which themselves contain stimulus-response thought, the thetan can change his postulates by making new evaluations and conclusions, and can express his will directly. It is very difficult for a thetan inside the head and confronted by the stimulus-response ridges of the body, to do other than obey these stimulus-response flows in agreement with the MEST universe.
“Ideas are invariably and inevitably senior to force and action, if those ideas stem from self-determined thought. Ideas born out of stimulus-response thought bear at times an almost indistinguishable similarity to self-determined ideas, but are occasioned by associative logic.
“In homo sapiens, it is quite common for the person to believe himself incapable of originality. This is because the MEST universe will brook no competitor. Operating on a highly self-determined plane, originality is a simple thing to attain.
“What is called will-power, then, could have two manifestations: the first would be actual self-determined thought; the second would be a result of an enforced or inhibited thought. When homo sapiens attempts to exercise his will-power, he normally brings into flow the ridges around the body and is nullified by them and is pressed into aberrated behavior.
“Ideas, when in the form of self-determined thought, exist above the level of 40.0 on the tone-scale and extend down into the action band.
“Ideas of the stimulus-response variety are occasioned by experience as held and contained in facsimiles and are actually dictated to homo sapiens by circuits.” (Scn 8-8008)
——————————————–
I always expected that physicists and particularly theoretical physicists would drool on this datum.
Hi Michael, you explained it now quite astutely yourself. The
Theta universe is another universe separate from the physical.
The only way I have tried to explain it is looking at the axioms
and the scales and try to figure out what happened to me when
got my beginning auditing. I guess I operated from another
dimension, or at least touched it. The thing is I did not sit down
and project my thoughts or anything like that. Things just
happened when I had some desire for it to happen. What I
did struggle with after a while was ethics as after some time
I made a conscious decision not to read minds or transfer my
Intention into someone else as that seemed not right to do.
It is as outlined already a combo of the Scio axioms, scales,
Know, not know, intention, tone 40. At one point I worked out
all the axioms in clay and that was a lot of fun as well as an
eyeopener on some points.
Thanks, Michael. I may not have understood what you meant by “the mechanics of how a postulate works” since the use of the word “mechanics” seems to be in the frame of reference of “time”. In reply to 2ndxmr, just below, I posted an excerpt from Scn 8-8008 re postulates, which might be of interest to you too as it includes the fact that time doesn’t exist with regard to postulates. Here’s another excerpt from 8-8008 that may (or may not :)) speak to your comments:
Start of excerpt:
———————————————–
“Time is an abstract manifestation which has no existence beyond the idea of time occasioned by objects, where an object may be either energy or matter.
“Time can be defined as change in space, but where one attempts to define motion as change in space, the definition lacks usefulness since one does not define what is changing in space; there must be something there to change in space in order to have the illusion of time.
“As was earlier discovered in Scientology, the single arbitrary is time. This is because time did not exist as such but stemmed from havingness.
“When Man experiences ‘time’, he is experiencing havingness or not-havingness.
“Time is summed up as ‘had,’ ‘have’, and ‘will have’. Goals in the MEST universe are summed uniformly under the heading of ‘will have’. One engages in action in order to have.
“This is one of the most important points of processing. The individual has made a postulate to have and has then gained something he did not want at every single point on the time track where you find him stuck.
“Example: He desired to have a castle. He may have been engaging in an action which would gain for him a castle and was stopped and killed by an explosion which destroyed a wall before him. The explosion caught him with a postulate that he would have and gave him something he did not want. Struggling with the facsimile afterwards, the auditor will find that the incident began with the postulate to have and is now in a state of indecision since the explosion is unwanted.
“Bluntly, any and all aberrative incidents to be discovered in a preclear are a reversal of havingness where the preclear did not want something and had to have it or wanted something and could not have it or wanted something and got something else.
“The entire problem of the future is the problem of goals. The entire problem of goals is the problem of possession. The entire problem of possession is the problem of time.
“Time is impossible without possession of objects.
“Thus is resolved one of the weightier problems of the human mind. The auditor may find it difficult to encompass this principle, since time may continue to exist for him as an entity, an unknown and hovering thing. If he will use the principle that the past is had or did not have, that the present is has or does not have and that the future is will have or will not have, and that past, present and future are divided and established entirely by desire, enforcement and inhibition of havingness, he will find his preclear recovering swiftly.”
———————————————–
(Scientology 8-8008)
We do know a lot from Scientology and Dianetics of
the relationship of theta and physical universe. And
we know about the physical universe through physics,
mechanics, chemistry, math, geology, astronomy etc
and now quantum sciences but we know very little
about the theta universe, more than what LRH and
some other seers (Budda et al) have told us. When
you try to explain another universe with words that
do not define what it is, it gets hard on the brain, at
least my brain. Then that is a good time to take a
walk.
OK, I am definitely not trying to discount these blogs,
as they are very exciting and can lead nowhere else
but up! To include and expand can be more than fun!
You are still in and you don’t even know it. Such is the mind control power of Scientology.
Wrong, LRH defined it as zero and infinite. Try to explain that to a theoretical physicist in the year 2013. Every time something approaches infinite in physics today, they re-normalize, and has done it since the thirties.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renormalization
Theoretical physics still has a long way to go.
That he is! Thanks!
Sorta like what happened with Scientology.
The Word became flesh?
No, He didn’t. He defined as 0, as in opposite.
Thank you for writing this up. These studies are quite interesting. The culture of western science continues to be limited by a perspective which separates the body from the mind. Realize that, until recently, western medicine’s knowledge of the body was founded on the dessection of dead bodies. There is not a big platform for understanding how the less tangibles – the such as mind, energy, vibration, tone, harmony – effect the more grossly physical. Taoism points to how the power of water shapes and moves rock; so too the fluids of our body ( we are mostly fluid) shape and move muscle and bone; so too vibration moves these fluids. We are that vibration. We are many vibrations, which combine into tone, and tones. Sometimes, mostly actually, tones are not harmonious. Sometimes a being, without awareness, compensating for a low tone somewhere else in the body, like in an organ, like in the stomach (as in “I can’t stomach much more of this “) will tense muscles in the back as an unconscious balance.
I believe beings, all beings, seek harmony, seek equillibrium, seek homeostasis, thus are always moving, adjusting in this turning gravity world. Vibration is movement, a contraction and a release; or more mindfully stated, a withdrawal and a reach. Yin Yang. A heart beat.
Some people think it is the word. I think it is the purpose behind the word .
That clip to that song was shot in my country. The netherlands(Holland) I was 9 or 10 and I was fascinated by this song
Gern – First, I am not Marty and have never met him. The fact is there are nuts in any part of the world but they are not the majority of the people. If you live your life with integrity and set that example that is how you will be judged. You seem to feel that I, Marty and anybody else here must be responsible for anything that may possible be mis-used. Not true. I can be responsible for what I do, for what I support, for who I befriend, etc.
Sure, we could get all hung up in what the wording of a law is and how it could be mis-used. I know that. But if you want to live that way you are still stuck in a fight, battle, opterm, etc to someone/something you don’t have the ability to change. Set an example, speak with people and let them know how you feel and why. Live the change you want to see.
The fact is that the only possible future is to bring up people’s awareness of themselves and their lives and families and how they can be better. With auditing, their understanding better their own religion, etc. No, I don’t like what all of our laws say. I also know to dramatize against them is to feed the fuel for their stated necessity. Just as DM keeps the psychs, other practices, governments, etc an enemy to Scn just to keep the eyes on the moving target – when it isn’t even a valid target to begin with.
If you feel and believe that man is basically good then start looking for what is good – don’t get fully introverted in what is wrong or bad. I have been there. It is a dead end. You will simply find more of what you are seeking after.
For you to say “I don’t see any other attempt to reduce the hatred of Scientology” is very disengenuous after the thousands of pages on this blog. There are MANY who want to better conditions – but not by replacing one enemy oriented group think with another. It is done by us, coming on up to a higher awareness and state of living and then using live communication to help others and bring others up from where ever they may be.
Think about it. To get out of one quagmire just to create another endless mind-war is NOT a step in the direction of freedom to be, to do and to have. Enough said.
Yes,
In the beginning was the word – a sound, “Let me be!” as I think you put it. Then the warming and the light.
Matter vibrating.
Gern – additional reply. After I posted I read the new post by Marty re the White Elephant…. I believe if you read that new post and apply that same line of thought to our comments in this thread you will see some new viewpoints. I don’t believe you are bad and I don’t agree with all that is occurring in my land. What we can do about it is move forward, think for our self individually and ethically. I think we all want to see a better future – just can’t yet agree the easiest fastest way to get there.
Gern – the post is Elephant in the room – (Not white elephant) sorry for typo.
What about The Joy of Creating? “Force yourself to smile and you’ll soon stop frowning,” “A being causes his own feelings,” etc. Do you think that’s valid? Or is one ultimately stuck in one’s tone unless “valid therapy” is applied?
Your body is a Word, and Life is a book.
>Marty: “You are still in and you don’t even know it. Such is the mind control power of Scientology.”
Still ‘in’ where, exactly? You think your culture isn’t a cult?
Christine: What happens when we die? This is a topic I have lately become very interested in. Twenty five years ago, when I was solidly in the Scn mentality I “knew” exactly. I could causatively decide where and with whom I wanted to be reincarnated and then make it so. Now I am very much not so sure about that.
What got me thinking about mortality and what comes after was being diagnosed with Stage IV hematologic cancer. Yep, another OT VIII with a cancer diagnosis.
Now I’m grappling with treatment and its side effects but also trying to get some kind of handle on how to prepare for the end of this particular incarnation. I would love to get your thoughts on this matter.
Also I’d love to hear Marty’s thoughts on the Scn version of reincarnation; the transmigration of a discrete self into another body. I think this would be another great philosophical dissection. And I love the wisdom of all the blog followers on these matters. I always longed for real debate and discussion on Scn philosophy when I was “in” and now that I am out I get an abundance of that here and on other blogs. Marty’s is the best though because Marty is open to ideas and discussion.
Yes, thanks Marty. That was just one item that showed
Ron’s brilliance.
Excellent video. Thanks!
Marildy,
now the reason I say, power is not important to me is, that power itself needs to have a direction. Otherwise you will accumulate to much power and it may happen that you throw it into a wrong direction.
Concentrating on harmony (or harmonius alignment) you will likley generate or align power on demand.
Power has no purpose in itself.
Anyone has power.
But not anyone can channel it for good purposes. Abberation for example is when someone throws power in contra-productive directions (against himself or his symbionts).
In my own “philosophy” therefore I am not emphasizing power too much.
The above HCOB is allright. Surprisingly it is one of my favorits. But it concentrates too much on the importence of power and less on the importance of “harmonious alignment”.
Does it make any sense to you?
I see how application of the Chart of Human Evaluation (CHE) in accurately obnosing individuals could be enhanced by knowledge of micro expression tech, and how application of micro expression tech in obnosing individuals could be enhanced by a knowledge of the CHE.
Application of micro expression tech alone – without also observing the plethora of other indicators given in the CHE as well as within the book upon which the CHE was based (Science of Survival) – leaves one thinking only with preconceived and, in some cases, specious “stable” data rather than direct observation of all indicators. Accordingly, such a non-holistic approach could in fact lead to wrong conclusions. Moreover, relying upon such stable datum alone could indeed INDUCE a lack of holistic observation and thereby be used as a non-confront mechanism.
For example, the datum as mentioned in the posted TED Talk by Pamela Mayer that if a person says “I did not” instead of “I didn’t” = a lie. This is not necessarily a reliable, stand-alone datum. When people are being emphatic, they often don’t use contractions. Similarly, one episode of Lie to Me stated, for example, Clinton’s use of a pointed index finger when denying his involvement with Ms. Lewinsky to be another indicator that he was lying. Does that mean that Pamela Mayer, pointing her finger at the end of her talk when saying, “And that’s the truth” was lying as well? Another questionable datum I’ve personally observed to be unreliable is that when one looks up to the left to find an answer to a question, they’re lying. I think where one looks may have more to do with where one hangs one’s mental pictures.
Accordingly, I believe micro expression tech could be enhanced by incorporation of the CHE and accompanying drills. Doing so would itself be an application and integration of Scientology, rather than an evolution of the latter, however. If done in full compliance with empirical procedure, such a study could be of sufficient merit to be accepted for publication in the appropriate medical journal.
SKM: “Concentrating on harmony (or harmonius alignment) you will likley generate or align power on demand.”
Yes, what you say makes a lot of sense. But in “OT Maxims” I didn’t think LRH concentrated on harmony as he emphasized the following:
“WHEN GOOD SENSE AND GOOD JUDGMENT ARE NOT ADDED INTO
CONTROL, CONTROL GETS A BAD NAME.”
So it seems to me that power should only be limited by the degree of “good sense and good judgement”. And this is handled by the application of the KRC triangle – wouldn’t you agree?
I also think of this LRH statement: : “…sheer policy is poor stuff as it seeks to make a datum stand where a being should be.” (HCOPL 23 Oct 63)
‘So it seems to me that power should only be limited by the degree of “good sense and good judgement”. ‘
Yes, and you’ll find that as soon as you start to concentrate on harmonious alignment, you’ll more likley do the right thing than while concentrating on power. Power is overemphasized when you start to apply Scientology to Livingness.
SKM, I see now that I misinterpreted your earlier comments to mean that going into ARC with people may take you in a wrong direction – which can be the case, and which is why I wanted to add that the potential wrong direction can be avoided by applying “good sense and good judgment”, as LRH.wrote in that HCOB. Anyway, I think we’re actually on the same page. on this point. 🙂
However, now you say “Power is overemphasized when you start to apply Scientology to Livingness”. I take it you mean that people often do overemphasize power when applying Scientology, as opposed to Scientology itself, being applied correctly, results in an overemphasis of power. Right?
I mean, that the overall emphasiz on power in Scientology materials can result in power-hungry people, or a desparation and a struggle for power.
And although the HCOB in question is correct, again you have the emphasiz on power.
We have three characteristics of energy: a flow, a ridge and dissipation.
How would you like to use your power?
Power is only good if you have a purpose for it. Power itself is not a purpose.
I see now that I misinterpreted your earlier comments to mean that going into ARC with people may take you in a wrong direction.
No, I mean, that if you create a culture where everyone is looking for power, you’ll end up with discord (disharmony).
Kind regards,
SKM
Precisely.
SKM: “And although the HCOB in question is correct, again you have the emphasis on power.”
I do see your viewpoint , but I myself didn’t read it that way – I saw it as a description of power AND the right way to use it. On the other hand, the “overall” emphasis on power in Scn materials is another matter, and I do see that the culture which came about emphasizes power – or, quantity rather than quality. I’m just not sure yet, from the data I have, how much of that culture resulted from the materials themselves and how much of it was how they were interpreted, or knowingly mis-interpreted.
Kind regards in return! 🙂
Marildi,
I did duplicate the HCOB as you did.
The other question: “ I’m just not sure yet, from the data I have, how much of that culture resulted from the materials themselves and how much of it was how they were interpreted, or knowingly mis-interpreted.”
My thought is, that words itself can be very malicious and insidious.
They represent physical action. Many words will be filled with concepts people have observed in the physical universe. We live in a world of mimicry.
So althuough the concept of power may be correct, the word is susceptible for not so optimal interpretations.
I have here a video. Please see it and listen to the narratives. And aks yourself the questions:
Is this POWER or HARMONY?
Is this guy “holding position in space”? Or is he rather efficient in ballancing the surrounding / incomming “powers”?
And the main question, would it be possible to replace power (the word) by harmony?
I don’t know yet. It just may be that harmony – the equilibrium of energies – is the strongest, most efficient power possible. It just could be.
LRH speaks of the ability to use only as much force as needed and not more. I am sure he was misunderstood and misinterpreted.
SKM, heart-warming video and it demonstrated your point beautifully.
You wrote, “My thought is, that words itself can be very malicious and insidious.”
That is very real to me too. And of course LRH himself talked about the far-reaching problem with words as early as DMSMH (or earlier), and then in Self Analysis he made it clear what an enormous effect language has on people. Just how much we can get around the pitfalls of words and language by choosing our words carefully is a good question. But maybe you’re right that the word “harmony” would create a better effect than “power”. In any case, here’s an LRH quote where you may find he did a better job of talking about power:
——————————————–
“But if you look it over, you will find that the ‘power’ of the ‘society’ and ‘state’ is pretended and is made from an effort to be powerful where they actually lack power. Our situation is quite the reverse. Ours is the power of truth and we are capable of power as a group, having power as individuals due to processing and power of wisdom due to superior technology.
“Therefore, when we grant too much beingness to their ‘power,’ we are granting validity to a falsehood and so it recoils on us.
[…]
“Evidently it’s not ‘them’ and ‘us’. It’s just ‘us’ and a false ‘them’.”
———————————————–
(HCOPL 27 March 1965: The Justice of Scientology, Its Use And Purpose, Being a Scientologist)
Marildi,
not really.
It just demonstrates what I said before. If you put your emphasiz on power you end up with discord – in this case LRH says “we” are superior to “them”. Now after the fact, please see what the result of this was for the next 50 or so years. Miscavige still teaches his “followers” they were superior to “the outside world”. Really? I wonder what will they do after they “cleared” the planet.
Okay, SKM, we may not agree on specific issues but I don’t think we are in disagreement in general. As I said in a previous comment, I do see that things went very far in the direction you are saying.
Btw, in reference to your last comment (“I wonder what will they do after they ‘cleared’ the planet.”), I think LRH’s answer would have been that Earth is an egress terminal:
“This universe is a major expanding trap of finite dimensions and rather idiotic simplicity. If one were to leave the MEST universe, one would solely create space of his own and maintain enough knowledge of what could happen with regard to the MEST universe to defeat its encroachment and its salesmen. No universe, however cunningly constructed, is entirely proof against this expanding trap. The MEST universe is a game which has gone on too long and of which even the players are tired. Earth could be considered to be at this time an egress terminal.” (Scn 8-8008)
ARC, marildi
🙂