I sometimes get annoyed by the a=a mentality of some attackers out there that attribute behavior to me or friends of mine because “look at what the church of Scientology is doing now.” Hey, we’ve copped to some rather fanatical stuff; but 2011 is not 2001 is not 1991. Some people lose sight of the speed with which Miscavige’s dwindling spiral psychosis has spread throughout his cult. That thought occurred to me while reading the stories of Bert Schippers and Lynne Hoverson and Rocio and Luis Garcia in the St Petersburg Times. Reading the knowledge reports on these four people posted on the St Pete Times website prompted this post.
Knowledge report on Lynne and Bert.
Knowledge report on Rocio and Luis.
While reading those reports, I took the viewpoint I had in the year 1999 while holding the post of Inspector General RTC (before Miscavige’s severe psychotic break described by me in an older St Pete Times interview, segment titled Miscavige’s Spiral of Violence).
The woman writing the report on Lynne and Bert would have been the immediate subject of an ethics investigation on my watch. Bert and Lynne would have been apologized to in writing.
As to Ed Dearborn, he would have been comm ev’d off of post in a heart beat, and it would be years before he’d ever muster the chutzpah to beg to be on staff again.
If anyone believes the cult has not seriously deteriorated in the past ten years, you are either plain misinformed or are severely deluded.
What we are witnessing here is the Titanic redux, plain and simple.
Titanic, exactly. And Ron described exactly how the ship could go down, right in the Keeping Scientology Working policy letter. You know – the policy Iceberg Miscavige has been putting on such a loud and militant show of enforcing. Well, he HAS ended up enforcing it, after all. In reverse.
I appreciate your bravado about how you would’ve handled something in 1999. (I mean you as IG RTC) I recall my sister coming to SMI in 1986 as she was blown from the Salt Lake City Mission and I was on staff at SMI and got her to come out. She told and wrote how she was locked in a closet as the Senior HCO person by the Mission Holder. She wrote and told of many other incidents that I remember as being hideous but I also remember thinking that “my sister blew, so she must have overts, the MH is still there.”
To make a long story short, I PC killed himself not long after this and there was some sort of murder case involving a PC also. Eventually the MH was removed. I remember writing a KR back then as I knew of a friends 2D who was terribly handled and I’d heard of the suicide and thought someone needed to look at this and I felt the trademarks were at stake so I even wrote RTC. Nothing came of it. This was 1984-1987. I know I’m fuzzy on the details but I do know 2 people died and my sister won’t have anything to do with Scientology at all and won’t even talk about it positive or negative. It’s just a terrible memory and she got in from reading Diantics and receiving Book 1 auditing.
You are spot on here, I was assigned by Jesse Prince and Vicki Aznaran to create the post of Reports Officer RTC in 1984, and held it for several years. We would never have acted on reports like this on Luis, Lynn and Bert … the response would have been to send the writers to cramming, and possibly even require a commendation be issued to the people for WHAT THEY DID DO! At that time we were concerned with over reging and use of credit cards, AMEX had shut off numerous orgs (including Flag from memory) for customer complaints of unauthorized charges and too many people defaulting on their repayments of COS billings. This was a matter of concern to RTC … not the supressiveness of AMEX, but the actions of orgs that created this problem.
I recently found a cache of stuff from that time, and while I am embarrassed at how “KSW” and arrogant it is, none of it was as vicious and malicious as I see today.
I have a tendency to beat myself up over my involvement in the whole thing, but you are right, things are much more invasive and aggressive and degrading and belittling now. In hindsight, we were far from perfect then, the whole system was flawed, but it had much more positive intention behind it. As time went on, the positive intention towards all continued to diminish. Now it is “all about me”.
The above perspective was not just my own. As training for a new post for a position being created out of thin air, Jesse and Vicki would come to my office and read through reports, giving their opinion. As I recall, at least half the reports I received required correction of the issuer rather than the subject. Malicious reports were investigated … the issuer was investigated.
We also dead filed a lot of reports such as on Luis, the guy gave $150,000 …. he is an upstat …. why is this piss ant reg/ED so desperate for money, not building a big enough pool of winning public so that he is desperate to pound and destroy and suck the life out of the few he has.
I am remembering now … always a bad thing.
I was specifically trained to look for people using ethics reports as a tool to hurt upstats. I was also trained to be more pan determined, as being at the top … RTC … we had to be strong fair and right … there was no other recourse … also to be subtle enough that if I was wrong I could fix it.
In hindsight, I think we did a fair job on internal matters, perhaps because there was a massive independent type movement running at the time we learned to become more compassionate and understanding. However we did not have or show any compassion towards the people leaving the COS in protest, part of the fatally flawed system.
One of my big problems, something I could never handle, even back then, was the cost of services and the impact that had on working class folk like my family. Marty, you may have even tried to “handle” me on some of that, LOL.
Marty, I can’t help but think about the Penn State child abuse case and how the Grad. Asst. saw Jerry Sandusky in the shower with a youth and he froze instead of going in and taking care of the situation right then and there. I really do believe that you(Marty) are one of a hundred who would actually do something right then and there but most of us would’ve froze or even some of us would’ve hid. I’ve spoken up many times in my life and exposed the “elephant in the room” while the elephant was still there. I’ve taken the shots for doing such. I still hesitate but I’m not wired to “put something off or let someone else handle it”. It’s very difficult to do this and I remember the last time doing something like this and looking around the room and thinking, “is anyone going to say anything?”
After the fact it’s easy for people to say they’d do something but truth is, they’re are very few who will do anything in the heat of the moment. This blog is even more proof of that as there are plenty of us who’ve witnessed glaring outpoints for years and put up with things that shouldn’t be.
I think the integrity and courage shown by you here and encouraged here negates the validity of any criticism in the speed of the release of the truth that will end the misery and enslavement that is guaranteed by involvement with what this organization has become under the control of this evil man.
So many people are missing and nobody asks about them. I despair about that. The contempt that CoS staff show for those they are trying “save” is just so sickening. In all of this the philosophy is almost lost, except on this blog. The idea was good. The organization was flawed somewhere and this resulted. So much pain and so many deaths. I don’t believe in Organized Religion anymore. This one failed. I believe in people and groups and good intention and it’s here in abundance. I am no longer looking for a superman to quote and paraphrase my thoughts and do my thinking for me. From what I know and have heard in lectures that was the inverse of the intended aims of LRH. Somewhere I heard him say something like “Someday you will be free. Free or me and Scientology too” and that stuck with me. The opposite of that is true in the Cult now. You will never be free. When I read u on the “Super Power” building project today I just thought, same old tactic. Create a mystery, hide nothing. A glorified “OT” gym. Gimme a break.
On a much less gloomy note, the good news is that the truth (as Ron laid out so abundantly in Tech and Policy) really IS unsinkable. As Marty pointed out a few days ago (in different words), now it’s time for real KSW, full speed ahead. Pick up all survivors, haul the wreck back to the surface and sail on. This time keeping a wiser and more wary watch.
One more, at least in the mid 80s, it seemed the positive intention towards public doing well, pan determined attitudes, and compassion towards admitting and righting internal COS wrongs had a lot to do with the competition created by David Mayo and others of the time. I was well aware that we had to be right and fair if we wanted to keep public who saw another opportunity and route to their spiritual freedom, even if I “knew” and was consistently told that Mayo was a squirrel (a “fact” I had no way of personally evaluating), he still offered a route to spiritual freedom that the COS was denying people. Including things like the great DM Mission Holder Massacre. At that time the COS had to change, become kinder and gentler to survive and keep its public. At that time, we still had some autonomy to do that. Today with DMs micromanagement style, there seems little to no autonomy for anyone to do what they think is right.
Agreed. These KRs are unbelievable, yet totally demonstrate the mind think of how the Church thinks it has a right to your wallet and anything else they want.
There is a policy, among others, that came into heavy misuse to accomplish those misguided purposes…it is Admin Know-How Series #32, “Product-Org Officer System Want Your Product”.
In that policy LRH states, “One has to actually WANT the product he is asking for or is trying to produce. There may be many reasons he does not, none of which are necessarily connected with being psycho. But if it is a creative and valuable product and assists his and the survival of others and he still does not want it, then one should look for PTSness or maybe even a bit of psychosis. And at the least, some withholds.”
This policy was horribly turned into Reverse Scientology by using it to make prospects wrong for not donating, accusing them of not wanting the expansion of Scientology…therefore they MUST be PTS or have withholds…again, stemming from that think of “the group is all, the individual is nothing.” The Church would refuse to give creedence to the personal, financial survival points of the individual.
You can see that in the KRs above which are totally insane.
DM knows that he cannot destroy Scientology fully so he needs to enlist the support of the Feds, specifically the IRS to REALLY shred the organization. He must know that sooner or later the government will have to do SOMETHING. And, if what is happening with many aspects of the way Washington handles things these days is any indication, it won’t be pretty. There will always be the subject, but any organization might not be recognizable. Sheesh.
That’s what I’m talking about.
Thank you for the justice in this post, Marty!
You know, back in 2004 I knew the admin was out when I was escorted off post and out of ASI, then put on IAS reg lines. I had a feeling tech was out because I’d just been through Dr. Denk’s medical cycle, a key producer (150 patients a week) and SOLO NOTS auditor. I had a clue ethics was out when I learned of the false exchange reported for Dr. Denk after his time with LRH.
I recall I could actually predict a period of “heavy ethics” from that time forward based on my personal experience. I see that period of “heavy ethics” did, indeed, come to pass and will be the downfall of corporate scn. Rachel
The SP Times is opening the door and letting the light into a very dark and messy room. The citizens of Clearwater, and all who read the paper, must be aghast at the plain evilness of what the cult is doing. This leads me to wonder, given that the paper has brought up the point of the CofS tax exemption, I wonder if the paper would be willing to promote another White House Petition requesting that the ‘White House’ investigates the tax exampt status and how it was obtained.. If the paper did push for it, I bet they could easily get the signatures required just from the Clearwater residents alone.
Interesting times …
What a lot of people may not realize is that there was no Int management at the helm. I don’t know for how long.
I had been writing various petitions to Mike Rinder for years. No response.
Turns out that he was in the Hole and explains why he hadn’t responded, but one would have thought that someone would have been holding the WDC OSA post or at least responding to comm? Obviously not.
One thing the SP Times articles haven’t addressed is the common injustice of selling a person service and then refusing to deliver it because he/she isn’t “eligible” (often they refuse to say why) and of course they don’t want to refund the money either.
Happy Thanksgiving ,,,, Marty ,, your on a role of giving. Plenty of sharing, lots of good dish(s) so we all have better fed understanding. Thanks for all the giving!
It was clear to me that there was “no one there” at the top of Scientology when I wrote a letter to the Inspector General asking for him to intervene in the abuse of staff at the mission where I was on staff – no days off, withholding of pay, starvation amongst the staff, lack of sleep to the point of torture, embezzlement and financial crimes, violations of LRH policy and incidents of high crimes and included a statement that I found conditions so bad that I wanted to leave staff. I received a letter saying only that he did not support my leaving staff and did nothing to address the rest. It was clear to me then that the Church of Scientology did not believe in basic human rights, employee protections, and viewed staff as slaves. I completed my contract and left (in good standing), vowing never to be pressured to do anything that would put my personal and family life in jeopardy again.
Each person has a responsibility to do what is right. I’m sure that there are moments in life where true emergencies occur and drastic measures need to be taken. The CofS has made just existing an emergency, a day to day occurrence, without hope for reprieve. David Miscavige’s church views its staff as slaves, but also its parishoners. If you aren’t working as a staff member, then you are working to financially support it. Everyone is a slave to the Church. This is why I will never again be part of an organized religion or allow another to dictate what form my contributions will be.
I am pleased that the truth is coming out and am grateful for your efforts to accomplish this, Marty.
Nice comment. 🙂
Kelly Brown (who wrote the K/R on Bert and Lynne), is a sad case.
This is the same young woman who sent out a mass email to the entire Seattle field around the same time, scolding us all by saying basically that if more of us hadn’t gotten up and left during the fundraising portion of the latest “event”, we’d be much closer to our goal of having an Idle Org by now.
Can you imagine worse PR?
Using the Titanic analogy, you really are the lifeboat. So many of us who thought that the only choice for doing Scientology or having any kind of Scientology 3D, was under the current regime, now have hope and a means to get back afloat.
You, Mike, Steve Hall and others have provided a lifeline whereby people can get the facts, communicate with others, and move on up as they choose.
As can be seen by the robotic responses by OSA, the “Church” will continue to deny the ship is sinking right up until their cabins flood with sea water.
Maybe those who get a chance to see you and your work on this site will be able to jump ship before it goes down. Even then, we will be here to pull them out of the water.
You are Keeping Scientology Working and alive. LRH would be proud of the work you are doing.
I really like this expose on the financial insanity of the “church”.
This attacking of the upstat is rampant within the “church”.
You are not judged as an upstat merely if you do very helpful things.
You are only judged as an upstat if you are willing to continually deliver what is needed and wanted to dm through all of his vias.
I recall the startegy thrown about by IAS terminals and Org staff. Push, debug, drive. Push production for all it’s worth and handle any stops or slows with ethics. They did that too. As I have said before on this blog, it is ethics gone insane.
In their minds (bots minds and dm’s mind) it is the greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics for a paritioner to go bankrupt if it helps “Clear the Planet”, it is the greatest good to use sleep deprivation to get any of dm’s “projects” done. It is the greatest good to RPF Sea Org members for not following “command intention”.
For the cult, ethics is not a personal thing used by the individual to determine his own survival. It is a club to beat anyone into submission who does not follow the party line. Those who live by the sword will die by the sword.
Well said. It’s worth remembering too that the vast majority, if not all, of public on lines now know that things have gone seriously off the rails. The conditioning and the mind control, now matter how powerful, never succeeds in crushing the spirit completely. Public hate the IAS Gestapo tactics, the spiritual blackmail, the endless crush-regging for money, and many smell a rat. They just can’t bring themselves to take the logical next step to “Look Don’t Listen” as they still clutch to the superficial straw of “not losing their eternity”. Even before I publically left in 2009 I spoke with a fair few public who were openly defying the IAS Gestapo (Ginger Smith and Nicole in the UK have been every bit as devious and culpable as the likes of Dearborn and his ilk). I would be very curious to know what the IAS is actually bringing in in the UK. A car count at the IAS event entrance this year showed attendance WELL down on previous years. It’s only a matter of time now…
Oh my god, I must share this video. This is what we are all working toward IMHO. 😀
The two KR’s are truly disgusting.
I am familiar with the KR on Bert and Lynne as they are close friends of mine.
I had never seen the one on Luis and his wife. Boy, that one really stank.
First off you have this ED acting all smug and criticizing Luis for not wearing his “hat”, that was probably forced onto him at the Freewinds convention. How about the ED wearing his own MFing hat.
I was on Solo Nots and I know how they try to get you to be the perfect little bot in order to stay on the Level or acually feel that you might finish it someday. KR’s written on you while on Solo Nots get taken up on your six month check with the MAA teenagers and sometimes are included on your security checks. I want to validate Roccio for holding her position as long as she did against this insanity. And to all four of the people that were subjects of this insane propaganda, I would like to thank you all for what you did to help the group. I know all four of you now and I think you are stellar beings and I appreciate you stepping up in this new challenge.
The ramifications of the suppressions emanating from DM are wide spread throughout thousands and thousands of people’s lives. It just reminds me of “unusual solutions to unusual problems” ad infinitum… to a point where finding simplicity in life becomes nearly impossible within this “church engram.” I like this blog as it is helping me to run this engram out, filling in the data of incidents that surrepticiously affected my life but were never fully evident as long as I drank the Koolaid. We were never encouraged to look at SCN outpoints when it came to the “church” despite KSW #1 being drilled verbatim.
I remember hearing from a friend who witnessed what DM said at Maiden Voyage in about 1993 or 94 where he told those on board that (paraphrased) …we can handle the external enemies of the church like interpol, the psyches or the IRS, but if we don’t handle the enemies within we will not make it. Funny how it turns out he was talking about himself.
The greed and criminality within radical Scientology has been a growing disease for decades. It is now so extreme, out of control and encouraged and protected from the top down, that the host is sure to die. Its just a matter of time.
For us that gave our time and/or money in good faith, it is especially painful to watch. We helped give birth to a brutally criminal, greedy, psychotic monster. Its a responsibility that is hard to swallow. It’s not surprising that there is an ever growing number of people who feel obligated to “blow the whistle” on the situation.
John Woodruff ran an incredibly upstat Orange County org in the 80s up to 94 when he left to become ED LA Day. Ed Dearborn was the PES and would come into the courseroom after hours almost every night to promote something – except it felt more like he desperately needed to hear himself speak. He was an arrogant punk. Once I FSMed a friend into the org and asked a public reg to talk to her. Everything went well until Ed Dearborn got himself involved. Then my friend did not ever want to go there again. Why on earth he was picked as ED beats me, when there were many other staff in the org that to any sane person obviously would be a better choice. Now, of course I understand that competency has nothing to do with being promoted in the COS. Blind loyalty and willingness to follow the party line is the only criterion.
In the mid-nineties my husband was doing the KTL/LOC. He loved it, was and absolute FNing student, but kept getting kicked off for not being there 5 periods a week in spite of the fact he had a D of T approved CSW to be there 3 periods a week (whatever happened to 1st polcy, we always deliver what we promise). At that time we had 4 young children and were struggling financially. There was a lot of back and forth with the staff. At some point Ed Dearborn (then the ED) seemingly wanted to help out and asked my husband to write him a letter where he would give his side of the story. My husband sat down and wrote a long letter. Ed’s response was out-of-touch, arrogant and know-best. It was very clear he had hardly bothered to read my husband’s letter – he had created a chance to lecture and belittle my husband. I think we kept the letter because we knew that one day he would get busted and we would have a good laugh about it. We did not expect him to still be on post 15 years later for a second.
You are absolutely right, Marty, COS 1991 is not the same as COS 2011.
I can tell many stories to make that point.
Very good on you Marty. I like your post.
The only time where something occurred on a Report I wrote uplines was in 1986 when the Remote Registrar system was in place.
In those times the newest Flag Nots completions went from Org to Org, did events and were regging anybody they could get hold of and were getting 5% on any deals they made and sometimes they were also claiming Fsm commissions for it or sharing it with the Org. They made tons of money, were stealing the publics from the orgs and the orgs didn’t get any commissions of their public that went into higher Orgs.
Alan Juvonnen was one of these guys. This way he paid off all his debts in very short time and then joined the SO.
I wrote a 6 pages report to Ed Int (Guillaume at those times) about it that it can’t be that FSM’s fsm in the Org and steal all the commissions.
Guillaume wrote back that it looks like that we 2 are the only one on this planet that understands what Fsming really is (no joke). With this letter in hands we threw those Nots completions out of our org and didn’t let them touch anymore our public and some months later the remote reg system was canceled !!! That was a big win for me !
But it was the only time something happened about a major sit I reported. I’ve written several reports to RTC about criminal sits, to no avail.
Looks like that Ed Int was wearing his hat in 1986.
And you’re getting yours back marty ! 🙂 🙂 🙂
“if we don’t handle the enemy within we won’t make it”
How to dismantle a group – turn the members against each other.
It would be interesting to trace back exactly where this guy has been on church lines during his career.
The “tech of fundraising?”
The “Int landlord?”
GIVE ME A BREAK! What sort of suppressive dribble is that?
This Ed Dearborn character and the rest of ’em, geeze… what a bunch of dorks. What’s their next tech – armed robbery?
The Cof$ needs an urgent enema.
Mike, you and Marty may have contributed to some of the weirdness in the earlier days, but the INTENTION was different. As soon as both of you saw where the Titanic was heading, you got off. What a person does in present time is what he is measured by and that is what LRH said somewhere. You’all are trying to make it right and that is admirable – admirable because of the sacrifices you guys make. I know I appreciate it.
Ed Dearborn the carnival huckster shill-man “Step right up folks and see the amazing, colossal, Ideal Org. Yes, that’s right folks, we figured out how to have an org without delivering Scientology or Dianetics. Truley amazing. Be part of this now with your generous donation and tell your grandchildren one day you were part of this amazing, chilling,. death-defying feat!” Step right up, don’t be shy.”
Marty, it is not the same place we knew. Not even the same people or the same activity. Those K.R.’s, such K.R.’s. never would have been written in my time. And that radio interview with Scott Campbell? I would not have imagined anything like what he went through, even possible in a Church of Scientology. Or anywhere else in America! I can barely understand the ideas and words used in those K.R.’s. I don’t even bother to respond to the A=A ser facers who lump us all together in their mind because they lack the ability to notice differences and similarities. There are unsuccessful people in every group and culture. Scientology is a very simple game to win at with tons of helping clues and methods along the way. You get up the bridge and help others do the same. Everything else is a barrier, via, or distraction. Some people choose to busy themselves with the barriers, vias, and distractions and remain in the dark forces. ( It would have been a help for the anti QandA drills to be included in the H.Q.S. course pack.) They are inside of the Church and outside of the Church. It is annoying on the third flow when I hear someone protesting about something you did 20 or thirty years ago or someone protesting about Hubbard as he might have been 50 years ago. But those people were never part of this game with any understanding about Scientology to begin with. Or they would know full well of transformation, evolution, and change, that comes about from playing this game. They not only invalidate the game, the people, the pleasure, the magic, the endless possiblities, they invalidate themselves and any of the above that was possible for them for even a second. That’s on them, not us.
The fact of the matter is that Miscavige Inc. is a bucket shop.
The Titanic sank because it’s weight became greater than its buoyancy. A certain amount of weight is needed in a ship to contain its buoyancy, but if the weight increases or the buoyancy decreases, the ship sinks.
In Scientology the buoyancy is provided by the theta released through the proper application of Standard Tech. The weight is admin and the mest controlled by admin. Too little Standard Tech and/or too much admin and mest sinks an org, and eventually the entire Church, as is happening now.
The PL “City Offices” states that the person running the show should be the person most able to deliver technically. That means admin assists tech, but does not control it. What happened to the Church is that admin staff, who had next to no understanding of tech, could not deliver it, and had not received much of it, were elevated to positions of control over tech staff. These admin-trackers were incapable of evaluating relative importances in the tech area, or concerning the proper balance of tech and admin. They ended up just dramatizing low-toned winning valences from their cases, and found common agreement in the ancient implant that is the basis for all cults, whether religious, political, or commercial.
Standard tech provides buoyancy through the release of theta from cases. Admin provides structure to contain that buoyancy, but must remain light so as to not out-weigh the lifting power of the theta.
This is the SITUATION. DM/s destruction is the consequence. Our task is, of course to remove him (“handle the situation and the danger in it”). But then we must “reorganize so the situation is not continually happening to us.” That reorganization must permanently establish tech as senior to admin, and actual auditing wins as senior to any other product of any Scientology organization. Then Scientology can “get off the ground” again, and “take off.”
Accomplishing this reorganization will require finding the WHY for admin taking over control of tech. I believe that a 3rd dynamic engram occured in the mid-60’s, having to do with government attacks and LRH’s decision to start the Guardian’s Office and the Sea Org. Both were admin-oriented organizations senior to actual tech delivery. The exact details of what happened to get this 3rd dynamic engram underway are not fully known to me. Perhaps others who were around at that time can contribute their observations.
Meanwhile, what I’ve labeled here as the Situation can also be taken, in a shallower data eval, as the Why. The Handling is to expand tech delivery in the Independent field. Huge validation should be given to those auditors who are already delivering. But, let’s face it. There are hundreds of trained auditors now out of the Church, who are not auditing. That includes dozens and dozens of Class 8’s, 9’s, and 12’s. Please, if you’re one of them, find a way, as best as you can given your current circumstances, to get back in the chair auditing.
Who should you audit? Anyone and everyone, of course, but first and foremost would be other Independent Scientologists who still harbor any charge whatsoever on their Scientology experience. I think that’s almost every one of us who hasn’t already had a thorough clean-up auditing program. And, even some who have.
I’m not saying any of this to divert attention from the current, absolutely necessary actions underway to get rid of DM. I’m just saying that more of us need to follow Marty’s COMPLETE example. He’s working his ass off to bring DM down. But he’s also auditing to lift up anyone who comes to him. So, he’s creating greater buoyancy, while also working to reduce the weight holding us down. That’s what we all need to do, in my humble opinion.
A very accomplished auditor, audits in life. A Scientologist who knows the technology and lives it very easily helps a person put things into perspective and free attention toward the future. I have witnessed gigantic gains in case state, awareness and rehabilitation of abilities through free, thruthfull communication between real Scientologists. I am afraid that this recurring pitch for a formal “thorough clean up auditing program” may begin to border on evaluation for some. Realize, I deliver more “correction and rehab” that I bet anyone in the past two years. But, I never refer to it as “thorough clean up”; I find, per the C/S Series and Data Series, the bigger the situation the lighter the touch required in handling.
When John Woodruff was there, Ed Dearborn was considered not eligible for anything in HCO because his dad had been in the CIA. Funny how quickly that was overlooked when a new toady was needed for the ED post.
Yes, Bryan, I had forgotten about that ugly one. It just added to my assessment that she had to be really, truly stupid to insult the people she was trying to get money from.
Tony, any sane person can see the dwindling spiral of production in people who are sleep-deprived, or weighted down by debt, or hounded by false ethics evaluations. That can only mean that the people carrying out DMs orders/intentions along these lines were either insane, unobservant, or so weighted down themselves that they couldn’t see. I prefer to believe it was the last thing.
Keep the light by the front door on for me, Marty.
Addendum to the comments I just posted:
Perhaps part of DM’s purpose for Ideal Orgs is to put so much mest there that the theta of individual Scientologists is invalidated. Working in small, downstat quarters actually validates theta.
Heavy admin also invalidates theta. Light admin validates it.
And, speaking of buoyancy, try this concept on for size: The universe contains 300 billion galaxies per the scientists’ latest estimate. What’s really interesting is that they aren’t spread around evenly, or even grouped together in simple clusters as was once believed. They are arranged on what seem to be some sort of membranes, which are separated by vast empty spaces. These spaces are shaped exactly like soap bubbles that completely fill up the inside of a jar. All galaxies sit on the soap films between the bubbles. The bubbles are expanding, which is why galaxies further away are receding from us faster than galaxies closer in.
Meanwhile, at the center of every galaxy is a tremendous black hole, and the structure of galaxies looks exactly like dirty water spiraling down a drain.
The expanding bubble space between galaxies is buoyancy. The black holes at the center of galaxies are the ultimate in mest havingness. In between are stars, planets, and life. The game is to somehow balance expanding space with increasing havingness — not sit out in the void with nothing to do, but also not fall into one of the black holes.
DM is well on his way to a black hole. It’s important that in cutting him loose we don’t get so attached to him that we follow him to his final destination. Marty’s production as an auditor creates buoyancy that allows him to fight DM vigorously. The more buoyancy we all create by getting busy delivering and receiving Standard Tech, the more we will be able to safely fight DM, too. We need to do both, but the balance needs to be in favor of buoyancy through the production of wins in auditing.
Demand your money back. In the demand made there is a firm tone 40.
Tony, and of course such thinking (clear the planet by going bankrupt) is precisely 180 degrees opposite of what LRH clearly states as the optimum solution to a problem. It is not a good solution to succumb on the first dynamic because of the hope that the third dynamic will succeed. And really dumb to do so based on fear mongering (“society is going down. sacrifice yourself so it can be saved.”) It might be good for the IAS Reg’s weekly bonus but not good for you personally, your family or your other third dynamics like your job or your company. Such short sighted insanity. It is dramatized like mad in the corporate world with CEOs racing to the bottom line at the expense of the long term health of the company, the environment, the employees, etc. These fundraisers/extortionists think that by dramatizing society’s dramatizations they are saving the world. Meanwhile, DM pulls the strings of his own agenda.
Kassapa and Marty !
What an exchange of Ideas !
What powerful ideas !
I would like to comment on this if I may.
The Bridge is walked from where you have a reality of it. The lightness of organisation and beingness along with the spirit of play path the way. The seriousness generated by Miscavige and his followers invites retaliation which is acceptable as a survival mode, but it is not an end goal nor should it be assocaited with the actual technology of going free.
We are all on the Know to Mystery Scale somewhere.
Putting a solution out there formally that this or that must be done can easily be counter productive, it aligns with bank goals so very easily. One’s position on the gradinet scale can and is easily advanced with standard tech, why modify it because some maniac is on the lines.
Study what tech you can help with, put a smile on your friends faces with whatever tech you know. In other words put your own house in order (self determinism) and just watch the Dynamics start aligning.
On the grand scale of things, responsibilty begins with making the tech your own, the best defence ever is flourishing and prospering.
It may be tough on the rebound, but hell, what else you going to do?
John Woodruff was sent to LA Day and he was then killed off. That’s how it goes in the church of POB.
Mat, this very feeling of giving his time in good faith is what makes it impossible for my son to recognize the truth. He feels invalidated at any suggestion that something is amiss, as though he is being told he was wrong for the fifteen years he spent in the Sea Org. He was not wrong. Like the rest of us, he did a lot of good. I hope someday he can see the truth without the blinders.
It’s a good analogy Mark. Check out this clip and see how the passengers of the Titanic were still partying while the lifeboats were being readied. The “passangers” now are the bots still within, doing a real good Not-is of the situation. I recall that there is a reference for the Sea Org which talks about those that can see the bad seas coming and had to yell to get the others to confront it. We here are the ones who can “see” the true situation and have the ability to do something about it.
theoracle, ditto. well said.
Tech should be above Admin but you can’t do that if you don’t handle legal. The shadow government couldn’t buy nor destroy Scientology, so they send in legal to take over. Extremely experienced and successful mission holders couldn’t fight back because they couldn’t throw Davey out as his handlers had manipulated legal. This is your admin why.
Best reform is by independent ownership of new groups so that the owner can kick out any interference in his group; no more parasitic regging, stealing of staff, dismissals, nazi youth, etc. Davey is not important; the trained Scientologists that are PTS to him are and they should be dePTSed, most potently done by blogs and media exposure of crimes, indicating the correct item and differentiating between the Church and Scientology.
Scientology can’t grow without auditors and thus auditors made would be the most important stat, preferably auditors made with number of pc’s that stick to them and refuse other auditors (yet we have only one Marty). It’s much easier to rehab auditors once made than training them from scratch but both should be done.
You make a good point about gradients. I really don’t see how the term “clean-up” is an inval or eval, but if you have a better term, I’d be please to use it. Just let me know how you talk about the issue. I like duplicating successful actions.
Meanwhile, I’ve been assuming that Independent Scientologists sitting in by-passed charge (ARC breaks of any kind) regarding their experience with the Church are aware of that fact, and would like to get some relief from it. My intention has been to encourage them to go ahead and get that relief. I think charge off individual cases will also be charge off our 3rd dynamic.
Certainly the good communication about our experiences in the Church provided by this and a few other “good” blogs provides relief, too, as it has for me over the last 2-3 years. But nearly all of us have also received out-tech auditing and other handlings at the hands of the Church, that will eventually have to be cleaned up by repair auditing if we wish to continue up the real, Standard Tech bridge. Even if we don’t wish to continue up the bridge such a clean-up could help us to feel better.
I have a friend who blew from Solo NOTS 10 years ago, after his sec checks had introverted him so much that he couldn’t fully EP what Solo NOTS restimulated. His bypassed charge grew and grew, to the point where he felt like killing himself just to get it over with. Thankfully he blew instead. Then he read the worst of the anti-LRH books and they became his new stable data. He became totally anti-Scientology, got involved in actual attacks, and got declared. Every time we see each other he wants to talk about how bad Scientology is. His reality level has been so reduced by bypassed charge that he not only thinks the upper levels are bullshit, but he thinks even his lower-level whole track recalls were probably delusion, and he says he doesn’t know anymore whether or not he’s a thetan.
But when I explained the reverse Introspection Rundown nature of 6 month checks, and suggested that he might feel better if he got the out-tech from his sec checks cleaned up with the help of a good auditor in the Independent field, he said that he might seriously consider that. Even at his current low reality level he knows that at least that kind of clean-up auditing would help him. Even so, I know he’ll never actually go get that auditing unless I set it up for him and gently 8-c him to do it.
I have another friend who is anti-DM but still pro-Scientology, who almost went crazy due to out-tech audited NOTS that he could never get the Church to repair. He knows he needs a proper clean-up, but is terrified of getting any auditing to address the area. So, he studies LRH a couple of hours every day instead, and has found that to be very stabilizing. He knows he’ll get clean-up auditing eventually, but he’s still not ready.
I certainly never intended any of my comments as eval or inval. So, here’s a restatement. If anyone reading this considers, from his own self-determined viewpoint, that he or she has bypassed charge still remaining from any experiences involving the Church of Scientology, know that standard tech auditors are available in the Independent field who can give you some relief. If you want that relief, please go get it. If you’re getting good TA just from reading or participating in this blog, and feel that’s all you need or want at this time, that’s great. If you feel that you don’t need any clean-up, but just want to continue up the bridge, go do that. The point is, keep making personal progress in some way.
I do believe that the more we just go ahead and re-establish traditional, standard tech Scientology delivery operations, both training and processing, the faster DM will fall. If anyone knows of any reason why we should wait, please let me know.
Yep. Freeing beings from whatever they have chosen to blind themselves is the game. And what an invigorating game it is. The physical universe is a great game. It provides havingness and an excellent adventure. The only thing that makes it unsavory is crafty traps of those who would BE mest; and who would sell others on being slaves in their self-created trap.
Funny how simple and easy it is to see, as soon as one decides to LOOK.
Funny that LRH says, “All I’m asking you to do is LOOK.”
Thanks to all the lookers and talkers here.
I agree that independent ownership of delivery centers is vital. At the same time, there needs to be some kind of certification regarding who is delivering Standard Tech and who is squirreling. This certification entity would have no control over the delivery centers, but would issue its opinion. Probably there should be multiple certification entities, too. Anyone could start either a delivery center or a certification entity. Then let the free market take over from there.
Marty, I believe every word you say. And I don’t say that just to “keep face” with you and others that I may communicate with somehow. I say it because I mean it. I realized a long time ago, much to my astonishment, that if my experiences with the Church of Scientology are what they really, really are, and they are, then how can I be just an “isolated case” and this or not anything like it never happened to anybody else but me? It is illogical thinking. The only people I have ever know that actually “talk about you” in accordance with a policy L. Ron Hubbard wrote called “Jokers and Degraders” is the Church of Scientology. I have never witnessed anyone else do this, but them. And to answer people’s questions, in case they have one, I would not give ONE DIME to ANY CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY ANYWHERE for any reason, whether I have it to give or not, I can’t be bothered. Knowing the tech is one thing. Pretending to offer that tech to others less knowledgeable than one’s self is dispicable. And not even one bit of gratitiude to Bert and Lynn at all. The church’s response “Thanks, but we want more money”. Well Church of Scientology why don’t you go scratch for it like everybody else? 🙂
‘as they still clutch to the superficial straw of “not losing their eternity”.’
And yet each day they do so, they are helping to destroy the very foundation of the technology they so desperately want to keep – risking not only their own eternity, but placing the eternity of their own friends and family members at risk.
You can’t help but pity them at this point. If only they could rise above the avid and selfish cravings of their own cases and realize how truly great they could be.
What value is eternity if you have to sell your soul to get it?
“if we don’t handle the enemies within we will not make it”
He was right about this one at least. We’re not ‘handleable’ and he won’t make it.
The attackers – cur dogs yapping at the heels of those who have proven they can and will do something about RCS.
I have no respect for anyone wishing to attack any members of this group. They are part of the problem, not part of the solution.
For any still inclined to do so: Come up to present time!!!
Luis Garcia is an upstat. Look at how much money he alone has given to the Church of Scientology for new buildings, that becuase of WHO will be occupying them in the future, will most likely remain empty pieces of real estate, not flourishing and propering orgs. And then someone from the church has the gall to say that Luis is “PTS to the middle class” because he and Rocio do not wish to donate any more. Really? Hey Church of Scientology! If you are so damn high class then why don’t you just pay for the new buildings yourself? 🙂
Well there’s an inversion on a policy I never woulda figured. That’s amazing.
The drubbing that things, data, policy receives when it goes below 2.0 is just stunning.
Holy shit, THAT really is twisted pretzel logic that wraps one up on knots.
Reading the material presented in the recent Times articles, it seems that 501 (c) 3 for the overall organization isn’t going to be a “hot item” on any IRS agenda.
BUT, “interim” sanctions, that is, penalties directed at specific abusers, those enjoying “excess benefits”, well, that is another story altogether. That is in fact a right target and the target is David Miscavige and those/that few other one, the “unnatural” relationship guy, you know, Deputy POB.
The worst part of all this is that little to no funds are actually used to handle all these “world problems” they rant about while separating the “prospect”
from his or her money. The little that is done, is mainly done by individual
Scientologists on their own initiative and with their own money. The Sea Org video team then gets sent in to greatly exaggerate what was done and
DM shows it off at the next event and takes credit for it. Of course it is all used – TO MAKE MORE MONEY….
The same tactic is used for recruitment. My 13 year old niece was locked in the Flag recruitment film room to watch a video showing all kinds of social horrors. She was made to watch it over and over again. After she was completely overwhelmed, the recruiters moved in. If she didn’t join the Sea Org (positioned as the only answer) then she was responsible for the worlds problems. She went home crying to her parents that she had to join the Sea Org “in order to help prevent the Chinese babies from being killed”.
The recruiters showed up at my sisters house to grab her daughter that night. After some HOURS, the recruiters finally got the message – F#@* Off! The confrontation had to go to the verge of violence.
This “church” not only feels entitled to its cult members money, but their children as well. No joke.
Even more basic is “Orders, Illegal and Cross”. Fundraising is off policy and LRH forbid it. The ED perpetuated an illegal order and should have been crammed for even issuing it. Luis should never have been asked to be a fundraising I/C in the first place.
What has helped me in helping others:
1. Knowing that “Reality is proportional to the amount of charge of a case.” Therefore I do not attempt to discuss or persuade to change some reality, but ask questions and listen. I look for the charge that “opens the door.” Like the out-rudiment that prevents the meter from reading, this rudiment will produce a change. If you find this, reality of the person will change.
2. Often a person has adopted an attitude, idea, emotion or reaction as a “solution” to some confusion or situation. Another person approaching to “clean that up” could appear to be on the side of the bank, wanting to take away his solution. When I was successful I did not attempt to evaluate or take away the solutions, but:
3. was on the side of the pc and helped him against the bank. I did not “handle him” I helped him to handle some charge he had overlooked.
4. When you can be in communication then you can audit. The most useful datum is the Axiom about as-isness: If the difficulty disappeares you have found it, it doesn’t then you both didn’t. I use this as compass.
5. I expect to find the thing that does help that person in front of me.
“Now, you radiate that intention if you are expecting, if your expectancy is good. If your expectancy is bad, your expectancy is critical, if you get a lot of overts on somebody, something like that and so forth, he has some recognition of this, he senses this. But he might not sense it consciously, but he just knows that it doesn’t quite communicate. Now your expectancy, you don’t necessarily have to be a super saccharine ARC, theetie, you know, sweet and all this sort of thing. You don’t have to be loud or haughty or anything of the sort, it’s just your, the normal action, but your expectancy and what you say and so on can have a fantastic effect. Because it is incredible, you might not want to believe it.” (HANDLING PERSONNEL, Part II, ESTO-6, 3 March 1972)
Right Jim. The prospect (or staff member) would be asked if he REALLY WANTED the product of more auditing, completion of the course, more books or whatever it was. And if they comm lagged about it due to the financial stress and not having the $, or unreal logistics on it, they would be evaluated for and told that they must not really want the product then and were demonstrating counter intention to expansion, etc…and thus sent off to Ethics for a PTS check or overt writeup. This was also run on staff members to get them to do insane things in order to get the stats up. I can’t tell you how many times I was asked, as staff and public, if I “really wanted the product”. The outpoint was that the “product” was achieved in a manner that made it really into being an overt product, but as you said, when it is below 2.0, they don’t see it that way. It IS pretzel logic! What a great name for it.
And as Marty presented in his post, it has declined much more over the last decide. These misinterpretations of policy were actually jumped on and corrected in earlier times. Now, they are not even recognized as an outpoint and are allowed to go unchecked…thus the KRs like the ones we see here.
“But, I never refer to it as “thorough clean up”; I find, per the C/S Series and Data Series, the bigger the situation the lighter the touch required in handling.”
That is so true Marty, just so true, at the opposite of dramatization, real wisdom.
Sometimes, it takes just locating and indicating the BPC, and all is blown. This is scientology, this is LRH, otherwise it’s just a dramatization of thoroughness, “perfect” type of action. Actually 1,5 on the tone scale, really of the order of psychs, and they call it scientology. There is such a wide difference between the real spirit of scientology and this homo-sapiens suppressive activity.
Thank you Carol. The loudest critics never walked in our shoes, never even considered walking in our shoes. Didn’t make the sacrifices we made, didn’t take the risks and chances we took. Never saw the things we got to see either. If they want to make any one of us sorry for reaching and knowing and living, I only have one message to send back:
I’d rather be sorry for something I’ve done, than for something that I didn’t do.
The accounts of those two friends cooincide with what I’m finding as severe out-tech practiced on those OT III and above, in particular on those on NOTs, either audited or Solo and exactly as you relate, in the six month checks especially.
Currently I’m redoing a checksheet for both Audited/Co-audited NOTs and Solo that is based solely on validated, original LRH material. While doing this it has become clear that what is being done in DM’s SP group is not only incorrect, but as you say, the factual reverse of what the Level itself addresses. That is, the NOTs case is re-inforced, solidified, added to, and the fundamental truth of what is there is denied and invalidated. It is as Reverse Scientology as could be.
The charge restimulated and then by-passed is brutal. It isn’t only the HCO Style Sec Checks that by-pass this charge and reverse NOTs tech, but other handlings such as PTS handlings with no consideration of the tech of handling OT III and above. Mis-identification run rampant, and more lies introduced to ossify the being and solidify his entrapment.
I agree. A service provided in the field of dealing with the ARC Breaks associated with this out-tech, and whatever else of DM’s suppressive reverse mental bullshit has been carried on is vital.
For any of those who have experienced this assault … genuine fixes are available and more are on the way.
Good God, these people! What are these people smoking? Their reality is so disengaged from the world at large that it’s quite scary. Having worked in and around the non-profit arena, I’d love to see any other group on Earth where the person seeking funds from a person coerces them by writing reports on them. Yes, totally cultish. Totally wrong. Just seeing the CC’s on Bert & Lynne’s report made me throw up a little. It’s total ser fac,”you won’t donate, huh well CO WISE WUS needs to know about this. Oh and for good measure, let’s CC the CO FOLO and CLO just because.”
Oh but I have folders of such reports written on myself or others in much the same manner. It was going on back in 01, but the whole KR people for not selling their kidneys, gold out of their teeth, and knocking off their uncle for money is definitely something that peaked probably 3-5 years ago. Today I think the mentality is still severely disengaged from reality and society.
I remember once, having received a KR by another staff member in my org with CC’s to about 15 random uplines terminals. I replied to the person and cc’d everyone they cc’d asking the original KR writer, “what exactly is the purpose of CC’ing all of these people? [that have NOTHING to do with this report, my post or yours?]”
I agree. Times have changed. I honestly think that public in general are viewed like lower life forms these days. I think staff view them as not being here on the same terms as the rest of us, therefor they are sort of fair game. The public that survive the best, seem to be the ones who can be the biggest assholes.
I’m not putting down staff. Staff are good people. This 3P, them and us, self preservation attitude is laid in with pain such as no sleep, bad nutrition, reverse sec checks, etc.
There is a push shove going on within that will eventually bring it all down, IMO.
I agree. These critics need to at least take a look at what’s going on in present time. Things change. People’s viewpoints change. Isn’t that what it’s all about?
What they need is the children from “The Village of the Damned”Those kids would put their ethics in, but good.
That reference is from Flag order 3930 “SAD TALE”. The mate has to yell at the crew to get them to safe waters, yet the crew is upset even after they’re safe. The chaplain cannot understand why the crew is upset seeing as they are now safe and asks them why. They tell him:
“The Mate yelled at us”
We all owe Marty and Mike a debt of gratitude for “yelling at us”. We might have been “lost to the seas” otherwise.
Everyone has eternity-some will be “eternally” miserable though.
this is a huge subject and I would love to hear what insight Marty and other Exstaff know about this. My question is specifically about all the people told that “they can’t get auditing at a specific org.” And they are not an illegal pc. And the huge mystery they are left with – of NO DATA ON WHY. This is really suppressive!!!!!
I would think that if someone is told they can’t get auditing at Flag, for example, that they can get their $$ back and would not be considered “a refund.” Am I correct?
John Woodruff killed off is one of the thousands of glaring outpoints that should tell people that SOMETHING IS VERY WRONG!! Sorry to yell.
The poor SO members on the Special Project to renovate a palace in Columbia for DM to hide out in. They are probably on a 2 hour a night sleep schedule since this latest series came out…
Well, I think the Church is way off-policy, out-tech and off purpose.
It’s a little hard to fully see that when you are in, but if someone honestly steps back and looks I dont see how they could come to any other conclusion.
You’ve got Orgs and “Scientologists” who do not know or follow LRH Policy and accept squirrel Miscvige tech alterations.
These Orgs and Church members do not even apply the KSW series.
They cannot or will not see what is right in front of them. I think you have to disconnect and get out of all that for a bit before you can really view it all as it is.
Mike Laws ~~
No compassion. Only ATTACK.
Miscavige’s main thrust in life is ATTACK, attacking others. He has only one solution to everything ::::: ATTACK and DESTROY. How he keeps his enablers from not seeing his modus operandi is puzzling. Many a vicious Sea Org THUG has been well trained into it as a “needed and wanted” by POB.
Sometimes the ATTACK is backlogged. New Yorker magazine was attacked 6 months after their Church article was dead and buried but the URGE to attack, the sheer personal gratification DM gets from a full frontal assault is almost amusing to sit back and watch.
Let’s see the Counter attack on the St. Pete Times. The ATTACKS on Village Voice re child porn are well……yawn yawn.
The biggest ATTACK is recent times is on ex Sea Org, and particuarly long term veterans.
What is baffling is the amount of ATTACK, beatings, slugging, assault and battery dramatized internally. In some perplexing way, this violence is not looked upon as ATTACK ! Only the whistleblowers are ATTACKING the Church !
Miscavige feels he is under total seige and is being ATTACKED 24/7/65 without ever seeing that HE is constantly ATTACKING the world ~~ Journalists. TV stations, media, Critics, Ex-Scientologists, Indies, everybody ! He himself is continuosly the Originator of the hostile act which bounces right back in his face !
All these bogus conspiracy theories ~~ Eli Lilli, the big Pharmaceuticals, “Germany”, the World Bankers, the Rockefellers, the Free Masons, the Vatican etc etc etc is pure hogwash. The current “Church” gets attacked because the “CHURCH” maliciously and with enormous hate spitefully and wickedly goes on a rampage of ATTACK.
I can only imagine the shaking of heads in disbelief at OSA INT at the ramped up QUANTITY of recent attacks. Straight up and vertical stat. They just do not get it that for every action there is an equal and contra re-action. Maliciously striking out like a rattlesnake to slime, poison and harrass others boomerangs right back in their face with heightened attack. Attacking people as a full time business which the “Chuch” does results in the “Church” being hated 24/7/365 while their enemies plot their demise from numerous angles outside the protection of “Religion.”
C of $ is like a monstrous virus ~~ a kind of SCI FI creepy liquid like a Tsumani wave devouring and drowing everyone in its pathway. As the Tsunami wave withdraws, the shores are littered with the debris of destroyed broken families, bankruptices, Fair Gamed victims, damaged pcs, severed relationships, locked down RPFers, huge sums of ripped of $$$$$, unspeakable cruelty behind closed doors and more more Internet leaks.
The “CHurch” is creating new enemies by the hour, by the minute. It has only one solution ~~~ ATTACK and DESTROY MORE !
I agree with you Laura Ann. The view on “public” has changed over the years, from my experience. It used to be what I considered a partnership at least. Sure there was regging for next service, joining staff etc. but still when the communication was completed there was still understanding and friendship. Last I was onlines, several years ago, I remember getting out of session and walking down the hall. An Org exec (can’t remember her post) grabbed me by the arm and said, “You will be at the event this Saturday, right?” I said, “no, won’t be there”. She said, “What?” I said, “I don’t go to events any longer. Just my thing, I guess”. She sorta yelled, “YOU HAVE TO ASSUME THE VIEWPOINT OF INT MANAGEMENT”!!!! Now I am all for good TR 1 and Tone 40 intention but that took me a notch down the scale a bit and I said, “well I would prefer my current valence if that’s ok”. Granted that was a bit 1.1 however, but I considered that com later and how (along with other outpoints that observed after being offlines for several years) things had shifted and I could not reckon how the old free communication, ARC, fun really seemed to had dropped out of the group.
Placing too much emphasis on mis-identification really plays into keeping people at effect in my view.
Of course I agree with you, and find it rather astonishing that anyone could think that the phrase “thorough clean up” meant anything else. What gets cleaned up is whatever is bothering the pc, and that’s all. “Thorough” does not mean over-repair. It means “don’t stop at under-repair.”
Being non-evaluative does not preclude promoting that people get auditing. How does someone go up the Bridge without getting some auditing?
Even if an Independent Scientologist felt 100% fine about his Church experience, as soon as he shows up with a Standard Tech auditor he’s going to get a repair program, even if it’s just assessing a C/S 53 to get things underway.
You hit the nail on the head when you mentioned “reality is proportional to charge off the case.” Isn’t it obvious to everyone that in the Independent field two things are true? (a) A lot of people are upset about what happened to them, others, and Scientology itself in the Church. (b) There’s a lot of disagreement as to what to do about it, what strategies to follow, who to trust, who one can talk freely to, etc.
Both (a) and (b) are symptoms of charge.
Applying “reality is proportional to charge off the case” to our 3rd dynamic, it’s my opinion that the more open comm people have through Marty’s blog, and the more the 3rd dynamic engram is run out by the data he’s releasing and the actions he and others are taking, AND the more that we as individuals takes responsibility for getting charge off our own cases (if we consider there’s any charge there, OK?), and help others get charge off their cases (if they consider there’s any charge there), the more charge will come off our 3rd dynamic and the better we’ll do as a team.
The whole Bridge is about getting charge off the case and thereby raising reality. I’m just saying, let’s go ahead and do that. I’m not indicating to any individual that they need it. I’m just saying that if someone feels like they could use some auditing, they should go ahead and get some without any further delay. And to make that more possible for more of us, I’m requesting that trained auditors find a way to resume actually auditing, if their current life circumstances make it at all possible for them to do so, and they haven’t done it already.
Agree on the recent steep decline. I can also say that until 2007 I always got in session. My last trip to the Church- never did get in session and that was only one out point-although looking at the big picture – the biggest.
As people have reported, and I have my stories too, The Basics insanity was huge. It was like the Church had a psychotic break. That was a steep turn for the worse. Then it was followed by the “Ideal Org” psychotic break. The outpoints are huge and after Marty left the Church!
So good to be “out of the machine.” I was listening to a PDC lecture and started laughing and crying at the same time! A passage from a book of teachings of Buddha helped firm up a stable datum of mine. And then there is all of you communicating here. Even though, I’m under the radar this is my group and boy is it a lot of havingness. Love you guys!
If by “misidentification” you mean “misownership,” my personal experience in my own auditing is that spotting misownership does more to pop me OUT of being effect than anything else. The entirety of what’s wrong with the way the Church delivers the upper levels is that it ignores and invalidates the concept of misownership. On the other hand, when repairing someone buried in charge, a light touch, as you say, would be appropriate. This would especially be the case with someone whose reality isn’t up to the issue of misownership, or once was but lost it due to accumulated bypassed charge. All pc’s and pre-OTs should be handled in a way appriate to their reality level. It’s pretty obvious by your results that that’s what you do. But if I ever come to you for auditing, misownership will be most of what I’ll be interested in.
See my reply to Worsel above. When I use the work “thorough” I mean “from the pc or pre-OT’s point of view..” The idea is to handle everything that’s bothering HIM, and NOT to address other issues that are bothering someone ELSE.
Apparently the word “thorough” reminds some people of what the Church does. But they’re NOT thorough. They miss instant reads, overrun F/Ns, try to audit the case on rudiments, re-run previously completed rundowns and levels, and introvert pc’s and pre-OTs with sec checking so they can no longer as-is what’s restimulated by actual auditing questions. That’s not “thorough,” because it leaves tons of bypassed charge. Bypassing charge is the OPPOSITE of “thorough.” Any and all auditing in the Church today is the opposite of “thorough.”
REAL “thorough” has nothing to do with being light or heavy. It just means to find what’s bothering the pc or pre-OT and help him to as-is it until nothing more is bothering him. I think that’s what we all want from our auditing.
I love that line! “Well, I would prefer my current valence if that’s OK.” That’s telling her!
I had a similar experience in a Sea Org delivery org regarding my declining to purchase the Basics. The Chief Officer told me I was out-ethics for not going along with “command intention.” I explained to him that I wasn’t his junior, but rather his customer. And that the way the Non-E formula worked between us is that he was supposed to find out what I needed and wanted in exchange for my money, and then do, produce, or present that. I told him he was running the Non-E formula backwards, telling me what he needed and wanted from me. His jaw dropped, and he stared at me dumbfounded for 10-15 seconds. He absolutely couldn’t think with so obvious a little piece of truth. He walked away scratching his head.
Wait for the WH response to the petition calling for revocation of tax exempt status for all religions, allowing these to file as non-profit charitable. That will give an indication of how a specific petition might be received.
What you propose — standard tech and free market delivery of that tech — is exactly the business model for open source software. The best-known example of this is the Linux operating system. There is a single organization that certifies the core technology. Everybody starts with a version of Linux that’s known, stable and trusted.
Then companies compete to do the best job delivering that technology in ways that meet customers’ unique needs. This model is unstoppable: in the last decade, Linux has moved from a curiosity to the only force that is successfully taking market share away from Microsoft’s Windows operating system. People are making billions of dollars selling and supporting Linux and they’re delivering better technology faster on R&D spending that are only about 10% of what Microsoft spends.
Microsoft is the richest most profitable vertically integrated monopoly in history, but they have been marginalized by a loose confederation of competitors connected only by agreeing on the core of what’s important about the product. Other rich profitable competitors like IBM, Oracle and others couldn’t make a dent in Microsoft until they started working together through Linux and the open source management process. I studied the economics of this market for several strategic consulting engagements over the last decade and could go on for hours about it.
The lessons for the independent Scientology movement should be obvious — if you can do what Kassapa is saying, and sharpen your aim by developing the governance of the Indie movement consciously and deliberately by learning from the open source software movement, you will be able to succeed at stopping the entrenched competitor (in your case, the Church of Scientology) where nobody else has been able to do that before. And when there are effective processes to agree on what is Standard Tech, it will happen faster than you ever thought possible. All the money looted in the CoS coffers looted from members will not help them a bit.
That’s the one! Yep, Marty and now all of us are yelling at people to get off the Titanic. But they are mad at us for yelling. 🙂
It was an interesting incident actually, in more ways. The session I just got out of was actually ok however it was odd when I got to the examiner. My needle was floating, albeit not my TA, but the after session exam was really odd. Once the examiner did her prep, turned on the video cam etc. she just stared at the meter. I mean this went on for at least 90 seconds! I was staring out the window, looking at her, stared out the window again. I was “Hello?” I was ok after session but I was close to challenging her on the process here then she called the F/N. Not sure I was really fning at that point when I put the cans down and walked down the hall. It was weird. So I was already wondering about stuff when I made it down the hall. I appreciate, reading on this blog awhile ago, about the change in calling an FN. It makes sense to me now. I had a few of the “whistling Dixie” exams and sessions I had back then. Btw, I appreciate whomever (Jim Logan?) posted that info on the squirrelling of this very important tech. If staff were required to at least get trained up through level 4, lets say within their first year of committing to staff then Scientology would be in a so much better position now.
Here’s another one. Being called and ordered immediately to the org for an ethics interview because of something (unspecified) in a KR from an ethics interview on someone else (again not named), because I was “preventing a PC from going in session,” and this on a day I had just arrived back from overseas after over 24 hours of plane flights. I said no and was threatened with escalating ethics gradients. I finally got the name of the person whose ethics interview I had come up in and who was supposedly holding up from auditing, found out this was not true, and that what I said was both true and innocuous, i..e. I told him something was nowhere in policy, and that was true. I told this other person to go straighten this ethics officer out and refused to respond to the summons, and that was the end of that.
Jim, so true. That has happened to me and is not fun, but I was able to spot the op and at least remove myself from any possibility of having it continued on me — and just cogniting on the truth of the matter discharged at least some of the charge being revved up.
I’m not much of a computer technical person, but my understanding is that the Linux operating system is continuously modified and improved by all the various developers who use it. The problem with applying that model to Scientology is that LRH is the one and only source of Standard Tech. I don’t particularly want to see others trying to “improve” it. I believe in KSW.
Where I CAN see Open Source working very well for us is with regard to the marketing side. I see a loose organization something like the old Mission Network of the 60’s and 70’s, where successful actions of missions were collected by Mission Office Worldwide and sent out to all missions as black-on-yellow Mission Advice Letters. That was Open Source and led to great success. Bob Mongiello and his daughter Charese are trying to re-establish it.
The Riverside Mission was the biggest mission in the world, larger than maybe all Class 5 orgs. But it wasn’t rip-roaringly successful right from the get-go. What really got it going was when Bob visited the Davis Mission and learned what they were doing, then adapted that for Riverside and really did it for blood.
I’m collecting hat write-ups on the successful actions of the old missions, and will make the results of that research, along with bright ideas for adapting it to today, available on my own upcoming blog independently of whatever Bob does.
On the Tech side, we just need to duplicate, understand, and implement Standard Tech as developed by LRH. In the Independent field there are disagreements as to what is and is not Standard Tech. At some point I’d like to see what in ancient times might be called a Council of Elders, composed of 5-10 of the most highly trained and productive Independent auditors and C/Ses, who would meet to consider each and every such disagreement and determine what LRH really said about it, and then report their determination to the field. Auditors who agreed to go along with the Council’s determinations would be Provisionally Certified.
If I had to pick Council members right now, based on the incomplete knowledge I have of everyone’s qualifications, I’d probably go with Karen de la Carriere, Pierre Ethier, Trey Lotz, Frankie Freeman, Jim Logan, and Marty. I think a group like that could do a great job. Surely there are others I don’t know who would also make great members.
LRH is Source on Standard Tech. Period.
In the late 60’s, before the Sea Org took over local orgs and imposed heavy admin, almost all staff members were on auditor training after their first few months on the job, and they got way more study time than 12.5 hours per week. It was more like 30.
But lack of training is not why your examiner waited for the meter to play Dixie. She was trained to wait for 3 swings back and forth, and to look at the meter to make sure. Back in the “good old days,” any auditor worth his salt could look straight at the pc and know after just one swing whether or not the needle was floating. He’d call it and then it would keep floating. When examiners stare at the meter and don’t call the F/N as soon as it starts, that invalidates the pc and can turn off the F/N. Idiotic. Absolutely idiotic.
The Sec Check Tech is being misapplied, and I doubt very much it was ever intended to be run on an F/Ning Solo Auditor on a blanket Basis. Granted, the Guy rips off other people, runs squirrel processes on himself, produces overt Products in Life … well then Yes, something needs to be handled, but that would go the same for any PC or pre-OT no Matter what Service he was on.
Running Sec Checks on any unfounded Basis can only serve to introvert the Person, stop his Bridge Progress, and place him at the Mercy of his Master’s arbitrary Edicts … in short control him, and make him agreeable to his Whims. Thus being OT is what David Miscavige conceives it to be, and thus barring the Road to OT.
Truth-Quote of the Day.
Kassapa, thank you for spotting and correcting the typo. It should read ““Reality is proportional to the amount of charge OFF a case.”
Thank you for your understanding.
Correction: F/Ns shouldn’t be called as soon as they start, but rather as soon as the other parts of the EP also occur — cog, VGIs, and extroversion. Calling an F/N after 3 swings can therefore not only overrun the pc, but in some cases chop his EP. Either one leaves him with bypassed charge. The main thing to watch is the pc.
“Deterioration” is to put it mildly.
The Place is gone, overrun with a new Generation in DM/RTC Valence.
Even with DM gone, they’ll carry on is his Footsteps. The Disease is now bred in.
And that is the same as one of the very first Posts I placed on this Board almost 2 Years ago.
Let’s get even more busy delivering Scientology … the Church is no more, it’s something else now …
You got it FG, it really is of the order of psychs. As I’ve posted before, DM totally fits LRH’s description of a PSYCH – he is an implanter. It is not a degree in psychiatry that makes a person a PSYCH. It is specializing in the implanting of others.
“I sometimes get annoyed by the a=a mentality of some attackers out there that attribute behavior to me or friends of mine because “look at what the church of Scientology is doing now.”
Hands up to that in the distant past Marty!! (Actually it was only Mr Rinder that fell into that trap in my mind , but that is sorted now!- Sorry Mike , use to refer to you as ‘Rinder SIG’, but communication and understansing sweeps away misconception)
I do feel there was always a nastier blacker element in the Church, lurking in the shadows, out of sight of many!
Anybody without misunderstoods on the Academy Levels, let alone Class VI, VIII, IX, etc could not possibly have a “disagreement” about what standard tech is. Your council of elders is a horrible idea – setting up another via to interpret. You’re gonna go the same route – except not as efficiently and organized as Corporate Scientology – as Corporate Scientology.
If someone doesn’t rise out of that nonsense after a while, and people continue to grant it such dangerous importance, that person can be manipulated and controlled for life – like the hapless Corporate Scientologists. Living a delusion, at effect.
Yeah, it’s like so many successful processes that work, if you keep at them, whether it’s Dianetics, O/W’s,Creative processing, failure ensues. Auditing itself can inadvertently become a solution for living: anytime something goes slightly wrong of discordant, the person feels he must run to session.
When auditing becomes a solution for living, auditing can become counter-productive. Auditing is merely a tool to help increase awareness and handle things that prevent one from being aware. Too much emphasis on charge and case and “the next level” can become justifications for not confronting and doing.
Scientology and Dianetics is so, so, so much more than auditing, than tech, than admin. It’s a study of life and knowing and living. Thus, an “accomplished auditor audits life.”
You don’t want individuals dependent on auditing. And this should in no way be interpreted as, “Oh, you’re suggesting that auditing has no value.” I’m suggesting that auditing is essential for what it is intended, and all processes and levels should be taken to their EP and the person should then be set about the business of living, of observing, of understanding, of being aware and active.
In the end, the abilities to confront, to observe, to duplicate and understand are where the emphasis should be.
I realize that we’re in territory that must be spoken of cryptically, but I’m uncertain as to your meaning in your last two comments. What’s the “nonsense” and “delusion” you’re referring to, that’s being “granted dangerous importance”?
Is it the basic truth of misownership and what is misowned, or what the Church does to block the effective handling of that truth?
Or are you saying that while misownership and what is misowned are real, one shoudn’t use that as an excuse to dump all personal responsibility, or mock up something that isn’t there in order to excuse one’s actions?
I’ve seen both extremes. On the one hand, the Church routinely enforces personal ownership and responsibility incorrectly, resulting in Reverse Introspection Rundown effect. On the other hand, some preOTs have used the misownership concept to incorrectly avoid personal responsibility in their lives. Get both extremes going in the same person (they’d feed off each other), and I agree, you’ve got prime slave material — at effect of both his case and the Church.
C/S Series 73 says, “A pre-OT who is doing well should not be interefered with by sec checking or anything else.” Virginia and Mike McClaughery and another couple on Solo NOTS were declared and expelled for revealing this to others on the level.
I’m saying the cult’s greatest lever of control is to keep people thinking the reason is “over there.” The sooner one transcends that effect, motivator viewpoint the happier and more aware and more able one will be.
If one doesn’t learn to walk the walk, he might as well be shovelling his money to the highest class psycho-analyst he can find; which would be a lot cheaper than paying to be lead around by the nose by a Corporate Scientology “auditor.”
You’re absolutely right that auditors without misunderstoods would automatically agree on what Standard Tech is. However, there are many highly classed auditors in the Independent field who do have disagreements, and very big ones. Some are outright, obvious squirrels, but not necessarily detectable to untrained pc’s.
One could say that in the long run, only Standard Tech auditors would be able to flourish and prosper. But what about the customers they ruin in the meantime? And what about the Church itself? It’s full of squirrels now, and still auditing away.
I agree that centralized CONTROL is dangerous, and could very easily lead to another DM. But does that mean that auditors who ARE standard shouldn’t help “detect and help re-standardize” auditors who’ve gone off the rails?
Is there no Middle Path between totalitarian control and complete free market anarchy? My “Council of Elders” idea (and we certainly wouldn’t call it that) is just an idea. Unlike some of the other ideas I’ve presented, I’m not totally sure this one is right. But what do we do about auditors who aren’t so bad that they go out of business, but bad enough to deny their pc’s the real gains they could have through Standard Tech?
What’s your solution?
Very clever concept extrapolating buoyancy and weight. Reading your stuff is always fodder for thought. One such thought is, “when does certainty of one’s ideas merge into hubris?” It’s a burden I bear. When do my ideas become so overbearingly important that they begin to overwhelm another and ruin their own ability to observe and maintain their self-determinism.
Buddha and LRH both walked that path. How to raise another’s awareness without subjugating them to an ideology. Each was served by individuals so enamored of those found truths that all must be inculcated. Intelligent, strong beings who had a mission to bring truth and set up organizations to drive that truth into society.
So many with stellar intelligence have driven their ideas into society. The great ones always weigh that influence against the well being of others. Some merely consider the physical well being. Others consider the mental or spiritual well being.
I wonder if truth can ever be driven or forced. I wonder if the importance of my truths should ever be allowed prominence over the importance of another’s. Such a subtle thing, bringing truth as a gift and enforcing truth as a burden. Such a subtle thing, being confident in one’s ideas and not feeling one needs to use those ideas in place of self.
The great beings I have known have never placed undue importance on ideas or plans or forms. The importance is on beings. The importance is on that which can understand and originate ideas. I’ve always stood off to the side and marveled at such beings, wishing I were a bit more humble.
But that pride, like an errant cigarette always seems to set the forest ablaze.
Hubris. A three pack a day habit with me. I’d hate to see the x-rays.
It’s just something I entertained. A moment of reflection I chose to share. Requiring no response. Just food for thought. A side dish. A stuffed mushroom. Didn’t mean to interrupt. Mmmmmm.
You noted, “there are many highly classed auditors in the Independent field who do have disagreements, and very big ones.” What are you gonna do, ‘splain it to ’em? My solution is memorialized throughout this blog.
Thanks for the clarification.
Part of the problem IS “over there.” And part of it is “over here.” One has to take care of both.
Denying “over there” leaves one at effect of it unknowingly. Becoming aware of it opens the door to handling it and gaining cause over it, even though one may feel at effect of it at first, and, as you say, motivatorish. Then one becomes cause over it by confronting and taking responsibility through the use of the actual Standard Tech processes and procedures that apply.
The way the Church inhibits this is by using invalidative sec checks to undermine people’s confidence in their ability to take responsibility on their own self-determinism. By overdoing the demand for higher responsibility, and defining responsibility as going along with DM’s “command intention,” this reduces real responsibility based in self-determinism, and keeps people at effect.
The Church also keeps its members at effect through constant promotion of the danger of external enemies, internal enemes now exposed, etc. Also through overwhelming multimedia presentations at events, new programs released in fully institutionalized form that cannot be questioned or even ignored, never-ending gang regging, etc. Staff are put at effect of “command intention,” and see their job as passing that down the line to public to put them at effect, too.
DM does not understand that Pan-Determinism includes granting Self-Determinism to others to agree or disagree. The Church wants pre-OTs to be at effect of the Church. But that also leaves those pre-OTs at effect of “over there” in their solo auditing.
By demanding that people rise above being motivatorish, the Church actually drives them BELOW being motivatorish. Being causative as a robot is not only being at effect of external control, it’s giving up fighting it, and choosing to agree with and forward it to others. It’s a condition below Confusion, as it solves the confusion by adopting an other-determined stable datum.
It’s actually psychotic. LRH’s original definition of a neurotic was someone trying to stay in present time (in control of one’s attention) but having trouble, while he defined a psychotic as someone who’d given up trying to stay in present time, and had gone completely into the past (having one’s attention controlled).
“Over there” is real, but the reason one is at effect of it or at cause over it is “over here.” That applies to daily life, OT case, and one’s relationship with the Church. One has to strike a balance, emphasizing “over here” without denying “over there.”
Well, I’ve tried to explain it to some of them, and that didn’t work. In addition to misunderstoods, they all seemed to have lots of charge on their experiences in the Church, and inflamed serv facs as a result.
It also seemed that like Iraq, Yugoslavia, and other countries where central control once held all factions in line, when that control was lifted, the factions re-emerged. Probably some of these squirrels were “standard tech guys” in the Church only because they couldn’t get away with the squirreling they really wanted to do. Some others act exactly like current Church auditors (squirrels of a different color), just out on their own.
When I tried to “explain it to them” with these guys, I just ran into their charge and got nowhere. So, doing more of the same isn’t going to help anyone. But that doesn’t mean that certain other auditors and training centers shouldn’t be labeled as “reliable standard tech providers” by technical opinion leaders that most of the Independent field trusts, with that certification being subject to withdrawl if evidence of squirreling is reported and confirmed.
As for those who failed to qualify for certificatioin, I wouldn’t necessarily 3rd party them to the world by name. But certain deviations from standard tech could be reported to the public by saying “watch out for auditors who do these squirrely things.” It would then be up to individual pc’s to make their own decisions regarding individual auditors.
To a certain degree, and on a very informal basis, withdrawl of certification is already happening. You’ve removed links from your blog to at least a couple of well-known Independent auditors who were found to be squirreling.
As for your “solution memorialized throughout this blog,” I’ve been reading it every day since you started it, and I don’t know what your memorialized solution is, other than let the marketplace decide. I don’t mean this as a challenge, but if you could summarize your solution in one paragraph in a reply now it would be helpful.
You speak wisely on this matter. I struggle with what you’ve described, and worry about it all the time. Is what I’m doing a commendable, or an overt? It’s a fine line to walk.
I’m definitely not just chatting. I see what I’m dong as bringing some needed order, which will inevitably cause some confusion to show up and blow off, for myself as well as others. In the process I’m getting both praise and criticism, and I find both restimulative to a certain degree.
But before I appeared on this blog, I felt off purpose and guilty of an overt of omission. I felt that I could make a contribution, but I wasn’t doing so. So, one day I decided to jump in. I didn’t really expect that to stimulate so much back-and-forth, but in hindsight it’s obvious that it would.
I appreciate the feedback of others. Fire away.
I admire your chutzpah, and your intelligence. The willingness to be responsible and take control. I encourage it and don’t want to diminish the glow.
As Marty pointed out, sometimes situations that seem the worst require the lightest touch. Estimation of effort. Finding out honestly what is needed and wanted, then providing that.
The best ideas ever created go to waste if the members of a group don’t want to contribute to them. Better a mediocre idea that gets everyone on board than an excellent idea that others resist–which then “has to forced” into implementation.
I’m talking about theta agreement, not bank agreement. Thetans quite readily agree to theta concepts, to high ideals and ethics and aesthetics.
My past is littered with the personal catastrophes of discovering my “brilliance” didn’t muster agreement, so I’m not trying to be critical here. I’m just suggesting that putting a supercharger in that particular engine will over-stress its dynamics and blow it apart–even if gaining all those extra horses seems like a good idea.
As for getting one’s ideas kicked around, I wouldn’t have a friend who wasn’t willing to put my thoughts to the most rigorous tests. If someone agrees with me too much, I raise an eyebrow and ask, “Since I know I’m so full of shit, what’s wrong with you for not noticing?”
I think you have intimidated some of the readers and posters. But, what the hell. If they can’t stand up for themselves and their ideas….maybe they’d better grow a backbone and learn to confront. It’s a tough universe. If someone gets knocked down, they need to pick their ass back up and get in the game.
Making a better world requires people with the courage to stand up and make a difference. Always a gradient scale of ability and contribution.
Untested balance never improves. It’s learning how much to test that balance rather than undermine confidence.
So true, Mark!
For me, reading this blog was clean up enough.
I’ve got other stuff to deal with that the church never addressed in a realistic way, like how to raise happy, smart, productive kids, other issues with your mate, career, etc. The tech is all there but the church had/has no clue how to align its dynamics.
Thanks for you comments. We clearly have a lot in common. By the way, if you’ve seen my fleet anywhere recently, please let me know. They’re late, and I lost my subspace I-phone awhile back.
Ditto me Sam!
If I’m following this dialogue, (not a given!), it appears to me that what Marty is saying is that when the cult says “the reason is over there”, they are pointing to a reason that is not in fact “over there”, a source that does not in fact exist “over there”. The cult uses propaganda to misdirect it’s public’s attention onto non-existent “over theres(sources)”. It’s a process of nullification by mocking up enemies that do not exist where it says they exist, or do not actually exist at all. “Over here”, one needs to start looking for himself rather than letting the cult evaluate for him, there is no other solution.
To Valkov a few comments above,
The blog formatting wouldn’t let me put this reply right below your comment.
I agree with you totally in terms of the “over there” and “over here” concerning SPs in the environment. There’s also an aspect of this having to do with case, and that’s what Jim Logan, Marty, and I were discussing.
Well, Kevin you were so into Scientology that it was above everything. No relationships or culture mattered to you. This is what the cult had brain washed you into. The things that you so believed in are the death of your life now. These people have lost their feelings and have become human robots. And all the organisation did was bleed you to death, financially as well as mentally. Promises to deliver that ended up in your losing reality with life. It is so sad that you were a victim of it and it destroyed you to this extent that you are neither dead not alive. Everyone (who was not a scientologist) who was trying to help you was declared a suppressive person according to your Organisation.. You lost a family twice. God gave you chances and you believed in a man made human robotic org rather than on humanity. All for what, so that the Organisation could use your hard earned money to build more buildings for themselves.