The end product of their agreement:
This instrument has no legal precedence value.
It does have evil value in that Miscavige can utilize it internally as a club with which to intimidate people in similar situations that Debbie and Wayne faced in leaving the cult – the Hacienda video-taped agreement signing ceremony. It will have an in terrorem effect upon the clueless. No doubt Miscavige has told those in Int Management and OSA INT who know of the case that this “judgment” is the fact – Debbie received nothing and wound up with a Permanent Injunction against her. And so it will be used to keep those folk in the pen too.
I have to take some time to evaluate this treachery.
I need to take responsibility for it. I’m just not sure immediately how to do so – but I will figure it out.
Moving On Up a Little Higher 
With all the power of prayer and postulating that I can muster, I strongly put out there that you be guided, and that doors open for you Marty to serve a Higher Justice beyond the manipulated farse of “hush money justice”.
Something really sucks about this outcome. But something tells me gears are being engaged.
You have our spiritual support.
Shame on them. They got bought again. And they allow it to continue. That’s “Personal Integrity” ?
This injunction is beyond belief! What in the world could have happened to lead to this? Was this the plan all along by Debbie and husband? Or, are they so scared and exhausted they simply have no fight left? OMG, OMG what a travestry.
There is no way Debbie or Wayne would have signed this document unless there was a HUGE amount of money involved. What a crock!
The fact of the settlement is disappointing, the way it is communicated in the media even more.
This was an opportunity to call the truth on the little lying pompous shit called David Miscavige. It was one opportunity to put an even bigger nail into his coffin and I really liked to see more truth revealed, so yeah the anger and disappointment is understandable.
Nobody knows at this point what moved Debbie and Wayne to settle and agree not to speak the truth about the church. And at this point I would not direct my disappointment at Debbie without further data what considerations brought her to her conclusion. I have to hope for Debbie’s sake that she weighed all aspects before she decided to settle in a way satisfactory to herself and applied good ethical reasoning to it.
People donated to her defense for two reasons: 1. to help a fellow human being in distress, 2. to help the principles of truth and justice to prevail. I made donations for both reasons. It will show the character of Debbie if she stays true to her promise and pays all donations back, as she apparently decided to no longer fight for the principle involved and therefore should give the money back. If Debbie decided to sell her soul to DM so she can live in peace; I feel sorry for her and in my mind it would just show how viciously the Sea Org breaks and destroys beings.
As of now the result of the Debbie Cook case is that more truth saw the light of day. That is a good thing.
Let us work together so more truth will be revealed.
The evil empire of little pompous shit will fall.
So, the money paid to Debbie and Wayne, must be as some form of side agreement which specifies that the money is given them not in settlement of their counterclaims, but for some other reason. This then allows for the show-and-intimidate document filed in the case.
Marty, I do want to contrast your public release of the information as to what has happened, to that of the King Squirrel and his Nuts. You don’t put any false positive spin on it, you call a spade a spade. What would Miscavige via Karin Pinocchip Pouw say — spin, lies and garbage.
That is another piece of evidence of the difference between you and them.
Excuse me !!! Have no words . How can I sign something like that?
I´m more than dissapointed. There is no excuse to that.
On the other hand I think Miscavige will get the what he deserves and it will come from a corner he does not expect.
The slow horse reaches the mill.
Shame on her. She took money knowing what the donors expected of her and it was far far from what she delivered.
disinfected
I’m currently watching the HBO series “Big Love” on DVD and the parallels between that show and the “Cook” show are uncanny. I feel for them as I know how ruthless the Church has been in the past. (past meaning: before right now) Those of you who are in the crosshairs of the church I commend you for sticking to your integrity. Thanks for keeping us informed Marty and you don’t owe us anything. (I can’t believe I’m typing that as I wouldn’t have said that a year ago.) I can’t tell you how grateful I am that I never rose to the ranks of Int and I was able to escape the cult over 20 years ago with minimal exterior damage although the interior damage still has residue from time to time.
There are things other than money that can ‘encourage’ a whistleblower to stand down and surrender. Think on it.
Maybe Debbie and Wayne will move to New Zealand. Friday nights they
can go on double dates with the only friends in the world they will ever find.
JM
This is a victory for the church inc. And very bad for all of us. I feel that Debbie let us down. She did not have the guts in the end. She let herself silenced? She must be very PTS … still.
Very dissapointing outcome. If I read it right, no side gets anything save that they are injuncted.
After a careful read of the PDF document and stripping away all of the legalese, it is SO obvious to me that the mini sociopath I/C is/was utterly terrified of one more utterance from Debbie on the witness stand.
So much damage has already accrued to POB to date from Cook’s actions, going all the way back to the New Year’s email, that he might just have a second thought before he puts anyone else who turns whistle blower on the stand. Even rabid dogs don’t like getting whacked by a nail-studded baseball bat.
Finally, I sense that the door is open for others to fatten their bank accounts by seven figures. Have at it.
My two cents…….
See.. I’m really confused now…
To me this pretty piece of toilet paper looks to be saying that all we have to do to keep Debbie and Wayne talking is be sure that anyone bringing a lawsuit against dear leader and his cult in the future should make sure to subpoena Debbie and Wayne as expert witnesses to testify about things he would rather have kept quiet…
But surely Miscavige wouldn’t be stupid enough to blow hundreds of thousands of dollars of parishioner money only to tempt some contrary minded thetan to do exactly that?
Presumably this injuction, which Debbie and Co agree, to was necessary for the church of scientology owing to the fact the Church of Scientology gag agreements and the conditions upon which they’re imposed are useless.
It’s all part of the documentation showing just what a nasty organisation the church of scientology is, that merely to question the authority ultimately results in this.
OK I’m slow on the uptake I know but I still don’t get it. If “no agency less than God” can take away one’s inalienable right to communicate, which right as I understand it as a non-US citizen is also enshrined in the Constitution, how in the name of Allah can this document mean anything? Or is DM actually God and I missed that bit?
In context, does this document actually mean that Debbie can no longer tell the truth about what she personally saw with her own eyes? Does DM have the right to alter one’s own time track? What she saw never happened as shown by the courts and the cult? Some one help me out here.
Betrayl after trust? After the money and support that was flowed to Debbie and Wayne…pitiful. HereNow said earlier, and I agree, there was a side agreement made. To be sure money changed hands off the redar!
Would probably depend on how “non-collusive” service of a a subpoena is interpreted.
Please note that the stipulated judgment does NOT assert that no money changed hands. It says “plaintiff shall take nothing” and “defendants shall take nothing” as a result of the lawsuit. In legal terms, this means that no money damages were assessed against either side by the court as a result of the suit. It is completely silent as to whether or not the official church tendered a check to Debbie and Wayne as as inducement to agree to the settlement. I don’t see anything in the agreement that implies otherwise. So, yes, in my mind that does make it rather likely that Wayne and Debbie received a substantial sum of money in exchange for entering into the agreement.
And, by the way, I see nothing in the agreement that would prevent Debbie or Wayne from disclosing that fact if it is a fact and if they choose to do so. The stipulated judgment does not say that the parties agree not to discuss the terms of the settlement.
Wow. THERE’S proof (not that any was really needed) that DM and his auto-bots must have some serious stuff worth hiding.
OK – I believe that a LOT of money has changed hands (almost wish I could rattle a few DM-cages, would certainly help me out, as I’m currently existing on one meal per day, no TV and no social life. Dinner for me yesterday was a bowl of cereal 😦 ). BUT I can also imagine that stuff has been taking place behind the scenes – terrifying stuff – to maybe make Ms. Cook scared enough to abandon her integrity and sign this piece of toilet paper.
People always slated (and continue to slate) J. Bruce Ismay (owner of the R.M.S. Titanic) for taking a seat in a lifeboat whilst there were still women and children aboard the doomed liner – but, if I was him in that situation, where the sole choice was your life saved OR an imminent and agonizing death by freezing in the North Atlantic, I’m not completely sure that I wouldn’t have done the same.
(Actually, I KNOW that I wouldn’t – I would have happily given my life for that of a child or a pregnant/nursing mother. But that doesn’t mean that I think badly about or wish to vilify Ismay:- unless one has BEEN in such an extremity, it’s IMPOSSIBLE to gauge the decisions/choices one will make at such a time).
I don’t know what has happened with Debbie and Wayne behind the scenes – but if, like me, they were wondering from whence their next bit of good fortune might spring – and then someone offered me a seven-figure some of money just to keep quiet and out of the DM-spotlight… well – sometimes desperation/hunger/pure fear can make a person choose a path that they would not necessarily condone in a more rational, considered, state of mind.
DM WILL ultimately get his comeuppance – it is inevitable. Whether Debbie Cook/Baumgarten is actively involved in his fall is a moot point after these proceedings – but he WILL fall. And rightly so.
Mr. Rathbun – please don’t take this as a personal betrayal; it smacks far more of exasperation and a desperate desire for an unpleasant situation (probably unenvisaged by Debbie when she sent out her original email) to be over as quickly as possible.
Keep smiling and stay strong,
IEG xxx
P.S. Still no email joy from hush. Should I admit to the sender that they cannot help – or spare my blushes and keep schtum…?! xxx
IANAL, by any stretch but I do not think they could serve as “expert witness” as there is no legal compulsion in that case. Debbie could be supoenaed as a witness if she has first hand knowledge of some aspect of a case under trial but you know that Miscavige’s attorneys will make every effort to prevent that or, failing that, to severely limit her testimony.
disinfected
You need help Marty???
You know how to reach me 24/7!!
— Jackson
Any side payment must have been considerable for Debbie and Wayne to have signed it. It seems at least as restrictive as their original agreement and there is no evident consideration, which seems to support Marty’s contention of earlier today that this is just a PR issue and the hush money was delivered separately. This is a justice system?! I think LRH warned about involving oneself in what laughingly amounts to the legal system. Sheesh. It makes me wonder what someone would have to pay me not to speak my mind. One thing the S.O. taught me was how to live without money, so it is almost like apples and oranges to me. And Steve Hall knows how much I like oranges!
Marty,
I’m no legal beagle, but my observation is that it is too difficult for a single plaintiff to endure in litigation with the Co$. That brings me to the conclusion, if legally feasible, that a class action suit instituted for the benefit of any person who has been harmed either financially, physically, emotionally or spiritually by the church is in order.
Ha ha! Exactly 😀
Marty,
Since the injunction says “anyone working in concert with them” and since you and Mike helped in the case with the attorney, does this mean that you and Mike cannot say anything against COB or the corporate church?
Spelling” “…off the radar!”
That is correct. The agreement specifically contemplates that she can be subpoenaed to testify by any as yet unknown party in the future, and there is nothing they can do to prevent that. She is just required to let them know in the event she is subpoenaed.
Have I read this wrong, or does this mean we have to disconnect from Debbie in order to establish that we are not in cahoots with her when we bitch?
Sam, I read that too. It’s a bunch of legalese but what does it REALLY mean in the real world?
I get that DM can and certainly will use it to keep people squashed, BUT, he does that already by any means possible. Short of him doing the perp walk on TV, he’s gonna spin ANY outcome so his sheep continue to follow his wolf-ass!
People being raped in DM’s church need to WTFU. Keep getting sucked for millions of dollars till they go ENOUGH!
We all had to do it.
+2c
HN — Yes, I am sure you are right. Of course, the intention of this wording was to get the media to do what they did — report that no money changed hands.
I had no idea of the terms of the settlement until I read this. Can’t say anything in here is a big surprise to me, I have seen language like this in numerous documents, a lot of it is taken straight from the agreements that every SO member signs every year and then again when they leave.
For sure it would be a very cold day in hell before I signed off on a document like this, but I am not standing in Wayne and Debbie’s shoes. They have to choose to do what is pro-survival for them and that entails MANY factors.
Nothing that they do excuses King Sleazeball and his Nuts in any way. He is a disgustingly reprehensible creep who thinks that his money allows him to manipulate anyone he wants. That is his biggest nightmare — confronting people who are unimpressed and unswayed by his money. It’s what makes Marty the source of endless knicker twisting fits and much wear on his copper rods….
Come to think of it though, they were probably required to sign a side agreement keeping the payment of the money confidential and providing that if they disclosed it they would have to give it back. So if they were paid (as now seems all but certain), they will have to keep very quiet about it. It will be interesting to see if their lifestyle changes! (That is, if they don’t completely fall off the radar and disappear from public view).
I sure hope not. I already violated it about 10 times today…. 🙂
So you know, neither Marty nor I were involved in this settlement and certainly didnt sign any documents. We are not bound by anything.
George — typically a settlement of litigation involves two separate things. 1. Signing and filing the dismissal of the claims in the court and 2. Signing a settlement agreement that is NOT filed in the Court. Guarantee you there is a separate settlement agreement. And the only reason there is so much information in this dismissal document is that it also serves as a stipulated injunction.
Marty —
We now know why you & Mike (+others) were especially designated for exclusion at some point. Y’all did not sell out, y’all are not about to sell out. Y’all did not kowtow to the most over the top harassment seen in recorded history. Bad karma for those that went behind closed doors.
It is yet another symptom of what ails this planet’s populations: greed, avarice, the ability to compromise one’s personal integrity and loose one’s self respect. It does not have to be that way.
Martin — it is not uncommon for people to bargain away rights. If you worked for Coca-Cola they would insist that if you had access to their formula that you not disclose this as a term of your employment. You are giving up your right to “freedom of speech.” It is not an absolute and there are numerous examples. On the other hand, you cannot pay someone to not disclose felonies — no contract can enforce silence concerning the breaking of the law.
David Miscavige, Debbie Cook is one person and is a woman who got sick probably because of you and gave up the fight. But … we… We, Davey, are not just one person. We are many and, oh yes, there will be more and more against what you are doing. That one battle was lost does not mean anything to us!
We are getting so many resources now! Cause we are Theta coming back!
More and more “Debbies” are gonna see the Truth and more and more of US are gonna stand tall against what you represent. And people will finally know about who you really are.
10 years ago, when you GOT ME OFF POST FOR STANDING UP FOR STANDARD TECH, (the insignificant for you Translations HCOBs) I was almost alone back to Greece and being declared because I posted the truth in the Freezone.
10 years after, Davey, your ugly inner black heart has been exposed to the 2 men who were NEXT to you and were running for you, believing you would do good and carry on LRH’s work really.
Now those 2 know better, much better. And because they were never of your pack of wolves, they left you.
Now those 2 men stand on my side.
And that is not all.
Behind those 2 men who alone could take you down, because you are not even able to THRILL the people of this world, stand hundreds of Indies, Hundreds together with me IN LINE, Davey and just by TR 0 we can take you down.
You are being AS-ISed Davey, cause Theta is unmockable and your stuff, man, no matter how good you may look to thousands now is KNOWN to us and we are not a bunch of kids here. We are TELE-FINISHING you Davey… through the NET (lol), from a distance (lol), through a blog, through communication, undoing all your injustices just looking at what you are doing and have done and exposing it to the world so more can SEE.
My wife and I donated money to her. I just checked and Debbie had unbefriended me on FB. I was going to let her know how disappointed we were.
The ONLY hope we have as SCN is to follow LRHs advice on it and create more auditors, groups, missions and Orgs. Yes Orgs, but not ala Miscavige but the way postulated by LRH.
Going up the bridge handles all the charge on “Ethics”, “control”, etc. So let’s get over that part of the track and create a future. So that in that future we have local groups or missions or even Orgs in which we know we are getting what we need and want and it’s done the correct way.
That is the ONLY way I see this going. I’m done hoping the little midget goes to jail or he drowns in his tub. Because if the best that is left inside management are a bunch of cowards, there is just no point.
Move up the bridge, now that works.
I.E.G. contact me chuck@scientist.com. it sounds as though you need some help.
regards.
CR.
With this document David Miscavige has, by Court order, confirmed his withholds, now MISSED. He MUST cut communication because it is with communication that what he’s DONE will be revealed and he cannot face up to what he’s done. It is his curse, brought upon himself.
He’s also just made it clear that in the Church he usurped, LESS communication and less reach, and the fact of withheld harmful intention and acts prompted by those intentions as “solutions” is the order of the day.
This document proves behond any doubt that Dave has made the church of Scientology the LAST place that spiritual freedom can be attained and Reverse Scientology is guaranteed.
What this is is the preclear, in session, saying that in no case and in no way is he going to actually communicate his acts to the auditor and he is thus condemned to the hell, the hostilities and sufferings of life, that he himself refuses to release.
David Miscavige is a NO GAIN CASE for the exact same facts that this document demonstrates – he refuses to apply the Universal Solvent, he refuses to communicate what he’s done. He is on a withhold flow that is now re-enforced making it a Black Hole, trying to suck back light to prevent that godawful center from being known.
I think the Church of Scientology, with this Court Order, will itself be sucked down that Black Hole with Dave.
To LRH, Marty and Mike and all of those who never gave up giving to the world unconditionally.
The highest form of goodness is like water. Water knows how to benefit all things without striving with them. It stays in places loathed by all men. Therefore, it comes near the Tao.
The Tao
Let’s save the “shame on you” holier-than-thou crap.
10,000 emails to Scientologists “in good standing” with definite effect, damning testimony on record…they obviously didn’t get into this for the money or to be martyrs. As to any millions they got paid to go away and not have to suffer years of mob attorneys, well, it’s the best investment Dave’s made so far with parishioners money.
…(re: Dave’s best investment)…meaning, he never would have had to spend it if he hadn’t launched his dumb ass into the worst PR blunder ever.
How might this go?
Attorney: On this piece of paper there is a number. It is a large number. It is the only number. If you accept this number, you basically must sign WHATEVER we put in front of you to sign.
DC: WOW, that IS a big number. OK.
How else could it have gone to have this as the end result?
disinfected
In 1305 or thereabouts, William Wallace was drawn, quartered and either gutted or hanged (depending on which chronicle you read) in a public execution. Whether he actually uttered the word, “FREEDOM”, at the time of his death, I am not sure. The purpose of his “public humiliation and execution” was to send a chill through the hearts of all Scots everywhere that they could not resist Edward the 1st (Edward Longshanks) and had to bow down to him.
If you are aware of the history of the Scottish people, you know that that execution wasn’t very effective, as Robert the Bruce became King of Scotland shortly thereafter…and Edward Longhshanks died right after that…and Scotland has NEVER been overtaken from without.
Point being that Debbie, whatever her motivation was, did what she did and was publicly embarrassed and humiliated… in order to send a chill through the hearts of all who dare to challenge Miscavige. Whether this is truly her endgame or not…I hope not, for her sake. But it doesn’t change the truth…and Sam brought up a great point: if we want her testimony, we have now been told how to obtain it – LEGALLY. And onward we go…
Chiun
Marty, thank you for your stellar reporting on this matter.
Debbie openly proclaimed that she is still a Scientologist, and I presume that being so, she will want to progress on the Bridge. She can only do so in the independent field and if such an agreement was enforceable on her, she would be breaking it by aligning with any independent groups. That is how I see it.
So, I agree with you that such an agreement has no force and effect on her, and she knows it, because I do not think Debbie would sell out her openly stated beliefs for cash. That would have painted her as a money grubbing disgruntled ex executive.
I see an open road for her to participate as an independent Scientologist and I hope she decides to become one of the most influential among its ranks, if she is not already.
This is total B.S.! I see no way this could possibly hold up if appealed. The stipulations in this injunction equate to a First Amendment straight jacket and are unConstitutional. I also found the following phrase interesting: “…unless compelled to do so by law.” That tells me that Debbie and Wayne are well within their right to speak out about any crimes that they have knowledge of.
You helped someone in need. You treated them the way you would want to be treated.
You have helped me. I appreciate it.
Peter Mansell. Interesting name. His signature is a rollercoaster.
Lol I did not think so…just wanted to make sure since the document said “anyone who acted in concert with them(debbie and wayne) who receives actual notice of this judgement by personal service or otherwise”…..if you see someone wanting to put this in your hands, run the other way…..”) I would miss seeing your comments on here.
We all figure Debbie was bought out and it’s probably true. But, isn’t it possible that the dwarf had an ace up his sleeve? What if he had something on Debbie that if disclosed would be harmful to her?
It’s got to be one or the other. Either DM bought silence with money or he had something on her. There’s no telling what he might have been holding to use against Debbie. It is possible that she wasn’t bought with money. It may have been a “silence for silence” type of agreement.
It had to either be a huge amount of money or one hell of a withhold that she didn’t want disclosed in order for her to agree to disconnect from pretty much everybody including her brother and then agree to remain silent forever, and cut off from LRH tech too. Kind of like life on a desert island in the middle of Texas. Man!
Heh, that’s what exactly what I got out of this phrase, Sam: “…unless compelled to do so by law.” 🙂
And in any event you and Marty are the last two people out of the entire Earth population that King Squirrel Miscavige and Nutscateers would go after in a court of law for disclosing their secrets and crimes.
It’s the former.
It is well established law in America that one can sign away his/her rights to speech for the holy buck.
morelives,
You just jarred something for me. There is no statement in the injunction as to financial penalty assessed should they violate the injunction. IANAL, BUT, aside from the Court assessing a penalty for violating their injunction, which could be tried and dealt with on its own merits, that DM’s original contract with Debbie is now over. The judgment disposes of all claims, and no other relief is granted, meaning Dave got no joy on enforcing the original contract claims.
So, she could take the money, and at some future point, from a safe place, be there and communicate.
I dunno Debbie, but I know that when she rehabbed her own Code of Honor and wrote her email, and then stood on that witness stand, and then spoke genuinely to the world, she was bound to feel the resurgence in her own life and across her Dynamics. To compromise now, after that, well, I dunno. If she did, then God help her, there is only one way out – through, and she’s just made “through” more barriered than it was. That sort of hell ain’t worth any amount of money or MEST.
It is hard to imagine that she would burden herself with such opprobrium as would follow, including the incredible self-loathing, from such a compromise of one’s self and their integrity.
If she’s taken the low road, I for one will keep a light on the higher path for her.
Pat — I think you are being too simplistic. THere are a large number of factors that go into any decision like this. ANd many of them we will never know. You are aware of how debilitating the legal system can be. The effect that being connected to something like this can have on your life and health. Financial realities are part of it. The cost/benefit analysis is something that is different for everyone. I am neither a defender nor critic of this settlement, all I know is that I don’t know all the facts of what resulted in this outcome.
But I do know that the first engagement in the courtroom in San Antonio, the RCS got their asses kicked. And it may be a really good strategy to walk away from a fight when you have just bloodied the nose of your opponent and before they get to regroup.
T — If I see someone coming to try and serve me with this, I will gladly accept it, and then send a copy to the media with my statement about what I think about it.
To: David Miscavige
From: Jackson
As much as you know I visit and read here daily…
I also know you visit and read here daily, in fact more than I do.
It tickles me that I can inform you of the following….
I know people who know people who knows a certain someone who keeps track of your special shipments of Irish Juice. To help explain that random “odd” taste you’ve been experiencing from your last shipment.. Let me explain….
You see each case has 24 bottles and um… how do I say this…. I pissed in 13 bottles of each case!
Have a nice day you little prick!
Now, back to my splendid day and a good day to all my good friends out there!
— Jackson
I’m sure Miscavige wants to interpret it that way; but even his whoring legal counsel won’t be idiotic enough to test it. That document (and anything else they agreed to) is meaningless, and powerless, to me beyond what I noted in the post.
Love it! It’s the first investment Davey has ever made with his blood money to really serve the greatest good of all dynamics. Go Girl, go!
I’ve said it from the beginning and I’ll say it again – legal is the LEAST effective means to bring about change. The LEAST.
There’s nothing for Debbie to appeal. She and Wayne agreed to this outcome.
Thanks Jackson, I know that. But, help is the last thing I need at the moment.
And in the spirit of the Highlands, that wonderous place of cold brooks, majestic mountains, the clean air of the upper worlds, and the courage of William Wallace as an icon, timeless and true.
Ok – I said in the email that I’ve got another book recommendation based on perusing your website. That is, The Art of Racing In The Rain – a wonderful novel by Garth Stein told convincingly from the viewpoint of a dog.
Mike, you make very good points.
Thank you Mr. Rathbun, I certainly will check that one out! 😉 xx
It would seem that this injunction Applies to you too Marty, and to anyone who donated to their defense!
As persons acting in concert.
Not only Debbie and Wayne have lost their rights to expose the church’s perfidity, but many independent scientologists fall under the umbrella of this courts injuction.
This is as far ranging an injunction as the one issued in the Lisa McPhearson case that was used for years against people with almost no connection to the case.
This is very bad indeed. Amazing how twisted things have become.
😦
Mike or Marty- these articles she signed do not make her in anyway immune from adhering to a subpoena do they? I can’t imagine judicially that could be. But does it lend wiggle room or a legit argument in the courts for her to escape testifying or being deposed under subpoena?
Mike
Part of the “Agreed Final Judgement” states…
“Defendants Debra J. Baumgarten,aka Debbie Cook baumgarten, aka Debbie Cook and Wayne Baumgarten, and any of their agents, servants, employees, and THOSE PERSONS ACTING IN CONCERT with them who receive actual notice of this Agreed Final Judgement BY PERSONAL SERVICE OR OTHERWISE are permanently and forever enjoined from performing or engaging in any of the following acts:…”
The way that I read this is that it appears to open the door for David Miscavige to “serve it” on anyone who could be conceived as “acting in concert” with Debbie and Wayne in any way, and that they would then also be “gagged”.
My bet is that David Miscavige is going to serve it on various people like you or Marty, or practically anyone that could possible be considered as “acting in concert” with Debbie and Wayne.
There can not possibly be any legal precedent where one person or entity can legally, or Constitutionally, sign away the rights of another entity.
Is he really stupid enough to try this? Is he really so eager to open up that Pandora’s Box all over again? Or is it as Marty said, his way of turning up the fear factor for any other possible new “defectors” contemplating challenging his illegal “gag orders?”
Eric S
Its a court ordered injuction, not a settlement between parties. That is what is so bad about it!
Pingback: Debbie Cook’s court case settles
Sad.
Now if we had a resource based economy the midget would not be able to do as he does would he? You wonder why I advocate for it well now you see why. I predicted it would end this way. IF you got enough money you can buy your way out about everything. Once in a while that don’t happen but in this case he has enough money to buy about anything he wants to.
That is how this system works you know. Maybe a miracle will happen but somehow I doubt it. I been waiting for close to 12 years and I gave up on a church reform. It just ain’t going to happen.
You go to an RBE then that would likely end it as well as it will end wars. I figured out the tech is not going to get the job done but every day people by waking up as they are doing will do the job.
Jackson , you gave me a good laugh 🙂 rofl
(Memo to Marty or Mosie–guys Im sorry I had tried to keep it clean. As you know I am NOT A former Co$ member and have never even met one or known one, but Im sick of the cult and I hope to hell you erase this memo BUT leave my quote unchanged, regardless of how profane–because that is EXACTLY the words I said when I read she backed down—its not that i blame her, and i don’t know what life is like for her dealing with DM and the Cult, but how could she turn away when she had them on the ropes in a public forum–and she just withered and gave up any momentum the movement had gained)
Bed Man OKC
Bullshit.
“It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom – for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself.”
Declaration of Arbroath 1320.
Although disappointed about what I am reading about the outcome of recent events, I will still try and apply “What is Greatness” in regards to Debbie and her decision. We have no idea what the future may bring – I only hope that she is the fighter that I believed she would be…
Good points Mike. For me, she just lost her social card minimally.
Stick to tomato growing. Legal ain’t your forte…
I am not acting in concert with Wayne and Debbie and they have no ability to sign away any rights I may have. They can do anything they want with their rights, but they have no say in mine or anyone else’s. Even Miscavige probably isnt stupid enough to try such a silly routine as you posit. Though I have been wrong in the recent past underestimating the nuttiness that breeds inside his bubble. I would never have thought it possible he would file a lawsuit against Debbie… And look what that got him.
Ooh boy. I just saw this one and had already responded to your other post.
You DEFINITELY need to stick to the tomato growing. Spread the fertilized on the tomaters, not on the blog.
Thank you so much Chuck (if I may). You are terribly sweet and I am grateful for your concern. I wasn’t always in such a state – and I WILL come through on the other side, I’ve no doubt. But bless you again and again for your kindness. Alas, I am presently paddling up a certain Creek without a certain Paddle… 😉
I share with you, and everyone here, a page from my own blog (founded August 2006) – http://jasper-thedogsblog.blogspot.co.uk/2008/10/saturday-28-july-2007.html.
Similar, though worse, issues now surround me – but, to me, the only discernible difference is that now I have no Jasper to comfort and reassure me.
I will be alright, probably. Thank you again and again for your thoughtfulness Chuck. Bless you.
With every good wish,
IEG x
Sinar, Dang that made me laugh!! Lost her social card. HAH!! No Libs for D.
Maybe oversimplified … just three words:
PTS
Thing is Sir, I AM a lawyer, and know what “in concert” means.
So as far as this judge’s jurisdiction extends, which is Texas, persons who assisted counsel, made funds available and advised Cook on this matter, even if for free, would be subject to this injunction. Sugar Ray didn’t see this punch coming.
You get what you pay for.
+1000
I also wonder how much had to do with Wayne, he’s kind of been the silent party in this whole thing. His entire family and children are all in the CoS. He also didn’t seem to be to happy about being out of the CoS. I wondered how much he was on board with the whole NYE email in the first place.
The stress of this could not have been easy on their already a bit rocky relationship. After this settlement I have a feeling a divorce will soon be in the offing — there’s not going to be any happy warm glow of accomplishment in the wake of this. Both are going to be miserable, together or apart.
You know Sacra that if you take aluminum wrap and shape it into a cone helmet, you can “foil” the attempts of Dave to infiltrate your thoughts, and then he can’t prove that you are in concert. It also foils the Dick Police. There you can be, in the privacy of your own space, naked, with the Tin Foil Hat on and Do What Thou Wilt.
Mike, can I just clarify – you are saying that you are sure (as much as you can be) that Miscavige paid Debbie and Wayne MORE money on top of the $50K each they already received?
How much would we be talking about here – $50K, $100K?
I’m hoping that financial considerations weren’t the deciding factor here, but…
Ax
Though this is quite a blow, I have to keep in mind what Thoughtful (Steve) said about the battle for truth being won. What was said in court is there and cannot be taken away.
Those who question their own personal security for telling or pursuing the truth need to ask themselves a question. Are they seeking freedom or entrapment? For surely, this injunction is confirmation that the church only seeks to entrap and by caving in to this threat they forfeit their quest for freedom.
Having left the matrix (RCS), I will never go back.
Masterful alter is! I have NO idea how you came to that conclusion!
Just an after-thought…In order to get that side money Debbie may have had to turn over her list of all who contributed to her defense fund. It’s just like POB to demand something like that before forking-out good money to silence her. An SP would want a list of his potential enemies! He’s that paranoid!
SacraTomato,
When I click on your name, it takes me to the Church of Scientology website. Are you a spokesman for the church?
I, like many other people am rather disappointed by this. I was hoping to see more revelations about that Nasty Little Tyrant come out in open court and even perhaps his Nastiness hisself dragged into the witness stand and have to answer some very awkward questions.
But, of course, I would be viewing all this from a safe distance and I haven’t had to endure what Debbie and Wayne have had to go through and I don’t have to live with the threat of this monstrous law suit hanging over me. I can imagine that it would be a traumatic experience for most people (but obviously not me as I’d just lurv all the media attention 😉 ).
So, I can’t really blame Debbie and Wayne for taking the easy way out when it was offered. Treachery? Well, I’m not in a position to say, but I’d imagine that there are a number of people who feel very let down.
Then again, if I was totally certain of the workability of the Tech and believed that it WAS the only route out AND I had witnessed all the abuses perpetrated by L’il Davy and I knew that he was hell-bent on destroying the repute and workability of the thing that I cared about more than anything else in the whole Universe – well, then I don’t think that anything would make me shut up and stop doing everything I could to expose what was really happening and try to prevent the destruction of my church.
Rather makes a mockery of KSW1 and all the stuff you swear to in the Sea Org.
Ax
This is so insane. The $CI gave nothing? not giving her at least “good standing”? canceling the SP declare? just another agreement??? The point is She must have been blackmailed for S/g She did and could be exposed. She did not have the right to betray everybody. Every one is so sympatetic and “understanding” . I was crying all day i have to say I KNOW freedom DEMAND SECREFICE, History gives us so many Heros . Debbie could be one and all her past cooperatin with DM would be forgiven. now the group have to decide and do s/g fast before this will become a 3D engram. If so nobody will come to help the next guy who will go the same path or he should sign an agreement to never get blode $ for silence.
MR. Marthi Thanks for being here.
ARC Joel
Moxon is that you?
You know everyone here sees you for what you are…. 🙂 Don’t look now, but your email address is at a church sponsored website.
are you sure you are a lawyer and not OSA?
Even if there was a huge amount of money paid, what person would sign such an agreement under any circumstances.
She has made a deal with the Devil. There is no justification for it whatsoever. Shame on them.
Thank goodness there are people out here with real personal integrity.
Now you are making me laugh,,,not subtle at all, are you?
Even if it was huge amount of money, what person would give up their personal integrity and sign such a document? This time they were out and not under total control by DM.
Fool me once shame on you! Fool me twice shame on me!!
Well shame on them. They made another deal with the devil.
Good catch Mike.
Marty & Co,
The thing is we have lost a battle (sadly)… the war will be won by US!! I would gladly donate again to the next ‘Debbie Cook cause” who spreads truth about DM and his cult.
Truth, in the end, will always prevail!
*like*
🙂
Moot point. Debbie is the one doing the disconnecting already.
Could be an OSA lawyer… Moxon?
Debbie’s motivation is the question, isn’t it? It seems rather cynical of her to proclaim the goodness of LRH and Scientology and then take hush money and agree to something which (as far as I can tell) cuts her off from the Bridge or any association with other Scientologists the rest of this lifetime.
Doubtless there are things we don’t know, and some of those things will come to light over time. But this is how it looks to me based on what we know.
Simple
Marty — now that I think about it, seems to me that the CHURCH is violating their agreement… Now, they ARE bound by the agreement. Commenting on the terms of the settlement and disparaging Ray Jeffrey I would guess is a breach. Pot. Kettle. Black Mr Tomater.
IEG – “I have no Jasper to comfort and reassure me.” Yes, and our deepest regrets for your loss. We, however, are here to comfort and reassure you. Not as a replacement for Jasper but as friends. L, Rachel
Like.
Right. Her website is down “for maintenance.” Her FB page is gone. But her MySpace account is still up at http://www.myspace.com/524603413
LOL
I have been thinking about that, too. Especially since every single PTS-handling I have seen so far within the CofS was using only half of the definition of suppression and so has a potential to miss charge. The TWO ways to suppress are found in Supplement No. 1 to Science of Survival, September 1951:
“Any of the dynamics may be suppressed in two ways. The first is the suppression which says “No!” A person who has been told since he was a child that he was worth nothing, that he was no good and that he would never be able to do anything is likely to have little or no First Dynamic. The First Dynamic changes polarity and starts pointing toward death. This person is capable of committing suicide, unless he is very strong on the Third Dynamic and can live for the group. He may, however, needlessly sacrifice his life for the group. This represents a suppression of the dynamic—the survival urge of the First Dynamic is not sublimated over into the Third; the Third is only more visible because the First has been suppressed toward death.
The second way of suppressing a dynamic is by enforcement: “You’ve got to be a good girl! You have to amount to something! We expect you to be a credit to your family!” After a few years of such commanding the girl who has been forced to be a great credit to her family is unable to do anything. She has been interfered with. Mama has entered her own dynamics into the dynamics of the child, with the resultant blunting of the child’s dynamics. If any dynamic is inhibited, it enturbulates, and if it is enforced, it enturbulates. Either way, it is pushed toward death.
The principle of self-determinism, to be workable, dictates that a dynamic should neither be suppressed nor too thoroughly enforced. On a spectrum from shut off completely to center to maximum enforcement, self-determinism would be found at the center. The individual who is surviving best is exercising all possible rational selfdeterminism in an environment which allows a maximum of self-determinism.” (SUPPLEMENT NO. 1 to SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, September, 1951, All possible Aberrations, Tech Vol 1, p. 220ff)
Thinking of the enforcement-type of suppression, many things become visible. Enforced giving, receiving, doing, being etc. And when through with looking at the restimulative effects found on Flow 1 you still have the other Flows. Just looking at her post this second one looks like a rich pasture, certainly not touched in CofS PTS-handlings.
Marty, it’s possible that you don’t have a complete picture of the leverage Debbie had on DM. It’s possible I don’t either, but give me a call. It has to do with the mystery of why DM took an interest in Lisa at all.
I think there is a tremendously too frequent falling back on “PTS” as an answer in Scientologist circles. It presumes a person is not the master of his own destiny – the opposite recognition of which Scientology, sanely practiced, is most qualified to deliver. In this particular case, I outright reject it as a why.
I am adamant that no one disconnects from me without my agreement. They may THINK they have, but baby, the connection is still in good working order.
What a joke. Work it out backwards. End product: Debbie and Wayne sign a document that supposedely stops anyone who is served with it from communicating about DM. Forget about namby pamby justifications on their behalf. These two low life set you all up for a fall. Look at it – even when SHE posted here SHE didnt answer one communication or acknowledgement 1.1. She was in ENEMY throughout no matter what GOOD. Solution: Create Create Create.
Jackson.
I do love you!
ROTFLMAO!!!!!
Marty,
Miscavige was always going to spin the final outcome in the best possible light for him and the gullible, the members of I-don’t-want-to-be-responsible-for-Scientology brigade were always going to swallow his spin wholesale. Nothing has changed there. And Miscavige still captains his sunken ship, pretending to one and all it is sailing the mighty seas when its really a hundred fathoms down, No change there either.
But what has changed is the fact that a big slice of truth is in the public record, it can’t be erased and this this court document does not change that. And the more truth that comes out the greater chance that people caught in Miscavige’s nightmare will see it and act.
You, MIke and all those that helped did a damn fine job The truth coming out is the only chance Scientology has as long as we Indies, collectively, don’t waste the opportunity and the time and space it creates.
1) How much money was spent?
2) What was Mr. Jeffrey’s evaluation of the scene (i.e. how much more)?
3) Perhaps Ms. Cook felt badly about accepting even more money?
Conclusion-jumpy people are working on reactive mind. Would you feel like donating more and more and more through 2022? Maybe the Co$ will be gone by 2014 – and all additional $100k’s moot? Imagine it’s you – how do you call it?
There is another PR-twist in it: Debbie had in fact said, do what LRH said, don’t follow squirrel activities, Keep Scientology Working! It is not her right to speech in general that she has waived, she has waived her right (duty) to say “Keep Scientology Working!”
How is that for an outpoint? A Church of Scientology that forbids a member to say “Do not squirrel, follow the rules of Scientology”.
But even if she doesn’t say that anymore, others will.
Hey Tomato:
What’s the difference between a dead lawyer on a street and a dead dog on the street?
There are skid marks in front of the dog. 😀
hahaha!
Can’t believe they bought the
http://associationofprofessionalindependentscientologists.com/
domain.
Seconded.
Two things were absent from this sleazy document. Very absent.
1. Any “under oath” denial of the facts presented by Debbie in court.
2. Any “under oath” denial or rebuttal of her initial New Years letter.
I find this very telling. I just can’t imagine miscavige letting those two omissions go unless he was desperate to end this thing.
I also want to point out something. There are over seven billion people on this planet who could use our help. miscavige has a few thousand clapping seals remaining in his cult. Even though the fish smell rotten, they are imlanted well enough to plug their noses as they eat the crap they are served.
The general population can tell the difference between a dead rat and quality sushi.
The exodus of people leaving dave’s den is most certainly a bigger flow than anything currently walking in his door. No amount of PR bull is going to alter this flow. The folks coming out now have many different locations and auditors to select from. They are finding us and are winning again.
More than half of the folks on our lines are people new to the subject. They like it. They are having wins. They differentiate quite well between dave’s cult and the value of the tech. We’re doing fine and will continue to do so, not because we’re advetizing much, or bragging about our glorious accomplishments, but because we simply deliver the tech to the best of our ability with a clean heart and clean hands. People find us.
Constant vigilance is needed and a willingness to fight back aginst abuses is needed, but what’s really needed is a few dozen or a couple hundred more of you able-bodied thetans to open shop and put up a shingle…even if it’s only to deliver a comm course a few nights a week.
The solution to everything is people having the courage to deliver the tech and letting others know it’s available.
Just sayin.
Les
Is that what you were trying to accomplish? You were trying to silence the Indies – not Debbie Cook…
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!
What a MORON you are.
Hey Davey – awesome legal team. This one is going to finish us off for sure! Think I’m going to die laughing!
Oh dear! I was rather confused when I first saw this ‘agreement’ as I couldn’t see what on earth you would have to gain from it – but now I get what it is you were trying to do.
Thanks for explaining it tomato. And thanks for the laugh – I thoroughly enjoyed that!
Ironic that the first quote in her MySpace is “A man is as dead as he can’t communicate. He is as alive as he can communicate.” – LRH – Dianetics 55!
It speaks volumes about what she just did.
This is one of the most perfect comments I have read about this whole affair. 🙂
Hardly Catherine.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Injunction
This is not a settlement between parties anymore, it is a order of the court and applies to Marty and in theory anyone else who acted in concert with Ms. Cook.
Marty documented his acts in concert here on this blog!
It puts the Kibosh on many activities.
Google “Scientology Clearwater Injunction” for a better understanding. Marty is very familiar with this.
Seems like Texas is not the place for him to be if he wants to continue his mission.
Mike
About “acting in concert with…
Here is a legal definition…
act in concert: verb: act jointly, agree, be in collusion with, collude, combine, concur, connive, conspire, cooperate, federate, form a coalition, involve, join, participate, pool, unite
See also: agree, associate, concur, connive, conspire, cooperate, federalize, federate, involve, join, participate, unite
Burton’s Legal Thesaurus, 4E. Copyright © 2007 by William C. Burton. Used with permission of The McGraw-Hill Companies, Inc.
—–
One of devious intentions and little intelligence may try to drive a “General Sherman Tank” through that definition. You can bet that that specific phrase is no accident in the agreement. It will surely have been included for its value to intimidate and suppress communication as far and as wide as possible.
Hell, in a pinch, my limited involvement could be interpreted as “acting in concert with” Debbie Cook. And in spite of what has come of it, it is a point of pride for me to have done so. Progress has been made.
One “abuse of process” perpetrated by David Miscavige, via his legal council, appears to be to “legitimize” this gag order through the misuse of a court’s authority, or assumed authority. I actually wonder if the judge involved even actually read the document. He may have been acting simply as a witness to the signing of the document, and in no way is legally authorizing its content or its legality. That is my best guess. I am actually stunned that Debbie’s attorney, Ray Jeffrey, put his name to it. I can only assume that there must be a lot more going on behind the scenes that has not come to light yet. Perhaps it never will.
The apparency that seems to have been envisioned and achieved here is that it is a court ordered or originated document, and fully legal in its content and its intent. I think not.
You know David Miscavige far better that I do (since I’ve never even met the man) But one thing he has made clear to me over the last couple of years is that his idiocy appears to know no bounds.
Eric S
“I have to take some time to evaluate this treachery.”
I bet, Marty! This thing is one huge out-point!
But I’m sure we’ll figure it out, sooner or later.
+100
Heavens no! Just an interested bystander, commenting with his own opinions.
Mr Jeffrey should be checking his malpractice policy about now. Ms Cook may feel betrayed. Or badly advised.
I believe that what is happening is what Steve Hall described a few posts ago:
“Looking back to spot the cause of the affluence, I was astonished that all my wins were rooted in the period when I thought everything was “going wrong.” That was actually things going right — the physical universe was just reshuffling so my postulates could come about.”
Things don’t happen as fast as we would like them to here in the good old physical universe. (But would we really want them to? Think of all the experiences we would miss out on.) I believe Steve put it exactly right: The physical universe is just reshuffling so the postulates could come about. There is a dance going on that we are all a part of. The results we are all looking for will come about, possibly as a result of something we haven’t even considered as yet and probably very quickly, when it does happen. Then we can all move on to another game.
We don’t know the amount of “fair game” that was directed on Debbie, to “encourage” her to agree to a settlement. This additional factor – besides of an army of Greenbacks – should not be underestimated.
Just in case a reader of this blog has forgotten it : “Fair Game” is standardly applied to all who stand up to Co$ tyranny.
+10
Muzzled truth is muzzled truth.
Never desert a group to which you owe your support seems to apply here. Whatever legal beagle mumbo jumbo bs exists around this and any other cycle to do with the RCS, one thing is for sure – there’s a heap of dudes out there with mega hang up at Doubt issues on what Scientology actually is and does.
The Church has no theta, absolute zero theta is being approached on that line. Time to call a spade a spade and go dig the garden someplace else.
Time to flourish & prosper, that is one thing that really pisses off the likes of dm big time.
Time to reassess what the PT workable dichotomy to sympathy actually is…
Lynne
They are quite capable of making up all manner of insane gibberish, doesn’t mean that you have to respond in any fashion but by your own choice.
Eric S
Propitiation, appeasing an SP and choosing to stay at effect of his suppression forever more. That ought to clear it up. Oh hang on…
My comment on the injunction, nothing in this universe can be manufactured that cannot be taken apart.
Amen brother Jim! Preach on because you are spot on.
The likely possibility that the she got bought off doesn’t surprise me. Perhaps she should be renamed “Debbie Crook” as when she was in the cult she specialised in confidence tricking public and coercing staff to extract money from thousands of duped people. She made large bonuses as a result and did not care what the consequences were for her victims. She also was involved in many numerous IAS crush reg cycles. She was also involved in abusing people in the Hole right up until the point she herself became an inmate. She was a sell-out and has now committed herself as a sell-out for the rest of her life.
Many readers of this blog feel disappointed or even betrayed by Debbie.
But I assume that Miscavige has designed his legal steps and his PR about his “victory” in the exact way to make us feel disappointed and betrayed.
I have a gut feeling that he was not satisfied with gagging Debbie, but wanted to teach us a “lesson” for daring to come to Debbie’s assistance.
My questions : do we want to learn his “lesson” ? Do we want to accept that it is disappointing and utterly hopeless to help someone haunted by Miscavige’s “church” ?
Mike and Windwalker,
Duh. I had just finished writing up what Windwalker brought up when I decided to read the other posts before posting it and then read what Windwalker had already posted and Mike’s response. Anyhow, here’s my question: Mike, even though they wouldn’t win because one party cannot give up another party’s rights, isn’t it possible that Miscavige could use this document as an excuse to legally harass numerous supporters of Debbie’s original email in numerous jurisdictions simultaneously,making it necessary for us to obtain counsel to defend ourselves?
Mike, thanks for taking the trouble to clarify – but I’m really none the wiser.
Let’s say I got bitten by a dog and suffer lifelong wounds. I sue the dog owner and he makes a settlement that includes an injunction or gag order that says I can never talk about the incident, NOR the scars I have as a result. I can’t talk to friends of his about anything at all, least of all dogs.
On the other hand I have the right to free speech and “God given rights”. When some one asks me “How did you get those scars?” am I legally and constitutionally bound to LIE? Something doesn’t add up here. If Debbie says she witnessed a DM cronie was ordered to break her finger, as she did, and that is simply a matter of FACT, what possible consequence could there be from saying so?
SacraTomato – Where the heck did you conjure that up from?? That is the most ridiculous thing I’ve seen on this blog. Are an OSA plant trying to scare people? If you’re not then my apologies. But you are certainly posting like one.
Marty if you want to not post this because I am possibly insulting him that’s ok. But for christ sake enough
David Miscaviage,
None of this changes your life:
There’s one more drag left on your cigarette
There’s one more swallow in your glass
You’re livin’ life like dirty money
Each day longer than the last
OMG Mike I just posted something about his guy being a plant and I’m thinking s*** maybe even Moxon or Kobrin. Then I saw this. Great catch as Marty said.
Transporter – Good point but as pissed as I am i would still like to believe that she would never agree to stoop that low.
We know what Debbie believes and so do thousands of Scientologists -through her email. She then went to battle and exposed some of the crimes of David Miscavige. All of this was a huge push forward for Scientology. A very good upstat for her and Wayne. I am not sure what to make of this turn of events yet. Too many unanswered questions. One thought I had was how horrible it is for her – money or no money. She doesn’t have terminals in the Church or us. Makes me sad. Will she go under the radar like so many of us? I hope Marty or Mike gets a comm from her. Somehow this outcome doesn’t fit with her other communications. I’ve decided not to go out of ARC at this point.
And as Steve reminded us, there is no such thing as failure. Let’s keep our eyes on the mountain. I’m glad the Indies were there for her. Some of you in a very big way. That was only a Plus Point.
Well said Karen.
Official Scientology deserves all the bad publicity it gets for this irreligious behavior.
One pluspoint of splinter Scientology groups is they don’t go all legal and strong arm on their members, I don’t think!
I tell people who call the 866-XSEAORG line, that one of the downsides to official Scientology is just this Debbie Cook legal gagging!
If a person wants just the “tech” (auditing and OT levels), then do the independent Scientology “route”!
Independent Scientology won’t be making people sign these types of gag agreements!
Understood. Just trying to fill the omitted data. Didn’t think of it as the Why for her, just as a possible factor.
I have seen people change and smile for days when they understood both sides of the definition, when before they had accepted, exerted or tolerated suppression as “good”, “beneficial” or “necessary” action. Also, overts became visible and blew.
It looks to me that Debbie has had a postulate or position carefully considered that she had found to be right, had acted upon it and has now given in to act in a way she found wrong before (to be silent). This looks like she has met a point of weakness, of inability or unwillingness to hold this position. She was facing suppression before she changed her position. What made her change is an omitted datum.
You have certainly more data about that particular case than I do so I trust you are right.
Espiritu: No, not possible. Dopn’t worry about it.
Mmmmm……… Mabye a real pro documentary feature film. Technology has put amazing power in the common man.
Facebook helped coordinate the taking down of Egypt.
With a few thousand dollars worth of equipment and some good editing. And more importantly, with believable and credible Independents being interviewed with inactment. It could the blasted into cyberspace and go viral.
Students and Facebook took down Egypt for good or ill. But they did it.
Cell phones (texting) kept communication flowing.
Apple’s Final Cut Pro is only (their flagship editing app that edits major feature films and TV) $300.00
Documentary anyone?
Thank you so much. You’re lovely. xxx
Martin — Don’t know how to make it clearer. If you agree to forgo a right and contract to do so, provided you weren’t coerced and were represented by counsel and received adequate consideration, if you then violate what you bargained not to do, you are in violation of the agreement and the aggrieved party has a right to get a remedy. You can agree to forgo any rights.
If this was a “lesson” for anyone daring to come to Debbie’s assistance, it was an utter fail.
Regardless of what anyone feels about Debbie herself and her choices, the fact is that the hands extended to her by so many resulted in Miscavige getting his butt kicked into next week. Think of what would have happened had the assistance NOT been forthcoming.
The RCS would have gotten a Preliminary Injunction and it would have been converted into a Temprorary Injunction through trial. The terms of that injunction would have been those of the original agreement she signed. Miscavige would not have been exposed in court and in the media. Debbie would have had NO bargaining position but would have had the agreement she had signecd without benefit of counsel enforced by a court of law. They would have had damaged assessed against them for being in breach. And Miscavige would have been crowing from the rooftops about how he “squashed her like a bug.”
NOte well the omitted crowing…. (and believe me, if he HAD won it would not only have been a press release it would also feature prominently in the June 6 junket — anyone want to take bets that if this is mentioned during june 6 by anyone they will be routed to ethics to buy another 20 sets of the “Legacy Package”)
One person said, “Well they can just choose to violate the agreement every so often, and go through another court case filed by COSFSO against them, and get their moment on the stand to make more damaging info public!”
A variation of this would be if they wait until they are 85 years old, and no way do they give a hoot about being sued, and then unload on their “deathbeds!”
Another thought, maybe every so often, spontaneously, ex official Scientologists who have been similarly legally gagged, hold a TV press conference, and en masse on camera violate their agreements!
Make a circus out of violating their agreements!
And maybe make it a religious ritual of being baptized as a genuine independent Scientologist! One who is spiritual free of the irreligious legal gagging rituals of “official Scientoogy!”
And as we move forward into the future, our movement gets stronger and expands. Just received an email from another new Independent Scientologist who is working on mastering the computer. For now I will post for him. He got into Scientology in the early 70’s.
His thoughts:
”THE INDEPENDENT FIELD IS THE NATURAL EVOLUTION OF SCIENTOLOGY RESEARCH AND DISCOVERY AS IT BRANCHES OUT INTO THE CULTURE AT LARGE AND THIS WAS ALWAYS THE DREAM OF THE CAPTAIN THE SKIPPER, THE FOUNDER, THE COMMODORE WHO(BY THE WAY IS STILL IN COMMAND OF THIS BOAT)
NOW YOU GOOD FOLKS OUT THERE HAVE ALWAYS KNOWN THIS!
WE KNOW DAMN WELL FROM BITTER EXPERIENCE THAT ALL RELIGIONS DESCEND DOWN INTO SOLIDITY
INSTEAD OF UP INTO THE LIGHTNESS OF THE WIND.
NOW IT’S UP TO YOU TO GET A HANDLE ON THIS..
THE COMMODORE WAS BRILLIANT IN THAT HE PROVIDED ( sound ethical business…excellent science…and the
recognition of marvellous art!) THE BETRAYAL OF THESE THREE ARE THE DESTROYERS OF EMPIRES PAST AND FOOLISH EMPIRES TO COME. THERE IS NO EVIDENCE AT LARGE INDICATING THAT CURRENT INT. MANAGEMENT PRACTICES ANY OF THESE VIRTUES. CURRENT INT. MANAGEMENT ARE GUILTY OF DRAGGING TWENTYFIVE HUNDRED YEARS OF MALEVOLANT UNWORKABLE MYSTICISM INTO THE
EXCELLENT SCIENCE OF DR. L.RON.HUBBARD.
ANYBODY KNOW WHERE L.R.H. WROTE; BUILD UP A GATE A TEMPLE OR A HIGH PLACE TO KEEP YOUR WISDOM PRISONER??
I DID NOT THINK SO HOWEVER THE IVORY TOWER OF MISCAVIGES BREED OF ‘SCIENTOLOGY’ IS EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE RATS BOARD THE SHIP AFTER THE SKIPPER LEAVES TO RESCUE HIS FLEET.
THE SKIPPER IS MY FRIEND AND THAT DULL THUD IN THE NIGHT IS YOUR (Miscavige & accomplices) WORTHLESS HONOR SCURRYING FOR A CAVE:
Largo Paris 69
…those who see,
Agreed, there is no such thing as failure. A year ago she was silent in San Antonio. Her email has communicated truth and this can not be withdrawn. Her testimony has exposed to public scrutiny the ugly side of evil. For any who think she just rolled over I think a pan determined view on this will show mostly plus points. She impinged with her actions and survived. A long drawn out legal battle is not a win. Time magazine spent about 10 million and “won” the court case but it almost cost them everything.
As Marty noted – legal is the least effective means. When the outcome in a court can be bought with time, money, or sheer devastation of any life outside of the court room there is no win. The truth, communication of the truth, is the ultimate win. We control our thoughts and our communication. The more who duplicate the less who prop up any opposition.
A reminder – In the 8th American ACC, The Power of Consideration, lecture called “Factors Present in Good and Bad Auditing”, LRH says:
“All right. ARC is the most powerful stuff on Earth—of course, it’s life. People would have you believe that bullets and bombs are powerful, they’re not powerful at all. The most powerful thing there is, is ARC. You can just swamp anything with it.”
Yes, lets keep our eye on the mountain – we have our future in mind and not keep attention stuck on the past. I say all should continue moving on up a little higher. Just my 2cents.
Hello Mr. CofS,
So, you are a lawyer, and one gets what one is paid for (now there’s some cutting insight), and you work with David Miscavige.
OK. That’s pretty clear.
And in your very learned opinion you figure that an injunction for Debbie Cook applies to me?
Well, let’s see. David Miscavige, the Pope on a Box (an applebox) of his very own SP Group, RTC, extending its suppressive fingers down the lines to encompass every Church of Scientology, applying Reverse Scientology to gullible marks, and using the bait and switch and “passing off”, in advertisements and mail, is in Treason on the Dynamics. You are a minion, minimally. A dupe.
Umm, there. Can I expect the Sheriff anytime soon? Perhaps a letter from Mr. Moxon? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?
I donated money. I aided, “in concert” in her affirmative defense. I am all yours, weiner face.
SacaSh*t,
Get what you pay for indeed.
Hey Mike,
What if the independent Scientologists work out a religious ritual, which includes a ceremony that frees a person from their “legal” agreements, would a religious ritual hold up in court when official Scientology came suing?
Is there room for a US Constitutional protection for independent Scientologists who work out a religious ritual/ceremony of religious nature, that bucks right into the face of the official Scientology’s legalistic and irreligious tactics?
Because I believe that OSA and the legalistic gags that Jeannie Gavigan Reynolds who is the OSA staffer who does most of the grunt writing for these legal gags, and then the paid lawyers add their input, correct; this is all OSA driven, and thus it comes from Hubbard’s old GO writings which are today OSA scriptures, “adpoted as official church policy” is what is on the bylines at the bottom of the OSA Network Orders from what I recall.
Because what Martin’s arguing is that LRH said the Code point about only God being the one to set aside a Scientologist’s right to freedom of communication. LRH was really elevating communication to a very senior religious principle, and while I know that LRH likely meant that Code point to allow Scientologists to cease communicating with “SPs”, but that Code point also has the meaning Martin is understanding of it.
To me, Martin’s actually sort of arguing that this is a religious right, and this is an interesting discussion, one that couldn’t be had inside the halls of any Scientology office building I ever walked around inside.
I believe one of the harsh critics brought up that independent Scientologists DO have religious rights, and might have some solid defense points.
OSA is acting legalistically, rather than religiously, and maybe someday a better opportunity will arise to challenge official Scientology’s irreligious actions as violating the Scientology religion, and that even an independent Scientologist’s religious rights are being improperly invaded by official Scientology’s irreligious tactics. (And minimally, this will make OSA NOT religious, and maybe force OSA to be jettisoned OUT of the HGB or something, someday!)
+1,000,000…. is this how you agree and indicate it in a big way?? (See what happens when you don’t know)?
Oh when we when don’t understand something or don’t know the real answer, we let our wondering and worrying take over and even maybe make stuff up…..
Mike you have explained this on a very good understandable macro basis which is real world!
Thanks
And you can document the harrasment as well. I think all Independents should be issued stylish head cameras to capture misguided souls live when they harrass. Just joking……. a little.
Head gear for everyone!!!!!!!!!
Kids, don’t be caught being harrased without your head gear. How many times do I have to tell you those Corporate Scientologists are crazy!
All that needs to be done is make a media event of the harrasment. Like marty did with squirrel busters. And make it into a pro feature film.
I have no doubt that you’d get many on board, even famous people.
This madness has been allowed to exist because it has remained hidden, unbelievable, far fetched.
Make a media event. Marty, if you are getting thousands of hits a day………………. just imagine.
I’ve had a chance to stew on this since my earlier post and I’ve come to a conclusion.
Let’s give the Baumgartens a break: This was ultimately a ‘broke versus a billion’ situation. Never-the-less, a blow was delivered that the little psycho black pope will NEVER recover from.
I hope Debbie and Wayne enjoy a retirement with maybe a million, two or three. That’s the price. I truly understand, i.e., anything to get away from one of the most destructive and vicious sociopaths to come along in at least a millennium: David Miscavige.
Just consider for a moment what this unRon has done as an historical usurper of sanity.
There’s one alternative I’ve found: I’m number 324 on the list as of today of the INDIE 500.
I’ll go up against this turd ball any time he wants. However, that’s not going to happen because POB is a world-class coward and ‘ninny’.
For the record let me state, Fuck you, miss miscavige, and the horse you rode in on. You’re your own executioner. Let the games begin.
Keen insight, Mike Rinder, thank you.
Freedom Fighter
The phrase… “…unless compelled to do so by law.” states precisely that this gag order applies right up to the point where some legal agent demands Debbie or Wayne to give evidence, and then the Church has demanded of Debbie and Wayne that they be informed within three days. The sole purpose for this is to allow the Church to “get to ” the authority that issued the subpoena and ultimately alter the outcome to be in their favor.
If you take this agreement to it’s ultimate insanity, it would mean that some Scientologist could theoretically walk right into Debbie and Wayne’s living-room and tear the head off a baby, and Debbie and Wayne have agreed to not say a word to anybody unless they are “compelled to do so by law”. Luckily this goes against the law all by itself, because one can be held accountable for any crime that they knew of and did not report. So there you find Debbie and Wayne… trembling (though I hope not) “between a rock and a hard place.”
But… since “the law” supersedes any agreement, then basically that means that Debbie and Wayne can freely, (and must by law) disclose any illegality that they are aware of that has been perpetrated by the Church or anyone on its behalf.
This piece of nonsense is so full of holes that it simply begs to be challenged.
But as Marty and others have already expressed, do not count on the law to handle this. In fact, the “law” seems to be more of a hindrance than a benefit when it can be bought or manipulated by suppressives to do their bidding.
We have the tech to handle David Miscavige and the abomination that he has created, and the application of that tech is getting results.
When enough good people boldly stand up and say NO! to David Miscavige, his regime will end.
Eric S
And interviews with a stellar cast
Right on, Les.
Debbie got scared. Too much responsibility involved in toppling DM for her. Someone else will have the immense pleasure of doing so. Only help when you feel you truly can… – Code of a Scientologist.
Copper rods!! LOL It’s hard not to get a mental image picture of DM, wearing his tuxedo, like at the events, holding copper rods….
DM, as he reads this just HATES the mention of the copper rods I bet….cuz it’s not good PR. LOL Kinda makes him look like the wacko that he is.
Debbie and Wayne have their own dynamics and they did make a huge blow to the church with her video testimony on record. This is HUGE and permanent.
She may feel like she did what she needed to do and she wants to get back to her life. It’s her decision and I understand. There is her health and so many other things that play into making her decision.
Paul
I KNOW your intention was in the right place. May I offer some wisdom from Napolean Hill. It has served me well.
NAPOLEON HILL
Principle 13: Learn from Adversity and Defeat
Your Attitude Toward Defeat
Throughout this book I’ve reminded you to look for the seed of an equivalent benefit in every defeat you
experience. This isn’t always easy when you’ve suffered a setback, but it is an important part of the science of
personal achievement. The time to begin mastering this skill is now, instead of while you’re licking your wounds.
Failure and pain are one language through which nature speaks to every living creature, pointing out mistakes.
Animals may become timid so that they avoid a threatening situation when it arises again; you must become
humble so that you can acquire wisdom and understanding. Realize that the turning point at which you begin to
attain success is usually defined by some form of defeat or failure. With this realization, you need not accept
defeat as failure but only as a temporary event that may prove to be a blessing in disguise.
Everyone Faces Defeat
No one who has attained success has not met with some form of failure comparable with the scope of his or her
success. Edison “failed” with more than ten thousand different attempts to create a light bulb before he hit on the
formula that worked. Jonas Salk tried countless different media to cultivate the polio virus for a vaccine before he
discovered that monkey brain tissue did the job. Debbie Fields founded the high-profile Mrs. Fields Cookies chain
with a single store and expanded it worldwide very quickly. Too quickly, in fact. The costs of expansion crippled the
company, and Fields found herself deeply in debt. She learned that trying to own and run all the stores was simply
too much. Now she franchises operations instead of running them herself, and the company is profitable and
growing once more. Defeat should be accepted merely as a test which permits you to discover the nature of your
thoughts and their relation to your definite major purpose. Knowing this modifies your reaction to adversity and
keeps you striving toward your goal. Defeat is never the same as failure unless and until it has been accepted as
such.
Emerson said:
Our strength grows out of our weakness. Not until we are pricked and stung and sorely shot at, awakens the
indignation which arms itself with secret forces. A great man is always willing to be little. While he sits on the
cushion of advantages he goes to sleep. When he is pushed, tormented, defeated, he has a chance to learn
something; he has been put on his wits; on his manhood; he has gained facts; learned from his ignorance; been
cured of the insanity of conceit; has got moderation and real skill. Defeat, however, does not promise the fullblown flower of benefit, only the seed from which some benefit may be coaxed. You must recognize the seed,
nurture, and cultivate it by definiteness of purpose; otherwise it will never sprout.
LOVE IT!
Marty,
By the way, Mary Beth and I agree that any refund from the legal funds that we provided toward the Cook thing is to go to you with the intention to help defray that stuff associated with your costs Let me state: F&%k POB!
Never-the-less, onward and upward!
To me Debbie became a “broken piece” and then gave the apparency of becoming a real player, but decided to remain a “broken piece” Phooey!
Had a lot of thoughts on this. Not knowing what went down one can only speculate.
Marty’s prediction that some sort of private settlement must have ensued seems to be the most logical possibility. If Debbie and Wayne, for the second time, signed away their rights, not only are they disconnected from existing Scientology members (as they are declared), but now anyone in the independent field as well. With the harm already done to their own business and many prior customers having cancelled their business with Debbie, there is not much hope for any quality life for the future. Their own legal fees must have amounted to a fairly substantial amount, hence it seems utterly impossible that they would agree to something like this without some sort of monetary compensation.
The rightness or wrongness of this is for them to judge as I don’t have any information about all the factors involved to judge myself, though many thoughts went through my head, as with most others on this blog.
I do think it is important though to consider all the effects that have been created since the initial New Years email. From the history of legal cases I will tend to agree with Marty that legal is not an approach which brings about any amount of positive change. But the effects in the media and on public at large will have ripple effects for a long time to come.
Maybe this injunction will help silence a few others who are now thinking twice, as no doubt intended, but, the backlash will be the ever growing doubt and fear among the Church’s existing diminishing membership as this news starts to trickle down among the ranks.
Also, the effect on any future potential public who are pretty much indoctrinated to look up new endeavors on the net, will be devastating for the Church.
In the end, maybe years from now, predictably and inevitably the membership support and influx of new resources and energy for DM and his Church will ebb out and it is only because of this support that he can do what he does. Take that support away and he will do no more.
No matter what one can say or think about Debbie, her combined actions created a tremendous blow against that support and the aftermath will be observed for a long time afterwards.
Disinfected,
Here is another viewpoint to consider:
Some people hoped that Debbie could take some tens of thousands of dollars and dismantle Miscavige and all the cult money in the legal arena.
Not a simple task. Ask the IRS and the Florida state attorneys office (Lisa McPherson case).
While I understand the disappointment, look at what Debbie DID DO. Despite knowing that she would be attacked with the goal of ruining her life, she sounded the alarm. She e-mailed as many Scientologists as possible. She testified in a court of law. She got out the message to millions of non- Scientologists via media that went around the world.
Don’t under estimate the affects this has and will have.
Debbie could not have done what she did without all the support that she got, financial and otherwise. If you don’t mind me saying – that was a lot of bang for the buck.
Debbie lost her business and I’m sure a lot of personal and possibly family relationships. Money or no money, she has the challenge of putting her life back together. She didn’t have to do what she did. I feel she gained personal integrity by the actions she did take.
I don’t feel it is right for anyone to now turn on Debbie. David Miscavige
(and his flying monkeys) are the target. It is all of our responsibility to continue to shine the light of truth on his black soul. Miscavige and his little cult is failing and dying and it will never recover.
The public needs to be warned and ex-members need to be helped in their recovery. Debbie contributed to this in a BIG way and I thank her for it.
As usual, Miscavige has clouded this event with lies. As usual the truth will eventually surface at which point we will have a better understanding of what really happened and why.
I was first shocked about her decision but now I think overal the Debbie Cook story was a big step in the direction of bringing down Miscavage. She was in need of help and we helped her. Real help should be unconditional. I will help the next person in need again. We have to take the high road on this one. That way everybody will feel safe to contact this group.
Hum this tune to sleep-
Mr. CofS,
I just thought of something, and you being a lawyer and all, would have to consider this in your opinion of the farreaching implications of this incredible power of the court in this injunction. If say, all those who donated to help Debbie, all those who posted data related to her using any media, including all the internet postings, and all those who forwarded her email and continue to do so, and all those who read it and then tell others and so on and on, are “in concert” then wouldn’t that be a heck of a lotta people that could say band together as a “class’ whose rights have been abrogated by this injunction, IF you being a lawyer are right, and wouldn’t that be something like a shit storm of “in concert” that would come at DM in court? Or something.
Well, you’re the lawyer. I suppose you figured that in with your opinion of the incredible ramifications of a civil case, settled out of court and with the court merely rubber stamping what was presented to it (not anything else, like the quid pro quo) and well geez, the entire Constitutional rights of the First Amendment have just been cancelled by DM’s lawyers in a “knock out punch”.
Holy cats. You guys are AWESOME!!!
Marty,
If it was me, I’d go fishin’. Get some space and time so that you can do the cypherin’ and ponderin’ you need to in order to solve this unsavory situation.
Thanks for keeping your eyes on the prize, Les.
It’s like being on a boat hunting a killer shark. Then you see how big the beast is and exclaim, “We’re gonna need a bigger boat.”
But in the end, the beast’s robotic single-mindedness did itself in.
The outcome of this matter is already written in the history of the future. (I recall a Buddhist saying: if you want to understand the past, look to the present; if you want to understand the future, look to the present.)
Huge changes are afoot, and I am not completely convinced that the Debbie Cook situation is fully over. She may for example get her health back in control, ruminate on this for some years, and then send another New Year’s letter. She is after all a woman with the courage to speak up once, and the one area where the injunction leaves her free to speak is when she is complying with duly authorized legal compliance.
In the meantime, OSA or DM may feel that weird emotion of glee in reading the posts on this blog. But this is not the end of the story. Not even the end of a chapter. Truth will prevail.
What gets me is: she slit one wrist with her email, knowing Hell would rain down. She had no where to turn but to the I.S.
Now, she’s turned her back on the I.S. and slit her other wrist knowing this would piss everyone ELSE off.
She has effectively pissed on and off anyone who has ever called themselves a Scientologist.
What could possibly be worth that?
Wow, if she didn’t know about many things not told yet, why would they include all this injunction?
Re yesterday: I believe Debbie’s letter stated she wanted change within the church but was unsuccessful and her intent was for members only. She advised them to not give monies for extra things but to put it only toward their bridge. Her apparent intention was not for people to leave, but to look and resist. Consequently those who could see further than that, really looked and left. Can you imagine how the attorney’s would make her guilty or faulty for having so many (they surly had numbers, proof) people leave her beloved church. How criminal she could have felt. That’s my altered viewpoint.
I cannot help but be profusely disappointed.
However I will hold my tongue.,
Sometimes there is so much more than meets the eye.
The fact we Independents were fund raisers and supported her and she is no longer a “friend” to Independents does bother me the most.
Damn good idea, Brian. Such a project should ping the interest of every rebel reading here. Call it The Knowledge Report.
Keep talking, Dave. You, as per usual, have helped solved the problem I was musing about in this post. You are like a juvenile glue sniffer with a platinum credit card, and thus can always be counted upon to provide the answers with your obsessive overreach. I would say “bring it” but you clearly won’t, having been reduced to infantile utterances on my site.
Chuck BTW if you have someone escaping in CW I can accommodate.2 and help them so far as a home to escape to. Mike knows how to reach me so if it comes up I will gladly help two he can connect us. When I leave to travel there is room for 3. What you do rocks! You rock Chuck!
No
What if 10 others leave and lawyer up, then reveal more?
Debbie is only ONE ex High ranking Exec. with limited funding.
There is a huge crack in the dam and it can’t be patched by the Faux C of S with dollar bills alone.
We need more Execs to help finish the job and collect a pay check while doing so. IMHO
We’re all breathing the same air, therefore are all acting in concert…jeeze, miscavige thinks he can shut everyone up. Dweeb.
Are you former staff in Chicago Sindy???
Also she can always be a witness and testify with a subpoena.
So the Faux C of S has only put a band aid on this.
Sam
I always love your post.
Pingback: Scientology Inc v Cook – Textbook Backfire | Moving On Up a Little Higher
Tell ya what, y’all. I think Debbie and Wayne got ‘an offer they couldn’t refuse.’
That is the only explanation that completely as-ises this thing for me.
Mike- You are right about the actual effect Wayne and Debbie’s agreement has on your rights, but the COS has never flinched at looking stupid in the court of public opinion when it comes to their legal gambits. I recall they used to lay the “in concert with” angle on lots of the “non-in-concert-with” critics back in the Lisa Trust Days (I forget what the original issue was; a restraining order against picketing near the SO shuttles I think). Anyway you’re right…but since when does the COS worry about what is right?
Right on
that was then, this is now
Same as freeatlast post for at least one.
Geez – travel for a couple of days and all hell breaks loose!
I don’t know what to make of this. It really is not a win for the church. It’s not really a win for Independence. I would love to have been a fly on the wall.
My take is that Sugar Ray would not have been out-boxed.
Regardless of anything else, I am grateful for Debbie Cook for what she did do. The damage to the Miscavige regime she inflicted was of such magnitude, that I, for one, will not criticize whatever decision she may have made regarding this agreement.
Regardless of this outcome, the church is still off policy, still doing significant damage to the legacy of L. Ron Hubbard, and is still covering up the crimes of Mr. David Miscavige.
Truth will out.
Miscavige might be doing a “happy dance” over this settlement, but he’s just nuts. Any sane person who looks for 5 minutes would know that the Scientology organization is ROTTEN to the core and is working exhaustively to silence anyone who might warn others to stay clear of that cesspool. Pretty soon, all Miscavige will have left are the pitiful cowards who gave up any sense of pride and rationality to support their “dear leader”. What a pathetic existence.
She has no credibility
Mike – speaking of felonies, do you suppose that DM threatened Debbie with the disclosure of real or falsified evidence that implicated her in something criminal? Something that could be prosecuted within the statute of limitations. I’m guessing that Debbie, as an executive, carried out “Command Intention” and that DM has the means to completely erase his own directives and involvement.
As someone who has been on the Scn-critical (of the organization, not the followers) side of the fence since well before alt.religion.scientology, I fully understand the disappointment being expressed here. Many have stepped up and been slammed down. Yet the net effect of their efforts is indisputable: the COS’s trend line has been diving like a kamikaze for quite a while now. It is a hollow shell of an organization that is doomed to be little more than a bunch of empty buildings manned by a few pathetic and truly lost individuals.
What Debbie Cook did was a major step in this battle because it was one of the most widely impinging communications to Scientologists. Focus on what was done, not what you imagine might have been.
If there is one thing my experience has told me: there will always be another thorn in DM’s side to replace the one he has just removed.
BRAVO!
Brian – There is already a professional documentary in the works.. the producers were at the hearing. They are looking to interview more indies for their research so anyone interested in interviewing with them can e-mail us your contact info at BrettAllenMedia@gmail.com And also Mark Bunker has extenssive video from indies as he is working on his documentary.. so theres lots goin on in that arena..
No
Hey! It’s The Grimm Reaper! Take it easy honey you have moved from PTS to ATS (actual trouble source).
You are a little early for the event, David had not arrived. But check out the eulogy I wrote for him:
Eulogy for A Toxic Man
We gather today…but
he was always dead.
Today, though, we feel the burden
has moved away from our heads.
We who came under
his black magic spell
visited darkness known
only as hell.
He led us to find
ourselves bankrupt, crippled
or locked in a cell.
All of his victims,
young women and children,
lovers, ex-wives, mothers,
all suffered his treason.
He had ready a good reason
for everything he did.
He brought him a lawyer
declaring to win!
“I’m in with a higher class
of people now,
and you don’t fit in.”
He presented himself
as a cheery Santa Clause
yet couldn’t gift another
with simple applause.
He artfully escaped
being caught for his crimes.
His smile was brilliant,
he never did time.
His friends, there were maybe two,
recall him only
as someone they never really knew.
If a person’s wealth
is measured by friends,
He lived in poverty,
beginning to end.
He lured in his victims
with lines of deceit
then pulled the rugs out
from under their feet.
Those of us here now
are at last consoled
that his heart has stopped beating,
his body is cold.
We can breathe again —
The truth has been told.
Gosh. I come back to the computer a couple of hours later after speculating about if this legal edict could allow the COS to harass people who supported Debbie’s original purpose by implying that we were and are “acting in concert with” Debbie Cook and what do I find? The Tomato Lawyer, or Moxon, or David Miscavige, or whoever the heck you are have taken up my speculation as a mantra! Trying to get everyone riled up.
Miscavige, I wish to inform you that I am not a lawyer. I am a legal nobody who was simply asking a question. You are taking legal advice from a legal nobody. You must be very desperate. I understand that you might be since you got your ass kicked in court. And by the way, I was not in the least concerned that YOU might suing ME.
Now, squeeze the squeak toy again and see what happens next!
I like what Karen said in her other posting about turning her back on those who helped her. It is not something to admire. She signed the paper, and that is the only EVIDENCE we have of where she stands. It is a betrayal after trust. All else, even the ‘fact’ that she has accepted money is supposition which no one has proved. Maybe, just maybe, she is happy to shake off the bit bulls with or without payola. Maybe she isn’t up to fighting. Maybe she is relieved that she isn’t being forced to pay out.
She shed some light on the truth, and as long as those who have been abused will speak, then it is still a forward progress. Where is Angie B? How many others have been paid off? I give Debbie credit where it is due, but at this point, it is what it is. It seems that some people looked upon Debbie as ‘the one’ or ‘the savior’ who will take down the evil one. There is no magic bullet in this situation.
Anyone who worked with DM forwarded his SP agenda and has to reckon with it. You can’t get a flow without agreement. The ONLY reason DM is stil in the driver seat is because there is agreement to keep him there by those around him. It is she, not any movement, who will suffer for any betrayal that she has done. It is her integrity that she has to live with. She made her decision. She refers to herself as “the girl who kicked the hornets nest”, and so she did. We all would have liked her to destroy it, but that isn’t my call to make.
MUM: I wrote to her and she answered.
BOOYAH!
SacraTomato….I mean, OSA, you are so busted.
Mike and Marty, you guys are the best. You can obviously smell a plant a mile away. Good job!
Speaking of Debbie’s original New Year’s email…I would love to know who released it to the press? It appears to me that she never wanted to violate her gag order and that she was trying to play the middle ground by promoting KSW to people who she thought would “get it”. Unfortunately, she wasn’t out for DM with both barrels loaded ‘live or die in the attempt”. She was being very careful and it backfired. Poof- friends gone. Even after she was called an SP by the church, she still didn’t reveal all that had happened to her. That is the problem with trying to be ‘reasonable’. How long did she work with DM knowing he was a nut case? How many people get beat, degraded etc and STILL forward his agenda?? She has her own big o/w’s no doubt. How could anyone work with an SP and be okay with it? You follow the orders to save your ass, and then you try to get the stats up by not following orders, but either way your screwed.
She turned to Marty, becasue she had no where else to go, but now that she can carry on in life, that is what she wants. That is what she was doing before all this fiasco, and I don’t believe she ever intended to be forced into confonting it all, nor did she want to do battle with DM. She was forced into battle by her own attempt to be careful. She knew DM was a suppressive but she doesn’t say that in her letter. So, yes, she did “stir up the hornet’s nest” which is ironic.
I’m sorry to say it is a win for DM because he has shut her up. True, she got in some punches first for sure, but she agreed to his agenda. All is not lost or any such thing, but the evil one did silence her, and yes the church is still status quo, no matter how anyone tries to spin it.
VWD
I don’t feel we lost a battle at all. We helped Debbie get her testimony into the public record, we kept her from being muzzled from the start, and we helped break Miscavige’s system of muzzling people when they leave the S.O.
And that’s apart from now having Debbie’s email message loose around the world. Which she of course has credit for composing.
Isn’t that what the Freezone Association renamed itself as?
That verges on cyber-squatting if the Association changed its name before the CoS registered the domain.
Can’t help it – ROFLMAO!!!
The way I see it Debbie and Wayne are Casualties of War. When you go to war with other soldiers, many will fall. Under the immense pressures of battle some people lose their mind, some people get blown up and physically ruined for life, many end up dead. How many former S.O. members do we know of who died way too soon as a direct result of that pressure? We all have our own breaking point when under extreme duress, and apparently Debbie and Wayne had reached that point. It’s hard to go on fighting when you have no money, no job, and many of your old friends have suddenly turned on you and won’t even speak to you anymore. Losing friends that you have loved, losing career stature, losing your very livelihood, that can trigger a major key-in as we all know. Debbie is a casualty of the War. She went DOWN on the battlefield, but at least she went down fighting. That email that she sent out was like a nuclear explosion in the Scientology community, and we all ought to be thankful for that effort, rather than question why she chose to quit, or even allow ourselves to feel any disappointment over it. The WAR goes on! There will be other Heroes who step forward out of the fog.
It shouldn’t be any surprise, really. What I am realizing now is that the Church is filled with cleared Cannibals: exactly what LRH warned us about.
It’s a John Allender, tripping as usual. I would recognize the voice anywhere. They are churning them out of the Int base. They restimulate their purposes to harm attack and suppress and turn them lose like pit bulls. By the time they zoom in on you as robo cops they are dramatizing DED DEDEX like people that never owned a tech dictionary.
I’m fairly certain that DM is using his secret, hidden comm line, to subjugate these people. Something along the lines of “okay, we’ll let you get some services at our ultra-exclusive CST hideaway, where the *real* OT levels are delivered, as long as you do an A-E that includes signing this document as the first step” ..
The “unless compelled by law” carve out is a necessary one. If it were not in the wording of the document, a court would imply it. That is because a sub poena (or any legal obligation that comes with criminal penalties for non-compliance) cannot be overridden by a private contract. A contractual term requiring someone to disobey the law is illegal and “contrary to public policy” and thereby unenforceable.
Public policy requires that the justice system must be able to function without being subverted at will. That is why the offence of conspiracy to pervert the course of justice, to pick a purely random example, is as old as the justice system itself. (*Note to NSW DPP.) Yes, sometimes people get away with it. But that’s for practical and evidentiary reasons. They’re not allowed to obstruct the legal process by inserting clauses into contracts that say someone must not comply with the law.
You could be a lawyer. You are bring chaos into chaos. And that would align with your purpose for a better world right?
Too funny!
Yeah on that Les, good talking Daddy!
Wayne has two sons; both are Scientologists in good standing. One is in the Sea Org. Rumor has it that he hasn’t been seen since this whole thing started and that there is concern about his safety.
I have heard that Wayne never heard about a lot of what went on at Int until Debbie was on the witness stand.
Someone at ESMB stated that Wayne had expressed sentiments even after the trial that he wanted to be back in the Sea Org. His facebook page declares him to be a member of The Church of Scientology.
A possible reason for them settling? My guess is that Debbie pretty much went into this on her own. She herself obviously didn’t expect this email to go viral and had no idea what she was letting the two of them in for.
Wayne did not have her reality, was probably never on board with it to begin with, and wanted out. I’m sure he fears for his son’s safety and is afraid that his son is in The Hole. (Hate to say it, but it’s an excellent possibility.) When someone has your child hostage they pretty much hold all the cards.
No one seems to be looking at him in this, but he is half of the equation here.
David Miscavige proves himself to be a “Disgustingly Reprehensible Creep”.
; DRC>COB .
I am so glad I escaped his, David Miscavige’s, madness…
The benefits I have received are as follows;
I feel free to live,
I have less stress,
I have more money.
I invite each and every one of you to join me in being free!
ML, Dennis Mulroy
Thanks.freeatlast and lizabeth,
The 866-XSEAORG phone number was Paul Adams’ idea, and somehow I ended up doing it. (Which means anyone can set up a more focused Independent Scientologist 800 number if they wish today.)
I don’t get many calls, (10-20 “serious” calls per year).
Not so much ex Sea Org members call but instead family of Sea Org staff, call to ask advice getting their kids/family out of the Sea Org.
Some calls asking about old Sea Org friends.
People who can give realistic career planning tips and advice are people I would appreciate being able to network to.
chuckbeatty77@aol.com 412-260-1170
+ 1 The cynic in me has had the thought that this whole thing may have been “Cooked” up by a person expert at playing people. Given the remarkable rapidity in which it was settled, from the point of inception – just 4 months. The cynic in me asked: could it be that when Debbie and Wayne ran out of the original hush money, and Debbie, knowing what she knew, “cooked” up a scheme to get enough money to see her and Wayne though the rest of their lives? That she knew she could get good further traction to bargain with by accepting support from Marty and the Indies, working the people and her supporters via the Internet, and the media, using them, so her bargaining hand was strengthened? It has happened before…..
Sorry to burst your bubble of certainty, but No.
Me too
Bottom line. If they don’t have family members still in the S.O. (ones that the midget can torture) they got a nice BIG check from CoM. NO doubt about it. Debi’s atty wouldn’t have had them sign otherwise…
I don’t know if the guy is related to the church or not. But if you were sent as a plant why would you chose to type in the cult website in the “website” box – which is total voluntary and so is the email input? You could put anything in those boxes – so if you were trying to be some sneaky OSA plant why would you chose to do that? Doesn’t make sense. I think what you have is just a troll wanting everyone to think he’s related to the cult to stir up BS. Now if you can trace his IP address back to the CoS or one of their proxies, then you got some hard proof. I think we just have a jerk off trying to get some people riled up.
+1
Great ThinkForYourself
+++ Beautiful. It rings so true.
I agree with you Matt. There is much good in what she did.
I don’t think it’s an actual injunction… it’s a settlement. Different legal definitions.
Amen, and thank you.
The Tomato is a type of plant, after all.
Unless they have another signed agreement concerning disconnection and treatment of his sons, I doubt any CoS promises on that score would be worth spit.
“acting in concert” = present tense. Not anyone who has ever “acted in concert”. But no person may now do these things while acting in concert with D & W.
I’m a tad discordant for that clause in any event.
Oh, yeah.
Yes 🙂
OMG!!! Hint on who I am – I lent you $ on a cycle when u were in or coming to LA (you were one of the few Scn that ever paid me back) Then I was in Chicago opening my office there I came into the org. Come to think of it I came by to meet u so a Reg must have connected from afar. I dont post openly YET. But Mike can give u my number. Do u remember me (without say my name)
SONG OF THE SPARROWS
The flock morns the sparrow lost
To the chaos of battle
The tyrant quick to hurry death
High on gilded saddle
The fallen friend, the broken wing
One less guardian to stand
Tall against the depraved foe
Come creeping sins in hand
But then a cry, sweet sparrows’ cry
‘tween flock and friends on high
“We are more than wing and claw
We are The Souls of Duty, bound
To the truth – we do not die!
Commentary:
(A poem memorializing Cook vs. COS, penned on 4 – 23 – 2012)
Signed,
Poet Laureate
Once she took the step of sending out the email she was making a stand against the exact thing that she is now guilty of accepting. Money ripped off from Scientologists by DM and his Con Artists through strong armed tactics.
To then go ahead and accept that same money and throw in the towel and give up your right again to free speech is not only hypocritical, but a betrayal of the only people who were willing to help her – the independents and Marty and Mike.
We will get over it, but lets tell the truth here – Debbie and Wayne folded their tent too early if they truly believed what she wrote in her email and compromised their own personal integrity.
Trust me there are people who comment on this blog who have come under far worse harrassment and are still standing tall against DM and are not compromising.