The Nullification Of Scientology Inc. Management

What follows is a despatch from David Miscavige (supreme leader of Scientology Inc.) to the top marketing ‘executive’ in corporate Scientology, as Miscavige addresses him: Acting, Temporary Marketing Executive International In Training (A/T/MEI I/T).  The adjectives (acting, temporary, in  training) overlap and are duplicative in some sense, but all are combined to nullify the person in question.  The preamble, A-D, serves no purpose other than to further nullify the recipient.


4 MAR 2001



This is so off the wall and so complex compared to what should happen to get it in that I know you:

A) Don’t know org boards, command charts,

B) Your resources,

C) Any tool of management,

D) How Internet works

I’m answering so you don’t take it as okay without any word from me (i.e., COB said nothing, so it must be okay).

Now figure it out—especially since I already went over how it’s done.


The actual order, the last sentence, is the ultimate nullification, and mind game. ‘Figure it out’, is a rather insane direction when Miscavige tells the person that Miscavige already figured out and communicated ‘how it’s done.’

Many who have attempted to work within Miscavige’s zone of influence can attest that this order above is only too typical.  Miscavige issues a dozen, or dozens, of similarly toned nullification orders in any given day.

Compare this to what L. Ron Hubbard writes about the nullification process in Science of Survival:

Nullification actually begins with domination, but becomes very pronounced at about 1.3  (emotional tone of resentment).  A 2.0  (emotional tone of antagonism) might demand of another that he demonstrate enough ‘guts’ to carry forward a project. But from 1.3 down, the modus operandi is any and every effort to convince another human being ‘for his own good’ or ‘for the good of others’ that he has neither the force nor strength to be dangerous.  By rendering the individual undangerous, the 1.3, 1.2 (emotional tone of no-sympathy), 1.1 (emotional tone of covert hostility) and on down seek to dominate him with the pitiful strength which still remains to the 1.3 and down.   The 1.2 and down is most comfortable around sick people, around people who are in apathy, since the 1.1 mistakenly believes these people not to be dangerous because they are obviously weak.  This is so far from good reasoning that the results are catastrophic.

And that explains in a nutshell why there is no international management in Scientology.  There is only a collection of sick, weak, apathetic people who did not have the strength or sense to realize the above before it was too late.  That was evident to me in ’04 when I left,  after this nullification process had been generalized by Miscavige for at least a decade.   After eight more years of it, Miscavige is surrounded by nothing more than shadows.  Their lack of understanding of  (or care for) the world  around them and how it has evolved makes them liabilities as managers. It would take years for any one of them to decompress sufficiently to be effective or trustworthy.  And that would mean a decompression completely unattached to and not influenced by Scientology Inc. culture.  Pining for a replacement of Miscavige is like whistling past one’s own gravesite.

The solution to Scientology Inc and David Miscavige is to move on and create a new Scientology scene.  Scientology Inc has been dead for some time.   As Jesus once said “let the dead bury their own dead” (Matthew 8:22). (for interpretation see this from ‘church of the Great God’).  In this case, I am not suggesting anybody follow anybody, quite the contrary, I am suggesting to folk that they physically and spiritually walk on.

355 responses to “The Nullification Of Scientology Inc. Management

  1. Speaking of miscavige, I’ve noticed some nullification activity on this blog.

    “There but for the grace of God goes God”.
    Winston Churchill

    George M. White

  2. I am astonished at the level of unprofessionalism in the dispatch. What a despicable creep. David Miscavige clearly thinks that he can behave any way he wants without consequence or he wouldn’t have put this in writing.

  3. Marty, I didn’t fully get what the statement “There but for the grace of God goes God” (English being my 2nd language and all) but I think Mr. White just called you the “grace of God” which isn’t half bad for a cussing expletive.

    As for Miscavige, I think the key to understanding why he is still around and doing what he is doing is contained in Mr. White’s comment, i.e. inability to confront evil. Hey, let’s think good thoughts and will all go away, right?

  4. Now the Church of Scientology NULLIFIES and uses Covert Invalidation on its Public with no attempt to even hide it. If the Co$ commits a crime – they nullify the person they committed a crime to – and twist the truth to justify the crime. You are right – the only ones still in have no strength – no integrity – they have been reduced to “being nothing” and are “robots”. They are insane and cannot even tell the difference between what is sane and insane conduct. Extortion at Flag – Bribery – human trafficking – anything this Organization can do to get your money and your free labor and then not do anything they promise! It is a CRIMINAL ORGANIZATION and David Miscavige is the GODFATHER! He uses covert invalidation on EVERYONE. You are clear – you are not clear. The books are good – they are not good (SP’s messed them up so everyone has to buy them again). Flag extorted money out of you – well, is that not great we are helping this country get the “tech” – no proof of anything.

    No transparency in this Church – they spend the money how David Miscavige deems fit and the members better start LOOKING as to how he spends it. He has quite the nice lifestyle. Photos all over the internet of his BMW, Range Rover, Infinite, Gun Range, Motorcycles, Personal Chef, Personal Hairdresser, Beverly Hills tailor for his very expensive tailored suits, Villa at the Int Base – and how to the rest get treated after dedicating their entire lives??? DISCARD VALUE ONLY!

    “Getting others to commit crimes so that the most money and free labor can be obtained” is the purpose of Scientology!

    As a public not in that long – it is very obvious what is going on and no one stays anymore. They have no new public coming in – if one or two dribble in a year – they leave fairly fast!

    Lurker’s and OSA – wake up would you please? Get out of that CULT!

  5. Marty, one of the comments in your post made me realize that having a top executive in the hole is like saying, “This person is responsible for comm lines to the whole world on this subject, but he is not allowed to have any comm lines.”

  6. Hey Marty,
    Interesting as always. I wondered if Indies wanted to replace DM. Happens in business when the COB’s job performance is not up to par.

    But you’re right: DM is irrelevant, “redundant”, as the Brits would say. I have NEVER seen such an odd job title. If it were not so insulting to the employee, it could be a joke. And the letter: Clearly DM speaks that way. Why he would put those unprofessional, abusive words in writing, is mind-boggling.

    Great explanation of “Let the dead bury their dead”. I once heard an explanation of the man’s excuse: It said the man was using a common idiom of the day (“I must bury my father”), which meant it was not the right stage of his life to follow Jesus. But in 10 or 20 years, after his father (who was not that old yet) was gone, he could consider it.


  7. Every single comment DM made in that post was a Generalization. Every single comment. One of the characteristics of a Suppresive Person.

    It’s so blatantly obvious, it’s miraculous more people didn’t walk away or run.

    And you’re right about it taking years for them to decompress. That phenomenon is something more Indie’s need to grasp fully so that they understand it well enough to communicate it. Anyone who has recently gotten out, or anyone on the fence thinking they can still salvage the “church” and bring it back have no concept of the need for decompression. Once understood, they’ll get the futility of trying to salvage the corpse that is Int. Management.

    Individuals can be saved. The beast itself is a zombie that needs a bullet right between the eyes. Figuratively speaking.

  8. Marty
    Thanks for this. I don’t know if anyone else has noticed but this tactic has regressed right on down the line. When I say down the line I mean all the way down to Mission Public.
    What exist nowadays is a cold manipulative parishioner and of course staff.
    Of course there are the exceptions but they too are at some point beaten down to cowling and succumb to this tactic or they leave with both dignity and compassion for their fellow man in tow.
    Hopefully the latter.

  9. George,
    Is your point that this blog is populated with real people, with real communication, at various points on the Tone Scale (including the nullification band), who have different reactions and opinions?

    Thank God.

  10. Lets show them how Scientology can really expand with the tool of the Internet, hmm ..

  11. True, there has been some flaming going on. I guess a certain amount of such posts have been accepted by the moderator(s).

  12. You know Marty, the first day I landed at the Int base, in the summer of 1984 (the irony of the Orwellian year was not lost on me) my only thought was “These people know nothing about Scientology! They don’t use it.” I even asked why no one seemed to know what ARC was and got an idiotic answer from an executive. So I got the hell out as soon as I could, getting myself transferred to Flag in a couple of months. I never intended to go back to the implant station and in 1989 when I learned CMU would be moving to Int… at first I refused to go.

    Fast forward to 2,000. After 4 years running the scriptwriting department I put all my COB traffic into binders organized by subject. His engram commands took up 14 linear feet of shelf space. Every single dispatch or transcript was complete insane anti-Scientology balderdash like the one you published.

    As far as a replacement for Miscavige goes, I will say this: Any person at the Int base — you have to admit — ANY person at the Int base, ANY bird in a tree, ANY June bug flying around a porch light, would be a monumental, stupendous, profound improvement over David Miscavige. Dead-in-their-head, brainwashed, crazy, degraded, stupid, abused as they are, they would still be a mega step up from Anti-LRH.

    Of course if we’re talking about creating an organization that could approach an ideal scene for Scientology… for sure they will need outside help. And of course we are already giving it to them.

    Notwithstanding all the above, we have to create a new Scientology scene because the existing organization is worse than a broken line. They break all lines into them. They have to be bypassed.

  13. Marty:

    Of course I can confirm having seen (and received) hundreds of similar “orders.”

    But worse than these that would make it into a written “order” were the rambling verbal rants, often too confusing for anyone to convert into even a semblance of coherency. The edited transcripts of those self-contradictory, incomprehensible diatribes could run a hundred pages or more!!!

    The receipt points of the constant barrage of inval, eval and nullification are gradually worn down to worthless introverted beings. The only stable data they have is:

    1. I am incompetent/suppressive and “COB” is right and is having to do “everything” because of my failure

    2. I have committed overts and have unhandled evil purpose and destructive intentions towards “COB”

    There is another wonderful passage from LRH on nullification found in Self Analysis. I shall always remember this as in the course of a PTS handling I was ordered to get by POB, I was made to read this passage and answer who I had run across that had done this to me. My answer was not popular and probably was never reported to him by the auditor, as I was made to come up with other answers, but it was what started me on my road out of the insanity.

    From Self Analysis:

    The second method might be called domination by nullification. This is covert and quite often the person upon whom it is exerted remains unsuspecting beyond the fact that he knows he is very unhappy. This is the coward’s method of domination. The person using it feels that he is less than the individual upon whom he is using it and has not the honesty or fortitude to admit the fact to himself. He then begins, much as termites gnaw away a foundation, as in California, to pull the other individual “down to size”, using small carping criticisms. The one who is seeking to dominate strikes heavily at the point of pride and capability of his target. And yet, if at any moment the target challenges the nullifier, the person using the mechanism claims he is doing so solely out of assistance and friendship, or disavows completely that it has been done.

    Of the two methods, the latter is far more damaging. A person using this method seeks to reduce another individual down to a point where he can be completely controlled and will not stop until he has reduced the target into a confused apathy. The lowest common denominator of nullification could be called “invalidation”. The nullifier seeks to invalidate not only the person but the skills and knowledge of his target. The possessions of the target are said to be not quite as important as they might be. The experiences of the person being nullified are minimized. The target’s looks, strength, physical capabilities and potentialities are also invalidated. All this may be done so covertly that it appears to be “in the best interest of” the target. The nullifier seeks to “improve” the person being invalidated.

    The first question of this list should be, of course, how many people have you known who have sought consistently under the mask of seeking to aid you to tear you apart as a person, and reduce your future, your hopes, your goals, and the very energy of your life.

  14. +1000 Mike

  15. You would think that if dm were sane he would actually want to HELP the person do better on his/her post instead of this kind of make wrong crap.
    I would hate to work for someone like this.
    I wonder what LRH reference he uses to justify this behavior? Probably HCOPL ethics review, “speakling derrogatorily” about someone.
    Misscabbage uses all the punishing type refernces and skips the theta, hat don’t hit references. He calculates to destroy.

  16. I feel exactly like you. Co$dm is dead to the world. No judgment, law enforcement, or anybody else can save it.

    It is time to move on.

  17. I certainly have been one of those you speak of George. And an example was my comment to Sally J the other day. It was off the mark and inappropriate.

    But it is not the job of the moderator to handle these things but rather ourselves. Thanks for bringing it up!

  18. Theo Sismanides

    Marty, this blog has given so much to the new Scientology scene. Unexpectedly so… and it proves Policy:

    Go to a safe place and speak.

    Yes, Steve is right, we are bypassing Scientology Inc.

    I am so happy this blog make big strides now. Thank you all.

  19. statpush,
    Actually, that was not my point. More to the point, the Winston Churchill quotation was directed at Mr. Dave M. It means, of course, that he would be worse but for the grace of God. Yes, I can agree that there is real communication by real people on this blog. However, I have seen the blog shift focus in the last 6 months. I think the lady on the last thread expressed it best. She said that she was of a different faith but wanted to help scientologists end the tyranny of miscavige. There is now a lot of frustration on this blog in regard to his persistence. That is the point I was making.

    George M. White

  20. Tony — you are exactly right.

    Miscavige loves to quote a single line from the PL on “Handling the Suppressive Person” which states: “One treats a real Suppressive Person pretty rough. One has to handle the bank.”

    He of course believes that everyone in his immediate surrounding is an SP. He has literally issued declares on everyone in international management IN WRITING, let alone the number of times he has stated it verbally (I think there are 4 “SP Declares” on me when I was CO CMO Int/WDC OSA).

    He has used this quote repeatedly.

  21. martyrathbun09

    Yes, wonderful reference Mike.

  22. It’s not “now.” The dispatch is dated 2001.

  23. Yes.

  24. …as in the dispatch is 11 years ago. It’s been going on a while.

  25. Mike
    Thank you for the reference. Perfect timing for me on a personal level. LFBD!!!

  26. It looks like statpush got it right:

    … “this blog is populated with real people, with real communication, at various points on the Tone Scale (including the nullification band), who have different reactions and opinions” …

  27. I am not frustrated with Miscaviges flea circus at all.

  28. Sorry George,
    I realized after I posted that I had misduplicated you. Guess I’m a little trigger-happy. My apologies.

  29. dm is type III. Raving mad.

  30. Crazy stuff from a crazy little man. Miscavige “knows” all his staff are nothing, incompetent & suppressive yet he doesn’t off-load them. How weird is that? He keeps them around. Miscavige’s problem is that he needs those staff. He derives his delusional sense of power from the very people he invalidates into the ground. Without them he’s nothing. Miscavige on his own, all by himself, has no horsepower. He’s the ultimate parasite.

  31. I did not entirely agree with you the last few times you brought this up. At first I was in almost total disagreement. Now I think you are right about the future of Scientology. So far I’ve met some really great, real people. Ive gotten some great, life changing auditing. I cleaned up the PTSness and confusions in Scientology and I think re-gained anything I got from my involvement in the Church. Lets all keep it rolling and be Scientologists. Something we couldnt do in the Church.

  32. Sometimes Poetry is the only way to feel. And this topic sends my heart up a little higher in faith that you Independents have something worth saving!


     ” I shall be a Niagara Falls, my joy thundering in a ceaseless cascade.The powerful flood will sweep away the heavy logs of others’ difficulties.

      I shall be a tornado of laughter toppling the timbers and towers of sorrow. Zooming over endless miles of mentalities, I shall demolish their troubles.

      I shall be lightning flashes in the night, breath-takingly bringing to view the panorama of Thy beauty–long hidden by the darkness of unseeing eyes.

      I shall be moonbeams of bliss, banishing melancholy from the earth.

      I shall be rays of light, putting to flight the gloom that lurks in recesses of human thought.  Through Thy grace the sudden shafts of wisdom will dispel error accumulations of countless centuries!”

      Whispers from Eternity    Paramahansa Yogananda

  33. He wrote his own reference. It says:

    “Note to self”
    “Keep these fuckers beat down so they don’t see me”

  34. Hi,
    I’m in the PDC in the lineup. I’ve been in the COS for less than 2 years. I didn’t know that you could get in “trouble” for seeking information outside of the ORG until I started reading this blog and others like it. BTW, I’ve only been to 2 ORGs in my life and before the first I walked in it, I never heard of the COS or LRH (well, this lifetime). I’ve delivered more Book ! than anyone in my area and I’m looking forward to moving up the training side of the Bridge to Class V. I have a lifetime membership.

    I can sense the pressure or PTSness more and more when I go to my new Ideal Org. It seems like everyone there is secretly holding on for something and it’s taking a toll on their spirit of play. I’d like to help them, but I don’t want to force one of them to take me to ethics for handing them the Debbie Cook New Year’s Letter (Well Done!), but I need answers. What do you suggest?

    My other thoughts:

    How can you make the COS better? How can we (you) fix it? What is the plan? Waiting for it to implode is not being cause, is it? What can I do? I feel that if it falls apart, what is going to happen to people like me returning to find that what Ron help bring into existence is gone?

  35. Here we have this monolithic thing that DM brought about, with an unmock, the nullification as it were, of the distinct Corporate structure LRH left with three separate entities, at least.

    Now we have an “only one”. That condition cannot maintain, as it defies the natural laws we’ve considered and that exist in this universe, that of “two”.

    That “two-ness” is evident on this blog, in many different viewpoints, not all in agreement, with back and forth, this and that and motion between. It is ecumenical, to borrow the term from my Roman Catholic youth.

    Were it not, were it just one view, one opinion, one oneness, it would not even be here, this blog. Since it takes two to have the co-motion needed to persist and move on the time stream.

    The moderation of this blog, by design or as it happens, has managed very well for some years now to make this a thriving, pulsing, active, real life, with all its manifestations of blood, sweat, tears and mostly, pure freakin’ joy at all these wonderful beings creating this amazing site.

    As to the Opening Piece, the following applies and is an expression of the way we put this together, this universe, and how it goes along. It also describes the blog itself, of course.

    My view is comparable to Steve/Thoughtful’s above. I think there can and will and should be, to have this marvelous adventure continue at such an uproarious cadence, TWO, at the very least.

    Here’s “two” ya’ll.

    “And the biggest swindle that anybody ever tried to impose upon Man was “unity,” “singularity,” “one-ity.”

    “You see? “One god.” And then they promptly write in all their books, “Two gods.” The god of good and the god of evil…”

    “All right, we’ve got one.• One, one, one, one, one, one, one, so on, all the way along the line. Got to be two.”

    “Now; I’ll give you an example today of something which is quite curious. We no longer have one science. Trying to give the public the-not you, but the public-:the reason why we have two sciences is very, very difficult indeed, because it’s a technical reason. There can’t be one science. So we can break it down and say, well, there’s Dianetics which is the material side of life and thenthere’s Scientology which is the spiritual side of life.

    “And this makes a duality and actually people are much happier with this. You’ll find people around don’t know anything much about either one of them, arguing violently in favor of one and violently in favor of the other-the Blues and the Greens. You get the idea?

    “They argue. They say, “Dianetics was really good, really good. This Scientology is no good at alL” “Scientology is really the stuff, but Dianetics is no good.” Well, fine. It’s just a discharge between two points. If they get mad at one, they can always go over to the other one.

    “Well, what If we just had Scientology? If they got mad at that, they’re done. You got the idea there?”

    “All right. This duality then makes for a saner organization, in spite of the fact that the boys keep trying to get a joint-control council which would then manage, with one board, all existing corporations. No, it’s the most wonderful thing you ever saw; how the animosities and so forth of either side of this organization discharge against the other side.”

    “So this oneness leads to revolution and we wonder why in the name of God, God had such a rough time amongst the Christians. We wonder about this. We don’t have to wonder very darn long. We find out that they were always trying to make two organizations.

    “And they would have greater or lesser success. But then as soon as one organization became dominant, it would eat up the other organization, go for a short time and then, bang, you have to have a revolution and two more organizations.” Tape, BACKGROUND MUSIC TO LIVING, 20 Jan 55.

  36. Yes, it all was a bunch of generalities, but also : not a single Miscavige comment was intended to give a positive direction, a helpful hint or a useful resource to the receiver. Destructive criticism at its “best”.

    However, David’s hostility was kind of covered with his “senior-junior-talk”. It would have been more straight if Dave had just written “BASTARD ! BASTARD ! BASTARD !”.

  37. PTS to himself.

  38. SKM,
    That’s great. However, I would really like to see him get replaced ASAP.
    Of course, I am totally removed from having any connection to him.
    I support the efforts of the blog. In the end, I don’t even practice
    scientology so I am simply trying to help.
    What I see is that, despite the many defections, he is managing to hold on. He would have fallen long ago in a normal organization.
    This leads to the question of the abnormality of the organization as a whole and its potential impact on me as a citizen.


  39. statpush,
    No problem. I have been more reserved on this blog lately.

  40. Some readers of theis blog, especially newer readers, may question why it is said that the “Cos is dead”,
    that it cannot be redeemed simply by replacing Miscavige and his fellow thugs, apologists, and enablers. In the interests of making this
    clear, I’d like to repost part of an article about what researchers learned from the North Korean treatment of American POWs in the 1950s. What is striking is that many, perhaps most of the returned POWs never did
    “decompress” from the “brainwashing” experience to which they had been subjected. Essentially, their ability to live, to “flourish and prosper”, had been thoroughly nullified.

    Much of the information here I took from the introduction to an audiobook called “How Full Is Your Bucket?” by Tom Rath and Donald O. Clifton PhD., the founders of a school of Positive Psychology.

    “North Korean Brainwashing is based completely on denying the target prisoners all positive emotional support, and exposing them to an all negative emotional atmosphere, and actually rewarding them when they
    acted to destroy their own ideals and emotional capacity, and relationships.

    The North Korean brainwashing camps were unique in that the prisoners were relatively well-treated in the physical sense. They had adequate food, shelter, and water, and were not physically tortured. In fact,
    their captors were careful not to make them angry, as this could have provided them with motivation to oppose the brainwashing process.

    A study done after the Korean War, of 1,000 returned prisoners of war who had been “brainwashed”, found the majority never got back in touch with old friends and family. They were found to be in a condition
    described as in “mental solitary confinmement”. All their bonds of affinity and relationship with others had been broken, and apparently they had lost their capacity to have positive relationships.

    The camps they had been in had no barbed wire surrounding them, and very few guards, yet escape attempts were very rare.

    At the same time,it was found that something like 28% of the prisoners had died in these camps, essentially by giving up their will to live.
    These camps had the highest death rates of any camps anywhere, ever recorded.

    Many of the prisoners just went to their quarters one day, sat in a corner covering themselves with a blanket, and died, often within two days. Usually no-one of the other prisoners tried to help them, because the bonds of relationship between them had already been broken.

    The researchers concluded these men had died of “extreme hopelessness”.”

    The situation in the CoS is similar to what exists in North Korea today, save that it is not yet as longstanding. North Korea is now on it’s 3rd generation of a DM-like dynasty of leadership, and it’s population has been indoctrinated now, for several generations.

    A simple change of leadership will not “save” the country and turn it around. It will take several generations of “decompression” to bring to country to anything resembling a social condition. This was learned already by the experience of Germany trying to integrate East and West after the fall of the Berlin Wall. Knowledgeable people estimated it would take 3 generations (50-60 years) for the suppressive influences to dissipate.

    Given the availability of trained auditors in the Independent field, it is likely the de-PTSing of the CoS staff and public can proceed faster and more effectively, but these people still need to be contacted and
    gotten into comm before they can be salvaged. So the establishment of a flourishing Independent field is a prime necessity for a good outcome.

    “The goal of this kind of brainwashing is basically to completely ARC break (destroy the positive emotion in their lives) the prisoners with themselves, with their fellows, with their leaders, their country, and with
    life, and eventually their will to live.

    Some of the prisoners essentially became like their captors, and became apologists for the North Koreans. Most did not, but were severely emotionally damaged.”

  41. “Pining for a replacement of Miscavige is like whistling past one’s own gravesite.”

    As you know, at one time over a year ago, I was suspicious you wanted Miscavige’s power, and maybe take over. (This is the rant of some people in Anonymous.) But over time, it’s clearly become self-evident this is not the case.

    To replace Miscavige is like taking over the leadership of controllable zombies who’ve lost all sense of individualism and personal integrity. WHO would want that control, unless they liked having slaves themselves? I would expect somebody like that to be a sociopath, too.

    Any real leader would want a core of the most able beings. To realistically rebuild the Church of Scientology from within would require the firing of EVERYBODY, so they can decompress, and the hiring of very able beings who already know the necessity of preventing a new Frankenstein monster from ever happening again. However, I’m of the belief that it’s impossible to create a huge central organization without it eventually become totalitarian, yet again.

    (Our Founding Fathers even knew this, and so came up with the concept of limited government with a constitutional republic. But even that ended up not working, and the United States of America turned totalitarian into a collectivist State.)

    The most UNable are what’s left standing in corporate Scientology management. The able beings have already left.

    IMO, the only viable concept for Scientology “management” is a free and independent field using free enterprise and the free market to determine the success of any independent Scientology group. History has proven one can’t free people with heavy control. What an oxymoron. It’s impossible to have the “lightness of organization” (Ron has mentioned) in a BIG formal organization. Impossible.

    I remember the old Portland mission in 1978. For me, it was the happiest, lively, thriving place to be at … even in their NOT ideal building. I’d love to see a rebirth of that same atmosphere. It was magic. It was true “lightness of organization” going on there, from my viewpoint anyway.

  42. Miscavige is an irrelevance, a freak show. What is frustrating – to me anyway – is that every day that goes by there are more abuses, more souls being crushed, and quite possibly more lives being lost. Needlessly.

  43. martyrathbun09

    I came in through Portland mission in late 1977. I thought it was the ideal building. At the cross roads of town and nothing but exact structure to meet the needs of a blossoming function.

  44. Hi Steve,
    Welcome back 🙂

    Here you go:
    “When you hear people growling, when the lines are all awry, when the
    auditor has flubbed and the world of Scientology looks black, just remember that in the dozen years of sometimes despairing work and heart-breaking setbacks, the dream has yet come true. We have it now. We can and are clearing them all – and you.
    “In Scientology, just remember this when all looks dark:
    IT WILL ALL COME OUT ALL RIGHT. ” L. Ron Hubbard, HCOB 2 Oct 62.

  45. ANY June bug flying around a porch light — OMG THAT is perfect!!

  46. Chris-
    Right on!!!!!!!! Welcome aboard!
    Good for you on your wins with STANDARD TECH auditing.
    Pretty cool stuff huh?

  47. +1
    Very well spoken Steve

  48. Bang on the money, as usual Mike.

  49. “So the establishment of a flourishing Independent field is a prime necessity for a good outcome. ”


  50. Fabulous write up Mike Rinder.
    Domination/nullification/invalidation is the HALLMARK of Scientology Inc.
    ++++You cannot progress spiritually til Scientology Inc says you are Elligible !
    +++++We control who you can or cannot befriend.
    +++++We control your right of free speech.
    ++++Your spiritual salvation lies ONLY in the hands of the Cult of Miscavology !
    The biggest GPM dramatized by the Church~~

    Touting the Road to FREEDOM…..while in actuality Scientology Inc is the road to ENTRAPMENT/

    As Marty says ~~
    I am suggesting to folk that they physically and spiritually walk on.

  51. Steve
    Here what LRH said:

    OT Doctorate Lecture Series
    Tape#26 “Flows: Characteristics Of”

    That unfortunately, is the opposite of what you see now. sad but true

  52. Actually George, I’m not sure I can agree with you that dm holding on points to the abnormality of the organization as in a normal organization he would have fallen long ago.

    If by “normal” you mean a for-profit organization — I agree.

    But scientology isn’t a for-profit but a non-profit and a church to boot.

    Meaning — he in power can stay there almost forever. There are no share holders or board to monitor.

    Although at one time there WAS a board and a system of checks and balances which dm has destroyed.

    ANYWAY — I’m not really sure what you are staying as I re read your comment about the potential impact on you as a citizen.

    TO ME — the impact dm has on ME, is my friends are still locked inside a numbing mindset, other friends are dying or dead …

    And as you know from the Heart Sutra — we are all connected … all the way down to the leaf on a tree is part of me …

    So – dm and what happens really does impact us all. Some more and others less but nonetheless the connection is there.


  53. That is the perfect reference Mike and realization of that was my last straw in 2001. Contribution to RCS and service to the Supreme Rulah David Miscavige was quite distasteful and solution then and now is to GTFO!

  54. Excellent reference, IamValkov. Thanks. Clearly, the corporate Scientology group isn’t the only suppressive group we can learn from to avoid pitfalls.

  55. Good point Safe re: who would even want to take over the cult’s unconscious followers. They either can’t see or refuse to see and are content to be lead down a dead end path to nowhere while their lives spiral out of control. They call it freedom! All the while the highest tone level they ever reach is propitiation on a good day, when they’re giving their last dime to the IAS.

    Yes, the able people are gone from the cult. As for the ones that are left; maybe sometime way on down the road they’ll come around. And maybe not.

  56. I wonder what do the two have to do with each other? Hasn’t every person who has left, who did not accept the ‘pretend Scientology’ of Scientology Inc., moved on already?

    Even if people have moved on, some hold out hope for an Org they once knew. The appeal of having an org back is a desire for the experience and reality that existed once-upon-a-time, where one could go in to an org and expect standard tech; where lines existed and worked to cross-check and Qual (correct); where there was a spirit of fellowship of people who truly wanted to help others, and produced shining, jubilant results of tech application daily.

    Wasn’t there a blog post some years ago about the “Church” being dead?

    I can see where even those who squarely faced the evil and assigned it a condition and left Scientology Inc might still hold hope. The tech is there to turn the management into something that protects and helps humanity. It’s being obstructed within orgs that clearly wrong-target and can’t even apply the basic Comm formula — but, worse, that have the correction checks system rotten to the core, making it so that anyone trying to correct is squashed.

    Sadly, most people fit to lead mostly don’t want to lead (though they will take it on out of duty). That leaves the history books populated by the power-craving warped peons who stake control.

    So it’s not like now it’s time to move on, people have moved on! Maybe what is needed is how to move on, not whether the orgs are dead or whether any execs or anyone else could ever run it. IF that day ever really really happened, it would be a gloriously happy one for me. The odds of that occurring are slight — but that doesn’t mean I can’t hope.

    Is a scattered independent application of tech the optimum way to the case gain for self and others? IMHO, no.

    Obviously, a common denominator of the throngs of people who left and/or escaped Scientology Inc MiscManagement is the shared observation that Orgs have an evil-other agenda manipulating Scientology.

    After this recognition that the Orgs are in Confusion, what else is the common denominator of the group calling itself “Independent Scientologists.”?

    The Indie 500 list, for example is Ex-Scientologists. They share in comon that they saw the Orgs were not applying Scientology. Beyond that — you cannot look at that list the way at one time one could look at an Org and know there was a fully functioning HGC and Qual and Academy. There are variables and variety in practice (or “application” if you will) as well as intentions and purposes.

    So that begets the question: How are they, outside the dead Orgs, moving on? Some are delivering auditing, and some claim standard tech, others openly state their disagreements — how does one know where to go, or where to bring someone for help?

    That was the appeal of the once-upon-a-time Orgs — knowing what you were getting. (tragically, no longer the case, except in reverse, you can be sure you’re throwing any selectee into a vat of vultures dressed as parakeets).

    Many seem to bear the scars of misapplied/altered “Scientology” — how so? Its evident symptoms are guarded and careful communications; trigger-happy jumping onto commenters; high-ARC suddenly turning on a dime with no TR4 or reason given; lack of deep loyalty/commitment to communicate misunderstandings to full understanding; out TRs (no reply, ignoring comm) — happens among Independents. I’ve seen it, and I’ve experienced it.

    The thousands of people leaving Scientology Inc have already moved on. It’s up to each person to be responsible for one’s sphere of Life (dynamics) and that will all somehow work itself out. It’s tragic enough (and it is, IMHO, one of the greatest tragedies of the 21st century and the ages) that the Scientology organizations, vested with tools that do help, went the way of total betrayal to Help. Without the pews and steeples and smoke and incense and insane political money-grubbing, status-seeking arbitrary hijacking that Management has twisted, becoming a grotesque imitation — Scientology itself simply is something that any person would love. (I have seen that over and over).

    I am sorry to see the loss of an organized support and protection of that process. That said, the Scientology Inc. organizations are not deserving of trust.

    It begs the question — is any human being capable of operating a “religion” without personal agenda and corruption? Perhaps the answer is “no”, one single person is not at this time, and hence the brilliant cross-check system Hubbard devised (which has gone by the wayside, and which Miscavige threw out, making himself dictator).

    But at one time, it was working (even though flawed, and even though contaminated with human foibles).

    So, if this platform is merely to rally people to leave, then fine — chant the Church is Dead. And yes, there is more defanging to be done. But that’s not the same as Moving On. Both activities are needed, but if it’s about moving on, then maybe some fruitful comm and people being in comm (rather than the divided factions even within the “Independents”) would be productive … productive to delivery. It is pretty much a free for all … but true freedom is freedom from something.

    The Freedom I want is not chaos, but the ability to practice, to receive, to apply to self and others, and to get help doing all the above, Scientology.

    Thanks for listening.

  57. Theo Sismanides

    Sally, why he puts those unprofessional words in writing? Because the criminal wants others (us) to put ethics in on himself. Even DM falls under this law. Thus he leaves traces of his crimes.

  58. MP,
    I still have a soft spot for a young man who has been trapped for over 20 years which is last time I saw him. I wish I could say something to him.
    Also, I get calls from a wonderful father who has two trapped in scientology. I give him comfort.
    George M. White

  59. Telling!

  60. Jim Logan, Thank you for that quote,.

  61. I don’t pine for a replacement of Miscavige by any means at all, but I do pine for a place to gather with friends knowing that consistent help is available for others and self, and that it is a true team effort (as in organized activity) with true comm and trust.

  62. “How can you make the COS better? How can we (you) fix it? What is the plan? Waiting for it to implode is not being cause, is it? What can I do? I feel that if it falls apart, what is going to happen to people like me returning to find that what Ron help bring into existence is gone?”

    First, well done on the Book 1 auditing! Your goal of advancing yourself as an Auditor is admirable. They truly are the most valuable beings on the planet.

    I understand your feelings. I’m sure most here do, too. I’ve felt agony and a huge feeling of betrayal. If you do, too, keep reading this blog. I believe you’ll find your answers here. Also, buy Marty’s book, “What is Wrong with Scientology”. Perhaps that book will clear up many confusions, as it did for me.

    Thank you for posting your very good questions to ponder.

  63. Theo Sismanides

    Wow!!! 4 “SP Declares” on you, Mike? What kind of policy is this? God, this is too much, now.

  64. George, I got your point.
    However, I didn’t come across any “frustration” at this blog.
    I see a change into the right direction: concentration on delivery and establishement of independent centers.

    All best to you,

  65. Hi Steve, and I also welcome you back. What Ron helped bring into existence will not be gone. It is being rebuilt here and now. We already have the beginnings of an org board, and lots of people working on helping others up the Bridge in various ways. There won’t be any fancy cathedrals and I suspect there won’t be any uniforms. Just a whole bunch of people training and auditing and some light organization as necessary. People taking on posts because they can see they need to be done, not needing any orders but only coordination.

    Not to worry.

  66. Marty,

    Thanks for this. I have witnessed and been part of what you detail in this post, on every flow.

    Flow One: I have been targeted personally by DM, and by those under his orders. I arrived at the Int base in 1993 as an outspoken, enthusiastic, stable and responsible individual. I was promoted to RTC in January 1994 and after being removed from many different posts, for reasons that I cannot fathom, understand or comprehend, and finally receiving a justice action (Committee of Evidence) in 1999 that found me “psychotic”, “dishonest”, “unproductive” and more savory descriptions (dictated verbatum by COB), I ended up in the kitchens (Galley). When I was then offloaded from the base 4 years later, again for reasons that made absolutely no sense, I was given a whole bunch more indications. I left that place as an introverted, cowed, confused individual. I had been nullified.

    Flow Two: I witnessed, for 13 years, DM personally work to nullify everyone around him. I saw him work over the Int management executives, I saw him target individual staff members in Gold, CMO Gold, CMO Int or in RTC. I watched as he would run the entire base down, at base briefings that were nothing but constant verbage about how suppressive everyone is, how unproductive and criminal everyone is, etc.

    Flow Three: I saw the contagion of aberration then taken up by others, and run onto others. I did my share of it myself — however there were some attack dogs who just savored the stalk, the pounce and then the killing of individual staff members. In the late 90’s, at the orders of DM, the first of the group confrontations started in RTC and then were mirrored elsewhere on the base. I watched as the RTC staff and executives, urged on by Greg Wilhere and Sue Wilhere, personally attacked different staff members for alleged crimes — pulling them out and then flooding them with demands for confessions of their horrendous crimes — and continuing till those staff were reduced to nothing but a puddle on the floor. In one case, the attack went on for over 2 hours — with 20+ staff against 1 person. This all came to a head when the entire org were held captive in the RTC conference room for almost 10 hours in a gruesome group confessional that was more like a pack of wolves eating themselves. These group confessions were then exported to the base and were a regular occurrence in Gold and CMO Int/Executive Strata.

    Flow Zero: And probably worse of all, I have experienced myself doing it to myself — as a result of the Flows above. There comes a point, when the torture and nullification has been continued for such a long period, that one starts to believe that it really is you that is causing the problem or upset — and what starts is an internalization and “mind fuck” to try and sort yourself out with Ethics or Amends or something. One makes oneself crazy — and you come to believe you are. I really did believe, at the end of the 90’s, that I could not think straight, that I was unable to work with others or get things done, and that I was truly really screwed up. I actually had come to believe I was suppressive.

    It takes a number of years to pull yourself out of the muck — and that is really why most of us have described a “decompression” period of 3 – 4 years or so. It is nasty stuff.

    And this is why it is so important that any of you out there, who have experienced the above (in whatever degree), get yourself exterior to the situation, get all the facts, and ideally, get yourself into a session to get the charge off, the wrong items found and handled, and your rudiments back in.

    Aaaaahhh…. the sunshine comes out, and you realize it was not you at all.

  67. martyrathbun09

    The book What Is Wrong With Scientology proferred some answers. But, I never expected them to satisfy everyone.

  68. martyrathbun09

    Lana, I am so happy you made it out and on up.

  69. I just called to check on my local org, regarding some LRH books . I talked to the cope officer, since there was no one in div. 2.
    He informed me that div. 2 was held from above by the E.D., who wasn’t there.
    Which led me to ask about all division heads. It turns out all these posts are held from above by the E.D., who wasn’t there.
    So, I asked how many people are on staff on the Day org now? His answer, “a couple dozen.”
    This made me curious. I asked, who is in the Div. 6’s? His answer,” it’s held from above.” Div. 3? “Held from above”. Div. 5? “Held from above.”
    I find that there’s 2 sups, 1 course admin and 3 or 4 auditors, one of whom is a book one auditor. This would be maybe 10 people on staff, “not a couple dozen.”
    Also, of course there was a DSA, who he decided was who I should be talking to, since I was asking so many questions.
    But alas, she wasn’t there either mid afternoon on a Friday.
    Thirty years ago, this org had well over 100 staff. Several staff would have been available to discuss the subject of LRH books, but apparently not these days.

  70. It’s not just decompression. It is learning the correct tech, as it was before all the additives and alterations, not just in RD’s but in theory and practice of delivery. I believe people confuse the exacting nature of the tech with some unnatural presence (which immediately destroys ARC). The correct philosophy, in its understanding, patience and genuine compassion, is fundamental to being an auditor and C/S who is really interested in the PC gaining ground.

    I know precious few people who can maintain a comm cycle, just a simple “I talk, now you talk” with good acks showing comprehension. I know a great many who seem hung up on their status, their history, and their popularity. I also know a lot of people who have unhandled errors in their auditing history. Many of those errors are just so stunningly gross they amount to criminal acts.

    As a ready example of what I perceive as correct understanding of the whole picture is the story Marty related of spending a day with Jason, just fishing, talking, shooting the breeze, airing considerations, sharing experiences, feelings (emotional tones) and attitudes. With that approach, the tech makes a lot more sense, and the bits and pieces begin to fit together. There is a way to do it right, and that involves ‘love’ that so many have been drained of under the “cold, chrome, steel” boot ground into their faces and fingers like broken glass (“cold, chrome, steel” might be a line that was edited out of an original movie script like Top Gun). Tech is useless without understanding, and understanding means = feelings of compassion, and pleasure, and joy.

    It’s not “fancy”. You see again and again and agaiin that somebody lost a dog, that someone lost a fight, that someone hurt them, and you have to be ready to experience that as an auditor as it happened at that moment in your PC’s life. It did happen, and it did hurt. When your PC blows out, you have to be there, too, at whatever altitude of being or humor or aesthetics or game he climbs to. And if he goes higher than you can reach at the moment, don’t lie to him – sitting there with your mouth open can be a very effective ack. You verbalize quietly, then. Let him do the smiling. An understanding that your PC can feel and see, with a correct comm cycle, and a process completion, wins it. TR 4 – understanding. Your PC is bouncing this stuff off of you, a real, live person – not a wall. He expects to create an effect on you. Gotta be there.

  71. True. (I was being a bit sarcastic coming from the viewpoint of what David Miscavige would think was the “ideal building.” No denigration intended if that’s what was thought.)

    I didn’t think twice about buildings when I was there taking the Comm course. Division 6 was perfectly by itself located in a high-traffic area, and the training org right across the street from it (if I remember correctly).

    When I did the personality test there, the pretty Div 6 girl (can’t remember her name) spent 3 hours with me truly listening to me. I felt truly listened to for the first time in my life! (I was 20.) I didn’t feel rushed by her, and felt she truly cared with compassion for me and my life. That alone was a huge key-out. I have great memories there. It was the most fun and exciting time I’ve ever experienced in the church. I was so excited, I ended up joining the struggling Portland Class 4 org (I thought I’d be in a “better org” it being “higher classed” lol), which was the beginning of the end of the exciting atmosphere of theta I got at the Portland mission.

    After months of struggling moonlighting while being full-time Div 6 staff, I decided to join the Sea Org at ASHO Foundation so I could put all my attention on expanding Scientology, and not mere survival. Later, I transferred as an expeditor to the G.O. under AL (can’t remember his last name) in the Guardian Office’s HCO. I got to see Heber every day. Loved that guy! But that ended up being yet even a bigger mistake. As we know, the GO came to an end, at least in name. Another story.

    I regret not joining staff at the Portland mission. Though we know that theta ended in 82 with the Mission network destruction by David Miscavige.

  72. Sorry if I sound like amateur hour to some of you more experienced auditors, I was just thinking over the art.

  73. Yeah Mike, and he also uses the “pin prick” reference in the Knowledge Report policy letter which says at the first pin prick the guy would get a black eye; and the story of LRH jumping off a 9 foot high board fence onto a bully from, what was it, an Flag Order? And others. Basically anything that validates violence, no matter how removed from context.

  74. ” I am suggesting to folk that they physically and spiritually walk on.”
    …………………AMEN TO THAT !!!!!!!!!!!

    It must be very difficult for those remaining in the church to muster up the fortitude to confront what walking on would actually entail. Following orders, robotism and lack of training/processing are a self induced and supported feed back loop that keeps the not so merry going round and round.

    Safe said:
    “The most UNable are what’s left standing in corporate Scientology management. The able beings have already left.”

    Sadly I must confront the truth that my wife and kids are still connected and ‘in’. The CO$ nullification system has their ear so soon enough I will also ‘walk on’. But I will drop a few more depth charges through the partially open door as I leave!!!!!

  75. Hey Steve, welcome. Another Steve here. One of the key references I have used from the start in 2008 is what LRH says about how to overset a confusion: just keep putting in order. Ignore the consequent confusion that blows off; and just keep putting in order. Anything you can do that helps to put in order — perhaps asking people about key words they are not applying like, “If the basic concept of TR-0 is confront, why are we told not to confront anything online?” Or, “If the reason for orgs is to get people up the Bridge, why then are staff pushed to get cash donations instead? How are they supposed to pay for their services, if they give their money in the form of cash donations?” Or, “What happened to the spirit of play around here?”

  76. Yes, a standard way of keeping “the lowlies” from seeing you is to make it painful for them to raise their heads in your presence, to make eye contact, to look at you in any way. In other words, you make slaves and peons out of them.

  77. “All the while the highest tone level they ever reach is propitiation on a good day”

    OMG, you crack me up!, Pat. Sad, but frighteningly true.

  78. Lana – perfect description. And I am SOOO happy you are now in a place where you CAN accurately describe it… 🙂

  79. Right you are Steve. And the reference about getting mad when the ship is being driven onto the rocks. And the despatch to him that he pulled out numerous times where LRH references “down dog!” in response to a report Miscavige had sent him explaining how brilliantly he had handled a situation and how he had to be “tough” with the “criminals” who were messing the scene up (in his reports he always identified the “criminals” and “L1 RSers” and whatever else that he had “blown away”). LRH said that he should realize that sometimes you need to “down dog” uppity yappers (not the actual state of affairs, but the story Miscavige told).

  80. Dan,
    Was that an ‘Ideal Org’ or one that has yet to become (tongue in cheek) ‘ideal’?

  81. The story about Jason really got me. There was someone who needed a hand, or an ear. Is an auditor only someone who can set up a meter and run a “model session”, or do you have the understanding, and can you actually DO something? Not to be overly dramatic, but a combat medic doesn’t necessarily know everything, he doesn’t have a sterile operating room, but he does have someone who just got his arm blown off, and he has a willingness to DO something.

  82. And thanks to both of you for leading by example!

  83. Sunshine Disinfects

    Wonderfully expressed, Carcha. Thank you.

  84. Oh Lana, my heart grieves reading this. I’m so sorry that you and many people here went through this. I’m so fortunate not to have gone through this myself. Divine intervention or, not when I came back from my LOA from the Guardians office to handle my debts (as a qualification for G.O. staff), the staff was dismantled and gone at the Advanced Org. I was routed back to ASHO Foundation, and the ASHO MAA thought I was blown from staff at ASHO (he didn’t know I was transferred to the G.O. and I couldn’t prove it as the HAS at ASHO who originally recruited me was gone. I was instantly declared an SP by the ASHO MAA, and escorted out of ASHO with the demand that I to the A – E list first if I ever wanted to be in Scientology again.

    This was enough indication of suppression on me that I never again wanted to work at any org again. That was my end of “being on staff”. Luckily, I missed and never got roped into the mind control of David Miscavige.

  85. Nice, Jimmy.
    So we have “corporate scientology” or “Independent scientology.”
    We also have, “standard scientology,” or “let’s screw around with it scientology.”
    Or “religious scientology,” vs “psychological scientology.”
    And “structured scientology,” vs “loose, unaffilitated scientology.”
    Also “scientology which is called scientology,” or “scientology disguised as something else so it will be more easily assimiliable to the public.”

    I’m an independent scientologist and am announcing the fact publically to all ten sides:)


  86. Christine,
    By normal organization I did mean for profit or non-profit with a board.
    I still have rights as a citizen, I hope. I have shifted my viewpoint in that now I see miscavige as a menace to society in general.
    Hope this clarifies.

  87. Love it! And agree with you 100% !!

  88. Hey Safe. We’ve got a four tech to one admin ratio up here. Real light on the organization, but man have we got some tech game going on.
    Come up and visit some time.

  89. Thank you for that, Lana. Wow. Precision communication.

  90. martyrathbun09

    Yes, the interesting paths we take…

  91. Thanks George — it does.

  92. Lana
    I am still decompressing from the mind fuck done – and I have always been Public. I can’t imagine what it’s like to have lived it 24/7 as crew.
    Again thank you for the posting and the wake up about self invalidation.
    I have often thought “geez if I just would have stopped after div 6 courses or maybe if I just would have stopped after Clear or better yet – if I just wouldn’t have started at all”.
    My stable data that I cling to is that “what they ran on me someone can fix terminably WITH STANDARD TECH”.
    So the game DMs running is: Nullify Crew on post and nullify Public in the chair. I used to say any auditing is good. My viewpoint now is – any auditing inside the CofS, particularly at a Class VII or AO, is dangerous stuff.

  93. I am a non-Scientologist. I began reading this blog last summer, while laid up and recuperating from an accident. During this period, I also watched most of the Republican presidential debates, in the hope there was something there (there wasn’t). I stopped following the Republicans, but I still follow this blog.

    I support what is being done here, and look forward to a day when Independent Scientology produces books on the subject that stand on their own. IMHO, the movement is still in the phase (necessarily so) of contrasting itself to CoS. Soon, CoS will be gone and/or irrelevant, and Independent Scientologists will produce books and services that stand on their own, without using CoS as a reference point. Again, I look forward to it. At that point, I will check out the subject again. Marty’s book is the start. Right now, I’ll stay with Zen.

    I was an executive with major corporations for 35+ years, handling large staffs, leading major projects, and controlling multi-million dollar budgets. The memo posted in today’s blog is mind-boggling on several levels. I have never seen anything like it. I’m assumming it’s bonafide. It’s unbelievable.

  94. Thanks Jim for the welcome back and the quote. I will now plug into my LRH lectures and look for an auditor outside the ORG and hopefully figure out a way to train myself.

    As a side note: When I witness all those Anon people in front of our ORG protesting, I would ignore them. I would just think they were crazy, and prehaps they are and it made it all the more difficult for me to search on the web because their sites would come up first in the results. I think if they didn’t wear the masks and chant and just handed me something like the Debbie Cook letter with a plea to look at what’s going on, I would have looked sooner.

    With that said, thanks for this site. Also, I saw the book cover “What is Wrong with SCN” earlier, but ignored it. I thought Marty was the one on the cover and just didn’t care to look inside the book. I thought he was the crazy one. I saw the video and now I know the crazy ones. And the videographer that got caught in the middle. How cruel!

    PS. I’d like to make a donation to help you with getting the truth in. What will the charge look like on my credit card?

  95. one of those who see

    Hi Simple, Love this “not needing any orders but only coordination.”

  96. SKM,
    Yes I did notice the shift to delivery and independent centers. I hope this cuts right into miscavige. On the other hand, it draws me away from the blog because I do not participate in those activities. Actually I am now thinking about making some videos on the subject of scientology.
    It could be fun.

  97. And people (I) need to read it first to know ! … I need to get past my (large) work-load reading and read your book.

  98. To clarify, when I joined the Sea Org, I just thought I was joining an org called the “Sea Org”. I didn’t know at the time I was joining ASHO Foundation, perhaps the biggest loser (at that time) of all the Sea Orgs. Nobody told me about the different organizations within the Sea Org, otherwise I would have been more selective.

    It didn’t take long for me in ASHO Foundation to see that I didn’t want to be there. As I sat at the ASHO F table eating beans and rice for weeks on end while watching ASHO Day table eating good food, I wondered what the hell I got myself into! I wasn’t to blame for ASHO F’s downstats while in the EPF, why am I being punished?

    Then I started to see the insanity in ASHO F, and started writing KR’s and “Things That Shouldn’t Be” reports. I even wrote reports on the staffs’ own MAA. He and I did not get along. I was a “trouble maker”. The ASHO MAA finally got even with me later with his personal declare on me. No Comm Ev. No justice. This was the very thing I wrote him up on regarding earlier events where I witnessed injustice. I saw justice at ASHO F insane, back in 1979.

    I knew I wanted to help Heber fight the psychs, as it was personal with me. Psychiatrists destroyed my own mom giving her hundreds of shock treatments during the 60’s, totally nullifying her mind to a 12 year-old maturity. I lost my mom to the psychs at age 5, and she never recovered and stayed in the wards. So I talked with Al at the G.O., and he swapped two people for me and gave them to ASHO F, because I was qualified … they were not. More than fair exchange for the ASHO HAS, and she agreed. Yet, the ASHO MAA falsely declared me for blowing from ASHO! I truly thought this MAA was a true SP.

    (Just writing about this is hard enough, so I can slightly imagine what the emotional confront must be like for others who write about their ULTRA suppression under David Miscavige!)

    So insanity happened even in 1979 before David Miscavige, but not to the extent after DM’s rising control, which breaking point for Scientology I believe was started with his 82 Mission network takeover. I can hardly wait for Marty’s next book, which I hope gets more into the time of the beginning of the end, and the fall of the Church of Scientology.

    I need to know the factual sequence of events that led to WHERE and HOW Scientology went wrong. We now know WHAT is wrong. Thank you again, Marty.

  99. Yes, do some videos.
    I want to make one myself soon.

    I wonder why you’re not using Scientology at all.

    I know a little something about the Dharma and I see not too many contradictions with the inner wisdom of Scientology. True, things are communicated differently and the emphasis lies in efficiency and techniques, but the purpose is quite similar.

    I wonder any time you show up here 😛

  100. Don’t forget the pink legs!

  101. “Instructor A was found to have huge ideas of how you must never invalidate anyone, even a lunatic.”

    There is a time and place for all things.

  102. “I have shifted my viewpoint in that now I see miscavige as a menace to society in general.” I completely agree.

  103. “Drinking the Kool-Aid” refers to … the phrase suggests that one has mindlessly adopted the dogma of a group or leader without fully understanding the ramifications or implications.

    I met with a Inc. ‘friend’ yesterday who was ‘concerned’ about me. Today I feel like crap. You just cannot talk to a Kool-Aid drinker. I thought this was a harsh term but it is so true. Esp. for us who really cared (cares).

  104. SKM,
    Actually, I thanked Ron Hubbard this morning so I do find a use for
    scientology. After all, it is part of my blood after having spent a lot of
    money and many years in the subject. I had been deep in meditation and I ran into a confusion which could only be handled with a good Pali dictionary. So I end session and drink of the Dhamma defintions in Pali.
    You know the rest.
    There are a few problems with acceptance of scientology at present.
    If you will go to 8-8008, I don’t remember the page, he says that he thinks that apparently there is no Nirvana. Well maybe there is no Nirvana but I can assure you that there is Nibbana. In the Theravada tradition, we have our standards and it is very easy to see Nibbana.
    You might also be interested to know that I am having more ‘wins’
    than ever. So even though I thank Ron Hubbard because he was a
    condition to my state, I am free to practice Dhamma with my wife and daughter on a daily basis.
    May all MU’s be cleared and happy!

  105. Awesome! Tell me more, please. 🙂

    You can email me anytime at (anybody here can for that matter)

    As Ron said, a being is as valuable as he can communicate to others, and had a standing communication line, which I’ve written several letters and got replies from Ron, which I believe were really from Ron.

    Does David Miscaviage, apparently “the” new alleged goal maker for Scientology, have his own standing open communication line (like LRH did), and will write back in response to any Scientologist’s concerns?

    Of course, this question is more rhetorical so as to compare the communication level of both beings. I wonder if second and third generation Scientologists knew this communication line was in with Ron for all Scientologists?

    Does anybody remember when Ron would send out birthday cards? This made me feel validated and cared for as an individual. Anybody get any birthday cards from David Miscavige?

  106. Hi George,
    how does one get in comm with you outside this blog?

  107. You Independents have a beautiful walless Church/Center. It occurs everytime a pc says, “Oh my god, that’s why so and so is so and so!”

    Everytime the mind disapears in ecstatic wonder of the true nature of the indestructible soul the Church of Scientology exists.

    Everytime you minister to someone in need, heal a relationship, help someone make more money in buisness: that is your church.

    And when your products of joy and laughter resound in your communities, your community will seek you.

    And when your communities create the magnetism of attraction through happy pcs, your church will grow bigger.

    When my teachers teacher told him to start an organization to spread the teachings, Yogananda said, “what a thankless task running an organization”!

    Then he said, “do you want to keep all this knowledge for yourself?”

    Then he told Yoganada, “without the hive, the honey is just a mess, and with just the hive(comb) there is no sweetness.

    Organization needs the honey of self realization, spiritual realizations, happy expanding people to thrive

    It seems the honey has left the hive here with you all. CO$ is an empty wax comb, with structure but no honey.

    It seems some form of benevolent simple, non central honey comb is in order.

    The true stat is joy, happiness, expanded ability, Soul realization/Self Realization: the resolution of human suffering!

    That is the only healing that will turn this around, the only war worth waging!

  108. Admin Dictionary Definition of Musical Chairs: ” musical chairs in life is the mechanism below ARC breaks an Grade III! To unstabilize gives ARC breaks! Whole staff can be put into a sad effect! This is the mechanism governments use. It’s the basic tool of the socialist. If he can just unstabilize everyone he can kill them with degrade. It’s a basic tool of the Insane to maintain their own stability by unstabilizing everyone
    else. (OODs 20 Aug 71)”

  109. Hi Newcomer,
    You will have a very nice support group waiting for you.
    If you live near the pacific northwest you can come to all of our parties!!

  110. Nice post Brian.

    It’s like the mother of all hives got smoked out and blew out all the bees. They went all over the planet and are now creating new hives. The “Ideal” hive is now a burned out comb. It is rotting and falling apart and the few bees remaining were the ones too sick to get away.

  111. Tom Gallagher

    Profound statement Steve because it’s a fundamental truth.

  112. Joe Pendleton

    I could not agree more with what Marty says is the solution – to move on and create a new Scientology scene. It is not just the only workable solution, but to me, the BEST solution. It will result in a new way of applying .Scientology (not auditing tech, which was already completely workable if applied by LRH’s rules/techniques, but how to relate to each other as group members). And this new way has been needed for many decades.

    At the same time, I will NEVER do Miscavige the honor of electing him total cause. Yes, he is 1.1 and has done what he can to get the results he has wanted. But the recipients of his orders and comm have studied these materials (tone scale, ptsness, etc) and attested to them. It was THEIR responsibility to TAKE responsibility and apply what they have studied and they failed at that utterly and miserably (“they” being the executives who instead of recognizing suppression and insanity, agreed to participate in it).

    Still I do agree it is very worthwhile to keep exposing Miscavige and his deeds as it will continue to result in a shrinking Church of Scientology and an expanding Independent scene.

  113. “I see miscavige as a menace to society in general.”

    David Miscavige is a menace to mostly private Citizens. He’s a benefit to government, as anything which nullifies and dumbs down individuals is “good” for any collectivist State.

    Public schools are busy nullifying kids. It’s so much worse than I ever imagined. Governments even use kids to report on parents behind their backs, through tests parents don’t even know their kids are taking. It’s gruesome, and getting worse.

    IMO, if Scientology had been allowed to grow without suppression, we would have been able to have enough attention to handle real societal issues, such as the dumbing down of our kids. Instead, our attention is still diverted on handling our own business of taking Scientology out of the much David Miscavige thwarted it into.

    David Miscavige is truly a severe menace to society, more than most people know, IMO. He’s knocked over Scientology backwards. He has diverted and prevented real progress in Society, and made things worse. We could have been WAY ahead in the game than where we are now in improving our environment, were it not for Miscavige’s suppression.

    Perhaps we could have already averted the trend to total totalitarianism here in these united States of America, had we enough attention for societies ills. David Miscavige diverted attention away from creating a world without sanity, war, or criminality. He’s screwed us over achieving this goal. I thought this would be done in this lifetime of mine. Now I’m 54.

    Sometimes I grieve about where this world could have already been, were it not for this fucking sociopath in our way!

    So from a government viewpoint, those who want to control others, David Miscavige is GREAT. He’s an asset. He’d make an awesome CIA asset, as that group has a wonderful history of mind control.

    Why does one think that NO government agency has bothered doing anything about the horrendous mini North Korea going on at the “hole” in California, right here in America, “the land of the free”.

    Governments sees this as THE Great Experiment, and I’m sure those who control are fascinated by this grand David Miscavige experiment, and are learning a lot. His deeds sets the premier example of how one can covertly use thought control on the masses, and make them believe they’re achieving freedom, while being slaves. What more could a corrupt government want?

    David Miscavige’s hidden message to his subjects are:

    “To be FREE, one must be a SLAVE.”

    I don’t think the 4th dynamic consequences of David Miscavige abuse has been fully realized by many.

    If this doesn’t scare private Citizens, it should!

    Of course, naysayers can stay blind and comfortable by confronting all this by uttering it’s all just conspiracy bullshit. But is it really?

    The concept of “those who are lying to you are trying to control you. Inversely, those trying to control you are lying to you” will forever more be etched into my spirit for eternity.

    If I got nothing else out of Hubbard’s writings other than this one concept alone, it is worth all the learning and misery I’ve spent in Scientology. I will forevermore be a feisty, rebellious individualist who always questions authority and questions belief.

    And I think that’s what Ron really wanted. (Of course, that’s the direct opposite of what Miscavige and governments want from their subjects.)

  114. Correction: out of the MUCK David Miscavige thwarted it into.

  115. You really summed up what auditing is all about!

  116. Tom Gallagher

    Before I log off I want to point out that the lunatic sawed-off ‘Pope’, Miss Savage, IS simply a lunatic.

    My side comment is that I still find myself shaking my head that this dramatizing psychotic criminal isn’t either in a common jail cell or at least in a padded psychiatric version or variety.

    Then again, that’s what “your” Corporate donations have bought including my $25K buy-out of my bullshit freeloaders fee……………

    Still makes me want to puke.

  117. Bill Straass

    I think that I was one of the lucky ones. I was not totally fucked up mentally whwn I left the SO. I was considered one of the best engineers on the Freewinds (which I clearly was) and was not pilloried to the extent that many here have been. i was physically all but dead (from AIDS which I received from a blood transfusion) but then , physical things are much less important than spiritual things. I had not been forced to commit a lot of overts before I left. I was still useful to them as a martyr to be emulated for the benefit of the curent order. I used to be proud of how much abuse I could take before I enevitably died. Now I see that DEATH is not necessary. It is not pro-survival to die just because someone in authority predicted it and used it to justify his overts on others. I hope someday I am worthy to receive my certificate (SP declare) which will demonstrate me to be worthy of this group. Of course, to bother declaring me the C of S will have to admit that I am still alive which would be most embarrasing.

  118. Bill Straass

    I should thank. as it is long overdue, the effort of Scott Campbell to educate me and get me to read this blog (which took him at least 6 months) . This is a real group (as defined by LRH) which is more than worthy of my support. I heard the Captain Freewinds tell another staff member that ” Straass would lay down his life for this ship”. I am glad that it did not come to that (although it was damn close) so I am still alive to assist this group which is much more pro-survival. If there is any help I can give any of you, I am at your service.

  119. SD wrote, “Is a scattered independent application of tech the optimum way to the case gain for self and others? IMHO, no.”

    If your answer is “no” to free and independent Scientology organizations, what is your alternative solution?

    BTW, are you a friend of Hamilton?

    Also, I don’t want this misstatement of fact to go unnoticed.

    SD wrote, “The Indie 500 list, for example is Ex-Scientologists”

    SD, this is not true by any means. The Indie 500 List are Independent Scientologists, NOT “Ex” Scientologists. Let’s not confuse this. People are confused with the facts enough as it is without passing misstatements of fact. 🙂

  120. What a story. So glad you are ‘okay’ Take care of your first dynamic for now in every way. This is what I also need to do.

  121. S.D.,

    There is a large and growing independent Scientology social and business network at

    There are 37 Independent Scientology auditor listings there, and 11 listings for Scientology training. There’s lots of listing in various categories, all of which are independent Scientologists.

    Headway is being made. The independent Scientology community is growing, and growing faster with REAL products than corporate Scientology. That’s good news!

  122. “If there is any help I can give any of you, I am at your service.”

    I’m sure the feeling is mutual among most here, Bill. Welcome!

  123. Did a little research on Churchill’s quote. The interpretation I thought was clearest and made the most sense is this: Churchill was sarcastically paraphrasing the original quote (“There but for the grace go I”). He was referring to Stafford Cripps, a member of Parliament, who Churchill felt was so pompous, he thought he was as good as God or better.

    Sound like someone we know??

  124. So essentially, you’re saying in 30 years, the orgs stat is a 10x SHRINKAGE.

    That definitely sounds like a power trend for David Miscavige, according to his goals, anyway.

  125. A lesser way of saying it would be “Thank God he’s not God!”

  126. For those readers who don’t know it, but may be interested, here is Bill Straass story:

  127. Not yet an ideal org, though they are doing goofy events trying to raise money.

  128. Austin Day.

  129. Hello George.
    Thanks for your reply.

    You know, I have a different definition than the one LRH gave on some ocasions.
    Ron is my “authority” in all questions related to Scientology, as he is the Source of it.
    But any body of knowledge has to be studied in its own context to be well understood.
    Words like Dharma (Dhamma), Nirvana (Nibbana) or even the concept of Karma vary from tradition to tradition and I never took LRHs definitions as obligatory or definite for other studies.

    But I have a nice quote for you. It won’t reflect the concept of Nibbana, but hey, absolutes are not easily attained, right?

    “Top end of the scale would be a thetan who didn’t have to operate. See, he didn’t have to at all. He’d be in a total, almost unattainable absolute, don’t you see? But he theoretically would be in a state where he was so serene, calm, disassociated with the physical universe, that he wasn’t even in it; he wasn’t even in the time stream; he had nothing to do with anything and so forth. Now, that would be the theoretical top of the scale and that would be a thetan who did not have to operate.”

    “Now, an individual at the bottom of this scale that leads up to OT and through OT, of course, is the effect of everything. He can cause nothing. Now, the individual at the total top of the scale would be potentially able to cause everything and anything—life, thought, matter, energy, space and time—and would not have to cause anything; would be under no compulsion of causing anything. He would, however, be in a no-games condition. And one of the characteristics of the thetan, the idiot, is he likes to have a game going.”

    “You might also be interested to know that I am having more ‘wins’
    than ever. So even though I thank Ron Hubbard because he was a
    condition to my state, I am free to practice Dhamma with my wife and daughter on a daily basis.”

    Yes, it’s nice to know. Thank you and all best.

  130. Perfect. I always liked June Bugs!

    Seriously yes, but the bus has left the station on the church. The june bug will have to share the pie with the independents, because I will not carry the yoke again.

  131. Steve, how I do it is to make the payment through Paypal and have it deducted from my checking account. Then my checking account statement will just show a payment made through Paypal and the amount. You can make the payment directly through Paypal using Marty’s email address of “” at the Paypal site. You can also set up a hushmail address of your own to use for Paypal to assure your privacy.You can mark the payment as a gift on the Paypal site.

    I would assume that you can do the same by charging the Paypal transfer to your credit card, and I’m pretty sure that will just show up as “Paypal” on your credit card statement. I think you can verify this at the Paypal site.

    This way of doing it may be more private than using the “donate” button, I’m not sure.

  132. Anon, on your side

    “The solution to Scientology Inc and David Miscavige is to move on and create a new Scientology scene.  Scientology Inc has been dead for some time.”. It seems to me that you have already created a new Scientology scene. The proof is in the growth of the indie movement. In fact, you, meaning Marty et al, have created what historically would be called a split from Scientology, Inc., or in another words, a new church of Scientology. Others have said it already, you have nailed your “ninety-five theses” to the Church door. You are being joined almost daily by Scientologists who want to practice their religion. As the indie movement grows, David Miscavige will become more and more irrelevant. However, there is a huge amount of money involved, and when DM and only a handful of his followers are left standing in huge empty buildings worldwide, you have to be prepared because questions will be asked as to which church actually owns those buildings.

  133. David Miscavige has blown off so many good people it is pathetic. Miscavige proves two things:

    1. People will go through hell to help other people, even to the point of enduring Miscavige’s insanity.

    2. There is evil in the world, and it does latch on to that which is most pro-survival.

  134. The basis of the term “drinking the Kook-Aid” is a reference to the November 1978 Rev. Jim Jones Jonestown Massacre, where over 900 members of the Peoples Temple cult committed suicide by drinking Flavor Aid (not actually Kool-Aid) drink laced with cyanide.

  135. The basis of the term “drinking the Kool-Aid” is a reference to the November 1978 Rev. Jim Jones Jonestown Massacre, where over 900 members of the Peoples Temple cult committed suicide by drinking Flavor Aid (not actually Kool-Aid) drink laced with cyanide.

  136. Safe,
    By “scattered independent application of tech” I was referring to inconsistencies, no Qual support, and even variable approaches. No, I don’t think that’s optimum. It is necessary now, in a survival mode — but it is not the ideal scene, that’s all.

    That is in no way whatsoever saying I am “opposed to free and independent Scientology organizations.” In fact, free and independent Scientology organizations would be one solution if one could count on being able to get consistent application of Scientology, with all the bells and whistles and support available — word clearing, demo kits, an academy, internships, sups, qual, ethics — in the real sense that these tools exist, to help fly, not to squash! That would be an alternative solution.

    It will work itself out eventually, with even the equivalent of missions (smaller practices) and even field auditors. But the whole point of Qual is to support the activity, and support field auditors, not stop them and yes, it would be ideal to have that infrastructure in the most helpful, uptone, on purpose sense possible.

    As for “Ex-Scientologists”, thank you for pointing that out — I see how if one took the term out of context of my entire statement it doesn’t say what I meant. Saying the list is comprised of “Former Scientology Inc. members and staff” would be a much better stand alone statement. The positions toward Scientology the subject, the activities, and the attitudes vary greatly within the group. That was my point.

    The independence to practice Scientology is freedom from arbitrary encumbrances, stopping, and the general abuses perpetrated by David Miscavige’s Scientology Inc. It would also be freedom from people who use Scientology with other practices but call it Scientology — one can do whatever, but for the sake of knowing where to bring someone for help, the choice should be with cards on the table. I think that should be clearly stated and made a matter of choice to individuals (don’t call it Scientology if it isn’t) . That’s all.

  137. P.S. To reply to your question: Don’t know a Hamilton. Why do you ask?

  138. Marty,
    Do you still use this email.

  139. martyrathbun09

    Yes – and now I know who you are. Great meeting you. Hope we can’t get to the bottom of the mess we’ve discussed.

  140. Ah good. Good meeting you too! Yes we will!

  141. Hi Lana, thank you very much for posting this. You are also especially correct about Mike and Marty too…I am very thankful for them as well. Below is a snapshot of what I experienced.

    I was never in the SO although I did sign a contract and was working towards this while holding an executive post in an outer org. That was 15+ years ago, and I still struggle in understanding what exactly went down…but then insanity can be a difficult thing to sort out.

    One major outpoint was our management deciding (just one day I guess) that we were going to go from a Mission to a Class V Org. The SO sent many Execs to recruit for and fill the required posts, but by the time the event rolled around where it was announced only about half of those staff remained. After the dust had completely settled there were 7 of us left. I’m positive most of us knew this was a stat push and a completely off-policy way to build an Org, but as you might imagine this got me nowhere upon query. After all, COB already announced this amazing accomplishment at an International Event. Needless to say, I felt that I was left holding the bag which is when the major nullification began. Certainly management knew best…it must be me.

    I think what it boiled down to for me is that I had wins with Scientology…major, major wins, and I wanted others to have the same. I also believe that good beings have a sense of duty. Combine these and we can pretty much walk through anything I guess, and one of the things that I always considered a sort of “saving grace” for me was my determination to get the job done. As you say though, with all the messed up Flows, eventually Flow 0 sets in. This is where I really began to lose the sense of who I was. The way out for me was regaining just enough of this to at least honestly ask myself some questions.

    This happened when my Senior pulled me to the upper Org for “handling” and for training. I consider it a major stroke of luck that she put me on the PTS/SP course…Wow! Mind you, I could find no person(s), I had no “why”, I could examine no real stats, all I knew, per the data, is how I felt being on staff, how I felt being in my Org and my upper Org, and how I felt being on the phone with my Bridge Pubs rep ramming the Class V allotment of books required for the next event down my throat. My decision (right there in the Academy) was that until I figured out why it was I felt this way that I was done.

    My ordeal was nowhere close to the experiences I have read of others. I take no pride in perhaps coming to the conclusion sooner than others did, nor am I disappointed in myself for not recognizing it sooner. I don’t think anyone should as it is not important when or how…just that we did. Here’s to walking on, and to creating a new scene!

    Utmost regards, Doug

  142. BTW, George, speaking of David Miscariage.
    I am sure, this bitter apostate will be defrocked sooner than he thinks.

  143. You know that scene at the end of A Few Good Men when Tom Cruise challenges Jack Nicholson and Nicholson finally breaks (“You want the truth?! You can’t handle the truth!”) and says what really went down? I am waiting for that moment when Miscavige is in public and someone challenges him and he goes over the edge and loses it and all the world gets to see his true character. Further, he is confused as the people there proceed to arrest him. Hey, a guy can dream.

  144. +1
    Yeah Lana!

  145. Well these types of dispatches are more than real to me. In fact we (RTC) had orders to read them all and attest to having done so in CIC with the threat of not getting paid our $46.00.
    And the business BM — sorry — DM asserted with each new dispatch about Acting/Temporary/in-Training/Pheasant-Pig type nullification was just too common, while he systematically wiped out all International Management.
    And even though I have the highest regard and affinity for those who are left, I will have to agree with you in full that they are nothing now but weak or sick — as like I or you and everyone else who was there, we had it in ourselves to see enough outnesses to be able to deprogram ourselves, keep our integrity and work out a way — any ol gosh darned way — and ourselves free.
    After having written this, I now believe that it is a point of whether one has been able to keep his/her integrity or not and it is obvious that the weak, who are still there, have not.

  146. Right, right! Pink legs. That’s a big one.
    And one of the biggest discoveries of Scientology — ARC — DM never mentioned that one at all. But who needs understanding when you can just punch people in the face and steal their life?

  147. Thanks for the update Dan. 🙂

  148. Welcome Bill!
    And great job to Scott Cambell for helping a friend!!

  149. Li'll bit of stuff

    Nice view, Barb, and BTW, I perceive you’re healing well, from the heavily worded initiation, (so thoughtless and
    quite unnecessary,) by a few who should know better!

    I have to say, that some seem to fare far better than others
    when posting here, in the initial stages. newcomer was
    certainly one of them, and, obviously having spent some
    fair time ‘in the trenches’ seemed to negotiate his way
    around the forum pretty adroitly, and as a result, received/
    inflicted minimum damage, if I can presume to say so.

    The fact that you present as a non-Scientologist and
    a Christian, speaks volumes as to how you have been able
    to deal with the careless, rather than malicious initiation,
    you experienced here. “….forgive them, my Lord, for they
    know not what they do.”..(attributed to Jesus.) As a matter
    of record, I am aware of a number of devout Christians,
    who also happen to be advanced Scientologists here!

    As I said earlier, this is definitely not a blog for the faint-
    hearted, rather a training ground in the tough, real world
    where ‘even tigers.have a hard time’ (LRH) Fortunately,
    though, there are those here, who see the floundering
    of a person in distress, and come to the “rescue”at a
    moment’s notice. I like to believe that the majority of us
    fall into that category.

    Any how, hopefully you can put that behind you now,
    and just enjoy the richly rewarding, if bumpy ride.


  150. Maybe Tom wakes up and asks DM himself what the truth is.

  151. Oh, he used to be the Treasury Secretary for the biggest org in the United States. His friends called him Alexander. He liked one strong (know-best) aristocratic energetic org (much like the RTC is), overseeing (with supreme authority) over smaller orgs, which is what appeared to me you were suggesting what you wanted, too.

    It seems you want Scientology controlled, it appears … with another overseer (not David Miscavige), where this new select “christened” authority makes the ultimate decisions about Scientology. This final authority should determine what’s “good” or not, and have the power to enforce their judgement of their determination of “good or bad” on others. At least, that’s what I got out of your communication (though perhaps I misunderstood). There’s a name for this. It’s called collectivism, which philosophy always ends up abusing individuals.

    However, I’m totally done with this false, unworkable idea. History has proven this philosophy leads to totalitarianism in an org. It’s ruined Scientology already. It also ruined these united States of America. This idea of a collectivist central authority won’t lead us out of the mess that we got into. We got into it BECAUSE of this false idea.

    (My question was intended to be a clever joke, and to see if you knew what I was suggesting.)

    Here’s what Hamilton thought, and perhaps this will make more sense as to the folly of repeating history with a continued central authority.

    “The business history of the America saga developed under the direction of Alexander Hamilton. His view of commerce for America was to emulate the mercantile model of the British Empire.

    The following summary explains the essential viewpoint and legacy of his economic influence:

    “Hamilton differed from his contemporaries was, first, in believing that only a “talented few” — understood to mean men drawn from the wealthy and aristocratic strata of society — had the wisdom and dispassionate foresight to implement the measures necessary for the public good. The second major distinguishing feature of Hamilton’s political philosophy was its emphasis on energetic government. He believed that the government should be proactive in economic and military affairs, have the power to supersede lower governments (as at the state level), and be able to exercise authority directly on the people.”

    “He believed that an energetic American government should, in the interest of promoting the public good, actively encourage manufacturing, assume responsibility for the country’s debts, standardize and control the currency system through a national bank, link the interests of wealthy citizens with the government’s success, and, finally, maintain friendly ties with Britain in order not to provoke a disastrous trade or shooting war.”

    The “implied powers” justification that Hamilton argued for a strong central government, remains a national curse to this day. He was more concerned with who controlled the components of commerce than the nature of the economic elements. Understanding Hamilton’s Federalist mindset and dogmatic drive for a strong central government constitution is crucial for a thoughtful comprehension of Totalitarian Collectivism.”

    I suggest you study what leads to totalitarianism, and how that ALWAYS abuses individuals. The site above is a good start.

    It appears you’re fairly fresh out of the chaos of the regime, and are still sorting it out and decompressing. I understand. Most here have been before you and understand what’s going on, and the frustration of it.

    I’ve discovered by the continued reading here, any confusion eventually evaporates. Right here on this blog is the biggest 3rd Dynamic auditing session for Scientologists on the planet! Keep in comm here, and you’ll see what I mean. 🙂

  152. Li'll bit of stuff

    Carcha, this is a first for me! …….you actually managed
    to give me goosebumps! Wonderfully stated and truly
    represented the miracle of the auditing experience!
    I hope more readers manage to get the import of this
    run of postings, you have just made here.

    Congratulations, just superb!…..Calvin.

  153. The successful action by the Miscarriage seems to be to nullify a few key OT VIIIs in an area, esp. if it can be done while they are attending the MV event and are captive prey for the lurking midget. He gets them to ‘own the problem’ ( POB simply gives them his problem ) and they take it home to their OT Committee and give the problem to everyone else in the field who is PTS enough to accept it.

    These key OTs of course now have a ‘special comm line’ in with the COB and they are happy to forward ‘command intention’ to further this end and maintain their special status in their field. Eventually after the Org is open and the dust has settled they will realize that the Midget really could give a flying fuck about their miserable bankrupt existence.

    And when these ‘upstat OLs’ begin asking where Super Power and OT XI and X are they will be given sec checking because they are asking too many questions. And in the hills above Gilman Hot Springs can be heard……..
    “What the Fuck is the matter with those C/Sing, M/Fing whining OTs. Don’t they know I have more than enough shit to handle without having to worry about their pissy little cases………….they need more M/Fing objectives. Send this out to the Orgs….all OT VIIIs are to begin immediate Objective coaudits to be done in their orgs. After 500 hours have them peptition …….”

    Factoid: There are OT VIIIs doing Objective Co-audits in the ‘combined theory/practical courseroom’ of the most recently dedicated Ideal Org in California.

  154. Li'll bit of stuff

    Wayne, I want some of whatever you’re
    knocking back, ‘bro’!

  155. “In fact, free and independent Scientology organizations would be one solution if one could count on being able to get consistent application of Scientology, with all the bells and whistles and support available — word clearing, demo kits, an academy, internships, sups, qual, ethics — in the real sense that these tools exist, to help fly, not to squash! That would be an alternative solution.”


    Independent Scientology organizations isn’t just a “would be one solution if”, it is the ONLY solution. Though I’m open to an alternative solution to this if you have one, but so far, you haven’t mentioned any alternative.

    I say, don’t worry about whether Scientology gets delivered standardly. Let the market determine that. If people aren’t getting what they expect, they can walk. Thetans with ability will make sure they deliver Scientology as it should be. They don’t need any force to do this. They WANT to do this.

    Standard Scientology is being delivered independently as you read this. Orgs like offer 37 different auditors/groups and 11 different training centers right now. Interview them. Get your concerns answered before you move forward with any of them. Marty himself delivers standard Scientology. Nobody has a noose around his throat to do it right. If only standard Scientology works, only an imbecile would want to deliver anything other than standard tech.

    The biggest Scientology squirrel group on the planet is the Church of Scientology who damages people. Even if there are smaller squirrel groups than Miscavige’s Orgs, it would surely do less damage.

    The subject of Scientology is established well enough now where it’s not difficult for an INDIVIDUAL to determine whether they’re getting standard tech or not. For one to have the option to go to another org if they’re not satisfied is enough incentive for Orgs to want only results-oriented delivery, or else they risk losing their income.

    Take a look at why the missions, at one time, BOOMED.

  156. Lana ~
    Absolutely informative and well written post.
    Good job on putting it on all flows.

  157. Li'll bit of stuff

    Carha, this is from my wife, Dorothy, a Class V., (original) “For me, you have just encapsulated
    the very essence of that beingness, which
    makes up an excellent auditor.
    thank you,

  158. I know this is off topic, but I just wanted to let you know that your blog is a treasure trove for finding names for the big list of ex-church members we are compiling on WWP.

    Thanks for what you are doing here!

  159. Very well said.

  160. Interesting post, Safe.
    I might have considered this viewpoint paranoid except for the fact that about 40 years ago I read a book entitled “1984” by George Orwell and look at the world now…… The world didn’t degenerate to that point by 1984 and isn’t even to that point yet (probably in large part due to LRH’s influence), but we are getting there. Miscavige wants to be Big Brother so bad, but there are just to many intelligent people with lots of integrity shining the spotlight of Truth on him.
    If he and his operation were being used as a governmental “real life experiment” he would probably not be aware of it and, in his delusion, maybe couldn’t even understand the concept of someone else having some control of his world. Just my impression of him.

  161. Thank you for posting this George.
    For some reason I was thinking along these lines today regarding myself. The other day I posted a sarcastic comeback to Dr. Faustus in reply to his posting which was critical of statements made by Gerhard Waterkamp in his declaration of independence announcement. While I do believe that his criticism was unwarranted, I myself was very out of line in the way I responded. Specifically,
    I made a pun on his name.
    I was a bit crude.
    and, most importantly, I was not very specific about what I felt was unfair about his criticism.
    For this I wish to personally apologize to Dr. Faustus.
    I will do my best not to “flame” others in the future. In fact I will not even refer to Miscavige’s stature in a derogatory way. I have known many fine, wonderul, and actually “big” people who were of small stature. Miscavige just doesn’t happen to be one of them. 🙂 But this has nothing to do with the size of his body. It has to do with his state of mind and his low state of ethics.
    Anyway I am sorry for my rudeness, Dr. Faustus.

  162. S.D.,
    I am not sure of this, but it is possible that Safe was referring to Alexander Hamilton from the Revolutionary War era who was a Federalist, in favor of a more centralized government.
    By the way I appreciate your concerns (which echo mine) with regards to Standard Tech in the Independent Era. I do not claim to have figured out an answer to the dilemma, but I do agree that there is a vacuum there and I also agree that some attempt should be made to fill it. The idea that the COS is keeping the Tech pure is, sadly, a matter of the fox guarding the hen house. Maybe a solution could start with something like a convention of independent Tech terminals who could meet, discuss Technical issues, find points of agreement, and based on these agreements issue non-binding advices as to what is in-tech and out-tech …with supporting references, of course. An idea.

  163. Marty,
    These Miscavige dispatches are amazing. When you first started posting them, they seemed so nasty, venomous, and stupid that it was hard to believe that they were actually real. (That said, we haven’t heard about any libel lawsuits, now have we?)
    These are not dispatches. They are the ravings of a reactive mind dramatizing things that the grades, the FPRD, and the rest of the Bridge is designed to handle.
    An interesting exercise is to take a copy of the 12 characteristics of an SP (from an Ethics book or wherever), read it, and then refer to it as one reads one of Miscavige’s dispatches.
    Like I just said, “amazing”.
    Or maybe I should say, “dumbstruck”.
    And this is one of the more intelligible ones!

  164. Its also a gorgeous description of those factors which an auditor creates in a session, that enables REAL auditing to occur at all, for the benefit of the person being audited. Very apt and eloquent, Carcha!

  165. Beautiful. Rings with truth. You feisty old dog, you! 🙂

  166. Safe,
    Very well written and I agree.
    In my own view, miscavige is still a little boy but with a billion dollar war chest. He can protect himself and do damage – Not good

  167. scilonschools

    Successful Governance can only be achieved with the will of the ‘people’, ‘Will’ has to include an element of trust, Once that trust has been betrayed beyond an acceptable level the governing body has lost governance.
    In my view the RCS (Scientology Inc.) has reached and exceeded that breach of trust!!

  168. “And one of the characteristics of the thetan, the idiot, is he likes to have a game going.”

    This comes close to the Theravadin idea of ‘ignorance’ and thus I agree that there are similarities. In addition, it is possible to retain an attachment to consciousness with scientology. In fact, I read some secondary Buddhist sources which align even more closely with LRH. However, we must stick to the Pali Canon and the Path is very standard.
    Thus we cannot deviate from it and even the Buddha tells us of the danger.
    So for me- its one way or the other – and I must follow Gotama.
    May all mystics be well and happy!

  169. Yeah, and you can be sure he is not writing any such dispatches these days because there is no one there to write to and hasn’t been for years! The place is populated with a bunch of shells, at management level at least. The Estates guys are probably still mowing the lawns and keeping the water running. Good old Waldo, Mats, Leroy and even Crazy Martin Reid.

  170. “But at one time, it was working (even though flawed, and even though contaminated with human foibles).”

    No, I don’t think it was ever working. It went from LRH in complete control to DM in complete control. DM was never “checked”.

  171. Dizzy Mizz Lizzy

    This is the most horrendous description of life in the Sea Org I have ever heard. I fully understand how traumatized you must have been after that experience. Imagine people devoting their entire lives to fight for a better world being given this kind of treatment in return. It is indeed incomprehensible! I´m so happy for you that you are out now and live to tell the story. I wish you all the best!

  172. The existing structure of the church is not ideal at all. It is a straight line of power line of control: CST controls RTC controls CSI. There should be NO trademarks, this is a religion not a business. Churches should be independent and not managed by anyone but those in that church. Public will know if they are getting good service. With no central dictatorship, word will spread if a church is delivering crap. There is no reason a church cannot deliver the entire bridge if they have trained personnel. There is no need for the SO.

  173. I wonder if it’s possible to have an “internet” org?
    You have an org board with people posted on it. Yet these people are in different geographical locations.
    Theory courses could be delivered like extention courses.
    I see much need for ethics help. This could be done with independent ethics officers via e-mail.
    I’d like to be able to determine who practised standard tech.
    I have many tech/policy questions that come up in my life and I sometimes wonder if data I’ve learned really was LRH or dm covertly altering LRH.
    This particularly applies to policies issues after 1981.
    There should an “internet qual”,where one can state their question and a terminal would direct them to a correct on policy/in tech answer.
    This used to be done all the time in an org.
    An org at one time was a place to find answers to life problems. Then orgs became problems.

  174. “I hope someday I am worthy to receive my certificate (SP declare) which will demonstrate me to be worthy of this group.”

    Be assured you are “declared”. Alone reading on Marty’s blog (and God forbid! – even writing) qualifies you as “SP” (DM version). Your badge of honer is there. And your posts on Scientology-cult for sure brought you in the top ranks of the “SP”- list. Thank you for writing that – it is very telling of what is going on behind the stage on the Ship.
    David Miscavige and his (in-) justice people wouldn’t dare to publish that list. Just imagine how long it must be meanwhile – more like an “SP”- book. Even the most “brainwashed” cult members would realize that the ratio is nuts. DM’s personal stat: number of “SP”s made – straight up and vertical (besides No of families and people destroyed). The exodus from his cult (CoS now = Cult of $uppression) clearly showing! – Karola

    My management of a multi billion global player company is concerned because a report says that 13 entries in a relatively unimportant system had not been done correctly. My supervisor told us that another negative report of that kind he cannot deliver to his management.
    You are right, we should not have our attention on stupid things sick minds emanate. I did my best I could to point out that management behaviour is not sane. But I cannot force my supervisor to see the difference between sanity and insanity. It is time to go on and do our own thing.

  176. Hi Lana – Thanks for this! It seems to me that the guys at the top of RCS are pretending to be Five Star Generals when in fact they are nothing further up the chain than a bunch of drill sergeants, who know nothing of leadership, but everything about “breaking the man down and building him/her up into the killing machine needed for war.” Nuts!! And nuts are for squirrels. I am glad tou escaped the madness. Good for you!!

  177. Anon, on your side,
    Thanks for sharing your viewpoint here, I agree with you.
    Re buildings I see it like this: he can keep the buildings. We keep our freedom which is invaluable and move on. Look what people around the world are ready to give up and how they fight for their freedom.
    David Miscavige is sitting in his own trap. He is alone in his mad universe he has created, trying with evil deeds (one is the suppressive application of disconnection) and lies to keep the ones who are hanging around the fringes of his self-made hell from escaping. I wouldn’t want to change with him for all the buildings and riches on earth. I would see the worth of the buildings only in compensating some of the people who suffered and that he cannot do anymore damage with the money. – Karola

  178. OMG! Pink legs! This is the reference that has been used to force staff to attack other staff — as if they don’t just “those pink legs? Oh, he didn’t like you Sir”, then it is a sign that you are not loyal and have your own crimes or withholds from the power (DM). This was a policy that the entirety of RTC had to wordclear Method3 and Method 9, and the entire org was assigned a condition of Confusion when we did not “pink legs” someone who had written and broadly issued an attack on DM.

  179. Thank you for your story Doug. I totally get it.
    You are right — here’s to walking on, and to creating a new scene!

  180. Gern Gaschoen

    You really could have described, to a tee, Vienna Org too.

  181. Thanks Brian. Love your post.

  182. So true, so true!

  183. You are right Shannon. BUT — as you and I have both discussed — at any point any former Int base staff member finds himself/herself on the outside (blown, ejected, thrown out, offloaded, or any other way), there is help here, and friends, and a very large family to provide support.

    Anyone reading this — who needs help, support, or even just someone to talk to — There is a vast support network out here — so just reach out.

  184. Gern Gaschoen

    Steve, get trained. Get Trained. Train, train, train. Don’t stop. Get straight in the chair and Audit. LRH wrote up the Auditors hat, and damn if that isn’t the absolutely most important thing that Scientology needs right now.

    Also, about those Anon protestors .. get ’em in, give them a body route, put a couple in session. They’re interested in Scientology, for cryin’ out loud!!!!

  185. I hope someday I am worthy to receive my certificate (SP declare) which will demonstrate me to be worthy of this group.

    You don’t need their crappy piece of paper to validate anything. You’re worthy to be here. Period.

  186. A few days ago my wife read a Sutta to me in which the Buddha called a monk a pig in order to get his attention. It worked. There is also a famous story where the Buddha calls a monk ’empty-headed’ even though the monk was an accomplished teacher with a large following.
    It was rough and tumble in 500 BC.

  187. Perfectly stated Carcha.

  188. Safe, I’m with you 100%. Raising three kids should be soooo completely different thanks to LRH. I can totally see what that should look like.

  189. 14 linear feet of shelf space – YUK! Talk about enmested.
    You’re right Steve. My best way to bypass is to make it my personal responsibility to get myself and my kids up the Bridge. While I was in, I gave that responsibility to the Cof$ to some degree. That’s being PTS, letting (ultimately) an SP be in control of my spiritual journey. Learned my lesson on that one!

  190. That WAS excellent Carcha!
    You rehabbed for me the value fo just listening and being a “terminal” for someone. I do it all the time, but I started to feel (while in the cult) that it wasn’t really a “product” so wasn’t that valuable.
    I now know that is EXTREMEMLY valuable.
    Thanks for reminding me.

  191. And when all those busy little hives are buzzing with happy pcs, DM will attack. Then turn it around and say, “hey, what about religious freedom, I thought you were all on it Pope Boy?”

  192. Tony I love it, “smoked out mother hive”

  193. Yes, Lana, you are correct. And that is exactly what the Independent Scientology network is all about!

  194. Les,
    Big, broad, ear to ear smiling on this “side” 🙂

  195. ‘Endurance asserts the truth of unkillability. We’re still here, can’t be unmocked. This drives the SP wild.” LRH, F.O. ETHICS PRESENCE.

    All of you, and Shannon too, muchos presence.

  196. Wow. Great post.

  197. Another little bit of A=A=A nullification that I just became aware of.

    “disaffected” means: dissatisfied with those in authority and no longer willing to support them. (Oxford concise dict.)

    I remember the first words out of Anita’s mouth when I began my 2 hour dissertation of my initial doubt formula. She said, “you sound disaffected.”
    My response was, You’re damn right I am.

    I thought back at all the times this word was used by org terminals. In every case there was a covert inference that I was “disaffected” with Ron or with “command intention.” The subtle way they use the line to twist it so you cannot be pissed at the little sociaopath miscavige without being disaffected from Ron or the tech. The covert positioning of scientology philosophy with “command intention.”

    Nice post Marty. Now I feel a bit more disinfected.


  198. “Any person at the Int base — you have to admit — ANY person at the Int base, ANY bird in a tree, ANY June bug flying around a porch light, would be a monumental, stupendous, profound improvement over David Miscavige.”

    The June bug gets my vote.


  199. I completely agree. I see another one in saying to someone “oh, you’re an ex-scientologist” when in reality the person is an independent scientologist.

  200. Yes, whatever independents eventually form as coordination / cooperation units, those units must be be acting to provide service to the individuals that empowered it, not the other way around. Ergo, no top-down, hierarchical authority using domination and control to usurp power.

  201. Hi Steve and welcome! Book One auditing – awesome! If you do that well, you can pretty easily become a metered auditor, at least that’s how it was for me. I haven’t been in the church for a while now and cannot even imagine how crazy it must seem these days. Out here in independent land, all you need are friends who apply LRH. You took the best first step by communicating here.

  202. threefeetback

    +1, forwarding the subject of Scientology as a ‘Third Dynamic’ activity.

  203. Wow Safe. Sorry about your mother.

  204. Thank you, guys. If I’m going to be right about anything, I hope it’s about auditing. You are leading edge, learned beings … it feels really good to get such wonderful validation from you for my thoughts on the subject and calling of spiritual counseling! (P.S. I left out that it’s great fun, didn’t I?) – Carcha.

  205. Hello George:
    “This comes close to the Theravadin idea of ‘ignorance’ and thus I agree that there are similarities.”
    I don’t think, the urge to have a Game is only because of ignorance or idiocy. For some beings responsibility plays a role, too. As the concept of the Boddhisattva vow; from Wikipedia:
    “Traditionally, a bodhisattva is anyone who, motivated by great compassion, has generated bodhicitta, which is a spontaneous wish to attain Buddhahood for the benefit of all sentient beings.”

    “In Mahāyāna Buddhism life in this world is compared to people living in a house that is on fire. People take this world as reality pursuing worldly projects and pleasures without realizing that the house is on fire and will soon burn down (due to the inevitability of death). A bodhisattva is one who has a determination to free sentient beings from samsara and its cycle of death, rebirth and suffering.”
    ( I know, this is not from Pali Canon, I only want to emphasize, that some “games” are not out of idiocy and have a deeper purpose.)

    All best,

  206. Hi Sally, did you find my email address from before? If not it’s I would be delighted to hear from you.


  207. morelivesthanacat

    “D. How internet works”.

    Dave, the rest of the world refers to it as “the internet”. “Net stands for “network”.

    You really sound like a dufus who thinks he’s a genius.

    By the way, since you know how it works, how come yours is so fucked up?
    How come comments are disabled on your anti-Marty sites?
    How come no one visits them except us when we go there for a chuckle or to see what’s currently coming out of the so-called mind of a drunken dufus genius?

    Now figure it out. Especially since I already went over how the rest of the world knows you’re a dufus. (clue: internet)

  208. Lana, you nailed it. Sorry you and other able beings like you were put through that! The contagion of aberration ran all the way down to our mission, but definitely not to that degree, at least by the time I saw the writing on the wall, that is.
    If it weren’t for Steve’s website and Marty’s blog, I’d probably still be waiting till next lifetime to try again…

  209. Newcomer, sometimes you have to take the lead and disconnect from Cof$ for the sake of your family – so that they have the courage to follow.

  210. Bill, glad you’re still standing! You’re right, a declare would prove they couldn’t kill ya! But we know they couldn’t anyway!

  211. threefeetback

    One has to ask onself, what if someone had applied that policy to the letter? Since dueling is not “in fashion” in the politically correct civilized world, would that person be demonized to this day? Would some still mourn the loss of the beast?

    A good philosophical approach to this would be to move forward with Scinetology on the ‘third dynamic’ acting as though the beast is dead (though only somewhat defanged). Being correctly labled and handled as a Suppressive is the hanging of Scientology.

  212. threefeetback

    The beast prefers to squash his enemies ‘like a bug,’ and has been known to ask ‘whart did so-and-so ever do for us?’

  213. It’s hard for a psychotic “pope boy” to be rational.. LOL!!!

  214. threefeetback

    Just as LRH studied the subject of study to develop his Study Technology, it behooves the Independent Field to FIX Scientology with Scientology.

  215. Dan,

    David LaCroix is trying to do something like this in Scientolipedia. The big difference with a Co$ style central org is that registering is non-mandatory.
    I suggest you write down all your ideas and concern and get in comm. with David.

    There is a standard tech certification board (also registered in Scientolipedia): APIS, The Association of Professional Independent Scientologists.
    In order to avoid future situations like Co$, there should be more than one independent certification boards, so to avoid monopoly.

  216. If an official “badge of honor” is not available, it can be done with the Do It Yourself Declare Kit. This kit is better than the official, because here one can state the real causes of the “declare”. 🙂

  217. threefeetback

    A constitutional, non collectivist, civilization provides a fertile environment for Scientology to FLOURISH.

  218. It’s good that Marty is disinfecting the Co$’s disaffecteds. 🙂

  219. “As for “Ex-Scientologists”, thank you for pointing that out — I see how if one took the term out of context of my entire statement it doesn’t say what I meant. Saying the list is comprised of “Former Scientology Inc. members and staff” would be a much better stand alone statement.”
    ————— SD

    Independent Scientologists are not “former scientologists” or X- scientologists. We are Scientologists practicing Scientology independent of Church, Inc. Why mess with that?

    As to ensuring Qual or study tech or demo kits or standard programming and delivery, indeed these are all things each of us can (and should) also be increasingly responsible for. If you’re unsure of something, query it. If you can’t apply something, study it, clear up the MUs and drill it. Maybe I’m missing the point but there is no guarantee that any programming or auditing you received in the last decade+ within Miscavige, Inc. (including GAT drills) is standard tech, too often otherwise in fact.

    Another comforting thing to know is that there are already, and a growing number of trained auditors and CS’s and crs. supers and OT’s in the field to help sort out each other.

  220. plainoldthetan

    We have been bypassing Scientology Inc for some time. And I for one don’t mind it a bit. What I see in Miscavige’s missive is that he’s bypassing. Everyone. All the time. The Ideal Org program is a bypass. Why? Because those stupid parishioners aren’t overpaying for substandard delivery. The IAS is a bypass. Why? Because Scientology Inc’s efforts to extort money on standard delivery lines was going too slow. The Basics were a bypass. Why? Because CMU wasn’t coming up with workable techniques to sell LRH books in the standard way. And when a “senior” bypasses compulsively, he puts his juniors in Danger. Just like the current stats of the church demonstrate.

    Miscavige puts people in Danger. And he puts the church in Danger.

    And he’s putting the Bridge in Danger.

    So Miscavige must be bypassed.

    Pretty simple, isn’t it?

  221. newcomer,
    Nice to have you among us thetans here, on this li’l blue planet.

  222. Alex Castillo

    David Miscavige was nullifying people long before the Internet in 1982.

    I was “nullified” by him false reporting to the US government that I was a wanted criminal, resulting in Federal Agents visiting my business with guns in hand, looking for weapons that weren’t there, but still carting me off to jail in LA, pending investigation of the claims RTC (COB) had made concerning me, whose only crime was to blow the Flag Land Base. Yes, he had already started not just nullifying but actually destroying people’s lives just for disagreeing with his buddying, covert empire, which he started while the Old Man was sick and unable to do anything.

    Nothing new about what he is now doing.


  223. Ub,
    “The memo posted in today’s blog is mind-boggling on several levels. I have never seen anything like it. I’m assumming it’s bonafide. It’s unbelievable.”

    Yep, that’s our Dave. And by “our” I mean not just us Scientologists, but all the peoples. He’s a prize to be sure. An “only one”.

  224. plainoldthetan

    Ironic. Under Hitler, “coordination” took on a totally new and different meaning…one that would help consolidate Hitler’s iron-fisted rule.

    Under Miscabbage, it means the same.

  225. plainoldthetan

    9-foot-high-fence: ETHICS, THE DESIGN OF

  226. dear,
    threefeetback i did not get it,what do you mean?

  227. Anyone here put on the RPF or forced to do mest work while under security guard?

  228. Applause! Standing ovation!

  229. Any chance you are the same Dan that was the ED there for eons?

  230. threefeetback

    +1, Ugh. What are the odds of reviving that US Government, Bin Laden style, raid of the ‘Hole’?

  231. Alex Castillo

    Correction to my report:
    It was 1984, not 1982 and I was married to someone who was a key staff member of David Mayo’s AAC in Santa Barbara CA. Marty and Mike Rinder would have been aware of that RTC Op.


  232. I am newly off-lines and welcome friendship. I am in the Los Angeles area.

  233. martyrathbun09

    Vaguely. Jesse Prince could tell you in technicolor.

  234. Good Lord. We may have to invent a new name!

  235. And what of nullification of people through the second dynamic at the Int base? The ridicule, the “can’t haves”, the sec checking for “thoughts” and punishing thereof?

    Consider the suppression of the Second Dynamic by the Third Dynamic: what does
    the group think about sex? The first group which might come to mind is the family. The
    family’s affinity on the Second Dynamic, when measured by the basic aberration that plagues
    society at the present time, is very low. Sex is not quite nice and certainly not to be considered
    as a communicable subject. Agreement within the family concerning attitude toward sex is
    rare indeed. What is it for? What is it like? When is it proper? Without agreement there can be
    little basis for reality.
    If an individual has been or is a member of a church group which is selectively
    “thumbs down” on sex, he has been suppressed on the Second Dynamic by the Third. The
    auditor is interested in finding how a group affected this individual’s Second Dynamic. He
    seeks to find incidents which enforced the dynamic, and incidents which inhibited it. “What
    did your family think about children?” It is not always necessary that an attack be made
    against an individual for aberration to manifest – the statements and attitudes of the persons
    around the preclear might easily have upset him, even though they were not directly aimed at
    If the preclear has served a term in the army the auditor will have a broad field for
    exploration of aberration along the Second Dynamic. “What did the army think about sex?”
    This one is always productive of results. “Did you ever go on a three-day pass and find an ‘off
    limits’ sign in the choicest section of the city?” There are few occupied cities which do not
    1 This is the next advance over Hurdy-Gurdy Straight Wire, which is outlined in SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL:
    Simplified, Faster, Dianetic Techniques.
    contain a rash of “off limits” signs. “Did you ever attend an army lecture about venereal
    disease?” Of course he did, and if the usual gentle and genteel service communications on
    venereal disease were given, the preclear will have many locks on the subject.
    One case was opened by working with the Second Dynamic as it related to the group
    in this way: A young man had been raised in a very self-righteous family, and attended church
    from earliest childhood. As he grew older a very likeable preacher became the man he most
    wanted to emulate, and one of this preacher’s pet sermons was to call hellfire and damnation
    down upon the head of anyone who would think or talk about sex. When the young man went
    into the army he began to hear and see as a common occurrence those very things which his
    preacher had called down. The general attitude on sex in the army was so radically different
    from what he had been used to that the difference between the inhibition of one group and the
    enforcement of the other made him almost psychotic. The auditor used straight wire on both
    the enforcements and inhibitions on sex, and rapidly raised the young man’s reality and
    general tone.
    Sometimes a girl tells her auditor how nice her dear little pussycats are, but that men
    and women are awfully nasty. She says that if men and women were only as nice and
    considerate as her little pets everything would be all right. Somebody in this girl’s vicinity has
    been talking about how bad people are, and demanding her agreement on the subject. Straight
    wire in search of such locks will soon relegate her pussycat to its rightful place in her life.
    What of the suppressing effect of the First Dynamic on the Second? If an individual
    has been told that he doesn’t love anybody and can’t love anybody, he will have a hard time
    with his affinity for his children. If he has been told that he has to be right all the time and that
    he has to make other people do the right thing, his agreement with his children will come
    chronically down to 1.5 on the tone scale. He will dominate the children, or try to. If he has
    been told that he must talk, his children will have a hard time attracting his attention to their
    ideas. In considering the things in general that the preclear thinks about children and sex, the
    auditor is considering the suppressing effect of the entheta of the Second Dynamic on the
    theta of the Second Dynamic. He can in this way determine that the Second Dynamic is
    suppressing the Second Dynamic. With this in mind, the auditor immediately sees a set of
    questions to ask.


    September, 1951
    The Hubbard Dianetic Foundation, Inc.
    Wichita, Kansas
    From a Lecture by
    L. Ron Hubbard

  236. So true, threefeetback. With that fertile environment, with suppression taken off the 4th dynamic, Earth’s entire civilization will prosper. Imagine the beauty our world would have already developed into, were it not for collectivism to get in Freedom’s way. I’ve had high hopes to see the 4th dynamic finally handled in my lifetime.

  237. “I am not sure of this, but it is possible that Safe was referring to Alexander Hamilton from the Revolutionary War era who was a Federalist, in favor of a more centralized government.”

    Espiritu, sharp and correct observation. 🙂

  238. TO: IMO this would not be applicable to someone who is a “voluntary” worker like a Sea Org Member. See the recent Headley decision. People can and do leave the RPF if their will is strong enough. Doesnt work that way in prison.

  239. Alex Castillo

    Thanks Marty. I would like to know the details of that Op in technicolor, just for the sake of closure. How do I get in touch with Jessie? Is he all right though? Last time I heard of him his physical health was not in a very good shape and wouldn’t like to burden him with questions about the past. I remember him from my distant past and he always gave me the impression that he was a good man. Christ, I didn’t even know he was involved in that one! Nancy Many wrote something about it in her book My Billion Year Contract but it was all a bit vague, just as your memory of it is. Like I said, I am just seeking details for the sake of closure. I am knocking on 72 and at my age one doesn’t want to have mysteries floating around one’s universe.


  240. threefeetback

    examples of nullifications of Scientologists, also a typo: what, not whart

  241. Another Layer

    Beautiful on all counts, Jim Logan! Thank you.

  242. And don’t forget from HCOPL “Ethics Presence”… “…Against noncompliance you add ferocity … Wrath is effective…”
    On all of these excerpts, David Miscavige omits the rest of the story that gives proper context to everything.
    All he sees are the words that communicate in or below 2.0 on the tone scale because that is all that is real to him.

  243. S.D., when you wrote, “The Indie 500 list, for example is Ex-Scientologists”

    Then you replied back to me with;

    “I see how if one took the term out of context of my entire statement it doesn’t say what I meant.”

    To suggest I just “took the term out of context” is ridiculous. Why not just say “Oops, my bad.” Then you would seem much less disingenuous and more believable to me.

  244. Li'll bit of stuff

    Lana, Marty,Mike, You have lived through some of the most heinous atrocities ever committed under the banner of “religion”, and yet you have used
    the experience to not only strengthen, and to proof
    yourselves, against future abuse of this type, but
    you have made it possible for so many others, who
    have followed you, or are yet to follow, to gain from
    your experiences, through your courage and resolve.
    It is plainly obvious, that when you have spoken of
    a 4 YEAR decompression period, that is a most
    severe amount of mental trauma, and crippling of
    one’ mental health & faculties to overcome. Visitors
    to this site need to get some perspective of just
    how damaging this radical, sadistic and psychopathic
    behaviour, can be, upon one’s capacity to regain a
    sense of “normality” again. Thank God for the power
    of LRH’s Standard Auditing Tech, the Standard
    Auditor’s Code, Simple ARC, and the willingness to
    believe in the basic goodness of one’s fellows, but
    most importantly, the ability to believe in yourselves,
    We’re all here today, because of You….and LRH!
    Thank you!

  245. martyrathbun09

    Apparently he’s recovered. You can find him on facebook.

  246. Thank you, Tara, for the ack. Yes, my mom became depressed after her 3rd child (when I was 5) which psychotherapists today call postpartum depression (PPD). This wasn’t identified then.

    Whether this depression is real or imagined, the psychs in that time in history started her on extremely strong drugs, which made her look crazy. This crazy appearance scared my dad into allowing the psychs to give her shock treatments. Little did he know it was the drugs that were making her look nuts.

    Today, PPD is treated much more gently.

    “Many women recover with a treatment consisting of a support group or counseling.”

    My father was never a Scientologist so he didn’t have a clue. He believes in the inerrant Word of God, along with the rest of my family. I’m the first generation Scientologist and still the only Scientologist my family. (That’s been a challenge in itself.)

    Had my dad read Dianetics or Scientology by 1963, I would have had a normal childhood with a loving mother, as he would never have then allowed heavy psych drugs or shock “therapy” to be used on my mom.

    It goes to show;

    The ignorance of people who haven’t read Dianetics or Scientology ALSO destroys lives.

  247. No. I’m a different Dan. The Dan that you ask about is the current ED, who is holding most the posts from above.

  248. threefeetback

    A big step towand taking on the 4th would be to activate the process of becoming a State of The United States; Hawaii and Alaska being the last ones admitted. Places like Afganistan and Iraq should have been able to make the move by now. Afganistan is rich in rare-earth minerals and Iraq would be the major oil producing State. To hell with anyone accusing a Republic of being Imperialist.

  249. > “Maybe a solution could start with something like a convention of independent Tech terminals who could meet, discuss Technical issues, find points of agreement, and based on these agreements issue non-binding advices as to what is in-tech and out-tech …with supporting references, of course. An idea.”

    I think in that direction are going David LaCroix with Scientolipedia and Michael Moore with APIS (The Association of Professional Independent Scientologists).

  250. Calvin,
    I operate more on a “damn the torpedos” approach than worrying about the threat. Any real or imagined damage would be miniscule compared to that being received daily by those arriving at the kool-aide stand.

    But when I overstep I like to think I have the humility to accept it as well.

  251. I don’t think globalism is a good solution.
    It’s part of A=A=A if you look closer.
    I am not a friend of the European Union neither.
    I love cultural diversity.

  252. Hubbard was a creative man who seems to have been determined to recover from the negativity he encountered in the armed forces and while being evaluated by psychiatrists. So he invented his own “science”, which consists of his observations expressed with his own distorted use of language and labeled with numbers. Trying to “save” Scientology by creating an independent movement is likely to simply incur accusations of copyright infringement from Scientology, Inc.

    “Independents” will reach more people if they revert to standard, commonly known words to replace Hubbard’s eccentric vocabulary. Unfortunately, special vocabularies create a separation between the “in group” who know them and the “out” group who don’t. It’s designed to reinforce the idea that Scientologists are a group whose special knowledge sets them apart from others and establishes them as having a unique understanding of human nature.

    This isn’t true of Scientology or of any other religious or “philosophical” group and reinforces a separation between people that contradicts the stated purpose of the “church”.

    No one possesses the “secrets” of human existence because we each have an equal connection to the forces that create and sustain us.

    That knowledge is freely available directly through our everyday life, emotions, dreams, mediation, and intuition as well as through study with people who have achieved certain levels of accomplishment, like Robert Monroe, or William Buhlman, who have mastered how to have out-of-body experiences and who teach it without any memberships or long-term commitments required of the students.

    You can pick up a second-hand book and with a little bit of effort teach yourself how to do this and then proceed to see what spiritual growth results from your own direct experience, uncontrolled by anyone who promotes you to new levels (after you pay a lot of money).

    As an outsider to Scientology and other religions, it seems that there is a nostalgic attachment to the rituals (whether you call them audits, confessions, prayers, hymns, sutras, sermons, etc.) which “leaders” promise will give you mastery over the human condition. The emotional highs and comfort that comes from these rituals can be found in an infinite number of other ways, free from the structure of controlling organizations.

    In addition, many former/independent Scientologists seem to feel a need to redeem and justify the many years of your/their lives that were spent supporting what has evolved into a corrupt, greedy formula for giving people hope and a sense of community while extracting a lot of money and free labor from them.

    Community can be found anywhere that two humans, or simply two living beings, connect with each other, without needing a special vocabulary or structure to make oneself feel like part of a superior group of insiders.

    There are no secrets. You don’t have to go through “levels” of courses to attain insights or some special powers. The truths are within us, each and every one of us, and not just in humans. Everything has an equal connection to the source.

    With regards to Miscavidge, law enforcement and a scrutiny of whether or not he is in compliance with the terms of the nonprofit should be brought to bear on this situation, just like the law has been brought to bear on the Catholic (or any) church that hides abuse of its members, especially children.

    If the independent Scientologists want to make their mark and assert their fundamental difference from the abuses within Scientology in its present form, then someone(s) will have to take responsibility for bringing legal action.

    All of the talk that endlessly enumerates and analyzes Miscavidge’s illegal, abusive and corrupt actions is nothing more than angry lamenting without involving the law. The emotional and factual discussions are necessary for personal healing, but need the scrutiny of the law to really protect against further abuse, exploitation and manipulation.

    Find a team of lawyers who will take this on for free. Many public interest legal groups exist who may be willing to do so. And the apparently deep pockets of Scientology mean that there could be very substantial damages for the church if they lose these lawsuits. This should create some reform or perhaps strip them of their nonprofit status and force a new mission statement that might be closer to the truth – that this is a self-help organization.

  253. What of the people forced against their will? Wasn’t someone held on the Freewinds for seven years under tight security and forced to work?–I-was-held-prisoner-on-a-cruise-ship-for-12-years-by-Scientologists-

    Haven’t other been held against their will and forced to labor (mest work) under security? What about all of those people held under arrest at In Comm, were they put on labor? I know it is not possible to sit on your ass and produce nothing when you are on staff and you suddenly op term.

    There must be hundreds if not thousands of cases of people not being permitted to leave when they say they want to go, and meanwhile forced to labor.

  254. This is the first I’ve seen the Do It Yourself Declare Kit. That is hilarious. So clever!

  255. Tara,
    I think the key point here is the step of the doubt formula where you announce the fact publicly to both sides.

    I have announced that to those I am connected with and I sent an e-mail to the IAS. It’s not like the OSA Bots don’t know who I am. I signed the Obama petition with my real name and I don’t receive mail anymore so I know they know that I know………and those still in know what is true for me. I have zero involvement with the CO$.

    But the point I have pressed is that I don’t support the CO$ forced disconnection policy (esp. since it is no longer practiced by the CO$!) among other things and I will not disconnect from someone because another tells me to do so.

    Meanwhile the whisper campaign goes on with those still in trying to get my friends and family to disconnect from me. So I am giving them all somewhat of a problem because I am applying the flourish and prosper approach. “If your life will be better without me in it then take your best shot…….pull the plug, go your own way”. Those still connected are debt ridden, bankrupt souls who attend events and squirm when Michael Roberts shows up at the tail end of an MV event for a ‘special’ briefing with his computer and projection screen!!!! In reality they know they need to stay connected to someone who can still produce a real product and put food on the table.

    In short, NOT BEING CONNECTED TO THE RADICAL CO$ allows a surplus to occur where before was only heard a loud sucking noise!
    (That would of course be Miscaviage!…according to the illustrious Mike Rinder)

    But I will not desert a comrade in need and those still connected need all the help that can be mustered. I have told them…….”your fellow staff members and friends will be asking you about me. If you need information for a KR let me know…I will give it to you and you can pass it along but I suggest that if someone really wants to know ……have them talk to me”.

    Rest assured, there is not a nut sack in the bunch that has the wherewithal to confront me directly. Reason ………position on the tone scale…… and receiving communication. Those in the RC$ really suck at it!

    So Mr. Dick Breath Davey ……. who am I and when are you going to get your kool-aide drinking robots to disconnectfrom my grody ass?????? Better hurry or maybe I will get them to move up a little higher ……on the tone scale. Your miserable stats are in the toilet.

  256. “In order to avoid future situations like Co$, there should be more than one independent certification boards, so to avoid monopoly.”

    Amen, Mabu.

  257. Thanks Jim,
    Nice to be here among friends ……again! You guys rock!

  258. Thank you. Interesting conversation — even though collectivism is not what I was suggesting nor longing for.

  259. Nope. Not a fact. –“It seems you want Scientology controlled, it appears …

  260. Although …the answer is also Yes, which simply happens when there are operating thetans. Good control is a brilliant, splendid thing in all its pan-determined, games-based glory.

  261. Hi Espiritu,
    I think communication like that is a fabulous idea, too. Especially with the safety to think out loud and cognite!

  262. Ronn S. I said, ” “Former Scientology Inc. members and staff”, not “former scientologists. Two completely different things.

    However, in the Indie list, am I mistaken, or are there also some who love the group but aren’t necessarily loving the application?

  263. I’m amazed that after Tom Cruise’s movie, The Firm, that he didn’t realize a similar control operation is being run in his own church as in his movie. It’s hard for me to believe such an intelligent and good actor can be so oblivious. The alternative is he’s in knowledge of the church’s black operation and enabling it.

  264. Hi Safe. You have a lot of spunk. I didn’t mean to give you a personal indication on that. I’d like to indicate my comment acted as a wrong indication.

  265. Interesting. Well, perhaps what I experienced with Hubbard in complete control was better control then. But you make an interesting point as a framework from which to postulate the future activity. Thanks for your comment.

  266. So true! What is Scientology if you’re not an auditor? Certainly not the Pompadour HaircGolden Podium Fleecers Enlightened Grand PoohPah Cult it has become in Scientology Inc. As an auditor, one is a true friend to life in every form.

  267. Great. “Coordination” and even “orders” and “control” are not dirty words for sure. Speaking personally, I can take orders, give them, coordinate, and also NOT take orders. Tone Level and Purpose of any activity determine its Character.

    The moment people in Scientology Inc were off-policy, I refused the order. When I realized something was systemically very off and stacked against truth, I applied the conditions and disconnected, befirending the legacy of knowledge (i.e. scientology)

  268. S.D. , first you wrote; | August 10, 2012 at 6:14 pm

    “Nope. Not a fact.” to my comment of ”It seems you want Scientology controlled, it appears …

    Then one minute later, you write; | August 10, 2012 at 6:15 pm

    “Although …the answer is also Yes, which simply happens when there are operating thetans. Good control is a brilliant, splendid thing in all its pan-determined, games-based glory.”

    So I get a “Nope” from you, then a minute later, also a “Yes”.

    Both a yes and a no on the same question doesn’t make sense to me???

    Do you believe in involuntary “good control”?

    Should control of Scientology be voluntary or involuntary?

    Who should be the final authority of controlling Scientology?

  269. When one or a few determine what is “best” for the many, and controls these many, that’s collectivism. What you wrote appeared to be that to me.

  270. Cool thought. I think every single person on Earth and in this universe has the inalienable right to practice Scientology freely, whenever, wherever. Any kind of organization whether a network of groups, in comm or not, would be for the purpose of comfort (from the French root…”with” and “strength”).

    My point was when you walk into Subway, you know the kind of sandwiches you’re getting and I like that. If someone is making pizza, they shouldn’t be delivering out of Subway.

  271. “Those still connected are debt ridden, bankrupt souls who attend events and squirm when Michael Roberts shows up at the tail end of an MV event for a ‘special’ briefing with his computer and projection screen!!!!”

    Michael Roberts is still doing his suppressing a guilt on others?

    I remember in 1998 I was excited to go to briefing at the Sandcastle, and Michael Roberts was putting pressure on the audience one at a time with “What are you going to do about it?” I watched in amazement.

    Finally, he came to me with his “What are you going to do about it?”

    I stood up, then hollered loudly, “This is bullshit suppressiveness!”, and then walked out to the exit from a very stunned audience.

  272. Welcome, DarnIt!

    Tell your story if you wish. I’d love to hear it.

  273. Both a yes and a no on the same question doesn’t make sense to me???

    I don’t think in Dichotomies — For a fun exercise, clear the word:

    and to clarify:
    Nope, I don’t want bad control
    Yes, I love good control.

    Do you believe in involuntary “good control”?
    1. There i no such thing.
    2. Control isn’t a belief, it’s an application — a productive one, or an unproductive one.

    Should control of Scientology be voluntary or involuntary?
    I’m not much of a subscriber to slavery, so I go with Voluntary.

    Who should be the final authority of controlling Scientology?
    Each individual being. It’s called Choice and Responsibility.

  274. Today is a historic day in Scn…10 Aug! Too bad Mc Garbage won’t read any of the PTS data!

  275. I like the donation idea. This blog is a real service to the world and to individuals.

    I went to the Scientologipedia and notice they have a Subscribe button, with suggested donation $10. monthly.

    The Donate button above on this blog doesn’t work as a button, but the link can be cut n pasted in to PayPal (or just use the email).

    Because this blog is so valuable, I think monthly, (weekly, yearly) donations or yearly “subscriptions” would flow power to it. So I have given myself a Start on donations. Thank you for the blog, and thank you to all who communicate here.

  276. Safe:
    P.S. Hamilton “…was more concerned with who controlled the components of commerce than the nature of the economic elements.”

    He sure had things backwards and inverted.

    BTW, another thought I had was realizing that eventually resources will emerge. For example, Jim Logan is a phenomenal Qual terminal in that, with the asking, he can produce a reference or a helpful material. So maybe “Posts” could even be held on the internet, as a resource and help back up. Etc.

    Eventually it will all sort itself out.

    As for Collectivism, it exists apart from Hamilton (though he is a good example in American history).

    Collectivism within any social structure, be it religion, political, or other, stresses the important of the group over the individual. IMHO, this easily fosters groupthink and elitism, and too often a hybrid of both, where the lowest common denominator inflates itself as a hierarchy on the delusion that it is superior and working for the “higher cause” (i.e., the group).

    It is an observable fact that individuals contribute to leaps of forward progress, culturally and otherwise.

    Collectivism does cite the “interdependence” of individuals however. This is something I have observed in both positive and negative gain. Interdependence as Positive gain: Teamwork, such as a NASA team, or an Olympic team, or a rescue operation. Interdependence as negative gain: Being a flea on a dog, as in living in a society that has nuclear war capability. No question, well-being is somewhat of an interdependent scenario.

    So I’m not much into opposing or supporting any kind of “isms” from the debate standpoint. They tend to introduce binary thinking. Having a good grasp of them is vital, though, in taking the pandetermined view and avoiding traps.

  277. Joe Pendleton

    Les, you are entirely correct. “Disaffected” to a Scientologist, when refferring to someone else means “do not put ANY value on the meaning or content of their communication; that person is completely charged up and that’s where that communication is coming from.” It is COMPLETELY used as a form of nullifying/making nothing of their communication so that the content will not be listened to, analyzed or understood. In the old days, the charge was usually “he’s criticial” or “he has withholds.” But “disaffected” has been much more effective as it essentially categorizes the person completely as saying that they are currently worthless as a terminal of any significance (as viewed by the church).

  278. Hehe.
    You’re cool.

    I’ve seen this guy once in Hamburg Org in duo with Jeff Pomeranz.
    Bullshit suppressiveness, you’re right, that’s all it is.

  279. I took it the same way as Safe, and replied accordingly since I did read it and duplicate it. I am curious S.D., why do you have to throw out some extra inapplicable “indications” you’re a punk, er, I meant have spunk?

  280. Also, there are staff that have been worked that were no longer “volunteering” or “voluntarily” there. This is the KEY WORD. When that condition changes one is No Longer a “volunteer” but a captive.

  281. Your more than welcome to my help Bill. You have helped me many times over the years.

    Besides, a future without my ol’ buddy “Nuclear Bill” Straass is a future I don’t want to be in!

  282. “David Miscavige and his (in-) justice people wouldn’t dare to publish that list. Just imagine how long it must be meanwhile – more like an “SP”- book. Even the most “brainwashed” cult members would realize that the ratio is nuts. DM’s personal stat: number of “SP”s made – straight up and vertical (besides No of families and people destroyed). The exodus from his cult (CoS now = Cult of $uppression) clearly showing!”

    Those are some pretty darn funny lines there, Karola!

  283. Bill,

    You weren’t just “one of the best engineers” on the ship. You were THE BEST engineer on the ship. Whenever no one else could figure something out, we knew what to do – Call “Nuclear Bill”!

    Within short-order, you’d figure out the problem (no matter how obscure), and we’d be up and running again.

    Your contributions and intention to help are HUGE! No one can ever take that away from you.

    I love you, buddy.


  284. Scott Weible

    Churchill was a remarkable fellow … to whom all free peoples owe an enormous debt of gratitude.

    I highly recommend the two books which William Manchester wrote about Churchill before Manchester fell ill (I think to Parkinson’s Disease) … one of which is entitled “The Last Lion”.

  285. Yup, SPs thrive in chaos.

  286. My question wasn’t answered, which was asked sincerely.
    In the Indie 500 list, am I mistaken, or are there also some who (by thier own statements, nothing nefarious here and place no other significance on it) love the group but aren’t necessarily loving the application?

    To answer Ronn S: (why do you have to throw out some extra inapplicable “indications” you’re a punk, er, I meant have spunk?)
    I don’t have to, but in the spirit of a vigorous discussion It was an observation communicated to Safe intended as a compliment –not an “indication.” The definition of spunk is: “courage or spirit.” Since I felt the admiration, I communicated it.

    Anyhoo, what started this discourse was my voicing a wish and a bit of longing for the days when I could bring someone into an org and know that would get help, with the full lineup I studied and understand. Or when I could walk in, and go to the Academy daily, or in session daily, with the full support team.

    Those days do not exist, that help has been thoroughly betrayed by Scientology Inc. It is dead. My wish for consistency and a preservation of and knowing WHERE to get that, Scientology that I know works,”standard tech” if you will, does not equal I am pro-Gestapo Organizations, collectivism, any ism, or anything beyond itself.

  287. Safe,
    He absolutely is. What a slime bucket! It’s the only way he can make a living……parasitically sucking off the bankrupt souls and putting 10% of his ill gotten proceeds into his own account. The most recent event I speak of was the first MV event, 2012 and he projected a quota of $80,000 on the screen at the beginning of his special event which occurred immediately following the MV event.

    Should he have made his quota, I assume it would mean he put $8,000 in his own account……………..unless the Midget bumps the commission if quotas are made.

    I was not present but know that the person who was squirming…….could little afford the $100 C-note that was given before getting up to leave.

  288. Oh Jim! You do so make me laugh! Your way with words is second to none 🙂

  289. In just the last 24 hours I have been contacted by 3 individuals who haev recently escaped/defected, wanting to hook up, get some help and assistance, and to move on up the Bridge (standardly!). My list of contacts in Australia alone is now up over 50 — not to mention those in South Africa, New Zealand, Singapore and Bali…

    Hey Davey — your sheeple are leaving in droves! Seems they are realising that your flock is not as it seems. They have come to see that you are actually a wolf dressed in sheep’s clothing — and they have decided they are sick of being fleeced.

    The word is on the street that your Church of Greed, Power and Suppression is not delivering the wanted happiness and freedom that people were after. They have seen that to get standard LRH tech, it is best to go out, rather than stay in and under the control of your dogs.

    I think you will have to up the dosage in your Kool Aide. Just doesn’t seem to be holding people anymore…

    It sucks to be Miscavige.

  290. Welcome here and thanks for writing to me earlier today. You are among friends. As you feel ready — tell your story. No rush. Take a deep breath first and enjoy your newly earned freedom 🙂

  291. TO: I am not trying to agree with the actions of the RCS, merely commenting on the state of the law. A lawsuit filed by a prisoner (which has not yet been won) isnt the same as one filed by a “voluntary” worker — even if the “voluntary” worker was mentally coerced. All the church has to do is show that people HAVE left the RPF or Gold or whatever and depose the people concerned and ask them if they ever demanded to leave and were physically prevented from doing so. I do not agree with this, but the fact is that it would be a big mistake to think that suddenly a floodgate just opened that will free anyone in the RPF or in the Hole. Sadly, it won’t be through a civil lawsuit.

  292. I went to Flag in May and had a horrid trip. If people think Flag is okay now, it is not. Maybe I should just post a copy of my letter to RTC regarding my trip ! At least that way someone would read it …. (PS I so love the Inde’s)

  293. Safe wrote: It appears you’re fairly fresh out of the chaos of the regime, and are still sorting it out and decompressing. I understand. Most here have been before you and understand what’s going on, and the frustration of it.
    Safe, Keep your Obnosis drill in before coming to conclusions. It’s been years since I assigned Scientology Inc. a lower condition, when I had no terminals or support except my own observation and integrity. I wasn’t that compressed, but will be forever grateful to Marty Rathbun and others who spoke out, and who hlpe people by applying Scientology.

  294. threefeetback,
    I think you will find some answers in this article:

  295. Great reference Mike.
    That same reference, almost word for word, can be found in Science of Survival. Chapter, Subjects method of handling others. One of my favorites and one I used a lot in Chaplains cylces and ethics handlings.

  296. Sweet!! Lol!! Good going Lana!!

  297. It’s funny how the cult can only try to discredit sources of information as “unreliable”, “defrocked apostates”, “failed case”, etc.
    I myself have never subscribed that any person was INCAPABLE of telling the truth. Anyone, can tell the truth at least occasionally. A bum on the stree can tell the truth. A junkie can tell the truth.
    Sure they can lie too. The trick is to be smart enough to observe and calculate the odds. Even if all of us were “defrocked criminals” or “apostates of satan”, there is no way in hell that all of this is just one big coordinated conspiracy. I think it is a mathematical impossibility. Plus the odds of everyone “keeping the secret” is against all of the odds too.
    If you can’t see that dm is an SP and the “church” is corrupt, then you are in very bad shape and need some clean up and de-PTSing.

  298. Going back to earlier and earlier similars, nullification is a suppressive idea which started back as early as 1834, in these united States of America. (I realize in other older countries, it goes way earlier.)

    Dumbing down the intelligence of the masses is real. Ron tried to reverse this trend. I’m amazed how much in PT LRH was regarding this. After LRH, David Miscavige reversed Scientology into dumbing people down. (DM took out 3 study tapes on education which addressed this issue.)

    Here’s a little back history of this nullification in America; (A couple video links are at the end)

    On the night of June 9th, 1834 a group of prominent men “chiefly engaged in commerce” gathered privately in a Boston drawing room to discuss a scheme of universal schooling. Even thought the literacy rate in Massachusetts was 98 percent, and in neighboring Connecticut, 99.8 percent, the assembled businessmen agreed the present system of schooling allowed too much upon chance.

    “It encouraged more entrepreneurial exuberance than the social system could bear.”

    – The Minutes of this meeting are Appleton Papers Collection, Massachusetts Historical Society

    In 1852, the first compulsory schooling laws went into effect in Massachusetts. Eighty percent of the public resisted this new law. “In 1880, it took the militia to persuade the parents of Barnstable, on Cape Cod, to give up their children to the system.”

    – Sheldon Richman, Separating School and State: How to Liberate American Families

    “We want one class of persons to have a liberal education and we want another class of persons, a very much large class of necessity in every society, to forgo the privilege of a liberal education and fit themselves to perform specific difficult manual tasks.”

    – Woodrow Wilson, at the Address to the Federation of High School Teachers

    “The conditioning of modern American society began with John Dewey, a psychologist, a Fabian Socialist and “Father of Progressive Education.” Dewey use the psychology developed by Wilhelm Wundt, and believe that through a stimulus-response approach (like Pavlov) students could be conditioned for a new social order.

    – Charlotte Iserbyt, The Deliberate Dumbing Down of America

    “I believe that education is a regulation of the process of coming to share in the social consciousness; and that adjustment of individual activity on the basis of this social consciousness is the on sure method of social reconstruction.”

    – John Dewey

    “That erroneous assumption is to the effort that the aim of public education is to fill the young of the species with knowledge and awaken their intelligence … Nothing could be further from the truth.

    The aim of public education is not to spread enlightenment to all; it is simply to reduce as many individuals as possible to the same safe level, to breed and train a standardized citizenry, to put down dissent and originality. That is the aim in the United States, whatever the pretensions of polititcians, pedagogues, and other such mountebanks, and that is the aim everywhere else.”

    – H.L. Menchen, The American Mercury, April 1924

    The Dark Intentions of Public Schooling

    Who Controls the Children (Schools Dumb Down Kids Deliberately)

    “Charlotte Thomson Iserbyt was Former Senior Policy Advisor in the Office of Educational Research and Improvement (OERI) in the US Department of Education under President Reagan. Due to her unique perspective she was able to observe firsthand the methods the Federal Government used to deliberately dumb down the American public education system with Soviet style “brainwashing”.

    Disgusted with the American Government’s policy to use a behavior modification system designed to churn out unthinking, uncritical “citizens of the world” trained to accept socialism, Charlotte set out to wake up her fellow Americans.

    This documentary is a MUST WATCH for any home-schooler, teacher, parent or anyone interested in methods of education or anyone wondering why we as a people seem to grow less intelligent and less able with each passing generation.”

    David Miscavige, why was the “Methods of Education” study tape taken out of the Study Tapes?

  299. Well DarnIt, welcome to freedom!!
    I am sure you will make lots of new friends.
    I would love to hear your story!
    Seattle, Washington

  300. “McGarbage”, I love it!!

  301. Hey, you wanna go out or something? Maybe? I know how to slow dance. I would even watch a mushy movie, at home, on the couch or something.

    Cause, well, I like it when you laugh 😉

  302. 🙂

  303. Hah!! You’re right. It is 10 Aug.

    If Dave won’t read it, and apply it standardly, fug’em, others can, do and will and spot the source and make it vanish.

  304. Is there really much difference between this inculcation done to our kids in public schools and the inculcation done within the Sea Org? (saving the fact that reverse Scientology is faster at inculcation)

    Doesn’t David Miscavige like fresh young blood around him, already pre-inculcated, who are much more easily malleable?

  305. Beloved Paramahansa Yogananda! An Autobiography of a Yogi was a great awakening for me, the start of a path I am still on.

    Do you know Brian, that Yogananda’s first temple was built in Hollywood and sits on Sunset Boulevard between Catalina and Edgemont? I do not believe this is a coincidence that this right around the corner from the Pac Base.

    When I first arrived to L.A. long ago to do the OT levels, I was surprised and gratified to see it there, for it was Yogananda, more than any other, that brought the great Eastern truths to America and introduced countless people to the Vedic traditions.

    “The season of failure is the best time for sowing the seeds of success.”
    ― Paramahansa Yogananda

  306. Li'll bit of stuff

    You are doing a great job in ALL respects, newcomer,
    and I’m all for grabbing the torpedoes, and lobbing
    them back, from whence they came, brother!!!

  307. Ubiquilo:
    Thanks for your comments. I am always interested to read the thoughts of non-Scientologists who read this blog. Yes, we are working to evolve a new reality. Its shape is not yet entirely clear. While waiting for us to get there, you might find some of L.Ron Hubbard’s tools of use. The Conditions might especially interest you as they are straightforward and can be applied very broadly. With an intelligent application of them, one can reach a higher level of survival. You could pick up a copy of Introduction to Scientology Ethics online read about them.

    Yes, David Miscavige is truly insane….

  308. O.K., I get it. The Church would deny it ,if it ever did happen and herd people forward to dispute it. True enough.

  309. Typo. What is WWP?

  310. Li'll bit of stuff

    Wow Bill, absolutely gut wrenching, to hear your story
    bro’ and how you’ve pulled through, is a really stirring
    inspiration to any one who is sitting in doubts.
    Scott Campbell, your heart is, and has ALWAYS been
    in the right place, (and your ol’ trusty TR-3 too!)

    2012, really is the true turning point in the recovery,
    not only of pure original Scientology, but more importantly,
    the recovery of the beings LRH meant it to serve in the
    first place.

    So welcome aboard Bill, It’s certain that you will be keeping
    the engine room running as smoothly as ever, with all that
    technical expertise at your disposal. OUR gain! Their LOSS!

    Calvin B. Duffield

  311. Gern Gaschoen

    Re: 1984, please google “TrapWire” and re-evaluate.

    We Are There.

  312. Li'll bit of stuff

    Duplicated. Understood. Thanks, S.D.

  313. TO: My understanding of the Headley case was that as a matter of fact, rather than one of law, there wasn’t a breach as far as human trafficking as based on the facts of the case, namely that the Headleys were physically able to leave the base.

    This isn’t to say that a different set of facts might give way to human trafficking, for instance where someone in the Hole or who hasn’t been off the base in years and living in confined conditions might reach the threshold.

    The court wasn’t able to consider any potential other issues as they weren’t raised as legal points, although it was suggested very strongly by the court that there was a case to answer, just not on these set of circumstances, citing this particular point of law. It’s like playing cards and you may lose at poker based on the cards that are dealt, but the dealer doesn’t then look at your hand and say, ‘well, that’s a winning hand in bridge…’

    As far as the 13th amendment is concerned and the case of the prisoner, it’s a brilliant parallel as it’s challenging fixed ideas, in this instance, what does slavery look like? The lower courts couldn’t think with it because of the fixed idea that it had to reach pre Civil war standards which it doesn’t, however the case will probably turn on the fact that he was on remand, rather than a convict as to whether the forced labor was appropriate. Probably not.

    In the Headley case, it was about what does human trafficking look like, and the court couldn’t quite get over the fact that they were able to leave as evidence that it wasn’t human trafficking. But this is a very weak argument as if you go to a brothel where women have been imported for the purposes of prostitution, and ask them if they are physically able to leave at night, one would get the same response. Sure, they can physically leave, but the repercussions stop them.

    I think that the criteria of human trafficking will evolve to consider not just physical circumstances, but emotional issues or the ‘Hotel California’ threshold where you can check out but you can never leave, including disconnection if one does leave, the contact one has with the outside world, fully independent advice including choices, real life choices. Has anyone on the RPF ever been offered a vacation to think over their options? Or advice about their options such as where they can go short term? Or alternative career advice?

  314. Li'll bit of stuff

    George, this is a beaut! BTW, I hope you don’t mind me
    plonking down in the (seemingly) empty front row seat beside you, or obviously off thread with this, but I’m hoping to get Marty or Mike’s attention, with a possibly innocuous, but never the less intriguing question, that has bugged me for ages:

    The “CLEAR” state, and it’s serialization number?
    Just how was this promulgated? Acked? Announced?
    And without being sarcastic, I have certain reservations,
    about what “that” means, in the context of present day
    products of ‘miscavology’ and it’s ‘fleece-by-any-means
    necessary,’ fraudulent extortion practices.

    To my mind, a simple, reasonably priced, acknowledge-
    ment bracelet, with the person’s name, “state of clear,” date of attainment, and a basic ack to the genius, LRH,
    who made it all possible, in the first place! A nice touch,
    no, make that validation, would have to include the
    words: ” Independent Scientologist .”
    Boldly stated then; who,what,when,how, & where!!!!!!

    Obviously, It goes without saying, this also makes a great conversation opening piece,as it has always
    done.Being “CLEAR” has always been the number # 1
    goal for public entering Scientology after reading LRH’s
    blockbuster DIANETICS, and will likely continue to be.

    Any clarifications / comments appreciated.

    Calvin, Durban, South Africa.

  315. Li'll bit of stuff

    You did, but it doesn’t matter, since ARC, is KEY!!!

  316. Li'll bit of stuff

    Jeez, Wayne, I went through the horrors of seeing
    my only parent, my late mom, turned into a virtual
    zombi, through the self same barbaric ECT. Feeling quite helpless as a 12 year old frightened child, myself, I understand the trauma you have
    just described, only too well. The upside of this,
    for at least the both of us,it seems, is that this
    experience definitely imbued us with the resolve
    and determination to understand the ‘demons’
    that had so rudely, and cruelly entered our
    respective lives, during those early, formative
    years, And clearly, there were many others,
    posting here, who had similar, if not worse,
    life scarring times in their lives, including Marty.
    Thankfully, we have all shared a common destiny,
    in that we have been fortunate enough to meet
    up right here on Marty’s blog, and to complete
    the healing process, post by cathartic post.
    In so doing, making it possible, for still others
    to commence / continue, their own respective
    healing process / es, in Moving On Up A Little

  317. Li'll bit of stuff

    Mike, just had to ask, how is the mighty big one,
    Jack, doing? He really looks like a bundle of energy
    and mischief just waiting to create some ‘rindereffects’
    worthy of the name, (going by the few pics, I’ve seen.!)
    Please send my love to the li’ll guy & Christie too!

  318. Li'll bit of stuff

    Very Buddhist of you, Nancy! Mine too!

  319. This was supposed to be connected to Tranporters comment (above)about “McGarbage”.

  320. Yes, it was Valeska that left, after I did. I could have left earlier but I would have had to blow. I belonged to a 3rd dynamic of slaves. In “The Code of Honor” LRH says “Never desert a group to which you owe your support” (maybe not exact quote) Now I did not owe the management anything; I had kept that boat going for 16 years for almost no pay. But all of my friends in the world were still there taking abuse when I left. I felt bad about leaving, although I was not told that I was being dismissed and I was all but dead anyway. The way to handle suppression is handle or disconnect. But don’t disconnect by frying youself on the electrical power lines (which I almost did ) or hanging yourself (which Jorge Arroyo, a former cabin mate of mine did after I left). Just leave. Not “GO, AND DIE WITH HONOR” like a gladiator. I was in the middle of a taylor-made FPRD action when I left to handle the above. It obviously is not complete, as I still feel bad about the slaves.

  321. Don;t forget the PL on Knowledge Reports which had a line in it stating “In an upstat group, Joe would probably have a black eye.” I was told by Scott Campbell that that was the reference given for the order by CO CMO Ship to “Get some thugs together and beat up EC members for not paying their rent (to FWSO).

  322. Wow! I recall saying that very thing once to the Ethics Officer at our IDEAL ORG that I wanted to bring in the Anon guy and sit him in a chair and just acknowledge him (I didnt know about Anon, I just knew it was someone in a creepy looking mask from a movie). I really wanted to help him get unstuck in whatever it was that was making him waste a beautiful day hiding behind a mask yelling and carrying a sign that said, Google Lisa McPherson. Just recalling that blew off some charge.

  323. Chris, very well said.

  324. Hi Gern- Roger that! I haven’t seen the auditors hat, just the code and Act1 which is pretty much my attitude. I’ll find a way to get trained up in the coming months outside the obvious suppression and when the day comes when the remaining staff wake up, I’ll audit them too.

  325. threefeetback

    Thanks for pointing out this article. With a pendulum swing in Washington politics that cleans house on the government agencies, Rinder’s plan of getting the investigators out of the gate rapidly to interview the Base staff is plausible. The Independent Field would need to bring pressure by demanding to ‘have their religion back’ from the crooked supreme leader (obstruction, assult, battery). If the Mormon’s Warren Jeffs can get a Federal anal exam, so can the DMonic Decimator of Scientology. The trick is to separate the beast from the subject of Scientology.

  326. I second that, Do sponsor your haters, they will turn out to be cudly an fun loving.

  327. Slow dance? Yep – I’m there!

  328. threefeetback

    Why not just verify what LRH worked out and move on up administratively (3rd dynamic; with current business models such as franchise, not-for-profits, etc.) and LRH ‘red on white’ Tech, following the removal of whole track DM?

  329. Thank you Calvin for your kind note. Your quote is spot on. Yes, the unkind and unfair treatment felt very personal by people who don’t even know me. Seems to have settled down. I thank and respect you and my other buddies on the site, who saw it all happen and stood up for me, some at great potential vulnerability to themselves. The important thing for me is to get back to the big picture, and not get distracted by skirmishes in the weeds. Those folks are welcome to take their energy & play kickball on the playground for awhile. Ironically, it seems that some were taking out on ME, their frustrations with, and suspicions of CO$. Just as Scientologists are not CO$, neither am I. While NOTHING to the extent of CO$’s extreme torture of the mind, heart, body, family, and finances — there was still emotional, verbal, and physical abuse in my family. It’s hard for anyone to get get past abuse, which can undermind our attempts to make grownup decisions going forward. I have a choice whether or not to engage, and I don’t always have to respond. I’m here to listen and learn, so I can continue to inform others that Scientology and CO$ are not the same thing, and that the abuse is well documented.

  330. Hey newcomer, you are a good guy. Thank you again for your heartfelt apology, and I’m happy to be respectful of each other going forward. 🙂 Hey, if I need anyone to man the torpedoes and sink a battleship like CO$, you are the first one on my call list. Get ready!

  331. Oh, sorry Nancy, I’ve been sick and not on the site for a few days. Thanks for your email, and I’ll get right back to you! 🙂

  332. woops, Nancy, I think the post got attached in the wrong place – please see my response above.

  333. Good one!

  334. Sound like it’s hard to get copies of anything from the DM club these days. Since we know his mindset and people skills have not changed, nor his speaking style, I think it’s fair to assume his writing style has not improved either.

    He would get F’s on his report card in English, Math, Public Speaking, Composition, Construction, Human Rights, Civics, Citizenship, Friendship Making, Plays Well With Others, Supports One’s Spouse & Works on his Marriage. His only A+ would be in Runs With Scissors (the teacher’s sharp ones, not the child ones with rounded edges). He certainly would not have the following in the comment section: “DM is a social butterfly; he flits from desk to desk.”

  335. I think he’s being an idiot. No one can touch him. I think this memo got smuggled out. Clearly he writes exactly the way he speaks. Most people actually write better than they speak, since you have more time. It is known in business and in life: NEVER put something in writing that is inflammatory, secret, or could embarrass anyone — call them on the phone instead, and don’t write notes about the call. You and the other person KNOW what took place, and don’t want to damage the organization. Because he doesn’t have much education (HS dropout, if I’m not mistaken), and never worked for an organization outside CO$, he doesn’t know know the first thing about How to Run a Business, particularly a Nonprofit – or the finances and business practices would be transparent. He doesn’t know how to manage people, and doesn’t submit to ethics, because he is unethical and would never punish himself. He is an absolute dictator and thus believes he is above the law. – His buddies include Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, Idi Amin, Pol Pot, Osama bin Ladin, and a host of other Dictators & Assorted Bad Guys & Girls. He has to have been this way since childhood, always politically bashing his opponent -who he now believes is “Everyone in the World Other Than DM”. He is the terrorist bully to anyone who crosses path, with attack dogs, assault rifles, grenades,and Improvised Explosive Devices (IEDs), who spreads his poison everywhere he goes and with whomever he interacts. I say we (metaphorically) call out the SWAT team and take him out peacefully; if he resists or tries to take any more hostages, I say take him out.

  336. Are any celebrity scientologists Indies, or are they Miscavige followers?

  337. I always wonder – does dm writes his own e-mails or someone does it for him?!

  338. Pingback: Miscavige still doesn’t know “how Internet works”

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