Idle Orgs update


Am I imagining it or does this promo piece communicate that C of M has lost touch entirely with Scientology and reality?  First, “The Bank of Spiritual Freedom”?  Has the membership become so conditioned to think in terms of money that joining staff (which to my recollection LRH always referred to as a mission or a crusade) has to be positioned with writing a check?  Then, when did joining staff becomg a “privilege”?   Last I recall, LRH didn’t promote that having a bunch of “statuses” (especially bought ones – such as Silver Meritorious Patron) was required (or even desirable) to becoming part of the team.  Finally, the Ray Bans and the DM-influenced Crusian over-the-top pose  are supposed to appeal to whom?  At this rate they will wind up with an elitist club, not an org.  Is this what Tommy means by “pinch me” material?

125 responses to “Idle Orgs update

  1. crashingupwards

    Marty, your funny. “Cruisian over the top pose”. Dead right. The guy is supposed to be OT8 and is out of valence. Save your money.

  2. Hahaha!! Marty, I got the promo too. Opened it up, and my exact thoughts were as above. Well said.
    Have been lurking for a while for known reasons. Will drop you an email soon.

  3. I guess it depends upon your definition of “pinch”. In the UK, it has the following slang defintions:

    Verb. 1. To steal. E.g.”Guess who’s just lost his job for pinching from work again?”
    2. To arrest. E.g.”He got pinched when he was climbing out of the kitchen window with the stolen TV.”

    Either one works for me, as a “telegraph” of their true intentions.

  4. The saddest thing about all this is that there is no way to vote MestSavage out of his position. If he was a CEO of a wog company he would have been toast long ago, or perhaps never would have gotten out of the mailroom.

    Thank goodness for the Independent Field. Without it, Scientology would be a lost cause.

    Centurion (non check bearing variety)

  5. Yes, please pinch me quick and wake me up, I’m having a bad dream! Marty you sure can nail those outpoints. Who would want to be part of something like this?

  6. He’s a practising attorney, isn’t he? Guess they’ll post him as Tech Sec or something.


  7. This imagery reminds me of a tacky Game show. But the semi-model assistant has been replaced. Same cleuless smile though.

  8. Marty, thanks for the morning laugh!

    Mestology seems to have mixed up the 7th Dynamic and the 9th Dynamic which it’s fixated on. The positioning of Tim Bowles as a contest/gameshow/lotto/hold em winner just doesn’t seem to hold water and is just ludicrous.

  9. One of many points to be made is that this Cruise wannabe has MONEY and thus can AFFORD to be on staff. Well, I can tell you that staff pay in ’07 was anywhere from exactly zero dollars to as much as a whopping fifty bucks for a full-time work week. Under DM, that’s not gonna change. Being motivated by duty is certainly at the top of the list but if you are paid dirt, it is degrading, nonetheless. And, if like most people, you aren’t in a position to be a Platinum-Meritorious, Double-Tall, Extra-Foam Donor with a Twist, you won’t make it for long on staff because your Landlord, the IRS and your local Cable Provider like to be paid in MONEY and staff members don’t have any. Pinch Me…. please……

  10. Highly embarrassing and — ahh, I dunno — no comment

  11. oh brother.

  12. Anybody know who the woman is in this shot?

  13. Meh, I think you are reading way too much into what was prolly supposed to be a fun and funny bit and likely not created any higher than the local org level (other than getting issue authority, of course).

    Hey, Marty.

    Tell you what did come to my mind recently, though. The Havingness Scale.


    Responsible for (willing to control)
    Contribute to
    Waste substitute
    Must be confronted
    Must be contributed to

    DM’s push to move every org into a huge expensive building and the push on staffs to reg donos for those buildings has the very real effect of pushing those staff downtone to the havingness level of “Must be contributed to”. How can those poor stiffs be expected to create or be responsible for anything if all their efforts are enforced into “being contributed to”.

  14. Fellow Traveller

    CofM Staff Qualifications Checklist
    1) Status in IAS
    2) Status of Bank Account
    3) Status of Opinion Leaders
    4) Status of MEST (Ray Bans optional, but recommended)

    This is odd. Qualifications = Status.
    So maybe CofS is now the Church of Status?

  15. As someone who started at Pasadena ages ago, all I can say is: ::facepalm::

  16. The “priviledge” of being staff in an idle org? I guess if you have enough money you can buy that priviledge too, LOL.

    After seeing this photo, I just sent in a check for 10 million dollars to Pasadena, and in return I get my own bathroom with an Italian marble toilet seat and the honor status of “Dorkus Maximus”. And I get the priviledge of working 100 hours a week for $40. Hip hip!

    The “Bank of Spiritual Freedom” reminds me of Frank Zappa’s song “Heavenly Bank Account” which makes fun of all those TV evangelists. Man, does this apply to Mestcavige and today’s Church of Mestology. So, hopefull Marty won’t mind if I post the lyrics here:

    And if these words you do not heed
    Your pocket book just kinda might recede
    When some man comes along and claims a godly need
    He will clean you out right through your tweed

    That’s right, remember there is a big difference between kneeling down and bending over…

    He’s got twenty million dollars
    In his Heavenly Bank Account.. .
    All from those chumps who was
    Born again
    Oh yeah, oh yeah
    He’s got seven limousines
    And a private plane…
    All for use of his
    Special Friends
    Oh yeah, oh yeah
    He’s got thousand-dollar suits
    And a Wembley Tie…
    Girls love to stroke it
    While he’s on the phone
    Oh yeah, oh yeah
    At the House of Representatives
    He’s a groovy guy. . .
    When he Gives Thanks He is not alone. . .

    He is dealin’
    He is really dealin’ IRS can’t determine
    Where The Hook is
    It is easy with the Bible
    To pretend that
    You’re in Show Biz
    They won’t get him
    They will never get him
    For the naughty stuff
    That he did
    It is best in cases like this
    To pretend that
    You are stupid

    He’s got Presidential Help
    All along the way
    He says the grace
    While the lawyers chew
    Oh yeah
    They sure do
    And the Governors agree to say: “He’s a lovely man!”
    He makes it easier for
    Them to screw
    All of you…
    Yes, that’s true!
    ‘Cause he helps put
    The Fear of God
    In the Common Man
    Snatchin’ up money
    Everywhere he can
    Oh yeah Oh yeah
    He’s got twenty million dollars
    In his Heavenly Bank Account
    You ain’t got nothin’, people
    You ain’t got nothin’, people
    You ain’t got nothin’, people
    Thank the man.. .oh yeah

  17. Even better, here’s a live version of “Heavenly Bank Account”:

  18. Is DM’s psychosis that he is obessessed with perfection? I recall from Admin training in the early 90’s that everyone was bogged down trying to meet unobtainable “Exec Qualifications” that disqualified pretty much everybody. It was the concept of turning out perfect execs (impossible) that kept everyone in full-time training for years instead of getting back to orgs and getting to work. Later it became perfect auditors (basically robots as it turns out). Now it is perfect buildings.

  19. David from England

    I now suspect Tommy said ‘punch me’ material, but the newspaper misquoted him.

    As for Mr Bowles, have mercy on him. He’s about to join staff.

  20. More likely he’ll be posted as DSA, so he can suppress all of us, especially those of us who used to be onlines at Pasadena. How special.

    Though it wouldn’t surprise me if he were to be posted as ED.

    Bank of Spiritual Freedom, huh?

    Guess they forgot to word clear “bank.” 🙂

  21. Tom Cruise could sue for a bad impersonation! That guy looks like a cheap Look a Like Celebrity rental.

    And since when did spiritual freedom have a Bank?

    “Pinch me materials” is really pinch your pocket materials.

    This buffoonery reminds me of a Mickey Mouse Club for pyramid scheme cheapo products.

  22. I just Googled Tim Bowles of Pascedena. Apparently, of all things, he practises employment law…boy, that should be an interesting experience for him. I wonder if he has any idea what he’s getting into…

  23. And in fact, that is his wife standing next to him.

  24. “As for Mr Bowles, have mercy on him. He’s about to join staff.”

    That’s kind of what I was thinking.

    This whole thing could very well backfire on, when the guy is actually working in an org and sees what is really going on.

  25. Lunamoth
    I think it’s his wife. Think her name is Rhona

  26. Oh is that a promo piece?
    Thought Tom Cruise had won the lottery….

  27. There is a wealth of comedy material in this flyer, but to get a bit serious for a moment:

    I see the same sort of inversion on money flows that has happened on ethics and tech lines; a complete reversal of the what was intended. Didn’t LRH say that he wished services were free? Economic reality makes that impossible, but the the money was never never never an end in itself. LRH would never have stood for that. I don’t know where worship of money is on the tone scale but I’m guessing it’s below 2.0.

    I often argued with IAS regges about the constant demands for money from existing public. It made it look like the biggest donors were the “upstats” and those who couldn’t donate much were of lesser importance. It can also create an anxiety and fixation on money itself – the constant pressure to get more to satisfy the demand. I wonder how many scientologists got into severe financial stress by maxing out credit cards. I know I did while I was still caught up in the Truman Show.

    Didn’t it make more sense to get a small amount from many public than try and get huge amounts from a few? Where was the application of Marketing Ss 17 and 17-1, the Planetary Dissemination issues? In these policies LRH made it crystal clear that the majority of resources and energy in dissemination was to be put towards new public by means of book sales. (As a side note, God spare any who dared have the audacity to actually try and apply these policies. Jeff Hawkin’s stunning missive Counterfeit Dreams is must-read material Real talent in marketing in the form of Jeff Hawkins and Steve Hall were forced out.

    Even if the money being demanded was going to “worthwhile causes” as opposed to DM-controlled slush fund, elevating the status, real or imagined, of those who give money is a nasty, callous trick.

  28. You just want to step into that pictue and pull them out of there and save them but helas one has to wake up on his or her own.

  29. That made me laugh out loud, Sam. 🙂

  30. War and Peace

    In 1987 Tim Bowles was the Lawyer that wrote a threatening letter to the St. Petersburg Times for publishing a review on the Bent Corydon Book “Messiah or Madman?”

    Bowles writes ~~
    “It has come to our attention that…[you] are considering publication of a review of L. Ron Hubbard, Messiah or Madman? by Bent Corydon….If you forward one of his lies you will find yourself in court facing not only libel and slander charges, but also charges for conspiracy to violate civil rights. If you publish anything at all on it, you may still find yourself defending charges in court…We know a whole lot more about your institution and motives than you think.”

    The St. Pete Times promptly published their full Book Review PLUS Tim Bowles menacing threatening letter.

    Note the arrogant Tone level of Tim Bowles’ letter.
    Conspiracy to violate Human Rights ?
    Whoa !
    Isn’t that what INT BASE does every second, every hour, every minute, every week, every month, every year, every decade ?

  31. It is a Bank where you are always in the red.

  32. Alright OEC/FEBC. I was there to: ITO with Baker in the Acadamy! You need to e-mail me, I’ll bet we’re long lost friends!

    As for Marty’s post on Cruisin’ in Pasadena, my God. If these people can’t see the out-points, they never will.

  33. ROFL! I actually had the same thought!!! LOL

  34. Boy is Mr. Bowles in for a big awakening he has no clue. I truly believe that with people like Tim it would be just to gruesome for them to know the truth.


  35. Part of the history of checks –

    Between 1118 and 1307, it is believed the Knights Templar introduced a cheque system for pilgrims traveling to the Holy Land or across Europe.[6] The pilgrims would deposit funds at one chapter house, then withdraw it from another chapter at their destination by showing a draft of their claim. These drafts would be written in a very complicated code only the Templar* could decipher.

    Transpose this derivation to DM’s nefarious methods and it’s quite germane humorously enough!

    🙂 *(Templar=C of M/DM in this analogy)

  36. Thanks, Sam.

    An employment lawyer? I can’t even stand it.
    I’d like to see the expression on his wife’s face after he’s been “staff” for about 6 months and is reaping the rewards of writing those reports uplines that you just know are bound to come, and all his failed attempts at “helping the church get their legal rud’s in.”

    One wonders what the legal ethics are for an employment lawyer participating in violations of employment law?

    This could be interesting.

  37. Kathy Braceland

    These two sure look like they desire to be liked or admired.

    Not only have they lost touch with reality and Scientology, they have lost touch with themselves. Who on earth would even think of using this as a promo piece to join staff — or anything else for that matter? Other than a Miscavige and/or Cruise fan club that is. Oh oh…do we have a “Boys from Brazil” sequel starting here?

    I think you hit it right on — it’s become an Elitist Club.

  38. Oh brother, not more corn!!

    I know this guy and he used to be pretty cool. He looks like he is a major “bot” now. Bummer.

    He will be surprised when that check bounces too!

    Those who know how to win are more numerous than those who know how to make proper use of their victories. ~~ Polybius


  39. Hmmm, I look at that promo piece and am totally befuddled. Don’t know what to think.

  40. Ghastly, just ghastly, on so many levels. Double facepalm, head moving side to side.

  41. Even better you can hit this link and play the tune:

    Zappa rocks 🙂

    (Used to know someone who knew someone who knew Dweezil and Moon Unit that had an office just down the street from Joe’s Garage)

  42. Martin, I can tell you DM’s think: it is much easier to deliver one hour of auditing for $1,000,000 than to deliver 1,000,000 hours of auditing for $1,000,000. That, to him, is viability. RTC’s main stat is the amount of Advanced Tech VSD, meaning if Flag can squeeze lots of 6 month checks out of Solo NOTs auditors then the RTC stat will be up and they will get their bonuses. To hell with planetary dissemination, in other words. DM knows he isn’t going to live forever and to hell with what is left after he’s gone. Just my opinion.

  43. I looked at that promo piece and my first thought was that this guy was getting paid to join staff! LOL You know, like the military does to lure in its new recruits. Nothing this church does anymore surprises me as I expect crazy behavior from an organization that has gone so completely wacko.

    Ever hear of Dane Tops? Until a couple of weeks ago I had never heard the name. But I came across this long ass letter that Dane Tops (not his real name) wrote back in 82′. He supposedly mailed it out 20 or so people and those people copied it and sent to others and so on. Well, like I had never heard of Dane Tops, I had also never heard of this letter until just recently. Anyway, this letter has been on my to read list ever since I came across it. Tonight I finally read the damn thing and it wasn’t at all what I had imagined it would be. Interestingly enough, reading the Dane Tops letter was like reading so many things that have been said here on Marty’s blog and others. Whoever the hell Dane Tops is he had it pegged back then. Makes what we’re saying now look like old news. If anyone’s interested, here’s the link:

    Click to access Dane_Tops_letter.pdf

    Monte (aka P. Henry)

  44. This criticism is, to me, doing pettiness.

    I am seeing that we sometimes (and that includes me) give in to a compulsion to be finding fault, to be finding something to ridicule about anything we are against.

    It is sort of a hunger that needs feeding and it, to me, deteriorates objectivity and especially theta.

    When I look at the promo, without the filter that it is being put out by a COS org and is being done by a current Church member, I get a light hearted flow that is purposely done to move it away from seriousness.

    He is purposefully, to me, doing Tom Cruise.

    And it comes out pleasing.

    I have posted before under Luis.

    Since this is my first criticism I feel the need to let know that my name is Luis Agostini, I live in Miami and my e-mail is

  45. War and Peace,

    I think you could consider that creating antagonism couldn’t you?? I mean from Tim Bowles and the church…


  46. Rory Medford

    at what point on the bridge do they really wake up see what is going on? or do they all have a blind spot?

  47. This is Tim and Rona Bowles. Tim used to practice in Portland, OR back in 80’s and in fact was one of the three Scn attorneys (the others being the infamous Rick Moxon and the much loved and respected Earle Cooley), who worked day in and day out on the Julie Christopherson trial that launched the Religious Freedom Crusade en masse-group-gather-circular-marching tech.

    Moxon-Bowles law firm later wound up in LA doing extensive work with OSA and Rick still remains the lead attack dog for them. (I’ll bet M&M have a few “fishy-lawyer whoppers they could tell about these guys, too! Perhaps lawyer-client privilege prevents their telling, however. )

    I’m wondering what post Tim will end up being hatted for? Will he forsake his practice and great income? Or, are the local orgs starting to “lawyer up” as a strategy to implement legal maneuverings in an effort to ward off the “blowback” that is finally coming their way from decades of abuse and misuse of staff and parishioners?

  48. Hi Monte,

    That was one of the first things I read when I started to become “aware” and it blew me away. Thetans have been getting hip to this abberated game for awhile now and we are late on the chain forsure.

    Ever read OJ Roos’s debrief?? Google his name and you will find it. I thought it was one of the best out there.


  49. Hi Luis,

    I feel your pain. I guess if you really get what DM is doing and all the lives that have been ruined, to me it is kind of fun taking pot shots at them.

    Now if you are still on board with them then you are still PTS to them and sort of brainwashed and you have to get through that first. If you feel REALLY BAD about “nattering” then go to them and confess all your sins and see how that goes for you.

    Don’t worry about being a “good boy”, just do the right things and you will be fine.

    A real friend is one who walks in when the rest of the world walks out.~~ Anonymous


  50. War and Peace

    Alex ~~

    There is GPM/dichotomy dramatization which is part the culture of the Church.

    Every WOG, Every Journalist, every Federal Agent, Every TV station, every psychologist, psychotherapist, psychiatrist, every (or almost every ) former GO staff, every former Mission Holder,every former INT Base staff, every ex SO member etc etc is a THEM that the Church polarizes AGAINST.

    Antagonism is created from within the Church to perceived ENEMIES or “THEM”.
    You rarely almost never hear of reconciliations of anyone the Church opposed and then reconciled with.

    But you hear of new enemies and disaffecteds and blows almost every day of the year.

    The Stat graph of making new enemies is in screaming affluence year in and year out !

    Yes, Tim Bowles letter is only too typical of the Church’s ATTACK mode that it accuses others of !

    If I didn’t know that Tim Bowles wrote it, I would guess that some ANONYMOUS poster was yapping. The style and content sounds remarkably like an ANON !

  51. Sigh. Busted. Please forgive our ‘petty’ foibles but I so did enjoy it 😀

  52. Luis,

    Thanks for sharing your views and for being transparent about your identity, inviting further communication.

    Here are my own thoughts about the piece and my reasons for reacting as I do.

    When an organization sends out a “promo piece” (which this specifically is), it’s intended to create a positive response. Naturally, the best pieces create uniformly positive responses, although for many pieces reactions vary, depending on the viewers’ own values.

    Given my own values, my response to this piece is in line with those of the majority of posters’ reactions — negative. Tom Cruise + Scientology + money does not equal a positive image for me.

    I’m also in agreement with someone (Deirdre?) who suggested above that juxtaposing the words “bank” and “spiritual freedom” was very unfortunate, since the two terms, in common Scientological parlance, are diametrically opposed.

    For these reasons, I find this promo piece to be a big fat FAIL.

  53. Agree about Zappa! Although I didn’t quite know what to think when he released the Joe’s Garage Albums. On my own I was thinking that the irony/sarcasm on Scn was something we all needed to experience 🙂 It’s good music and above all, funny.

  54. Luis, you wrote…

    “This criticism is, to me, doing pettiness.

    “I am seeing that we sometimes (and that includes me) give in to a compulsion to be finding fault, to be finding something to ridicule about anything we are against.

    “It is sort of a hunger that needs feeding and it, to me, deteriorates objectivity and especially theta.”


    “To speak ill of others is a dishonest way of praising ourselves. Nothing is often a good thing to say, and always a clever thing to say.” -Will Durant


    “So, let’s look at the bracket of death: greed, lust, crime, sin. you look at this bracket of unwanted things, and psychomatic ills and all the rest of it. It comes to life, actually, just because you are looking at it, and for no other reason. It could be there and be dead for a long time.

    “Actually, if people with life in them paid no attention whatsoever to crime, it would not continue and would have no continuance, no life, and no power to hurt. The power in the communication line always comes from the upper bracket of understanding: affinity, reality, communication.”

    A bit more….

    “This is a principal on a social dynamic, a very interesting principle: every time you close terminals with entheta, you are being asked to duplicate – what? – entheta.

    “What do you do with an entheta line? Ignore it. Don’t even bother to cut it.”

    -LRH Untitled tape No. 5412C04 HCAP-1: Last Lecture 1954

    Note: I found this LRH ref in an Advance mag. The title given to the article was Granting Life to Death.

  55. Bob, thanks for that vid. I enjoyed it.

  56. Virgil Samms

    So I went to the event at an Idle Org last night to pay homage to LRH on his birthday and to see what was what. There were about 150 staff/SO and close to 125 public there. It was a bust.

    The event itself was crazy. The first hour was okay with the LRH Biographer telling about the early days of Dianetics and had people from the old orgs like Phx, FCDC, London and St Hill talking about working with/under LRH. That was cool. Phil Stevens and Monica Quirino looked great.

    But then, when Dan was finished, about 50 public left, as if on cue. They had their BS meters on and left before the BS came and it did because DM showcased the new Idle Orgs (Roma, Belgium, FCDC etc). This went on for 1.5 hours. I mean, he got the LRH stuff out the way, now for the real reason we are here… . I mean it went on and on.

    Then finally the birthday game. Guillume presented it. He was introduced as Guillume Leserve from Internatonal Management, not ED Int.

    The little Chinese missions cranked. Some doing 9.500 – 13,000 WDAH per year. But when the Class V Orgs were announced, they did not show WDAH or Comps stats, only STP, which were in the millions. But we know this is because of the basics study. When the Sea Org orgs came up they did not show # OTs Made stat at all. Only STP. Wonder why?

    Anyhow, it was the usualy glistening and terrific PR and was mainly about the Ideal Orgs. Even when they played a bit of tape of LRH and he talked about organization, in the background you saw tall buildings. and pretty orgs with pretty mest. It was very subliminal. The message was “MEST”.


  57. FreeAndClearNow

    I don’t off hand know what a correct stat for RTC should be, but that sure the hell isn’t it.

  58. FreeAndClearNow

    A better stat would be “Volunteered Success Stories.”

  59. War and Peace,

    I think it will be thier downfall also.


  60. Freedom Fighter

    “But then, when Dan was finished, about 50 public left, as if on cue. They had their BS meters on and left before the BS came . . .”

    Wow! That’s very telling . . . and encouraging.

  61. They talk about STP because they are much easier lie about than WDAH’s, OT’s Made, Auditors Made, etc.

    I suspect that the “fact” that the orgs in China are doing so uncharacteristically well is that they are 1/2 a world away from most of the scientologists in the world and also easier to lie about.

    Knowing that the church has lied for years about stats, and knowing that more lies are necessary to keep those lies protected, I would believe NONE of the
    stats they give at these events. NONE.

  62. Alex, never heard of OJ Roos’s but I will find his/her debrief and give it a read. The way I came across the Dane Tops letter was by first reading a transcripted interview that Project Camelot did with Dane back in the fall of last year. Did you by chance read that? If not, here’s the link:

    Alex, you mention becoming “aware”…becoming aware sure is a process isn’t it? But then thinking about it, I figure becoming aware has, since time began, and perhaps before, always been a process.

    Since late Nov last year I have spent many long hours glued to this damn computer acting as a sponge just soaking up everything I could about what has been going on with the church of scientology, DM, et al while I have been working to get my wits around all that has happened. Consequently, I’ve also had the excitement of simultaneously managing this wild ass emotional roller coaster ride that I’ve been on as a result of my finally deciding to look into this proverbial can of worms. It has certainly been a process leaving what I thought was CoS but in actuality was CoM. But it seems that I have finally reached a stable flat point in that process. However, the process of leaving scientology as being my sole belief system and spiritual operational system continues, but that process too, I sense, is quickly approaching its flat point. As I move through this process, new understandings of a depth and breadth that I have not previously experienced are becoming manifest. Also, as a consequence of this expansion of understanding, I have discovered that there is nothing too kooky, too weird, too esoteric, too wacky, too way out, etc. for me not to look at and examine in my search for the truth. Ironically, as a scientologist I had become shackled and consumed by a tunnel vision reality that I touted as being “certainty.” Well, many shackles have now been removed and I’m out of the tunnel into a new gradient of freedom. I’m once again LOOKING without restriction or fear of penalty…like losing my chance at spiritual freedom.

    “Inquiry is fatal to certainty.” – Will Durant

  63. Monte and Luis,

    I think it sounds good to “take the high road” and in some cases it may be appropriate.

    In this case it doesn’t seem appropriate to me.

    Based on the data DM is a suppressive and he and his minions have ruined a lot of peoples lives. Also having your comm cut and told that your opinions are of no value does tend to aggravate.

    Using your logic, I guess we would say nothing about anything as that could be construed as criticism. That is what that C of M does to shut people up, they say “you are nattering”, ” you have crimes”, “you are entheta”, “you are the enemy”. That is their way of shutting people up and it seems that you are using a low grade version of that by saying “have class and shut up”.

    I for one will not shut up. I will continue to natter and speak out and criticize because that is working. The stats are going up in terms of people finding out about the abuses and that is the main objective.

    The worst thing about slavery is that the slaves eventually get to like it. ~~ Aristotle

    Have a good day.

  64. Virg, soon Miscavige will just lie about stats rather than sift through them to pick one that looks good. His tone vacillates between 1.1 and 2.0 and you can see what happens to Truthfulness in that band.

    1.5 hours of listening to that is why I haven’t been to an event in years.

    Tim Bowles made how much money over the years from the CoS? Maybe now he’s putting in exchange?

    But what happens when he sees the real scene?

    That promo is beyond bad. I thought he was a National Sweepstakes winner. And the Cruisian fist pump with the RayBans indoors, well, it explains itself.

  65. Virgil Samms,

    Thanks for your short summary. We were ready to go, but after we read that we have to look at buildings for 90 minutes we stayed home and will be less enturbulated.
    Re the promo:
    We could go on for years to find out-points. Does this help ?
    I don’t think.
    Better is to concentrate onto the purpose and create a new tomorrow.
    The only thing that will count in the end are the real stats, Clears, OTs and Auditors.
    How are those stats in the indepedent zone ?
    How is promo in the independent zone ?
    As a youngster I used to say to my comrades, when we were at concerts and they were nattering about how bad the musicians are:
    ” Go onto the stage, show it to them or play yourself or shut your mouth and go home if you don’t like it. They at least try it, you don’t ! ”

    I think its about time to leave that to other people and we should just concentrate on doingness and produce.

    Just MHO.

    Have a good day


  66. Joe Howard,
    Yes, RTC’s stats and the ‘Six Month Checks’. Interestingly enough I’ve been checking this out with another guy who’s pretty good about chasing these things down, that is wearing his Qual Librarian hat.

    It turns out that there are two issues related to these Six Month Checks: HCOB 8 Mar 82R, Confessionals and the Non-Interference Zone and HCOB 23 Dec 71RB, C/S Series 73RB, The No-Interference Area, Clarified and Re-Enforced.

    The first one says: “One would not embark on a series of Confessionals during another Grade or OT Section, but it is imperative that Pre-OTs on these sections that have missed withholds get them off and a specific Confessional can and should be done to accomplish this.

    “CAUTION- A Pre-OT who is running well making case gain should not be interrupted.”

    The second HCOB states: “Pre-OTs progressing well on the No Interference Area should not be interfered with by Sec Checking or anything else. However, when a Pre-OT is stalled or moving slowly, any of the actions listed below, as appropriated, can be ordered by a qualified C/S.”

    It lists:
    1) Non-audited PTS handlings.
    2) Confessionals and O/Ws.
    3) FPRD
    4)Service Facsimile handling (no Dianetics, only recalls).
    5) Disagreement Checks.

    So, nowhere in any of these references are ‘Six Month Checks’, mandatory or otherwise. That’s quite interesting don’t you think?

  67. Just one more post for today;

    the Independents are having an effect.
    It seems that the treatment of Sea-Org Members is improving.
    One friend that was on OT IV for 20 years in the Sea-Org completed OT V. Another Sea-Org Member will start her OT IV and then V and another one is on the Solo-Course after 20 years of service.
    I’ll do call-ins on them to see that they really do it.
    Since 9 months I ask every callinner where he is on the bridge and why he doesn’t go up the bridge. The answers are very funny.
    It seems that they cognited about they have to care about their staff or they loose some more.
    So, next to the question about their bridge , I’ll ask now why all those OTs they have do not disseminate to their famillies and friends. As it would be then a piece of cake to boom.
    Per my understanding an new OT 8 has so many wins, that all the people around him are in awe and just want the same.
    So where are there any problems ?
    This will be very interesting.


  68. Virg et al,

    Re: STP (student points) stat. You’re right, they can only be the result of the basics..however, these are no doubt being reported falsely. STP, per policy, can only be counted from Academy (Div lV) study. I went thru hell as the Tech Sec of Pasadena after the Basics release as the courses were announced as Div Vl courses and therefore points were not counted unless the person was also doing the basics as part of their academy checksheet.

    Tim, as Mickey stated, is Rhona’s husband and the family’s main financial supporter. Right before the ED of Pasa, Meri Vallerius, was ripped off from Pasadena to become the ED of Dallas for the grand Idle Org opening a year or so ago, Rhona was persuaded to quit her job at Delphi and become full time staff. She then “became”(as in “poof, you’re now the___”) the ED of Pasa which I believe is her current post.

    There’s no way Tim is going to be full time staff. When I left in June 2008, most staff were part time, the only full time staff being those with husbands that could support them or who had money saved from other sources (2).

    It is by no accident that DM pushes to get the OTVllls to join staff. They are, for the most part, untrained and wouldn’t have a clue about what was off policy or on policy. But one thing is certain, they hardly dare question orders from upper management. Nope..not an accident at all.

  69. martyrathbun09

    Sherry, Thanks for these facts and your correct analysis. Jibes with Geir’s story. It couldn’t be more off policy.

  70. martyrathbun09

    Jim, Quite.

  71. martyrathbun09

    Huck, We’ve long since passed the point where Miscavige makes up stats to project with his exploding graphs. Long since. Ask any former member of Gold or Int involved in events.

  72. martyrathbun09

    Lunamouth, I think you hunch is right. It is why Russia boomed in the nineties, Italy boomed in the eighties, Mexico boomed in the eighties. To a one, management left them alone. Until they became something. Then began the steady campaigns to unmock them.

  73. Alex,

    I posted the quote by Will Durant and LRH in response to Luis’s comment. I didn’t say that I agreed with either one.

    Obviously if what LRH was advising in this excerpt was being followed there never would have been a “Truth Revealed” appearing in the SP Times and such sites as this one and a plethora of others would not exist. And if these sites/blogs did not exist how would we have ever discovered the extent of abuse being waged upon SO members, staff and public by DM and his slavish minions? Nah, like you Alex, I think this particular LRH reference is flawed. I definitely feel that we should continue doing what we’re doing. After all, isn’t the action of ignoring entheta tantamount to not-ising entheta? And where does not-ising get one?

    I’m with you Alex.

  74. Fellow Traveller

    I could start to snap into DM’s GPM here. This is scary.
    “It is by no accident that DM pushes to get the OTVllls to join staff. They are, for the most part, untrained and wouldn’t have a clue about what was off policy or on policy. But one thing is certain, they hardly dare question orders from upper management. Nope..not an accident at all.”

    If this is the state of eight, then what should we opine at nine?

  75. Fellow Traveller

    This area is very interesting with respect to Source and how to defeat verbal tech.

    From the Virginia McClaughry story, posted at http://wwwdotfreezonedotorg/reports/virginia_refund.htm
    “The auditor produced a pack of BFO’s, an inch or so thick, covering the SOLO NOTS administration line. She showed Virginia the page that covers the history of the six-month check line. Virginia immediately turned to the back of the reference to see if LRH wrote it. It was written by RTRC I/C Int. (This post is part of Senior C/S Ints office.) So, Virginia said, this is not LRH so I do not have to follow it.

    Christina said read this part. This part said that:

    “….in 1982 LRH was consulted regarding a situation with SOLO NOTS auditors at the time, to which LRH responded “ get them in, get them cleaned up, and keep them cleaned up”. Thus, the six month check line was born……..”.

    So, there was an “advice” that potentially could be source, but not one available to those who should be able to see it.

    It sure muddies the waters. But nothing in that advice statement actually contradicts anything that Jim and his Librarian have checked. IMHO.

  76. There’s another ref. that applies too, going over what too much sec checking does on a case which someone posted a while ago. Miscavige knows better than LRH about how to handle cases.

    I’ve brought up this point to management people and get back basically “this isn’t my responsibility and who cares, it’s a minor point, so back off….anyways lets handle the black PR which would cause you to disagree with COB.”

    I’d like to know where were these tone 40 people in 2007 before the brand new Bridge? They went all the way to getting declared to make sure Miscavige corrects the Bridge with longer training runways before the basics release? Because that’s what KSW asks you to do so I’m befuddled.

    Did that happen or is it actually the case that it doesn’t matter what Miscavige does to the bridge? Hmmm. Also remember to attack any disagreement viciously and mindlessly.

    Regarding a long history of false reporting stats at events, here’s something from ESMB, with an excerpt from it posted at the top here for emphasis:

    (“I remember at the next event being sick at my stomache as the stats were announced knowing it was a complete falsehood.”)

    “I just remembered one of the final straws that got me to realize I had to leave. The jig was up.

    Those of you who were at Int in the late 90s will remember a series of briefings from Jenny Devocht called Wake up and smell the coffee? I believe she was acting CO CMOI at the time as Yager was on the RPF. Davey declared him an SP which was the subject of a whole other base briefing from Dave.

    These briefings were literally a slide show to show us how empty the orgs were and during what should be peak production hours. We were shown hundreds of photos every night over a several day period of almost every class V org course room, HGCs, etc. All of which were completely empty. One or two students here and there.

    Im positive that the effect these briefings was supposed to have was to get us all worried about the state of Scientology internationally and to get us to work even harder. But for me and probably others, it had an opposite effect.

    I thought how on Earth could we be working so hard and for so many years that the course rooms are freakin empty? And internationally? Are our marketing campaigns really that ineffective? All of our campaigns are COB approved which means that they should work right? I mean theyre on Source, etc. Lots of thoughts racing through my mind over the state of things. I realized that the world was not buying Scientology. Something was terribly wrong and I couldn’t see it for myself because I had no contact with the outside world. I had to find out for myself. I had to get out.

    And another thing I realized was that although we were finally being shown some truth about the real state of things, we were seriously lying to the public. What about all these $cientology events where the public are briefed on international stats and how booming $cn is. What a load of crap! I remember at the next event being sick at my stomache as the stats were announced knowing it was a complete falsehood.

    I even remember thinking that maybe the Smell the coffee briefings were a lie to the base crew to get us more productive or something. But after getting out and seeing for myself that orgs are empty, I realized it was the truth.

    Getting out was quite a process and could be an entire novel or movie unto itself, but that story will be told at a later time.

    Who else remembers these briefings?”

  77. I’m not surprised, Marty, primarily because that tone band seeks to weaken the integrity of others so all manner of shocking lies become acceptable. He really has gone the way of the televangelist.

  78. Hi Monte,

    Well said!! I agree with everything you say here. I will check out that link and send you another one. When you open it look tot he left hand side where all the tabs are. It has some of the best reading I have seen. I would like to hear your comments and get in comm.


  79. Thanks Jim,

    This area is a real pet peeve of mine. I would love it if you could do one of your investigative Master of Qual write-ups on this.


  80. Hi Jim,

    Oh by the way…I asked for disagreement checks and never got one while on the Level. Just more sec checks.

    Personally, I think the Church has gone mad on the subject of overts and withholds. I can see doing it for the persons benefit, but to keep doing it for the “security” of the group over and over every 6 months is a bit much. That is why I came to the conclusion that they were and are being done for revenue and control purposes.

    When I am working on a problem, I never think about beauty….but when I am finished, if the solution is not beautiful, I know it is wrong.
    ~~R. Buckminster Fuller

  81. Yeah, they are making it look like they are conquering the world.

    Could the reason by for their promoting being on staff a “privilege” be because they are having a harder time getting staff members these days?

    I wonder what the real statistics of the church of scientology are now.

  82. Yeah still looks likeba cheap Gameshow to me.

    Cleuless couple is Cleuless

  83. Concerned Citizen

    Dear Alex,

    I must here side with Monte and Luis.

    It is not that we are trying to shut you down, is that we have more constructive things to do, more theta things to do, than getting caught in the GPM DM has designed. It is what they want us to do. I personally don’t see how it helps at all. I can explain how it actually hurts our cause a lot.

    There is a very big difference between providing specifics, time place form and event, of situations and the gripping Luis mentioned.

    I too have on occasion felt that impulse, but what tone level is that? What does that do to help me resolve the injuries and the upset? How does this natter help me to help others or clarify things? More importantly, do you realize that it is precisely this gripping DM is trying to cultivate and which is used to raise funds and prevent well balance people from looking? When I first left the SO, I looked, but found mostly this kind of reactions, this sort of vague, ridicule, I got a personal axe to grind sort of thing.
    It did not answer anything for me, did not explain the situation or as- is things, it only made me feel attacked for supporting something that I knew had inherent value. Well, with all its flaws, it seemed saner than what I found in the net and I resolved never to look at these things again.

    There were a lot of accounts and true data on the net that I could not find because they were lost among these kinds of comments. I could have used that data then, and saved myself so much, but I could not find this valuable information, because it was obscured by natter and obvious ridicule that was generated by someone with an axe to grind, but which offer no explanation as to their side of the story.
    I later learned that cultivating this kind of comments is something OSA is working on, because they know it creates this effect. When we indulge, we play right into OSA’s hands. We all see the outpoints, we all have experiences that make us upset to some degree or another, we need the truth, the specifics, the answers, no more natter and upsets that answer nothing.
    There is plenty of that. If that is what you feel you must do, I do not fault you, certainly do not want to censor you, by all means do it, but not here, for here is finally a place where people like me can get some real answers and make an informed decision, without having to worry that things are colored by personal upsets. There are no shortages of places to vent, feel free to muck, ridicule, take pot shots etc, in those places, please do not do this here. Here, here is where answers lie, where reason shines and we need to preserve that. That is all my friend, we do understand your upset and we to feel like deriding and commenting in that fashion sometimes, heck it is only human, but we can and most rise above it for the above reasons.

  84. Thanks for the comm Monty.

    You sound like you are very cool.


  85. Sherry, I don’t agree that DM wants OTVIII’s because they are not trained. Many of them are trained, sadly in the Golden Age of out tech. These OTVIII’s are like pod people; they are very easy to control. Imagine that, they have gone all the way up the bridge to become other determined. What a win for the dwarf.

  86. In your first comment you sneer at his wife’s looks. In your second you are so compassionate you feel a strong desire to ‘save’ them. Your contributions to this blog frequently seem a bit ‘off’ to me.

  87. I was never in that push for real, OEC/FEBC, 1991. But my “Case” jammed right there on that cycle.
    (Flew to ITO to do the line-up. Spent a Month in LA Petitioning for OK. But should of NEVER been sent without the most fundamental of quals. such as SS II & Production Record.)
    I’d love to know more about that cycle, with those who lived it.
    Can I email you too?

    I think I can see two more outpoints, that picture of Tim “Cruise” looks grossly abrasive; like a) someone who’s punched someone, and b) should be. lol

  88. I think Sherry’s talking about admin training, which most aren’t trained in.

  89. ““….in 1982 LRH was consulted regarding a situation with SOLO NOTS auditors at the time, to which LRH responded “ get them in, get them cleaned up, and keep them cleaned up”. Thus, the six month check line was born……..”.

    This doesn’t conflict at all with the refs Jim laid out. Nothing in this supposed quote calls for non-case-specific blanket handlings of all solo NOTs cases regardless of whether they’re running well on the level or not.

  90. I wanted to get opinions on a few questions:

    1. Do you think David Miscavige’s way of looking at things and his way of doing things have trickled down to lower executives and lower orgs?

    2. If yes, how much to you think it has trickled down?

    3. Do you have any evidence to show or point to that it has trickled down to lower executives and lower orgs?


    Tim H.

  91. My take is; We are going to see allot more “Cellebs” recruited with lots of fan-fare in the near future…
    DM’s going to use them to help Stuff-up Orgs. All quite overtly, then cut them loose long before their 2 1/2 – ahem… 5 year “contract”.

    This is probly made quite clear to them from the onset. ‘No strings attached.’ (For them, but not necessarily for those who foolishly follow their lead…
    Easily “replacing” themselves in about two and a half Months, with the lamest most approving excuse.

    Take actress Cassandra Hepburn, who recently joined staff at Scientology Las Vegas. Who appeared in Quentin Tarantino films?

    Like, that isn’t a Stat Push…total piece of BS.

    Watch for it.

  92. Virgil Samms

    I just want to get something straight here. I believe OT VII and OT VIII are fine as far as they are. They are, after all, LRH approved OT sections.

    What is happening is that there is suppression on the lines where they are delivered and when one does the OT sections like VII and VIII there are out tech arbitraries such as the 6 month checks, IAS regging, Superpower crapola and so forth.

    When you have suppression on the lines, the case gain is not going to be happening as it should and if it does, then the person will lose any gain right away (R/C). In other words how can you go OT when you are PTS and there is suppression on the lines?

    So please understand the actual mechanics. Attacking OT V, VII or VIII is not the correct target. When we use these OT sections out here in Indie-land we will be using the same exact tech, sans the suppression. Attacking the suppression is the correct target.

    Stay on target, please.

  93. Hi Concerned Citizen,

    You make some good points.

    Sometimes, we here on this blog, bring out specifics and sometimes we natter and ridicule too. In my opinion it is just the spirit of play.

    For me it is sometimes therapeutic. When I see the horrors that have been committed in the name of freedom and so forth, I just have to hit back in some way. Maybe for me it is putting me at slight gentle cause. I understand if it isn’t for you, I don’t see it as something that would be a deterent for others getting the facts.

    When we take things too seriously they can be harder to confront. A little humor now and then softens up the subject IMHO.


  94. Concerned Citizen


  95. I aggree with you. I have to control my impulses better. She still has a cleuless smile though in light of what is going on. Although atributing that might be a bit mean. For the replacing of the Semi model in the light that I thought it was she hosting the event. I stand corrected although the observation that lies therein she would not be a Gameshow assistent is not far fetched.

    Nice to meet you Toby Jugg and thank you for your obeservation. I can be a vilein and nasty creature but I am glad you called me on it for it was sitting there as a giant ellephant in the room. I feel reliefed.

    But I reserve the right to be vicious to the hardcore villans like Moxon and Slappy and the “lesser gods” that are instrumental keeping people in bounds.

    Evil guys are Evil


  96. The funny part is after he drops the body he has he’s got to find another one this planet. He won’t be able to take the money with him.

  97. Alex, thanks much for the link. I made a trip to that site last night and began reading. I read the Peter Green debrief, the Julie Mayo material and the Joleen Marshall letter. As I read these personal accounts I was struck with how similar the stories were to many of the personal accounts that have been featured here on Marty’s blog and elsewhere. Indeed, I found myself amazed that personal accounts from late in the first decade of this new millinneium so closely mirror personal accounts from the early 80s as well as anywhere in between. It’s like watching Shakespere’s Hamlet being enacted again and again and again by one thespian troupe after another. And over the span of time the locations, props, and names of many of the characters change but the story line remains the same with key elements such as comedy, tragedy, victim, good, bad, right and wrong, being constant from one enactment to the next. So, what does this tell me? Well, it tells me that….

    1) We really like this particular Scn play and never seem to tire of it.


    2) We are asleep and we don’t even realize that there is an ongoing theatrical presentation or that we are continually assuming a role, whether it be a member of audience or a leading part, within the play. Therefore, we are locked in to seemingly infinite repeat performances.

    I believe that it is number 2. In order to continue to participate in and perpetuate such a nonconstructive play in the game of life it is necessary that we remain asleep to it. Because obviously, as proven here and elsewhere, when we wake up…we leave the theatre and have nothing more to do with that script. We break the seemingly endless loop of re-enactments and move on.

    DM and all the others who are continuing to enact this dead end aberrated play are all asleep. But this is no dream that they are having while they sleep, this is a nightmare that they are unable to awake from. And the ONLY reason it can exist is because the beings involved are and remain asleep. And the proof of this, if proof is required, is witnessed in seeing that when a being wakes up they stop doing this shit to themselves and others and they go on to find a more constructive game to play.

    For whatever the reason we and many others managed to wake up from the nightmare and now that we are awake to what has been going on for so many years, we are doing what we can, however we can, to wake the rest of us up. We are the alarm clock. We are the cold water in the face. We are the persistent shake, the pinch and voice saying “Wake Up! You’re having a bad dream! You’re having a nightmare! For Gawd’s sake, snap out of it!”

    Father Anthony DeMello:

  98. Freedom Fighter

    Exactly, Virgil!

  99. Alex,
    This string pull to the references is pretty short. The references on the Sec Checking of persons in the No Interference Zone are the ones I’m quoting.

    The LRH ‘advice’ quoted above doesn’t conflict with these HCOBs. There is no justification technically to administer ‘Six Month Checks’ as a mandatory action on persons in the No Interference Zone. That’s it. That’s all there is.

    The entire operation , save for those cases as described in the HCOBs, is arbitrary. BFO’s by the way, Base Flag Orders, are not technically senior to HCOBs. ‘Advices’ are not senior to HCOBs.

    Aside from that, there is no conflict between the ‘advice’ mentioned above, and the HCOBs. There is a conflict between David Miscavige’s exegesis of ‘advices’ and LRH data published in LRH written or approved HCOBs.

  100. Virg,
    You got it buddy. Case gain doesn’t occur over problems unhandled. Rollercoaster = connected to Suppression. Hidden Standards = connected to Suppression/Suppressive.

    “The chief stumbling block, huge above all others, is the upset we have with POTENTIAL TROUBLE SOURCES and their relationship to Suppressive Persons or Groups.” PL 7 March 65 RB Suppressive Acts.

  101. Thanks Jim.

  102. War and peace where do you think Anonymous gets his Dramatizations from *wink*

    Anonymous has studied its subject-matter before it went to task.

    Ever wondered why you see them wear fedoras in the earlier protests or bussinessuites ? They must have “keyed in” to something. Ever wondered why there is must to do about Marcabia ?

    Yes subliminal messaging has been used to protest the Church. How about that.

    Agent of the 5th invader fleet, CD

  103. Hi Monte,

    I’m glad you liked that link. I am reading the project camelot stuff now, pretty interesting.

    Nice video clip too, yes there are a lot of asleep people that is forsure!

    By the way, your writing is excellent. You should consider writing an article and posting it on the Scientology-Cult site, you are a very good philosopher.

    The man who strikes first admits that his ideas have given out. ~~ Chinese Proverb


  104. Hi Tim H,

    I don’t know who you are asking so I will answer. I don’t want you to get answer hunger. 🙂

    1. Yes, most definitely!
    2. Very far down. My friends and I would observe out-points for years thinking it was just the unhatted lower orgs doing this nutty stuff. This has been going on for years. Then we realized if it wasn’t being pushed down the org board it would not continue to happen. If you ran a company couldn’t you get your juniors to stop doing seriously destructive things over and over??
    3. There is a ton of evidence. It sounds that you might be at the early stages of your awakening. Just keep reading and studying and filling the vacuum. You will find your answers.


  105. Luis Agostini

    The road to gaining the hearts and minds of anyone is not, in my certainty, the ridiculing one, the making wrong, the inflicting pain, one.

    By ridiculing the “picturee” an enemy has been gained.

  106. Tim it’s the orders that “trickle down” most effectively, it’ s not mystical if that’s what you’re wondering.

  107. “3. There is a ton of evidence. It sounds that you might be at the early stages of your awakening. Just keep reading and studying and filling the vacuum. You will find your answers.”

    No I’ve know this for 7 years. I wanted to know if there was any other stuff other than what I’ve seen that I could place on my blog to show others.

  108. Al Baker! Love him!!! I was at ITO from 1988 to 1990. Saw the renos at the management building and the KTL/LOC and Pro TRs evolutions. And studied with Debbie Cook. I also had Linda Verner Johnson and Lisa Frau as sups. I arrived back at my org three months before the big OEC release in March 1991. I sobbed.

  109. Hi Tim H,

    Well, I don’t think I have any other evidence then you have seen already. Good job promoting all this. No insult intended, since you are a veteran at this!!


  110. Barney Rubble

    Virg and Jimmie,


  111. Virgil
    I agre with you.
    I personally know both Tim and Rona Bowles, for 30 or so years. They are both very sincere and dedicated. I have respect and admiration for them both. I must also say they are not being honest and not confronting what is happening in front of them. That was also true of me until just a short while ago. We all come to face the real “truth” in our own way and in our own time, truth is what we observe and see to be truth, sometimes it takes a bit to see through the smoke and mirrors. It is a very hard point to come to as a Scientologist, especially on staff in an org or in the Sea Org. It is very hard. One of the hardes things I have ever had to deal with. Those like Tim and Rona should not be criticized. They are being used in a very cruel way, just like many of us were. To use people through the love and respect they have of LRH is the highest cruelty imaginable. Please do not make less of those who are being so used.

  112. The shift from Saint Hill size Orgs to Ideal Orgs.

    For years the goal was to get the Scientology Orgs to Saint Hill size. Recently, it appears to me that this has changed. I could be wrong that they have abandoned the Saint Hill size idea ( and please correct me if I am ) but it looks to me as if they have. The church of scientology has been buying new buildings, fixing them up real pretty and calling them “Ideal Orgs”. If they have abandoned the Saint Hill size idea than that means they’re moving away from one of LRH’s ideas to their own ideas, which personally, I think they should not be doing.

    Does anyone know for certain that the church of scientology has abandoned the Saint Hill size idea?

  113. Toby,

    One of the great thing about Marty’s blog is Marty’s willingness to let people with a variety of viewpoints contribute. In my opinion, there are comments posted by a variety of people that occassionally seem “off.” So be it. In an open forum this gets sorted out.

    I appreciated Cat Daddy’s contributions, and I think he adds considerable value to the forum. He also has the ability to correct himself, an ability to be admired above many others.

  114. Drop a line anytime!

  115. One thing I wanted to mention here about Ideal Orgs:
    I went to several of their websites, and they have VERY fancy bookstores. On these sites, and on Bridges’ site, you can order all the new books. But has anyone noticed you can’t order the OEC books? Executive Volumes? Tech Volumes? I’ve been looking everywhere, and maybe it’s out there and I just haven’t found it. But I’ve been looking, and I definitly see OMITTED TECH. Just a little minor thing I noticed. Checking to be sure I’m not missing something.

  116. Silvia Kusada

    IT is fundamental to flourish and prosper. It is also important to continue to expose out tech and alteration of the goal for the new people that every day for the first time are looking at the web to find more data. It should be done comparing the true LRH tech. A sort of true data study and false data srtipping…

  117. Silvia Kusada

    such a good point!! now I do understand why, they forced the auditor in training to go into a checksheet to study the basic which wa formulated as an extension of the academy or BC… so they could count the points…

  118. ?? Luis??

    You have to be able to move on the tone scale my friend. We are all not at serenity of beingness, not even the enemy.


  119. “Evil guys are Evil.”

    The assignment and handling of evil is an interesting but slippery area. Maybe some of your victims would consider that you were evil when you were being a ‘vilein and nasty creature.’ A cyclo driver thought I was evil the other day because I didn’t pay him the ridiculous amount he wanted. I thought he’d overcharged me, so it was all a matter of viewpoint.

    Given that evil is a huge subject, one mechanism that allows people to act in evil ways is to denigrate, dehumanize and demonize the fellow or fellows on ‘the other side’. This is the mechanism that allowed insane witchhunts such as those seen in Cambodia in the 70s and in the Chinese cultural revolution. We can see minor but significant examples in your message wherein you refer to one unnnamed individual as “Slappy” and say that both he and Rick Moxon are ‘hardcore villains’.

    Not to worry though. This is a common mental mechanism. Sometimes it stems from the fear of being accused oneself and sometimes its the famous mote in the other man’s eye that keeps our attention off our own plank. I’m sure most of us are guilty of it at one time or another.

  120. StillWaters

    Slappy the Squirrel AKA David Miscavige deserves jailtime in my opinion. Kendrick L. Moxon deserves jailtime alsoo. And a lot of others need a serious reality adjustment.

    Your words are all true and you are absolutely right.

    I have checked I can not remember ever to have enslaved anybody, been instrumental in anybodys death or ordered anybody in a chainlocker.

  121. Ceileen, you wrote…

    “We all come to face the real “truth” in our own way and in our own time, truth is what we observe and see to be truth, sometimes it takes a bit to see through the smoke and mirrors.”

    When I read this sentence Ceileen it stopped me dead in my tracks. Prior to early yesterday morning that would have not been the case. More than likely I would have just read your sentence, shook my head in agreement and said in thought, “Yeah Ceileen, so true.” However, yesterday morning as I traversed that in-between ethereal area that divides the dream world and the so called “real” world, I had a revealation of no small magnitude. And it just so happens that the viewpoint you expressed is a major component of this revelation I speak of.

    I was a loyal, dedicated, active scientologist from March 78′ up until I watched the dvd of the BASICS event in 07′. After viewing that event I ceased being active. And, to clarify, what I mean when I use the word ‘active’, is that I continually disseminated LRH and his technologies. After seeing the event I stopped any dissemination because I perceived that something not okay was ocurring within my church. But, this separation I was doing was just with the church, certainly not with LRH or the tech.

    Until I finally began to search the internet in Nov of last year for information about the CoS, which soon brought me to where I began to read the many articles and watch the videos, I had absolutely no idea (and would have never imagined) how far off the rails the CoS had gone. I was astounded, shaken and as my stable datums were being vaporized wholesale, my universe went into a vigorous tumble mode. That being noted, it did not take me long to formulate some workable stable datums to replace those which had been obliterated and adjust to this new reality of the evil despot DM and the CoM.

    The next stage of the process, though, has not been so easy i.e., answering questions like, where am I now? What am I now? How does this impact my relationship with Scn? And much like a jilted lover on the rebound, I quickly reached over to the Indie Movement and identified myself as being an Independent Scientologist. And, in looking back that was, without a doubt, the most pro-survival move I could have made at the time. And the reasons, I would think, are obvious if anyone has spent much time here on Marty’s or Steve’s, Jeff’s, Geir’s, Old Auditor’s and a few other’s websites. That said, it was, for me, an important point (no EP – not even close) reached within the ongoing process.

    Having the lie of DM and CoS revealed just opened up the can of worms for me. Thus I began a new and very difficult stage of my process. But this is where I stop with my story and come back to look at your sentence Ceileen. Especially this part, “…truth is what we see and observe to be the truth…”

    I would expect that almost anybody who is reading this has at least some familiarity with Ron’s essay, Personal Integrity. At the end of that essay he writes something to the effect, in Dianetics and Scientology what is true for you is true for you. And this concept stated here by Ron is what my revelation that I had yesterday morning had to do with. Here’s what hit me: An expanded way of looking at this statement is, in Dn and Scn what is true for you is what you have created for yourself to be true. In other words, what is true for you is the illusion that you have created as being your truth.

    With this revelation, I suddenly understood that the reason I was having such a difficult time in sorting out where I was in relation to LRH and scientology was due to the fact that I was attempting to find the “real” truth while not being cognizant that my “truth”, my illusion, was constantly getting in the way.

    You see, I had awakened to the fact that the instant my path intercepted the path of LRH and CoS, I began creating my illusion of Ron, the church, the tech and so on and so forth. And all the conversations and experiences that I had during the entire time I was an active scientologist, on a very subtle level, served as fodder to feed my unique illusion (truth) of L. Ron Hubbard, the CoS and everything else that had to do with the subject. I realize now that it was my continuous creating of this very complex illusion which is what kept me blind to what was actually going on with Ron, the church, DM, etc. And, as I now peel away my illusion, like one peels the plastic from a CD case, I can clearly see that I was being incredibly generous to the isness I had wrapped up in my illusion.

    There was a movie that came out some years ago that I only watched a part of when it finally came to TV. In the movie something had occured that caused this guy to see, what in reality was a very obese woman, as being this slender fine figure of a woman (his illusion superimposed over the isness) that he was enormously attracted to. Well, this movie, at least this part of the movie, serves as an appropriate example that illustrates what I had been actively doing with Ron, the church, the tech and so on. Again, another major point has been reached in my ongoing process.

    Thank you Ceileen for presenting me with the catalyst to write about this. Also, thanks to Alex Metheny for directing me to that collection of debriefs from the early 80’s, they too were quite instrumental in pushing this revelation up to the surface.

  122. Saint Hill size had to be abandoned because you need growth in order to achieve that goal, not shrinkage. Idle Orgs you only need brick and mortar, which is easier to assemble than people.

  123. Word on the street is that there will be a new release of the OEC vols soon.

    Wouldn’t surprise me about the others being re-released soon too.

    It’ll be interesting to compare them to prior versions.

  124. Fellow Traveller

    I apologize for being a bit too brief on my comments re 8 and 9. I am not attacking them. I was commenting or attacking the state of their delivery within the Co$. It was a comment regarding my concerns related to the outKSW associated with them in the CoM.

    Jim is my hero. Well, a very insouciant opinion leader anyhow.

  125. I’m scared. If anyone is selling an old set, I’m buying!

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