I am introducing my recommended reading list to anyone who has attained the Scientology state of Clear. By doing so, I am not promoting or trying to win over anybody to a particular line of thought. Nor am I attempting to dissuade people from continuing to worship their firmly held religious constructs. I respect their First Amendment rights to continue to do so. Instead, I am responding to the relative few who have expressed genuine curiosity about from whence I have come and to where I am going. Folks can take it or leave it, or pick and choose to satisfy their own curiosities. And, as is their wont, Scientologists can of course nitpick and snipe so as to kill the agent who brings news they will likely find is anathema to their Scientology religious beliefs.
I recommend that these materials, minimally, be studied before embarking on Scientology OT Levels 2 through 8. Actually, I think anyone would gain a tremendous amount of insight by reading these books. But, I believe this (or a comparable) recommended study is essential to understanding from a scientific and spiritual view what it most likely is that makes a meter read on a Clear. It also gives a much deeper understanding of what it is that Ron Hubbard was grappling with on the upper levels. To pursue a subject calling itself a ‘science of the mind’, while subjecting oneself to religious mythological belief constructs (as one inevitably does by running headlong into the OT Levels of Scientology) sets up a vicious form of cognitive dissonance: religious belief masquerading as scientific certainty. The result is the inability to perceive as-is; defeating the entire stated purpose of Scientology. More debilitating, Scientology at the upper levels continues a process of self-affirmation and self-fixation that firmly shackles an individual from rising to greater heights; locked into a solidified ego as he or she becomes. I think this recommended study can alleviate that dissonance, freeing an individual to continue to move on up a little higher.
I am not creating some new study by this recommendation. I am sure there is an infinity of gradients and steps one could, and some certainly have, take to navigate the mire that is implanted at the Scientology upper levels. I did not follow this recommendation. I went through numerous other valleys and peaks along my own way. For example, as part of my own study, I studied and evaluated what Hubbard studied and drew from in developing Scientology; and I haven’t included that byway on this list. I reviewed my path and noted those studies I feel were integral in understanding Scientology in the only way Hubbard himself recommended anything could be fully understood. That is, studied against data of comparable magnitude. When one does, I believe one cannot help but recognize that Ron was definitely onto something in his upper level research, but that developments in science and consciousness far more rationally and accurately revealed what it was. One may or may not also see in the light of this understanding, that continued, blind adherence to mythological constructs supplied in Scientology might be crippling of spiritual evolution.
If sufficient interest is communicated, I may follow up with a series of posts on each of these references, explaining why I consider them important, connecting dots demonstrating relevance to the Scientology experience, and making sense of the sequence, etc. In either event, I hope some people find this of some assistance in their graduation and transcendence process.
1) Tao Te Ching – Stephen Mitchell translation
2) Siddhartha – Herman Hesse
3) The Prophet – Kahlil Gibran
4) The Four Agreements – Don Migel Ruiz
5) The End of Suffering – Russell Targ and J.J. Hurtak
6) Buddha’s Brain – Rick Hanson
7) A Brief History of Everything – Ken Wilber
8) Kosmic Consciousness – ten part interview with Ken Wilber, Sounds True Productions.
9) A Short History of Nearly Everything – Bill Bryson
10) The Biology of Belief – Bruce Lipton
11) The Unobservable Universe – Scott Tyson
12) The Secret – Rhonda Byrne (book and video)
13) The Intention Experiment – Lynne McTaggart
14) The Field – Lynne McTaggart
15) Entangled Minds – Dean Radin
16) The Tao of Physics, Fritjof Capra
17) Quantum Enigma – Bruce Rosenblum and Fred Kuttner
18) Biocentrism – Robert Lanza
19) A Gradual Awakening.- Stephen Levine
Some folks have already expressed dismay at such a recommendation in that it is a hefty amount of reading. One person implied that I am asserting that one must become proficient in Quantum Mechanics in order to achieve enlightenment. I am not suggesting that.
I am suggesting that if one devotes the better part of one’s life to following someone who implants in one’s mind a certainty that what he is following is proven scientifically to be the only road to spiritual freedom, one is demonstrating a large degree of gullibility in accepting and dramatizing that implant with no context explored against which to evaluate the truth of that implant. Understanding is an universal solvent, in my opinion.
Your insightful overview has and is always fabulous. I look forward to your connecting the dots.
Thank You for putting this together, Marty. I am grateful you share your insights and take the time to communicate.
I’ve read 3 of the books thus far and I personally agree with you on opening one’s mind to look, observe and evaluate. It’s actually a freeway of ideas/philosophies that we can learn from and expand our spiritual freedom. That was the whole purpose of the State of Clear–freeing oneself…
Ahhh. . . some wheat amongst the chaff.
I’d like to add my voice to encourage you to express your thoughts on why these books assisted you in sorting out the upper level experiences. This is an area I have been grappling with at various times.
You expressed what had been happening with me for a long time—the cognitive dissonance of not being able to believe the OT 3 background story as factual, versus the very tangible and lasting benefits I experienced from auditing the level. I had just decided I would never know what really occurred on that level and had just shut the door and stopped thinking about it.
Now you’ve reopened that door and I am interested. Is your recommended reading list best done in any particular order, in your opinion?
Marty: “One person implied that I am asserting that one must become proficient in Quantum Mechanics in order to achieve enlightenment. I am not suggesting that.”
Me: I think you should.
I’d like you to add another book to the list: “The Sociopath Next Door” by Martha Stout. You have recommended this before, but not on this list. This book may not talk about theta or OT abilities, but it is like the guerrilla warfare knowledge that is so needed in the trenches of life. If one could only spot the sociopaths and handle to not have any contact with them, or to be able to be at cause over what little contact they had with them, it makes for a much happier, stress-free, unenturbulated and calm life.
Thank you Marty. I’ll take you up on that offer. And thanks for caring enough to share with us. I’m always looking, reading, discovering. This looks like a great list to take up. Best to you and Monique always.
Falling Into Grace by Adyashanti is a good one too 🙂
helps solve the whole riddle of ethics
Some aspects of the sub-atomic world mimic or mirror aspects of Theta but are more ‘interesting’ than important.
This is the cream of the crop in terms of opening posts/articles on this blog. Kudo’s to you Marty.
I’ve often considered and agreed with the adage “the greatest heights of Spiritual Awareness/Understanding are scaled by those whom have experienced the greatest depths of ignorance/error”.
Ok, so my paraphrasing may be lacking, but the point remains the same.
For all the talk (in my head) about Marty’s previous delusions of spiritual grandeur, I now concede such delusions were mere precursors to the Reality of Spiritual Transcendence which Marty is providing freely, in spades (i.e. in abundance).
I imagine ‘Memoirs of a Scientology Warrior’ ought be included on the list. Preferably in the #1 (first) or the #20 (last) position. Or both.
Thanks again for the inspiring opening post.
Just finishing Ken Wilbur. A tour de force. It is an amazing integration.
My wife and I audit weekly. Mostly prepchecks. Unbelievably fantastic results. Yesterday was Kosmic Consciousness day, also known as the Day of The Dance.
So I am very interested in your reviews of these books. We have read a number of them but we’ll be filling in the gaps.
And many thanks to you for opening these doors.
What a great list!
As far as the theme of gullibility, I found the book, ‘The Lucifer Effect: Understanding How Good People Turn Evil’ by Philip Zimbardo very interesting. Here, the author conducted an experiment called the Stanford Prison experiments where volunteers took various roles, prison guards, prisoners, etc, and was fascinating how people react in an authoritarian setting.
Marty I am very keen to follow this line of learning. I hope you continue with it – bearing in mind that it will take some of us (well, me anyway) a bit of time to get to and through these books.
Suggestion: Since you are doing the work of promoting the reading of books of others, have you thought about putting up an “Amazon” or other link on your blog site as Tony Ortega has done? I don’t know what the pros and cons are of doing it, just a thought…
Re: the Quantum Mechanics et al: this was a conference held last week. A series of presentations and Q&A sessions, for the public, amongst leading physicists and cosmologists. The presentation by Fr George Coyne, SJ is a wonderful testament. The last half hour of each session was the Q&A; often the interplay amongst the panelists was the best part!
Very much appreciate that you would share this reading list. I would look forward to your commentary on each book and how you see it relates to our Scn experiences.
I enjoyed ‘The Gods of Eden’ William Bramley and ‘Slave Species of the Gods’ Tellinger, based on Sumerian tablet transcriptions/translations of ancient history of planet earth. This is based on Stichin’s work on the tablet translations. Helped to put things in perspective for me. Suddenly a lot of things made sense to me.
I can honestly say I no longer feel ‘brainwashed’ I just understand how all the programming locks in and why it is so easy to continually create trauma and drama. When bitterness, control, power, revenge, victim, limited creator, etc. is programmed into the human DNA kinda fascinating unlocking it. Understanding it all was the first key to start to as-is it all. So far so good. Of course, you also have getting to the basic of why you mocked it all and desired/agreed to the whole bloomin’ experience in the first place. And yes I feel its like the ‘bloomin’ onion from Outback’.
I should also mention I see LRH’s motives and methods so much clearer now. Lately I have no charge on any of it, nor any eval or inval, just understand it all.
I have read a good number of the above books and thoroughly enjoyed.
Read on and keep exploring ….. Many roads, one mountain.
Definitely interested. Have read a number of these and appreciate the list.
This is very good. And if others have any to add to this list, that would be appreciated too.
“I am suggesting that if one devotes the better part of one’s life to following someone who implants in one’s mind a certainty that what he is following is proven scientifically to be the only road to spiritual freedom, one is demonstrating a large degree of gullibility in accepting and dramatizing that implant with no context explored against which to evaluate the truth of that implant. Understanding is an universal solvent, in my opinion.”
I think this sums it up quite well.
The only down side of Scientology, the subject, is that it has tended to be exclusive, and this is due primarily to the CofS policies. I don’t think the subject itself brought about that condition, at least I can’t think of anything at the moment.
I understand why LRH may have leaned it in that direction, given his environment at the time, and the tech he was developing was incomplete, and no clear idea where it was leading, not exactly. Now that his work is done, at least as far as he was able to do it, it can be more properly evaluated. Doing so doesn’t in any way invalidate what he did and what one can get out of it. In my opinion doing so validates it even more, and integrates it with the evolution of our understanding.
LRH’s greatest accomplishment is that he decided to find a way to actually DO things that result in moving on a little bit higher, on a gradient that most can walk; he wanted to share with others what he was experiencing.
Reading what others have written about out spiritual nature, the development of our consciousness and such, cannot help but be enlightening. But, to be frank about it, when I read some of the works you have mentioned above, many, many years ago in some cases, none of them gave anything I could actually DO to experience those realities. No doubt some that I have not yet read may give a guiding hand of some sort, but if they don’t, then what?
The Greek slave of a Roman family, Epictetus, did give a workable path, a very, very workable path that anyone can follow and bring about a significant improvement of their condition. Others that give data, but no path, are giving sign posts along a rode they cannot map out for the rest of us. There are exceptions, but they are few.
All my opinion, of course.
” Understanding is an universal solvent, in my opinion.”
….and education is the path to it !
Thanks for the list Marty…
#3 The Prophet – Kahlil Gibran I read and then re-read often about 50 years ago, which was before I discovered Scientology in 1970. It has sold 100 million copies since its 1st publication in 1923 and still sells 5,000 copies a week. Excellent recommendation. I read Herman Hesse early on and A Brief History of Everything – Ken Wilber and Biocentrism – Robert Lanza recently at your recommendation.
I think decompression outside the bubble requires some reading…. both internet and books like you have recommended. I am sure your list would be longer, but it had to end somewhere…. anyway, thanks for the list.
As Ben Franklin said:
“We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid” which is what being in a cult does for you in spades.
Pretty interesting, Marty. #2 and 3 I had read prior to my Scientology experience. # 1,4, 7 and 11 I’ve read since departing the “group.”
Since I like the way you are digging into all of these subjects, I’m going to go ahead and line them up.
An interesting exercise also is to google search the shape of the continents over the past millions of years. Where we live now, was once under 1/2 mile of ice. The creation of Hawaii and its movements is also interesting.
One of these days I’ll write you back line to fill you in on some of the games we are setting in motion. I think you’ll be amused. One such is a girl we trained on basic book one auditing has just completed creating a checksheet and is going to be running a course based on The Four Agreements.
Integrate or disintegrate is a reality.
After I read the history of civilization” by Will Durant I decided to leave the RCS and now I’m reading it again (about 30 books) and I’m still winning on it.
But in beetwenn i’ll read some of those books.
I humbly suggest we found a foundation that also studies all those problems and comes with science and applications of it to all of those things we are discussing here. Something like an university.
Well, I’m not clear, but I’ll read those books anyway, and look forward to your proposed series, should there be a sufficient audience.
“Pursuit of Understanding ” was the main reason I got into Scn in the first place. I confess I’ve not read many of these books, but 15 years on virtually all critical and FZ forums have been an education.
Bob, you expressed so well two things:
1. “Now that his [LRH’s] work is done, at least as far as he was able to do it, it can be more properly evaluated. Doing so doesn’t in any way invalidate what he did and what one can get out of it. In my opinion doing so validates it even more, and integrates it with the evolution of our understanding.”
2. “LRH’s greatest accomplishment is that he decided to find a way to actually DO things that result in moving on a little bit higher, on a gradient that most can walk; he wanted to share with others what he was experiencing.”
I’m also very curious about what you said regarding Epictetus – that he found another “very, very workable path that anyone can follow.” Do you say that from personal knowledge or experience (maybe even from a past life)? I’m sincerely interested in how you know about it being as you described it since you seem to have excellent powers of observation!
Marty, based on the few of these that I am already familiar with, it seems that they are pointing at the same thing, just from different angles. Do you see it that way also, and if so does that apply to the whole list? In either case, I would be very interested to hear why you chose to include each of these.
By the way, your observation about self-fixation becoming more solid on the upper Bridge is something I had observed as well, and was my primary indicator that the route had gone off the rails somewhere.
LOVE those! sadly, many used book stores will no longer shelve them; I bought one of the last sets from Powell’s after my family moved me and ‘down-sized’ my personal library without my knowledge. Had to pick and choose which to replace and considered the Durants’ essential.
I love what Marty is creating here; I feels to me like an international, 4-dimensional seminar on the biggest questions humanity has asked. This is where I start my day now; my morning meditations are fed by these posts.
Very grateful and would endorse a book by book discussion…a book group!
ps am not clear, either…a never in with long participation in a Fourth Way group.
This is brilliant. Sheer BRILLIANCE. When I was first recruited into the S.O. my first desire was to explore and discover like Ron Hubbard did. I wanted to sail the world and meet people from all over and study ancient cultures and come to my own epiphanies. And then I was told flatly, “The best part is Ron did all that for you. There is nothing left to discover. He mapped it all out in the only workable path for you to achieve freedom.” This made me incredibly sad. I wanted to live. I wanted to explore and learn the wonders of the universe for myself. But that wasn’t an option. So I went in the path and was never happy after that.
Seeing things, experiencing them first hand is the only way to know for yourself. Take the Sistine Chapel for instance. You can describe it ad infinitum but until you walk in the room and FEEL it you don’t know. Luckily I have seen the Sistine in person. And now I will see many more wonderous things and learn all about the world, he universe and myself in the process.
I think the key is to NEVER stop looking up. Never stop being curious and NEVER stop learning.
Thank you Marty, a lot. If this is going to assist me, and others, in analyzing and concluding other truths or ways, it is valid.
So, lets get going and start reading these referenced books.
I do appreciate your communication of all this.
Looking forward to your input and my own road to discovery.
Fantastic list of ‘recommended reading’!!! I stand in gratitude every day for the auditing you provided and for the person you are! I highly, highly recommend the auditing portion of Scientology, which is an innovation based on maieutics, a Greek Oracle process. However, I have now come to realize the ‘tech’ side of Scientology is just another organized limited belief system. I am in my thirst year of studying to become a ‘Science of Mind’ practitioner. ‘The Law’ simply breaks down how this ‘Cause-and-Effect’ Universe works on a metaphysics and spiritual level. The truth based on Divine Principle… We are all Divine Spiritual Beings, Infinite Innovators and creators. We are God!
Give my love you your family!!!
Love for eternity, e
still in there ?
“I am suggesting that if one devotes the better part of one’s life to following someone who implants in one’s mind a certainty that what he is following is proven scientifically to be the only road to spiritual freedom, one is demonstrating a large degree of gullibility (…)”
THAT is a good quote!
You probably were already, by the time you joined. I don’t quite remember if you mentioned this in your book..?
“I am suggesting that if one devotes the better part of one’s life to following someone who implants in one’s mind a certainty that what he is following is proven scientifically to be the only road to spiritual freedom, one is demonstrating a large degree of gullibility in accepting and dramatizing that implant with no context explored against which to evaluate the truth of that implant. Understanding is an universal solvent, in my opinion.”
It’s true that LRH said Scientology was “the only road to spiritual freedom ” but you have added that he said this was proven scientifically – which I don’t believe is a true statement on your part. He may have said that the tech itself was proven scientifically, but he didn’t make the claim of scientific proof as regards it being the only road to freedom. If I have this wrong, please give the reference.
No…it came time to leave…very hard but we had been told at the beginning we would know when it was time to go back out ‘into life’…though there was no real ‘exit strategy’ in place…a very real missed opportunity on the part of the remaining community leaders, in my opinion.
Aurora: I use wwwDOTabebooksDOTcom for used books and I’ve never been disappointed – the prices vary from 1.00 to signed first editions with no shipping fee or a small shipping fee.
I just checked the site and there are over 1091 books by Will Durant — meaning that there are LOTS of used books sellers who put their books on abebooks and give abebooks a small cut.
Each listing will tell you the quality of the book — fair, good, very good, like new … whether there are markings/underlining inside.
I was in to it. But only in more recent years have I learned to appreciate how key QM is to enlightenment.
Marty, I think all three of your books should be on the Suggested Reading List. Don’t be modest; put them on the list!
I am very interested in your postings and your take on
I am interested in follow-ups on each of your recommended works!
That’s an awesome list. The more the merrier. I’ll need to read these – I have read some.
In addition to nonfiction works, there are a number of enlightening fiction works that can open you up. Reading good fiction in general feeds the soul. I am talking works like:
“Huckleberry Finn” and “Life on the Mississippi” – Twain
“The Old Man and the Sea” and “The Short Happy Life of Francis Macomber” and “The Killers” – Hemingway
“David Copperfield” and “A Christmas Carol” by Dickens
“Typhoon” by Joseph Conrad
“To Build a Fire” by Jack London
“A Doctor of the Old School” by Ian Maclaren
“The Whistlers’ Room” (not the re-write, but the real one by) Paul Alverdes
“Tobermory” by Saki
And some non-fiction like:
“Mary White” by William Allen White – the best obituary ever written.
http://grammar.about.com/od/classicessays/a/Mary-White-By-William-Allen-White.htm (Really, read it now).
Works by Anthony Robbins
The New Testament books written by Paul (my favorite apostle).
Man, I could go on. The point is that life is a learning experience, and if you do it right, you continue to learn and grow until you die. And then, who knows?
Agreed. Awesome book.
I want to resoundingly thank you for your efforts to help others, like me, achieve an understanding of where we came from and where we’re going.
Some time ago, as I recall, you quipped that you may put yourself out of business because of your efforts. I can confirm that you are correct.
Your scholarly research, subsequent insights and shared conclusions have precluded me from having to compulsively sought out those Hubbard-based dichotomies and confusions.
Ron’s stuff is wonderful, only if kept in perspective.
Never-the-less there’s a whole bright world out here.
Onward and upward seems to be a worthwhile battle-cry.
Thank you very much for this list!
Someone complained about it? LOL! Too much data for your evaluation and understanding of LIFE, what a complaint!
“If sufficient interest is communicated, I may follow up with a series of posts on each of these references…”
Please add me to that list, I’m very interested.
Marty, also a question: quite a while ago, you wrote something to the meaning (sorry if I’m misquoting you, I just recall the meaning, not your exact statement) that you considered the Philadelphia Doctorate Course lectures to be the best summation on to how a spiritual being works. Do you still agree with that statement? Since you seem to have changed your opinion about a number of things in Scientology that you now consider artificial constructs, mythology, enforced data, implants, etc. do you maintain your opinion that despite your recent realizations/understandings in this area, i.e. that the PDC is still a pretty good description of the “anatomy of a spiritual being”, still valid on its own merit?
Thanks for sharing your list . Although its very appropriate for that scientology public, its also a great selection for anyone on a spiritual quest .
Your timing couldn’t have been better. Elaborate away. Please. I’m all ears…
Marty, I am curious why you have specified “Clears” and why these materials might be more significant to “clears” than to others.
Yes, I will admit to ‘having a large degree of gullibility’ 🙂
But if I had not and did not realize that well I’d still be there so goes another lesson. Thank you for the list. I see you left ‘The Shack’ off. It was a nice easy gradiant for me when my mind was probably to complicated to comprehend the simplicity of the rest.
Yes, your description would be good to help figure out which to read first.
PS Well done you both on the court wins!
Moneca — that’s great. I’m getting there. It’s taken me over 20 years. But the first 15 I was not engaging that part of my life. Then I realized that to be whole, I had to integrate all parts of my experience. Very little charge on most things at this point.
“I should also mention I see LRH’s motives and methods so much clearer now. Lately I have no charge on any of it, nor any eval or inval, just understand it all.”
Moneca, can you say a bit about what you see at this point? I’m still working on it and it helps to get others’ perspectives.
I definitely support your sharing more about these books, their key points, and relation to Scientology. Please do continue.
I’ve read perhaps five of the books. But they are all now on my reading list.
You must have ESP……as just a few moments ago I was telling Pat Shannon I am perplexed about what I want to do about my Spiritual evolution.
My dilemma is since I received auditing from you I no longer have a “must-have” or attention on doing “the OT levels”. As I feel this is redundant, I’ll been there, done that. Albeit a long, long, long time ago. And, I no longer feel the need to validate or have someone else tell me I’m at a certain level.
On the other hand, that doesn’t mean I want to stagnate where I am.
In looking at your list, prior to Scn. I read #’s 1-3, however not Mitchell’s version of Tao Ching, and use them today as references.
Your post is a very apropos, as a past-life clear-I’ve been on a quest for higher levels of spiritual awareness since the beginning of my eternity.
So, regardless the path, I look forward to my continued journey when I see you in January!!!
I support your endeavor to enlighten us, in this Movement to reach higher plateaus.
I have read a list of books of comparable magnitude ( actually much longer, ..around a few 100) before I got into scn in 97 and some after. It is a sort of “bridge” on it’s own.
I have read a couple of the ones Marty mentioned.
Of the 100s of books I read, I strongly recommend only a handful as worthy of recommending:
1. the first one is the Oahspe bible.
Available online in pdf or ebook.
2. The Urantia book,
also available on line in pdf or ebok.
3. The Anastasia series of books 1 to 9, by Vladimir Megre.
For more info visit: http://www.ringingcedars.com/
4. The bible old and new testament.
Best to read a few different versions.
5, Alien Interview, by Lawrence Spencer
Click to access Roswell.pdf
I qualify my suggestion: There is a lot of criticism that the book “Alien Interview” is a hoax, but I recommend reading it completely, without such irrational judgement and then making your own decisions.
In my opinion I give the author the benefit of any doubt, and give him the liberty to be right, even in the most incredible story. I have listened to his videos and detect no insincerity.
No one has the right to condemn him and call him a hoax, because they were not there with him when he said he received the papers, did the research, etc.
And no can call Matilda a fraud, because they were not there to witness the incident, either. So all have to remain silent, and give them the benefit of any doubt, simply because they were not there to see what happened and witness that what they say, is not true. If a critic was not there at the times to prove that the stories are false, then the critic is not qualified to open his mouth and make such comments or criticisms. To comment on something you are not qualified to comment on, is intellectual dishonesty.
If you think it is a hoax, then do not read it. You can live with your dishonest and narrow and shallow mind, in your own little world.
6. Books by Wayne Dyer, Ester Hicks, and Deepak Chopra are also good.
7. It is a good idea to read the Quran and the Bhagdavita and the book of Mormon and books of other religions as much as possible. The more the better.
Dio, some time ago I was reading that book “Alien Interview” by Lawrence Spencer and I was amazed at how many things sounded like Scientology – even some of the phrases were exactly the same wording as LRH’s. I started to get suspicious so I did some research on the author and found out he had been a Scientologist, and also that the editors of the book basically admitted it was not a true story. Sorry, I don’t have any of the links to provide, but I give this data for anyone who might want to research it for themselves.
Those all sound pretty cool. I may get around to reading them some time.
For now I feel overrun on philosophizing and introverting. I have a good grasp of life and am having fun just enjoying life. When I feel ready I will probably check some of those out. I did try to read the Prophet once and found it very hard to duplicate.
A book I read quite a bit of and was very easy to understand was The story of Philosophy by Will Durant.
I’m not trying to badger you Marty, but I am really curious as to what you are doing now as far as therapy or counseling for others. I have no opposition to what you do, I just don’t understand what it is? You say you’re not a Scientologist. That’s fine. The OT levels are bullshit, ok. Is it that you just use bits and pieces of several peoples works to move people up a little higher? If so, that’s okay with me. I just want to understand your orientation.
If you could put that in a nutshell, that would be appreciated.
Previously you had told me that the older PDC stuff was the direction you were going. Also you have used OT stuff on me when we did auditing. Are you not doing that anymore?
One thing I am encountering is that there is no real way out of this MEST universe. I just confront it and find games that I enjoy playing and make the most of it. It was my goal to find a way out of the trap or the apparent trap of this world we are in. Dying, living amongst greedy criminal politicians, etc. I still believe that I am a spiritual being and that Man is basically good. I believe that I have lived before. So even if the planet gets blown to smithereens, I feel I will continue and will create games with those that I love.
The game of Scientology helped me a lot and I will never say that it didn’t.
I still use many of the things that I learned from that philosophy. One of the biggest things is the topic of making life a game. The group forwarding that philosophy of games became the opponent to me lead by a psychopath. Quite ironic.
Some people lost a great deal of their lives playing that game for all it was worth. I really feel for all who have suffered. Life is a fascinating game.
I feel a kinship with all that went through similar experiences to me.
The Scientology game is over for me.
At least the part of trying to make it to “OT”. Whatever that is.
I think running towards an unachievable goal can be a losing game.
The game of doing your best and enjoying the journey can be much more rewarding.
I wish you and Mosey all the best and I hope you become millionaires in the process of throwing the monkey off your backs.
Thanks for the list, Marty. Always appreciate hearing your viewpoint.
I read a lot of Ouspensky and Gurdjieff as well as some of the other associates, one upon a time. Back in the 1960s and 1970s, I thought of core Scientology as potentially the basis of the most successful 4th Way school to yet come along. I think the jury is still out on that. But there is a heck of a lot of good stuff in Hubbard’s early lectures, like from the mid 1950s.
Good looking list. I’ll try some. Have you read any Douglas Adams? (Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy etc). I think you would enjoy those. My all time fave is Dirk Gently’s Holistic detective Agency. Pure brilliance.
I’m interested in follow up posts Marty, this is where it’s at for me.
In my pursuit of understanding — what became important to me once I left the physical buildings of scientology — but before I actually left scientology mind-set (approximately a 6 years difference in time) was what exactly was I wanting to understand.
My pursuit of understanding has taken many forms through the years and continues to this day.
Perhaps the first thing for me was to recognize that WITHOUT structured scientology I was NOT going to 1) die 2) lose my eternity 3) rot
Whew — that was a relief.
Then it got trickier. I had to start to cleave from my personality a great deal of BS that I bought without examining. Too many to go into here and everyone will have their own “stable datums” — which I’m going to say aren’t the least bit stable and actually can cause a person to go WAY off the track of being an aware and awake person.
The path started to get rather exciting as I discovered philosophies and ways of life that I previously had known nothing about. Buddhism for me was the biggest change. Along with meditation — also quite huge because we were CAUTIONED against it by LRH.
And now — 20 years after walking out the doors (actually in truth being barred from the doors as an OT VIII) … I am learning about Catholicism … not the hard core fundamentalist “we are the best” Catholicism but the newer version that is truly what the word means … universal.
I’m currently reading:
Richard Rohr’s book — Falling Upwards: Spirituality for the Two Halves of Life — and his other books
And anything by Thomas Merton —
“Love all God’s creation, the whole and every grain of sand in it. Love every leaf, every ray of God’s light. Love the animals, love the plants, love everything. If you love everything, you will perceive the divine mystery of all things. Once you perceive it, you will begin to understand it better every day. And you will come at last to love the whole world with an all embracing love … Things flow and are indirectly linked together, and if you push here, something will move at the other end of the world. If you strike here, something somewhere will wince; if you sin here, something somewhere will suffer.” Fyodor Dostoyevsky, “The Brothers Karamazov”
Marty has continued to share with his readers his journey and suggest what has been meaningful to him. Each of us can and should forge our own way —- using what Marty and others have brought that touches them and creates that spark of — riiiight …
“If you think it is a hoax, then do not read it.”
Up until that sentence I was intrigued and was considering reading the book.
The sentence afterwards kinda put me off both the book and anything else you might recommend.
“… You can live with your dishonest and narrow and shallow mind, in your own little world”.
I am fully aware of what you say, including the scientology lingo. I have also commed with Lawrence Spencer and asked him about it. Amongst other things he did say he studied scientology, but he said he is not a scientologist, and gave me the impression that he never was.
(And I think he said (something to the effect of) he was not in the COS or if he was it was not for long. (I don’t recall exactly what he said.) But I do recall he said scientology is only one of many subjects he studies.
And at the same time, a person does not have to call himself a scientologist, even if he is in the COS. (That was my situation.)
Actually, John Mcmaster said that Hubbard told him something to the effect of; that the only reason that people call themselves scientologists, is because they do not know what other kind of “gist” to be.
So, via a leap in judgement, and evaluation you made an assumption, that he had been an scientologist, and that is intellectual dishonesty.
When I take “a bird on the wire” view point of the entire scn story, and as many different viewpoints on scn, as possible or practical, and related matters, and the world picture too, (the 4D and the 7&8Ds), based on 40 yrs of research, I get the idea that the scn story is a much bigger story that the average human mind can wrap it’s mind around. The truth can be stranger than fiction.
What you (and the average person) “think” is going on, on this planet is not what is going on.
I also study scientology, but I would never stoop so low as to call my self a scientologist. I also study the bible and generally follow the teachings of Jesus, and do not like to call my self a Christian.
I am a truth seeker. No one holds a monopoly on truth, so I go where ever I can find it, where ever I am led to, as a result of my prayers to be taught the truth in all things. I apply the data in Hubbard’s article ; “How to study a science” to the highest degree possible.
Sometimes for the sake of necessity, if I get cornered, I will call my self a Christian Scientologist plus.
I prefer to consider myself an intelligent, responsible, loving, unlimited free spirit.
Intelligence is the relative ability to impartially evaluate data, and solve problems towards the highest degree of success possible on all dynamics.
Truly intelligent people feast and thrive on problems and adversity and become healthy, wealthy and wise.
That sounds like an interesting course Les. I too read #2 and 3 prior to Scn.
The clincher for me in getting on board with the Scn group was the viewpoint that what is true for you is yours and you can use it as you see fit. The dissconnect came later when the exceptions came into view!!! (yes it took awhile to break down that self constructed belief system!)
#10, 13 and 14 I have read since ‘coming to my senses’ and I especially like Bruce Liptons work being based on scientific observation and how it aligns with my fundamental views of the way the universe must work.
Keep up the good work of integration!!
A big AMEN to that Ex RPFer!!!!!!!
I highly recommend to you the “The Biology of Belief” by Bruce Lipton. I have an inkling that if you get through that book that many of the points you raise in your statements above could be adressed.
“I believe that I have lived before. So even if the planet gets blown to smithereens, I feel I will continue and will create games with those that I love.”
The point I wish to make here is that as you have stated ….. it is a belief. Examine it …….. you may find that “making it to OT” has many paths. I think Bruce Lipton’s work may help with that.
No problem Chris, make your own path.
That is the best idea.
I often craft my comm to be provoking and feather ruffling, and cage rattling, to put the comm at a place in a person’s universe that has not been looked at and evaluated prior.
This has the effect of waking people up and expanding their universe a little bit more, than it was before, they came within my sphere of influence.
I see that I have been successful with you.
All the best to you,
Glad to see you took up my recommendation:
The End of Suffering: Fearless Living in Troubled Times . . or, How to Get Out of Hell Free
The rest of the list looks good too.
Will we be seeing you at Sangha soon?
I would suggest Autobiography of a Yogi Windhorse. For those who consider God as a reality in their lives. Autobiography is good.
A friend of mine was on a retreat in a Trappist monastery ( Merton’s order) in Italy. He was studying Yogananda but was considering joining the Trappists. My friend was wearing his meditation beads around his neck when he was counseling with a resident monk. He told the monk he wasn’t sure which path to take. The monk left him and then cam back. He should my friend his meditation beads and told him that he practices the technique of Yogananda also and that he is on the right path and stick with it.
My friend was blown away at the universality of the Trappists.
For those interested in God as a reality, liberation as a goal, this book will blow your mind. I have found various writings of Ron’s a copy of some of the knowledge I learned in Yogananda’s home study lessons.
They are about $60.00 a year, two sets of lessons a month. No phone calls, no regimented membership. Just you and a desire for liberation.
I don’t talk about God too much here because the word has baggage in Scientology and society.
Oh God beautiful oh God beautiful
Oh God beautiful oh God beautiful
At Thy feet oh I do bow
At Thy feet oh I do bow!!
Such love and joy to experience!
My words are impotent to convey!
I wish you all great success on your journey.
I wish you all great confidence on the road ahead
In your chosen path.
Yogananda’s book is a portal more than a book.
It will jump start your journey.
Without a doubt
Thank you for your recommendation. How do those come packaged?
Thanks for the suggestion Cooper. 🙂
Great list Marty,
Here is my two cents for looking at the Theta Universe;
Because it is written by a liberated soul.
Yes, I have. Definitely a mind-bender.
Thanks Brian. I’ll re-read it … only read it partially years ago.
This book is one of my candidates for the reading list -THE BOOK. On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are by Alan Watts.
You can read or download it as a PDF at this URL: http://selfdefinition.org/zen/Alan%20Watts%20-%201966%20-%20On%20The%20Taboo%20Against%20Knowing%20Who%20You%20Are.pdf
I try to read Epictetus at least once a week, from the Enchiridion (Greek for “handbook”. A slave only for the first part of his life, he is an important philosopher of the stoic school. Personally I find him inspirational toward toward the creation of a peaceful life that preserves personal integrity while not harming others.
A few favorites:
“Of things, some are in our power, and others are not. In our power are opinion, movement toward a thing, desire, aversion (turning from a thing); and in a word, whatever are our own acts…..”
“Men are disturbed not by the things which happen, but by the opinions about the things……… It is the act of an ill-instructed man to blame others for his own bad condition; it is the act of one who has begun to be instructed, to lay the blame on himself; and of one whose instruction is completed, neither to blame another, or himself”.
“Remember that it is not he who reviles you or strikes you, who insults you, but it is your opinion about these things as being insulting. When, then, a man irritates you, you must know that is is your own opinion which has irritated you. Therefore especially try not to be carried away by the appearance. For if you once gain time and delay, you will more easily master yourself”.
“If it should ever happen to you to be turned to externals in order to please some person, you must know that you have lost your purpose in life”.
In KSW 1965 it makes clear THERE IS TO BE NO QUESTIONING of L. Ron Hubbard, who, according to him, was the “only one to rise above the bank”… and so therefore “we must win or die in the attempt”, and on and on.
In other issues, he alludes to himself as a physicist, and he emphsizes all over the place that Scietology is THE SCIENCE of knowing.
I can’t place any specific quote about scientifically proving all this, but I’ll bet there are good quotes to be found. If he never came right out and said that, I would be shocked.
As an aside, I would sure like to hear the back story of KSW 1965, where “somebody died” because people “had a right to do what they…” (this story implies that somebody died because they dared to do something else instead of what “Ron said”). In my imagination, what happened was that there was various experimentation going on, and that others, not just L. Ron Hubbard, were investigating many lines of reasoning. I imagine that LRH took this as a challenge for leadership, and he clamped it down but good, and made sure he had LOYAL followers of the “if you’re not with us, you’re against us” type, from then on. I know such challenges had occurred before – back in Dianetics Foundation days, Nibs, etc.
Dio, you said: “No one holds a monopoly on truth”.
That’s why I appreciate this current post and comments so much. Exploring and researching, and trying to better oneself – worthwhile. Plenty out there to look at.
Hopefully we won’t “judge” too much what others find useful to them in such a journey. It’s great to be able to share something, without being called an idiot, blasephemer, heretic, defrocked appostate, or fool, which is one of the many things I appreciate about this blog in general.
Dio, perhaps telling others their inferences are “intellectual dishonesty” is perhaps itself moral and ethical dishonesty. Or perhaps it is just antagonistic condescension, which amounts to the same thing. Why do you bother? Did you have a bad childhood? If so, why not see a therapist who specializes in abused children?
Just my take on some of your posts. OK, go ahead, evaluate away.
Oh, you do know what an “inference” is? People make inferences ever day, there is nothing intellectually dishonest about it.
a conclusion reached on the basis of evidence and reasoning.
synonyms: deduction, conclusion, reasoning, conjecture, speculation, guess, presumption, assumption, supposition, reckoning, extrapolation
If you mean the lectures, there are many different packages. L Ron recorded about 3,000 hours of lecture so it’s a bit much to sort out. They are available on CDs as well as cassette tapes, and many can be found for free download from the WWW.
However, what to specifically recommend? I guess if you’re not very familiar with it all, I would recommend this specific set as a starter, in this particular release because I believe it is unedited:
You get 5 CDS and a book, probably the transcripts for as little as $7 plus maybe some shipping.
Beyond that, you can browse Amazon for “L Ron Hubbard CD lectures” or something like that, and maybe you will find something that catches your interest. But there can be a bewildering variety over there. The one I mention above introduces and explains the basic concepts pretty well, as I recall.
Modern Dianetics is much streamlined over those lectures, but later stuff won’t make much sense if you’re not familiar with the basic concepts.
Dianetics is where it all started and might make some sense to you as it explores the “mechanicalness” of human beings. The book Dianetics goes into a lot of detail on that.
Wow, Marty you just put down anyone who has religious beliefs and stated that you didn’t all in one sentence, “Nor am I attempting to dissuade people from continuing to worship their firmly held religious constructs.” Don’t use a sledge hammer when the proper tool, a small pall-peen hammer is required, “Nor am I attempting to dissuade people from continuing to worship their religious beliefs” or better yet, “Nor am I attempting to dissuade people from worshiping”. Unless your true purpose is to attack those who are religious (You really do it so insidiously). Though I think anyone who reads your posts, that is those who can get through your over-use-of-thesaurus posts will see your true purpose.
Here’s a hug Christine 🙂 Just because
Books, books, books. Yammi.
There is one novella I loved when I read long time ago.
It’s not on your list but in case you never read it it’s “Jonathan Livingston Seagull” by Richard Bach. Spiritual. (Maybe even a little bit more spiritual message than Hesse’s “Siddharta”.)
And another one, in perfect tune with your blog, Moving On Up a Little Higher:
I loved your post on Jonathan Livingston Seagull.
It was also what I appropriately and coincidentally needed to send to someone. So I did.
I have the book and have only glanced at the pages, so far.
But it is on my list to read.
Yes, Valkov, inferences can be classified as “intellectual dishonesty”.
Similar to beliefs, opinions, assumptions, and speculations and the like.
Intellectual honesty (integrity) is sticking to what can be proven.
Operating on facts.
Or scientific thinking.
When it is necessary to operate on inferences, opinions, beliefs, assumptions, theories, hypotheses, suppositions, conjecture, presumption and speculations, such should be sufficiently qualified so as not to be construed as facts by the intellectually inept or ignorant. .
This is just plain silly. Science is based on making inferences and then setting out to prove or disprove them.
You have no more proof of your opinion of the book/writer in question, than marildi or anyone else does.
For reasons best known to yourself you infer there is some truth to the book, and state your belief, in the process preemptively attacking anyone who might disagree. Huh. The 2nd Coming of Gurdjieff, you are not.
I see no evidence that you are qualified to comment on anything.
That’s OK Dio, I don’t see any evidence that you are, either. That doesn’t stop either of us from talking all we want, does it? It is a day off for the “Evidence Police” I guess.
“Screw you guys I’m going home.” Cartman
► RELIGION → from Ancient French, from Latin religion = obligation, reverence | from Latin religare, re = back, ligare = to bind, tie, by extension attatch.
Thank you for your inquiries and thorough studies into the comprehensive principles of enlightenment. This is a great recommendation. It makes sense.
Quote for today from the Urantia Foundation:
A Thought to Ponder from The Urantia Book
“Civilization is in danger when youth neglect to interest themselves in ethics, sociology, eugenics, philosophy, the fine arts, religion, and cosmology.”
I am glad that you think we have something in common.
I appreciate an intelligent opponent and comrade.
Now, now, Brian, don’t be petulant.
Interesting convergence Brian. My still-in scientologist OT mother recently recommended Autobiography of a Yogi to me!
Amazon here I come!
I for one like where you have gone and are going.
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My attempt at humor 🙂
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MONSTER HOTEL: KRISHNA CONSCIOUSNESS* *or how I learned to stop worrying and love the new world order
In the 11th skandha of the Bhagavat Purana, Sri Krishna taught his friend Uddhava on the absolute truth of all we experience:
In the universe the Supreme Soul alone is the creator and the created, the protector and protected, the destroyer and destroyed. Therefore no being but the Supreme Soul is observed as established reality. (All is God due to God being the primeval substance and controller of all of reality)
The creation, maintenance and destruction perceived (as absolute reality) within the Supreme Soul is unfounded – know that as a product of maya (illusory appearance) dependent on the gunas. (All reality is simply a manifestation of the supreme all-pervading soul, perception of any other independent agent or substance is based upon an illusory perception of supreme reality dependent on how you are affected by the gunas (modes of influence, e.g. adversely affected by ignorance, or passions, or good intentions)
One who has properly understood the process of becoming firmly fixed in theoretical and realized knowledge, as described herein by Me, does not indulge in material criticism or praise. Like the sun, he wanders freely throughout this world.
By direct perception, logical deduction, scriptural testimony and personal realization, one should know that this world has a beginning and an end and so is not the ultimate reality. Thus one should live in this world without attachment.