The Great Decompression

I borrowed, or coined by inspiration, from Viktor Frankl (Man’s Search For Meaning) the idea that decompression was the first and most important step in recovering from the Scientology experience with an upward trajectory.  Frankl – having himself survived years of imprisonment in Nazi concentration camps, and attempted to help others similarly situated upon release – noted that an adjustment period was critical for someone coming out of a strictly controlled environment to a relatively free society.  He likened it to a deep sea diver submerged for several hours far beneath the surface.  One must bring the diver back out from under the tremendous pressure he has adjusted to on a gradient basis or he will suffer from Decompression Sickness, also known as the bends. Similarly, if a person imprisoned – even mentally – in inhumane conditions, conditioned to think and act in super-compliant ways while developing all manner of deceitful (albeit as justifiable as they may be) means to survive, comes out acting like he owns earth he is going to be in for big, ugly and possibly devastating losses.

Over time I have exchanged observations with other counselors about a number of folks that we guided and assisted through the Scientology Underground Railroad – or Decompression Road.  One pattern we all have observed, and taken terrible losses on, is Scientologists entering the family of humanity with the exclusive, arrogant and judgmental attitudes they developed to survive in Scientology culture.  All of us have expended a great deal of resource and effort in helping to clean up messes such attitudes have created, and in getting people who exhibit those attitudes back on their paths after the inevitable smack downs society tends to deliver in response.   For those going through that process now, and who are discomforted absent orientation to L. Ron Hubbard references, everything I have noted thus far in this article is in complete accord with Scientology notions of the efficacy of tackling problems,development and life on a gradient scale; and even the ethics conditions formulas (see Non- Existence condition and formula).

One of the first posts on the Milestone 2/iscientology blog – created largely in protest of my books and this forum – was a piece attempting to discredit this idea of decompression as some psych-based attempt to belittle Operating Thetans and put people at introverted effect.  It reasoned that former Sea Org members and public OTs who bought into the idea they could use a tad of decompression as part of their gradient entry into the community of fellow human beings were victims of an attempt to put them at groveling effect of the psych-indoctrinated ‘wog’ world.  By God, the MS2ers proclaimed, we need to bring society up to our standards, Revenimus! (In keeping perhaps with the Class VIII indoctrination, ‘you are the people who own the planet’ – see Memoirs of a Scientology Warrior).  This mentality of wanting to cling to the inside is understandable (see e.g. the films  The Shawshank Redemption and One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest – I know you have all seen them, but watch them again with the Scientology experience in mind).

These thoughts arose when considering a general response to the many inquiries I have received lately asking me which of my three books ought to be read in what sequence.   That includes a lot of non-Scientologists asking what book might appeal to or help a Scientologist family member or friend. My answer is always a question, eliciting information on where the person is at on the decompression process.  When I know something about their circumstances I can recommend the single book that I think might help the person concerned.  They do not necessarily flow one to the next in the order they were written.  And all three of them aren’t for everybody necessarily.

So here is a short generalized guide to whom I believe the three books individually might appeal to, and hopefully help  –  in alignment to degrees of decompression already experienced by the concerned person.

The Scientology Reformation.

This book was written primarily with Scientologists still connected with the church in mind.  It is anchored upon L. Ron Hubbard references and attempts, on a gradient basis, to get a Scientologist to observe for himself or herself just how far adrift Scientology Inc has strayed from the intent and purposes memorialized (at least in some places) by its founder.  It introduces hope that one need not reject all of Scientology, in order to escape and even to take a stand against its abuses.

What Is Wrong With Scientology? Healing Through Understanding

This book would likely be dropped like a radioactive rock by the time a Scientologist in good standing read the first sentence of the introduction.   It is addressed more to people who are already out of the church, and for whom turning back is no option.  It is a detailed presentation and analysis of the features of Scientology that tend toward entrapment.   It describes in some detail the sum and substance of what Scientology’s effective processes are  in order to set the table for analyzing what is wrong with it and how it is ultimately used to entrap.   If one only mindlessly makes a break and declares a wholesale rejection of everything scientology, one tends to become as glued to it as ever, albeit from the opposition vector.  That is because he or she never took the time to understand and come to grips with what salutary aspects of it may have kept one pursuing it in the first place.  If one understands that, one can transcend the experience in a more desirable state than victimhood.

Memoirs of a Scientology Warrior

Because of the personal, autobiographical nature of this book and its consequent gradual, real time and subjective introduction to Scientology this can inform someone never involved in the subject with a perspective they will get nowhere else.  That is, what attracts and keeps one involved in the subject.   Popular books and films have been woefully two-dimensional and inaccurate in that regard.  They only focus on fear factors, which for those involved had next to zero effect in garnering their voluntary, self-determined involvement (the involvement that creates the most lasting effect on someone).  Many who have read it remarked that reading another’s real time experience of getting into, developing into a crusader for, and then transcending out of it prompted them to review their own experience more honestly, fully and rationally.  And that had a liberating effect upon them.

Memoirs is probably akin to a post-doctorate extension of the ‘what is wrong with Scientology’ analysis.  But not with a lot of opinion.  For the most part I let the facts do the talking.

While I still regularly use the term, and the model, of ‘decompression’ I am more often using it with a modifier to better describe what it is I am trying to accomplish: Decompression with an upward trajectory.

Link to all three books:

Mark Rathbun books on scientology


158 responses to “The Great Decompression

  1. One of the things I have learned to hate about how Scientologists operate is the way they put themselves above everyone else. To me it is a cult mentality, I have fond it to be completely false that Scientologists or OT’s are above the rest of society. One of the things that really shocked me when I got out of the Sea Org is how nice people are, in fact the average person on the street is a lot more helpful than pretty much any Sea Org member I ever encountered. They don’t look down on you. I have learned a lot since coming out of the Sea Org and in fact I have had a lot of catching up to do and to some degree still have a lot more to go. To me there are a lot of contradictions in Scientology policy. When you look at the basic stuff it makes sense but the deeper you get into it the more corrupt and controlled and less think for yourself it becomes. I think it is brave of you Marty to have looked at all aspects of Scientology and LRH. I have read your first book and will read the others. It is important to look at all the facts as well as our own life experiences and decide for ourselves what the truth is. One of the things I really didn’t agree with on Iscientology is the 11 people and the vanity involved. To me that is delusion.

  2. Cooper Kessel

    “One pattern we all have observed, and taken terrible losses on, is Scientologists entering the family of humanity with the exclusive, arrogant and judgmental attitudes they developed to survive in Scientology culture. ”

    I’ll say a big AMEN to that Marty. The road out of the cult at some point has to pass through the town of ‘humility’ and all that goes along with it. One of the key turning points for me in the process of decompression was to get in communication with all of my friends and acquaintences and ‘go there’ with respect to my actions and attitudes (related to the cult) that may have caused upsets over the years. I acknowledged my behavior, I apologized to them and of course has discussion about what was happening in PT as it applied (indicating all BPC so to speak). This was/is a great process and certainly helped me to move a tad higher.

    Great post! Cheers,

  3. martyrathbun09

    You are a good man Coop.


    Marty, very well said one more time…. THERE IS.. A DECOMPRESION state that all the people leaving the cult need to do… I did it, and I helped another member to do that too, so it’s real for me what you said and it’s necesary in order to fit in todays world mainly when we have been disconected from that world for so many years…as a personal viewpoint on this one important point on this is to have a terminal you can talk to that can help you through that decompresion and funny enough I did it applying Snc tools…. thanks one more time…

  5. martyrathbun09

    Thanks for those helpful observations and thoughts Valeska. I think you’ll find Memoirs validates your views; nothing you need to grab for, you clearly have found your bearings and do us all proud.

  6. martyrathbun09

    Good advice.

  7. The Majestic 11 are apparently not quite “out”. While they may have the appearancy of freedom bought by disconnection from the insanity of RCS, they are still prisoners of their own mind.
    The more time I have spent decompressing, the more beauty I’m able to see in the outside world. Concurrent with that, the traps and paradoxes in Scn become more and more visible.
    Close-mindedness and fixed ideas prevent observation and perception, and deprive the individual of data which is necessary to properly evaluate Scn.
    I hope they eventually get there.

  8. All of the people you mentioned as discussing decompression have something in common: they each left the Church on their own determinism, and I suspect the decompression process started quite a while before they actually bailed. By contrast, someone who was suddenly ejected from the organization would have a tendency, I think, to grab for a stable datum and hang on tight. That datum most likely would be LRH, or more specifically, KSW. At some point though, they have to let go before decompression can really start. You can’t learn to swim while you are hanging on tight to a life preserver.

    Great title, by the way. I happen to think the pun is one of the higher language skills.

  9. martyrathbun09

    Great observation that, ” I suspect the decompression process started quite a while before they actually bailed. ” and clinging the point blown off of – LRH covers it nicely in the HCOB Why Thetans Mock Up.

  10. Dear Marty ,I’m the luckiest person on the planet ,it was by pure chance I found your blog, At the time I didn’t now how to use a computer ,I’m still learning . Reading your first book gave me a better understanding in to what’s happening with the church .and also what helped me decompress further and helped me heal,was reading other people’s comments on this blog, example links,music,u tube,and other links to different sights,and recommendations of books.In all the years I was in Scientology , I only read
    Scientology books,never any other books .I was never a book worm to begin with.
    Eric Alexandrou
    Brisbane ,Australia

  11. I think decompression is very apt term in this context. As I observed in a recent thread, it is quite a process, and in my own case has been very ably assisted by all three of your books Marty. Why? because as you say, you let the facts do the talking. As a great man once said “truth blows the lies away”.

  12. Brilliant.

    What I find slightly amusing is the consistency with which you have presented yourself on this blog since it’s inception versus the wild fluctuations of others with supposed similar intentions for the fate of those characters touched by the Scientology tragedy.

    From the beginning this blog has had the same name, purpose and results;

    Moving on up a little higher.

    There’s a lesson in there somewhere I’m sure.

  13. Marty,

    I had been planning on doing a little piece on Milestone 2, but this post is similar in intent, but comes from a very different angle, but addresses it from the same source … the decompression/recovery from the hyper high control group that is Scientology.

    Several concepts that go into this.

    With all of the people I have worked with, a common thread is they have lost their personal identity, yes they still have a personality, their quirks, their humor, but THEY ARE SCIENTOLOGY, SCIENTOLOGY IS THEIR PAST, PRESENT AND FUTURE.

    Those that do truly well and build fulfilling, meaningful and prosperous lives uniformly, IMHO find their personal identity outside of Scientology. They have their passions and interests and thrive to learn and develop personally. They have non Scientology friends, they have interests of things to do with their money. They focus on their families, children parents, trying to serve and make better the lives around them. They either find a way to make money that they love and have passion for, or make money doing a great job, and find something rewarding to do with the money, familiarity, social work, hobbies, education, etc.

    My suspicion with Milestone 2 has two components:

    1. every group I have seen and been part of has been heavily influenced and controlled by one or a few hyper aggressive personalities. In this one, I suspect either Jim Logan or Mark Shreffler or both as the dominant personalities trying to impart their personalities, a product of the corporate COS, into this activity.

    2. To me, the structure of this group was fascist, but I don’t think most of the people supporting it realized such. It is highly exclusionary, with all sorts of hidden standards that provide for COS level controls. I would not qualify as a member, nor would you Marty, or Mike Rinder, or Karen Delac, or many of the other people who have stood up dauntless and defiant for individuals and helped try and protect and make things right.

    Any time you look for a club as a membership, OT III, people that believe in KSW, continually moving on the bridge (a highly manipulative generality.

    Any leader or manager knows that if you want to build a truly great business or group or activity, you have to go for the most talented and accomplished people that share the goal regardless of race, color, creed, religion, education, social status, etc. Any organization that immediately rules out (literally) 99.9999% of humanity to aide in their management operations is doomed.

    I don’t know Schreff, he has never reached out to me, and didn’t respond to my few attempts to talk to him.

    I don’t really know Jim logan … we had a few wonderful in person conversations about dogs, both shedding tears … but otherwise I only know him by what he writes and his reputation, which I don’t care for. As a professional I consider his behavior reprehensible, if you take money from someone to help them, and it goes bad (things often and easily go bad) a true professional takes the high road, tries to make things right, and if not possible quietly moves on. A true professional will NEVER get into a character assassination of their past clients. NEVER. You can’t hold yourself up as an opinion leader and behave like that.

    Many of the people involved, I believe, didn’t do their due diligence, blinded perhaps by the idea, or blind trust in Scientologists, or a deep emotional need to reconnect with pleasant and exciting times from their Scientology past with a similar looking activity.

    This, for me was furthered by the reference in Lanas introduction, comparing the 11 to the team in the movie Oceans 11. A group of rouges that pull together and operate with an almost telepathic synchronicity to accomplish impossible and changing goals and go after the bad guy. I absolutely loved the idea and would love to work with a team like this. Its a hell of a dream. But the 11 were not and did not work like Ocean’s crew.

    Like you, I bear no ill will to any of these folk, I like many of them, Lana included. I don’t think Lana intended to do anything bad, or nefarious, but she is not skilled in intel or legal or security, and relied on too small a pool for her support and guidance, a pool that was operating way above their pay grade.

    I personally think the exercise was fascinating and in a way positive, showing that the community, even though it is made up of individuals operating on their own instincts and intuition, would not allow a potentially dangerous situation to harm others without yelling such from the roof top.

    I think this exercise, the fallout, and all the rest is a part of this community growing up, maturing, people finding themselves, etc.

  14. One more note, I don’t think full decompression can be accomplished by thinking about it, sitting quietly, auditing, or any intellectual or spectator sport.

    I believe full decompression is a full contact sport, you have to engage life, do things, fail, pick yourself back up, learn, try again, engage with people, have upsets, work through them, create strong bonds with people, etc.

  15. Tom Gallagher


    I want to sincerely thank you for helping free me of the ‘mind cement’ I lugged around for decades regards the sticky tangled web that blind lock-step adherence to the RCS fosters and demands.

    My decompression actually started the first time I linked through to this site after stumbling across the Truth Rundown several years ago. Factually, the whole process took me about two years.

    There is a true sense of peace I now feel. I’ve reached the other side.

    You’re a good soul Ke-mo sah-bee.

  16. I so agree… most people in the real world are just people, not the large, hostile generality of “wog” that you are warned about in the SO.
    I think one thing that made my passage into the real world easier, was granting beingness to people. I like granting beingness to people. That’s why I got along for a good while in the SO, because I was an auditor and spent a lot of time in session, the one place (for the most part) where the practice of granting beingness, not invalidating or evaluating, and just being above 2.0 was actually still permitted… at least for a time.

    Thank you, Marty, for your insights.

  17. Tom Gallagher

    I need to add that your latest book completed the process!

  18. I didn’t finish a paragraph:

    “Any time you look for a club as a membership, OT III, people that believe in KSW, continually moving on the bridge (a highly manipulative generality.”

    You miss out on the best talent. Legal, accounting, finance, fund raising, PR, operations, inspiration.

    One of the traps of Scientology to me is that people believe that because they are Scientology and have LRH tech they can do everything better than everyone else. The results, the statistics, the outcome of the past in the COS should prove this false without a shadow of a doubt.

    There are some things I think Scientology can help you do better than average, it can (not always) give excellent communication skills, it can help people operate under stress better than most, it can help people think more efficiently with tools like the Data Series, but doesn’t automatically do anything, in the end it always relies on the individual.

    This blind automatic gain and elitist belief that comes with the title, to me can ONLY lead to things like Robotic GAT, Div 6 FART, KSW Nazis and all the rest.

    I don’t want a person who can find an LRH reference for every bazaar thing but can’t feed himself leading anything I am involved with. I will politely turn and run.

  19. My wife came home and started dancing spontaneously. Her feet were doing a jig and she couldn’t stop them. She had just gotten booted out of the courseroom for having too big a cognition. I realized then and there how much pressure we had been under. That’s when the decompression began.

  20. I have used admiration to assist me in my “decompression”. Remember the data about admiration in the Factors and elsewhere? That, in it’s absence, things persist?

    1. To regard with pleasure, wonder, and approval.
    2. To have a high opinion of; esteem or respect.
    3. Chiefly New England & Upper Southern U.S. To enjoy (something): “I just admire to get letters, but I don’t admire to answer them” (Dialect Notes).
    4. Archaic To marvel or wonder at.
    v.intr. New England & Upper Southern U.S.
    To marvel at something. Often used with at.
    [French admirer, from Old French amirer, from Latin admrr, to wonder at : ad-, ad- + mrr, to wonder (from mrus, wonderful; see smei- in Indo-European roots).]

    I often wondered about that factor as I was in the SO and about it’s application in life. I don’t know if I figured it out well enough while I was “in”! But I am certainly getting a better and better handle on it as i go on with my life.

    Some years ago I was feeling some upset as I was thinking about my staff days. There was too much of that, too often, and thinking about Scientology was kind of getting in the way of living well, NOW. So, I took a notebook and labeled it “Book of Positive Aspects” and then went to the first page and wrote at the top of the page the name of a person I very much liked in the SO. I then wrote a longish list of various things that I very much liked about that person. It was a little like an L&N in that I did not push myself for more and more answers, I just kept writing them down until I stopped thinking of things easily.

    I then turned the page and thought of another person in the SO that I liked a good deal, and did the same thing: the name at the top of the page, and an easy-to-write list of the many things I liked about the person. I did that again and again and again.

    Doing this, many things “turned on”: laughter, tears, and the occasional flush of goosebumps.

    I did pages and pages of this stuff. Gradually, as I looked for more personalities to write about, I noticed that people I liked-not-so-much came to mind. I had written down these lists of all the amazingly-far-out-and-groovy people, now a “lower strata” was coming up! But I noticed that now, in my mind, I was not regarding them as harshly.

    I just continued as I had been: a name at the top, followed by all the things that I could think of that were positive about the guy. Person after person. Same phenomena: laughter and tears, but a growing feeling of lightness.

    Finally the names of people who I had thought were just total scoundrels started coming to mind. And I looked for the positive aspects of these, too. I probably would not have found them so easily if I had not done this “ramping up”, but there they were!

    Since then, I think, I have more and more been “making peace” with Scientology and my past. It’s a lot like a lot of things that you have mentioned from the Tao, Marty. There’s also that thought about hating people being like drinking poison in hopes that the other person will die.

    I have found that the general rule of auditing is very true in life: that which is not admired tends to persist. None of us wants to experience any longer the deep sea pressure of the Sea Org, we all want to decompress from that. But I think that the decompression process is sped up and made more comfortable, even more fun, if we take deep breaths of appreciation as we rise up. Not only for our current environment and friends, but for our past environment and comrades as well.

  21. martyrathbun09

    Thanks for all your thoughts Mike. My response to your analysis is going to sound unbelievable to you. It won’t seem that way the next time we have ample time for me to connect the dots for you in person. The response: You are more in than I am, by a long shot.

  22. Hear, hear!

  23. LOL, OK a**hole, you are on! You coming to my house or am I going to yours?

  24. “entering the family of humanity with the exclusive, arrogant and judgmental attitudes they developed to survive in Scientology culture”.

    There is a certain sense of power and recognition one gets from holding a top executive/technical post in the CofS and if combined with a big ego and the need to dominate, the ability to let go and decompress is even harder. Some of these individuals have lost all of that and the need to regain and fulfill that loss plays a part the creation of the MS2 IMO. This doesn’t apply to all of the 11 but I’ve observed it in at least one of them.

  25. martyrathbun09

    You’d be surprised how that phenomena can exponentially expand further down the org board as well.

  26. Reblogged this on My LRH.

  27. There is definitely a process of decompression – it took me two years to decompress from being on staff when I was 17. It was very intense.

    Leaving the church was a different process. For me it was a combination of growing up and opening up. I believe you grow into tolerance. And I also believe that actively learning in life will bring you to the point where you expand upon and eventually outgrow Scientology. It is inevitable, since Scientology is frozen in 1986 and CANNOT grow anymore. There is a lot of value – amazing value – in Scientology, but a person cannot and should not shrink himself to any set of ideas. People are senior to ideas.

    To me the hardest part of moving away from the church was truly confronting the reality that there are evil and stupid elements in the Scientology world – and that it is not going to be corrected by some magical process. There is a large side to Scientology – getting larger daily – that is just cussing weird and dangerous and stupid. The incredible disrespect for other knowledge, including medical knowledge (which kills people by neglect – the unchecked mole, the squirrelly cancer treatments, etc). The “hole” and the realities around that. There is a point where you have to A. realize that this is really true and happening, and that B. as an ethical person, you HAVE to reject that. And it is hard and it is a loss. And you cling on anyway because you still believe that A. Scientology is the only route, and B. that this route is available only in the church. Whether or not A is true, B is definitely NOT true. Realize that, and you are free.

  28. I should clarify: In the “History of Man” tapes LRH explains that a false datum has an effect similar to hypnotism. By “too big a cognition” the perceived problem was that her cognition exceeded her personal and family problems and intruded into the business of staff members. She concluded (I believe rightfully so) that false data (we didn’t realize the source at the time) was causing staff at our local org to “act hypnotized.”

  29. I believe that of the public people, the higher the person was on the Bridge the more decompression he requires. The eligibility is a thought stopping process. The more you get it the more decompression you need. Then when you are on seven, every six month refresher is designed to put you a little more under.

    I am not sure about ot8, but the people I saw coming back from that were real zombies. It worried me even when I was still in.

  30. I find that “decompression”, like most things that have to do with beings, is not a “blanket CS”. Anyone who entered, lived and exteriorized from the particular form of Scientology that they experienced, will have their own unique set of things to deal with. The things that most closely aligned with one’s personal goals will be the hardest to re-evaluate.

    It is not “pain and unconsciousness”, or obviously non-survival things that are hard to let go of, nor do I consider that they are the basis of one’s aberrations. The hardest things to let go of are things that seem to align with your own survival.

    It is your allies, not your enemies, that are capable of causing you the most grief. Unfortunately, that “turning a blind eye”, opens the door to vast areas of false, unconfronted, and unevaluated data.

    I consider that this is the area that each person’s personal “decompression” must necessarily address. One needs to confront and reevaluate all of one’s decisions, even those, and especially those, held most dear.

    We are specifically addressing the area of decompression (or exteriorization, if you will) from Scientology, however I have come to think that this same basic process will be the route to one’s spiritual advancement in all areas of life and livingness.


  31. Marty, further to our conversation on Saturday, although it started out as something that was deeply personal and traumatic to me, it went elsewhere, but your observations are equally relevant to decompression, specifically, being able to distinguish whose experiences/track are in question. So, am not as badly off as I thought I was.

    In any case, saved me a trip to Texas which can’t be a bad thing….

  32. martyrathbun09

    Hi Sara. Thanks. It was great to meet and talk with you and your wonderful daughter.

  33. Coop and Valeska, Great truth you gave us. I also am now seeing how very superior and even condescending in some cases I was when a full on Kool Aid Drinker. I have been trying to break free of that since coming out. To grant beingness doens’t mean that “they can be as they are, which is much lower than I am.” That still smacks of the superior attitude I see in all corporate Scns, especially the young ones they have attracted to the cult and brainwashed. I liked Cooper’s almost 12 step program where he went to friends and neighbors and apologized for his former attitudes, got them talking, and indicated BPC wherever he could to help them and then built up the ARC in a new unit of time. Well done Coop! I did tell my siblings that I had left the cult, but I think now I”ll go back and do the other step of apologizing for my superiority with them. I will definitely blow charge all around. Decompressing doesn’t happen overnight, but it is good that it is happening daily and we are moving up a little higher as Marty says.

  34. Saw a movie that kinda reminded me of you. Its called Peaceful Warrior. Check it out!

  35. Awesome exercise.
    Getting rid of the “holier than thou” computation for me had to include admiration for others without judgment on them as less than or greater than. They just are, as I am.

  36. Here’s a thought.

    Assuming the decompression journey is a trajectory… Is there an apex or tipping point?

    By that i mean a point at which we finally accept our experiences and begin the process of authentic growth?

    I would argue, based on my own experiences and occasional discussions on the subject, that it isn’t until a rather large piece of humble pie has been eaten that real progress begins.

    Humility trumps arrogance any day of the week in the world of spiritual and psychological growth. Well… It does for me anyway.

    It’s the one thing I see in the entire spectrum of adherents from DM through to the most diplomatic of indies… Being wrong is not an option. And it’s the opposite that I keep seeing in those who have found genuine peace and joy in their lives… They don’t have any issue with being wrong.

    Is humility, or the “ability” to be wrong, the difference between decompressing fully and struggling with expanding nitrogen bubbles indefinitely?

    Anyway… It’s a thought… But I could be wrong… Obviously…😊

  37. I did read your blog almost since the start. After reading through the milestone 2 stuff I instantly rejected it. I think especially reading through your blog and comments enabled me to have a better „sight“ looking at Scientology Inc. and modern „splinter groups“ that claim „we do it better as we know better“.
    Thanks to all and especially you.

  38. Old Secretary

    Anyone who took ownership of scientology also had scientology take ownership of them. Its the way the cult ingrained itself into your being. The decompression goes in stages. Its not a checksheet to be done in a week or a year. The majority of the relief is gotten in the first few years, but the agreements and beliefs can hang around forever, whether they are true of not, whether you go cold turkey from scientology all together or remain in the world of the indies. There is a reexamination of things that occurs over decades. I suppose it could be speeded up by a focused effort if one chose to do so. Marty’s suggested reading list is a good place to start. But you will need to dig deep. It shouldn’t be a surprise that it would take time. Being built up and praised only to be spiritually raped, mind fucked, swindled and betrayed are things that usually stay with a person.

  39. Marty you said the following about anyone “new” who understands your book What is wrong with Scientology: “I don’t think he or she can very easily be entrapped by application of Scientology by anybody.” I believe this applies to next lifetime too… no amount of amnesia can cover-up this truth and you will not have to relive your enslavement in some future Dear Leader IV Co$.

  40. Exactly. “Less than or greater than” questions in regards to others and how we relate to each other never turns out well.

  41. Cooper Kessel

    As an aside, when communicating about the former Church of Scientology to friends and acquaintances, use of the word ‘cult’ seems very apropos because it’s use never results in a passive response. It either blows charge or really jacks the person up. That tells you immediately where they are on the scale of freedom to slavery!

    When you use the word around those previously at the Kool Aide stand it can be very funny because they sort of look over their shoulder to see if anyone else may have heard the use of the ‘C’ word!!!! You know…..they could get KRd !!!! OMG is it ever uplifting to simply say the truth because it becomes part of your past!

    The Church of Scientology is a CULT! When you can tell it to your kids and your friends you can feel the spring in your step as you move on up a bit higher! Cheers!

  42. Cooper Kessel

    “One more note, I don’t think full decompression can be accomplished by thinking about it, sitting quietly, auditing, or any intellectual or spectator sport.”

    I second that opinion. Theory is great but the practical is where the heavy lifting occurs!

  43. Warning: Long one coming –
    My decision to walk away from Scientology came the day I was being pressed to go into a courseroom to begin OTVI and VII at Flag (which was already paid for). But what about my life? What about all of those things neglected while I had slaughtered myself financially and socially to make it to V already?
    Unimportant. All of those things would be ‘handled in session’
    I was struck with the overwhelming realization I was really tired of sitting in a room digesting ‘problems’ that could be sorted out with a real life conversation or physical universe handling. Why on earth would I circumvent that when I far prefer to be interacting with another live being than sitting in a room all day?
    I don’t know how much of this realization was brought about by the prior levels on the Bridge (God knows if I was able to make any case gain with all the insanity going on around me) or whether this was my wake up moment. It’s irrelevant to the point that it was time for me to leave and as far as I knew there would be no more Scientology for me and yet I felt free. I am still decompressing in various from the experience 6 years later. So are my children and I know we still have a long way to go.
    Do I still use Scientology in my life? Sure – from time to time I find it helps me to think logically around a situation and it’s second nature for me to mentally scan for some tools that might be useful. But that’s all it is now. A tool that belongs to me and I can use it or not depending on whether I actually NEED it at the time. Why go buy a bag of plaster when there are no holes to patch?
    Forgive the evaluation (although I am not repentant) but I’d say a person who still feels that the entire solution to every situation in the world is to simply ‘go in session’ has not even started on the road to decompression yet.
    Yes. Scientology tools may have their use in making a person more able to handle his life. The point is, it’s still down to that PERSON to HANDLE it – not use Scientology as an excuse not to live. Those who choose to stay locked in their ivory towers arrogantly preaching that Scientology is the solution to life never ‘left’ in the first place. They just continued making the same mistakes from a different physical location.
    That’s my 10c worth.
    Marty – you’re tenacious 🙂 I most likely would have shut down this blog a long time ago in protest of the snipers, vipers and OSA idiots and told everyone to leave me alone and go figure it out for themselves. But I can see the value this blog holds for many who are looking for sanity and I am so glad you keep it going in spite of all the bull crap

  44. PS
    For anyone out there who still thinks that ‘Scientology’ is the answer to life, my advice is to go look in a mirror 😀

  45. Marty, I just finished reading “Memoirs…”, so your present blog post could not be more timely for me.

    When I went Clear in ’92 I wanted to get on with Life and try out my new wings, but as I am sure you can guess, the reg had other things in mind for me – KTL/LOC, the Ls, blah, blah, blah…I was going stir crazy! After finally getting away from Flag and getting back into the real world, I really began to hate what I was starting to become. I find it incredibly embarrassing now to look back and see that I was turning into one of those self-satisfied, Homo Novus, I’m-better-than-Wogs type of Scientologists. And, yes, I suffered the humiliation – Thank God I had the presence of mind to be humiliated! And thank God that phase didn’t last long. It sure was the wake up call I needed to distance myself from the Church.

    I particularly loved the last chapter of your book where you spell out the very danger of falling for the Crowley-esque super-ego trip and the demand that you MUST begin the battle against Xenu and the Body Snatchers. Thank God I escaped before I became assimilated by the Borg.

    I see now why the M2 crowd and so many “better-than-human” Scientologists are pissed off at you. They enjoy their superiority complex too much. And I also see why you have renounced the label “Scientologist” for yourself.

    Thank you for your excellent book and your thoughtful insights.


  46. That is a fact. 🙂 You are wise to point it out. To people in the Church of Scientology, if you do not stand behind endless TR’s & Objectives you are suppressive. If you are doing TR’s & Objectives for the 3rd time and your sister asks “Is this really what you want to do?” she is suppressive, and you must disconnect from her and/or bring her to an understanding that your 8 months on TR’s and Objectives is good for you. BUT… the staff at the church that are stealing your letters from LRH and not telling you, spending money in your church account as if it was their own and when depleted lying to people that you were delcared, selling you an e-meter before you have even read a Dianetics pack…they are the trend setters, the social personalities the aristocracy of society…What LRH wrote and what the Church of Scientology practices are 2 completely different practices. 🙂 Recovery can be slow but it is certain as long as one follows the closely written path LRH laid out and NOT the “trend setting money making acts” the church engages in. I have met unemployed people who think the Church of Scientology is crazy in spite of the fact they always have a “Now Hiring” sign in front of their church. And wait until you see the kind of people they are hiring on the list on the sign: Executives, Administrators, Counselors, Clerks, Typists, Contractors, Accounting Personnel. And then to top it off, you go into one of these places and you met by a deranged moron that pops out of the woodwork named David Miscavige, who is not representing Scientology or its people. I have to stop, because this making me laugh, as serious as it is. I think my decompression ended a while ago! 🙂

  47. WHOOPSIE! Naughty cognition – naughty, naughty, naughty. LOL!!

  48. Sunshine Disinfects

    So true Valeska! I know you and love your honest and direct response when communicating. You are refreshing. Hugs to you, Chris and your beautiful boys. And Marty, you have my utmost admiration. Thank you for everything you have done and what you have been put through, doing so.

  49. martyrathbun09

    Thanks a lot Nancy.

  50. My experience is that there is a decompression period and each of us goes through it in our own unique ways. For me it came off in layers, sometimes months would go by before I recognized that another layer was still present. As each layer came into view my ability to confront increased which made it easier to handle…much like valences falling away when getting processed.

  51. Mary Rathernotsay

    I understand a little bit about decompression. When I got out my decompression was very gradual. I had no terminals to bounce stuff off of, and I used to sit and read the Tech Vols sometimes and wonder whether it was just me or the Church who was the most confused.
    Marty your three published books are a boon to folks recently out who are in process of decompressing. If timing had been different then you would have gotten out ahead of me and I would have had your books back then as an aid. But I believe that this blog is (hopefully) the final step for me and when I stop reading it, it will be that I am healed.
    Also your second book serves as a great caveat to those who (I hate to say) like me, may be prone to being caught up in a cult mentality. Such folks can quite easily move from one cult into another, hard as that is to fathom.
    Your third book explains the whole phenomena….Looking for answers, wanting to help a family member, and on into the thick of the forest where its easy to lose oneself in the greater Cause.
    By the way remembering your story and how in Memoirs you described your experiences with basketball- I feel that you could really relate to the documentary The Iran Job, which chronicles the experiences of pro basketball player Kevin Sheppard when he traveled to Iran and encountered cultural differences but a good deal of spiritual similarities with the people both on and off the basketball court. It is an inspiring documentary, and fun to watch, if you ever take a break.(Can see it on Amazon video) A fast paced film that actually gets one thinking. Watching it reminded me of your chapter on the Zen of basketball, and also how you helped all those guys in the institution through basketball.
    That in itself was a fantastic therapy. Sorry if I’ve digressed.
    But thanks. I like the way your blog is evolving. And evolving.

  52. martyrathbun09

    Thanks Mary – I’ll check out the movie too.

  53. This reminds me of what one is told about the Sea Org. Just by joining the Sea Org and being in the Sea Org, you are automatically OT and the elite in the universe, you are extra special, one of the 10,000 who lead, whatever. You can say that all you want but it doesn’t make it true. It’s a fantasy bull shit. The same idea is pushed on staff and public.

  54. Hmm. I tried that, but there was no reflection.

    BAHAHAAAAAA!!!!! 😀

  55. gretchen dewire

    Chris, I agree. Humility is not an adjective I would use to describe most scientologists. After doing a lot of reading, however it appears to be a trait that describes the more spiritually enlightened..

  56. Mike Laws, now that was well stated Sir……my thoughts align. There are some awesome people in this world and hey many I have met ask me where I got certain ideas or why I do certain things the way I do and if they are so inclined to want to share different viewpoints hell I tell them I studied LRH and learned and grew as a result. As a result some have reached to want to know more. I will not make others wrong with the attitude that I am in any way better than anyone. I enjoy helping others both people and animals and I have gained the ability to tell a”used car salesman” from a real and honest person. From day one of meeting Marty he was genuine. From what I have observed from some who make up Milestone 2, or for that matter any organized group I am not interested. Mike, I look forward to meeting you someday!!

  57. I have seen just that phenomena Marty! Betsy, nicely stated!!

  58. Mike,

    I want to get hold of you to ask you something but I don’t know any of your contact information. Can you give me some contact info here?


  59. Betsy, your comments reminded me of Dave Petit whom I believe became the ED of CCLA. I remember Dave from when I was on staff at Orange County Org. He was so sweet and funny and easy to be around. I can’t recall what my crime was but someone in a Dave Petit costume was inches from my face yelling at the top of his lungs. I can’t even remember what he was yelling; all I recall was his bright, red face and the sound of his screaming voice. I went totally pie face (before I knew the term) and he only got madder and madder. Next thing I knew, he had been promoted and that’s the valence he kept according to stories I’ve heard and read of others who encountered him. I can’t imagine what it must be like to go from such a sweet and generous demeanor to DRACULA!


  60. Marty, after finishing your book and having a few hours to let it sink in, I would like to know you opinion on the OT Levels. From what I can gather from the materials that have been leaked on line, they seem to be one-size-fits-all-cases processes having very little to do with the actual person running them. In your opinion, are they even worth doing?


  61. How I decompressed.

    When I left Scientology in 82 this is how I decompressed: I consciously did things that I wasn’t ever aloud to do in Scientology. I went on top of a secluded hill in Griffith Park, under a shady tree and I prayed and meditated. I chanted songs I learned as a teen and felt my world expand into my new phase. I felt a strong feeling of kinship with the universe and felt a benevolent presence heeding my call for guidance.

    I was pissed at Ron and aloud myself to luxuriate in criticising him. For it was he and only he that was at the heart of my self thought stopping.

    I went home and did the ultimate: I smoked pot from someone who offered (I did not take it up as a habit but it was a my way of saying fuck you to all the mind control) It felt wonderful and I laughed and blew so much charge. i wrote down my thoughts and cried and laughed and cried and laughed for a few hrs. I was exhausted but felt relief and a very deep level.

    I never ever for a minute since 82 ever not studied, practiced some form of spiritual living. I read other teachers, listened to other lectures.

    By keeping my eye on the prize of spiritual knowledge and experience I kept myself safe from the feeling that I have left the ‘only hope’


    The goal of spiritual freedom is real. The best way to decompress is to find your way again. Betrayal after trust is a treacherous place to be stuck. Move on up a little higher. Take up the journey again, find your way, roar like a lion in this world. Make fear and danger cower before your awesome goal to discover spiritual liberation.

    Reject the mind numbing agreements that Scientology was the ‘only hope for man’. In resolving that one false and supressive ideology lies the answer to a quick recovery.

    Be bold and reject anything that causes you to shackle your mind with only way thought supression.

    And when you do you will be relieved. And then, you will be attacked by those who have not made it out of the mind prison. Have patience with them, allow them to judge you with kindness in your heart. Then you will be working out the karma of every condemnation you have stuck into the heart of another.

    Then, when they finally see the light of day they will come to you and say’ ” hey bud, I’m sorry for being such an asshole, forgive me”. Then they will in turn help others by being patient and loving when they start getting judged for ‘thinking unthinkable and unapproved thoughts.

    It is easy to feel hopeless when you quit that which you thought was the only hope. Stand unshaken amidst the crash of breaking worlds and reclaim your sovereign right as a free soul wending his/her way back to Source/God/Liberation/Satori/Theta/Samadhi.

    Because that is what we are. We do not have to reach it or deserve it. We need to remember that we have always been it. We just need to improve our knowing

  62. It helps to study and practice another religion, just as you did Scientology.

    As you go through that later, similar activity, you realize all the things that are NOT there, and some of the things that are.

    You realize how it was wrong and how it was right. And you also realize what you brought to the activity and what others brought to it. And you sort all those things out and move on.

    Until you are confronted with something that hasn’t happened to you since you were in Scientology, and you watch your Scientology trained-in, knee-jerk response fully dramatize itself.

    Then it feels like you haven’t gotten anywhere. But you have. So you clean up the mess you made, and then it doesn’t kick in as much the next time.

    It is like peeling an onion. An onion with layers that you never thought were there.


  63. Marty – it’s a perfect edit 😀 Thanks

  64. Mike the trailer looks good…I am going to rent it!!

  65. How civilized. Seriously. Very nice.

  66. And yes. The consistent use of the (implant) line ‘you need to go in session’ is the ultimate in inval, eval and covert mind control.

  67. martyrathbun09


  68. To the Moderator:

    I would like to read what Sam Freeman wrote that was censored, and which the impulse to hyper-control everything that people might say to each other did not survive.

    Sam is a thoughtful person. If she wrote it, it should be read. And the consequences NOT handled BEFORE THE FACT.


    Just expressing my opinion here on Marty’s blog.


  69. martyrathbun09

    I wouldn’t make a blanket recommendation one way or the other. I would have to hear and see the person in front of me very well before I recommended a particular next course of study or practice. I am explaining the rationale and philosophy for that approach in a soon upcoming post.

  70. martyrathbun09

    Objection noted. Incidentally, she agreed with the edit.

  71. Brian, that was gorgeous! That was poetry.

    I remember the horrible, lost feeling I had when I first tried to escape and subsequently read my initial SP declare. I was driving in LA traffic and was so distracted I missed the exit I was supposed to take and wound up in a completely unfamiliar and dangerous neighborhood. I should have been scared, hoping for a route out, but I found that I was really hoping I would get shot and killed, and despairing that even such an immediate fate would not end my eternal damnation. I ultimately did my A-J and temporarily returned to the cult, but I was still trying to find a way out.

    I had always kept a journal since I was a kid – not so much as a record-keeping tool, but just a place to write my thoughts. When I was fully immersed in the cult I noticed I stopped writing – because I stopped thinking! Once I began to spend time in the real world, I began writing again. My writing reflected my mental/spiritual straight-jacket. Instead of exploring my thoughts to see where they would lead, I wrote up my goddamn O/Ws! I eventually got to a point where I felt free again to write exactly what was on my mind without having to assign myself an ethics condition. I then NATTERED up a storm. Knowing that I was only nattering on paper (to my own auditing file) I began to lift away from the thought-stopping guilt that came with the urge to natter. No else ever knew about that natter – I just got it off my chest without annoying anyone else or embarrassing myself. I also found that after I nattered in my journal to a certain point, my thoughts turned to exploring the cause – sometimes O/Ws contributed, but it was always much more complex. Once I explored without forcing myself to dig for O/Ws the natteriness dissipated, and I felt so light and free and happy!!!

    Lesson learned: 1) thinking through things often resolves things in a natural course of inquiry. 2) It is not necessary to confess your sins to another human. 3) being honest with yourself is far more valuable and certainly more “pro-survival” than revealing your transgressions to a terminal whose reliability you cannot determine.

    In the cult you are enforced into trusting the Ethics Officer. There simply is no option or process to actually “establish” trust.

    Gah, I am rambling… It is so good to be free. It is so good to be able to communicate with others who know how damn good it is to be free.


  72. Alonzo: I liked your earlier comment about studying other religions …

    And this part “Until you are confronted with something that hasn’t happened to you since you were in Scientology, and you watch your Scientology trained-in, knee-jerk response fully dramatize itself”

    I completely understand this and I have to say — chuckled when I believe your comment to the moderator about Sam’s edited post — showed exactly the knee-jerk.

    Don’t worry — I’ve been reading you for a few years on ESMB — I’m thinkin’ you are making progress …

    How’s that for judgmental 🙂

  73. Brian, I think you’ve got it right there.

  74. Dirk Niblick

    While my life experiences are different, what you’re saying about decompression really rings true for me.

    I was raised in an extremely conservative evangelical church. Today, the more I think about it and the more I learn about Scientology, the more I see parallels- some great, helpful ideas, but a sea of thought-stopping, judgmental thinking, and dangerous habits. The mentality I read about in Scientology seems so similar to what I learned… as a child I would walk around and see the world around me as “lost,” as damned, as people who just don’t get it. If only they knew the truth I know (not believe, know). If only my church could grow and save the world. Such lost, degraded beings, such wogs, such “unbelievers,” the mentality really is identical.

    I stopped going to church nearly 15 years ago when I finally left my family’s home to go to college. For the first time my eyes were opened to a bigger world and I realized that something in my upbringing wasn’t quite right. But, it took time to come to grips with things. It’s only within the last few years that I finally feel comfortable in my spiritual journey- I am happy being a seeker, and I am happy to encourage others who are seeking. The change happened when I was willing to step back and say “I really don’t know. I’m going to look, it’s going to take time, I’m going to listen, I’m going to read, I’m going to try to learn, and I don’t have to have it all figured out this minute.” In other words, I realized I had to decompress.

    For years, though, even though I felt I was no longer a “conservative evangelical Christian,” I had to shake the habits and behaviors and thought-patterns I’d learned and slowly open my eyes to the world around me. It really was decompression. Today I still find myself having to fight the kind of angry, judgmental, “I know I’m right” thinking that I grew up around.

    Today I have ideas that I would’ve considered blasphemous, dangerous, even damning 15 years ago. Even 10 years ago I still felt confused. Some of it was probably that I was a cocksure, loudmouth 20 year old kid back then… still learning how the world works. It’s only recently that I’ve become more aware of who I am. Much of my growth has come from my interest and study of Scientology’s history, and my study of the independent movement’s growth and progress. I see parallels that have helped me understand my own experience and my own life. Your blog and your story in particular has helped me quite a bit. Perhaps we come from different backgrounds, but I appreciate the thoughtful ideas I see you share here.

    Thank you.

  75. Old Secretary

    I agree that it absolutely helps to take up a study or practice of other paths. It not only helps, you owe it to yourself. You will find riches and understanding and continue on your journey. It certainly does not need to be a religion in name or ceremony. I am sure whatever new avenue of enlightenment you pursue will be the right one for you at that moment. The important thing is not to shut down because of scientology.

  76. OK, that makes sense, especially since blanket-ism seems to run rampant in the church. I am really looking forward to your thoughts in your upcoming post.

    Perhaps this question is also premature: Were the OT levels right for you?

    I guess what prompts this line of inquiry is my admittedly limited perception that people’s basic personalities really don’t seem to change that much from moving up the Bridge. Supposedly moving up the Bridge changes your chronic tone level. While I have seen social tone levels change dramatically, I really don’t think I have observed chronic tone levels change.

    Of course, this is all my subjective observation, which means Jack Shit…
    (Heya Jack Shit! You must know Dumb Shit and his Russian cousin, Don’t Giva Shit! ….. ok, I’ll stop now..)

    I can say that I have made deep changes in my life since my involvement in SCN, but I cannot confidently assign these changes to my work in SCN. How much have I grown simply because I am a curious person and I have grown up and matured? Yet, I am still the same clueless, silly, creative, independent, insouciant, reclusive, absent-minded, clumsy, happy-go-lucky dork I was when I was a rug rat in preschool.

    Did Scientology change me? How different would I be today if I had been raised in a SCN family as opposed to the Christian household? I do not consider myself a Christian or a Scientologist.

    Marty, dear, I know you cannot answer these questions with authority. No one can. Well, LRH might try to convince me he could…

    Thank you for this forum and for sharing your thoughts…


  77. Alonzo – I had already warned Marty that the post may not be appropriate and figured it wouldn’t go up so really the edit was a response to that. It was edited perfectly in a way that took out what was potentially inflammatory without taking away anything I was trying to say.

  78. And ‘moderation’ is not the same as ‘censorship’ 🙂

  79. Crap! Sorry I got your name wrong Alanzo. While I love that no-one can go back and alter their comm once it’s up it’s really annoying when you don’t bother to spell check 😀

  80. Figure you just as-ised yourself 😀

  81. While they are clinging to that life preserver, they need to dog paddle over to the shallow end of the pool where they can stand on their own two feet before moving back into deeper waters. LOL

  82. Grasshopper (Mark P)

    I don’t agree with the statement that if you take ownership of Scientology it takes ownership of you. Rather, the only way you can get through it is to take full ownership and decide what is true and what is not – or take ownership so you can throw it away.
    To me the big problem is that people who are in have abdicated ownership to people like DM – and here we are.

  83. I like this blog 😀

    I like how it is moderated and that people can freely discuss with respect. Here are wonderful people and all this sharing of viewpoints helped me to decompress and find my own way again.
    I still catch myself sometimes with thoughts like “the biggest crime is be there and communicate” and such things to find out that it is not the biggest crime at all. I was so stuffed with “stable data” that they sometimes pop up out of nowhere and I have to really look at them in a new unit of time and ask myself if that information is really true …
    Some things I find out for myself, some things I read here and cognite then. So, thank you to all of you. I can learn again from anybody. I learned to lay down my arrogance of knowing all about life because Ron wrote about it and he found everything already out, I don’t have to look myself anymore or elsewhere…. lol
    I compare it with the process of stopping to smoke. It’s the same process. One really has to get rid of all the false data which prompts one to smoke e.g. it tastes good, it’s not so unhealthy, I need it to calm down, to … whatever.
    And maybe one has to go through the same decompression as being for being so addict to the body and the cylce of rebirth …. 😉
    And thank you Marty for creating this living room. In case somebody thinks here is again somebody admiring a hero and following a leader only because I acknowledge a person… no. I like you, Marty, for putting a living room here where we can share our viewpoints so freely and can learn from each other and help to decrompress. I like to be inspired by all these different ideas and also to be challenged – even if it is sometimes only my patience … 😀
    And I must say it’s true. I read your book „What is wrong with Scientology?“ at exactly the right point. I was still into this Scientology Think and out of church and trying to continue to audit the OT levels in the field … It did for me what you said and helped me to decompress even more so I could move up big steps out of this mist. And I haven’t thanked you in all these years – so THANK YOU!!!!! 🙂

  84. Grasshopper: “Leaving the church was a different process. For me it was a combination of growing up and opening up. I believe you grow into tolerance.”
    Yep! I agree to that one! Way more tolerance 🙂

  85. A possibly different way to view stuff:
    Q: If everything is my projection, then who are you?

    Rinpoche: You see the world through your dream, I see the world through mine. That means what you SEE is your reflection, what I see is mine.

    Q: But apparently, you aren’t separate from me, so how does that work?

    Rinpoche: What you see is not separate, it’s very similar, you see a stupa, I see a stupa, so which one is yours and which one is mine? That means we share a very similar but not exactly the same stupa. You see your karmic appearance, I see mine. Actually there is no you, no me, but when you talk about appearances, you have to all the time divide.
    Rinpoche means precious teacher. In the above quote the Rinpoche is
    Kyabgon Phakchok Rinpoche — he has a facebook page — I find its well worth “liking” for different perspectives

    Stupa = dome shaped monument used to house Buddhist relics


  86. martyrathbun09

    Nancy, you noted this, “How much have I grown simply because I am a curious person and I have grown up and matured?” In my opinion, whatever contributes to keeping curiosity sharp and leading while nurturing growth and maturity (that last word might not be the one I would have chosen but it is close enough) is good for anyone. To answer your question about what was right for me, everything I have done has been a learning experience. In keeping with some previous essays I have posted – most particularly introduction to Integral Theory (and the dozens suggesting reading outside Scientology) – I think doing the OT Levels with tunnel vision, no other context and idea of other similar constructs with which to compare and fully understand what one is doing, is the road to delusion and religious fundamentalism.

  87. martyrathbun09

    Great post. Thanks for sharing that.

  88. Old Secretary

    I chose the word ownership to embrace one getting fully involved with the subject. Absorbing and identifying with it. After having done that, once is “hooked” and the cult “think” is part of ones own “think”. That is how I was using the word. Ones entrance into the trap. Yes, you can also use the same word to provide a point from which you disentangle oneself. Akin to one taking responsibility for the condition they find themselves in. But that was not my point.

  89. “What is life?” I’ve seen people ask on several occasions until one day it came to me: “Life is to accumulate, store, and conditionally release energy”.

    It’s a flow. Energy goes in and based on the current conditions we release the energy stored within as needed. That is if we have it. The sentence may look like an over simplification at first but if you consider the word “conditionally” it covers a whole LOT. Part of this condition is logic. Our logic is a very complex and intricate “thing”. It can allow or restrict the flow of energy. Adaptation, influence all fall under the word ‘conditionally’. Decompression makes perfect sense. One who has been surrounded with a certain environment demonstrating a certain behavior will likely adapt some of that unless one is set from the get go to rebel. Once adapted a behavior is not easy to shed. One needs time in the new environment to adopt to how things roll now. Decompression is is a very good word for this experience.

  90. Ditto Sam re: wrong spelling on your name.

    Sorry Alanzo.

  91. Great article, Marty! This needs to be repeated again and again until it is widely known and understood.

    I have been counseling ex-church members for several years and decompression is an observable phenomenon. The decompression time seems directly related to the depth of indoctrination. Unfortunately, this means that Sea Org members and long time staff take the longest time to decompress. For example, it took me 15 years before I could confront the idea that I had been in a cult.

    Any independent practitioner should be aware of this as it affects the ability of the preclear to benefit from counseling.

  92. LOL! Funny.

  93. palehorse, elle and just me……….. Thank you for your response to this. Palehorse, I think you have just expressed the utter evil of being conditioned to think that any therapeutic free self expression is considered natter and the only reason for it is some crime “YOU” commited.

    This is how Mao dealt with dissent. This is how Ron dealt with dissent.



    Criminality and critical thinking is then identified as the same thing. This is why cult recovery groups say, in there experience, Scientologists take the longest time to recover. Some say 12 years or so. Marty is lessening it for a lot of people.

    All I needed to do in my recovery was to allow myself the freedom of critical thinking. And my aim was squarely at Ron. Because it was he who made it a crime to be critical of him. And then it was WE who agreed thus sealing our fate as mindless ideologues masquerading as deluded super beings.

    After feeling safe and free to be critical, it took me a few years to separate out the truths I learned from Ron from the lies.

    This was harder to do because it required me to not just be negatively critical but positively, consciously critical.

    Then I was able to appreciate what I learned and see truths that were now my own. I was also clear on those things that I considered his case, his craziness, his meglomania, his narcissism.

    Differentiating between the crazy Ron and the genius Ron was real tough for me because of the mental booby traps he layed in on seeing him.

    He ran from the law, he ran from justice and he created an ideological and doctrine ladden scripture, that WE agreed with, that kept him hidden from our God given right to see him behind the smoke screen of his self appointed messiahship.

    He made it our overts to think freely. This is the basic basic shackle that holds minds in the prison of destructive Scientology.

    The degree to which you judge me for writing this, is an accurate measuring stick of how deep you have denied yourself sovereign thinking: the freedom you were promised and then crushed for expressing it.

  94. BTW, I have finally found the one true path to freedom: Briantology :-))
    Love you guys for sharing, have a great day. It’s going to be hot in LA.

    Thank you Marty for allowing this dissedent, me, to get some of this off my chest. Maybe one day we share in a beer or two.

  95. Phil Bruemmer

    “I think doing the OT Levels with tunnel vision, no other context and idea of other similar constructs with which to compare and fully understand what one is doing, is the road to delusion and religious fundamentalism.”
    Thank you.
    I had that thought recently, tho’ it was one of several I was entertaining.
    This one is the correct one for me.

  96. At some point Scientology won’t be around…but for some reason it’s necessary right now for some and for others it has shown “what not to do if you believe in love” I have forgiven myself for ever going this route and I have forgiven all I came in contact with during those years of stress. Bottom line is I did it for a reason and I probably wouldn’t be as happy and unencumbered now had I not had the contrast of Scientology.

  97. Grasshopper (Mark P)

    Ah. Understood.

  98. Tom Gallagher

    Consider the following-

    “Of all bad men religious bad men are the worst.” — C.S. Lewis

  99. Marty,
    I just wanted to comment on something you pointed out at the end of “Memoirs”.

    It is the spin which with the OT levels are sold as the bridge to a Super Ego/Super Power kind of being.

    It is very interesting. I never quite added it up (I haven’t done the OT levels), and because of the communication gag to all OTs and the secrecy about these levels, I completely missed that spin.

    But now it all finally makes sense to me. I can add one plus one. That explains the obnoxious, compulsive and obsessive controlling nature of Scientologists in general and Sea Org/Staff in particular.

    What is so dissonant to me, it is that since I was a kid, I have always viewed the spirit world as a magic place. I found it interesting that LRH added the ability to control it to the mix, as something that ads balance to an otherwise so malleable a reality.

    But to make the control of Theta an all consuming goal is absolutely for the birds, and ultimately self-defeating.

    In my personal experience, the Theta Universe, is a crazy, magical kingdom where all possibilities exist, it is at once chaotic and perfect. It is that place where “Self” vanishes, and “Reality” can be viewed it for what it is.

    Why anybody would want to turn the Spirit Realms into and obsessive Control Operation is beyond me!

    Thank you for all you are doing, I can definitely conclude that my observations and rejection of Scientology, as packaged and sold, were correct from the beginning.

    Scientology is a self-defeating, self-cancelling proposition. For whatever power it has to free, it dead ends itself by its own arrogance and obsession to control that which cannot be owned.

  100. martyrathbun09

    Thanks for that insight Conan. That so many peak experiences are available along the way makes this truth almost impossible to see for many. I guess you can appreciate why I keep repeating the theme that folk involved in Scientology for very long would be well served to learn, or re-learn, the ability to let go.

  101. Marty,
    Yes I do. I’m learning that ability again. To let go is definitely the way out!

  102. Hi Marty,
    You mentioned in your above post to Nancy:
    “I think doing the OT Levels with tunnel vision, no other context and idea of other similar constructs with which to compare and fully understand what one is doing, is the road to delusion and religious fundamentalism.”

    I couldn’t agree with you more. I’m currently doing a little reading on the history of running incidents, earlier similar incidents, and the practice of destimulating traumatic incidents. It would appear that the ideas borrowed by LRH and refined in his own terms and practice have a lot more “history” than anyone inside of the cult of scientology would dare admit.

    Auditing several PCs on grades processes while reading other material is giving me a broader understanding of the entire subject of helping people overcome their self-imposed limitations. The Grades are extremely valuable exactly as written. Using this tech exactly as written is still my preferred methodology. But without a real understanding (KRC) for the background material, one will definitely not be as effective as he could be.

    This also applies to the OT levels, and what they might and might not achieve for a person. I have a friend who does Shaminism. She’s more aware of the existence of beings sans bodies than most scientologists I know. Most of the lower bridge and some of the upper bridge is like, “yea? So? What do you have that’s new?” What she most keyed out on was the concept of granting beingness, instead of creating an oppositional terminal. She started putting that into practice right away and was impressed with the results.

    There is a tremendous amount of useful material in Ron’s work. But there is much more to know. Knowledge that one would get ostracized for profferring as valid to folks in the cult.

    A huge part of decompressing for me has been the pan-determined search for truth from many sources, and the cessation of the compulsion to make everything and everyone fit into the framwork of Ron’s creation.

  103. martyrathbun09

    Thanks Les. That is real interesting.

  104. Thanks for your thoughtful response, Marty. I so enjoy and appreciate your gentle wisdom. 🙂


  105. Ah, yes … the confusion between critical thinking and natter. Really good posts above by Brian, Nancy and others.

    ARC is based on true realities shared, not bullshit niceties that cover up real disagreements. That’s why simple, heartfelt apologies restore so much ARC. But without some occasional screaming and yelling and cussing (and some good listening and hearing) you wind up with nothing but pretend-friends. And who needs or really wants pretend-friends? Nobody.

  106. Windhorse –

    I have to say that questioning a moderator is not a knee-jerk response learned from Scientology.

    The knee-jerk response learned from Scientology would be to agree that one is being uppity and not a good “group member”, to introvert and to look inward to find some kind of overt or missed-witthold, or personal out-ethics situation, and would thank a moderator for “putting their ethics in”.

    Standing up to and questioning a person who deigns to cut or alter another’s communication is very good for a person who has had their communications suppressed in Scientology.

    I highly recommend it.


  107. I second that statement “That so many peak experiences are available
    along the way”. After more than 24.9 years out of the cult, it boiled down to the “peaks”. Now those peaks are “empty” and “void”.
    George M. White

  108. I am one of those who started decompression while still in the Church. Having disagreed with taking the “nut” valence advocated by the staff when reading KSW ,I set myself up for being the odd one out and it was not all that comfortable , juggling being in but not really , defending my position but not attacking , kind of making it my mission to insert some sanity , sticking to the Scientology principles I found true and workable.
    But 35 years of sacred cows and other determinism still did some damage, making it sometimes difficult to have an intelligent conversation with someone of a different faith because I had become ignorant but justified with the cult think “they just don’t know”…
    It has been an interesting road since the brave Debbie Cook email.
    I was told about Marty “the devil” and that’s all I needed to check out the blog.
    I have read the books as they came out . I just couldn’t read fast enough , I had such a thirst for information , read most of the book recommended and more, had a hard time with Lawrence Wright but read it nonetheless and now I think the Tao of physics is going to lead me back to listening to LRH with new understanding. the cognitions keep coming , a new clarity in my thinking.

    So education has been the primary factor in decompressing in my case.

  109. Totally agree Just Me. My favorite trait in human beings and myself is authenticity. And Palehorse, I felt what you went through when you left. I am glad you made it. I have enjoyed you posts over time. Thank you for insights.

  110. Great thoughts, Brian.
    I appreciate your distinction between critical thoughts (negative) and critical thinking. Of course, in the cult, critical thinking = reasonableness.

    And I love your new path to freedom. LOL! One time when I was on the fence about Scientology my sister came to visit me for moral support and we came up with our own religion – the Church of Fuckit-ology. Apparently there is a bloke in the UK that has taken it a bit further!


  111. This is altogether an awesome comment and awesome edit.

    The idea that every time something happens to you you need to get audited on it is ridiculous. Auditing is not about daily life maintenance. If auditing is about anything, it is about getting to the point where you don’t need it anymore.

  112. LDW,

    Your post really resonates with me. I am only just studying Scientology, specifically the more philosophical side of it, through listening to lectures and reading books. It seems like thoroughly in-depth research is played down within the CoS culture (despite the hard sell of the materials), but even as someone who’s coming from a Buddhist background, I have found that it’s possible to gain some interesting experiential insights into one’s condition simply through study of the works alone, which does bode well.

    One of the things that first struck me as a unique approach is LRH’s treatment of “superstition” and the history of religion’s view regarding other/”higher” beings, entities, deities, and the like – and there seems to have been an early effort to de-emphasise those considerations, perhaps because they could be seen as barriers to entry.

    Unfortunately, perhaps due to a policy of overprotection in parts, the narrative has now become one of “dead space aliens”; which acts practically as a smear by those who do not connect “Thetan” with “Spirit”.

    By some detractors, it is forgotten that all religions believe in discarnate beings. The difference in Scientology seems to be one of emphasis (in part) and the need to personally extrapolate further when one is ready to.

    In fact, I think that the essence of all religion is in seeking for this same fundamental truth; however, due to people’s own individual inclinations, the emphases in teachings differ (sometimes radically so). This is not to say that there’s no such thing as bad doctrine or that one should mix things haphazardly. But the implication is that we just might find the right “emphasis” or way to integrate and internalise a particular ideal from a spiritual teaching of a wholly different kind; i.e. truly valuable teachings are applicable regardless of what one follows.

    Fortunately I’ve not had to go through a “decompression” in the strict sense that it’s being used here, although I have had my fair share of taking stock and recalibrating after having difficult spiritual experiences. Personally I feel it’s important to take a relaxed approach – particularly when other people around us feel strongly affected by our own restrictions and conditions – and just allow the seeking and questioning to take place.

  113. The mind, with all its layers upon layers of defence mechanisms, hates change. Any addict will tell you.

    So it’s understandable why some choose to attack messengers rather than their messages.

    It’s understandable why some can dismiss an entire message if it contains a “bad word” or if its tone was “too low”.

    It’s understandable why a group will try to stamp on those who dare to demand change.

    “Fear is a state of imperception; fear is an unwillingness to confront.” — LRH, The Deterioration of Liberty.

    Seeing supposedly “advanced” Scientologists demonstrate this fear, both in the Co$ and out, compounds my belief that absolutes are simply unobtainable, including the “state” of Clear.

  114. Hi Conan,

    I love your description of the Theta Universe as being a “crazy, magical kingdom”!

    Ideally, such a place shouldn’t – wouldn’t – need to be “controlled” in a militant sense; however, I do believe in the idea of being able to have mastery of one’s own place in such a Universe, and thus have control of its (our) expressive energy.

    In order to do this, I think that such a place needs to be made discoverable through knowledge and methods that we can use to enter, since this is not how things are for us at the present time, and letting life pass idly by is not necessarily going to do any wonders!

  115. Ha ha, Nancy. That is a great path

  116. That was a nice sharing Eddie

  117. That is the ultimate truth Christine. In this land of dreams we dreamers dream. In Vedic literature there is a Sanskrit word called Lila. It means sport or play. It is meant to answer the question ‘why did all this come to be, why did the Uncreated Absolute differentiate ItSelf into infinite multiplicity?


  118. Conan, I have another question to had to yours:

    Why did LRH create the magical spirit world into an implant station?

    Going into the Light is not being absorbed into love and beauty after a long haul in the body. Going into the Light in Scientology means being tortured by aliens.

    Geeze, someone make it stop.

  119. Bravo Marty, the other night I spoke at length with Tiziano, do not write spent on your Blog, my English is bad and i use a translator.
    Here in Italy a similar thing happened to what is happened to you, but at the end the truth always comes out.
    Here in talia there are more and more people get together and form independent groups.
    A free Scientology outside of the monopolies is now a reality.
    No one has the right to claim to be “senior” of the independents, and the secret is in the definition of the word.
    In the independent field honestly I made ​​my way from Clear to OTVII thanks to qualified, competent, trained and eager to help as IgnazioTidu, Paolo Facchinetti and David.
    They were not interested in how much money can make, but simply listened to the words of LRH: “The work was free, so keep it. ”
    And that is what I see that you’re doing, so thank you.
    Francesco Minelli


    Bravo Marty, l’altra sera ho parlato a lungo con Tiziano, non scrivo speso sul tuo Blog, il mio inglese e’ pessimo ed uso un traduttore.
    Qui in italia e’ accaduta una cosa simile a cio’ che e’ accaduto a te, ma alla fine la verita esce sempre.
    Qui in talia ci sono sempre piu persone che si riuniscono e formano gruppi indipendenti.
    Una Scientology libera al di fuori dei monopoli e’ ora una realta.
    Nessuno ha il diritto di pretendere di ” essere il senior ” degli indipendenti , il segreto e’ nella definizione stessa della parola.
    Nel campo indipendente ho onestamente fatto il mio percorso da Clear a OTVII grazie a persone qualificate, competenti, addestrate e con tanta voglia di aiutare come Ignazio Tidu, Paolo Facchinetti e David.
    Non erano interessati a quanti soldi fare, ma semplicemente hanno ascoltato le parole di LRH : ” il lavoro era libero, mantenetelo cosi’ ” .
    E questo e’ cio’ che vedo che anche tu stai facendo, quindi ti ringrazio.
    Francesco Minelli

  120. Being clear is a practice, not an absolute state. Selling absolute states of being was good for sales, but delusional for the recipients. Especially when it was criminal to see that those who were supposedly clear and ot were not so clear and ot.

    It is the formula for self induced madness, to consider seeing clearly as out ethics or knowing what you know by direct perception, as having evil intentions.

    These simple but powerful distortions in the fabric of Scientology dogma are at the heart of it’s failure and the seeds of emotional and mental problems for it’s escaped prisoners.

  121. Is it just me or is there an extraordinary amount of integrally informed discourse occurring on this blog?


  122. Tom Gallagher

    The “state” of Clear is a beginning, not an end.

    To borrow from the last line in Marty’s Memoirs,

    ‘One is not different from who one used to be; only one’s course of action is different than before’. – Pai-chang.

    Ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, I feel free.(repeated 8 times)
    Feel when I dance with you,
    We move like the sea.
    You, you’re all I want to know.
    I feel free, I feel free, I feel free.
    I can walk down the street, there’s no one there
    Though the pavements are one huge crowd.
    I can drive down the road, my eyes don’t see,
    Though my mind wants to cry out loud.
    I feel free, I feel free, I feel free.
    I can walk down the street, there’s no one there
    Though the pavements are one huge crowd.
    I can drive down the road; my eyes don’t see,
    Though my mind wants to cry out loud,
    Though my mind wants to cry out loud.
    Dance floor is like the sea,
    Ceiling is the sky.
    You’re the sun and as you shine on me,
    I feel free, I feel free, I feel free.

  123. Tom Gallagher

    Breaking News: Neither are the OT levels “Nirvana”.

  124. martyrathbun09

    One reason I recommended Rogers was his insight into the value of treating the client as process rather than static fixity – which better lends toward notions of growth, development, evolution, upward trajectory.

  125. martyrathbun09

    One reason I recommended Rogers was his insight into the value of treating the client as process rather than static fixity – which better leads toward notions of growth, development, evolution, upward trajectory.

  126. martyrathbun09

    Why don’t we chill with the ‘why’ question about people’s motivations. People here have had plenty of conditioning to go down that rabbit hole – and I think the decompression process helps to quiet the dissonance that route inevitably leads to.

  127. Okeedokee Marty, I’ll be good 🙂 I get you

  128. Indeed Mr. R.

  129. Tom Gallagher


  130. Hubbard says the way to get new people in is:

    Bring to Understanding

    But this is a third dynamic activity also. Many people seem unaware of these simple powers on a one to one basis. The greatest power I have seen with this magic was 3D , Marty taking on the German Government, and Mike Rinder taking on a group of intellects in Ireland.

    They did the above on a HUGE level.

    Brought Others to Understanding

    Indeed, I wondered why Hubbard hadn’t just done this himself and used this simple remedy instead of creating the Guardians Office.

    So! Here we are and what IS “DECOMPRESSION”? It is when we help one another in this way.

    Hubbard did this,
    Bring to Understanding ~ ~ with every policy letter (or not), daily OODS, letters, training and auditing.

    Marty does it every time he puts up a new blog post.

    “Decompressing” is managed by better understanding, which pulls us from beneath confusions, wrong items, wrong whys, false data, false information, wrong indications, wrong sources and illusion.

    But to date, all of the advances we make as truth seekers and those who want to know how to know, are with all of us bringing one other or more to a better understanding. And it is a very, very, gentle wind.

  131. Hubbard could not always follow his own advice to others. That is true for all of us. You never saw him out body routing.

    The more he mocked up vias to work “for him” the more vias he created. Finally his entire life was managing the vias he had established.

    As one moves up the bridge, one learns to live life directly with out vias.

    As one moves up in the “ruling class”, the more one has to establish vias and life becomes managing vias.

    I have found people that are obsessed with groups, are people who feel better living as a via, or through vias.

    I body routed for YEARS as a volunteer on my time off between gigs.

    Mostly for the “elite” Scientology groups in my area. Nobody in those places EVER, EVER would have gone out on the street them self and walked up to a “wog”.

    I would talk to someone about Scientology for 20 minutes and have them ready to sign up for a course, right there on the street. I would bring them in, and the first thing they would get hit with was a via, the OCA test. “You have to get through this before you can do something else”. And it would blow them right back out the front door.

    I got hit with a lot of wrong why’s and wrong indications during this time, as you might imagine. Snarky remarks and inval like, “We all don’t look like you” “They are only following you in here because they are interested in something else”..whatever. It was not true at all. Many of those people were people that stopped several time to talk to me over many nights and only decided to come in the more I told them about Scientology.

    The O.C.A. was a via. The div six reg with the patter was via. If Hubbard had spent one week in front of every mission and org body routing he could have boomed Scientology highhandedly as a div 6 staffer.

    I should have walked them straight to the invoice machine. It is right out of the anti Q and A drill.

    I have found what is true for you with the auditing, spread across your other dynamics as a truth also.

    Want to run the planet? Want to rule the world? Oh man are you looking at living through a lot of vias. Go out first and live directly and give it a shot. Bring ONE new person in to Scientology and get them up the bridge, THEN talk to me about “clearing the planet”. Try wadling through your OWN vias, and get up the bridge yourself, THEN talk to me about clearing the planet.

  132. “I should have walked them straight to the invoice machine.” Cancel that, I should have walked them straight to an auditing room. The invoice machine is a via. Most people want help. They are put on the communications course whether they think it is their problem or not. It should be option and elective according to the OTHER person’s want a need.

    Don’t think you NEED anything, ANYTHING, to help someone else, except a good care factor. We could have offered the fist 12 hours of auditing for free. An introductory experience. THAT would have been a REAL Contact, Handle, Salavage and Bring to Understanding.

    Even health spas offer a free one week membership so you can understand what it is you are being sold.

    You just have to SORT OUT YOUR OWN PURPOSES.

    Do you want to “make Scientologists” or do you want to “help your fellow man” no matter what banner he is flyng under?

    If you sincerely want to HELP, just invite your neighbor over and start them up on grade zero. No strings attached.

  133. You don’t need a license or permission from higher authority to help another permission. You don’t have to become a member of any group to help another person. You don’t have to breed to make baby Scientologists. These are ALL vias. If you NOT feel clean about helping the person in front of you on your own, with Scientology, and taking FULL responsibility for that, then sort out your own disagreements with the Scientology. Help in another way. Just listening is a gift.

  134. I have found the fastest way to decompress, is to help someone else.

    Harming attacking suppressing other people, has not helped anyone decompress. In fact they just become more stuck and more solid and more threatening and more violent and abusive.

    Just help someone else a little, and you will key right out of your own charge.

    I think that is why we see the sanest words gifted to us on this blog, are spoken from the auditors, and the people that are really helping others.

  135. one of those who see

    Yes. The Church of Scientology lost it’s heart, it’s center which should be Truth and increasing the freedom of it’s members. It’s emphasis completely shifted to: protect the church and Miscavige at all costs which included – making Money is senior to making Totally Freed Customers. Therefore, the heck with the Truth. And The Group is more important than the individual follows. Thus they blocked the road to freedom.

  136. Here is a little something that I wrote a while back.
    I believe it is appropriate here.


    Wake the mighty God within.
    Rouse the sleeping giant.
    Raze the keep that holds you fast,
    And from its ashes rise!

    Throw off those weighty shackles,
    Walk proudly through the land.
    And always,
    Whatever else,
    Keep the God alive!


  137. Wow Dirk. Thank you for sharing. It’s real good for all us to hear of other’s stories so thank you. Part of a lie may be not knowing the whole truth. Once we begin to question, I don’t think the truth will come all at once but it WILL come.
    If I had never ‘jumped in’ to Scientology when I was 21 it very well could be that I would be very far behind where I am now ~ so it’s a good thing (no matter how much it hurt). I just want the whole truth and this blog & the suggested books has been like college at 60 🙂
    I like the Evangelist spirit. I hope you are able to pass what you learn back to your family and help them somehow.

  138. martyrathbun09

    You noted, ‘And The Group is more important than the individual follows. Thus they blocked the road to freedom.’ Seen this in Scientology outside the church lately?

  139. maxim46zbitnoff

    Nancy, your comments are like fresh air.


    On the other hand, when you realize that you are the one agreeing to it and it is just an idea then have you not made some “serious” spiritual progress. I know everyone’s experience is different even if there are a lot of commonalities of finding your way through the scientology experience. I liken it to a zen koan… scientology being the koan. Once you get it you are free to do with it what you like.

    It took me several years to decompress… not sure when it stops as it feels so good. What I find funny looking back is that for a while…after I had left scientology… I considered my experience (I’d done the wall of fire and the second wall of fire) as superior to others on different paths. Pretty pathetic but true. Scientology enables our need for “specialness”.

    Nancy, I’m convinced that we all have our own evolutionary path that takes us where we need to be and not to worry about finding it because you are it.

    This blog has come a long way, baby. Seems to me to be a good thing that some of the people that used to hang out here have formed their own M2 group. It is where they need to be. There ain’t no one way.

  140. Hehe! Everything but the horns! 😉

  141. Hey Maxim, most definately on the agreement thing. I have made peace with it within myself that I can appreciate my experience

    Let me digress from my usual complaining.

    Why I am grateful to Ron:

    1) He taught me to love and value words
    2) He helped me develop within myself the habit and confidence that I could find the source of a problem by seeing chains of causes and effects, thus neutralizing negative mind and emotional energy.
    3) Surviving for the planet became part of my life strategies.
    4) I learned the magical healing power of listening to others for their own sake. (over coming my need to be right)
    5) He banded together a generation of truth seekers, of which I was blessed to be part of, dreaming dreams of freedom with friends and keeping our focus on the goal of life: Wisdom, knowledge, soul realization, granting beingness etc.

    I will always be grateful for what I learned from Ron. And I am always grateful that I grew enough to disagree with him.

  142. The 27 years in made for a good long laugh.
    Thanks David!

  143. Max, I think you are right on track with each of us having our own track that we inevitably walk. Yes, this blog has changed. Well, not so much Marty, who has been remarkably consistent in his communications, but rather, those of us who gather here.

    Your take on the M2 group needing to gather under their own flag and philosophy makes sense. If all former cult members gather in one place there will either be a great deal of discord or we risk recreating the cult we left. I think there is certainly a place for those indies who apply KSW by fully duplicating and accepting every verbal or written utterance by LRH. That may well be the final phase of their decompression. If so, no wonder they balk at Marty’s willingness to reject some of LRH’s writings.

    One the many things I have enjoyed about getting involved in the many non-Church blogs/groups is the contrasting communities. There are separate circles for anti-, ex-, non-, indie-, (etc) scientologists and some folks roam freely among these circles. I first came upon ESMB when I began searching online for non-sanctioned Scientology information. I love the folks there, but I found there to be a stubborn intolerance for the notion that some folks might find some value in many aspects of Scientology. Same with WWP and Tony Ortega’s blog. Although Tony’s blog community (not so much Tony himself) tends to be hostile even toward ex-Scientologists for ever having been so STUPID to have fallen into the trap.

    Marty’s blog seemed to me the one place where Scientology as a subject has been tolerated and thus welcomed indie-scientologists as well as others. Now, with M2, there is a community for those Scientologists who only reject Miscavige’s regime, but who remain utterly loyal to all aspects of LRH and his writings. I really think it is a good thing to have such diverse Scientology interest groups. Everyone needs a place to communicate with like-minded folks. And yes, we can expect some sniping between those groups, e.g. I said above that the M2 folks value their superiority too much. That was not a fair statement on my part.

    The important difference between the Church community and the non-Church community is that sub-groups are allowed to naturally congregate outside of the Church. Within the Church, all are members of the same community and must conform to the prescribed group-think.

    Now that I have had some time to consider this larger picture, I really feel that the M2 group is vital. There must be a safe home and a support network for those who remain dedicated to LRH and feel that his path is the only path to spiritual freedom. It is simply too much to expect such an individual to rely on the support community among adamant ex-, non- or anti-scientologists.

    I would hope that there would develop a mutual respect among such diverse groups, but I guess that is a bit naïve on my part. My point is, there are many paths, and there SHOULD be many paths, so let us allow, encourage and celebrate many paths.


  144. Second that re truth! 🙂
    Just got another boost for the future….

  145. Brian,

    I think that, to be fair, this is just what LRH had observed as happening (or having happened), at least to a point. And if we believe in infinite possibilities then we’d have to consider both the good and bad things that can occur within infinite space and time, and doing so is a positive activity.

    As an example, if 1%-2% of the general population are considered psychopathic, and being able to manipulate people in the way that they do, just imagine what such people could or would do if and when they become discarnate!

    We can’t assume that so-called higher dimensions are necessarily pure simply because their appearances are more malleable. Of course, this allows for speculation about any number of possible situations. 🙂

    I do appreciate the view that going into the Light is nothing but positive. The question is, how many of us are able to do that completely without being led astray by our own perceptions?

  146. Eric, Such a beautiful poem with a great message! Thank you.

  147. Nice journey Naomi. Well done.

  148. Thanks for the synopsis Marty.

    I convinced someone very recently to get hold of your books and start. This person was not sure where you were headed. He is now starting. Nice.

    Decompressing upwards is different for all of us it seems. Chatted to someone, again recently, who is connected to Ron’s Org, on the budding ideal org OT Committee and doing handlings in the field with both in and out.

    There seems not to only be those in or out or under the radar. There are those all over the place!!


  149. When I was in SCN (that expression sounds kinda lol) we used to dream how cool I’ll be to do the Bridge etc. And we postponed stuff to achieve after we achieve to climb on the Bridge. Then some advanced etc and sometimes I wondered “hey how come you haven’t handled this and that and the other?” The answer was that it cannot get handled because things are so and so….they are really MESTy, you know, get real 😛 I’m on a way of decompressing from reality. My SCN reality is long gone (as I didn’t stay for decades and never in the SO, and I have kept the good stuff that I like, and discarded the others.), but I still need to make money etc because things are like they are etc and get real dude 😛 I wish we’ll be really OUT somewhere someday looking in current society as I perceive it, and laugh at the guys who insist that it is the only way.

  150. “We are the superior species of the earth, effect of thousands of years of evolution, the peak of intelligence, and we are awesome…look at all this technology!” Does it remind you of anything? gh h h h

    No, -like in SCN- I like the technology. I just don’t like it when it’s used for harmful purposes, and I don’t like the harmful purposes themselves.

  151. Thinking you can’t do any better because you are on the peak…the chosen by God or nature race, and thinking that this is all there can be….what a cult!

  152. Fantastic Dan! Brilliant job!

  153. Wow. Haven’t heard Frankl in years. I remember his book very well though.

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