Has Miscavige’s “church” Run Out of Clears to Invalidate?


David Miscavige’s level of desperation is apparently red lining, as evidenced by this OSA operative email received by Monique “Mosey” Rathbun yesterday.


Dear Mosey,

Per the below HCOB your state of “clear”, as declared by Mar-tey,
is hereby CANCELLED!

Saint Hill Manor, East Grinstead, Sussex


Any org staff declaring a Dianetic Clear “achieved in other
practices” is subject to expulsion from the Church.

Technically, a very few thetans have never been anything but Clear.
These few didn’t “go Clear” on anything; they have simply always
been Clear. When a natural Clear is found, it should be so stated.
To assign this condition to some other practice is a suppression of
Dianetics and Scientology.

Anyone evaluating for or feeding a preclear data to persuade him to
declare Dianetic Clear is also actionable.

Anyone suppressively validating squirrel practices or groups by
stating they are producing Dianetic Clears is also actionable as
above, as it is not possible. It requires the exact application of
Scientology and Dianetics technology to bring a preclear up to the
state of Clear, whether on NED after Grades or on the Clearing

Falsely declaring a person Clear who isn’t and failing to declare
one who made it on Dianetics or the Clearing Course or who has
always been Clear are also actionable.

In the event of a false attest, the C/S, Director of Validity and
any other org staff involved in the cycle are subject to a
Committee of Evidence and, if found guilty, are subject to
suspension of all certs. (Ref: HCO PL 7 Mar. 65 II, CERTIFICATE

People don’t go Clear in garbage eating or psychiatry – they
perish. Thus, herding people into their hands by falsely validating
them is suppressive.

Any and all such false declares are cancelled.


End of email.

It occurred to me that, according to this very reference, if anyone should be de-certified and declared suppressive it ought to be Miscavige; dozens, if not hundreds, of times over. First, there is the wild pendulum swings, from arbitrary declarations of Clear where not evidenced (e.g. Lisa McPherson, himself, etc), to the other end of the spectrum, the hundreds of Clears he has de-Cleared arbitrarily. In fact, it goes beyond even that. The organizations he has created are prohibited from declaring Clears or undeclaring them no matter what the circumstance because they are in violation of these specific provisions of the cited HCOB:

Any org staff declaring a Dianetic Clear “achieved in other practices” is subject to expulsion from the Church.

Anyone suppressively validating squirrel practices or groups by stating they are producing Dianetic Clears is also actionable as above, as it is not possible.

People don’t go Clear in garbage eating or psychiatry – they perish. Thus, herding people into their hands by falsely validating them is suppressive.

Mosey’s immediately composed and sent reply to the above email highlights just how far off the deep end Miscavige has gone:

Thank you for your eval. But I keep telling you church people I am not, nor will I ever be, a member of your so called church. I have no interest whatsoever! Therefore, you do not have any power to cancel anything on me. Am I making myself crystal CLEAR?? Why don’t you go find one of your church members and run your non-clear r factor, because it has no effect here. Unless you guys have completely run out of church members to run it on.

490 responses to “Has Miscavige’s “church” Run Out of Clears to Invalidate?

  1. Tony DePhillips

    Mosey, you go girl!!
    That was a spot on handling!! LOL!!

  2. Azul Celeste

    I got a r-factor on the phone by someone at StHill last year that I may not be Clear. Yep. From the CS. I was trying to be polite, but it was a challenge to my TRs. Not to control anger, but a scandalized “WTF??”. Keep up the auditing guys!

  3. Freedom Fighter

    Someone needs to word clear this person on the diffinition of a “squirrel” ’cause they’ve got the mother of all squirrels running around in their midst and can’t even see him.

    I was spittin’ mad reading this until I got down to Mosey’s response. Snap!! Mosey, girl, you ROCK!!

  4. It is kind of scary to have someone tell you {in writing per LRH policy no less} that you have been decertified as a Clear if after lets say you have already finished OT II?

    Could it be for the money?

    A person that has gone Clear and is in the Non-Interference area moving up to and through OT III? Chances are that person will NOT go Clear again in this lifetime. Or the next?

    So what do they do? 25 Intensives of Sec Checks until it is dicovered WHY your case is not progressing?

    I can’t even beleive I am hearing this.

    But, I heard it, so I guess I believe it.

    There is another Class XII out there, and that he said the same thing just about, that DM was ordering people’s gains {whether attested to or not} invalidated to the church can give them more “further processing” until they *finally…* get the result?

    Oh my goodnes, I would not nuts! {LOL}

  5. Freedom Fighter

    Typing too fast. Should say “definition”. 🙂

  6. Watching Eyes

    So now Standard Tech is considered an “other practice”? That’s rich.

    Make sure when you email back to the crims that you include a link to this blog. They’re deathly afraid of it. And you just never know…….someone might read it and leave.

    I’d like to see lots of people posting auditing & training wins, wins in life etc. Flourish & Prosper. This will let others know that it’s possible to do well, very well in fact, outside the walls of the CofM. It will tell people still lurking or in doubt that the only way to do well in life is to GET OUT.

  7. Mosey, you go girl! I love your response and it is so fitting.That little man continues to show his colors. The only “squirrel” I know of is DM himself.
    He, once again has turned policy around. Anything written by LRH has been turned around to benefit himself.

    Love to Mosey and her standard tech Auditor

  8. Dear Mosey,

    Congratulations on your wins, your marriage and your clear state!
    In reference to the comm you received from the Church of Out Tech!
    Excellent response and now you can block their email address!
    I am so…glad I am out of there!

  9. Priceless.

  10. ✩ ♥ ✩ ♥ ✩ ♥ You go girl! 🙂 ✩ ♥ ✩ ♥ ✩ ♥

    “It requires the exact application of Scientology and Dianetics technology to bring a preclear up to the state of Clear, whether on NED after Grades or on the Clearing Course.”
    We KNOW this is not happening in CofM, sad but true. It starts with reading a meter; if that’s out, then go no further…it’s ALL out. Sad for the believers stuck in though it is.

  11. I felt the same way! Then BAM, Mosey put that SP right in their place! No thought-stopping on her…those asswholes!

  12. Way to go, Mosey! YAY!

  13. Great response Mosey!

    Per the below HCOB ALL the states of “Clear” who have been de-Cleared, as declared by David Misgarbage’s church, are hereby CANCELLED!

    I was one of those de-Cleared, who David Misgarbage extorted over $60,000.00 from to do various Flag only “programs” in order to convince me that I am not Clear.
    Thanks to my amazing, 100% Standard auditor, Mr. Marty Rathbun, my true state of Clear has finally been validated and I am ready to move up a little higher and no longer stuck or refusing to go in session. It is the first time I am actually winning!
    I knew after all the money I spent in the church, there was no hope for me to really move up the Bridge. David Misgarbage’s intention is to stop people from winning and doing well in life.

    Thank you Marty for being an amazing auditor!

  14. Congratulations Mosey! When Marty wrote the post about being Crystal Clear, though your name was not mentioned, I was hoping it was you! Hooray! I am so happy for you and for your auditor!

    Love, Gaiagnostic

  15. Awesome insouciant response to the invalidating, evaluating bastards! I’ll stop right there as the four-letter words are going to gush forth in a flood if I don’t!

  16. Mosey’s reply to this pointless email is so spot on. If Clear is an actual state, that state is not linked uniquely to Scientology, which is only a path to the state of Clear. Even LRH says so, indirectly, in KSW1. The CoS is the least qualified organization on earth to determine if an alternative path to Clear exists because it has no motivation to do so, and in any case would be forbidden from investigating the existence of alternative paths. I assume that the typical independent Scientologist simply thinks that he/she has a path that works and thus follows it. Hopefully he/she is not caught up in the same illogic that the CoS is, which is that there is only one true path and no other path could possibly lead to Clear.

  17. Marty,

    Judging by the workman like way Miscavige and his cronies went about rounding up the remaining “church” members who were clear and de-certifying them these last few years, and the fact that there weren’t that many “church” members left anyway, I’d say he has run out of clears in the “church” on which to run this crap.

    This is definitely straight from DM, it bears his hallmarks:

    1. Making strange and suppressive tech pronouncements in weird ways, in this case an email but that’s definitely his “style” or rather lack of it.

    2. “C/Sing” (if you can really call it that) without ever studying the folder because of his suppressive know best which knows no bounds and for which he is now infamous.

    3. Pretending to apply tech but really acting out of spiteful revenge, prejudice and bias which has to be the most degraded thing I have ever witnessed masquerading as Scientology.

    I am shaking my head at the idea of what the author of the tech would say or do. Something that includes Miscavige, town and a rail come to mind.

  18. Mosey,

    Listen, I watched this same idiot walk around the Int/Gold Base one afternoon asking every staff member he came to (about 20), “Are you clear?” Each would answer and he would in some cases and in other cases not ask, “What was your cog?” It was amazing to watch his face and body go into near convulsions of joy, actually more like lust dripping off of him while he told each and every one with “great authority” (intended only to crush them), “WRONG! You’re NOT clear!” The more caved in or shocked the person was the more his body convulsed. It was really VERY ugly to watch.

    Later that evening back in Room 51 (the “officers lounge” – which only he could use of course being “the only true officer”) he goes on about how he is now having to work on OT 9 and 10 and above because he is, “The only tech terminal left”. (He had declared the others.)

    Well, I wonder if anyone actually knows just how much “tech training” this obnoxious jerk actually has? How about his actual case level?

    Shelly, his loyal wife and Assistant – who had locked Dave’s folders up some years prior to telling me – let me in on that secret…! (As a note I was told that Dave had her lock his folders up so no one could “mess up his case”…. LMAO!)

    It truely is amazing this little brat would even consider evaluating for you or anyone about their case or for that matter even their comm-cycle. He’s about as qualified as I am and I’ll tell you straight up that I am NOT.

    Actually, I guess the difference is I know I am not and I am happy others are. To him, the idea that anyone else could be more “technically trained” drives him insane so he’s killed them all off and propped himself up way way way way way way way way higher than he ever made it.

    In case no one noticed, Dave’s got a real self-importance button, to say the least.

    But anyway, my point is, he just can’t stand the idea that you made it and he hasn’t.

    Guess Who

  19. I am not surprised by this tactic, notwithstanding the fact that Mosey is the 2D of Marty. It happens to others even inside, as detailed above.

    Case and point. I have known three Clears who were later declared not so. One was a Flag CCRD completion, the two others, DCSI completions when Ron was on the line. ALL THREE WERE INVALIDATED AS NOT CLEAR by the DM mest machine, years later. One left Scientology, the other fell off the lines and the third was sent running out of the org in tears, being chased by HGC personel in an attempt to get them to stay for more degraded invalidation, and some crush regging to get them to pay for even more.

    Mosey, their attempt to mock you is yet another pathetic attempt to destroy something they know they cannot destroy – the true, validated state of a beings case level. Their attempts are laughable. They alter the tech and then have the audacity to impart some glib authority over people who have sought LRH tech in the field where it is largely practiced as LRH instructed – as demanded by most PCs. Can you believe this??

    To any OSA worm reading this: Your Jedi mind tricks wont work on us. Go back to work on your end of endless super power real estate projects. Have Tommy pinch you harder. Maybe that will speed things up.


  20. Hell, I was de-Cleared in the middle of NOTs – and so were a number of others at the same time.

    Let’s just say there were a few unhappy campers – ugh!

  21. “Any org staff declaring a Dianetic Clear “achieved in other practices” is subject to expulsion from the Church.”

    Marty, in order to attempt the inval on Mosey, the OSA troll quoted an HCOB that refers to you as “Org Staff.” Now that is a, pardon the expression, a Freudian slip if I ever saw one!

    BTW, I enjoyed you watching you put John Sweeney on the cans. That was a good, straightforward, honest use of the meter. I nearly fell out of my chair when you and Mike ended the demo and did not try to reg John for $360,000 + a $40,000 IAS donation + a $5,000 IAS Lifetime membership like they do in Miscavigology.

    It is true: Auditing can be decoupled from crush regging. In Miscavigology, the two are permanently welded together.


  22. Cool response Mosey. Good job.
    David Miscavige is the ultimate squirrel….correctly named “the mother of all squirrels.”
    Nowhere is he more KNOW BEST and Harmful than on the Declare Clear Line.
    He has even turned the Clear declare cycle into a Corporate $$$$$ money making venture, with Clears being declared and undeclared over and over, as much as 5x and 6x, each time, the parishioner must pay newly $$$$ for new CCRDs and Clear cycle reviews.
    AFTER one has attested OT 8, DM’s CSes trained in DM’s ‘Golden Age of Tech” “realize” the person is not CLEAR and they must re-do bridge starting with NED.

    There are no refunds or credits for “FALSE Bridges” that DM’s cult delivered. You pay again. $$$$$

    In most places in the United States where you PAY for a messed up product, you are granted a replacement e.g.. the Lemon Law on cars. If you buy a refridgerator, stereo , IPOD, whatever, a malfunctioning one is replaced at no cost. DM rigidly runs auditing as a BUSINESS model. No Free pass. You will not get 1 hour credit over paid hours til you PAY again. No charity in the Orgs.

    And when the declare of clear is cancelled, due to service deliver “ERROR”, the pc must pay, pay and pay again.

    Some 5 years ago I was at AOLA re-doing some NOTS. Out of the blue sky my auditor BURT announced that we would be looking into my CLEAR STATUS via HCO Sec Check. I was appalled. I had no issues on the subject.

    This is a DM inventi0n. An HCO SECURITY CHECK on a personal own universe state ?????????? How does a clear or non clear status endanger the SECURITY of the Church ?

    Yes, it was “NOT auditing YOU”, meaning this was being done as an interrogatory for the Org for HCO not for any benefit for the pc. The HCO questions were rude, insulting and out of ARC.

    One intensive of mine, well over $5000 was wasted on this drivel until I raised the stakes with increasing impingement, then everyone apologised and all the hogwash was cancelled.

    However I lost 12.5 hours in the garbage auditing.

    Haydn James and I had a comm cycle, some months back where I found out that HCO sec checks on clear was occurring in the UK and God knows where else. HCO Sec Check Clear for more bucks$$$$$$

    DM the mother of all squirrels on Clear Status.

  23. Sooooooo….I wonder if anyone at Flag would like to hold a comm ev on the totally botched clear cycles of 11 people I know who left FSO in disgust? Would anyone at FSO or RTC be interested in investigating their own squirrel auditing and C/Sing which resulted in failing to declare 9 of these folks as valid clears? Or leaving the other two with very very bad indicators instead of the VGIs on “not being clear” that they had when handled by a “competent” class VIII C/S? Is anyone at Flag aware of how many of their own (current) public call their CCRD the Clear Uncertainty Rundown?

    I wonder how many hundreds of such cycles have left the Flag Land Base with Very Bad Indicators after receiving squirrel auditing? Comm ev anyone? SP declares anyone?

    Judging by the email you received, Mosey, they may not be able to run out service facs anymore, but they sure are top-notch professionals at running them IN.

  24. Are you guys sure that this is really by the C of S and not a prank by someone? The last that I heard is that they don’t accept any auditing status within the Freezone or by the Independents. If they don’t accept it, they don’t cancel it.

    All cancellations of C of S certificates I have seen were made in writing and mailed with the USPS. C of S makes these things very official.

    Can you post the header? Can it be traced back to C of S server?

  25. I really can’t wrap my head around this OSA e-mail. The only thing I can get from it is two things. First, overts make you stupid. Second, stupid people are too stupid to see how stupid they are, being cut off from the fruits of observation. Let me explain the above HCOB clearly.

    If you let someone attest to going Clear on Vipassana meditation, that is suppressive because it invalidates Dianetics and Scientology.

    If someone goes Clear on Book One without ever setting foot in a “Tschursch” then that is great! Way to go on knocking out the bank! LRH would love it. If Marty audits someone on the Grades and then they go Clear on NED, same thing.

    If someone is a past life Clear, then invalidating that is truly suppressive, since it invalidates the very concept of the time track. Whats that, RTC does that constantly? Well, maybe if you disconnected from those SPs you would be much happier.

  26. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    That email is a perfect typical example of CofS leaders using violent communication as their primary method of communication, and also displays their utter lack of and regard for compassion.

    The email’s quality has ZERO empathy.

    There is absolutely no ARC in it.

    Clearly, this is NOT Scientology. It is fraud. It is a letter from an imposter pretending to be a Scientologist. This imposter Scientologist, from the squirrel group called CofS, is “suppressively validating squirrel practices or groups”.

    All the imposters Certs are hereby CANCELLED!

  27. Jean-François Genest

    Awesome reply Monique!! VWD Marty!
    Flourishing and prospering! You are definitely impinging and getting TA on OSA, DM and the C of $$.

  28. becomingAware

    Nice reply Mosey!

    It seems to me that they are shooting themselves in the foot again. Oh, wait, the 3 swing FN wasn’t a squirrel practice was it because it was ordered by the Dictator. I meant to say it was ordered by ‘Mr. On Source beat the Standard Tech into the Unappreciative Bastards’ himself. Yep, Mr So Low on the Effect Scale he is probably out looking for a cannon right now.

  29. Didn’t the church of scientology claim that Lisa McPherson was clear?

    Are clears supposed to have psychotic breaks?

    What does that tell you about their claim on being able to say who is or who isn’t clear?

  30. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Keep in mind, it’s the pride, admiration, and officialness of Certs which is the determinate factor as to whether or not one is really a Clear, an OT, or a good auditor!


  31. Dear Mosey:
    I am one Clear that Miscavige re-declared so he could make more money. I was audited by a Flag trained auditor, and when I arrived for my Oatee preps, I got the news that I was not Clear. That was squirrel.
    There are hundreds of people who were falsely declared not clear, after hundreds of hour auditing. Lets declared Miscavige.

  32. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    “Worship your Certs” is the mantra of CofS dogma.

  33. That stupid email they sent is like saying that gravity only works on their side of the street. That HCOB doesn’t even read like LRH writing. I wonder who really wrote it.

  34. Wait a minute? Where’s the Comm Ev? I guess the church sort of just stopped even trying.

    Great response, Mosey!

  35. Mosey…Good for You! Perfect answer.

  36. Scott Campbell


    That was just the kind of righteous “Flatty” upside the head I would expect from you in response to such a ridiculous attempt to invalidate you.

    “It’s the Bank that says the group is all and the individual nothing. It’s
    the Bank that says we must fail.” –LRH

    What kind of group would have the audacity to presume to invalidate one such as you. Obviously, a group that operates in Bank agreement.



  37. Now that is a big LOL Lutz for me to read that.

    I can shoot holes all through it even with my fogged auto immune brain. LOL. Means I can see what is wrong with it even if I am not thinking clearly.

    And to think I been afraid to get auditing out of the church and in what universe can only the tech be given in the official church.

    Crazy as loons church is and I am glad I see it more each day now.

  38. Joe Pendleton


    I do know why I got into Scientology, and I can tell you that it was not to be continually threatened in terms of all the offenses and penalties I coudl commit and be subject to. Started in the mid 60s really with all the listed misdemeanors, crimes and high crimes…then it continued in the early 70s with MORE THINGS THAT YOU CAN DO THAT ARE SUPPRESSIVE AND CAN GET YOU EXPELLED……like blowing, letting people go past misunderstoods,telling someone you weren’t gonna resign contract, etc.

    Folks, it’s a continuation of the OOOOOOLD DAYS on planet Earth (and LOOOONG before that I’m sure). Is it in Exodus that a person is subject to capital punishment for working on the Sabbath? Leviticus has capital punishment for cursing one’s parents (among many, many, many other crimes you can get expelled or killed for). Christianity put an end to the “Old Law” for a while, but the church still found enough transgressions to stone and burn people at the stake……and Islam has done very nicely, thank you, in establishing even more crimes that one can lose one’s hands or head to.

    Yeah, I know. In Scientology, we have ETHICS codes, not MORAL codes. Yeah, right…..and if you believe that……………

  39. Eileen Clark

    You are the classic textbook example of what comes from applying standard LRH tech to a person. You are the bomb!! That was such the perfect reply.
    Love, Eileen

    To the person who sent that email to Mosey:
    You are acting suppressively. That you do it from your position toward members of the C of S is despicable and cowardly. That you do it to someone who is not and never has been a member of the C of S is proof that you have lost control, completely. You’re on the slippery slope to hell. I feel sorry for you, sort of, because you are so pathetic. Mostly, you make me laugh. Have a nice day.
    Tick, Toc, Tick, Toc, Tick……..

  40. scilonschools

    My deepest respect to Mosey for her ‘Handling’ of the situation, and the strength of you relationship which is evident by your united front!!

  41. Please accept my correction on the above reply which came inadvertently with several typographical errors:

    1. 25 Intensives of Sec Checks until it is dicovered WHY your case is not progressing?
    SHOULD READ: 25 Intensives of Sec Checks until it is DISCOVERED WHY your case is not progressing?

    2. I can’t even beleive I am hearing this.
    SHOULD READ: I can’t even BELIEVE I am hearing this.

    3. There is another Class XII out there, and that he said the same thing just about, that DM was ordering people’s gains {whether attested to or not} invalidated to the church can give them more “further processing” until they *finally…* get the result?
    SHOULD READ: “There is another Class XII out there, and he said the same thing just about, that DM was ordering people’s gains {whether attested to or not} invalidated so the church can give them “further processing” until they *finally…* get the end result?

    4. Oh my goodnes, I would not nuts! {LOL}
    SHOULD READ: Oh my goodness, I would go nuts! {LOL}

    Otherwise, if I did not fix this, I am convinced I would be misunderstood.

  42. The definition of squirrel seems to be, ‘anyone who dares to do anything other than that which is expressly commanded by Chairman of Buildings, David Misdwithhold.
    The violation of ARC is astounding! First we alienate everyone outside of Scientology,then we alienate the upstats(read upstat as: those that GET it and genuinely APPLY it), then when we are left with nothing but other-determined Koolaid drinkers what do we do next?…………….poison the Koolaid?
    This is both horrifying and depressing at the same time. It’s like watching someone descend into drug addiction.
    On a lighter note, well done on holding your position in space, Mosey. you are a Rock and as you guys in the States would say, you rock!

    Fu Dog

  43. Mosey, I laughed out loud at your first sentence! “Thank you for your eval.” That’s ALL they are good at anymore! Total Professional Arrogance. I think you should have some brand new Clear number or something–anything to indicate that it was Standard and not nutso-quickie-SP-tech. I haven’t really properly congratulated you yet so Big Fat Congratulations, and to your auditor as well, and may you keep moving up and up and achieving the true gains that are there to be had. There is no correct tech within the structured church anymore but you sure are proof that it exists outside the fence, outside the ideal morgues. Life! Success! Happiness!

  44. Mosey,
    I’m currently reading “Atlas Shrugged”. It reminds me of when Hank Rearden was taken to court for having violated some absolutely destructive law and he stood up in court and said that they might have the authority to throw him in jail, but he would not in any way acknowledge their right to impose destructive laws and therefore would not plead anything and was willing to suffer the consequences. In the theoretical world that is “Atlas Shrugged” the authorities crumbled when a strong thetan stood up to them and exposed where they were at. Fortunately DM’s C of S is not the authority of the country, but the comparison is that they do crumble when someone stands up to them, who is theta, constructive, absolutely unafraid with nothing but goodness in their heart. Power to you, my sister.

  45. Mr. Mismanage acts like one of those wired (keyed in ) fathers who says:
    “You are not my son anymore”
    Like one can undue a done by just saying it did not happen!! Even DN does not undue the incident -only discharges the mental effect of it!
    Well done on your response Mosey :):)

    Look forward to a stat reporting from our group in the next few days (request of Silvia K)


  46. Mosey,
    You go girl!!

  47. When LRH wrote this bulletin it was after he got reports that people were being declared Clear from practices other than Dianetics and Scientology. THAT is what he is referring to. If you want to go to heaven, practice Christianity. If you want to achieve nirvana, practice Buddhism. If you want to go Clear, practice Scientology. Different religions offer different things. LRH was ticked that some C/Ses had awarded Clear certs to people who achieved them in whole track practices. That’s not where people go Clear. Basically, the whole mess resulting from Dn Clear starting in 1978 stems from C/Ses messing up and no one in management handling it terminatedly.

    Mosey’s response to this BS is utterly appropriate. Why the hell would anyone in the church care?

  48. Nightmares Getting Less


    Sounds like Mid Whittman’s campaign.

    I am disgusted by all of this now. Thank God Mosey is standing strong. Please continue.

  49. Per many articles on this site COS is a suppressive organisation. I herby declare its authority over Scientologists CANCELLED.

  50. That was a perfect reply Mosey!!! Nobody can take away from you what you’ve achieved with your auditing!!!
    Now just to add a personal experience on that same subject, recently a fellow contacted me after reading my story. After getting in good comm as a possible pc to audit, he told me that had attested to clear, but later got undeclared. He didn,t sound very happy about it at all, so I dug into it and asked him if he recalled what realization he had that he told his auditor when he was allowed to attest to clear in his CCRD. He replied most definitely that it was like yesterday, so when I prompted him to express what that was, without much effort at all, he voiced the so called “Clear Cognition” At wich point I asked if whatever he said was his honest realization and not something he read someplace or got told by anybody. He confirmed it as being a genuine cog of his, so I took responsibility for the guy, in a complete by-pass of the squirrel kingdom of Miscavology and told him that he had reached the EP of dianetics and thus he had validly made it to Clear! He was very happy indeed and didn’t spend a single cent to get sorted out.

  51. A warm up for Halloooooweeeeeeen.

  52. Impartial English Girl

    Is that the whiff of squirrel-tinged desperation I can smell…?

  53. Woohoo, Mosey, you’re awesome! It is so fun to be an Indy!!!

    Hey, COB, we don’t need any of your stinking certs!

    What a bunch of idiots. How do they ever expect to clear the planet this way??!!!

  54. Watching Eyes, here is something Miscavige was accused of in 1984 when the OT Committee World Wide convened a Comm EV on him:

    “2. Organizing a splinter group which takes and perverts Scientology materials or practices, in whole or in part, still calling it Scientology or calling it something else.”

    And he’s still at it, and he is calling it “Scientology” when it is not.

  55. Congratulations Mosey 🙂 and VWD to Marty.

    Poor DM must be feeling bad. Being an SP is pitiful enough but he’s rapidly becoming a failed SP. Perhaps he deserves to have his SP status cancelled as he just isn’t making the grade any more.

  56. What the heck, here’s a copy of the SP Declare of David Miscavige resulting from the above mentioned Comm Ev of 1984:

    David Miscavige SP Declare


    8 June 1984

    Ethics Order 1 Int
    All Scientologists

    DAVID MISCAVIGE of Los Angeles is hereby declared a Suppressive Person.

    This is in accordance with the Findings & Recommendations of the Comm Ev on Miscavige, conducted at the request of the OT Committee WorldWide. The Findings & Recommendations are available for public view at the OT Committees, and at ceratin Delivery Centres.

    The Interested Party failed to appear, nor did the Committee receive any evidence in defence of Miscavige. In the interest of Justice, the Comittee nevertheless proceeded, despite the recommendation in HCOPL 7Sep63: “Refusal or failure of an Interested Party to appeaar results in a recommendation of the full penalty possible in the dase for the Interested Party.”

    In June 1981, Miscavige – as Chairman of the All Clear Unit – forged a dispatch purporting to come from LRH. This dispatch removed Diane Voegerding, the then SO SMO Int and Miscavige’s senior, from post. This was an act of Mutiny.

    David Miscavige was a signatoryof the splinter group RTC on 1 January 1982. There is no evidence that this group was authorized by LRH. The “legal” documents transferring Scn Trademarks from LRH to RTC bear a forged signature, and in fact Miscavige notarized these documents althuogh he was a party to one side of the “agreement.” Further, re the forged LRH signature, according to two independent experts, John Swanson and Irmgard Wassard, Miscavige was a party to this forgery.

    No HCOPL exists authorizing RTC. RTC has engaged in the perversion of Scn practices. Miscavige was personally involved in the gang SecChecking of Jay Hurwitz, then CO LA Day, at Gilman Hot Springs in October 1982. This violates HCOB 30Nov78 Confessional Procedure, which states: “If the PC is not in session, you won’t get the withholds… A wrong or challenging auditor attitude can throw the scene off as there is a destroyed comm cycle.”

    During October of 1982, Miscavige assaulted John Aczel and Roger Barnes at Gilman Hot Springs, according to testimony from Jay Hurwitz.

    On 17 Oct 82, Miscavige verbally declared top Mission Holder Martin Samuels. There is a photograph of him doing so in the Church publication “Sea Org Expansion News.” Kingsley Wimbush and Dean Stokes were also verbally declared at this meeting. This violates HCOPL 16May80 Ethics, Suppressive Acts, Suppression of Scientology and Scientologists, which states: “All investigations must include confronting the accused with the accusation and where feasible the accuser, BEFORE any action is decided upon or taken.” It is worthy of note that Samuels and Wimbush were, at the time of their “declares,” the two most successful Mission Holders in the world, by actual stats. HCOPL 15Aug67 states “One of the ways an SP works to stop an activity or halt an affluence is to pick out key personnel and spread wild, false and alarming stories about them.”

    The “Running Program,” where senior executives were punished by being forced to run around a tree in desert heat for up to 12 hours a day, is another example of perverted tech authorized by Miscavige. This happened from December 1982 to the summer of 1983. Amongst those on the “program” were David and Merrill Mayo. David suffered an unhealthy loss of weight, physical debilitation and the loss of teeth, whilst on the program.

    At the San Francisco Mission Holders Conference on 17 October 1982, David Miscavige made scornful comments concerning Scientologists in good standing. For example, “These bribe days are over. These squirrel days are over.” (See SO ED 2104 7Nov82.) Miscavige also threatened Mission Holders with criminal prosecution. This violates HCOPL 18Apr70 Ethics and Franchise, which states “It is not our policy to harshly handle Franchises… Almost without exception, Franchise Holders are fine, willing people and we trust them to do right.”

    Miscavige allowed publication of the SO ED of August 1983 Story of a Squirrel. This was an attempt to destroy the authority and reputation of one of the highest officers of Scn – the man chosen by LRH as his technical successor.

    Under Miscavige’s direction, civil suits have been brought against Scientologists Eddie Mace, Marian van der Linde, Bernard Wimbush, Don Hills, Lawrence West, Robin Scott, Ron Lawley and Morag Bellmaine.

    According to HCOB 23Dec71R The No-Interference Area, “It is vitally, vitally important that one gets any person who has gone clear through his next required steps onto OT1 and through OT3 rapidly.” HCOPL 23Sep64 Policies: Dissemination and Programmes, states “One week’s process (25 hours) should cost an average month’s pay.” By violating this policy, the Bridge has become unobtainable and Scientologists have been placed at risk.

    Under Miscavige’s direction, almost 2000 SP declares have been issued, most of these without Comm Ev. Many senior executives had top auditors have been declared and removed -for example: Diane Voegerding, Gale Irwin and John Nelson, all ex-COs CMO – Bill Franks and Kerry Gleason, both exED INTs – Emille Gilbert, exCO Canada – Ron Hopkins, exCO UK -Murray Chopping, Leon Steinburg, Merrill Mayo, David Mayo, Alex Gerber, Brian Livingston, Mike Mauerer, Ron Shafran and Alex Sibersky, all Class XIIs.)

    David Miscavige has been found guilty of the following charges:


    1. Mutiny.

    2. Organizing a splinter group (RTC) which takes and perverts Scn materials or practices, in whole or in part, and calling it Scientology.

    3. Public statements against Scientology or Scientologists but not to Committees of Evidence duly convened.

    4. Reporting Scientologists to civil authorities in an effort to suppress Scientologists from practicing standard Scientology.

    5. Engaging in malicious rumor-mongering to destroy the euthority and repute of higher officers and the leading names of Scientology.

    6. Spreading false tales to invalidate Clears (and OTs.)

    7. Spreading libellous statements about the alleged behavior of Clears (and OTs.)

    8. Splintering off an area of Scientology and denying it properly constituted authority to “save the organization from the higher officers of Scientology.”

    9. Willful misapplication.

    10. Bringing civil suit against Scientologists without first calling the matter to the attention of the Ethics Officer.

    11. Organizing a splinter group (RTC) to confuse people about the true beliefs and practices of Scientology and to deceive them into considering that they will be able to study part or all of Scientology and receive standard pastoral counselling from the splinter group.

    Insufficient evidence was found on the following charges:

    Receiving money, favors or encouragement to suppress Scientology or Scientologists.

    Pronouncing Scientologists guilty of the practice of standard Scientology or of the practice of the religion of Scientology.

    Miscavige was found guilty of the following CRIMES:

    1. Placing Scientology and Scientologists at risk.

    2. Following illegal policies knowing them to be contrary to those issued by the International Board (and LRH.)

    3. Not reporting flagrant departures from the International Board (and LRH) policy.

    4. Permitting the organization to collapse.

    5. Condoning circumstances and offenses capable of bringing the organization to collapse.

    6. Neglect of responsibility resulting in catastrophe.

    7. Being a Potential Trouble Source without reporting it or taking action.

    8. Using Scientology harmfully.

    9. Using a local Scientology title to set aside policies from the International Board (and LRH.)

    10. Instigating a local power push against a senior.

    11. Spreading destructive rumors about senior Scientologists

    12. Falsifying a communication from a senior.

    13. Causinig severe disturbances which have resulted in disrepute.

    14. Holding Scientology materials or policies up to ridicule.

    15. Condoning the suppressioin of the word Scientology in its use and practice.

    The Committee also found Miscavige guilty of the following additional charges:

    1. Forgery.

    2. Fraud.

    3. Assault.

    David Miscavige is assigned a condition of Treason. All of his certificates and awards are suspended. His is dismissed from all posts and titles in any Scientology organization.

    And Scientologist supporting Miscavige’s usurpation of power is guilty of the High Crime of Muthiny. No auditor should give him auditing until such time as he has successfully completed his Ethics conditions and made thorough amends for the damage he has caused. As the Independent Field does not practice disconnection, no restraint is made upon communication with Miscavige. However, it is recommended that he be referred to a competant Ethics terminal, as he has proved to be highly enturbulative. Reference should be made to HCOPL 16May80 Ethics, Suppressive Acts, Suppressiion of Scientology and Scientologists, before dealing with Miscavige.

    Jon Atack
    OT Committee UK

  57. Desperate Cult is Desperate, Anons will keep up “ethic-presence” in front of the Orgs ;), Any Independant that scooted past DC Org lately ?

  58. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Yeah, Freedom Fighter. I was angry about this also. It’s another fat “make wrong” (invalidation) coming from the counterfeit church, CofS … the “Church of Simulation“.

    Then I read your “mother of all squirrels” and could not help but crack up. 🙂

  59. Beautiful handling Mosey! (God help any double-glazing salesmen who knock on your door!)

  60. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    sim·u·la·tion (sĭm′yə-lā shən) n.

    Definition 2. An imitation; a sham.

    – The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition

    Author’s note: The CofS (Or CoS) acronym can also appropriately and properly stand for the “Church of Sham” or “Church of Spuriousness“.

    sham (shăm)

    1. Something false or empty that is purported to be genuine; a spurious imitation.
    2. The quality of deceitfulness; empty pretense.
    3. One who assumes a false character; an impostor:


    Not genuine; fake: sham diamonds; sham modesty.

    spu·ri·ous (spyr ē-əs)

    1. Lacking authenticity or validity in essence or origin; not genuine; false.

  61. I’m not tech trained but isn’t something like this gone over with a Pre OT in a technical interview with compasion and care? An e-mail from OSA? A phone call?
    Oh dear….

  62. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Yeah, like I’m going to cry over any cancelled certificates from an organization defined as above. ROTFL.

    I had way more charge on this than I ever imagined. So this has been a fun exercise for me. Thank you Marty for allowing my multiple posts on this as new thoughts on this keep coming up.

  63. Have you run out of stories, Rathbun?
    Compared to the bombastic and admittedly interesting stories from last year – it seems things has lost its momentum, am I right?
    You seem more and more like the rebel who abandones, with flag in his hand, his home city which he considers corrupt and on the edge of going under, shouting “follow me”, but noticing the followers kind of drop off into the woods, and seeing how the city is still standing, and attracting hords of people travelling to it. At night, the wolfs are heard crying into the night, and the number of true and contributing followers who are willing to actually step up and DO something – not just whine – is now down to the very few, and they are not as convinced as they used to be.
    Isn´t it a pain in the ass when ones belief in other peoples ability and willingness to stay by the route, by the standards, are disappointed? Did they stay with standard tech not because it was the right thing to do, but mainly because it was proclaimed by law/policy? Isn´t it a pain. It all sounds so great when talking about it, but then when push comes to show, it´s an entirely different thing alltogether. But hey, you can still hear them shouting “Yeah, Marty, go for it, we´re behind you all way …. far behind. And when you have laid the streets of gold for us, let us know, will ya?”

  64. I guess the following for the future:
    All those not activeley on the bridge and not actively on an IAS status upgrade or other donation project will have canceled all his certs. And after that action he either has to start new or be expelled/SP declared.
    Reference will be KSW: There is no “half in” or something like that.

  65. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Whenever I write “CofS”, I don’t mean the “Church of Scientology”, as I don’t acknowledge that organization as representative of actual authentic Scientology due to all the fraudulent fakery within. It is not worthy of that name, and is a false depiction, portrayal, or representation of the real thing.

    So when I write “CofS”, think the acronym with any of these words, as they are what I DO mean:

    Church of Simulation
    Church of Squirrels
    Church of Spuriousness
    Church of Scam

    Pick one or all, or add any of your own favorites if you wish. 🙂

  66. Quite Funny !
    That is the exact reason why we should drop the religious label.
    If somebody doesn’t have anymore a engramms as himself, it is a scientific fact and can be proven objectively.
    If it is raining then it is rains. Even if you have it in written from the Church that the sun is shinning and you believe it, you become wet.
    This E-mail is the greatest nonsense I’ve ever read.

  67. Well, if this isn’t the crown jewels of ignorance, arrogance and stupidity.
    It is simply staggering…
    Do you self important little b*st*rds really think that you have such a monopoly on the Human Spirit that by some meaningless decree or proclamation you can negatively affect someone?
    The power you think you have such a death grip on is nothing but the air in your hand.
    You long ago threw away any semblance of what could have been.
    You are the antipathy of True Power.
    A stellar example of bullshit for all to marvel at.

  68. Theo Sismanides

    Mosey, great reply!
    Marty, the Indies need to re-declared Miscavige a Suppressive (he has been declared so once by Capt. Bill Robertson) and a formal document needs to be composed for him and his squirrel tech. There should be in it all of his High Crimes which can be proven by facts and Tech and Policy, e.g the translations HCOBs by LRH which have kept Ron’s Tech suppressed for so many years due to their not being applied. I have extensive evidence on that. Other High Crimes should be included with due documentation and all of those should be included in a formal document by the Indie Office which Safeguards Ron’s tech. A name should be given to that Indie Office as Safeguarding Ron’s Tech is a basic and we all agree upon this. SRT (Safaguarding Ron’s Tech) or iKSW ( which is rather modern and catchy as the can denote the Indies or the “I” as per the apple i

  69. Most despicable.


    Even Scientology has morphed (dramatically) at one key point or ANOTHER, from 1950 to 2010. Should we condemn Scientology at any point in its development as a “squirrel group”? To me, this is a rather forthright matter of logic.

    This is nothing but an obscene attempt at “brand protection”, strictly profit motivated, by a composite being referred to (generally) as “David Miscavige”.

    BTW – if you grant this mindless composite any more than a milligram of beingness…….you are sadly mistaken. He is just a “them”, a creature. Just another unfortunate, wadded-together, unknowing composite….not even to be pitied, just swept up and disposed of. He isn’t even much of a human, possibly the worst inval I can think of. I have far higher respect for most of my taxi drivers.

    Clear is Clear – whether you achieved it on Book One, TR-0, the formal Clearing Course, or never were NOT clear, what boots it?

    There are many paths to Buddha – as Ron, who claimed to HAVE BEEN Buddha, would happily testify (if he hadn’t got lost on the between-lives roller-coaster! It’s not an easy way back, take it from me!).

    Should we invalidate Ron’s Buddha-hood?

    Ron went Clear as The Buddha. It just kinda happened one day underneath a particular tree. Then? He never got acked, and spent many centuries (and 20th century decades) as a neurotic.

    Jesus was Clear (beyond?) also, but a rough carpenter never could write up the tech, could he?

    The putrid composite known (generally) as “David Miscavige” can just jam this hideous little inval where the sun doesn’t shine.

  70. While this comm from the “church”, is both eval and inval, it is also 100 percent on-policy, in-ethics and on-Source. Clears can not be declared “Clear” outside of the C of S, as strange as ut may seem. There is much policy which covers this and it’s one of the well-known drawbacks of the indies. However, since we’re not concerned with what’s written, who the fuck cares? Apply what you know and try to help people. That’s what it’s all about. Don’t let this little missive from the “church” invalidate Mosey’s wins. What’s true for you is what’s true for you.

  71. GW,
    This post, if one can confront what you are describing, describes this suppressive personality as well as any I’ve seen. It put me beyond apoplectic rage reading it.

    It is a stark description of the RSing, pernicious, twisted being that is the Aberrative Personality, the ‘psychopath’, the ‘clinker’, the SP.

    As to ‘tech cues’ and where DM seems to be taking them, other than his own perverse universe, he apparently looks to these blogs. Yep, that’s right. In an attempt to mollify those he’s sought to wreak case havoc upon, he’s trying to put in what is being corrected by independent Scientologists, out here in the field. Only thing is this, he has to corrupt that, else others will make the gains that elude him and become more powerful, will turn around and maybe even see this piece of work as he is. Just as he is described in this post.

  72. Ralph, you really nailed it, MASSIVELY witty, (“failed SP”).

  73. Dennis,
    This is all the more squirrel and suppressive, if that’s possible, when one considers that there is an exact step/part of the NOTs RD that addresses the Clear question and simply and directly handles it, if it is done, PRIOR to carrying on with NOTs.

    What DM does is sort of like flying an ARC Break, getting the FN and the charge moved off, then word clearing Affinity, Reality, Comm, Break and redoing it. Except with advanced case material. Any who have met the ‘living lightening’ as real on the advanced steps know what that means.

    Yes, I’m sure there were some ‘unhappy campers’. It’s a wonder that there isn’t a burned crisp where DM stands. I guess his Discharging Rod works. For now.

  74. Wow – I didn’t know how BAD it was these days.

    I’ve uninvolved too long.

    Stupid to say this perhaps, but I would rather jump off a building than pick up the cans in one of Miscavige’s “AOs”.

  75. Please, 🙂 I do not get it. So, someone who is not a member of the Church (expelled), audits a person with the same techniques he or she would be audited in the Church can’t produce a Clear? Now, that is really religious 🙂 This has really nothing to do with science or techniques or whatsoever 🙂
    So does this state really exists?
    (I mean, seemingly the Church questions the existance of the state with the above.)

  76. Haydn,
    I recall the phrase ‘make Capt. Bligh seem mild’. Bligh keel-hauled.

  77. Some great insights here 🙂

  78. No, no, no 🙂 I’ve just wrote below that this is the absolute proof that the subject is utterly religious 🙂

  79. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")


  80. Les,
    From Karen’s post above, and my own comm with others who have experienced ‘Sec Checks’ in this squirrel cage DM runs, there is a direct restimming of advanced case going on aside from anything else on Clear. It’s just freaking ghastly what is occurring.

  81. “I know no man who has any monopoly upon the wisdom of this universe. It belongs to those who can use it to help themselves and others.” – LRH

    So the Church is forming a monopoly on the wisdom of this universe? 🙂

  82. I agree and thank you for sharing I like to find the SP declare done on David Miscaviage back some around the mid 80’s by Indepts on Yellow paper ( which Indentified in those days as HCO ) and it definitly needs updating. Its my opinion

  83. Mosey, What a complete LOAD of crap! that was an absolute PERFECT response! You go girl! Love, Jan

  84. Bryon,
    Good post. One thing; “If you let someone attest to going Clear on Vipassana meditation, that is suppressive because it invalidates Dianetics and Scientology.”

    It’s suppressive, because it denies the actual gain/case state that is achievable with the precise tech of Dns and Scn. This state, researched, discovered, amplified with further research and discovery, by LRH in Dns and Scn, has exact manifestations and ability that are attained with exact procedures and the handling of exact phenomena. You don’t get it from a Strawberry Smoothie or 48 hour Tantic Sex. You get it from Dianetics and Scientology, applied as written.

  85. Mosey, I hope your doing well. It all boils down to how well anyone is doing. Certs, bracelets, etc mean very little in most cases, except if the owner allows them to define him or herself.
    Take a nice piece of string and tie it around your wrist if your feeling good.
    Or not. I doubt you have the need for anything more.
    I recall LRH talking about military braid on the officers as being necessary in order for one to know which ones were the officers.
    One does not need any braid, AKA certs and awards, bracelets, plaques. And if anyone feels he/she “needs” them, then THAT VERY NEED of course makes the point that there is plenty of work ahead for the person.
    No one should let anyone have power or authority over them because of this clear or unclear matter. All that matters is how well they are doing.

  86. atcause,
    The Introspection RD describes the precipitating factors related to ‘psychotic breaks’. Please, no Hidden Standards on any state of case. It is vital, and stated over and over by LRH, get trained, know the mind, know how to handle yours and others, and with full KRC, one has what it takes to not be adverse effect of come what may.

  87. grasshopper,
    You got an excellent eye for the outpoints!

  88. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    CueBall wrote, “While this comm from the “church”, is both eval and inval, it is also 100 percent on-policy, in-ethics and on-Source.”

    WOW! You mean to tell me that it’s on-policy, in-ethics, and on-Source for the “church” to not use ARC (apply basic Scientology) in their communication?

    I’d definitely like to see the reference for that one.

    Amazing. No “We regret to inform you that”, or “We are sorry to inform that” … and then after the bad news, say…

    “Here are the reasons why:” (Then list the reasons.)

    I believe any other civilized educational institution would be graceful about delivering any bad news, show compassion for the unfortunate situation, and then express what can be done to remedy the situation.

    Again, the CofS demonstrates their violent communication and inability to show compassion for the own customers and ex-customers who work(ed) hard in their studies. Sadly, CofS destroys (or tries to destroy) that innate human willingness to want to contribute to life.

    Clearly, CofS doen’t understand the difference between Force and Theta.

    Theta uses cooperation with life. Force uses demand on life.

  89. Fancy,
    I think you’ve given the new T shirt : Crazy As Loons Church Is.


  90. Joe,
    Again, excellent, vital point: the Code of Offenses and Penalties, with now page after page of ‘SP Acts’, is nothing other than a Moral Code. It is NOT an Ethics Code. There is a single Ethics Code, unenforceable by its nature – the Code of Honor.

    The ridiculous expansion to absurdity that has occurred by and under DM, of the Offenses and Penalties, is Moral Code. It, like any other Moral Code, is subject to being suppressive when it does not align with the actual survival of the group for which it is formed. That’s what has happened to the Offenses and Penalties. That’s how DM uses it.

  91. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    OMG, Ralph, you have me in tears! ROTFLMAO!

    What’s worse than being an SP? A failed SP! 😆

    Failed SP … such an accurate and apt description for the out-of-control, narcisstic “mother of all squirrels” malevolent little-man dictator who is failing at monopolizing Scientology for his own personal gain of wealth, power, and cravings for attention, and admiration.

  92. Jesus Ralph, that’s perfect! He’s an FSP. Man, that’s spot on, in all sorts of ways.

  93. CD,
    That’s an important point Ethics Presence. Have you read this issue? That’s a sincere question.

  94. Mosey;
    Looks to me like you have AS-ISED the current “SO CALLED CHURCH”.
    You make me proud to be your friend. After reading your email response, I can’t stop grinning.
    GO GIRL GO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  95. I think the OSA troll that sent that communication to Mosey knew exactly what he was doing and I think he expected the response he got, more or less. He got everybody excited and talking. It is best to cut entheta lines. Just cut them. That is what LRH did. They love attention of any sort, even negative attention.

  96. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    OT VIII wrote … “This is nothing but an obscene attempt at “brand protection”, strictly profit motivated, by a composite being referred to (generally) as “David Miscavige”.

    BTW – if you grant this mindless composite any more than a milligram of beingness…….you are sadly mistaken. He is just a “them”, a creature. Just another unfortunate, wadded-together, unknowing composite….not even to be pitied, just swept up and disposed of. He isn’t even much of a human, possibly the worst inval I can think of. I have far higher respect for most of my taxi drivers.”

    Understandable viewpoint, OT VIII.

    One would probably have to be God Almighty himself to be able to grant even a drivel of beingness, compassion, or empathy to the “Beingness” of DM.

    DM is probably the only “person” on Earth that I cannot drum up any compassion or empathy for. What OT level would one have to be to do so? lol.

  97. Mosey — great response!!

    And if they happen to come back for more – borrow this one from the movie Wall Street: Money Never Sleeps

    “If you stop telling lies about me, I’ll stop telling the truth about you”

    Of course, since we all know they are compulsive liars, then I guess we’ll just have to continue to tell the truth about them.

    And we as a community are gathering more and more truth!!

    (Truth becomes spacious – lies compact space. The prison of dmology will get tighter and tighter and more claustrophobic by the hour until it concretizes into cinders. Count on it)


  98. OT VIII,
    I’m going to take the opportunity with your post here, and the comment on ‘granting beingness’ to give you an Instruct.

    Granting beingness, life.

    From the Factors:
    3. The first action of beingness is to assume a viewpoint.
    4. The second action of beingness is to extend from the viewpoint, points to view, which are dimension points.
    5. Thus there is space created, for the definition of space is: viewpoint of dimension. And the purpose of a dimension point is space and a point of view.

    From Scn Journal issue 14 G(eneral):
    “In terms of human experience, beingness is space. Space is a viewpoint of dimension. The points which mark an area of space are called anchor points, and these, with the viewpoint, alone are responsible for space. The creation of anchor points, then, is the creation of space, which is, in itself, the creation of beingness.”

    The only possible way to handle the repugnant composite being that is DM, is to get him to view, himself. He’s an SP because he is ‘out of valence’, in other words, he cannot view, cannot create space and see and that because his dimension/anchor/attention points were pressed in to the point of that which pressed becoming the ‘viewpoint’. It’s that which ‘sees’. That which puts out points to view. DM doesn’t anymore, he sees what the false viewpoint sees and so DM can’t as-is case.

    “Perverts, suppressives and critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant or contemptuous personalities are always out of valence.” HCOB 2 August 69, LX Lists.

    That issue also states:
    “There are now three “LX” Lists:
    Originally they were called “X” because they were Experimental. They still are to some extent so the X is retained.
    These serve to isolate REASONS A BEING IS CHARGED UP TO SUCH an extent that he is OUT OF VALENCE. When a person is out of valence he does not easily as-is his bank.”

    “Quite ordinary cases are out of valence. If their folder gets too fat you can assume they are out of valence. Perverts, suppressives and critical, snide, ruthless, arrogant or contemptuous personalities are always out of valence. A person who is in treason on the 1st dynamic is always out of valence.”

    There is some indication with your posts that you are a ‘composite’ as well, being more than one. That really doesn’t matter though, as in any event, granting beingness is not just for who you like. It’s even more important for those you don’t, else they can overpower one, and persist. Just like DM.

    Persiflage is one thing buddy, pounding in anchor points another.

  99. Beautiful Mosey, Rose of the Indies,

    Perfect TR2! Not to top!!
    But just between you and me:
    Have you considered that you haven’t really and honestly exteriorized from your wallet?? That you haven’t really exteriorized from all your and Marty’s bank accounts into bankruptcy??

    Even if dumb Founder might have forgotten that in his bulletin, (he just hadn’t thought about that one in all the flurry of day to day whirls) it might be part of the confidential EP of any higher state attested to in the tschurtsch (aren’t the German mothers of all SPs cute?)

    Mosey, you rock!

  100. Mosey and Marty,

    Oh, God … I am screaming with laughter! I just woke up to this. I haven’t read any other comments, but had to throw down with what I’m sure is the general WTF response. (Bless OSA’s ignorant little hearts.)

    Just Me

  101. Thought Provoking

    My first thought, Mosey was that I was embarassed by the way the church is behaving and can’t believe this was the group I once belonged to. They really have gone off the deep end.

    Then I read your reply! It made my day! I am so glad that you have chosen to experience Scientology in its pure form. YOU ROCK!

    If nothing else, I have learned that LRH was a really smart man. He laid it all out there for us, the good. bad and the ugly (DM and the koolaide drinkers). It just took some of us a while to duplicate and see the evil within.

    Every once in a while I find myself thinking that I am part of the CofS. But, you reminded me that I ceased to be part of the church once I found out about all the abuses and case invalidation towards execs, staff and public. They have tarnished their once good name so badly that I wouldn’t even think of being affiliated with them. It was just a minor point that kept some attention units in the past, but no more. When I look at BE, Do, HAVE, the church really doesn’t have what I want.

    The future is with the Independent Scientologists who have the integrity to delivery standard tech and have the courage to produce vibrant winning PCs who have attained their next grade chart level. Those who won’t cave to some meaningless threat of loss of certificates or status.

    And Mosey, the most exciting thing about clear is that it doesn’t go away. All the brightness and theta persists. It’s been about 8 years since I attested and I still feel the same way. I remember your picture when you finished grade IV and I will always see you as that vibrant theta being.

    If you haven’t read Mission Earth yet, it is a great read and appropos to what’s going on with the church. You remind me of one of the key characters in the book.

  102. Thought Provoking

    “He has even turned the Clear declare cycle into a Corporate $$$$$ money making venture, with Clears being declared and undeclared over and over, as much as 5x and 6x, each time, the parishioner must pay newly $$$$ for new CCRDs and Clear cycle reviews. AFTER one has attested OT 8, DM’s CSes trained in DM’s ‘Golden Age of Tech” “realize” the person is not CLEAR and they must re-do bridge starting with NED.”

    This would be the fastest way to prove the “tech didn’t work” and destroy the church completely. Eventually there will be so much failed purpose and charge on the states of clear and OT that the desire for them will be non-existant as they are simply, unattainable.

    What is frustrating, is that so many people just don’t see it and keep paying for their next invalidation. It is amazing how screwed up a being will allow himself to get before he says, ENOUGH!

  103. Azul Celeste

    The cogs people post on these boards are another proof of that Scientology works, no matter where it is applied! My revoqued OEC, FEBC, HC and other certs do not affect my ability to APPLY the Tech, and the effects are true. My gains on OT IV don’t get invalidated by a phone call. It is my responsibility to keep an objective viewpoint. Not easy, but it makes for pretty spectacular cogs! Thanks Mosey for your bright and shiny Clear response! And Marty for some great Tech application!

  104. Lawrence~I understood very well the intention, even behind the wrong words. In fact, I put in the right words before you did.

  105. Truth! ♥ ✩ ♥ Awesome! ♥ ✩ ♥ Way to Go! ♥ ✩ ♥ WooT WooT! 🙂 I’m soooo HAPPY for you! ♥ ✩ ♥
    You can’t imagine the charge this blows for me, myself and I! ♥ ✩ ♥

  106. GuessWho~OMFG that was the best description of evil incarnate. Holy crap. That’s the real David Miscavige. I totally got that.

  107. There is one way that this makes sense, and that is if the “Clear” being offered in the CofS is not a state of being, but a piece of paper with a number on it. A state of being can’t be cancelled. It just IS, no matter how the person got there. A cert is another matter. If the CofS gave you a number, I suppose they can cancel it and give you a bigger number later after you have paid more money and jumped through more hoops.

    Of course, Mosey doesn’t have a CofS-issued number, so there is nothing to cancel, in spite of the posturing of the unidentified ARC-cutter who sent the email. Mosey has achieved a state of being, and judging from the way she handled this cycle, it’s one tough, beautiful state of being.

  108. Dusty~Valid concerns but you are trying to make rational the irrational. There’s nothing official or by the book anymore…witness the testimonies here.

  109. Yep, it’s your certified status that’s important to David Miscavige and Company. And that is NOT LRH or Scientology.

  110. Freedom Fighter

    “I watched this same idiot walk around the Int/Gold Base one afternoon asking every staff member he came to (about 20), ‘Are you clear?’ Each would answer and he would in some cases and in other cases not ask, ‘What was your cog?’ It was amazing to watch his face and body go into near convulsions of joy, actually more like lust dripping off of him while he told each and every one with ‘great authority’ (intended only to crush them), ‘WRONG! You’re NOT clear!’ The more caved in or shocked the person was the more his body convulsed. It was really VERY ugly to watch.”

    WOW! WOW! WOW! To anyone reading this who still remains loyal to that little f–k, you deserve every bit of karma that is coming your way — and it will come. Rest assured, it will come.

    It’s not too late, however. My advice is to grow a spine. If you can’t do that, borrow someone else’s, but it’s time to step up and help stop this insanity — NOW.

  111. Do they have De-Clear bracelets now, I wonder?

  112. The introspection RD is something that should get a lot more discussion. It is often used in the Miscavage Church of Squirrels, with uniformly bad results. For one thing, I don’t see how locking someone up in a dark, hot boiler room could improve their case. Somehow I think that a vital piece of tech is being wrongly applied.
    Can anyone share some successes of the introspection RD? I would love to read some good things about it.

  113. So Clear is a certification, kind of like Microsoft certification for your IT guys, but way more expensive? It does make things easier to only have to deal with MEST. I want to hold my beautifully framed certificate high with both hands with a huge fake grin, just like those stupid photos from Flag!

  114. Thanks for that, Jim!

    And Mosey … congrats on Clear attest! This is excellent!

    Fun times up ahead too … you’ll have a blast!

    Well done!

  115. GW, if this is true, this is the most disgusting things I have ever heard. Un-F’ing-believable.

  116. In my mind, I refer to the Church as The Church of STOPology. For the last few years, when trying to get up the Bridge, even after paying for intensives at Flag, I ran into STOP after STOP after STOP.

    One of the stops, was after paying for an intensive at Flag, and going to Flag I told of a blood clot I had had in the front of my leg 30 years previously, that had completely healed and of which there was never another. I was shuttled off the base so fast it would make your head spin. This is after being a Flag Land Base public since the beginning in 1975. I did not know why for many years, actually until this blog. It was because Lisa McPherson died of a blood clot, apparently from being so dehydrated. I also had made the origination that my son “was driving me crazy”. He was something like 8 years old at the time and being an active normal kid. The D of P, who was German, apparently took this to mean I was indicating psychosis. I kept telling her it is an American expression, “driving me crazy”, meaning someone is irritating and annoying. Anyway with these two items, blood clot and psychosis, I was routed of the base by Causima, MAA In Charge, like I was some kind of security threat. A year later, someone looked at my folders, and said “there’s no reason why this person can’t receive auditing at Flag”, and I paid for 3 more intensives, and promptly got declared, when my stats were at a 30 year high, and I was making massive contributions of both time and money. Some very important public programs were STOPPED.

    So, it is not enough to stop Scientologists inside the Church, now they have to attempt to stop Scientologists outside the Church.

    Very well done, Mosy, on telling them what they can do with their pitiful attempts at STOP.

    And very, very well done on going Clear!!!!!!!!!!!

    Love always,
    Lady Minn

  117. There is so much “history” which I am continuing to find out about on these threads.

    What is the story with: “…Miscavige was accused of in 1984 when the OT Committee World Wide convened a Comm EV on him….”?

  118. Another thought about Clear (with regard to Taoism as many here aspire to the Tao). Ancient tradition was that if you went to a Taoist teacher to learn the Tao, he would ask you the person you most despised and then tell you to go be a servant to this person for seven years. If after seven years the aspirant had not killed this person, the teacher would now accept him as a student. Why? Because the student had demonstrated an adequate mastery of self. If you cannot master yourself, you will never master the Tao. The state of Clear, as stated, is about the self, the First Dynamic. It is far easier to master DM than it is to master yourself. What will you have once you have mastered him?

  119. Karen, my God! And HCO Sec Check to review clear status?


    I had an HCO Sec Check “eligibility” that was completely a waste of time. The C/S saw something in my folders that he or she felt needed a full-on sec-check about, apparently missing the fact that the same subject had been addressed considerably early and that the area was now CLEAN.

    Sure enough, not a question came up – all were clean.

    Yet, as you note, Karen, the clock was ticking and a whole intensive was burned up.

    That was the last session I ever paid for.

  120. Wow. Wow. “The more caved in or shocked the person was the more his body convulsed.” Wow. Wow.

    If I was evil…I would like to see someone drive a sharpened pencil right straight through David Miscavige’s eye. Or a chain saw to the groin. Or a steamroller to flatten him. Or a slow Fargo woodchipper ride. Or public flogging with razor-tipped cat-0-ninetails. Or a good Islamic-style stoning.

    But I’m not evil, so…I don’t want that for him. Instead, I’ll settle for some form of extreme public humiliation of him, like a lengthy video-taped confession, followed by the abolishment of everything he ever put in place, followed by a whimpered apology from him, followed by making him run around a pole, crying in the hot desert sun, for the rest of his life, while being video streamed 24/7 on the internet. With continued, daily apology.

    Oh, only rice and beans (poorly cooked, no spices) from here on out.

    OK, one last thing, a permanent tattoo of “Un Clear” on his forehead and all definitions of an FN tatted on his chest.

    Is that too much to ask? Just for him, not any one else. Simply one permanent head on a pike. Amnesty for everyone else. Who would be the first to release DM from his torment?

  121. I know this is going to sound naive and probably not brilliant at all but I feel I must say it because it would be my stance on the situation if it were a situation I were in:

    How come the entire staff of the INT Base just don’t show up for muster in the morning until DM is ousted? What should DM do call the police? He cannot even find people to staff the new Super Power Building in Clearwater.

    A long time ago in Germany there was a concentration camp called Sobibor buried deep in a forest in Poland. The entire camp “Private Messaged” each other so to speak at the insistence of two men that were prisoners in the camp with them named Leon Feldhendler and Alexander Pechersky. The entire camp then revolted and the prisoners escaped some of them {such as Esther Turner Raab} making her home here in South Jersey. The camp was eventually burned to the ground by the Nazi’s to save face rather than admit defeat. If it had not been for the intervention of some form of military justice system the German people probably would have committed sucide over the genocide or themselves been but to death by the armed forces that eventually cased the Holocaust to come to an end.

    I know that sounds like Kindergarten talk but if anyone else knows of a better way, now might be the time to say something about it.

    I could never go into a Church of Scientology for auditing again. The New York Org actually has a Class VIII C/S on staff. As corny as this may sound, since when is it even necessary for anyone to be anything more than a Class VA C/S in order to address all the auditing of any of the public that comes into a local org?

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  122. East Grinstead Birdy

    Regarding David Miscavige’s training, a recent conversation with a person who was there with him at Saint Hill while Miscavige was interning Class IV relates that he observed Miscavige leaving his auditing room in a rage, followed by his female PC, who was in tears. It seems he had struck her, while in session. David Miscavige physically assaulted his PC in session, while on the Class IV internship at Saint Hill. He was busted off the internship. He did not complete it. Thus his certs would be provisional for that level of training.

    He apparently was influenced by the large quantity of steroids he was using at the time for the control of his asthma. Rage being one of the side effects of steroid use.

  123. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    That’s correct. The CofS monopolizes Scientology by using their copyrights as their hammer. That is the only thing that’s stopping independent Scientology from flourishing without threat from CofS, and the CofS fading into nothingness.

    For some reason, I barely see this issue mentioned. Yet the copyright issue is the CofS’s archilles heel, IMO. Nobody yet, as far as I know, has the financing it will take along with the courage to take CofS to task on the legitimacy of their ruthless monopoly of Scientology.

    Until Scientology is freed this way, practicing Scientology by delivering auditing and training will never be safe, will never really expand, will always be delivered as a bad service through CofS, CofS will continue on their never-ending cycle of hurting people, and Independents will continue to struggle with expansion and worry about survival or getting hammered by CofS, and the real benefits of Scientology won’t get anywhere significant, anytime soon, and we will see the same ole same ole we’ve seen for the last 45 years of Scientology.


    Why there is no apparent energy in this area strikes me as odd, and I do not understand that. Just thinking about this makes me very sad.

    I hope I’m totally wrong about there being no energy hitting CofS’s archilles heel. If there is, could somebody please speak up about it? If there is, is it a secret?

    Personally, I’m starting to feel a little annoyed by continuing on the line of exposing DM’s overts. It seems like there’s enough already to convince any sane mind that he needs to go.

    Beyond that, where do we hit the archilles heel where it has teeth? Financing and courage. That’s where I see the challenge.

  124. Of course they question the existence of the state of clear. Their members are PTS. PTS folks rollercoaster and lose their gains. Only by extracting themselves from the suppressive environment they are “trapped” in will their gains become stable. At which point, someone from within the squirrel group (the Cof $; the Church of Miscavology) feels the rabid compulsion to lash out and invalidate them for daring to have a win without their express permission. Poor, lost souls they are.

  125. Thanks, Jim. I’ve been enjoying your take on this as well!

    It just pains me that the church has gotten so far off the rails. Guess Who’s post on DM asking staff “Are you clear?… WRONG!” just frosts me. It is so outrageous I have a hard time believing it. And then using HCO Sec Checks to check out clear status? WTF? This is using a jack-hammer to fix a BMW. The only reason anyone would use a jack-hammer to fix a BMW is to… destroy the BMW! Thank God we are all a bit tougher than BMWs!

    You know, I just had a thought. If you plot the CofM on the Havingness Scale, well, I first thought that they were at “Waste Substitute” because they have been wasting their own substitute clears and their substitute “tech”, but on further review, it is worse than that.

    Havingness Scale:

    Responsible for (willing to control)
    Contribute to
    Waste substitute
    Must be confronted
    Must be contributed to

    The church is at “Must be contributed to.” They are damn near gone.

    It is an interesting exercise to map out the CofM against this scale over the last 20 years.

  126. Jim,
    Yeah, it is ghastly. After completing OT VIII I went to Flag to get set up for the GAT Solo Nots. This involved 100 (yes, one-hundred) hours of sec checks and ‘repair’ which I did not need. The ‘auditors’ were not even OT VIII who were auditing me, so I was informed by the D of P to not bring up anything from OT VIII. That was the ONLY thing I WAS interesting in bringing up. But I had to shut up about it and run their non-sequitor drivel. Forced Thought-Stopping.

    One of the auditors they assigned me had recently been…A COOK! Nothing wrong with being a cook, I love cooks, I love cooking. But this guy, a nice guy, had escaped from the kitchen and got trained up real fast and had very little experience. I was OT VIII, L’s completion, interned auditor, trained and experienced executive, give me a break. Ok, so I’m also a cook, but that’s irrelevant, ha ha.

    Another auditor, who actually had great technical skills and wonderful overall TRs, behaved in a very strange way. I’ve always answered auditing questions truthfully, otherwise what’s the point? He asked me a question, I answered it truthfully to the best of my ability, and suddenly he grimaced up his face and said accusatively, “Now, I may seem stupid to you, but do you expect me to believe that?” I was dumbfounded. I had the strangest feeling that he was doing it for a camera or something. I found the entire delivery of that HGC to be completely riddled with pure dumbness. Just dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb.

  127. What’s truly remarkable is this : the author of this email believed that he would cause an effect, right ?

    That’s “hallucinatory cause” at -8 of the tone scale.

    Conpletely out of reality, the author doesn’t have the slightest idea whom he is dealing with.

    The only uptone thing about this matter was Mosey’s answer – very direct and spot-on 🙂

  128. That HCOB does NOT have the flavor of LRH’s writing.

  129. DFB aka Dfb99

    I could be wrong but I thought LRH talked about what Buddha achieved as more of a release than clear.

    For me, I think the confusion comes from a somewhat uncler definition of clear. I feel an uncertainty on what clear is from the church.
    Someone worked with me for hours of metered word clearing on clear and I’m still not sure. I think the word clearer was confused on it too.

    This is my thought, but it seems like you are not really clear until you are all the way up the bridge, or theres levels of clear. Or maybe the state of clear followed up by handling of the stuff that might suck you back down from that state.

  130. The current COS today, seems to have come up with various ways and means to invalidate the state of Clear. Some of us have gotten phone calls to that effect. As I’ve stated before on this site, I got a phone call from someone at the Denver Org telling me that they had a Class XII auditor standing by to check me out on weather or not I am truly Clear. I asked when it had become OK to inval and eval a person’s case? She sort of back peddled and said that they had questions about all attestations of Clear from that time period, as the tech was known to be out in most cases. Referring to the 60’s and 70’s. I laughed and said, “Oh, you mean when people were getting trained right under Ron’s nose?”
    At that point I was laughing so hard I had to hang up. Makes me wonder how many people they got in for auditing with that line.
    IMO it’s a moot point weather or not that email came from COM or not. We know they do this sort of thing all the time.
    Does anyone know if the email to Mosey would be made public within the so-called Church? I would think not. I don’t think they would want anyone to know that people like Marty are out there making Clears in the field.
    Mosey, I know that email didn’t affect you in the least. You are the living proof of what Standard, Scientology tech can do for a theten. I miss the days when we used to expect that. What I am truly relishing now is the shared love and support I see and experience in this place. That is how it used to be and how it always should be. No longer is Scientology (as practiced in the Indie field) a place to escape from.
    My sincerest thanks and appreciation to all of you here.
    Marsha Pearlman Sorensen

  131. martyrathbun09

    Dennise, to “de-clear” a person mid the OT levels is perhaps the most suppressive and squirrel practice imaginable. LRH prescribed a short C/S for anyone having the slighest question about Clear once he/she has begun the OT levels. I’ve delivered it many times and never has it taken longer than but a short session; as it was intended.

  132. martyrathbun09

    Good eye Haydn. You’ve precisely listed the hallmarks of this cat.

  133. There is still such a thing as Fair Game in the Church of Scientology you know?

    How Fair Game is practiced elsewhere in the world by others is of course such others business but, there is still such a thing as Fair Game in the Church of Scientology you know.

  134. Marty there were clear checks on all that were auditing OT VII when the GAT came out. A blanket CS given to all and the reactions were interesting. Some people ended their sessions, some caved and some went along with it.

  135. martyrathbun09

    You are right in that it has “exact manifestations.” It has exact characteristics. If there is anything in Scn that is nearly absolute it is that state. There are precise tests to validate it. So much so, that the question of what lead to it are purely academic. If you know what IT is and how to verify it, the concern about what lead to it too is academic.

  136. That you Yager….
    Davey tired of being the only one putting in ethics….
    Trying to do some damage control here?

  137. Go Mosey! Congratulations on your Clear status. Davey cuts all pro survival activity and I’m delighted to see that he got even less effect on you than when he did it to me. Even though stopping and invalidating is the only thrill he ever experiences, you were not the real target. Cancelling status and certificates he never issued, is of course a last ditch effort to prevent his bots from opening their eyes and going Clear independently.

  138. martyrathbun09

    DFB, there is no more CLEAR, and unequivocal definition or state in all of Scientology. Someone has messed with you. Word clearing has NOTHING to do with it.

  139. martyrathbun09

    Secrets? Wayne, I’ve seen six comments – plus the original post – of people who are DELIVERING on this thread alone. The secret is to get your boat the hell off of lake Tanganyika!

  140. Jean-François Genest

    Who is John Galt? 🙂
    Very good analogy, Bodil. As you go through the story of Atlas Shrugged, do you observe a similarity between our Independents and the ethical producers who disappear out-of-the-blue, one after the other?

    (I would recommend that this book be recommended for reading)

  141. martyrathbun09

    A week or two of Objectives with an auditor who knows his stuff beats seven years in a monastary any time.

  142. Jean-François Genest

    Thank you for your wisdom, Dan.

  143. Are you saying that a person can be clear and still have a psychotic break?

  144. Jean-François Genest

    Yes! Obviously, it is NOT their goal to bring beings thrugh the State of Clear and thus Clear the planet. DM and the church of $$’s goal is to PREVENT beings FROM perceiving and finding out their crimes and out-tech, and obtain ton$ of money without proper exchange (another crime) in the proce$$.

  145. martyrathbun09

    I also suggest the essay Civil Disobedience by Henry David Thoreau. He originated the concept a century earlier. Gandhi and MLK both were inspired by it, applied, and changed the course of nations by doing so.

  146. martyrathbun09

    Theo, You’ve pointed up one of the DIFFERENCES between the alleged “independence” movement of the past I am periodically attacked for not acknowledging. They went the way of the dinosaur by becoming what they resisted, joined into the GPM, and perished. “Stupid is as stupid does” – Forest Gump.

  147. Mosey, I Loved your response to the attempt to invalidate your Clear attest. You are very lucky to have made it to Clear the right way with standard tech applied by a very professional auditor. When you e-mailed me about going Clear I wasn’t just very happy for you but I knew you were Clear. Congratulations again! Don’t ever let anyone try to take that from you. Be thankful you didn’t have to go through the ‘Church of Davey’ to get there, if you would have. Love you, Sargio

  148. Ha Ha – well done Mosey! And congratulations on your Clear state – a permanent state, un-cancellable. These guys must think they can “cancel thetans” or something.


  149. Everyone gets the moral of this tale. In itself it’s an astonishing viewpoint. But nobody here will go serve DM for 7 years. And he is still alive,. Did it do both parties any good ? NO

    2 October, 2010


    Any and all orders, writings, commendations, accolades, rank, status, valences, position, indications from and certificates held by David “The Vampire Emperor” Miscavige are hereby permanently and totally CANCELLED, as his presence and actions have proven to be squirrel, suppressive, damaging and stupid.

    He is hereby assigned to permanent pole running, never to be cancelled.


  151. otdt~I’m rolling around in glee over here! Bwahahahhahahahahahahahaha! 😆

  152. Just practice scientology.

  153. OTDT~“Now, I may seem stupid to you, but do you expect me to believe that?” I was dumbfounded.”
    Another OMFG from me! I am dumbfounded!
    And boy am I glad I got the hell out of there when I did!

  154. Theo How is your Indy Org going over there ?

  155. “I count him braver who overcomes his desires than him who conquors his enemies, as the hardest victory is the victory over self.” ARISTOTLE

    Man has his higher nature and his lower nature. To rise above and gain control over ones lower nature is the goal.
    Many different paths exist to help one work on what needs to be worked on to achieve it.
    Scientology is one path. And its advantage is that LRH removed a lot of the added time found in other practices when he codified drills and processes. BUT, some things do take time. And experience adds to and deepens the lessons of life. Its hard to put an old head on young shoulders.

  156. TRUTH, WOW! Thank you for sharing your win. I am very happy for you. I agree with you, Marty is one of those ‘natural’ auditors. I think he could audit without an e-meter and get lots of TA. I’m a little prejudice because he’s my auditor too. LOVE! S

  157. Yes, Grasshopper

    As you state: “The church is at “Must be contributed to.” They are damn near gone.”

    David “Must Have, damn near gone” Miscavage.

  158. I wish you did not say that.

  159. Jean-François Genest

    Have you received False Data on the subject of Clear?
    May I recommend making a trip. Go see Marty or Jim Logan or Glenn Samuels or Dan Koon and sort this out.

  160. “I laughed and said, “Oh, you mean when people were getting trained right under Ron’s nose?”

    Now THAT is a nuclear powered rebuttal! Excellent.

  161. Tony DePhillips

    Nice post Joe,

    That was one of the reasons I quit the cult. It had become such an oppressive group to be part of. Speaking of suppression and ethics penalties, doesn’t LRH talk about a “suppressive rendition” of a subject in the study tech? A subject so fraught with penalties that it is too hard to confront ? To become an auditor is like that today. You have to give up your integrity to even get through the “training” and if you make mistakes then you are creamed by ethics. Is this how a person learns how to audit people? I don’t think so and that is one of the many reasons that the cult is on it’s way out..

  162. Hi Mackenzi,
    Still stinging from having your Cult of Miscarriage being exposed on BBC, to 5+ million viewers, are we? Yeah, I thought so.
    Pull your head up out of the sand, mate. Having a good LOOK will serve you well.

  163. JB, is that you?

  164. Tony DePhillips

    The current cult are masters at using references out of context and in inapplicable situations. These could all be loosely referred to as mistakes. Another indication of the PTS/SP scene at work within the cult.

  165. Freedom Fighter

    The church is at ‘Must be contributed to.’

    OMG, I said this years ago!! It’s so true and is a total reversal of what their role is supposed to be.

    Instead of servicing the public with Standard Tech and getting in more public to service and deliver Standard Tech to, it’s become all about what is the public doing to help THEM!! Donate to this; donate to that. Come help with this project or that project.

    You know, if the Orgs and Missions were just doing what LRH said to do and doing it well, they wouldn’t have to beg, borrow, and steal — yes, that’s right I said steal, as in 1st condition of exchange and outright stealing (reference some of the comments on this blog about accounts being debited without permission) — all of the time. The Org would be the place to be and people would want to contribute to the motion naturally.

  166. Eileen Clark

    Yes, exactly.

  167. Jean-François Genest

    As horrible as it may sound (read), I believe it 200%. It does not surprise me. It confirms.

  168. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Perhaps I was not duplicated, or else I failed to make myself clear.

  169. These stories, this one and the earlier one about gleefully telling the staff members they were not Clear, need to be put into a pamphlet format and dropped from a helicopter over the complex in LA, Flag, downtown Clearwater, St. Hill Manor. Then somehow brought to the attention of any public (if there are any) going in or out of all the orgs on the planet.

    Not to be hyperbolic – just saying, some how, some way, these 2 incidents need to become widely known to those who are still blindly pledging their allegiance to this little dork.

    As a former professional auditor, the striking of the pc is most offensive crime I can think of. I have NEVER IN 40 YEARS heard of anything like that happening in an auditing session (we will exclude gang-bang & other abusive “sec checks” from the definition of “auditing session” for now). It is an outrage of the first magnitude.

    Glad someone finally brought up the Captain Bligh quote from LRH – I’ve thought of it often, it is one of my favorites. I will try and find the exact quote; maybe someone else knows the reference. Keelhauling would be too light a punishment for striking a pc in session.

    Thank you OTDT for the list of possible appropriate punishments or amends projects. There are a few others I recall from my medieval days – drawing & quartering, burning at the stake, etc. Perhaps The Count will weigh in here with a few juicy suggestions of his own.

  170. Tony DePhillips

    Hi Cowboy,
    “A stellar example of bullshit for all to marvel at.”
    I really liked the use of the word MARVEL. I cleared MARVEL as well as WONDER . Both are truly descriptive of what we are witnessing.

    I marvel and am astonished at how decayed and decrepit this once great church has become. It is an overt of true magnitude for DM to be unmocking the goodness that was once there. It is very hard to choke down.

  171. CO$ = cult of money-grubbing. That does it for me.

  172. Mosey,

    Congratulations on Clear!

    Nice and “clear” response to OSA? Yeah!

  173. OSA you sad, toothless, whiny little cur dogs that can only do a smelly mess in ones yard.

    OSA you should avail yourselves of some real auditing and get yourselves Clear maybe then you will see the beautiful people and world around you.

  174. ETHICS PRESENCE, 1. ethics presence is an “X” quality made up partly of symbology, partly of force, some “now we’re supposed to’s” and endurance. Endurance asserts the truth of unkillability. We’re still here, can’t be unmocked. This drives the SP wild. Because of the Sea Org we appear to have unlimited reach and in some mysterious way, unlimited resources. The ability to appear and disappear mysteriously is a part of ethics presence. As an executive you get compliance because you have ethics presence and persistence and can get mad. The way you continue to have ethics presence is to be maximally right in your actions, decisions and dictates. (HCO PL 4 Oct 68) 2. is basically knowing what you are doing and making sure the junior backs you up and does it. (ED 123 USB)

    — L. Ron Hubbard
    Modern Management Technology Defined

  175. Jean-François Genest

    Jim, Θ
    Thank you very much. You just helped me blow a HUGE chunk of charge, AGAIN!. Merci a Million! 🙂 Θ 🙂

  176. IMHO, this is the point – this point of invalidating the State of Clear for so many Scientologists – which will bring down the whole Mestcavige empire like a house of cards when C of M insiders finally figure it out. It was the promise of that State that got me interested when I read DMSMH. I bet that is the case with 99% of other Scientologists as well. THIS is the point – the evil, relentless invalidation of this State by the current “church” that will finally send its Parishioners running for the doors when it FINALLY dawns on them what the hell has been happening. THIS IS IT.

  177. Jean-François Genest

    VERY GROSS X 10^9,000,000,000

  178. Watching Eyes

    You know what OSA/Miscavige/Troll? I’m so tired of seeing your rotten to the core posts that every time you do this I’m going to post telling people how to get their money back. Take that!

    Here you go folks:
    For anyone wanting a repayment/refund here’s where you need to write. These are government agencies and WILL respond to you. Your complaint will not be ignored.

    For the IAS here’s the one to use. It’s in CA.
    You can plug in their EIN number, just above the “search” button to get the exact name they go by. It’s very hard to find the name otherwise.
    Put the EIN number in your complaint.
    It’s 521840679
    This complaint has to be printed out & mailed via the US Mail.

    For Flag or the Ship this is the one in FL. It’s under the Attorney Gen’s office, Dept of Consumer Services, Bureau of MEDIATION & Enforcement.
    Under Consumer Complaint Form click on “online form”. With this one you can submit it online and attach any docs.
    Note: when you fill in this form, under each question, every time you add in another line of info it shrinks the print. By the time you’re done anyone reading it will need a magnifying glass. The best thing is to do is write on the form referring them to your attached complaint.
    Also, the form asks when you paid. If it’s a real old date, the form might not take it. Put today’s date and explain in your attachment.

    Go for it. If enough of these show up on their desks, the CofM risks an all out gov investigation. Remember, most of the people asking for repayment/refunds are NOT in their 20’s & 30’s. Most are 50 and older. Think “elder abuse”. Gov doesn’t like that.

  179. Jean-François Genest

    Geezz, this looks like a Dan Sherman speech, doesn’t it (??)

  180. Jean-François Genest

    I take that back, the apostrophes aren’t North American.

  181. Jean-François Genest

    Hey Sarge,
    Are you still on target for Canadian Thanksgiving? 🙂

  182. Jean-François Genest

    Truth, Θ

  183. Didn’t change in 26 years (except for volume).
    Should be seperately posted and linked to on all sites.

  184. SAFE
    “That’s correct. The CofS monopolizes Scientology by using their copyrights as their hammer. That is the only thing that’s stopping independent Scientology from flourishing without threat from CofS, and the CofS fading into nothingness.”

    This is no longer true, or at best only partially true. I can’t recall
    COS starting a lawsuit on this area since Enid Vien and Mayo.

    Karen Spaink and Zenon Parnousis had around 5 legal actions
    with COS re copyright. In the last one in Holland, the COS withdrew their suite as tghey were going to lose. The Dutch courts re-opened it and said COS can no longer carry on with its lawsuits against them, and because they had withdrawn from the case in the Dutch courts COS cannot therefore take matters up in the european court.


    “Dutch Attorney-General DWF Verkade has now published an 82 page opinion
    to the Dutch Supreme Court, in which he upholds the decision that free
    speech can trump copyright. “Although copyright resides under Article 1
    of the First Protocol of the European Convention on Human Rights and can
    therefore be regarded as a human right, this does not exempt copyright
    from being balanced against the right to freedom of information,”
    Verkade concludes. It is expected that the Supreme Court will adhere to his advice.”

    Since this decision this website:-

    Has got both sides of the the bridge up to current OT IV hosted in Holland. This has met with general approval with those most highly trained and was written by a class VIII with expert input and side checked by experts. COS hasn’t been able to take this material off the web, although it scared the e-book publisher Lulu off. So one would
    have to download and print one’s own course packs now.

    There is also another server in Holland which carries a significant
    amount of LRH masteial. Also Wikileaks has much material including the handwritten by LRH OT III materials.

    The horse has bolted, and is all over the net in fact, as is well known. Their is still the lip service of multiple locks on the stable door!

    For the last decade the Freezone has been growing and expanding.
    Originally I’d post one success story a week for promotional purposes,
    now I often have to post more than one a day to keep up. I don’t have access to stories not in english, or even all of those in english.

    This blog and its attendees are accelerating the number of people doing scn outside COS even further. I suspect its word of mouth reach is greater than anyone has good data on right now.

    With regard to Mosey’s ” R-factor”, a famous brit polititian once
    said, when you’re in a hole stop digging!
    The CoM has yet to learn from that. Should have been obvious that
    this would be told to the world and result in even more no longer
    wishing to remain affiliated. Specially those with money who’ve been given this same “r-factor.

    Mosey’s response was just the icing on the cake. 🙂

  185. Thought Provoking

    Perfectly stated. You can’t cancel a beingness.

  186. Mosey, I think it would be great to hear your wins if you would be willing to share. If you’ve already posted them, my bad.

    I loved your response to the cult people!

  187. Jean-François Genest

    * My apologies for mentioning and naming, on this blog, on September 19th, my perceptions that Mosey had attained the State of Clear. I hadn’t realized the extent of the repercussions it would cause.

  188. I did not read the Issue but I get the jist of it. and I do not even totally agree with it. For me it is flinging CofS’s misguided views about ethics back in the face of the church.

    October 4, 1968, Ethics Presence · L. Ron Hubbard writes HCOPL ‘Ethics Presence’.
    Sam | August 29, 2010 at 11:28 pm | Reply

  189. OTDT,
    Freaking ghastly.
    More. Unbelievably, it is even more.

  190. Jean-François Genest

    * Nevertheless, thank you for confirming that my perceptions were true.

  191. Watchful Navigator

    Yes, the current church as it operates is eminently capable of creating psychotic breaks in Clears and OTs. An “OT VII” from Denver recently shot and killed a business partner and then himself, surviving to be arraigned for first-degree murder.

    Lisa McPherson is another prominent example. The field is littered with Clears and OTs caved-in, not doing well in life, falsely labeled ‘PTS’ when for many of them, their only possible ‘item’ must be the Miscavige influence in the church itself.

    And Byron:
    The Introspection Rundown is one of the most compassionate, life-saving, dignity-restoring -RESCUES- ever invented in the history of mankind.

    It’s one thing top be physically rescued from a fire or drowning. It’s quite another to be RESCUED FOR ETERNITY from the brink of spiritual extinction. That’s what this rundown, properly executed by a compassionate and careful auditor, is capable of.

    Any of Pierre Ethier’s pcs who have made it out of the Church who did the rundown with him probably could attest to miraculous recoveries.

    I will let you know when I have completed it and my wins (you do not have to be in a psychotic break to benefit from this incredible rundown!) Meanwhile my case is flying, my ‘tragic’ life has turned completely around and I’m not even past the first few steps!

    Ron’s amazing breakthrough in completely reversing factors which cause psychotic breaks starts thusly: “I have made a technical breakthrough which possibly ranks with the major discoveries of the Twentieth Century.”

    Read that carefully, and then study if you will, HCOB 24 JAN 74RA. This miraculous rundown is now prescribed in advance by and for parishioners who sign legal enrollment forms for services in the church, but because of the McPherson “flap” has very unfortunately been WRONGLY POSITIONED with FAILURE and PSYCHOSIS.

    Everyone (critics take note!) get this point and get it really good:

    LISA McPHERSON did NOT EVER receive any meaningful part the “Introspection Rundown”.

    What she received just before her famous psychotic episode running through the street naked after a minor car accident was a false, capricious, out-tech R-Factor from David Miscavige that she had attained the State of Clear. This, being a lie invented to placate her wealthy, influential employers Miscavige was trying to impress, caved her in and then incompetent, cowed personnel with misunderstoods on the subjects of ‘ARC’ and ‘human compassion’ drove her the rest of the way to tragic physical death. They just couldn’t ever even get past steps 0 and 00 of the rundown. What step 1. of the Introspection Rundown would have revealed about David Miscavige’s unqualified, destructive ‘executive C/Sing’ of her case is another matter that Marty, who was there, has already attested to in his videotaped interviews.

    Can anyone think of a more egregious violation of our basic fundamental beliefs as enunciated by L. Ron Hubbard in the 1950’s?

    “And we of the Church believe that the laws of God forbid man:
    “To destroy his own kind;
    “To destroy the sanity of another;
    “To destroy or enslave another’s soul;
    “To destroy or reduce the survival of one’s companions or one’s group. ”

    My friends are those who subscribe and faithfully adhere to the above principles, which are regularly violated in the current Miscavige church, in the name of “management strategy” for “clearing the planet”.

    P.S. – INVEST WHO = David Miscavige, ACTING “Senior C/S Int” – “held from above”

  192. So, Lady Minn, after you paid for three more intensives, then they declared you? What for, pray tell?

  193. Mike Lemeron

    Mosey, your response was just perfect. Keen, sharp – dead accurate. That
    e-mail to you was just plain stupid – amongst the obvious other things it was.
    Grats to you for making the level! And grats to Marty too!

    As Independents we are not at the effect of the “Church” (in name only) that used to be Scientology.

  194. atc,
    A cutesy name, and a dilettente’s question.

  195. JFG, Since Martys visit I have been doing very well. Let me ask you.
    I don’t know when Canadian Thanksgiving is but if I don’t make that target do I have to do laps?

  196. CD,
    That clears that up for me. Thank you.

  197. Well, it kind of makes senior policy, “We always deliver what we promise”
    a joke. I guess just don’t promise anything and that’ll do it.
    However if the promise or implied promise is standard tech, than if it was out and resulted in a no/overt product, than it wasn’t delivered and now should be at no additional cost, since it was already paid for.

  198. Rough idea for a newspaper ad. Well, one can dream anyway:

    SCIENTOLOGISTS: Have you attained the State of Clear only to have it cancelled by the Religious Technology Center? You are NOT alone! RTC under its leader David Miscavige has been on a relentless campaign to invalidate the State of Clear for many years. Did you realize that Scientology and the “Church” of Scientology are not the same thing. Call 0123456789 to find out more.

  199. CD,
    You said “For me it is flinging CofS’s misguided views about ethics back in the face of the church.”

    Not quite. Well, not even, actually. Which is understandable, and accounts for the lack of ‘altitude’, i.e., a part of that ‘X’ quality.

  200. Marty!

    Dose CO f****B get sec check????

  201. Cueball,
    You: ” …it is also 100 percent on-policy, in-ethics and on-Source.”

    Me: “References?”

    I’m like me bra’ Michael (Once Upon a Time), ‘show me’ motherf@!#er’.

  202. Cowboy you have such a way with words…”A stellar example of bullshit for all to marvel at”. that says it all!

  203. I onley want Bubba to love him.

  204. No you were duplicated. Lake Tanganyika, your boat, get it off.

    Hint, cause I’m nice, look up ‘laches’.

  205. “It seems he had struck her, while in session.”

    It seems that DM always has been the person he is today. an Anti Social personality.

    These persons need to be given little space. You see that ? If given more and more space you get WOIII.

    Some Spirits are incurable hence you call them Demons

  206. metaequal,
    ‘Everybody excited and talking’. That’s ‘bad’ how?

  207. Every time I think of Mosey and Marty, for some reason, this song comes to mind:

    Just replace “Moses” with “Mosey”.

    The physical universe is a comm lag…..maybe others will “get” this in time.

  208. Makes me so proud

    “Scientology’s Internet Wars
    James Walker
    On March 12, 1996, Scientologists lost the latest skirmish in their ongoing Internet Wars when a Dutch judge acquitted Karin Spaink, et. al., of all charges. The Church of Scientology is currently locked in an international legal war to remove copies of their super-secret “scriptures” from the Internet. In the US, Scientologists have obtained federal court orders to raid and confiscate alleged “trade secrets” from the homes and offices of four of their most vocal critics, slapped lawsuits on Internet service providers, and sued the Washington Post when it ran a related news article. In other attempts to block public access to the materials, lawyers representing the church have threatened legal action against scores of others including Carnegie-Mellon University. Watchman Fellowship has been threatened with legal action by Scientology concerning these “scriptures” as well.”

  209. I suggest Independants contacting Carnegie-Mellon University :). Maybe set up an Scientology course there lol. Maybe it’s the “Ideal University”

  210. loki,
    Expanded Give and Take. Add Acceptance Level Processing. These can reveal to one a whole lotta that which you refer to as ‘lower nature’. More to the point, they open and release the pent up, unadmired, resisted stuff and lo… whole new states of being.

    Heck, anyone can do it with a buddy, no license required, and it’s in books available all over the place. 8-8008 is one.

  211. Thanks for reminding me why we do what we do – seriously.

  212. Jeez Louise, OTDT! I’ll say what you said: Dumb, dumb, dumb!

    Please don’t have answer this if it identifies you too much, but I’d be interested to know what year all this happened.

    Just Me

  213. Beautiful, Mosey. YOU know who you are. Congratulations. Rock the world, baby. 🙂

    At Tampa Org, after doing all the grades and stuff after that, we came to a point where we did at least a dozen C/S 53’s. The only thing that read was “past life clear”. I was informed I had to go to Flag, there was no other choice. Here’s where it got fun.

    There’s alot I could say… but sometimes brevity is good. DM was at Flag at the time I was, and it was also around the time of Lisa McPherson. My auditor asked if she could video me because there was someone very special on the base who wanted to review our sessions. Hmmm…..

    I know exactly what I know, and I know exactly who I am. So guess what I had to attest to? NOT CLEAR. I actually had to attest to “not clear.” By the way, nobody clapped. It was funny.

    When I got my declare, they “cancelled” all my certificates of states attained up to that point. I was walking from the mailbox reading my declare and actually had to stop because I was bent over laughing so hard I couldn’t continue. Cancel the states that I had attained with a piece of paper??? Hysterical. To the C of DM: Not only do you not have the power to cancel ANYTHING about my beingness, but you didn’t.

    All the power anybody could ever want or need is inside them and absolutely NO ONE can take that away unless you give them permission.

    Bless you all.

  214. plainoldthetan

    One of my auditing supervisors on the SHSBC and I spent about an hour discussing how she successfully delivered the Introspection Rundown. It took months. And the pc had to be carefully cared for and feed and medically tended properly. Despite this, the auditor was still physically violently attacked mid-rundown and ended up with a broken jaw that had to be tended to. The attack probably resulted in the rundown being extended to the length it was since the auditor’s jaw was wired shut for nearly two months.

    This is just what I was told. But I believe it.

  215. martyrathbun09

    So true Cathy, more power to you.

  216. UC Berkeley Campus Life
    His Holiness the XIV Dalai Lama: Peace Through Compassion

  217. martyrathbun09

    Tom, I’ll be damned. All last week Mosey and I had the privilege of waking to Tiziano singing this – with the lyric altered just like you have done. Ain’t no comm lags in our universe it seems.

  218. martyrathbun09

    Jim, I guess you noticed the Cat got it too. I’m impressed.

  219. plainoldthetan

    Hmmm. I guess this is like the state of Texas writing someone an E-mail telling them they don’t have the abilityto drive because they learned to drive a tractor on the back forty as taught by their father when they were 12. Instead of taking (zzzzzzz) driver’s ed in high school and (zzzzzz) a written test and (zzzzz) a driving test. Just because one does not do the latter (go through a CofM Qual cycle) doesn’t mean that one did not achieve the state.

    Oh, yeah. I have C/Sed pcs to Clear outside the CofM.

    It happens. They just don’t have a laminated embossed famper-proof card in their wallet stating that an authoritarian suppressive organization certified that they’d spent enough money to deserve the card.

    That is in fact one of the great things about auditing in the 50’s.

    You could audit, and audit and audit. And deliver and deliver and deliver. And people would change. And that was the reward.

    Not some piece of paper to frame and hang on a wall.

    Of course, I don’t have the headset of a current in-Church OT. If I did, losing a bunch of money and getting a piece of paper to frame and hang on a wall would be the object of the game.

  220. DM = David Musthavage, or Diminutive Musthavage.

    Great job Mosey and Marty too.


    I was at St Hill training at the time.
    I will confirm David Miscavige assaulted his on pc.
    It was blamed on medication for his asthma.
    He was removed from the Class IV interneship for ASSAULT.
    I had previously told Marty about this but was seeking corroboration from those concerned.
    I will attest and confirm that this did occur and that I was there.
    David Miscagive ASSAULTED his own pc and was removed from continuing his Class IV internship.
    The on line BIO on David Miscavige being a wonder kid in auditing is patently FALSE. He was kicked off auditing lines and never graduated.

  222. Yea, I know Jim. My lovely wife blew a cool 100 grand experiencing Flag’s version of “standard tech.” Utterly suppressive auditing, programming and C/Sing. I DID assign them the condition but they refused to do their A-E.
    Oh well. We’re free:)

  223. Why not a very Big Billboard near L’Ron Hubbard way ?

  224. Let’sLook,

    In March 1984 the OT Committee World Wide apparently called for a Comm Ev on David Miscavige by publishing an Ethics Order #1, with quite a long list of charges specified. You can read that here at this link:


    This Committee of Evidence was held about 3 months later. The results were published and David Miscavige was Declared a Suppressive Person by this Comm Ev. Here is the link to that:


    Marty does have the Declare published in my comment downthread.

  225. Many think they have this X quality wich is just arrogance or delussion on thir part.

  226. Okay ETHICS has nothing to do with some tough SO member being an arrogant bully.

  227. Mosey, SPOT on response to this crack of bullshit. This ridiculous comm from Coven of the Dwarf is not surprising as these guys, as mentioned above, have lost it. Marty asked me to “stay strong” and I reciprocate right back to you – DITTO. Evidenced by the many posts you receive here, you are STRONG, both you and your Lady and we all appreciate the position you take.
    I know that I would never place myself in the hands of those who would try and tell me that I am not Clear. Knowing that this is what is going on at Flag I would never place myself in jeopardy by going on lines there. I am done with the place. Flag is the epitome of BIG HAT, NO CATTLE.

  228. Sorry,

    Can’t agree with LRH on this, unless we’re quibbling with definitions. There have been so, so, so many case examples of individuals rehabbing states of theta clear and cleared theta clear on the track. Entire religions have been based on the premise of our being spiritual beings who are creating it all. Not only creating the universe as experienced, but creating our minds and our personalities. And, even though the founders of these religions may have been natural clears and natural OTs, enough of their followers gained those insights to enable the religions to continue.

    As remarkable as LRH’s achievements have been, I don’t grant him the right to evaluate or invalidate my case/gains nor the case/gains of anyone who has a live-transforming cognition. Finding understanding outside of Scientology and Dianetics does not denigrate Ron’s work. But, understanding certainly does exist outside of Scientology and has existed since before this universe was conceived–and before the many preceding universes were conceived.

    Who the fuck made them?

    Regardless of the efficiency of Scientology, LRH did not have a monopoly on either wisdom or spiritual/mental gain. OTs exist in other systems that can easily match anything produced using Scientology. That’s as demonstrable as anything in Scientology.

    No sense being blind just because we like our system. No sense denying valid information just because it disagrees with how we want the world to be. We don’t like others doing such to Scientology, nor should we do that to others.

    A win is a win is a win. A cog is a cog is a cog. Understanding is understanding. Knowledge is knowledge. Ability is ability.



  229. 🙂

    You don’t have to post this one, but ask Tiz to sing this one:

    Just replace “New York” with “Creston”, “brownstone” with “farmhouse” and “Johnny” with “Ronnie”. Sends shivers up and down my spine…

  230. Thank you.

  231. Oh my God! I had never heard this tale. I realize this is such a sad story for his poor preclear — but for some reason I am line-charging!

    Forehad-slap. I guess I’m just a theetie-weetie, unable to confront evil, since it never occurred to me that any auditor would strike their PC. If this story is true, what a piece of work that guy is.

    Just Me

  232. “Few people knew (or cared to know) anything about Scientology’s OT materials until their lawyers – with e-mailed threats, press releases, and interviews – loudly broadcast that they were secret. The general public may still not have taken notice had Scientologists not raided the homes of their critics, in what appeared to some as gestapo-like attempts to suppress freedom of speech and religion.”

    DM you don’t get it. You just do NOT mess with the Internet.

  233. Kathy Braceland

    Mosey, I LOVE your response!

    To you Miscaviage…and those who follow Miscavige’s orders and Miscavige’s technology: Invalidating the state of Clear is a High Crime. Need I say more?

    When justice comes knocking on your door, remember that ignorance of policy is not an excuse. Also remember that LRH wrote policies to create and run Scientology organizations for the sole purpose of training auditors and making Clears and OTs in volume. There is no other reason for orgs to exist.

    Marty Rathbun is applying standard LRH technology, with which he is creating miraculous results, Clears and OTs. He sets a good example that you guys might want to follow. It’s simple really — standard LRH tech works, Miscavige’s tech does not.

    More power to you Marty!

  234. ClearlyMistreated

    Me too! He got about 60K out of me by telling me I wasn’t Clear. That seems to be the going rate.

  235. Marty,
    I did notice.

  236. Mack,
    If you were laughable, I’d laugh.
    Just looking at post replys to recent blog entries, you can tell traffic to this site is up exponentially. Replys are up and in the affermitive.
    If you had a leg to stand on, I’d point to it. But frankly… I just don’t see one.

    Dream on, bubba!
    Tell Davey… I got his “straight up and vertical” right here.
    Hook ’em, Horns!

  237. Cathy,
    I think I can hear your laugh getting that mail 🙂

  238. Tony DePhillips

    The sec checks are just to introvert you to distract you from the out-tech.
    I mean REALLY, are they saying that over all these years the C/S’s and auditors have been wrongly declaring people Clear??? WTF!! And now only little old DM is the only one who knows about Clear?? I hear he is channeling LRH. That is pretty squirrel too ain’t it??

  239. “It was blamed on medication for his asthma.”


  240. That’s correct. The CofS monopolizes Scientology by using their copyrights as their hammer. That is the only thing that’s stopping independent Scientology from flourishing without threat from CofS, and the CofS fading into nothingness.

    Yup, its the only Thread of Power DM/RTC has. Cut that Right, and DM becomes an absolute “Nobody”.

  241. Tony DePhillips

    Almost unbelievable if I hadn’t had similar bullshit myself.
    My last trip to Flag I wanted to route off Solo Nots peacefully since I wasn’t willing to dump more money into it. They proceeded to “convince” me that I “needed” to stay on. When “logic” didn’t work they sent me to the MAA who told me that I had “upset” my auditor and threatened me with a non-enturb order. I had done nothing but answer the auditing questions honestly. That was only a sample. When on Solo Nots (GAT) they told me I wasn’t Clear. I had to do an 8 intensive program. The first 5 intensives were grindy sec checks than a NED program. Then I re-attested to Clear and didn’t really feel any different. Bt they soaked me for about 60K on that trip, so stats were up!!

  242. Cathy~Hi five!
    If they canceled your certs then that must mean they canceled NOT CLEAR so you ARE CLEAR! 🙂

  243. Exactly correct Mr. Rathbun.
    The real target is the reactive mind.
    The “gun” is delivering standard tech to the best of one’s ability and training others to deliver it well.
    More and more people every day are being trained and processed. I know of four delivery units which have been established in just the past six weeks. They are just beginning , but they are determined to use the tech to help their fellow man.
    If Marty can continue to help people with the tech despite all the best efforts from the collective bank of the CoM, then…well…What Me Worry?

  244. That’s right – that’s the extent of his tech training! And he say’s he found the why, “the blind leading the blind”. He got that right except its more like an evil prick leading the blind.

  245. I never imagined either…I’ve been shocked and awed today!

  246. Michael,
    “A win is a win is a win. A cog is a cog is a cog. Understanding is understanding. Knowledge is knowledge. Ability is ability.”


  247. Sarge,
    Just one big lap, around Canada.

  248. Karen,
    Thank you for this added data. There it is. Plain sight as the ne plus ultra of the Dangerous Auditor. This is beyond any pale.

  249. Michael, I cant tell what your not agreeing with as its not clear what your responding to. But I like what you wrote regarding other systems and monopolies, etc. I think LRH said no one has a monopoly on the wisdom of the universe. But he also tried to shut down looking. Scientology evolved into somewhat of a vain organization, among its other faults. If scientologists want it to take its righful place as a valuable applied religious philosophy in the eyes of the worls, they should understand that they are only one of many paths and drop their judgements. LRH said the only richness there is is understanding. That takes looking and an open mind. LRH didnt make his formulations and discoveries living in a fishbowl.

  250. Watching Eyes,

    Do you have the EIN of Celebrity Centre Int, by any chance? (…or can you point me to where I can find it)?


  251. martyrathbun09

    Guess Who. It is great having you weigh in.

  252. martyrathbun09

    Tony, Flag acknowledged that the auditor you paid for had lousy TRs. Interesting. I think Miscavige’s penchant for painting himself as a victim has crept into the orgs now. How could an auditor be the victim of a pc?

  253. martyrathbun09

    Tony, I have encountered no man who despises LRH more, or who truly believes LRH was a fraud, than David Miscavige.

  254. LOL. Mosey I love you’re response. On the simplest of level that was a true “you’re not the boss of me” response. Suck it up OSA! This girl ain’t buying your sh%*!

  255. Thanks for the confirmation, Karen.
    Just Me

  256. So, it is not enough to stop Scientologists inside the Church, now they have to attempt to stop Scientologists outside the Church.

    As usual, your Posts are always informative and precisely to the Point.

    I also do not consider the Church of Scientology to be a viable Avenue to receive Scientology. The BS I was facing to get onto my OT Levels was beyond any realistic Point of Feasibility. Here in the Freezone, it was up ‘n go, done in no Time at all. I would never look back. CO$ is completely useless to me.

  257. Just out of curiosity, is this Jeni Mackenzie? If it is, I love you and I think you are the greatest! All this dramatization will eventually pass and we will all have a really, really, really bright future.

  258. Dear Mosey,

    Thank you for your spot on insouciance! And congratulations on Clear. Marty, well done.

    A song that crossed my mind while I read your post. Hope it fits.

    ML, Tom Gallagher

  259. Watching Eyes

    I just went on the California site that I mentioned above and searched but couldn’t find anything about CC Int. I’m pretty good at ferreting things out and could not find it. Not to worry.

    You don’t need an EIN number. The only reason I included it for the IAS is because they don’t have a building like the orgs do. I thought they might try to be elusive so wanted to clearly identify them, which that EIN number does.

    All you need for your report is their name and address. I wouldn’t just put “Celebrity Center International”. I’d write “Church of Scientology, Celebrity…….” That way it’ll be VERY clear to the reader.

  260. let me try that again-

  261. OTDT,

    If not, they need to start manufacturing them. Now that GAT “Golden” evolution is done, D Musthavage needs to start on the “Platinum” evolution.

    First, he needs a Degrade Chart to replace the old “no longer in use” Grade Chart.

    The terminology needs to be updated across the board. In fact, instead of Org Boards, he is now using his own favorite and needs to publish, the Disorg Board.

    Along with this, he needs to publish the new Unbridge to Total Freakdom, leading to the new State of Unclear. That’s where you get your Unclear bracelet. It delivers electric shocks when the wearer utters any “enemy line” or perhaps has any overt thought of his own concerning the CoS.

    Lastly he needs to publish the new levels above ( or is it below?) the state of Unclear. These are the now well-known DB Levels, attainable only within the CoS, and not available anywhere else except perhaps in North Korea and Beijing.

    I’m sure I’ve left some details out, but that’s the broad outline of the coming Platinum Evolution, of which the aptly named “SP Rundown” will of course be the crowning jewel.

  262. Scientology is not and will never be a replacement for hospital treatment.

  263. And I wove Jim!

  264. Never mind, I found it.

    CCInt’s EIN is: 952707137.

  265. Tony said: “I hear [David Miscavige] is channeling LRH. That is pretty squirrel too ain’t it?”

    OK – I want to hear more about this. Anybody got the goods on this one?

    Just Me

  266. DFB aka Dfb99

    No false data stripping.
    A couple things happened that ended up with me originating that I had some confusion on what clear was. We did metered word clearing on all the definitions in the tech dicionary and I said fine, but it didnt really help.



  268. Jim,

    I’ve been running thought as effort and ran across this huge incident that serves as the basis for the human condition. Without thought becoming effort, there is nothing to support bank. And some interesting beings took advantage of this datum.
    One of these days we’ll have to get together for a chat.
    Or email.


  269. Gawd, well there-in lies the start of his abuse.

  270. Crock Of Shit?
    Pardon my language lol.


  271. Loki,

    I was disagreeing with the concept that only Scientology can create a clear. Or an OT, for that matter. Scientology is just very efficient–if understood–at achieving those states.

  272. Jim Logan, For starters, you can listen to the LRH tape “A Basic Talk on Qual”. If that doesn’t answer your questions, I have more references.

  273. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")


    Thank you for your post. I really do appreciate you taking some time for a larger R factor instead of curtness.

    That’s apparent good news. However, I’m still not assured that Independent Scientologists are safe from the threat of CofS using their copyright iron-fist here in the U.S.A. to harass. I was harassed in 1999 just using “Fair Use”, not doing anything wrong, let alone any intention to simply blantly publish LRH full materials, like books and tapes and HCOB’s.

    Are you suggesting it’s safe now for independent Scientologists to openly publish LRH materials and hang up a Scientology Delivery Services sign in a high-traffic public area open for walk-ins, and build a growing Org like David Mayo attempted?

    If that’s the case, where are they? Where’s the list of addresses and phone numbers of these open independent Orgs in the USA? I’d really like to talk to their ED’s about this.

    I’m not talking here about delivering discreet auditing and training services in one’s home. I’m referring to all out openness, just as public as CofS is now. There should be no fear of CofS whatsover which forces one to be clandestine in any sense.

    At this point, I’m still not convinced Scientology is safe-pointed yet. IMO, it won’t be until the Copyright issue is clearly resolved once and for all so that Scientology is completely safe to deliver without any possibility of threat or harassment.

    Again, there should have to be no fear whatsover in building one’s own Independent “church” and congregation if one wishes wish.

    Is this the state of affairs? I don’t think so. Though it’s something I truly wish to be wrong about. lol.

  274. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Typo: Erase in your mind the last word, “wish” in the second to last sentence. lol. Wish there was a way to edit after publishing.

  275. Metaqual

    “Cutting entheta lines” probably can backfire as entheta depends on theta. better to maintain your space and extend your reach and understanding which would include permeating the entheta and converting it to theta. Backing off from entheta just reduces your space.
    Apply the toughness concept: create two entheta lines and have some fun watching them sparkle and explode against each other.

  276. one of those who see

    Hi Mosey – perfect response! They probably are running out of Clears to invalidate! I know i’m not going anywhere near “the buildings.” Off the top of my head i know 2 other clears that are off lines too. Thetans can perceive. Org calls with C/S R Factor for them, a new program, promo comes by the bucket load – ” all you have to do is arrive and we will get you to OT.” And the Clears are going – yeah, I don’t know, not ready, no money, too busy etc…. What is really going on is like that old TV show, Lost in Sapce. Where the robot warns the boy ” Danger Will Robinson, Danger Will Robinson. LOL

    This staff member has committed quite an overt “attempting” to invalidate a Clear. That HCOB does not apply to Marty & Mosey.
    Marty was chosen as the Auditor to Audit Tom Cruise because he is standard and gets results!
    Unlike DM and associates, Marty duplicates and can apply straight LRH. He has no need of unusual solutions.
    I am thrilled to have another Clear among us. Once again , congrats to you both!
    Just as an aside here, has anyone else received the newest THE AUDITOR mag from AOSH UK? Under completions there is one guy who completed Level 1 and 2 of the Academy Levels. Thats It! No Briefing Course Level Graduates at all! Do I have an MU? Isn’t this the mag of Saint Hill? It actually says on the front cover “Saint Hill, where LRH trained the Top Auditors of the world!” Then it goes on to advertise the new Life Improvement Courses! I question my self again…Is this really the Saint Hill Mag?????
    Oh and those Auditors LRH trained. How many are declared at this point?!
    Have restrained self from hitting head against wall.

  277. Jim,

    I was looking for your comment condemning someone to a lap around Canada.
    Bra’, that’s too cruel to contemplate. We drove through Canada from Niagara Falls to Detroit. My fourteen year old grew a beard and his hair turned gray during that span. My sixteen year old girl now requires a cane for walking. I turned to dust and was blown into the gutters of Detroit where a derelict relieved himself with complete disrespect for the sanctity of my disassembled meat body. My wife simply sprouted wings and said, “fuck it” and went on some ethereal journey.
    So, Mate, rethink this matter.


  278. one of those who see

    Had to respond. Pericles – Coven of the Dwarf has me hysterical! Can’t stop laughing! OMG

  279. Marty, Truth be known DM was scared to death of the ‘old man’.
    There’s a reason DM was NEVER at Creston while LRH was alive.
    He wasn’t invited. Period.

  280. Pingback: Top Posts — WordPress.com

  281. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    The copyright issue is a steamingly hot topic of which seems to be something of which there is an urge to not confront, ignore or “not-is”. I don’t know why. Again, it is THE achilles heel of CofS, IMO.

  282. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Are you referring to this?


    What is it with this apparent “cloak and dagger”?

    I really do enjoy explicitness and clarity. 🙂

  283. DFB, The definition of clear as stated in HCOB 14 Dec.1981is what it says, very simple:
    “A clear is a being who no longer has his own reactive mind”
    But that’s not the end of the bridge. Clear is a really big step to sanity, but there is still some real nasty stuff to handle after Clear, and a lot of it. Until this charge is totally handled it can still make a person feel and act restimulated, and even extremely restimulated, particlarly if that person recieves out-tech (such as the above mentioned de-clearing, Dianetics after Clear, un-needed sec checks, eval, inval, etc. etc.). What you may be seeing in others as “different levels of Clear” is really just more Bridge to do. So, you are right in a sense when you say “you are not really clear until you are all the way up the bridge”, but a more accurate statement would be, ” you are not really free of case until you are all the way up the bridge”.

  284. Youch! Intentional pounding in of anchor points prompts me to wince before I pounce. Or is that pounce before I wince? Never-the-less, right-on references. Thanks MOQ.


  285. OnceUponaTime


    Can’t agree with LRH on this, unless we’re quibbling with definitions. There have been so, so, so many case examples of individuals rehabbing states of theta clear and cleared theta clear on the track.” [snip]

    I’m ambivalent re this statement. I think it may possibly be

    For reasons I can’t easily articulate I seem to be natural clear.
    Forced St Hill in 1991 to ack that.

    On OT II separated from one who seemed at least theta clear. Happy
    to exist without a body, and came back to visit. Real big win!

    On FPRD recalled pre mest universe actions which may have been the creation of universes. Also a ser fac connected to that, left a group
    to make them wrong. Others may have similar?

    I think LRH went a bit overboard in his claiming of a monopoly.

    However he said, it may not be a perfect path, but a workable one.
    Or similar.

    I don’t know of any other path that gives a nuts and bolts, if you like, blue collar, approach to universal enhancement in simple language.

    I believe that is unique.

  286. Leland Conrad Powers

    In theory, Miscavige isn’t canceling anything here. She wasn’t issued a certificate/award from CoFS so to me, the only shocking thing is that they bothered to send the letter and waste time on something that’s almost certainly a dead issue. The fact that the church will not honor states of CLEAR or OT attained outside of it’s confines is hardly new or revelatory. Again, the only mystery to me is why they wasted their time – maybe they’re hoping just be assholes?

  287. Mosey,

    Congrads on the state of clear.

    Its amazing the things you learn on this blog.
    DM beat his pc; at Staint Hill no less…
    Has his PC folders locked away (nice way to withhold)
    Loves to invalidate Clears
    First to be declared Failed SP

    this list could go on and on.

    Love this blog…

    Ron Minor

  288. Watching Eyes

    Good work! Odd that there are no 990 forms on file. The 990 is the annual report form. You might want to mention that when you file your complaint.

  289. Unfortunately the big news that didn’t follow this declare was that DM was offloaded. But at least for him, that can be a fun way to feel, “Unwelcome where one has 100% certainty one is not welcome”.

    A Scientologist called me on the phone once and told me that “You are not welcome here” {meaning at the mission} and then wrote me a letter and said the same thing, twice.

    It is the favorite phrase of all criminal Scientologists that just love to go out into the world hiding behind the chaos of people’s ignorance and pointing the finger at people and informing them publicly “You are not welcome here”.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  290. Don’t be so afraid. The subject DID get disciussed on this blog , on ESMB on WWP on Alt religion scientology on Operation Clambake on Scientology-Cult on Leaving Scientology and all much of the Freezone.

    Mosyt of the Old Hubbard Materials are NOT copyrighted

    Copyruight may never stand in the way of somebody practicing her or his belief. See what Terril wrote.

  291. Well if they do, I would like to get one.

    It is unlikely the bookstore at ASHO would sell them even though they probably De-Clear people twice a week.

    Maybe on E-Bay, they seem to have everything there.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  292. There is a part 2

  293. Lisa McPherson died in the middle of her auditing.

    This is a fact. This is not a good thing.

    The public is not even allowed to know what was the outcome of the lawsuit filed against them for her death.

    Lisa is gone and so she cannot speak up for herself right now on the matter, but they killed her. It was a bad result. It was a no result. They caused her death.

    DM Was involved in the whole thing over the phone. But he never went there in person.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  294. Eileen:

    The reasons why I don’t want to say too much about Mosey’s E-Mail {even though I know for sure that she got} is because the party behind the E-Mail is probably reading this and laughing.

    So I say, have a good laugh to the party “behind the E-Mail” {i.e. the actual sender}, because laughing is good for you.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  295. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    I’m with you, Foremost. Perhaps, more precisely, alleged “right”. 🙂

  296. That’s correct. The CofS monopolizes Scientology by using their copyrights as their hammer. That is the only thing that’s stopping independent Scientology from flourishing without threat from CofS, and the CofS fading into nothingness.

    For some reason, I barely see this issue mentioned. Yet the copyright issue is the CofS’s archilles heel, IMO. Nobody yet, as far as I know, has the financing it will take along with the courage to take CofS to task on the legitimacy of their ruthless monopoly of Scientology.

    Until Scientology is freed this way, practicing Scientology by delivering auditing and training will never be safe, will never really expand

    that’s funny ( I mean PTS thinking) SCN is save to deliver by anyone anytime – ther are NO copyrights to read a book an dthen practice what is in — just don’t copy the damm book
    so, everyone – go and audit, get autiting , train others , and get trained —
    ANYTHING Goes —


  297. Joe Pendleton

    Drat – The Germans!!

    After reading your post Lady Minn, I think I now have it figured out.

    There are just too many staff members and Sea Org members who think that “Alice in Wonderland’ and “Through the Looking Glass” are LRH references on how to run Scientology. I mean, the books are IN THE ORG, aren’t they?

  298. Jean-François Genest

    Well Sarge, it’s October 11th. I agree with Jim. One big lap around Canada will suffice → your VICTORY LAP 🙂

  299. And now he {DM} has taken all the Tech LRH wrote and buried it in the desert in a mine shaft that is nuclear war proof so future generations can read and not miss out.

    But who knows what is really written there. It is all in the form of an alloy that resists decay for centuries.

    You don’t know what could be in these metal books unless you went to the mine and read them. It is buried under the desert.

    It could be the real thing or it could be something like it DM cooked up to make money.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  300. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    How do I qualify for this elite nobility? 😉

  301. Yes, but the reactive mind is not the whole picture.

    There are other things that LRH says happened earlier that caused a reactive mind to come about in people in the first place.

    But you can’t get to that material unless you go Clear first, so that is why you need a good auditor and/or need to be one.

    Today DM trains auditors that are not 100% standard. They are stat-ready, and that is all. I know because I have met a few. One of them forgot who I was by the next time I spoke to her.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  302. Joe Pendleton

    Wayne, it is………and it isn’t. (Though when you use an expression like “steamingly hot”, I start to think of bisquits right out of the oven….or maybe Rita Hayworth in one of her old movies.)

    Marty, as an example, has every right to practice his religion by auditing people or auditing himself, using materials he already has or recalls (“free exercise clause’ of the First Amendment – the basis for the ruling against the Headleys in their case).

    What the CofS Trademarks do though is prevent Marty from advertising what he does as “Scientology” or “LRH Tech” as Scientology and LRH are registered trademarks of the CofS (among many other terms – I even think “Study Tech” has been trademarked). And yes, this is a potential stop or slow on Independent Scientologists starting their own movement openly.

    Copyright law prevents Marty or anyone from copying LRH material. An agressive lawyer might even challenge using LRH passages on the internet, but I think that would be a losing battle and horrendous negative PR for the church (not that that has stopped them before, but this would be SO bad….).

    I DO think a legal challenge to the church (on first amendment grounds) would probably win if there were some lawyer(s) who would take on this task (as it would be very costly and time consuming – the church would no doubt ask for hundreds of hours of depositions and tons of docs over a period of years). Of course a court might issue an injunction against the church to stop them from harassing someone on a first amendment rights basis.

    BUT, Wayne………..is this all really necessary now? I think even the church realizes now that it would be REALLY bad for them to take people to court on these issues and have them call church people to the stand……..

  303. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    PlainoldThetan wrote, “You could audit, and audit and audit. And deliver and deliver and deliver. And people would change. And that was the reward.

    Not some piece of paper to frame and hang on a wall.”

    Indeed, plainoldthetan.

    The CofS’s fixation on the “value” of Certs should indicate to anybody their fixation and worship of MEST (Matter, Energy, Space, Time … physical objects).

    How can any sane mind want spiritual help from a group who worships MEST? How much more squirrel can a group get than worship of MEST?

  304. Thanks Marty,

    Yes, it was pretty nasty – real nasty.

    On the plus side, I had no shortage of NOTs material to run after that 🙂

  305. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    To take money and to not deliver what’s promised is fraud.

    I would find interesting to know the true number of cases of fraud by the CofS.

  306. Terril:

    Even though Mosey’ letter is a truly an exciting topic, do you think it is a good idea still that the OT III materials are all over the internet like you say?

    Would LRH have wanted it that way instead of sending people to an Advanced Org? Isn’t that why he invented Advanced Orgs in the first place?

    A person {like me} that gets involved in Scientology and then leaves and then could possibly come back has to get heavy sec checks. I was told I had to do a Sec Check before I started my Purif, but I am not even a wanted criminal. I am not even wanted for anything at all, except of course my ARC and KRC.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  307. GW & Karen,
    Thanks for the info, it now makes a lot more sense his ordering me directly to do the levels, while on the SHSBC, which I could not think with.

    I had unfortunately, heard about Dear Leader’s on the spot De-Clearing episode at the Int Base from another old friend as a separate source of info.

    Had never heard of an auditor getting violent with a PC! Wow – Dear Leader’s violence has an earlier beginning!

  308. Thanks Valkov!

    …and Watching Eyes, Thanks for the data on repayments. It will get passed around.

  309. Tis’ easier {and more profitable} it seems these days to get Microsoft certified than Clear certified.

    I was thinking something crazy you might not hear from too many people except me.

    What would your true response be if a true friend of yours still in Scientology came up to you and said ecstatically “Bryon, I just went Clear for the 9th time, this life!”

    Would you be happy? Would you be sad?

    What would your response be?

    If you tell me what your response would be, I will tell you mine.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  310. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    ExVet wrote, “Well, one can dream anyway:”

    Why just a dream? Why not do it? Because, apparently, according to Marty (from what I understand him implying in his post to me earlier), Scientology is now safepointed and there is no threat of CofS attacking independents with CofS’s “copyright hammer.”

    Though I’m really having some trouble swallowing that this is the case. (Of course, it’s possible I misundertood Marty’s implication.)

  311. I knew a girl in New York named Marcia Valente Cruz {OT V} that was recently the NYFDN course supervisor. I don’t know what post she may be on these days, but she was not on that post or OT V when I met her.

    One day at work, on my job outside the org where she also worked I asked her what she was doing in Scientology. I already knew she was Clear. I could tell. She said she was saving money for her XDN {because her case stopped progressing}. Later that year LRH released the NOT’s and the news about all the people that had gone Clear and not known it. And guess what? She was one of them and soon after went right on up to OT V. But, that happened naturally, the policy had not been released yet and the moment it was she went right up the Bridge.

    I have not seen or spoken to Marcia in quite some time, she is part of that criminal New York Org scene. I wonder if she too has been De-Clear certified?

    Do you know her?

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  312. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    ROTFL. Very funny stuff, Valkov.

    Perhaps the ultimate state of being on the “Degrade Chart” would be … drum roll please …

    Failed SP

    (Thanks Ralph Hilton, this will forever be in my nomenclature of DMology. :))

  313. Ha ha ha ha!

  314. Marty,

    Perhaps you should consider renaming this site: “The Truth Revealed”.

    Today’s been another one of those Wow Days.

    Thanks to all.


  315. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    ROTFL! 😆

  316. The assaulter leading the assaulted.

  317. Approximately 1996-97.

  318. The Flag MAA’s became insane after GAT. I think alien pod people took them all over.

  319. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    I just had the realization that this blog may be a frenzy FEEDING ground for David Miscavage, and that he absolutely LOVES Marty’s blog, and perhaps he’s even truly grateful for it.

    Because psychotics CRAVE and OBSESS on getting attention, and hope to gain admiration.

    Of course, this blog doesn’t grant DM much admiration, true, but it surely gives DM an utterly amazing amount of attention.

    Perhaps it may be the equivalent of “Feeding the Trolls”?

    In any case, this blog is surely a good educational outlet and vent, perhaps the best, to find out what’s really going on within CofS, and who DM really is.

  320. OMG, DMs river of treason is a whole f**king acid ocean.

    Its mind boggling how a total anti LRH character can hold any position in the Co$ for that long, a complete mystery.

    If there could just be some solid piece of evidence where DM thrashes LRH, shown to SO staffs, that would be it, game over for him. I think they would bury him faster than one swing of a needle, followed by the greatest party in the history of the SO!

    Awesome remark, Marty, I really like when you or others lay out the raw stuff about DM, even if it takes some serious confronting!

  321. If every Scientologist onlines at the church felt free enough to communicate their honest and legitimate gripes on this board, it would be filled with thousands of posts, similar to the ones you see here now.

    But they don’t feel free to post. They don’t feel free to communicate. They have very legitimate gripes and observations that they are in fear of communicating, to the church or on a open forum like this.

    They are going on hoping that things will straighten out. They tolerate but don’t understand, because they are good people who believe and trust that they will not be betrayed, but suspect they might have been. That’s what they are hoping, that they have not really been betrayed.

    In the meantime, they sweep their valid objections and complaints under the rug and forget them for now, because they are distracted by the church vacuuming up all their money and making them throw away their legitimate LRH materials in order to study DM-altered versions.

  322. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    OTDT wrote, “But they [Church Scientologists] don’t feel free to post. They don’t feel free to communicate. They have very legitimate gripes and observations that they are in fear of communicating, to the church or on a open forum like this.”

    Because CofS “believes in” Free Speech and this specific statement in the Church Creed …

    “That all men have inalienable rights to think freely, to talk freely, to write freely their own opinions and to counter or utter or write upon the opinions of others; ”

    So all church Scientologists have to do is go to the CofS open Internet Forum and post their concerns and free thoughts there, right?

    Oops! Wait a minute. The CofS doesn’t have this. 😦

  323. Hey zoos, this site is a fucking god send, I have a thousand words that want to roll off my tongue but I rehabilitated a state of being without auditing that I have invalidated for years after my clear status was cancelled years ago after which I did not progress on the Bridge (yea Sec checks, reviews,etc.) I am so exterior and aware once again, OMG, no joke, what a relief. I feel like a fool and so fragile for allowing that to happen to me. Talking about fragile, only the tigers survive and even they have a hard time, I’m turning into a tiger to survive any future invalidations by the CofM.

    So Mosey, you know what you know and don’t ever let some supppressive asshole cancel or suppress your beautiful state of being! Like I said for whatever reason we are fragile and thankfully you have Marty, et al, around you without a vested interest to help you maintain your state i.e., no IAS statuses, Basic Book Donations, Super Power, Ideal Org donations and a zillion other back breaking donations to move onto your next step, you are able to move on up higher without breaking your back financially and just achieve it without all the inval, lucky gal!

  324. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Good, problem solved.

    Then for those so inclined, it’s “safe” for anybody to start their own church missions and advertise authentic Scientology auditing.

    Sorry, I don’t buy it.

  325. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Yes, taking the copyright hammer away from CofS is absolutely necessary for the unsuppressed expansion of authentic Scientology, and for the dissolution of the biggest squirrel group on planet Earth.

  326. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Too add to the above, I’m talking about taking away every form of suppressive “legal” (not necesarily lawful) control of Scientology, including its registered trademarks.

    Again, I don’t see enough energy in this area, which puzzles me.

    “But before you go, whisper this to your sons and their sons—”The work was free. Keep it so.”” – L. Ron Hubbard

    Scientology: Clear Procedure
    Issue One
    December 1957
    L. Ron Hubbard
    Red Vol, 1957-1959

    So I question (not to you specifically), what part of “Keep it so,” is not understood. Is there reasonableness in this area?

  327. Mosey,
    I thought Mike R. and I held the record for best comebacks, but I have to say girl, that was kickass!

  328. Cue,
    I reviewed the tape. Where exactly is this datum?

  329. Michael,
    Wish I could. Can’t.

    Ummmm, OK, I can. He’s off the hook.

    Sorry about the kids.

  330. Yes.

  331. Leland Conrad Powers

    Religious Technology Center and CST have not enforced or attempted to go after people using the copyrights of Dianetics and Scientology for almost a decade now. As far as independent Scientology flourishing, it already is – mostly in Europe and Russia though.

    The “Freezone” has had conventions for decades now, nearly all un-molested by the Church. Granted there’s some Black PR employed against them and some minor buggery but it’s mostly noisy investigations which are designed to disrupt and annoy.

    If “Independents” want to learn how to run Scientology outside the Church, my suggestion would be organize much like Ron’s Org has. Ron’s Org was featured in a documentary called “The Beginners Guide to L. Ron Hubbard” which is available all over the Internet.

    The way to do it is just to practice Scientology as you believe it and it is laid out in the Reds, Greens and in-betweens (see what I did there?).

  332. It is a horrible fate for Scientologists to constantly monitor the lies they have to make up for people to believe so they can stay in business. That activity alone is enough to make a person crazy all on its own.

    That is why most people just don’t believe Scientologists.

    Including me.

    There is something wrong with them. I like to think I never anticipated this being the eventual truth about them when I first got involved, but at that point in time, before any formal auditing or training, even I was prone to believe.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  333. DFB aka Dfb99

    I think I would be fine if it said -A clear is a being who no longer has his reactive mind. It’s that word “own” that is a bit of a mind fuck excuse my french.

    And in hindsight, I do not get how you can be “not really free of case” after clear. If you didnt have your reactive mind, how is this stuff you are handling effecting you? You “go clear” and then apparently you run whole track implants or incidents that are effecting you, but how do they effect you if you are clear?

    I don’t know man, I know auditing works. Some of the auditing I’ve had has been incomparable to anything else in life and I’ve had indescribable spiritual gains (I think) . But it’s all subjective. Thats the part that gets me.

  334. Michael,
    I’ve been working the Factors on space and the 1st ACC. The other day he mentioned running an engram is just putting the space back in it as causitive application of these Factors. I think the whole subject, every process, every thing in it, fell into alignment for me. I’m experiencing ‘creaks’ on all fronts. Wow. Unfreakinbelievable. I think it would be good to chat. One of these days.

  335. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    I’m stunned by the apparent ridging on this hot topic. The discussion of it seems to trigger a few into “attack” mode. I’m being judged that I’m PTS? ROTFL.

    I’ll try again to make myself even more clear:

    Scientology, its name and all its absurd trademarks, and works of LRH are under the suppressive control of a madman.

    As it stands this minute, the work is not free.

    One cannot start their own mission without fear of legal attack.

    If I’m wrong, then I’d appreciate the Scientology Org name, address, and phone number of a thriving independent, walk-in Scientology Org posted here, so I can talk to their Executive Director and ask how they can exist as an independent Org without CofS coming after them for trademark and copyright violation.

    Can even one public Org in the USA like this be named, which operates without any fear or secret?

    Unless this is the common scene, Scientology is most certainly not freed.

  336. DFB aka Dfb99

    I don’t have anything else to say thats worthwhile.

  337. DFB aka Dfb99

    Taking a break. Maybe I’ll figure out what this all means.

  338. 🙂 Who’s the boss? I am!

  339. Squatting Bill

    WE, maybe I’m being dim here, but if you want a refund don’t you just write to the relevant Org? I am going through the cycle so am interested in any successful actions, especially Flag and the IAS. Thanks (outside the US).

  340. I know that type of personality – and it is far more likely such wadded-together, compressed composites get really keyed-in by these jibes.

    British intelligence used to really get under Adolph Hitler’s skin by adroitly placed newspaper articles.

    The next step is to get to his MONEY…then you will see some apocalyptic rage. Perhaps a third-party, government entity coming in “temporarily” to run the “books”? The American Justice Department did this with the Teamster’s Union for awhile, due to breach of fiduciary duty by union management.

    Such an event would likely make him blow – but he’s clever enough to have a nice fat cash-stash set up for himself. But….has he dared to rig false IDs for himself? Probably not – so he’d have to hide within the USA. If Dave were smarter, he’d have a crooked republic somewhere paid off to give him asylum.

    When they finally catch him, he’ll have the chance to discover his true sexuality….in prison. maybe Cruise will visit him there?

  341. It’s pure application of the Miscavige Disorg Board.

  342. Scientology was never intended as a replacement for hospital treatment. On the other hand, it is the perfect complement to hospital treatment, because the hospital treats the body, and Scientology can treat the mind and the spirit of the person. The person heals and recovers better from illness and injury when he is treated as a whole person of all 3 parts.

    There is in fact a whole volume published long ago, of various assists for various upsets, illnesses, and injuries, that can be used together with medical treatment to improve healing and getting well faster. Assists like the touch assist, nerve assist, body comm process etc.

    Of course most of them have never been integrated with medicine, which they could have been.

  343. Alex Braverman - Pleasanton, CA


    ~You got the midget mad now,
    tell that little suppressive dick that it is game over.

    I got my PI tonight good, check the news tomorrow. (or Monday?).

    Send in the next one you little prick, 2x worse, guaranteed.

    Independent at heart,
    ~ Alex

  344. Simple – no one wants to be the “first out of the trench”. Ever watch that British silent movie of the first moments of an attack out of the trenches toward German lines? Almost everyone was mowed down.

    If you are LATER out of the trench, you can at least use the bullet-riddled bodies of your dead comrades for “cover”. The folks with REAL integrity bailed-out in 1982-84, leaving a sort of thug-like “second team” of bench-warmers to take the court.

    I always make a special point of acking the “first out”.

    Me? I stuck it out for several years beyond that – I was determined to complete OT VIII. After I completed, I remember leaning over the side rail, watching some distant coast slide by to the south, thinking “At last…no more sh*t-sandwiches, these bastards can’t hold the Bridge over my head anymore”.

    When you’ve been poorly generaled for decades, and the game has degenerated down to dog-eat-dog, every man for himself? You just don’t get a good mass uprising. Besides, most staff at Int AT LEAST get “3 hots and a cot”, so it’s not like they have been pushed to the brink of physical survival.

    Their bodies are still alive.

  345. Jim,
    That was a very nice comment. Great information/quotes backed by the reasoning of a good mind.
    Nice work–very thoughtful.
    I don’t often make the time to read real long comments with the exception of the posting, but from now on, I’ll follow your column in the Sunday paper here and see if you can become one of my favorites!

  346. There is always the matter of confronting evil – an ability you seem to lack if I correctly interpret your post. Sorry if I am wrong “for others”.

    I long ago got out of the habit of making excuses for evil conduct – I suggest you do the same. I’ll leave it to you and other theetie-wheaties to “grant beingness to David Miscavige”.

    That’s not MY job. Ask Marty to “grant beingness to DM” after that pussbag just got done dissing his wife!? After trashing her hard-earned attest to a beautiful new state?

    As far as “still being a composite”, I don’t dispute that. You are correct.

    Absolutes are, after all, unobtainable (remember the Axioms….SURE you do!). Though at the end of New OT VII (not OT VIII) you are asked to attest to the same impossible condition you attested to on OT III, the fact is the EP of New VII is supposed to be “Cause Over Life”; “My space is devoid of any circuit, lock, secondary, engram and stray beingness – from NOW onto all time!” is NOT the EP. The difference is “Cause” versus “Effect”.

    It would be impractical to eliminate “all pebbles on all beaches everywhere”….but one might become CAUSE over them, so that one can deal with the odd bits that pop up now and then, as the therapeutic process of living itself increases your awareness. Also, if the only way one could be “cause” was to utterly eliminate the existence of items you were the effect of? I would have to say this is a first class confession of being at “effect”.

    Winning a war is all about “pounding in anchor points” – not sitting on a mushroom, puffing on your hookah.

    Rehabilitate, by all means – AFTER the war is won.

    BTW – look up the meaning of “persiflage” – you used it incorrectly. **DOH!**…..did I pound in an anchor point!?

  347. I second that!

  348. Nice philosophy – but Man remained in chains for centuries long after Aristotle was done “propounding his propunderances”

    Yes, you BECOME what you RESIST…….that is, if you resist too uncleverly and too obsessively.

    So….don’t do that! Then you can fight David Miscavige without becoming him.

  349. Bravo!

    Thanks for the link(s).

    You’re the real thing.

  350. Of course Marty,
    you should know better!! In the Church of $, Clear is not a State anymore, but a STATUS you can only buy if you are an IAS member (and of course I do not think Mosey has ever donated to the IAS).
    And if you do not move to your next status into a reasonable time frame… it might be cancelled again… ;-D
    Ha! ha!…
    Congratulation Mosey!! you Rock!

  351. I used to urge my friends during the 80s to GET CRACKING Bridge-wise. LRH wasn’t kidding with that “brief breath in eternity” bit. I had an excellent FSM team that assisted me as far as they could, then I had to transfer to a different entity who could navigate Flag’s shoals.

    Who knew that DM would completely close off the Bridge once he consolidated power?

    It got really “tribal” at Flag close to the end for relatively free access to OT VIII – if you didn’t look and smell EXACTLY like the enemy (Flag) you weren’t going to be allowed through the lines. I succeeded, more by gutter instinct than any analytical grand plan.

    Anyway, I just had a fresh look at Clearbird’s site….every time I visit that site, more order and value has been added to it. “The totality of power is orderly progress”.

    As I have met some of my financial goals, and have more free time not devoured by business, I have decided to renew my quest for OT (beyond OT VIII). I have sufficient friends and finance to pursue this, and (hopefully) enough time.

    For those who may seek Clearing, I recommend Clearbird. They have a very orderly presentation of materials.

  352. Watching Eyes

    Writing to the orgs makes sense. The problem comes in if they tell you they don’t have to refund. If you paid for a service thinking you were getting LRH but instead got Miscavige-tech you should have every right to ask for that money back and get it. However, they see things differently.

    Or what if they don’t respond at all. Or what about when the IAS says they don’t give refunds when we all know it’s been done. What do you do then? Write to the gov agencies above.

  353. Speaking of men in chains, the SO and its chain lockers along with the mental and emotional entrapment amongst staff and public inside scientology ITSELF, 60 years after Hubbard wrote dianetics and built his organization based on his own philosophy. I think we can cut aristotle some slack.

  354. Shouldn’t you at your level have such compasion and serenity that you would express the intention to audit him in jail or at least be an instrument of help ?

    Not a complaint but an observation. I actually fully agree with you on this, yet it suprised me.

  355. Begin out of your or someones home. Make a world wide web of homes.

  356. What do long term splinter Scientologists think about this? They surely have been-there/done-that on producing splinter group Clears for decades now.

    Dr. Winter, in his book “Dianetics: A Doctor’s Report” , 1951 edition (found on Amazon for cheap) says he saw improved cases, but never saw a Clear as Clear is defined in DMSMH.

    Another book I like is scholar Harriet Whitehead’s book called “Renunciation and Reformulation.”

    In Harriet’s Chapter 3 “The Puzzle of Religious and Psychotherapeutic Revelation” she explained for me WHY Scientology therapy works.

    Winter and Whitehead’s books are on Amazon for cheap relatively.

    Winter’s book is easier to read.

  357. Silvia brings up an interesting point.

    If the states one was awarded while in the church of scientology in the last 20 years ( While DM was running things ) was not really a state but a status as Silvia says then that must have also been the case for her state/status of being an OT VII given to her if it was given to her within the rein of Miscavige. ( or any other OT or clears in the last 20 years ).

    Is a church of Miscavige OT really an OT or just a status given to them for other reasons like the state/status of “clear” was given to Lisa McPherson?

    How do we know for certain that all the clears and OTs that came out of the church of scientology since David Miscavige are real clears and OTs not given that stat/status for other reasons. How do we know that this has not been systemic?

  358. OTHVIII,
    If you check the derivation of persiflage you’ll find it means ‘to hiss thoroughly’.

  359. martyrathbun09

    I suggest you go clear and not put a lot of stock into the threats, promises, and conditioning others try to lay on you about other case at that point.

  360. martyrathbun09

    absolutes are unattainable.

  361. OTVIII,
    “…if you resist too uncleverly and too obsessively.”

    You recall the Study Tapes, the datum ‘know what you know and know what you don’t know’ as a requisite to learning. (I’ll assume you do).

    By assuming an identity, and droppinng down from full responsibility, pan-determinism, and selecting out other-determinism, one achieves ‘two-terminals’. That’s the necessity in this universe for action. Concommitant with that, there’s a need for some ‘plus’ on the ‘negative’ and some ‘negative’ on the ‘plus’. In other words, to some extent you’ve already ‘become’ that which you resist. You have to in order to get any flow.

    However, if you figure you can do it otherwise…

    You didn’t do my other Instruct on the meanings of ‘self-determinism’ did you.

  362. Jim and Michael. I admire your ability to grapple with these concepts. You guys are party animals of a different sort. When your done comparing notes, meet me down at the river and we can do some fishing.
    Your thoughts on a “first incident” Michael did get my interest. Do you see any parrellels with Aquinas and his first cause or mover or with “the fall” of man found in many religions? Or are you later on the chain? I am not tryiong to keep up with you guys, just baiting the hooks.

  363. Quoting OT VIII, yes that’s pretty amazing in itself.

    “OT VIII | October 3, 2010 at 10:29 am | Reply
    Simple – no one wants to be the “first out of the trench”. Ever watch that British silent movie of the first moments of an attack out of the trenches toward German lines? Almost everyone was mowed down.

    If you are LATER out of the trench, you can at least use the bullet-riddled bodies of your dead comrades for “cover”. The folks with REAL integrity bailed-out in 1982-84, leaving a sort of thug-like “second team” of bench-warmers to take the court.

    I always make a special point of acking the “first out”.”

  364. martinez regis

    Big ACK for the job !! I guess you will be paid for that soon.
    With love
    Régis from FRANCE

  365. Do your Homework, Critics and Freezoners have paved the way for you.

    November 9, 1998 4:00 PM PST

    Scientology loses copyright round
    By John Borland
    Staff Writer, CNET News

    “A Colorado nonprofit group has won a critical round in a legal fight against the Church of Scientology, raising questions about whether Scientology has a legal right to keep hundreds of documents offline and out of the public eye.
    The church, through its nonprofit subsidiary Bridge Publications, is suing Boulder-based FACTNet on charges that the group pirated more than 1,900 copyrighted church documents and distributing them on CD-ROMs.

    But FACTNet and its cofounder, former Scientology member Lawrence Wollersheim, contend that Bridge does not have legal copyrights to all–and possibly to any–of the documents in question.

    In a ruling last Wednesday, federal judge John Kane denied Scientology’s request for summary judgment, saying that FACTNet successfully had cast doubt on the legal status of the documents. Kane’s decision sends the case to a full trial, which will be supervised by a court “special master” appointed to untangle the thorny copyright issues involved.”

    Read more: http://news.cnet.com/2100-1023-217696.html#ixzz11J4klvPc

  366. Thank you very much for all the congrats! You guys fully duplicated what I was trying to express. Reading through all the comments and personal experiences here, I am extremely grateful that I have the good fortune to have access to the tech without all the added carrots and certainly without all the sticks!
    There is nothing more satisfying than having my wins in session on the weekend, then leaving the safety and security of The Shack and testing them out in the everyday world. Once I can apply my wins to my everyday world, I know I’ve got it! That has been the best part of my journey up the bridge.
    We know what we know and we know who we are. No one has the ability to take that from us unless we give them the power to do so!
    Thank you to my best friend, my husband and my auditor, who has shared this with me for no other motivation than to simply help me become me!
    You Rock!
    Love Mosey
    PS. Mitsu…No one is the boss of me!!! One of most favorite sayings! 🙂

  367. http://atheism.about.com/od/scientology/ig/Anonymous-Protest–Scientology.–Vq/Scientology-s-Lawsuits.htm

    “Judge Leonie Brinkema rejected all arguments offered by the Church of Scientology and recognized that they were a transparent attempt to censor critics and keep people from learning what Scientology really teaches: “the Court is now convinced that the primary motivation of RTC in suing Lerma, DGS and the Post is to stifle criticism of Scientology in general and to harass its critics. As the increasingly vitriolic rhetoric of its briefs and oral argument now demonstrates, the RTC appears far more concerned about criticism of Scientology than vindication of its secrets.”

  368. http://www.euronet.nl/~kmj/Ntfaq1uk.html

    I Bloody LOVE my country ! It ends in (dot)nl
    “The Church of Scientology
    Questions and Answer about the Churchs’ actions to uphold religious freedom, copyright law and trade secret protections on the Internet.

    Church of Scientology organizations have filed suit against a number of individuals and organisations for copyright and trade secrets violations on the Internet. The following questions and answers explain why the Curch has found it necessary to take these actions and address specific questions which have been raised in some media about the issues of copyright infringement, trade secrets violations and religious freedom, as it applies to these cases.
    Why does the Church of Scientology use copyright and trade secret law to protect its scriptures?
    Why does the Church keep certain of its scriptures confidential?”
    ETC. ETC.

  369. OK Wayne, I’ll try and make up with a longer explanation. Read Terril’s post again. If you follow each link you’ll gain some valuable data on the issue. You’ve looked up ‘laches’ now as well.

    Here’s the point, RTC has a time limiter on taking action on those who use the terms that are supposed to be under their authority. It’s not a real long time either, on the order of weeks, or less, once they become aware of the use. If they don’t actively pursue then they lose exclusivity.

    That doesn’t mean they can’t file action. It does mean they won’t succeed. If they file and lose, then of course it becomes confirmed in the courts, and then the mirage, the Lake Tanganyika of scary shadows herding the fish, is gone, ‘officially’.

    DM wants to avoid that. Why? Because he’s the Chairman of the Board of RTC whose SOLE reason for existence according to LRH’s personal estate planning was to protect the marks! He’s blown the reason for existence of RTC.

    Now, he’s already blown it, that’s the point being made. Is he willing now to lose it in court where it becomes broad public knowledge?

    I’ll grant that he’s completely wonk and so in a mad frothing rampage he’ll demand his lawyers pursue it. However, these are the stakes he’s playing for and personally, knowing how a game is played much better now, if you can outplay every possible move ahead of time, then there is an overwhelm and no game. That’s pretty much where we, humans, people on earth, us beings studying and using Scientology, written and spoken by L. Ron Hubbard, sit today.


    To make this perfectly clear; in this post, on this broadly reaching public forum, I’ve used the ‘marks’. I’ve been doing so for well over a year here, and all over the broadly reaching public forums for a few years. I’ve not heard a peep. Sooooooo, LACHES.

    And I’m only one person among hordes of others. Why I just watched a fantastic video presentation by Trey Lotz at the Freezone Conference held recently. Ask Trey if anybody from RTC said anything to him or any other at that conference. They didn’t. Sooooooo, LACHES.

    It’s done. It IS free. Wewax, put you wegs up, and enjoy the freedom.

    Jim Logan, Scientologist

  370. Jim,

    Wowzer! Hadn’t heard that datum about putting the space back in as a causative application of the Factors. Makes sense to me. Probably very similar to what I’ve been looking at: how theta creates force/energy/power and the ramifications. How space comes into being and how beingness interacts with what is created. How organisms became a solution–and the problems for which organisms were a solution.

    Then the initial idea of “impediments” which LRH renamed “engrams,” but which extends far beyond merely engrams as a concept. Just what impedes theta from top down? And how do these impediments manifest as theta descends the scale? Plus, what is the source of the actual impediments to one’s life and existence–and how does that source actually bring these things about?


    So, simple and so complex.

    It’s just fascinating seeing LRH’s rapid progression from running engrams from a human viewpoint to running this stuff from a theta viewpoint. Just fucking fascinating.


  371. Thanks, OTDT.

  372. CR,
    Good on ya!

  373. CD,
    I’m impressed.

  374. As Susan is a Poster on this Blog now an Tory too on occasion and even Wise Beard Man congratulating Mosey and Marty on their Marriage I like to post this. Lyne Fontain from ESMB is there too. Alsoo Graham Beryy, Yes that’s the Lawyer who has the balls to take on Scientology together with Barry van Sickle(not in the video). Wasn’t Susan not the one who Invited Jim Logan for the 12th in LA ?

  375. Watching Eyes

    Squatting Bill,
    Another thing; if you reside outside the US, if you file a complaint with gov agencies here in the US, cc your ambassador to the US. That will draw more attention to y our complaint.

  376. Ahhh, my ol’ buddy, Dimension is the myriad manifestations: chick-peas, facsimile/pictures, emotion, the corner store, brain cells, toe-nails, a walk in a park, Chevrolets, sunlight, quantum physics, magnetism, feeling, rocks and in all that, every ‘thing’ there is missing – the Viewpoint.

    Space and time are psychological phenomena – the psyche – source. Even Kant could on that one Chuck.

  377. Psy·che (sk)
    n. Greek Mythology
    A young woman who loved and was loved by Eros and was united with him after Aphrodite’s jealousy was overcome. She subsequently became the personification of the soul.

    psy·che 1 (sk)
    1. The spirit or soul.
    2. Psychiatry The mind functioning as the center of thought, emotion, and behavior and consciously or unconsciously adjusting or mediating the body’s responses to the social and physical environment.

  378. Chuck what is your view on Neuroplasticity ?

  379. becomingAware

    Guess the PC didn’t obey.

    It explains why he enjoyed disparaging others auditing abilities.

  380. Michael wrote: “Scientology is just very efficient…at achieving those states.”

    Wouldn’t you also add more thorough, and therefore potentially far more stable?

  381. LOL , you don’t understand anything. We are onley just starting 😉

  382. Your humble servant

    Of course we don’t want to torture him, although he has tortured countless others and cost incalculable damage. But why should we audit him before we have the time and resources to get around to him along with “the last dregs”? He has no money to exchange for auditing. All the money he has was stolen from others, so any money he has is not really his to exchange. In his insane condition he has nothing to contribute in exchange for help, not even gratitude or an honest smile. We are looking at a real spiritual clinker here.

  383. I think you mean fweedom.

  384. OTHVIII,
    You: “There is always the matter of confronting evil – an ability you seem to lack if I correctly interpret your post. Sorry if I am wrong “for others”.

    “I long ago got out of the habit of making excuses for evil conduct – I suggest you do the same. I’ll leave it to you and other theetie-wheaties to “grant beingness to David Miscavige”.”

    Me: search my name on this blog in the Search feature.

    When DM declared me, I experienced overwhelm. I was not yet through OT III at that point, but Clear. I’d also done the FPRD, eight Dynamics, twice, given and received. I’d done the Grades. Dianetics. I’d had lots of auditing, lots of training.

    I directly witnessed the utter hatred and evil intentions of David Miscavige. I went through the Valley of the Shadow of Death. I felt my own impulses to hate him back. I was in confusion and could have easily selected a Ser Fac as a solution and formed the next part of the identities of the GPM. I could have easily fallen into to a new failed attempt to solve it with destructive intentions – epurps.

    This time, it was different than all the whole track that preceded it. This time I had enough KRC of the mind and life, to rise above the automaticities, the fixed answers that are just new problems. This time, I knew how to know. I have Scientology.

    DM, in my opinion, is a familiar being from a shared track for this particular part of this universe. He’s a whole-track Suppressive Person, not just some wanker that got lucky. In my opinion, due to the technical breakthroughs that LRH acheived in that life, this being is come to thwart the freedom that can be attained with Dianetics and Scientology.

    Be that as it may, he IS a classic SP. I’ve undergone his direct suppression. I’m free of it. Now, what to effectively do about it becomes the issue. What is going to actually work to terminatedly handle this?

    My answers come from the materials and use of them that has worked for me. No continuation of the GPM, but application of the truths of Scientology. Why would I dramatize when I can be present cause?

    I have managed to confront evil head on. I have, thanks to L. Ron Hubbard’s work, emerged able to understand it, and become very much more cause over it. That’s a much better place than I’ve been all these many ages, waiting, watching, preparing and looking forward to another chance to apply the correct estimation of effort to deal with the issue at hand.

    I’d be a fool to merely play the GPM. You aren’t a fool, are you?

  385. Wow I posted a Churchie’s view. don’t get Enturbulated Wayne ;). Well we are “Looking at Both Sides”now it seems.

  386. And THAT answers the question for me of why he has declared 99% of the old Saint Hill staff.

  387. Thought Provoking

    In my org, when someone went clear, a bell was rung and all staff and public stopped what they were doing and went to the chapel to hear the announcement.

    It seemed to me to be the one time where crowd valences dropped and beings shared a moment of pure theta. Listening to your words, I’m having one now.

    What wonderful wins and such a beautiful spirit of play! Well Done!

  388. loki,
    I haven’t read Aquinas in ages, so I’m out on that question. The fishing? Oh yeah, I’m in!

    Do you flyfish?

  389. “He apparently was influenced by the large quantity of steroids he was using at the time for the control of his asthma. Rage being one of the side effects of steroid use.”

    In his defence this could be so, and hw was a child at the time.

  390. Jim, I’m afraid I don’t flyfish. I am at the bottom of the rung when it comes to fishing. Put on the bait, cast, find a place to sit down. I will stand up when I get a hit, though.

  391. Michael,
    I know the area you are talking about, it’s in the area of Effort Processing. OK, here’s another take, and one I haven’t fully integrated with electronics/two-terminal on a grosser plane, yet.

    You know the idea of theta as the ‘base’ holding two-terminals apart but in proximity. OK, in order to get a flow, energy, AT the terminals, you have to have some plus with the minus and some minus with the plus. Sort like getting in touch with one’s ‘feminine’ side, or moustaches on girls. With this energy at the terminals, and an abundance at one, and a scarcity at the other of the overall plus or minus, you get motion on ‘automatic’. Somewhere in there is the idea in electronics that Resistance is needed or there is no Difference of Potential, there is equillibrium (well, as much as you can get in this constantly changing manifestation). So, as it appears on this blog for instance, add some resistance, and the flow increases. Just the right amount though or it won’t flow.

    The Dianetic Axioms had that idea that all thought was preceded by a counter-effort. The Scn Axioms, the Qs preceding them, lift this up to the Static and postulates preceding all that Dn Axiom data. So, while mechanically speaking, the Dn Axioms apply, above that is consideration and the very first ‘effort’ (at a high level of thought) would be opposed by the ‘counter-effort’, emanating from the same source, the Static. The Static would have to deny source, lie, and thus gain persistence of the ‘counter’, while the primary thought is allowed to remain. Hence ‘two terminals’ and the beginnings of the automaticities that give the apparency of time.

    I’m only on the first half a dozen Factors in my aware ‘practicing’ and it takes a hyper jump when you Factor in the rest of the Viewpoints. But I gotta tell ya, ‘space is a viewpoint of dimension’ has never been more apparent.

  392. I agree that DM onley has taken from everybody and is over-drawn on his Spiritual Bank Account.

    clink·er (klngkr)
    1. The incombustible residue, fused into an irregular lump, that remains after the combustion of coal.
    2. A partially vitrified brick or a mass of bricks fused together.
    3. An extremely hard burned brick.
    4. Vitrified matter expelled by a volcano.
    5. Slang
    a. A sour note in a musical performance: hit a clinker.
    b. A mistake; a blunder.
    c. Something of inferior quality; a conspicuous failure: a clinker of a show.
    6. Chiefly British Something admirable or first-rate.
    intr.v. clink·ered, clink·er·ing, clink·ers
    To form clinkers in burning.

  393. M,
    P.S. You can take Effort Processing so far, and that’s not too far, before you are into the ‘GE’ and go down that track. The cells are manifestations of the theory behind Effort Processing. Li’l buggers, getting together in colonies, and voila, good looking babes on earth! Don’t wanna as-is too much of this stuff 🙂

  394. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Thank you! I and likely other readers (and future readers) of this blog appreciate you taking the time and effort to write a quality reply to explain clearly what you’re talking about. I was frustrated from the few apparent smug and curt non-answers.

    The real test (of what is still hypothesis to me) is …

    Are there any existing, well-financed, ballsy independent Scientology Orgs who have gone forward to test this hypothesis, and risk CofS attempting to utterly ruin them through the legal process?

    If so, who are they? That’s why I asked for the name, phone number, and address of even one successful, full-scale Org like this.

    I’m not talking about small, in-the-home, one person operation … worse, an operation which may act in clandestine like the Germans hiding the Jews from the Nazi’s. That’s certainly not “free” either.

    I’m referring to a fully manned independent Public Org … a Class IV or even an active mission like the highly successful (at least in 1979) Portland Mission of Davis, where I started in Scientology.

    If there is nothing like this in existance in 2010, then the hypothesis of “laches” is still seems like “vaporware”, because it hasn’t been tested in a full-size Org yet in broad open public.

    IMO, the CofS isn’t worried about any one-man operations auditing another in their home. Doing that has NEVER concerned me.

    It’s the competing, fully-manned Org that CofS is likely to come down hard on with their ruthless copyright and trademark hammer, especially if it’s run exactly like LRH intended.

    In all earnestness, if Scientology is truly free as you claim, where are the independent Public Scientology Orgs? I asked for the name of just one.

    If the test of laches hasn’t been proven out in a significant Org, then we’re just playing in the field of hope, instead of fact. IMO.

  395. Marg,

  396. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Jim Logan wrote, “DM, in my opinion, is a familiar being from a shared track for this particular part of this universe. He’s a whole-track Suppressive Person, not just some wanker that got lucky. In my opinion, due to the technical breakthroughs that LRH acheived in that life, this being is come to thwart the freedom that can be attained with Dianetics and Scientology.”

    Indeed. This is my opinion too, Jim.

  397. CD,
    I’m impressed again.

    By the way, did you know that Self Analysis is practice in neuroplasticity?

  398. Commendable performance. Very good, very well done on the completion of your OT VIII.

    I am not from the INT Base. I have never been there. I know of one or two stories from people that have been there and left that are not happy ones. I believe them. I do not think them liars or cowards.

    “David Miscavige is not my boss!” though. I don’t hate the man, he is just ignorant. And that coupled with him not even having a high school diploma and his drinking whiskey 3 times a week does not make him the “prince at the party” in a social scene. He seems like a violent person to me. People that drink or take some kind of dope are almost always the people first prone to violence, which of course does not include being the first to jump out of the trenches.

    One time I went to a Flag event in New York {a different one than Karen #1 was at} and some guy in the audience ask the SO host {emecee} “Where is L. Ron Hubbard these days?”. She {the SO emcee} came right out and told him it wasn’t really any of his business. Really? Well I wonder if she would still say the same thing today if she ever found herself in the RPF for 9 years.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  399. Leland Conrad Powers


    Again you’re going into siege mode. No one (at least not the post you replied to) is attacking you directly or indirectly). Maybe you have some self esteem issues?

    Anyway, you asked for data on organizations that deliver standardized LRH technology freely, openly and without harm. Here is such a list courtesy of the Ron’s Org field auditors list.


    If you have any questions you can address them to people such as Terril Park, Max Hauri or failing that, talk directly to somebody like Ken Urqhaart who was a person friend of LRHs. He’s been delivering for years. Whether or not Ken is still active, I don’t know.

    You’re welcome btw ! =)

  400. martyrathbun09

    Wayne, if you want a Class IV or even Mission, go to your local church of Scientology.

  401. Jim

    I couldn’t help but notice a couple of technical outpoints in the e-mail to Mosey.
    It states… Per HCOB 5Mar 1979 RB, Dianetic Clear False Declares, that…
    ” It requires that the exact application of Scientology and Dianetics technology to bring a preclear up to the state of Clear, whether on NED after Grades or on the Clearing Course.”

    Hmmmm… First of all, whatever happened to going clear on Dianetics per the book Dianetics The Modern Science of Mental Health? Or R3R.? I cannot believe that LRH is saying that neither he nor anyone else who produced a Clear using these technologies, prior to NED, is not only mistaken, but to say so is Suppressive.

    Can you, or Wayne perhaps, do a comparison of the original HCOB, dated 5Mar 1979, (or an earlier issue).

    And then there is this…
    “In the event of a false attest, the C/S, Director of Validity and
    any other org staff involved in the cycle are subject to a
    Committee of Evidence and, if found guilty, are subject to
    suspension of all certs. (Ref: HCO PL 7 Mar. 65 II, CERTIFICATE

    So… Are all those terminals being rounded up and Comm Eved? What about the recent cycles where Clears are “undeclared” “handled to Clear”, attest, and are later “undeclared” again, etc. Are all those terminals being “handled” per the Policy? Has David Miscavage been called before a Comm Ev for his”involvement” in the Lisa MacPhearson fiasco? What about all those involved in Clearing anyone prior to NED, or any such person acknowledging such a state of clear?
    I wonder how the currrent “church” or DM justifies that breach of policy.


  402. DFB,

    Obviously you are a real thinker.

    These are really good questions. I can’t answer them. These exact questions are answered very specifically on the OT levels.

    I’m intrigued by your comment that your case gain is subjective. Am I to understand from this that you are trying to sort out your own Clear status? If so, you won’t be able to do this on your own. There are technical reasons why this is so, and you‘ll need to get a professional to help you sort this out. I recommend Marty of course or Trey Lotz, who I know personally.
    A lot of wins and case gain await you. Best thing to do is just keep on going.
    All will be revealed.

  403. DFB,

    I thought of a really great reference after my last post to you. It might help answer some of your questions. It is:


  404. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Too late. LOL. But it’s not because of the “churchies” view.

    I tend to get “enturbulated” (read impatient and annoyed) when I see smugness, curtness, and blitheness. I’ve never considered those qualities helpful to life.

    (Quick note: You being a non-Scientologist, I want to clear up what the church lady, in BBC Panorama, said about the Tone Scale … that “Clears don’t experience the lower range of emotions.” The hell they don’t! One not experiencing negative emotions is NOT the mark of sanity. One experiencing the appropriate emotion to an event, is. Of course, one chronically in a negative emotion is an insanity. So to clarify, one is not “insane” if they get “enturbulated” about something. The right question to ask is, “Was it the appropriate emotion to the event?)

    I also get “enturbulated” (read saddened and disappointed) when the Auditor’s Code is not practiced outside an Auditor’s sessions.

    I’ve found when the Auditor’s Code can be applied, in earnest, to everyday livingness 24/7, one’s compassion for others shines through. This beautiful Auditor’s empathy contributes to sanity, new “aha” moments (cognitions/realizations) for oneself and others, and gives the gift of more peace of mind for all, even outside of session.

    I recently realized that practicing the Auditor’s Code IS nonviolent communication, which, on Earth, is a very rare and precious commodity. (If there was a Heaven, I envision this is how communication would be there.)

    Anybody who can always uphold this high standard in their everyday life has my most upmost respect and admiration. I’d hang with a Class O Auditor who upholds the Auditor’s Code 24/7, over an OT VIII who doesn’t, ANY day … hands down.

    IMO, I consider the Auditors Code a way of life, not just a temporary beingness “in session” with the PreClear. For me, the mark of a good Auditor is one who practices this Code in LIFE.

    Being able to apply the Auditors Code 24/7 should be an acknowledged “State of Beingness” in itself! lol.

    IMO, the Auditor’s Code sets the standard for nonviolent communication, a way that the most beautiful, most loved Beings naturally behave.

    If I came across to you as the vague catch-all word, “enturbulated”, the above is an attempted description of my exact feelings, and what I aspire to. 🙂

  405. Marty and Mosey

    Well done Marty on a job well done in producing your Clear, Mosey.
    Well done Mosey in achieving the state of Clear!

    FLUNK on DM or his OSA terminals who are involved in attempting to invalidate a Clear. Per the HCOB you have cited that is an “actionable” offense.


  406. ,Wayne (AKA Safe), I will satisfy your request about a driving SCN place!! (In a few days I will post them right here on Marty’s blog!
    However you are right – the words SCN & DN are NOT used in the group’s name, nor are we for instance: advertising ARC classes,or any other SCN nomenclature – there is no reason and never was – even orgs should not do this as it does NOT comply with marketing principles and which is why I can put more people in a org single handedly than the whole org together .
    Actually even when I FSM’d 60 000 people on the bridge (doctors to orgs or people into my mission in India) I never used the word SCN or DN “to make the sale”
    I am not here to promote SCN – never was – I am here to help people and make a living at it!!
    Mostly I am doing it because its fun !!!
    The word SCN – even DN can (and will) be gone tomorrow and I could care less.
    Even Ron’s name is not anymore part of the equation as such – keeping up anyone’s “legacy is abberated at the least.
    (It would be nice if Mr. Mismanage would not have ruined it, but he did – so what? – let’s move on)
    My point is let’s not pay attention to the cup , rather to the coffee.
    Helping people is the coffee, al the rest is the cup, and I guaranty you that the coffee (SCN ) tastes the same no matter what you call it.
    Even – or especially the adherence to a supper exact tech standards is -and always was destructive, as no matter what you or Ron says – they are ALWAYS up for interpretation.
    Ron – never adhered to it – he just called new development!!
    We do not have to live in a time where a comma out of place is more important than the person winning. It’s a misleading sales pitch and always was!!
    People want coffee (wins in live) – all kinds of wins and different for every one) just give it and never mind the cup (name, tech,)
    Let’s start handing out wins – we are not her to make people liking Ron, SCN, “make them spiritual” or anything else.
    We are here to help them with what they want help and then some more!!
    Avail yourself of the tools (coffee) – not the cup (legacy, tech, standard, our SCN, Ron etc).
    The church is death – the ability to help is not!!!

    I am not attacking you Wayne ( AKA Safe)– even though I very well know that this method of talking gets the blood pressure up – it’s all done un-purposely to get people to look –wake them up , get them to talk ,and is some form of “bait and badger” if you will – defiantly very effective in making millionaires and happy people as they start fighting back and get charge of and thus start seeing – so I do appreciate the opportunity to hopefully make some see that they are NOT in the church anymore and that there are no rules ,no limitations ,no barriers . (Our group has over a 100 staff by the way – look for SK’s stat publishes soon)

    nothing above says that we are NOT using SCN & DN to the fullest as it IS the very best there ever was .
    I am just not a patriot -that is all – and that not only eliminates all the “problems” some of you guys seem to want to solve, but actually gets more people reaching for it a sit complies with basic marketing principle!
    Do you know the Ron said that if would find out that red door brings people in he would do it?
    I know Ron operated MY way, as I learned it from him – long, long time ago!
    (Go ahead and take that to court dear Mr. Missmanage!)

  407. SAFE
    “Are there any existing, well-financed, ballsy independent Scientology Orgs who have gone forward to test this hypothesis, and risk CofS attempting to utterly ruin them through the legal process?

    “f so, who are they? That’s why I asked for the name, phone number, and address of even one successful, full-scale Org like this.”

    Some people still like to keep under the radar as far as COS is
    concerned, more from threats of disconnection from friends,family etc, than worries about copyright. However many top flight auditors are quite openly delivering auditing. Some have posted about that on this blog, for example Ken Urquhart, Trey Lotz and Glen Samuels,
    who I’ve spoken with or met and a class XII from Italy [ Tiziano?] and
    others here who may or may not audit, I don’t know them personally.
    Not on this blog but with his own website is also Pierre Ethier
    class XII.

    Not sure about the well financed part. Viable yes. There are in fact
    few places that run a course room in the english speaking world, but
    I’m in touch with 3 and post there success stories broadly on a regular basis, and know of a few others who are pretty much under the radar.

    This URL below is a website set up by a Russian Tatiana quite recently and you can find websites and phone no’s and pictures of
    premises and at of at least one courseroom. Also there are many videos of auditors, including ones made at the recent Freezone conference. I found the videos of Mary Freeman, nee Maren, on
    her history in scn very interesting. She is trained as an auditor of
    power and also class VIII under LRH.


  408. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    I would never trust any issue “by” Ron on 2 December, 1985 … right before his death, IMO.

    Here is an earlier version …


    Bold = DELETED from the previously posted issue of 2, December 1985 Issue
    Italics = ADDED to the previously posted issue of 2, December 1985 Issue

    Saint Hill Manor, East Grinstead, Sussex
    RE-REVISED 31 MARCH 1981

    All Orgs
    All Missions
    Ds of P
    Ethics Officers

    (Revised to clarify paragraph 5, to give references which apply to this issue and to include this issue as part of the Dianetic Clear Series.)
    (Revisions in Script)
    Dianetic Clear Series 11
    REF: HCOB 29 Aug 80 KSW Series 23
    HCOB 19 Jun 71 C/S Series 46 DECLARES

    Any org [or mission staff] declaring a Dianetic Clear «achieved in other practices» is subject to expulsion from the Church.

    Technically, a very few thetans have never been anything but Clear. These few didn’t «go Clear» on anything; they have simply always been Clear. When a natural Clear is found it should be so stated. To assign this condition to some other practice is a suppression of Dianetics and Scientology.

    Anyone evaluating for or feeding a preclear data to persuade him to declare Dianetic Clear is also actionable.

    Anyone suppressively validating squirrel practices or groups by stating they are producing Dianetic Clears is also actionable as above, as it is not possible. It requires the exact application of Scientology and[/or] Dianetic technology to bring a preclear up to the state of Clear.,whether on NED after Grades or on the Clearing Course.

    Falsely declaring a person Clear[, Dianetic Clear or natural Clear] who isn’t, and failing to declare one who made it on Dianetics or the Clearing Course or who hasalways been Clear, are also actionable.

    In the event of a false attest, the C/S, Director of Validity and any other org staff involved in the cycle are subject to a Committee of Evidence and, if found guilty, are subject to
    suspension of all certs. (Ref: HCO PL 7 Mar. 65 II, CERTIFICATE

    People don’t go Clear in garbage eating or psychiatry—they perish. Thus herding people into their hands by falsely validating them is suppressive.

    Any and all such false declares are cancelled.

  409. There is a Science Fiction movie in wich people are taken and come back wrong. They end up being happy and smiling and calm ALL the time. In the end they all comit suïcide.

  410. Wayne~My plan is to test this “theory” by my own actions. This is a work in progress for me. Read forward and envision what I can create and join me one day. 🙂

  411. Boy,steroids or no steroids that’s just really sick. Doesn’t surprise me that he would feel such delight in caving pcs around him in, and what were those staff doing have off -line and off hat discussions of their cases outside of session?

  412. Although I can follow your line (both of you) of reasoning. (Have to cleanse out brain now). How do you work Evolution into this. And do not say it’s an Implant, I actually work at a place were we alsoo make a replica of a Triseratops skull at the moment (the mold to begin with).

  413. Does DM still take his Steroids ?

  414. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    You’re kidding, right? Do you really think I’d ever flow even one raindrop of power and support to this utterly corrupt organization? Why would you suggest me going to CofS?

    I’m dismayed and offended that you would believe I’d even remotely think about doing such an overt act.

    In any case, thank you for indirectly implying the answer to my question with your non-answer. You’re “verifying” by implication that no such independent Public Org exists, as I described earlier.

    Lately, it seems like the communications you’re giving me are curt implications of which I have to try and decipher. My need is clarity of communication and direct answers to my questions, just so you know. Communicating by implication is just too messy for me. It’s confusing.

    I guess the CofS does train one in the habit of doing one thing very well. Now it’s your turn to decipher my implication. 😉

  415. ΘTater/GaryLerner

    Absolutely hilarious!!! MWHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

    Valkov, I think that (hmmm… therefore I am 🙂 ) that there should be a Final Ultimate Copper – ized Level to attain (de-attain).

    Copper-plated Platinum UN-Dead.
    —– One has fully devolved after the full de-attainment of any kind of soul. You will be unable to think or be without the un-help of the copper-rodded zombie-brain of Duhvid Myst-o-vich.

    What an UN-Glorious “Down-to-Under-Earth” level! No Indie will be able to touch your “heart” and “soul” again!! Think of it (or un-think) Total, Solid, Soulless Un-Beingness!!!


  416. Mosey – you are right and strong. No one can “cancel” what you have achieved and is now in your consciousness. Oh that is simply too funny that one can actually believe that is possible! I laughed so hard when I read this because you were audited by one of the best auditors in Scientology. The arrogance of these people, the self righteousness, and the desperation, and the cluelessness are just magnificent to behold.

  417. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Now I’m allegedly “sieging”, apparently because of my alleged “self-esteem issues.” Is this judgement (evaluation) of me your way of showing compassion? lol

    I already know about Ron’s Orgs. I’m not looking for field auditors. My criteria was a fully manned Org in the USA. I thought I made myself clear about that. Besides, nobody on the list you supplied, that I could see, is from the USA, which is what I had requested.

    But I do appreciate your effort. Thank you.

    What I seem to be observing is an apparent not-ising that Scientology is not free. I’m told it is. Yet when I ask for proof, I feel I’m getting a run around.

    Also, this apparent non-confront is resulting in ridging with me on this issue. As far as I can still tell, there is not even one competing, independent, fully-manned Scientology Org, as LRH intended … here in the USA.

    Can you acknowledge that?

    If I’m wrong about this, then I’d very much appreciate if somebody can post the name, phone number, and address of the still apparent “vaporware” Free and independent Scientology Org in the USA.

    I actually VERY MUCH want to be wrong about this! Truly, I do! lol.

  418. Squatting Bill

    I highly recommend that you check out the policies relating to Refunds and Repayments. In my HCOPL Subject Index there are 12 policies cited. There are specific actions to take in requesting a “refund/repayment” that should be taken so as not to run up against being refused because you “didn’t follow the policies of the Church” in your request. You may not even be told that this is the problem with your claim. It may just be denied or derailed.


  419. Mackenzie

    I’m don’t mean to be critical or anything but I really didn’t get what you are trying to say there. It seems that you say one thing and then almost contradict yourself. Could you please clarify it for me. There just seem to be very few posters who say the things you seem to be saying and I want to understand where you are coming from. Please be specific and include your references and documentation, as I wouldn’t want to accept verbal data. You know, KSW and all that.

    WW 😉

  420. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Terril Park wrote, “Some people still like to keep under the radar as far as COS is concerned, more from threats of disconnection from friends,family etc, than worries about copyright.”

    That only tells the story more clearly that Scientology is not Free.

    If the “friends, family, etc” had an operational, Standard Tech, manned independent Org to go TO for auditing and services, why would anybody even care about CofS’s “disconnection” anymore? It would be silly, even absurd, IMO.

    Even if what you say were true, are you telling me that all independent Scientology Orgs can’t get manned up and fully functioning because every independent Scientologist is afraid of CofS’s disconnection?

    That’s operating on the basis of fear, isn’t it? Surely, most independent Scientologist are much higher toned than that.

    Still, I have yet find or receive even one competing, independent, fully-manned Scientology Org, as LRH intended … here in the USA.

    Even after a lot of TR3. 😉

  421. Wayne
    Thanks man, you’re a gem.

    Exactly as I suspected. FUBAR… F- – – ed Up Beyond All Recognition.
    DM ( or someone else of questionable intentions or understanding) removed or altered key phrases. Kind of opens the door for massive inval/eval of Clears. As I said earlier it also as good as accuses LRH and others of allowing preclears to “falsely attest to the state of Clear”. Now why would someone go and do that? (rhetorical question)


  422. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    That was most likely a glee valence they were all in.

    What’s the name of that science fiction movie? Now I want to watch it. 🙂

  423. ΘTater/GaryLerner

    Truth, Very Well Done! I’ll double Tara’s “woots” and well wishes!!

    For anyone that has doubts about what the term “TRUTH” means – Just look in the mirror and smile! Oh, and if you go exterior while looking, THAT’s you, baby!!! 🙂

    Mosey – You and Marty ARE a match made in TRUTH!


  424. LDW~Love your website and what it represents!

  425. Karen:

    I have always wondered about this myself. I am not the kind of person that is opposed to any kind of auditing {especially [blush] the world famous auditing I know you were reputized for delivering} but…

    I have always wondered if there was every such a thing as an auditor that assulted a PC. I am thinking why assault the PC for you know?

    And then the one who actually, actually did, is the one that is now COB of RTC!

    What a thing.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  426. Margaret,

    What a can of worms you’ve opened. More thorough and potentially far more stable? I don’t know. I’m no expert. I have to rely on my experience and then wade through the reports and stories from others. So many individuals had gone up the grade chart even before the squirreling, and then found themselves in a state of case collapse. Marty tells a story of being at death’s door and having Mosey bring him back. LRH also found himself at death’s door.
    (I called Lowe’s for a quote on replacing “Death’s door” and they didn’t carry them, so I think it’s a very specialized item, even if common.)
    In the sixties, Buddhist monks would protest the war in Vietnam by dousing themselves with gasoline and calmly sitting in the public square burning alive. Talk about control.
    We have OT3 as an incident, but most beings in this universe were not subject to it. And many individuals here on Earth now were not in this area at the time or were on the other side of it. The loyal officers had OT tech–they weren’t just a bunch of meat bodies who considered themselves MEST.
    There has been a lot of OT and clearing tech on the track, some of it very effective, some of it crap.
    Ask Ray Mithoff how stable his gains have been when he gets free. Ask the Class XII’s. Ask the OTVIII’s. I don’t know. I just see what I see.
    I do know that I enjoy Ron’s work. I know that he’s provided great insights. But I’m not bound by his work. And I see flaws.


  427. Jim,

    Not to worry. I love women. Not about to as-is them.
    Been running into a lot of GE stuff exploring the effort bands. And the effort bands begin way, way up in theta land, so it’s operable far above bodies, per se.
    I’m not sure how limited the approach is. Just trying to understand. When I understand enough of an area, I’ve usually stirred up interest elsewhere so get pulled to that. But, right now…

  428. OTDT

    Ya. I can see where you are coming from.

    I acknowledge your right, and ability to express various tones on the tone scale. Freedom… Ain’t it grand?

    May I be so bold as to introduce a slightly different scenario?
    How about having him honestly doing conditions from his current condition up. It may well require some of the things you have stated.
    But, way down deep (or not so deep,) wouldn’t you want to see the tormented being that is David Miscavage brought up tone and achieve an honest state of being whereby he could acknowledge his true beingness as a Thetan, and actually proceed to “make up the damage he has done”, honestly and thoroughly?
    Personally, as I have said before, I am not one for “punishment for punishments sake”. I do not see it as a “valid process”, as it does not obtain to “optimum survival across the Dynamics”.
    Having said that I can see that DM “making up the damage personally” by your requirements will be quite a challenge. I wish DM luck with that, if he ever realizes what damage his actions have caused. It is a HUGE bill!


  429. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Helmut Flasch, I will satisfy your request about a driving SCN place!! (In a few days I will post them right here on Marty’s blog!”

    Helmut Flasch,

    You are a breath of fresh air to my soul, and put a fat smile on my spirit!

    I have absolutely no problem totally renaming every single word in the Dianetics and Scientology Dictionary.

    Because, obviously, the WORD is not the “thing” it represents. So what if I have to learn a new nomenclature. It would be a little inconvenient at first, but the big payoff I see is no charge on the terms for oneself and others.

    It’s crazy delivery a subject which has charge on the words in the subject, when the subject is supposed to be alleviating charge! lol.

    I’ve already commented in earlier posts that perhaps the Scientology name is so soured and in disrepute, that it’s no longer salvageable.

    I can’t imagine that LRH is so narsissistic and arrogant, that he really cares about his bust, pictures, and office being in every “church”. To me, that moves down to the level of worshipping bodies, which I always had a problem with. A truly high level being shouldn’t give a shit about that.

    It’s about the ACTIONS that move one up to a higher level. That’s what’s important, to me. If you have something that accomplishes the same goals, I’m all for it. I’ve never considered myself married to words. lol.

    I’m in marketing myself, and I’ve been moving in the direction of realizing with confidence, that Scientology, in it’s present form, is unmarketable. It’s repugnant to most non-Scientologists. “Thank you” you son-of-a-bitch, David Miscavage. You ruined it!

    So it’s probably wishful thinking to believe Scientology, in its present nomenclature form, will every expand again. I’ve been cogging on this over time, but I wish I more quickly realized this before so I didn’t waste my time thinking about (and worrying) how Scientology is going to get freed from a despot.

    I’m already feeling relieved that somebody has done this. I can hardly wait to hear more. I am holding onto my seat now with anticipation. Please hurry if you can. 🙂 I want to know!

    Thank you for finding this blog and stepping in with your communication. I so appreciate it.


    P.S. Not for even one split second did I ever feel you were attacking me.

  430. ΘTater/GaryLerner

    Wow!! Pol Pot has NOTHING on David Miscavige. NOTHING!!

    If there was anyone whom never was a Clear, that’s David Mishandle. By “de-clearing” everyone sanctimoniously, the Pimp of Darkness also “de-cleared” himself. But honestly, I have NO DOUBTS or RESERVATIONS that he never was and never will be Clear. Just a Rock Slammer destined to be trapped in his own make believe world of self-importance and en-MESTation.

    Gary (re-lighting my torch for DM)

  431. OSA terminals involved in current “ops”.

    Please restudy your original Hat pack (accept no forgeries or altered versions and no “hidden data lines” or issue authorities other that real LRH) with special attention to your Valuable Final Product(s), your stats, and your Purpose.

    Good luck, and may you have many cognitions.


  432. Jim,
    Shhhh! We’re going to put everyone to sleep.
    I find the subject of “points” relevant. Just what constitutes a point? The sun itself is a point. This galaxy can be considered a point when viewed from a distance. A point can be either simple or complex.
    As can a terminal. A terminal has to have sufficient potential to generate a flow of energy. It’s got to have that build up of force that gets released. The larger the terminal, all things considered, the larger its potential to create a flow of energy.
    Of course, different elements contain different potentials for storage and release of energy.
    And how does that energy manifest? Electronic, magnetic, chemical? What constitutes the energy of light? Is energy a result of particles or waves? Or a combination? Or some of each?
    The problem with a terminal is maintaining sufficient potential to continue a flow. So theta creates systems to cycle and replenish. A battery in a car would discharge and become inoperable without being recharged, but where does that energy to recharge come from? Gas? And where does the energy from gas come from? You’ve got this every widening layers of systems.
    When we send something into space that must continue to operate, energy must be acquired and utilized. The space craft is a system that is dependent on energy. Where does it get the energy? Veritas could answer the techical aspects of that better than I could.
    But, this leads back to theta and the creation of universes and the creation of energy that will sustain itself. Theta creates a system. And when theta establishes viewpoints and dimension points, it’s often complex rather than simple. Theta does not just put out one dimension point to act as a terminal, but a multitude of dimension points that often act as a grid of interacting potentials.
    And the discussion of flows begs the question of what exactly is flowing? Particles? Potentials? Waves?
    As you wrote, a lot of this hangs on resistance. Flows will not exist without the resistance. Resistance builds up force potentials. And it’s funny as hell to see how much flow occurs here when someone posts a resisting idea. Too much agreement does not produce flows. The uniformity dissipates the potential build up of energy and force. The disagreement and disparity bring about a flow.
    But, the resistance also forms barriers which can be used to channel energy and create systems.
    However, Shhhhh! This stuff is all fascinating, but would take books and books to explore. A couple of posts won’t do it.

    ps. And I didn’t even begin to approach the subject of bases. sigh.

  433. ΘTater/GaryLerner


    No matter how we precisely describe DM and his vicious ways, he is still very simply DRAMATIZING HIS OWN EXTREME OVERTS!

    A true SP/RSlammer. That boy needs a mental colonic!


  434. Loki,
    This isn’t the first universe. A lot of stories precede this one. And a lot of stories accompany this one. Many stories in the Bible relate actual events. The conflict with angels actually happened. Not exactly as described. The fall of man has a complex history, part of it implanted memory designed to control thetans who weren’t so easy to control. A lot of “primary incidents” are actually way, way down the track–meaning later on the track rather than earlier. Some are actual, some are manufactured. Getting a thetan to accept a “primary incident” as happening earlier effects a snarled track. It just leaves him confused and destroys his confidence in knowing.

    As for Thomas and his work, I haven’t studied him, so I can’t respond. I’ll have to take a peek at what he said.


  435. Karen

    Thank you for the data. Good stuff.

    You see, there is the HUGE outpoint for me.

    How on earth could a State of Clear matter possibly be a security issue for the “church”. I guess I am incredibly naive (not) but I cannot fathom what kind of twisted mind (or case) could even consider it. One would have to be terrified of beings generally. Which potentially tells us something about DM. He attacks beings at every level because he has tried to overwhelm one or more and gotten “burned”. Perhaps there is now some false or evil purpose fixated that commands him to “destroy any evidence of Theta” so that “it will never happen again”. When one is fully dramatizing their case there is only one solution to handle “threatening situations”, dramatize harder, and even that command is not coming from any theta postulate.
    It is kind of sad to see a being so totally overwhelmed by their case.


  436. Cat,

    Evolution moves well beyond organisms. Theta also evolves. Universes evolve. The one we currently inhabit is far, far more sophisticated than earlier versions. Far more complex and stable as a system.
    Implants play a part in Earth evolution, but even without implants, theta would continuously tinker with the way organisms manifest. It’s just the nature of theta to propagate change, to understand and to build on that understanding.
    A study of the intelligence behind the intelligent design of this planet just fills my little theta heart with joy and anticipation. Wow! Ain’t it fucking fascinating?

  437. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Helmut Flasch,

    Another cognition I had is …

    Independent Public Scientology Orgs (if they ever were to exist) will carry the baggage of CofS in the publics’ eye. The public will identify the CofS church with the Indy Orgs, and they won’t differentiate no matter how hard one tries. It won’t happen. IMO.

    So even having an independent Scientology Org won’t matter from a marketing perspective. It’s still the same ole same ole to the public. They’re likely not going to believe the the new and better independent Scientology Org is not going to abuse them.

    I wanted to see this with my own eyes by looking at an existing Indy Org, but I’m discovering they don’t exist in the USA in a Scientology form.

    It was really hard for me to imagine there was one that was successful, and I confirmed today that none exist, let alone one that’s successful. lol.

    I’m so ready for something that will work on a grand scale without the suppression of a competitor trying to wipe you out, and without the duress of having to do an almost impossible job in the “handle” step of the Dissemination Drill.

  438. ΘTater/GaryLerner

    J. Swift, Are you kidding? You know that David and Tommy were watching the video of Marty doing the “pinch” test with John Sweeny and SCREAMING “REG HIM!! GET HIS MONEY!! You F—ing SP, GET HIS MONEY!!!”. DM and TT both slapping each other in total disbelief!!


  439. I believe Ken is more active than ever. He gave a wonderful speech at the Freezone Convention a few weeks back up in the Spokane, WA area, at Deer Lake Resort — which is also where Les and Anita Warren’s Independent Scientology delivery facility is located.

    You can see videos of the speakers at the event here:


    “I am not here to promote SCN – never was – I am here to help people and make a living at it!!
    Mostly I am doing it because its fun !!!”

    Love that attitude. 🙂

    I get asked by people from time to time to connect them up to tech terminals.

    Sometimes they are not near any. Happy to send people your way.

    Please mail me at basic2basic@yahoo.com or give contact details here. 🙂

  441. one of those who see

    Hi Mosey! Great to hear from you. Tears in my eyes. Hugs to both you and Marty.



    Even though Mosey’ letter is a truly an exciting topic, do you think it is a good idea still that the OT III materials are all over the internet like you say?”

    Overall yes. In fact I visited Karen Spaink and Zenon Parnousis
    in Amsterdam to shake their hands and treat them to dinner for
    their efforts to disseminate the upper levels including NOTs. Zenon
    in particular did LOTS more to help Freezoners even though he was not interested in tech. By putting these materials into the swedish court system anyone in the world could get copies from the courts for minimal payment. Thousands were thus disseminated!

    So CoM cannot hide them. Even those who were familiar with the materials didn’t have them to hand as a reference.

    From PDC 20 [ original version ]
    “It’s a very simple remedy.And that’s-just make sure that the remedy is passed along. That’s all.Don’t horde it, don’t hold it; and if you ever do use any Black Dianetics, use it on the guy who pulled Scientology out of sight and made it so it wasn’t available. Because he’s the boy who would be electing himself “The New Order.” And we don’t need any more new orders. All those orders, as far as I am concerned, have been filled.”

    On our FZ forums discussion of upper levels is not allowed, there
    are separate forums for that.

    However OT 3 was posted in the LA times and no one died as far as I know!

    I do know of a couple of people who had reactions to premature exposure to OT 3. One had more gains than losses re this.
    Enormous gains! The other had problems. Having met him he
    has much more serious problems than that and IMO exposure to
    OT 3 was a minor factor.

    What we know is that anyone who wishes can access upper level
    material and there are no stories that I know of re problems, other
    than the two examples I gave.

    In general I’m in favour of full disclosure. A good friend of mine
    had a psychotic break and was baby watched and escaped. he’s not
    worked since for a decade or so.

    It was while studying the PTS/SP course that the psychotic
    break occurred.

    Where does one draw the line re confidentiality?

  443. Marty
    Good point
    I am walking a fine line here with this one. I am restraining myself from revealing something that is “true for me” regarding my “state of Clear”.
    I really do not have any point where I feel I went Clear in auditing in the church. I did a DCSI and although acknowledged Clear, I could find no particular time when that had occurred. I attested to “always having been Clear.” That never really satisfied me totally though. I do not mind if I am not Clear but I do know I am what I am. I even am so bold as to think I am more than Clear, though I have never done anything above the Grades. At one point I tried to nail down the state in auditing but it never felt duplicated by any of the options available. I was acknowledged for my own statement of my state.
    It wasn’t until recently that I actually happened upon a truth about my “State of Clear”. It has a particular time attached to it, and it is this lifetime, before any auditing.
    I no longer call the state “clear”, I am currently calling it “enlightened”. It seems to have many, if not all, the attributes of Clear. The auditing gains that I have had since that time have been nothing short of phenomenal, some perhaps (dare I say) even OT in magnitude. Curiously, the only processing I never had much in the way of wins on was Dianetics (R3R). I do not invalidate the process being run or the auditor. It simply didn’t apply to my case state at that time. I didn’t even suspect this until later on in my Dianetics.

    I actually wouldn’t even mind addressing the whole issue but I would need an auditor with no fixed ideas, superb TRs and excellent technical skills and understanding. I would not offer it up to anyone else. I am betting you would be such a person.

    Some day perhaps.


  444. Lawrence
    I am afraid to say my TRs would likely go out and I would try to cover it by smiling as best I could so as to not invalidate them. Then I would probably weep for the incredible injustice that had been done to the being.


  445. Wong wive scientowogy!

  446. Yeah, I know, I was feeling a bit lazy at the time.

  447. Injustices are many in the Church of Scientology mainly because of what is at stake and that being the fate of Mankind.

    How such a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow can inspire people to hurt people is either an area of research LRH might still be working on or perhaps the truth of what has become of our beloved church.

    I absolutely won’t rest until DM is defrocked morally and ethically.

  448. Yes it is but do not discard Randomness. I do not believe much in “intelligent design”. Randomness is one of the basis principles I adhere too. Without Randomness everything is fixed. I KNOW this is not thruth. The onley thing I will adhere too is the tiniest microbes upping the game for themselves to mankind. Theta would want to go back to it’s original nature through knowing how to know untill it knows it all and there is no game. When no game is to be played boredom will follow. Not knowing gives Randomness a chanche to exist. Chaos is a creating force too. Choas makes Anonymous possible or as you know it the Humancondition.
    Chaos theory is a field of study in mathematics, physics, economics and philosophy studying the behavior of dynamical systems that are highly sensitive to initial conditions. This sensitivity is popularly referred to as the butterfly effect. Small differences in initial conditions (such as those due to rounding errors in numerical computation) yield widely diverging outcomes for chaotic systems, rendering long-term prediction impossible in general.[1] This happens even though these systems are deterministic, meaning that their future behavior is fully determined by their initial conditions, with no random elements involved.[2] In other words, the deterministic nature of these systems does not make them predictable.[3] This behavior is known as deterministic chaos, or simply chaos.


  449. I believe much of the field of Scientology contains this. That is why it can alsoo be dangerous when misused. The Tech draws from a number of fields I can see that. I do believe that Scientology can contribute to the field of neuroplasticity like Buddhism is doing right now. Build bridges like the brain does. Or like the Thetamn that uses it’s mind to build bridges in the brain. This can be achieved by the Tech without the scientology politics.

  450. I pried in my brain It was a episode from a series. It will come back to me. I can see two of the faces of the actors in my mind. One whpo blew his brains out alsoo played in the movie Fargo. Droopy fgaced fellow.

  451. Hubbard made sure he will not be forgotten. OT III is like a magnet. Think about it.

  452. “One of our LA critic friends is leaving Los Angeles to go help her Mother. So I had a Fair well Party in honor of Susan. A delightful group of people arrived and fun
    and tasty foods were had by all. Some of them are in this video—many still don’t want to show their faces, for various reasons. To Susan….we will all miss you 🙂
    To all of my dear friends, thank you for coming!”

  453. Wayne Froemke (AKA “Safe”) | October 3, 2010 at 8:57 pm | Reply

    Terril Park wrote, “Some people still like to keep under the radar as far as COS is concerned, more from threats of disconnection from friends,family etc, than worries about copyright.”

    That only tells the story more clearly that Scientology is not Free.

    TP [ aka bb]
    Thats very simplistic. I presume you have no friends, family, business associates you may be required to disconnect from!

    Some connected to CoM are not totally free. This is not news!

    If the “friends, family, etc” had an operational, Standard Tech, manned independent Org to go TO for auditing and services, why would anybody even care about CofS’s “disconnection” anymore? It would be silly, even absurd, IMO.
    TP [ aka bb]

    I ‘ve always assumed you were smart. What you say is logically correct. But PTS [ in CoM] people may not be able to exercise excellent logic.
    Even if what you say were true, are you telling me that all independent Scientology Orgs can’t get manned up and fully functioning because every independent Scientologist is afraid of CofS’s disconnection?

    TP [ aka bb]

    Never said anything like that! You’re pulling this out your ass or being a devils advocate. [ the latter is preferable:) ]

    That’s operating on the basis of fear, isn’t it? Surely, most independent Scientologist are much higher toned than that.

    TP [ aka bb]

    Still, I have yet find or receive even one competing, independent, fully-manned Scientology Org, as LRH intended … here in the USA.

    Even after a lot of TR3.

    TP [ aka bb]

    You into Idle Orgs then? With big buildings and no staff or customers.

    Many COS orgs are not fully manned.

    You explored the URLs I posted?

    I spent a year re-posting your earlier posts.

    I know of your problems re CoM back then. Not
    in full detail as you stopped posting. Back then it was hard.

    Now its a piece of cake. 🙂

  454. Jim

    Should be able to get the appropriate books at every single library in the world. Well… Maybe not quite EVERY library.. well maybe at a FEW libraries…. Oh Hell… I’ll loan you a copy if you like. 😉


  455. Michael,

    I too enjoy Ron’s work.

    Does not any organism eventually pass through death’s door? That’s how the game was designed. Then too, when all else fails, it is a way for a thetan to leave the game, or even to make a statement, as those Buddhist monks did during the Vietnam war. The Christ story is also an instructive tale having to do with death and life.

    Death can appear to be a solution to a problem of entrapment. At bottom, any being basically knows this. When one does not see any other achievable way out, death can be seen as the solution.

    The Creed of the Church of Scientology concludes with this:

    “And we of the Church believe that the spirit can be saved and that the spirit alone may save or heal the body.”

    Going up the Bridge and expecting to live happily ever after as the effect of scientology and one’s processing does not necessarily place one at cause.

    So of course there can be a collapse. It’s not the processing that “saves or heals the body”, is it? And yet the processing, done correctly and in the right spirit on both the pc’s and auditor’s parts, does indeed save lives by enabling the spirit to reach states of ability to live instead of dying. But the basis is ARC. “Man, in affinity with Man, survives. And that survival is pleasure.”

    I’ve always liked science-fiction and speculation, but I think the extreme para-scientology can wait.

  456. Wayne

    I’m with you on applying the Auditors Code in personal interactions in ones life (although I find all points do not necessarily apply at all times.)

    When one complained of having difficulties with someone, our Mission holder used to ask “Are you being the auditor or the Preclear?” I generally preferred to be the auditor, but if I was going to be the Preclear, I certainly wanted the other person to “be the auditor” and apply the Auditors Code. If they were not able or willing to do so then I would assume the auditors role.

    If one is generally going to be the “auditor”on your own dynamics, it would seem to behoove you to apply the Auditors Code for best results.


  457. DFB aka Dfb99

    Alright Beebercat, thanks. And thanks Marty. Your suggestions are valuable to me.

  458. ΘTater/GaryLerner

    CP, you’ve definitely roped in those yahoo’s true beingness. Now get out your branding iron with the big “SP” and let ’em have it, Cowboy!

    Gary 🙂

  459. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    You’re very welcome, WW,

    Added text, changed words, and deleted text throughout LRH’s works is the specialty of the despots regime, and creates a situation where the works of LRH, as they are now, cannot be trusted, IMO.

    We’re talking about 28 years of work-in-progress to screw up Scientology, and a MASSIVE project of reconstructing LRH’s works back to that originally intended.

  460. For readers info – I’m not possitive about this but I believe that English is Helmuts 2nd (or 3rd or 4th…) language. He does pretty good but don’t trip over the miss-spells and take your attention from off what he is saying.
    Intention takes priority! Very nice to hear from Helmut. He has a lot to say from v many years of helping persons. Thanks Helmut for all you have done for us/them/you/me.

  461. ΘTater/GaryLerner

    Correctly professed and gratefully welcomed. Thank you Jim, for your “present” beingness. 🙂


  462. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")

    Helmut Flasch wrote, “Wayne (AKA Safe), I will satisfy your request about a driving SCN place!! (In a few days I will post them right here on Marty’s blog!”

    If you wish, you can also send any information about this to my email at …


    Thanks Helmut!

    – Wayne

  463. Michael. If you actually look into Thomas Aquinas, his 3 proofs on the existence of God are what I am referring to. You can probably google them.
    Are you familiar with Harold Waldwin Percival’s “Thinking and Destiny”, written in 1950. Deals with locating the being in the body and ultimately restoring it to a place with the higher intelligences governing the universes?

  464. Cat,
    A major problem with theory is the tendency to be exclusionary. Evidence exists that a certain randomness explains evolution–such as a sudden change of temperature forcing animals to adapt. So, a theory develops that randomness explains the whole thing. Chaos theory is basically the concept of incidental occurrence (shit happens) made more sophisticated. Certainly, you want to get to work, so you intend to drive safely and then a fucking block of ice falls out of the sky and crushes your car. Pure chaos. But, before the chaos was the intent to get to work. And most days you would have made it.

    Intelligent design doesn’t mean “God made it.” Even a cursory examination of an eyeball or ear or any other organ of the body just screams design and engineering of such subtlety as to leave me breathless. Wow. To design a body that will not only reproduce itself with continuous modification but also manufacture from available elements all of these intricate parts that usually work so efficiently.

    Now, these organs don’t always work perfectly. And when you’re making a cabinet, it’s not unheard of to smash your finger with a hammer. So, yes, life is full of chaos. And things get unpredictable, such as Northern Iowa knocking off Kansas and messing up most people’s brackets. And scientist make all sorts of advances with accidental discoveries. But still, life is fraught with intelligence and awareness which applies that intelligence to cause and change and design the conditions of life as best it can.

    Otherwise, we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

    And I’m kind of glad life is intelligent so we can have conversations.


  465. If he was old enough to audit, he was old enough to not hit the PC, no matter if he was on steroids or any other medication, drug or substance. There is zero defense for this. ZERO.

  466. Wayne Froemke (AKA "Safe")


    Oh yeah, you’re apparently a marketing guy. Me too.

    So I figured you might want to check out these marketing books I highly recommend to my fellow marketing buddies:

    Do It Wrong Quickly: How the Web Changes the Old Marketing Rules, by Mike Moran

    Ca$hvertising, by Drew Eric Whitman

    Power Copywriting, by Herschell Gordon Lewis

    On the Art of Writing Copy, by Herschell Gordon Lewis

    (All the other books by Herschell are great, too.)

    Web Copy That Sells, by Maria Veloso

    Motivational Marketing, by Robert Imbriale

    The Sales Bible: The Ultimate Sales Resource, by Jeffrey Gitomer

    IMO, these are THE most top-notch books in PT, in the field of sales and marketing. We have some extremely brilliant “wog” minds out there. 😉

    I hope you like these. (The CofS is in the marketing Dark Ages. Thank God for that!)

    If you have any of your favorites, I’d definitely appreciate you letting me know about them if you have time. This is my professional love, and an area of constant study (and doing) of mine.

  467. Terril,

    Ah, missed this as the comments are often too numerous and I don’t have time to read more than a fraction of Marty’s blog. Congrats on your cogs. I agree that Scientology is a workable path. I also have ambivalence about that path, mostly because I have seen so much that contradicts an array of Ron’s assertions. As a matter of personal integrity, I’m not just going to bend on my own observations just to be polite or to agree.
    That experience you had with the theta clear on OT2 is not at all uncommon. We all run into these beings but don’t really know what meaning to assign to the experience. Just how do you interpret the experience? Is it me? Is it someone else? Is it just imagination? We tend to explain away things that don’t fit into our normal system of logic. If we have a past life memory and are sitting in church listening to the preacher we would certainly dismiss the memory as nonsense if multiple lives were not part of our belief system.

    Scientology has a system of logic and belief which members use to interpret experience and assign meaning. Of course it’s a past life memory. Of course you can’t go clear except using Ron’s methodology. Of course no one has ever made an OT before except those lucky bastards who have somehow become temporarily “keyed-out OT.” And of course, by following the closely taped path of Scientology we will become fully operating OTs and Complete Cause over Matter, Energy, Space, Time, Life, Form, Event.


    Moving the belief system out of the way, what do we actually observe? Not only about Scientology, but about ourselves as beings? About our case? About the actual abilities others exhibit. About the controlled manifestation of those abilities.

    All I’m saying it: use that workable bit of Scientology which deals with personal integrity and make your own observations about your case and life and Scientology and LRH. Don’t let the belief system substitute for your own observation.

    Not that I think you personally are doing other than that. I’m just generalizing.


  468. Loki,

    Looked up Percival’s book. Very interesting. Will add it to my list. He said that most of the material was developed between 1912 and 1932 (I might be wrong as I just scanned.) Also, the book was published 1946 initially, which predates LRH’s Original Thesis. So, I will see what he has to say.

    As for Aquinas, I did a quick study and find his reasoning brilliant, but with a flaw: he was looking for an explanation for a single God, so used his reasoning to prove the existence of a single God. His logic could just as easily apply to two gods, or three or a thousand. What one god could originate others with the same capacity could also.

    Logic and mathematics often have the drawback of shepherding data within the confines of the system. The applicable laws of the system prove and disprove that which exists within its confines, but fails to explain what lies without.

    For example, measuring a board is easy enough and provable because each of us can check the tape. But what is the distance between two thetans/spirits? Each holds a separate position, yet the intervening space is not as easily defined as that within the physical universe. Math and logic work most efficiently when applied to that which is consistent, but begin to break down when applied to what is not consistent.

    Aquinas postulated a consistent result when applying his logic. But, quite possibly, the result of his logic leads to something less cut and dried, something contradictory and elusive.

    But thank you very much for the information sources. I value those who seek insight into life, those who seek enlightenment. In study, it is less important what we study than that we learn how to study. The greater our capacity for study and learning, the broader our interests and insights will become.

    Thus it is with enlightenment: it is less important to attain a specific insight than to gain the capacity to attain insights and enlightenment.

    So, I’m always interested in one’s approach to enlightenment as much as what one gains from that approach. What is gained might be pure accident, might be purely incidental rather than attributable directly to the method.

    I hope that isn’t too abstract.

    I’ll get around to Aquinas and Percival in the near future.


  469. Mosey,

    The C of S has no monopoly on case gain or states of awareness; as much as they would like to. Rons tech can be delivered anywhere. Case gain can be had from its delivery. Don’t let this twerps comment stick in your craw. He has much bigger issues he has yet to confront.

    I am certain you already know this.

    Invalidation is a GPM item. OSA is dramatizing.

    You were , IMHO, overly polite, it must be in your nature.

    Here is my response in your stead if you don’t mind.

    “Fu&%k off twerp. Send written evidence of your evil intentions to your C/S, not to me. I am not the correct terminal for your handling.”

    Unfortunately for him, he currently has no terminal for his handling, but that is his problem to solve.

  470. strange times

  471. Yes the body is a beautifull organism but still it, or mestbodies if you will, began with microbes in the mud.

    I think the miracle lies in this: Because of shit happened, Man appeared, Isn’t that Awsome.

  472. Michael.
    Your right that Aquinas was definitely working to fit the logic into the existing Catholic theology. Focusing on a specific result can cut one off from other observations.
    Percivals writings are rich, even if you only accept half of what he says.
    Thanks for your thoughtful feedback.

  473. William H. Macy? If so, great actor.

    But I don’t know what sci-fi movie you’re referring to …

  474. Yup, not a perfect system. But in the right hands, I’d give it a 10.

  475. BIG ditto to Jim!

  476. Pingback: David Miscavige’s Qualifications « Leaving Scientology

  477. Different Susan, CD.

  478. It seems to me the word “neuroplasticity” represents a similar idea to “form follows function”. Neuroplasticity refers specifically to the brain changing to meet function needs.

  479. Squatting Bill,

    If you want a refund or repayment from Flag, you write to the KOT(Keeper Of the Tech). If you want one from a local org, you write to the Chaplain. After that, it’s not necessarily very”A to B”. Keep your TRs in.

    David St.Lawrence (“OldAuditor”) has some good info about this on his blog: http://possiblyhelpfuladvice.com/?p=920

  480. WW,

    It might also require a padded room and a straitjacket at times….

  481. I like your return comment on that email, it’s a shame that the person who sent that to you only copied and pasted, they didn’t even write directly to you. And in any case how can they cancel something in a church you’re no longer part of?

  482. Well done Mosey on your handle. Dont give them any power. They have none. I am shocked at how low they will go. That was so evil on their part. And I am happy for you on Clear!
    It was a special moment for me, and something NOBODY can take away.
    I heard DM closed the door on any last lifers too.

  483. Pingback: Loony Tunes | Moving On Up a Little Higher

  484. Pingback: Marty posters & anons outed by OSA? - Page 8 - Why We Protest | Activism Forum

  485. Pingback: David Miscavige – Investigator’s Guide to the Criminal History « Watchful Navigator

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