Leah Remini and her Troublemakers, Part 14

34 responses to “Leah Remini and her Troublemakers, Part 14”

1. iamvalkov | July 6, 2017 at 12:03 pm |

   “All the world’s a stage,
   And all the men and women merely players;
   They have their exits and their entrances,
   And one man in his time plays many parts…”

   Beginning of a speech in “As You Like It” by William Shakespeare.

2. marildi | July 6, 2017 at 12:17 pm |

   I have to say, I don’t think Jeff Hawkins meant “hammer in my face” literally. I watched that part again just now and saw that Hawkins was motioning with the side of his fist when he said it, which I understood to mean Miscavige used his fist in that *like* a hammer in that way. This is at about 9:30 in the video below.

   That said, I couldn’t agree more regarding what Hawkins stated in “My Scientology Movie” where he said he didn’t think Marty had “divulged everything” – without giving any real substance as to why he was saying it: he “just got the feeling.” The line that “Marty hasn’t told all” is just one of many that have been forwarded by critics – and gets repeated until it becomes something “everybody knows.” Yet they criticize Scientologists for their lack of critical thinking – and criticize the church for its smear campaigns. Ironic is one word for it, hypocrisy is another.

3. Merrell Vannier | July 6, 2017 at 12:34 pm |

   The “devolution” phenomenon you speak of is a natural consequence of an effort to stop (hate, revenge, destroy, same thing), which is the entrance point to insanity.

   I hesitate to condemn those you name, however, because many of them found themselves in a bad situation after first dedicating their lives to helping others. Let’s not forget that.

   I set my sights on: 1) the cause of the bad situation, and 2) those who tricked, paid and persuaded them into siding with those (e.g., Tony Ortega) who have an agenda against Scientology, free thought, and religion in general – the Religious Thought Police, I once labeled them.

   As you know, I have publicly called for the church to reinstate the 1968 Reform Code of Scientology, thereby abolishing the harmful policies of disconnection, fair game and security checks (except when used in an auditing session for case gain), and for independent, internal investigations into the abuse allegations at the root of the mass exodus beginning in 2009.

   Imagine had these remedial actions occurred or were still to occur. The ASC may not have formed or could be eviscerated even today.

   Without this balance I think your information, while still important, will miss its potential impact and come off to many as a church PR campaign.

4. georgemwhite | July 6, 2017 at 2:20 pm |

   Criticism of Scientology evolved in a direction that I did not anticipate. Most of the people who left Scientology that I know just reached the cold, dark conclusion that Hubbard’s theories were wrong. People were hurt in the pocketbook and many were very angry with Hubbard. Many in my line of friends have died along the way from cancer, broken hearts or business ruin. Many of these stories will never be told again. I would separate out the age of Miscavige from the history of the real Scientology. If reality TV could show the real Scientology, no one would be interested. There would be no audience. Those in the Sea Org who left, injured by Miscavige deserve compensation.
   I did not anticipate the role that Realty TV would play. In one respect, I enjoy seeing the audience grow. I wish many more millions would see the truth. However, I still reject those who rely totally on the emotional hype but bypass the deeper issues of the origin of this religion.

5. remoteviewed | July 6, 2017 at 2:51 pm |

   That’s the problem Marildi. I doubt if the most of the audience will be as discerning as you are or have a misunderstood on how the word is used in that context as a metaphor.

   The word “ghoul”, “ghoulish” would apply but also so would “delusional” or “dub in” as it seems as time goes on the stories get wilder and wilder.

   In my opinion what Marty calls the Anti Scientology Cult is appropriate since most of its members are fanatics. So fanatic that they spread their hatred of Scientology to areas where Scientology isn’t even mentioned.

   For instance I was reading an article about a person who just happened to be a Scientologist who was currently a supporter of the current administration in office.

   No mention of this person’s religious association was ever mentioned but this didn’t stop members of the ASC from bringing it up and use it as a platform to fanatically attack Scientology.

   I’m sure if the person happened to be a Christian, Jew, Moslem, Buddhist, Hindu or even a Rastafarian or a member of the Church of Satan nothing would have been said about this person’s religion.

   As it should be.

   Somebody’s religion should be nobody’s business but their own.

6. remoteviewed | July 6, 2017 at 3:02 pm |

   I agree Merrell if the Church reinstituted the Reform Codes proposed by RJ 68 and based on extensive surveying of the public it would take a lot of the wind out of their sails.

   One of the key issues that was issued at the time was the Third Party Law which is very appropriate since much of this conflict is being created by an unknown third party of some kind.

   What also complicates the scene though is that many in what Marty correctly calls the “Anti Scientology Cult” profit from this divisiveness or conflict.

   I mean if it all ended what Marty calls the “Scientology Troika” would be forced to get real jobs.

7. Grasshopper | July 6, 2017 at 5:11 pm |

   “Hammering my face” – not “Hammer in my face.” Big todo about a misheard statement. Miscavige still hit him, no?

8. Chris Mann | July 6, 2017 at 8:22 pm |

   I guess it becomes another cult. But the behavior they are manifesting is not unusual. It’s not logical or likely to produce any positive result, but it’s not unusual. Life is in the mind, and people decide weird things based on emotions and stuff like group think, prejudice and confirmation bias. What Tony and Mike do is the same thing we are seeing in politics now, just a bunch of craziness.

9. Miss Tia | July 6, 2017 at 9:02 pm |

   It seems some former Scientologists are now “Professional Exes”. They can only tell the same experience so many times, then you get a hammer added to spice it up. Or they’ll change their opinion on someone if they can get press time on a blog that will promote their book, youtube channel, etc.

   Personally I think it’s wrong to tell someone they will always be a victim. That’s a defeatist attitude. You might HAVE been a victim, but you’ve survived it. The situation will have, of course, changed you; but you must go on, and hopefully thrive in spite of it; but you become a SURVIVOR, not a victim.

10. windhorsegallery | July 6, 2017 at 9:56 pm |

    To me, there is no question that each player in this saga has suffered.

    But it is not the suffering that defines someone or the depth or the cause but the decision what to DO with that suffering.

    Does one take the suffering to propel oneself toward an understanding of existence. Of faith? Of destiny? Of honor? Of conviction? And other lofty sounding words which point to, but are not themselves the essence of the beauty of human life?

    OR does one take the suffering and ratchet down harder and harder to become a more and more concretized vehicle of despair, shame, and hatred, swirling with such a lack of joy that those unfortunate enough to come close are pulled into their vortex and trapped like a moth to the flame.

    It’s truly up to each of us.

    Windhorse

11. iamvalkov | July 6, 2017 at 10:23 pm |

    Well, MIke Rinder just posted to his blog fans, that “He (Valkov) has decided not to post here any more.” I guess that means my last couple of comments won’t appear there. Too bad. One of the posters, Marie, posted that she didn’t like me and that she felt I shouldn’t post there anymore. Marildi, is she the same one who claimed you talked all kinds of shit on Alanzo’s blog, when actually you didn’t post on that blog at all, except maybe once?
    So I posted to Mike about that, saying that if he banned me as she apparently wished, it would impeach the popular view of his blog as being so tolerant of diverse views.
    Then Thetaclear chimed in that I was clearly insane. I guess he’s a psychiatrist now? Perhaps a clearly insane one…? 🙂

    I guess the veneer over there has cracked.

12. The Oracle | July 7, 2017 at 12:14 am |

    Interesting that you point out the brainwashing Marty. What Leah, Karen and the ethnic cleansing group is doing, is a reverse A – E on people.

    If someone is even remotely connected to Scientology, or even good-willed towards it, they are automatically considered a suppressive Person.

    To get in good standing with the ethnic cleansing group (anti Scientologist), one must come forward and openly attack Scientologists at random, make public announcements recanting any benefit they thought they might have had while involved with Scientologists. (full memory swipe). Requires a public announcement to the effect that they realize their actions of being curious, exploring Scientology, were ignorant and unfounded and stating where possible the influences or motivations which caused them to attempt to improve themselves through Scientology methods.

    It’s gaslighting. To manipulate (someone) by psychological means into questioning their own sanity. Gaslighting is a tactic in which a person or entity, in order to gain more power, cause their victims question their reality.

    To become part of the ethnic cleansing group, one must also “be processed”.

    Then well, we have Leah conducting comm evs on A&E. In the valence of an IInternational Justice Cheif. At least a CMO exec.

    It is on A & E. Which is entertainment. So everyone contributing to the special is double-hatted as an entertainer.

    Leah Remini went from homeless in Florida to a mansion in California. All with a lot of support she, well, it somehow left her memory files.

    The purpose of amnesia is so that people will continue to make the same mistakes. What I see graduates of the ethnic cleansing group doing, is the same thing they were doing before their life was “ruined”, the first time around.

    The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over, and expecting a different result.

    The enforced memory swipes are killer.

13. The Oracle | July 7, 2017 at 12:20 am |

    For everyone’s benefit. The ethnic cleansing cult’s normal habits and routines

    Gaslighting is a tactic in which a person or entity, in order to gain more power, makes a victim question their reality. It works much better than you may think. Anyone is susceptible to gaslighting, and it is a common technique of abusers, dictators, narcissists, and cult leaders. It is done slowly, so the victim doesn’t realize how much they’ve been brainwashed. For example, in the movie Gaslight (1944), a man manipulates his wife to the point where she thinks she is losing her mind.

    People who gaslight typically use the following techniques:

    1. They tell blatant lies.

    You know it’s an outright lie. Yet they are telling you this lie with a straight face. Why are they so blatant? Because they’re setting up a precedent. Once they tell you a huge lie, you’re not sure if anything they say is true. Keeping you unsteady and off-kilter is the goal.

    2. They deny they ever said something, even though you have proof.

    You know they said they would do something; you know you heard it. But they out and out deny it. It makes you start questioning your reality—maybe they never said that thing. And the more they do this, the more you question your reality and start accepting theirs.

    3. They use what is near and dear to you as ammunition.

    They know how important your kids are to you, and they know how important your identity is to you. So those may be one of the first things they attack. If you have kids, they tell you that you should not have had those children. They will tell you’d be a worthy person if only you didn’t have a long list of negative traits. They attack the foundation of your being.

    4. They wear you down over time.

    This is one of the insidious things about gaslighting—it is done gradually, over time. A lie here, a lie there, a snide comment every so often…and then it starts ramping up. Even the brightest, most self-aware people can be sucked into gaslighting—it is that effective. It’s the “frog in the frying pan” analogy: The heat is turned up slowly, so the frog never realizes what’s happening to it.

    5. Their actions do not match their words.

    When dealing with a person or entity that gaslights, look at what they are doing rather than what they are saying. What they are saying means nothing; it is just talk. What they are doing is the issue.

    6. They throw in positive reinforcement to confuse you.

    This person or entity that is cutting you down, telling you that you don’t have value, is now praising you for something you did. This adds an additional sense of uneasiness. You think, “Well maybe they aren’t so bad.” Yes, they are. This is a calculated attempt to keep you off-kilter—and again, to question your reality. Also look at what you were praised for; it is probably something that served the gaslighter.

    7. They know confusion weakens people.

    Gaslighters know that people like having a sense of stability and normalcy. Their goal is to uproot this and make you constantly question everything. And humans’ natural tendency is to look to the person or entity that will help you feel more stable—and that happens to be the gaslighter.

    8. They project.

    They are a drug user or a cheater, yet they are constantly accusing you of that. This is done so often that you start trying to defend yourself, and are distracted from the gaslighter’s own behavior.

    9. They try to align people against you.

    Gaslighters are masters at manipulating and finding the people they know will stand by them no matter what—and they use these people against you. They will make comments such as, “This person knows that you’re not right,” or “This person knows you’re useless too.” Keep in mind it does not mean that these people actually said these things. A gaslighter is a constant liar. When the gaslighter uses this tactic it makes you feel like you don’t know who to trust or turn to—and that leads you right back to the gaslighter. And that’s exactly what they want: Isolation gives them more control.

    10. They tell you or others that you are crazy.

    This is one of the most effective tools of the gaslighter, because it’s dismissive. The gaslighter knows if they question your sanity, people will not believe you when you tell them the gaslighter is abusive or out-of-control. It’s a master technique.

    11. They tell you everyone else is a liar.

    By telling you that everyone else (your family, the media) is a liar, it again makes you question your reality. You’ve never known someone with the audacity to do this, so they must be telling the truth, right? No. It’s a manipulation technique. It makes people turn to the gaslighter for the “correct” information—which isn’t correct information at all.

    The more you are aware of these techniques, the quicker you can identify them and avoid falling into the gaslighter’s trap.

14. The Oracle | July 7, 2017 at 12:42 am |

    Understanding Tony Ortega is easy:

    Humiliates and demeans people in the presence of others,

    Is amused by, or takes pleasure in, the psychological or physical suffering of others.

    Lies for the purpose of harming or inflicting pain on others.

    Gets other people to do what he wants by frightening them (through intimidation).

    Restricts the autonomy of people with whom he has a close relationship. Anyone questioning him is instantly banned and thereby his followers have disconnection enforced on them frequently without even being aware of it.

    Is fascinated with stalking, intelligence gathering, ethnic cleansing, injury, and slow torture. Especially upon women and children. Feels victory when nobody calls him out on it.

15. Patrick | July 7, 2017 at 8:29 am |

    I’ve watched all of Marty’s videos lately, especially since “Going Clear” right through to these latest ones regarding the Leah Remini series. I am not and never have been a Scientologist and only know of things from the perspective of those who left; after all, they lived that life and I’m sure for the most part are truthful when explaining their experiences. However, having listened to Marty this past while I have to say I do find him very believable and authentic, at least to the extent where I am now looking into Scientology with an open mind and not as judgemental as before. I thank Marty for that.

16. marildi | July 7, 2017 at 11:40 am |

    Yes, Marie is the one who tried to discredit me, and then disappeared when I called her on it. She’s one of what seems to be a growing number of “never-ins” on Mike’s blog. Apparently, the ASC bandwagon is appealing to a certain type of person regardless of their never having been “damaged” by Scientology – which is the “rationale” many ex’es use for their participation.

    I saw the exchange you had with Mike and others last night. It was a good example of how he makes sure certain viewpoints are condoned and even protected by him, no matter how false or irrational – while any dissenting views are made nothing of if they come across too convincingly. It’s more than okay with him to pile on a dissenter, but heaven help the dissenter who tries to point out inconsistencies or irrationality in the party line.

    At one point during the time when you were being shot down, I tried to post a comment. Mike kept it in moderation for a couple hours while moderating other comments several times. But in the end he moderated it out. I saved it for you because I was pretty sure he would have no good comeback and that he would resort to deleting it, as has happened before. Here it is – a reply to one of Mike’s replies to you:

    ——————————————-
    marildi says
    July 6, 2017 at 8:44 pm
    Your comment is awaiting moderation.

    Mike: “Yeah, and I have told you it is not scripted. Nor is it rehearsed or acted.”

    The point about it not being “acted” is debatable at the times when Leah reacts to what has been said with a shocked or pained look on her face. It’s as if she’s hearing it for the first time. And even if she is, it comes across as overly dramatic acting.
    ——————————————–

17. iamvalkov | July 7, 2017 at 11:47 am |

    George I think you make an important point. Having just been gaslighted on Mike Rinder’s blog, I did some reflecting. Was I a scientologist? No, because when I was around scientology, back in the 1970s, a scientologist was an auditor, or at the very least, someone who was seriously training to be an auditor.
    This led me to consider, Was Mike Rinder ever a scientologist? I don’t really know. His biography does not indicate that he was. I see no sign that he was ever an auditor or interested in being an auditor. He was head of OSA Int’l for 25 years. and also “spokesman” for the Church much of that time. He was a PR guy. Presumably he believed in the apparent goals of the CoS and scientology, and left when it became clear to him it was headed in a different direction. I’m glad he is out of the Church. Its better all around that he is, for him and for humanity.
    I then realized that what i thought of as scientology was in a sense, long gone. One can’t go home again. Your childhood home is gone as the river of time rushed on. Change is the order of things. Go back to where you grew up, and it’s not there anymore. Maybe now your house has been torn down to build condos. Maybe your school has been moved. My high school was moved the year after I graduated. A new campus had been built. So, what I thought of as “scientology” is long gone. It was never “the Church”. The mission attitude was different, and it was slain in 1982. It took a while to fade away, but it has been gone for some time now, thanks to DM, and ultimately to LRH in some sense. Perhaps “scientology” as I thought of it exists in places outside the Church. I hope so.

18. iamvalkov | July 7, 2017 at 11:53 am |

    They lost a strong sense of belonging and purpose. They are seeking to fill that void. They need to be part of something larger, and that’s what they end up with, at least initially. Some, perhaps, for life.

19. iamvalkov | July 7, 2017 at 12:01 pm |

    Mainstream psychologists generally recognize that people play “games” in life, and that “Victim” is one of the common roles. It takes at least two to play a game. Sometimes 3. Transactional Analysis, for example, has the idea of something they call the “Drama Triangle”. It is well worth knowing, because once a person is on the Triangle, s/he can get quite good at moving around it to the other roles on it, those of Persecutor and Rescuer.
    Karpman drama triangle – Wikipedia
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karpman_drama_triangle

20. iamvalkov | July 7, 2017 at 12:24 pm |

    Thanks for posting this Patrick. I’m sure Marty appreciates it. He hasn’t been getting much positive feedback.

21. marildi | July 7, 2017 at 1:35 pm |

    Obviously, Marty made an honest mistake, since what he said could easily be checked out. But he wasn’t making a “big to-do” about it – it was intended as just one of many examples he’s given of the subtle and not-so-subtle dishonesty in the anti-Scientology campaign. The vast majority of examples are not misunderstandings but accurate perception, in my view. And the overall message I get is that there is hypocrisy and hidden motives – which is the important thing to consider the truth of.

22. marildi | July 7, 2017 at 2:33 pm |

    You’ve described my observations too.

23. remoteviewed | July 7, 2017 at 5:27 pm |

    In my opinion there were two relatively good histories written on the subject by the late Omar Garrison based on actual documents obtained through FOIA:

    The Hidden Story of Scientology

    http://www.freezone.org/english/Historical/Data-Sources/Hidden-Story/hidden-story.html

    Playing Dirty

    http://www.freezone.org/english/Historical/Data-Sources/Playing-Dirty/playing-dirty.html

    And of course Arrows in the Dark written by Merrell Vannier. One of the commenters here:

    http://www.arrowsinthedark.com

    For after the Sea Org coup or Junta as I call it. I recommend Marty’s own book Memoirs of a Scientology Warrior:

    Then for those who are big into Conspiracy Theories there is Randy MacDonald’s book written under the name of Ashton Gray entitled Watergate the Hoax:

    A very important letter – Finale

    By the way all the above books have been panned by Back Page Tony which means they gotta be good 🙂

24. remoteviewed | July 7, 2017 at 8:54 pm |

    Again St. Micheal is parsing words here. “Reality” TV isn’t scripted like a drama or sit com with what they call a Bible but it’s scripted in other ways even though there is no actual script per se.

    In other words it’s about as “real” as Donna Brazille giving Hillary Clinton the debate questions before a debate on CNN.

25. J.Neira | July 7, 2017 at 9:07 pm |

    As a regular reader of Tony’s blog (therefore I guess I’m ASC???) I can assure you that if Fair Game and forced disconnection were abolished, I and many others would stop criticizing.

26. iamvalkov | July 7, 2017 at 11:22 pm |

    Yeah, we touched on that – He said I was guessing and didn’t know what I was talking about. I said others do a lot of guessing and you don’t call them on it. He said, Yeah its what your guessing about (or something like that). It all has to do with where he wants the blog to go. I don’t mind that, every blog owner has a narrative or scri[pt in his mind about what he wants his blog to be like. Marty does too. Any of them moderate and select. But I feel Mike is a bit slippery about it. And his blog is clearly now resembling ESMB and some of Tony’s fan club has migrated to it.

    As far as Aftermath goes, that’s Leah’s baby and her pulpit, as far as she’s concerned. It’s like her TV blog. She overrides anyone else on camera, including Mike. She’s on a mission and it comes across. Sometimes it spunds like she’s reaching, probably because she is. I think what I consider as “scripting” is basically in their commentary on the guest’s stories. And Leah is the director and prime mover there. It’s not enough that the people tell their stories, she wants to make sure her interpretation and evaluation of things gets out there to everyone watching, and Mike of course tries to help out with that. I would prefer if they just let people tell their stories and let us judge for ourselves.

27. Richard | July 8, 2017 at 8:27 am |

    Someone needs to be sent to the Principal’s office.

28. remoteviewed | July 8, 2017 at 2:52 pm |

    Both Fair Game and Disconnection were abolished by the Reform Codes in 1968. Yet it seems that the esteemed opposition never brings this point up and demand that the Organization adhere to them.

    Why is that?

    It’s like people who continually complain about the Government but never demand that it abide by its Constitution.

    From what I’ve seen what Marty calls the Scientology cult very rarely offers any constructive criticism.

    Just carping criticism.

    Another thing. If it’s only about forced disconnection than why the continual carping about Scientology’s religious philosophy?

29. marildi | July 8, 2017 at 4:18 pm |

    “It’s not enough that the people tell their stories, she wants to make sure her interpretation and evaluation of things gets out there to everyone watching, and Mike of course tries to help out with that. I would prefer if they just let people tell their stories and let us judge for ourselves.”

    Same here. And this is also Marty’s point that they present a very biased view.

30. J.Neira | July 9, 2017 at 7:54 am |

    Don’t care about Scientology’s religious beliefs – though obviously some do. They can believe whatever they want. I was never in Scientology. The thing that drew me into Tony’s blog was reading about Fair Game. Fair Game & Disconnection are what fuels at least 60 percent of online criticism.

31. julia | July 10, 2017 at 6:24 am |

    I’m wondering if Leah and Mike ever did get any gains, and if they did, they obviously feel compelled to not-is for the purpose of their show. I certainly hate the organizational infrastructure of the cos and the harsh ethics, and what dm has done with the bridge, but I could never say the tech of LRH is not amazing. These folks are actively keeping people from reaching for tech, which they know exists, outside the church. I remember when Mike and Marty put John Sweeny on the ‘cans’ years ago and how they made it clear that the tech was the tech and the church under dm was altered. Now Mike is ditching the only thing (to my knowledge and experience) which can truly free beings. They are operating off of motivators at this point. The show would have more merit if they told how great the true tech is, how they had gains, but how actions and policies of the church are evil; thereby presenting an exisiting scene.

32. remoteviewed | July 10, 2017 at 4:17 pm |

    I totally agree Julia. Only problem here is that both Rinder and Remini feel compelled to denigrate the tech in order to keep A&E, their sponsors and their biggest promoter Backpage Tony happy.

    Heaven forbid that they’d say anything good about Scientology.

    Like Marty says. They’ve become a Cult. Way back Alex Constantine made the same observation on Mindnet back in the 90’s.

    In order to create what Constantine calls a “false dialectic” and what the media and press call “controversy” they have to create to opposing sides that are opposites.

    What is known in Scientology as a GPM for Goals Problems Mass.

33. Pat_in_KY | August 2, 2017 at 2:47 am |

    Wow, this guy Ortega sounds pretty bad. Is he in prison? I’ve just started looking around online for info on Scientology after someone at work told me about the Leah Remini shows. (Alas, I don’t have cable.) What do you mean by ethnic cleansing? What group of people is he trying to kill off? I don’t understand, is he a Scientologist? Who did he kill? I looked around on this blog and it looks like there’s a lot of talk about him here, he’s a pretty big topic here, so I can only guess he’s a Scientologist.

34. Cat Daddy | August 1, 2023 at 8:28 pm |

    I grew up in Scientology, here’s what happened…