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Tony Ortega Unhinged on SPs-R-Us Over Marty Rathbun!
Tony Ortega Posted: Marty Rathbun’s videos trashing Leah Remini are now featured on the Church of Scientology’s official website smearing Leah and her show guests.
Michael Hobson: Well, we all knew that was going to happen, whether he is actually working for Darth Midget or not.
Tony Ortega: Bullshit. They couldn’t use those videos without his approval and you know it. Time for you to acknowledge the obvious.
Michael Hobson: Tony, that’s the difference between you and I. You make assumptions that I do not. You might well be right on this. That is as far as I will go without dox.
Read what I wrote *again*. I allow for the possibility that your interpretation of events is correct. No true fanboy is going to allow that their Hero *might* be wrong or have done wrong, ever.
You may well be right in this, Tony. But you *could* be mistaken, too.
Edit Addendum: what makes you think anybody needs an author’s permission to link videos hosted on YouTube and then say whatever the hell they please ?
Tony Ortega: You don’t make assumptions? OMG. You were still hanging on to the fantasy that Dani Lemberger’s email was hacked from Marty without any evidence whatsoever. Don’t pretend now you haven’t been twisting yourself into a pretzel to see Marty as blameless. Jesus.
Michael Hobson: Tony, you *still* haven’t answered me as to whether you checked with the Israeli courts to see whether or not Mattan Ben-Shaul subpoened Mark Rathbun for whatever data he might have had (including that email) – before you published that article implying that Marty had just given Schaul that email because he was asked.
Once again, I never claimed Rathbun’s computers were hacked – I only pointed out a possibility you should have known had precedent from other OSA ops – that you have reported yourself on your blog.
Tony Ortega: Hobson, you’re so full of shit. I didn’t IMPLY anything in that story. I reported from an official court transcript that an officer of the court, a partner in a prestigious Tel Aviv law firm, said on the record in open court that he had talked to Rathbun, who gave him Dani Lemberger’s email. You can dream up whatever crazy scenario you want to in order to absolve Marty, but the burden of proof is on you, not me. I have the court transcript, Dani authenticated the email, and Marty has refused to answer my question about it. But you just keep spinning and make up shit about subpoenas (which wouldn’t be involved in a civil case like this), and then tell us you aren’t making assumptions.
Michael Hobson: Tony, nope. I take regular dumps to avoid that.
I never called into question the trial transcripts. But transcripts are not document filings. The transcripts only detail what was said in open court.Taking the statements of any Scientology attorney as gospel truth without further investigation of the court records was just plain foolish – as your own blog has demonstrated numerous times.
Bottom line is that you failed to determine exactly how Ben-Shaul obtained that email and simply took his word for it. Mark “Marty” Rathbun not responding to *you* is quite irrelevent. But, if he had responded to you about that email, your only chance to have caught him in an outright lie was having examined the actual court filings for whatever discovery-related court orders might have been aimed him.
As for my use of the word “subpoena”, my bad. I meant an “interrogatory”. Here is an overview of legal proceedings in Israel:
“Typical pre-trial disclosure (discovery) in civil matters comprises of (i) document discovery and production; and (ii) answers to interrogatories. It does not include the taking of witness testimony (such as depositions).
A party to civil litigation in Israel is generally allowed to demand from the other parties discovery of all documents which are in their possession or under their control and which are relevant to the issues in dispute. Relevant documents are both “helpful” documents and “damaging” documents, namely those documents that may help to prove the case of a party as well as those documents that may help to disprove it. “Relevancy” in the context of document discovery in Israel is narrowly construed in comparison to the U.S.practice. Relevant documents are those documents that are directly relevant to the issues in dispute and not those that are only remotely relevant.
Each party is allowed to submit interrogatories to the opposing parties. Answers to interrogatories must be in the form of an affidavit. The Court may exempt a party from answering specific questions contained in the interrogatories if they are not reasonably relevant to the issues in the litigation, are unnecessarily broad, require an unreasonable effort to answer or are unduly long.
The whole procedure is administered by the parties. However, if a party fails to comply with a document request or interrogatories directed to him, the requesting party may file a motion to compel compliance and the Court may issue an order directing the non-complying party to comply with the request. If a party fails to abide by the court order, the Court may strike out his pleadings.”
Michael Hobson: Tony wrote “But you just keep spinning and make up shit about subpoenas (which wouldn’t be involved in a civil case like this), and then tell us you aren’t making assumptions.”
Again, I’m not assuming anything here. I’m simply pointing out that you should have checked discovery-related court documents and not just accepted the statement made in the transcript by a Scientology lawyer.
Hopefully, the quoting of comments from other blogs will eventually cause a breakthough in this whole Scientology/anti-Scientology scene. It lets the blog hosts and commenters know that their statements are likely to be broadcast to a much larger audience, which doesn’t necessarily have the same bias and isn’t as ready to accept anything they say. The facts will gradually be outed and the playing field leveled, and more truth will prevail.
In other words, ethics pressure is hopefully being put on bloggers and posters, who don’t get it from the members of what is essentially their “group.”
Michael Hobson nailed it. And I’m not OSA, a troll, a conspiracy theorist or crazy. I’m an outside party with no vested interest on either side…although I’m certain I will be called all those things simply because I won’t go along with the group pile on. No dox, no thanks.
Bravo Michael Hobson!! It’s quite shocking Ortega doesn’t understand anyone can link to a public youtube video, or to a public website. He seems quite angry and argumentative–and touchy cuz how DARE someone challenge him!! Ortega has been known to get more aggressive on FB, where that group is, than on his blog–where he tries to present himself as a ‘journalist’.
Ortega thinks Marty should answer any question he has?! HAH! Yeah, I basically fair gamed you and your family, let people plot on hiring PIs to follow you in the comments, but can you answer some questions for me? Who in the world does he think he is?! Certainly not a journalist! Nor the proclaimed ‘Scientology expert’ he claims to be with 20+ years of coverage. Not even half that amount of time.
ITA, Michael Hobson nailed it.
Ill willed journalists have been a persistent problem in our country. Due to his conspiracy in using the Village Voice as a front for Backpage online sex trafficking syndicate, American taxpayers are now hit with an annual bill of over 50 million dollars just in damage control, and this does not include the expenses of law enforcement. Which is vastly greater.
I’m not saying that this justifies Karen’s alignment with sleazy Backpage Tony but then again maybe she is unaware of what slime ball the guy really is.
Tony’s on drugs if he thinks the Church has to pay money to post Marty’s vids. Either that or he’s being totally disingenuous. I’ll put my money on the latter.
Backpage makes scientology look like a toy in a Cracker Jacks box. LOL WTF?
I was quote surprised to see that little verbal kendo match reposted here, but I am not displeased.
Miss Tia – Tony O. is used to dealing with his so-called “critic” fanboys uncritical acceptance of everything he says. The utter failure by them to distinguish between mere reasoned speculation and documented true facts is what empowers him, I reckon. He forgot that (per the group description) SP’s ‘r’ US Facebook group if for all factions who are opposed to David “Darth Midget” Miscavige and his regime, not just the ASC.
Michael A. Hobson
Okay; I think you’ve answered it.
I don’t trust Leah Remini’s intentions one bit. I think she only left the “church” because she didn’t get something she wanted and now is going the anti-cult route to get power and money which she obviously is hungry about. I believe you Marty and hope you are Okay. I wish you and your family all the best!