Moving On Up a Little Higher

I knew coming into the struggle that there would be a price to pay for advocating freedom. I knew what we had done from the inside to make life hell for those on the outside exercising their rights to free of expression. Criticism has been leveled against me for not running to law enforcement agencies to report activities that could be construed as criminal. I advised caution against making complaints that were not viable because of statute of limitations and lack of unimpeachable evidence reasons, reasoning that to cry wolf would hurt the chances of justice being served  for prosecutable crimes. Quite a few untoward acts have been directed my way recently. That I knew came with the territory and has been treated for the most part like water under the bridge. However, I did not anticipate the lengths the church would go to in order to harm my friends.

As I reported at the end of December, my email and blog were hacked into. The blog was taken down by the invaders.  I have just learned that at least one email that was sent to me in early December has been posted on an internet site.  These acts constitute felonies under law. During my tenure in the church there was one standard we nearly always adhered to. That was do not commit acts recognized as criminal under existing statutes.  I mistakenly estimated that this standard would continued to be adhered to. I was wrong, pure and simple. The appropriate law enforcement officials have been notified and there is an ongoing criminal investigation on the matter. For those who have known me for any length of time, I don’t think there is any doubt about my capacity for sticking with this until justice is served.

 I sincerely apologize to those who have communicated to me at my posted aol address ( whose privacy rights have been compromised. I recognize that people trusted my representations that the church would not hack my email. I also recognize that gives little solace to those who shared their thoughts and feelings with me via email. Your communications may yet wind up posted by the invaders. I realize that by posting this, communication between myself and others may decline. That is understandable.  Recognize though that for every act of invasion of your privacy that may be committed against you individually the perpetrators of that crime will receive  ten times the pain you may suffer. 

It is my hope that people will recognize that the intent of hacking me and invading people’s privacy was done for one purpose, to cut our communication. The intent is to drive our anchor points in. The very objective our community and communication was exposing and overcoming. Because the strength of the communication lines we have established between ourselves we were able to bounce back fast and stronger than ever . We had more visits per day to my blog within 24 hours of getting back up with a temporary address than we had had for weeks. That is testament to a network of communications that has been formed amongst us that is apparently very widespread, rapid, and resilient.  No matter how hard the church hits, the network of communication we have formed apparently just keeps getting stronger.  Regardless of where things go, and what further attacks we might receive, remember that as long as you keep communicating and keep extending your reach among one another – central coordinating point or not – you are cause over the source of suppression. You are continuing to overcome suppression and if you stay at it you will crack the back of the source of suppression. And for every person who joins your ranks, you will continue to help lift the dark cloud of suppression off of his or her shoulders.

I have taken security measures to prevent a further breach of personal communications to me. If you would like to communicate directly with me, you can write to my pgp encrypted email account, If you are concerned about the measures the church is willing to take to compromise my communications, that is completely understandable. But, do not allow them to cut your reach. Increase your communications amongst one another. Get on Facebook to network, establish your own security encoded accounts where you are concerned for your privacy. No matter what, continue to reach, increase your communication. At the end of the day it is that one action that will overcome the suppressor who seeks to nullify me, you and any one else who wishes to communicate with an independent mind.

Finally, remember what Frederick Douglass said about the mission to abolish slavery in America. It is as applicable today as it was over 150 years ago when first communicated: “If there is no struggle, there is no progress.”

202 responses to “Moving On Up a Little Higher

  1. If you’re approached by the C.O.S about being on the Internet or in communication with the wrong persons on the Internet make a game out of it, don’t confess to anything;
    – be schocked what me ? No !
    – then be evasive that lots of people could use your name or your computer and that wouldn’t be ok.
    – You want to help and investigate who did that, but you need some more data from them to find it out. If they could send you an e-mail with the data they have (e-mail, ipadress etc…,ask an internet freak to help you to understand it). keep on to get something in written from them.
    – when you have it in written you won, you know then they were spying on you and that is illegal.
    You tell them, they are out-ethics and still don’t confess to anything.

    have a nice day !

  2. These attacks just make us stronger, more determined and focused. Vive la résistance!
    And they can post my emails to you anytime – they are full of ARC. Heavens, the crime!

  3. Or not be shocked and live openly.

    Don’t counter their perverted game. Don’t be the opposing terminal.

    Communicate at your own choice, by your own rules.

    Set an example for them of how it can be done.

  4. The Church of Scientology became a real Human Rights threat.
    I admire your bravery. You are really great!

  5. Virgil Samms

    Marty, thanks for the posting. You’ve got nothing to apologize for. We knew the chances we took when we emailed you.

    Besides, only innocent bystanders get hit from shrapnel from the bombs that fly in wars. But like LRH said in his RJ in 1982, and I paraphrase here: why are you a bystander getting showered with shrapnel from both sides? You should be in the war launching some of the bombs.

    So maybe our hands will be forced now. It will all work out for the best, that I am sure of.

  6. “Moving on up a little higher?” That says it all Marty. We are all doing that a little bit more each day now.

    Speaking personally, I don’t give a rat’s arse what the church know or don’t know about me, simply because there is absolutely nothing they could know that would prevent the inevitable demise of their suppressive regime . As surely as the sun sets each day Miscavige’s dark dynasty is doomed and by and at his own hand, not ours. We are merely the purveyors of truth and there is no possible down side to that truth being known by anyone. This outrage, as you point out, is simply another self inflicted nail in that coffin.

    But yes, I feel for friends still flying under the radar and your advice speaks sooth. All I can add is a heart felt request that they take all necessary steps to protect themselves and those they hold dear while moving out of the shadows and into the light.

    It’s warm and bright in the sunshine and a great deal less suppressive, despite what the church tries to do.

  7. Hi Marty,

    I can turn you onto a great password manager that will prevent such hacking..or at least cut down the chances greatly. Let me know if you would like to have the info and I will send to you in private.

    It’s not roboform, btw.



  8. martyrathbun09

    Thanks. You can get me at

  9. Donald Williams:

    For those who have seen the Earth from space, and for the hundreds and perhaps thousands more who will, the experience most certainly changes your perspective. The things that we share in our world are far more valuable than those which divide us.

  10. Virgil Samms

    Nicely put Haydn. Who gives a rats arse indeed!

  11. Yes you are right.
    I’m still little bit under the radar (pts?)

  12. Dave Adams,
    Yes, an example of how it can be done! Pan-determined and able to be both or any ‘side’ with the positive purpose of handling the departures from the Ideal Scene. Yes!

  13. Your concern for the privacy of your readers and fellow independents is appropriate and right, Marty, but I think these “hacks” -er- “hackers” underestimate the strength and resiliency of comm lines at this tone level. And the intention of those communicating.

    That they are reduced now to flagrantly illegal activity tells us that they know that they’re not strong enough (or smart enough) to counter the progress of this unstoppable movement in a legal manner. We’ve known all along that they are constrained by the need to operate covertly, now we know they believe they must be criminal, as well. Ironically, trying to endanger
    Independents and other scientologists by violating their privacy will result in they themselves being exposed fully to the light of day.

    We know about criminals. They are stupid and they want to get caught. And they increase the likelihood that they will get caught with each criminal act they commit.

    I look forward to everyone here warming their hands at the fire you are lighting under this particular criminal.

    Marshmallow, anyone?

  14. Martin Luther King, Jr.:

    I believe that unarmed truth and unconditional love will have the final word in reality. This is why right, temporarily defeated, is stronger than evil triumphant.

  15. My level of cause and overall tone goes UP when I throw my points of reach further OUT. Thanks Marty for the forum and your persistence in keeping it here so others can feel safe to communicate also.

  16. I’m not too bothered if someone got my details, my identity isn’t that important. But perhaps I shouldn’t have sent you those ‘bold and artistic’ photos of myself in that posing pouch? I wouldn’t want those plastered all over the interweb!

    I have never been under the illusion that the CoS would stay within the law and I certainly don’t expect them to have any sense of fairness or decency or stick to the ‘rules’.

    Of course we don’t know who did this hacking of your email account (yet), and I wouldn’t be too quick to jump to conclusions. But I know who I’d like to be caught with their grubby little hands in the cookie jar. 😉

    This whole episode is a salutary one for us all. Never assume that a particular communication channel is safe and be very careful what information you pass on. And good password practice doesn’t go amiss either. Use a password involving numbers and letters and not easily guessable and use different passwords for each website / email account that you register with.


  17. Virgil Samms

    I just had another thought: when OSA saw the vast list of emailers to Marty, and who they were from, they must have felt a 100,000 volts of electricity flowing through their org. Be careful of what you wish to know when you tap into us OSA.

  18. “The attacker has an evil purpose in life. He is a thing of death, not life. And his harvest is a death harvest.
    Such a person feels he cannot be safe unless everything else is dead.
    His evil purpose take many forms and expressions. The end product is the same-death.
    Where an attacker has gone too far he is himself then attacked. Long, bitter quarrels and national wars are alike the to and fro exchange of violence.”
    HCOPL 21.nov.1972, Iss. I: How to handle black propaganda.

  19. Thought provoking


    Through LRH’s magnificent technology, I have been able to achieve a sense of freedom and strength I had never thought possible. The technology, when applied, works! It’s as simple as that! It is why I chose to join staff. I wanted others to have similar gains that I’d had. I could even imagine the state of the planet with the Aims of Scientology as an actuality. Incredible!

    When I found out that the technology had been altered and management as I knew it no longer existed, I knew that I needed to speak out. The gift of LRH’s legacy is too valuable to lose.

    Each one of us who has chosen to stay under the radar has done so for our own reasons. I know that I for one have thought of going public as I simply believe in what we are doing and I hate the idea of hiding who I am. I am just looking for a way to do it without compromising my integrity and honor. In my opinion, Haydn did it right. He took care of the business and security of his family and was free to make his declaration.

    As Attacks to our freedom and privacy increase so must our communications. If my annonyity is less than I intended, then I will deal with it. I am not as afraid as I was when I first started communicating on this blog and I am certainly more willing to fight to the fullest extent any direct attacks that come my way…loudly, publicy and legally if needed.

    Many in the past saw in management what I am just now seeing. Good people who lacked the means of communicating the truth on a massive scale. We have that means now. Marty, you opened up this vital comm line. YOU did not corrupt it. It is up to myself and others to keep it and LRH’s tech pure.

    You can count on my support that I will continue, despite any personal danger communicating may create, to forward the Aims of Scientology as written by L Ron Hubbard!

  20. lunamoth,
    Boy do you know where the light is! I’m betting lots of other moths will be following, I am and am not a moth. I’ll sit down beside you and have a hot dog over the fire. Mmmm, that tastes pretty good.

  21. I second that Mary.

    I don´t gige a f**k what they do with our communications.

    We don´t have any crime to hide.

    At least we are not cowards like the ones don´t accepting his wrongdoings.

    We all know who am I talking about.

    Let them use his last torpedoes before they collapse.


    Roberto Sánchez Núñez

  22. WomanSetFree

    All this HE&R and Criminal behavior by the ‘church’ (a term I use loosely) is proof of the following:
    “When buildings get important to us, for God’s sake, some of you born revolutionists, will you please blow up central headquarters.”
    LRH; Tape: The Genus of Scientology
    Anatomy of the Human Mind Congress
    31 December 1960

    Marty et al, in my view, you are the ‘born revolutionists’ appealed to in this quote and ‘central headquarters’ is going KA-BOOM!

    Thank God and it’s about time. Thanks to you all for taking a stand whether under or over the radar. As for myself, as x-SO and x-Scientologist as I might be, I still support rationality & sanity. It’s something CoS abandoned sometime back and I applaud you all for bringing it back in a huge way.

    You have my support.

  23. Dang! You sure are a magnet for trouble, Marty!

    See what happens when you started thinking for yourself?

    The hardworking OSA types and their PIs are forced to commit illegal acts just to keep up with you.

    Oh well, now I will have a new topic to discuss when I get a call or email from a church terminal about my support of Independent Scientologists like you.

    In previous conversations I accused them of either being woefully ignorant or complicit in covering up for DM. Now I can ask if they were involved in the hacking of email accounts.

    It has been most interesting that not one of them has ever communicated to me again, even though I invited them to email me if they had any further questions.

  24. crashing upwards

    Communicate to others. Thats the key. 98 % of staff or public whould shun anything like nightline or the SPT article. But if they only knew what was being aired. Maybee its time for everyone to make a list of 2 or 10 or 100 people they know and do some direct mailings or e-mail broadcasts. Otherwise, the wall remains up. Reach out and communicate. When you communicate with a heading that reads; :”Who physically assualted Mike Rinder?” or “Why are OTVIII’s going independent in droves” , you might be able to get by that initial block that keeps the public and staff in the dark. Maybee a nice announcement like “Scientologists loyal to LRH start independent movement.” , followed by a few paragraphs with some names in there they would recognize and respect. Its best to assume they know nothing of whats going on. And as long as the loyalty to standard tech and LRH remains foremost, they might see that this truly should not have to be taking place outside the church and certainly is not a suppressive movement. You plant the seeds and then when injustice hits closer to home for them, the seeds take root.
    If you need to remain under the radar, do up a nice letter or promo piece and mail it to people you care about ananymously if needed. As long as your intention is pure and just, there is nothing wrong in taking any particular road to getting the message out. Your not trying to hurt anyone. Your trying to get them to look at the subject and organization as it truly is in 2010. Then its up to them. You’ve done what you can.

  25. A message to the hackers:

    Ethics is the technology of survival.
    What you have done -and may continue to do- is NOT contributing to your survival.

    Breaking an established Federal law is no way to survive.

    A Law must be followed because the majority of those around you (including yourself) have agreed to follow them.
    To the degree that you stray from the agreed laws, you create an ARC break with your fellow man. That’s dangerous to your survival -no matter what the justification is.

    If you don’t agree with this, try robbing a bank and notice the reaction by all the people around you. You will become a target.

    Actually, don’t rob a bank -just take my word for it.

    Prison is not a safe place.
    It’s no place you to expand on your dynamics.
    It will be even harder to survive there.

    Stop your actions now.
    Turn yourself -and those you work with- into the authorities.
    Do this before it gets worse for you.
    Do this and you will be a much happier person who can sleep at night with a brighter future.

    Contact me if you need my help:
    You can also call and leave a message here:

    Being a Scientologist, I genuinely care about you and your survival.

    Master at Arms.

  26. Independent Spirit

    Marty, thank you for the update.

    Hushmail is a better e-mail provider, but people should be aware that it is not 100% secure/private.
    Please see these links:

    Click to access hushmail_report.pdf

    But it is probably sufficient for our purposes of
    communication, as we have nothing to hide from law enforcement agencies.
    Something in total contrast with David Miscavige, RTC and OSA and their human rights violations and atrocities.

    To obtain a higher degree of privacy PGP and GnuPG can be implemented. But that is more difficult.

    Another problem is that your website:
    is under continued attack by hackers, who are lurking to obtain the IP-addresses of people who are visiting your website, so that they can break into the private computers of the Independents and other visitors.

    To try to avoid that you have to install and run a service such as JonDoFox:
    You will need 2 programs:
    And JonDoFox:

    To have a fast line on this network you will have to pay, but it is not expensive.

    Then it will be difficult, but probably not impossible to get your IP-address.

    You will also need a good firewall on your system that can run in stealth mode, such as

    And a good virus/malvare scanner, such as Norton.

    Unlawful intrusions and attacks should be reported to law enforcement and intelligence agencies.

    You are doing fine Marty. We are not letting them cut our comm lines.


  27. Theo Sismanides

    Marty, whenever you get attacked you know you have done something good!!

    Take a big win and let’s start consolidating those wins and resources, my god!!!

    Marty you hit 7 Declarations of Independece by OTs in 7 days!! I mean, man, this is Production!! This is D/IG for Ethics indeed, and I am no freaking kidding. This is Ethics applied here big time.

    We are no kids now. We of the SO have been harassed beyond imagination for the cause. Wogs would think we are nuts. Been humiliated, been torn apart, been beaten down, been denied their freaking Bridge to Total Filthom, but never, never, never, no one of us, the true “us”, never forgot ethics. And this is our contract to the Commodore. Sorry for some guys wh0 think that just a walk in the park could do it. No inval on them, but hey, I got stories to tell, too. But I stick to just one for reasons of expedience in Understanding the grossness of the Outpoint:

    -Where is the freaking HCOB cancelling those HCOBs on translations? The tape translation series?

    You know why I did this? Not because I am fixated on HCOBs as Sarah Kotric told me with a mad staring look (really a very weird glaring mad look, like a hypnotized being, same look her husband had) that night at CLO EU that I was taken off post.

    I did it because it’s Ethics. It’s not even Tech. It’s been Ethics all along, for the last ten years. One Tech, One Source, One Tribe, oups sorry that’s from Black Eyed Peas…. One Admin tech, where you can see the outpoints.

    A Scientologist who cannot get Ethics in will never make it. And we are just doing that. Maybe we are not going up the Bridge all of us now, but, hey, we got to know Scientology when we took the decision to change. That’s Ethics, Emergency formula or Danger.

    Nowhere, nowhere on the Internet have I seen for the last 10 years I left Mestology, any such phenomenon, like it’s happening on this blog. So, you have done good Marty. More good than bad.

    Actually you have done a tremendous job without anybody understanding
    it really from the beginning.

    Little by little, everyday. The “calm resistance”. The openess in communication. The comm lines being put there little by little. The ARC coming up, and thus UnderstandingS, new UnderstandingS by new thetans each day. The acks we missed from you as a high Exec when under DM. You even did that to a teammate from Greee. You gave that acknowledgment for the translations we were doing, me, my wife and that other teammate. You found the time and you had the mind to that too.

    The soothing notes from a man who takes his e-pen and writes words of wisdom in a calmness sometimes not understood by me…

    But it worked. It yields its fruits now, we can see it everymorning on our monitors, more and more people, openly, signing by name, standing up, speaking up, jumping from 4th floors and screaming and shouting I AM FREE, I AM A THETAN UNKILLABLE, take my name, take my identity, take my friends (or so you think), take my family, take my fetuses, take my everything, you aren’t taking MY THETAN, ha ha? Yes, Dave “OUR” THETANS you are not going to take. OUR thetans! I remember some poor guys, when coming in Scientology who couldn’t get it and would say MY Thetan. This is the kind of Scientology you teach Dave. You made them YOUR thetans anyway.

    But no, you are NOT taking OUR thetans Dave, we are smarter… and more ethical without honororis, meritoritorius statuses. What happened to the translations HCOBs Dave? Can you answer to me? Do you or anyone of YOUR thetans dare protect your freaking s(hit)andard tech. Cause that’s what you made it Dave. Take it as you want Dave, we are poets, creators, that is. You call us SPs. I bet that’s Super Poets!! Read some history instead of going around with Tom Cruise and practicing guns! Oh, freaking thing, I could go on and on and on with you Dave. Sorry pal, no more time for you. We gave you enough. You ain’t taking MY thetan. Take the others’ thetans. Ha ha ha. That’s actually what they know, they are thetans because of you almighty leader, “give us life, give us a license to live”, type of thetans. No poets, no creators. Pfff… take them, they are all yours. Us, you are not taking ever, ever again!! Bye bye Dave!

    I estimate that the site now, will start picking up even more. The most important thing is that it has been a standard focal point for many decent beings and true fighters. Scientologists are fighters and decent beings. All we have to do is to now reitirate the fact that a free being is equally forceful as well as intelligent. If you have observed something non optimum (intelligence), well, you should be able to open your mouth and say it (force). Demonstration of force (declarations openly coming out, signed with names) is NOT bad. It’s OK to do it. Actually, it’s demonstration of our Power of Choice. The power of a Thetan. The rights of a thetan (as described in the PDCs). The right to his own sanity and the right to leave a Game. And your game is S(hit)andard Tech, Dave. We hadn’t just noticed the (S-hit) factor in there. Now, we know it. And more will come out and acknowledge it.

    And we will continue. Free thetans will continue to do that, declare their independence.

    The site will pick up. More and more people will join because Scientologists are not tweety weetie numby pamby dilletants. This is what we are fighting now. The one only thing:

    Confront of evil. An angel holding just a pigeon for peace will not do anything, a sword is a given, too, in the other hand. Get your e-swords, guys!

    I hear Jim Logan’s drum-beat from Nova Scottia. And I like the beat. It ain’t peaceful necessarily to my ears. I am not advocating blood showers but in any case it won’t be my head this time.

    Go Jim!! Over the ramparts guys!!!

  28. Marty, First off, thanks for posting this – Thank You – Thank You -. I am humored OSA still spends so much time and effort “gobbling up every typed word” there is posted on the net about the crimes their own management has committed – stated by those who witnessed the crimes take place. More specifically – a personal journal for CSI Management in reality. I’m no tree hugger but I do know I take action to be more responsible for the effects I unnecessarily create against the 5th Dynamic. I know when I am harming the environment. The church boasts themselves as curators for human rights and goodwill towards mankind but they CAN NOT call themselves environmentally responsible. They kill a tree each time they print off “specific’s” for DM’s daily “Press Briefing Pack” or “Intel Pack”. I only wish I had kept such a detailed well docemented list of those I’ve screwed in my lifetime. What Memories! but I keep reminding myself that church management no longer believes there is a 2nd Dynamic. It’s only and has always been about the 3rd dynamic. The fact they hacked your, and I am sure, others sites prooves “we are the strength.” Here is a quote I heard being Chinese Schooled at the HGB 12th floor over the holidays.. “The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he, who in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother’s keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who would attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know my name is the Lord (David Miscavage) when I lay my vengeance upon thee.”
    Happy New Year Marty and Mosey!! and Every other well-intentioned and good hearted person reading!

  29. Having been the target of some of the Co$’s attacks here in Oz (although mercifully very mild compared with others including yours, Marty,) I was at first shocked by the ferocity of the OSA attacks but I then realized it’s the sign of a VERY desperate organization that HAS to throw caution to the winds as these are probably the last counter-attacks that they will be able to launch.

    There is nowhere in the Co$ these days that isn’t contracting rapidly – I reckon that life in the Reichstag these days isn’t a lot of fun for anyone stuck there. Non-existent armies marching to defeat the SPs, new releases that will flood empty orgs with droves of new public, new PR campaigns to restore the terminally damaged image of the Co$ – the list of lies is legion.

    It is the sign of last, desperate days that these are the the tactics being used so blatantly in these days of instantaneous comm via the Net.

    Only the very insane or the extremely desperate (or a combination of both) would even contemplate these acts, let alone fund them. I believe we are watching the last days of this abusive organization right now.

  30. becomingAware


    Right you are. More will be coming into the sunshine as a result of the repeated en-theta coming from the church.
    They are PTS and trying to protect an SP from imagined attacks. They just have to turn around and get what’s left of their own integrity and confront up to save themselves. Their SP will take them down with him as he continues on his own self destruction.

    Marty, Please keep up the good work. This is getting fun!

  31. Albert Schweitzer:

    Ethics, too, are nothing but reverence for life. This is what gives me the fundamental principle of morality, namely, that good consists in maintaining, promoting, and enhancing life, and that destroying, injuring, and limiting life are evil.

  32. And such a nice fire!

  33. I was wondering to myself why an organization would continue to do things that are so blatantly against it’s own interests.

    The answer I came up with was this. Getting into DM’s mind I realized that he continues this behavior because it has “survival” value to him in his view. As long as he can keep this “battle” energized he can keep promoting to his “followers” that the “Bridge to Freedom” is under attack by the “SP’s”. This gives him credibility and makes him feel safer.

    The rational thing for the Church to do would be to cease the crazy behavior and start making up the damage. That is what a rational person would do.

    But, as LRH says a low tone person has ” No traffic with reason”.

    We are watching the actions of low toned individuals and it will be their downfall.

    In a way it is good if a lot of people get “outed”. They might realize ( myself included) that they are fearing the shadows, like the fish that allow themselves to get caught by the shadows moving in on them that LRH talks about in one of his books. The fish think the shadows are solid barriers and the natives would move the shadows into the shore and the fish would allow themselves to be pushed to shore and harvested. We should stop granting this organization so much power, as the only power they really have is the power we grant them.

  34. sygate is not that good. I got spoofed under that one. zone alarm is supposed to be one of the best.

    I have more than one firewall myself.

    I am pretty sure I got fair gamed by they using my bank card to take money from my bank account. Money was taken every three days till I noticed which then was too late. I was up the wazoo in overdrafts. I know they had the bank card number as I was stupid after I was not in good standing I never considered to close that account out.

    1 week after editing the Nancy Many interview video is when it started. They took money every three days though a web site I never heard of till then.

    I now have all flags set to my bank accounts to tell me what is going on and changed my passwords and other info. I told the bank what direction to look at. I am glad you are out. I gave up a social worker counselor as she thought it is not good for me to fight this fight.

    Now I don’t think I have to fight as hard since you guys came out. I can now concentrate on what I need to for myself.

  35. I’ve never seen that before. This group here is moving on up a little higher at fast speed. Marty apologizes. The answer is we don’t care if we are hacked or whatever. they can’t take our thetan away, we can jump on trees from the fourth floor, get our 2d into a plane by intention alone, we can communicate freely, we are free beings.
    Theo your post made me laugh, i liked it so much.
    Theo, do you know if somewher any materials in german still do exist from the briefing course ?
    Or did they really destroy all the translations in 1994. You should perhaps write here what happened then I don’t think the american people ever heard about this tapes and books burning.

    have a nice night

  36. Thought provoking

    Okay, I confess… It has been many years since I studied Christianity or any other formal religion.

    Please tell me your Chinese School quote is a joke, something said in mockery of Cof S.

  37. Marty, You are the best thing that happened to the Independent Scientologists and free thinkers. It is very apparent that DM and OSA are constantly in fear of who could be the next in line to expose their crimes, therefore they would do any think to find out.
    Well, they have no clue what a BIG surprise will be hitting DM soon.

    OSA, DM and Tommy Davis! Stay tune! 🙂

  38. I have a question to all of you.

    Group Anonymous is known for hacking. I really dislike DM and some others within INT but C of S isn’t known for hacking and was a victim of Anonymous hacking too.

    Who do you think hacked Marty’s blog?

  39. I have been a scientologist for more than 3 decades.

    I have never for one second considered myself being anything else than independent. For me
    independency is all Scientology is about. You are all your dynamics, but more than that you are bigger than anything else. That means that you potentially are bigger than all your dynamics. In other words you are your own God, and your biggest problem is that anybody else has the same potentialities.

    You are in big trouble as a God in your own Kingdom. You want control ower life, and you
    need to get some agreement from your dynamics to get somewhere. Tough life, isn’t it? You are married to a Goddess. Hell it can be.

    As far as I see this planet and the rest of the Universe, then we are in it together, and
    together we will eventually get out of it. In a good state or in a bad.

    Marty Rathbun and David Miscavige were good palls at least up to 1993 with the IRS victory.

    After that it seems like the power shifted to a dictatorial regime, that seems to take no end.

    I have not withdrawn from my Church, and I have no intentions doing so. I have expressed my dismay about David Miscavige to proper terminals high up in the Church, and have not been kicked out at this time.

    When you don’t have enough data to evaluate properly you fill in the vacuum. Before the truth revealed I had filled in a vacuum like this:

    David Miscavige had done the OT Levels all the way up to OT 15, and as the wise man in Star Wars lifted his Hummer 10 feet up in the air, and silently put it down again. David Miscavige became a real OT and realised that with these powers in the hands of out ethics publics and staf who knew nothing, it was all too soon to release these powers.

    It would simply destroy the world in outethics games, where scientologists in 2D quarrels would throw their wifes (Goddesses) out of the window with pure intention, not to speak of the CIA raiding our churches to gain control ower the mind control invention. The evil purposes had to be handled first.

    I admit that I have a sound imagination.

    With the SP Times my vacuums were filled with a lot of data, that made my hopes and dreams vanish. And in despair I have been.

    David Miscavige was an SP trying to grab us all into slavery?

    And Marty Rathbun being the new Luther that would find the middle road?

    Marty being the good hat and David being the bad.

    After half a year of lurking I have come to this conclusion:

    David and Marty are both good hats.

    Why is that?

    Well, again I have far too little data, and by that my imagination again has driven me owerboard in a desire to fill out vacuums.

    Set the scene to 1986, the old man just died. David Miscavige goes into the holy grail, and
    the 26 year old boy discovers that there is no OT levels as promised. The holy grail is empty. Zils. OT 8 is the highest level.

    4 years has gone by with our hero fighting a battle to win control, and now he sees it’s for nothing. The Church promises Total Freedom and we don’t have it. David is the only one to know, takes the worksheets, put them in a secure locker, and decides to keep on going in the game of making a better place out of earth. He soon assumes total control, and he is
    running an incredible show, culminating in the final triumphant victory ower the IRS.

    The missing OT Levels was not a problem until this point. Every scientologist on earth new
    that it was not time to release new OT levels untill things were calm and easy. They were
    now, and staff and public started asking about the OT Levels, and the release of super power.

    Instead of admitting the truth, and saying that there were no Total Freedom, he kept on
    going in a desperate attempt to keep the show on the road.

    By this time he was so fond of being in control, that he actually forgot the mission, and kept on going just for the game of it, and he has done so ever since.

    If this is true, why is David then a hero?

    If he had told the truth in 1986, Scientology would have died a quiet dead. Very very few could have continued KSW. What we have as the tech today would have vanished in a lot of
    squirrel activities, and the Church would never have accomplished the win in 1993. The Church could have folded down as a house of cards.

    David Miscavige is a hero for what he did, and he should not be condemned as many wishes.

    He should be removed, yes, but he should be removed, like he himself removed Mary Sue. She was gratiously taken care of untill her death. David Miscavige should be gratiously taken care of for the rest of his life. The group owes him that.

    Scientology will never make it, neither as a Church or as an independent field, unless the PR around the subject is turned around. We are rediculised toward the world. All of us.

    The PR got somewhat handled in 1982, by blaming Mary Sue. The PR back then was bad. The press told lies about us all the time, but they were lies most of them, and they were pretty easy to dead agent. Apollo wasn’t smugling drugs, and there were no blatant illegalities going on except stealing copy paper. Many americans even considered us heroes, just for taking the fight with the government.

    The international press today is worse than ever. And what is the worst is, that they actually are telling the truth. Some scientologists have been held against their will, and they have been beaten up by their superiors, worst off all by their own leader, as many says.

    The PR could be somewhat handled in 2010, by blaming David Miscavige.

    Byt only somewhat. The only way to get good PR are by good results technically. It has always been like that.

    And why is Marty Rathbun a hero?

    Because he made it possible for so many of us to get a glimpse of what really goes on.

    As I said before. I have a good imagination, and it is all due to still many missing pieces of knowledge. I just filled in a vacuum again. I hope you don’t mind.

    And would it be a catastrope if we didn’t have Total Freedom?

    In my honest evaluation, not at all. We have so much else to offer the world. And we can do it.

    Scientology IS the super religion that the Dalai Lama never thought would arise. It is the religion that embraces all the other religions. You can practice scientology as a hindu, budhist, jew, christian or a moslimn. If it is standard.

    But we have to get the PR on the word Scientology handled. NOW. Elsewise we will all fail. We are in this together.

    The OldTimer.

  40. Oui! Viva la resistance!

  41. Damn I like your spirit!

  42. “Here then is the cycle of a group receiving an engram…. The emergency status of the situation has to do with compressed time-something obviously is happening so swiftly that a full use of communications is not possible, for which must be supplanted arbitrary rules or commands. As soon as the emergency is over, is can be seen that an engram has been implanted in the group. The clearing of this engram consist of an examination by the whole group of the arbitraries, which is to say, he orders and commands which were issued without explanation and which demanded instantaneous action on the part of other individuals in the group……
    The processing the group should be the special trust and charge of selected members of the group itself….. Such an examination and discussion of these moments of emergency should not be colored in any slightest degree by any thought of protecting the public idea concerning the ethics of this particular group.” LRH

    From Dianetic Auditor Bulletin GROUP DIANTICS Jan 1951.

    Looks to me like Marty is applying the tech as should.

    It would really be beautiful to get those still in to apply this tech. I’m working on it.

    Very well done. Marty and friends.

  43. yourfriendtoo

    If God knows, the wolrd can know it too….
    When the dog barks, is a signal that we are moving forward…

  44. Great reference. Thanks Peter

  45. I sure havent that would be interesting.

  46. For anyone out there who is being bullied as a result of information illegally obtained:
    So far OSA’s (under DMs orders of course – can’t blame OSA entirely) has attempted the following on Chrissie and I:
    1. Asking old friends for info about us (busted)
    2. Sending in plants to get data (busted)
    3. Sending frightened Scientologists to the house under the guise of being friendly (busted)
    4. Trying to bully Shane (busted)
    5. Getting one or two completely insignificant terminals to disconnect (busted)
    Is this what we are to be afraid of?
    The only power an SP has is the power to restimulate.
    Take a nice long walk if you are being attacked as a result of any data these morons have acquired and realize there actually is no REAL danger in present time.
    If you are flying under the radar and getting any kind of attention or attack at all you must be very important and powerful – well done on being a big thetan.
    Marty – it is not your apology to give.

  47. Lunamoth I will warm my hands by the fire with you any time

  48. Kathy Braceland

    You’re the man Marty!

    Watch out you hacker guys…and you know who you are. You have absolutely no idea who you’re messing with here.

    Let me repeat that in case you didn’t get it the first time…. you have absolutely no idea who you’re messing with here.

    Yep, the more communication, the better. So if any of our emails to you get spread all over the web, it’s just more communication going out, right? I’m not concerned in the slightest. Unless of course…say…I didn’t email the map to the hidden treasure to you did I?

    You’re absolutely dead on by saying continue to reach and communicate. And that I shall continue to do. I’ve never known when to shut up anyway….

  49. Alas, I discovered many years ago that you shouldn’t send or say anything online that you don’t mind your loved ones and worst enemies to know, because that will be the first thing that will be revealed. No matter how many walls are put up, someone’s there with a chisel slowly making a hole.

    That said, I think that most people who would contact you know that. Too much evidence of dirty tricks from numerous places.

  50. Ooh ooh!
    Forgot to mention the one about the MAA calling us and telling us we had 24 hours to report to Saint Hill.
    Or else what? They’re going to confiscate our teddy bears?

  51. Hey Marty,
    I don’t know how your accounts were hacked, but a usual method is to guess weak passwords & to exploit “security question” features that on-line services provide to recover your password.

    Here is a simple guide on how to create more complex passwords that cannot be easily guessed:

    And as far as strengthening “security question” features used to recover your forgotten password go, you need to rethink the security questions asked. For instance, if a security question asks “What was the name of your dog growing up” DON’T give it the name of your dog. Answer that question with something like “Chicken Gizzards”. Personal information is too easily guessed or figured out.

    Best of luck to you & keep up the good work.

  52. Don’t forget about the button that upset them enough to do the hacking, all the charge on Clear declarations . Pour the coal on that fire don’t be distracted.

  53. Hi Marty,
    I am one of the people who may have been compromised. However, I do not regret my communication to you because it gave me a chance to blow off some steam, and because it was long enough ago that I have had time to learn more, confront more, and plan more.

    If I am outed, I am now at the point where I am willing to accept the consequences, handle the suppression, and get on with living.

    And if I am approached by a terminal who seems to know more about me than they should, it will only be proof that their group is indeed as perverted as it has been accused of being.

  54. Dear Marty, keep up the good work. Since my declaration of independence I keep getting requests of help and auditing at all levels. I don’t even need to make much call’-in at all. People wants scientology and are sick about what the church has to offer for their ripp-off prices.

  55. Marty,

    Thank you for your concern for our well being. You have done so much for us all by providing this forum to congrigate. The reality is we are safer and far better off being here and in communication than not – despite the security risks.

    “The freedom of an individual depends upon that individual’s freedom to alter his considerations of space, energy, time and forms of life, and his roles in it. If he cannot change his mind about these, he is then fixed and enslaved amidst barriers such as those of the physical universe and barriers of his own creation. Man thus is seen to be enslaved by barriers of his own creation.” LRH

    Through communication, you are helping us to help each other to alter our considerations, thus eliminating barriers and we are becoming more and more free.

    There is no question it is worth the securitiy risks.

  56. Well said.

    The most in-ethics you could be is imortal.
    The most out ethics you can be is dead.

  57. Theo Sismanides

    Dear LO, thanks, unfortunately I don’t know if all translations were destroyed. I know little of what happened, I was in the US at that time and when I came back to AOSHEU I met the Supervisor of the Briefing Course and he told me with tears in his eyes that one night RTC came and gave the order to burn(?)/destroy all old tapes from the BC and all translations. It was an italian guy (the supervisor, I don’t remember his name) and he was so afraid to speak up and say anything. Then in the basement of CLO EU where we kept the tools for renos there were tons of translations tapes all packed up and thrown there in very bad condition.

    The fortunate thing is that the Freezone and my contact in Switzerland probably has the BC in German. I am contacting him today and I am sure he will have something. They are doing a great job in Russia (made many OTs there) and since he is Swiss, German is his main language.

    The essence of the Tape Translations was that you get a translator of high caliber (LRH says to get a UN – United Nations- caliber of a translator) together with a Tech Expert who explains and assists the specialist translator in understanding the SCN terminology and then the translator, having gotten it, and having decided how to put it (some terms are just hobson johnsoned, meaning they are just put in the target language with the english words but made to sound more German for example. Like the word “case” in Greek would be put as “case” in greek letters (κέης), wouldn’t be translated as it is a special technical word.

    Amazing amount of Duplication Technology for other languages in those HCOBs.

    And let me tell you guys, LRH…. I found this LRH ED (I don’t remember the number 8, 10?) where he says the Why for Europe was the no use of the HCOBs on translations.

    And I had met a guy in Milano who used to be on the BC and couldn’t continue because the BC tapes were destroyed.

    And LRH says in a CBO (Central Bureau Order): the HELL with Perfectionism, this thing (meaning a translation) can be perfectionized until it’s never released.

    Amazing! LRH was not a perfectionist, he was a guy for workability. The Tapes would be made and sold as a Course in the Academy and they would be CHEAP, he says that, because they don’t cost as much as the printed paper and books. And then you have the printed books, you first have the Tape Courses all translated, ha ha. He speaks in those HCOBs about the oral society who have a problem to study and they can better follow a speaker etc. etc.

    We had tremendous amounts of stupidities and perfectionisms by RTC, we would have our materials sent back from RTC disapproved for almost nothing, nothing, nothing.

    Then when we left me and my wife Olga in 1999 they released a whole bunch of the materials we had translated to show who were the bad guys. Us!!! Ha ha. Amazing black PR using our work. Before my wife Olga came on the lines on translations the translations wouldn’t make much sense in many tricky points and the language was not natural, very unprofessional. She dedicated 5 years and corrected them to get SP declared. She is a Super Poet, I know that. Not an SP.

    Now, if those HCOBs were applied in nations around the world people could study in the Academy the courses CHEAP, this is exactly what LRH says, and auditors would be made.

    Now, they have a lot of materials here in Greece, they even became a Class V Org, but guess why? Because back in 2000 I did 6 TV shows and the church felt very panicky about the whole thing. So, they rushed to make Athens a Class V Org and put a lot of attention on it. 6 TV shows on Greek TV channels with ministers and journalists and the church was absent, no PR, nothing. They couldn’t confront anything.

    Anyway, the point is that the translations in German might exist. I will know soon. But the High Crime on Planet Earth is continued because people cannot be taught easily by the written word. Better in oral. Go read those HCOBs, in the Red Vols. Dianetics and Scientology in other languages and Course Translations to Tape, from the Tape Series, which has been black PRed, abandoned and neglected on purpose. As the TU Director for Europe I did my duty and stood up for LRH Tech. I am proud about it.

    You know how I left post? Walter Kotric came to me and said: “why you don’t apply the program by COB?” and I said: “But… Sir, what about the HCOBs, why we didn’t include them in the program?” And he said “Read COB”, and I thought… what? So I said to him: “Read LRH”, pretty logical I thought, and he said: “Read COB” and we went back and forth: “Read LRH, read COB” for a couple of times when I understood that this guy was definitely not there for LRH but for COB, and I went to give to an end: “Read LRH and I will check you out”, so you understand, he got pissed, the junior saying I will check you out on LRH materials, ha ha, so he yanked me off post!! Ha ha, after months I became the baker and he was asking me for black bread, to bake for him and I did, ha ha. One morning I left and nobody ate bread from my hands anymore. I wasn’t the baker, I was the TU Director for all of Europe and I know I could do it with those HCOBs. They wanted just bread from me, too bad.

  58. That’s a good point, the button needs to be flattened!

  59. “C of S isn’t known for hacking……”

    How do you know? Please be specific.

  60. Theo Sismanides

    Hey guys, check out Aida Thomas and the LA convention of Freezone:

  61. Marty,

    You’re doing a great job and a few SPs are just trying to stop you which really worked well for them, since traffic to your site doubled!

    Nuff said.

  62. Independent Spirit

    Let me make a further comment on these
    security issues.

    I don’t think Sygate is that bad a firewall.
    Norton Corporation bought Sygate and have incorporated into its security suite I think.

    Anyway, you can check some of your firewall’s vulnerabilities at:
    Choose ShieldsUp to test the first 1056 ports of your computer.
    You can test all other ports also, such as common hacker ports.
    You can then test your firewall to see if it is leaking any information:
    And then you can test some other common vulnerabilities:
    And much more.
    The best of course is to have the help of a security expert.

    About e-mail. Sending an e-mail on the internet is the same as sending a postcard by ordinary mail. Is it open to everybody unless it is encrypted.
    Intelligence services are screening millions of e-mails every day looking for patterns of terror threats.
    Hushmail is better than ordinary e-mail, and PGP is even better.
    I would not be surprised to find out that it is not only Marty’s mailbox that have been hacked, but all visitor mailboxes also.
    Why? Because I don’t think these break-ins are done by teenage kids.
    They are probably done by highly professional paid hackers obtained by private investigators.

    The problem is not so much that they are reading your e-mails. A bigger problem is that when they hack they lurk and obtain your private IP-addresses, and then they will try to break into your private computer. Not primarily to steal information or credit card data. But to do something more sinister, such as planting illegal files on your system. To set you up. To get you to court for things you have not done.

    And that is why I take this quite serious and advice you in case of an intrusion into your computer/mailbox to take a copy of your firewalls security log and if possible report it to:

    – the internet service provider of the intruder, if the intruders IP-address is in your firewalls security log
    – your local law enforcement office
    – your country’s law enforcement headquarters, IT crime investigations
    – your country’s intelligence agencies.
    These organizations are interested in these reports as they are themselves the subject of professional possibly highly paid hacker attacks.

    We have seen all these eye witness reports of human rights violations, genocide-like atrocities and torture committed by David Miscavige, members of RTC, OSA, DM’s personal security staff and the armed guards at INT/GOLD base near Hemet, DM’s lawyers, private investigators and other agents.
    If you are in any way intimidated, threatened or harassed, I advice you to report it to and contact:
    – your local law enforcement office
    – your country’s law enforcement headquarters
    – your country’s intelligence agencies
    – your country’s members of government and parliament
    – your country’s human rights organizations
    – your country’s news media
    – all your friends, family, colleagues and acquaintances
    – all your country’s religious leaders
    – you might also want to send a report to Australian senator Xenophon who are involved in police investigations into human rights violations and crimes committed by David Miscavige, OSA and RTC.
    Now why would you do that?
    Because you have become member of a minority group, Independent Scientologists,
    that are subjected to genocide-like persecution, organized crime and Black Scientology.
    And people would like to know about it.
    Governments, law enforcement agencies, intelligence agencies, human rights organizations, ordinary people and many more are concerned about what is going on. So I recommend that you enforce a NO-tolerance policy on these matters.

    I have no doubt that the situation at INT/GOLD base and other “Sea Org” units are undergoing secret police/intelligence investigation. Why?
    Because the US Government, Department of State, FBI and other organizations are getting
    complaints or petitions from all over the world about people that are falsely imprisoned at INT/GOLD.
    And there is a limit to how long they can tolerate a concentration camp on US mainland. Governments all over the world are getting involved in this matter because some of their citizens are held against their will, maimed and tortured at INT/GOLD base.
    David Miscavige is or is becoming a national security problem for these organizations. Because he is bringing these organizations international reputation into question.


  63. Ohhhh Noes! Not our Teddy Bears!


  64. “If he had told the truth in 1986”

    That would be the Ethical thing to do.

    “The Church could have folded down as a house of cards.”

    So frightened you are that you can not do scientology without the failing structure.

    “He should be removed, yes, but he should be removed, like he himself removed Mary Sue. She was gratiously taken care of untill her death. David Miscavige should be gratiously taken care of for the rest of his life. The group owes him that.”

    He supressed her plain and simple making her a bird in a golden cage. And a group should not be condoning supression either.

    Bishop Desmond Tutu:
    I am not interested in picking up crumbs of compassion thrown from the table of someone who considers himself my master. I want the full menu of rights.

    “unless the PR around the subject is turned around”
    “The PR got somewhat handled in 1982, by blaming Mary Sue.”
    “The PR could be somewhat handled in 2010, by blaming David Miscavige.”
    “Byt only somewhat. The only way to get good PR are by good results technically. It has always been like that.”
    “But we have to get the PR on the word Scientology handled. NOW.”

    You Sir frighten me and the rest of Anoymous. You are not a truthseeker. You are talking Pr Like to Be, Do and Have the PR you want to save the Curch that alows for Human Rihgt Violatons. Step on individuals rights in order to shield the group/ public Scientoligists from the Truth. You Sir do noty seek change, You Sir want to contineu on the same beaten doen paths that have destroyed so many lives, families, childhoods and livelyhoods.

    I hear”For the greater good, For the greater nubers” dripping from your written statement.

    You talk about PR ! You talk about who to (falsly) blame. You talk about the group if they are not Individuals that can think for themself. Free Thetans if you will.

    You Sir frighten me, When PR replaces the Truth, Faith is lost.

  65. No worries in our situation. May declare louder and sooner than we would otherwise, because of the hack, but that’s about the sum total of tghe effect…

  66. Old Timer, your vivid imagination is off by half a bubble. I did the old OT sections 4, 5, 6 and 7. I also know that when OT 8 was released, only half of it was released. The other half is OT 9.

    I know that if one honestly finished old OT 6, he would achieve total freedom. That is a for sure. Old OT 7 would have been a really good cherry on the top of that pie.

  67. This made me think. If (and obviously nothing has been proven yet) it was OSA who hacked Marty’s account, then any attempt to contact those Scns whose details were stolen from the address book and who are still on lines in the CoS and subject them to ethics actions because of this, will immediately link the hacking to OSA.


  68. LOL. That’s funny Sam, but losing a teddy bear can be very upsetting. 😦

    But when you think about it, that’s about as effective as they can get in punishing us, unless we go into agreement with them.

    Was this recently? If you are tempted to ‘report in’ and give them a piece of your mind – I’d love to be there with my video camera. 🙂


  69. As we all know, freedom is not free. Our founding fathers set the bar pretty high by pledging their fortunes, their lives and their sacred honor. We are not going to run for cover just because our emails might get hacked.

    On another point, the natural world is based on networks, not hierarchies, because networks survive. And we each survive to the extent that our networks flourish, and connect to and overlap with other networks.

    Marty helps this process by being the hub of this particular network, and all of us connected to it are surviving better because of that. So Marty, thank you, sincerely!

  70. Underground For Now

    William Shakespeare wrote a history play based on the life of King Henry V and in one of the more memorable passages Shakespeare wrote,

    “…And Crispin Crispian shall ne’er go by,
    From this day to the ending of the world,
    But we in it shall be remembered-
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers…”

    Currently we are a group of few and soon to be a group of many.

    Today I toast Marty’s, BAND OF BROTHERS.

    Very comforting to know someone has my back.

    Marty, I am not worried one bit about OSA, FLAG or anyone in the COS.

    I just want to get the truth out to as many deserving thetans as possible. IMHO the three most important actions Marty’s BAND OF BROTHERS can do is…..


  71. Independent Spirit

    Let me make a further comment on these security issues.

    I don’t think Sygate is that bad a firewall. Norton Corporation
    bought Sygate and have incorporated into its security suite I think.
    The freeware version of Sygate do not support hooks, so your system is vulnerable at start-up.

    Anyway, you can check some of your firewall’s vulnerabilities at:
    Choose ShieldsUp to test the first 1056 ports of your computer.
    You can test all other ports also, such as common hacker ports.
    You can then test your firewall to see if it leaking any information:
    And then you can test some other common vulnerabilities:
    And much more.
    The best of course is to have the help of a security expert.

    About e-mail. Sending an e-mail on the internet is the same as sending a postcard by ordinary mail. Is it open to everybody unless it is encrypted.
    Intelligence services are screening millions of e-mails every day looking for patterns of terror threats.
    Hushmail is better than ordinary e-mail, and PGP is even better.
    I would not be surprised to find out that it is not only Marty’s mailbox that have been hacked, but all visitor mailboxes also.
    Why? Because I don’t think these break-ins are done by teenage kids.
    They are probably done by highly paid hackers hired by private investigators.

    The problem is not so much that they are reading your e-mails. A bigger problem is that when they hack they lurk and obtain your private IP-addresses, and then they will try to break into your private computer. Not primarily to steal information or credit card data. But to do something more sinister, such as planting illegal files on your system. To set you up. To get you to court for things you have not done.

    And that is why I take this quite serious and advice you in case of an intrusion into your computer/mailbox to take a copy of your firewalls security log and if possible report it to:

    – the internet service provider of the intruder, if the intruders IP-address
    is in your firewalls security log
    – your local law enforcement office
    – your country’s law enforcement headquarters, IT crime investigations
    – your country’s intelligence agencies.
    These organizations are interested in these reports as they are themselves the subject of professional possibly highly paid hacker attacks.

    We have seen all these eye witness reports of human rights violations, genocide-like atrocities and torture committed by David Miscavige, members of RTC, OSA, DM’s personal security staff and the armed guards at INT/GOLD base near Hemet, DM’s lawyers, private investigators and other agents.
    If you are in any way intimidated, threatened or harassed, I advice you to report it to and contact:
    – your local law enforcement office
    – your country’s law enforcement headquarters
    – your country’s intelligence agencies
    – your country’s members of government and parliament
    – your country’s human rights organizations
    – your country’s news media
    – all your friends, family, colleagues and acquaintances
    – all your country’s religious leaders
    – you might also want to send a report to Australian senator Xenophon who are involved in police investigations into human rights violations and crimes committed by David Miscavige, OSA and RTC.
    Now why would you do that?
    Because you have become member of a minority group, Independent Scientologists,
    that are subjected to genocide-like persecution, organized crime and Black Scientology.
    And people they would like to know about it.
    Governments, law enforcement agencies, intelligence agencies, human rights organizations, ordinary people and many more are concerned about what is going on.So I recommend that you enforce a NO-tolerance policy on these matters.

    I have no doubt that the situation at INT/GOLD base and other “Sea Org” units are undergoing secret police/intelligence investigation. Why?
    Because the US Government, Department of State, FBI and other organizations are getting
    complaints or petitions from all over the world about people that are falsely imprisoned at INT/GOLD.
    And there is a limit to how long they can tolerate a concentration camp on US mainland, because governments all over the world are getting involved in this matter because some of their citizens are held against their will, maimed and tortured.
    David Miscavige is or is becoming a national security problem for these organizations. Because he is bringing these organizations international reputation into question.


  72. Man, Samantha. You are NOT taking this seriously…


  73. You know, Pirate is right. We were talking about the blanket invalidation of the state of clear and the subsequent confusion that created on the 3rd D. Marty wrote a great post on that. Since it was at that point that we last left off, I’d just like to ask if there is anything else anyone would to say or ask?

    We can end off on that subject on our own determinism, after all.

  74. Travelagent
    Be really careful here. You’re starting to smell like a plant already.

  75. Hi travelagent,

    I have some thoughts. First, though, I did suggest to Marty that it might have been an Anon who did it. So bear that in mind.

    You say “C of S… was a victim of Anonymous hacking”. If you are referring to the initial attacks on the CoS sites that brought them down, that wasn’t hacking. That was lots of requests for the websites at once, so that the servers were overwhelmed. Not hacking.

    You say, “Group Anonymous is known for hacking.” It’s true that, after some loose-lipped Fox Media person called Anonymous “hackers on steroids”, that some Anons on the chans thought that was FAR too good to let pass into the annals of history. So, the meme was perpetuated. That said, the proportion of channers that are actually hackers is anybody’s guess. Even the Sarah Palin email stunt wasn’t a “hack”. The guy just guessed or researched the answers to her security questions. Not hacking.

    As far as the Chanology Anons go, they are probably exponentially lighter on in the hacking skills, most of the channers have returned whence they came. Many such as me couldn’t hack into our own email accounts.

    Having said all of that, while the CoS has the motive to want to get Marty’s email, I wouldn’t be surprised if it was either an Anon or the CoS.

  76. Nah axiom – that was before we got loud. I think the offer has expired now.
    Great idea about the video camera though. For sure I’ll keep some form of recording device on standby to welcome unexpected visitors. Thanks for the tip 😀

  77. Oh, dear. Marty I linked to a terrible file type. Would you mind inserting this into the above comment instead?

  78. Thought provoking

    Good reference. My opinion is that the basic on the chain is the cut comm line to LRH. All of the out tech, misapplied ethics, etc. are simply restimulators. As more and more charge blows the comm line to LRH gets restored.

    Marty is doing a great job.

  79. Thought provoking


  80. BRAVO Theo!! I loved this!

  81. Thought provoking

    Actually, yes. DM butchered the clear references with the blanket statement that there were no”past life” clears. What about natural clears. Anyone have the LRH reference on that?

  82. Heres a thought, probably buried at the bottom of yesterdays thread never to be noticed, but…

    How can we, those of us with a like mind and intent, create the situation where those in the church who are trying to oppose us, can win too?

    Win without violating their integrity as they see it?

    It seems to me that “they” are doing what they know. Dogs bark, cats run up a tree, people apply the solutions they know or that their experience and previous decisions provide on an automaticity.

    First “we” should not provide them with the terminal in opposition for them to generate energy. Call it Ghandi tech, whatever.

    But how do we get “them” to communicate in a higher tone level than hacking email accounts? Or having surrogates, PI’s, (vias) doing “noisy investigations”?

    How do we bring uptone what may seem to be “our opposition”?

    Many on this side are in the band of play in this matter….how do we get them out of the shithole band of errrgh and angst that it seems they have fallen?

    And if we did, would that alone be a factor that would start the internal change in the direction the church is headed?

    It will change. It would be cool if it didnt involve anyone losing their lifes dreams, and the decades of work on organization turning to dust.

  83. How can we make a safe space for them? Where they can truly be in comm? How do we get the “church” in session, not in a comm ev? (not that that is not needed too…)

    Call me naive if you wish.

  84. Touché!

    … and gree.

    We knew it already.

    No problem.

  85. Hackers contracted by…


    Sended by lawyers.

    Tipical move.

    This way CofS can´t be blamed at all and still get all the info to try to make life miserable for his “rebel and aut-ethics parishioners”.

    What a way to improve conditions; isn´t?

    Dumb moves to try to regain size and good PR.

    On other subject: again I apologize to all for my bad use of the English language. Remember is not my native language. But daily working on improve it.

  86. Theo Sismanides


  87. “I am not as afraid as I was when I first started communicating on this blog…”

    Dear provoking…

    You have contributed a lot to us, to me with all your views. I don´t understand what are you afraid of. You don´t need to answer or explain. Just let you know I don´t understand it.

    Thanks for all you have done so far.

  88. Dave Adams,
    I’m not gainsaying the idea you’ve put forth, but it seems to me that if the dialogue was in the offing with these fellas, then why don’t they just write on this blog? Why not on any of the pro-Scn ones?

    The PR Series 18: “It is a long-to-find and hard-learned fact that people who engage in Black Propaganda have big bursting crimes to hide.
    They do not have little crimes. They have BIG ones.
    One’s own ability to confront evil may be too low to really grasp the Black Propagandist’s crimes or believe they exist.
    Such people are often SANCTIMONIOUS hypocrites. They are usually arrogant and will not parley (have conferences with a foe).” Policy Letter 21 Nov 71 Issue I.

    It’s the lack of ‘parley’ that is a clue to what’s going on. I’m so easily communicated to with no mystery as to where I live, my email, my phone and any number of ways to just TALK to me, that it seems apparent there is no intention to resolve the issues with the universal ‘resolvent’; communication.

  89. Jackson’s quote above is what Samuel Jackson said in Pulp Fiction when he was about to blow someone’s head off. There must have been at least one SO member who has seen this movie and would start laughing if required to chant it! So I’d say somone’s leg has been pulled!

  90. Really great thoughts, bro!
    The problem lies in their indoctrination, I guess. I see them like members of the French Revolution. And you know, when they do the TR course and begin to act like machines… How can they have a cognition in a state like that?
    I suppose they confuse two things. TRs are for session but they use it in real life. Instead of using the ARC triangle in life which is meant for everyday communication and the use of it would lead to understanding, they just use TRs and that will never lead to understanding.
    So, how can they be in comm? That’s a though question. You know, they do not negotiate with terrorists. And they KNOW that all other guys than themselves are terrorists… LOL
    I know. I was in the SO myself. They disregarded any non SO guys as well…
    On the other hand who knows … maybe some good worded “auditing question” would work in the long run… But then I guess all other communication from all Independents and “associates” would need to be terminated during that “session”… Maybe even all other web content would need to be withrawn like a “ceasefire”.
    I would just empty the websites and ask simple, honest, not offensive questions.
    I do not see as impossible, that this would work…

  91. Old Timer, with all due respect, I find your post troubling on many levels. I personally worked with David Miscavige for many years, up close and personal. The man is a sociopath. He rules by threat and intimidation. He constantly threatens, abuses and even physically attacks his staff. Your conclusion that he is a “good hat” and a “hero” is deeply disturbing to me. I would say re-read the St. Pete Times accounts of what life is like under Miscavige. Re-read Blown For Good’s book, re-read my own blog, Counterfeit Dreams.

    Secondly, one of the heroic acts you ascribe to him is carrying on and keeping the show on the road despite discovering the lie that there are no upper OT Levels (OT IX – XV). Well, you may well be right that these levels do not and never have existed – certainly that would be a valid conclusion after 20 years – but let me point out that promising to deliver these levels – and even taking money for them – when they do not exist, has another name. It’s called fraud. It is not a heroic act to promise something that does not exist and that you cannot deliver. It’s called a confidence game.

    Finally, you say that the problem is that Scientology has “bad PR.” No, the problem is that the Church of Scientology has perpetrated and condoned and carried out abuse and human rights violations and fraud. And these have been exposed and therefore public opinion has turned against the Church. The answer is not to throw a scapegoat under the bus and carry on. The answer is to actually live the principles you espouse. If Scientology is about truth, then be truthful. If there are no upper OT Levels, then say so – be honest about it. If there are abuses, then stop them, and reform the Church so it never happens again. The answer to Scientology’s “PR” is to actually be what they claim to be, to live by their principles and become an embodiment of the aims and goals that they espouse. You can’t “PR” your way out of lies and abuse and fraud. You can cease doing those things and actually reform and actually become what you say you are.

  92. IMHO we are using the wrong verb time.

    Central Headquarters are not going to go KA-BOOM. They have done it already. Is like a big explotion looked in ultra slow motion. We are witness of the first debris.

    Again I say: In all wars we have casualties. My respect and support to all the goodwill people inside CofS following wrong commands.

  93. Dear Cat Daddy and the rest of you brave people.

    The one PR policy current management has broken the most is:

    “Never lie in PR.”

    This has been broken internally and externally. I have communicated that I am on strike untill this situation is solved one way or the other. I actually did quite a lot of PR for my Church untill the truth were revealed to me through this blog.

    My ideal scene is that a new Church management will tell the truth as to what happened, and off course cancel disconnection from “SP’s” that just told what they observed with their own eyes.

    It is my firm belief that truth will set you free. That includes the exact time, place, form and event.

    I am independent towards all living beings in the universe, but I am also loyal to them all. They, as well as I, need the help of everybody, to reach the highest states.

    David Miscavige must be in so much “need of change”. Three steps above that is “help”. I will be there to help him, if he wish so, as I will be there for all I care for. And I do care for David Miscavige as I did care for Mary Sue Hubbard, even though she went to jail and had her crimes.

    The world is not black and white. Chit happens.

    I cannot see my viewpoints as a threat to anybody, much less invoking fear, as it obviously has done to you Mr. Cat Daddy.

    The truth will set you free. Nothing else.

    The Old Timer

  94. You expose the SP that is suppressing them and they in turn cognite and remove him from post. I know of no other way. Sooner or later if they want their citadels to survive they also will have to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps just as we had to. If they fail to do this they will lose their church to a madman and we will be their only recourse for sanity and help. That’s how I see it anyway.

  95. By the way Marty another thought occurred to me today:

    OSA had a really sweet gig going hacking covertly into our email accounts (I just found out they have been spying on me too).
    They knew who to go after next to try to suppress comm lines and prevent action. Wow! talk about a home game advantage!

    What a DUMB (DUMB! DUMB! DUMB!) move to blow their cover!

    (DM someone should be RPFed for this!!!)


    Wow!! Marty, Joe Howard, Thoughtful, anyone:

    Can you comment on the veracity of these “Dead Sea Scrolls” of Scn? Me thinks it is an effort to stem the tide of those leaving. Gee, now a quandary has been created. How can the Independents ever get access to these newly discovered “missing” works?

    I recall decades ago a major “roundup” of all these early years materials and thought we were told THEN, all had been located.

    Sheesh! LRH’s words have either been altered by dead transcriptionists or found suddenly sitting in basements, storage trailers or garages.

    Wondering what will be the next “why” given as reason to reissue more material?

  97. On the lighter side. CAT DADDY You now have me addicted to Within Temptation- I downloaded one of there CDs and went on a long bicycle ride listening to them. What a Diva she is.

  98. Yes. Communicate to others is key.


    Is it possible that in some cases the bypass would be unnecessary?

    What is happening with the ability to LOOK at the real situation, once that we have a lot of information sources on the internet for example?

    Why the interest of many scientologist is low regarding the state of affairs of his church?

    Why only believing the oficial story?

    There´s a lot of technical data that can gives us answers to all this and in the same time let us know who will be the firsts to stand up.

  99. Theo, Thanks for this write up. I love all this inside data. I was just public and not privy to any of the crap. DMs high crimes just keep coming out and it just shows how his robots act.

  100. The mighty Greek making THE point.

  101. Marty, you, thoughtful and friends of Scientology are the Theta behind this movement. Of course entheta attacks theta. From What I see no one mentions the “War” word. Well from a somewhat outside viewpoint (not on staff with him) Miscavige has always operated that he is at War with the environment. It appears to be his modus operandi. Of course an SP like him knows “everyone is after him”. So I dont want to invalidate DMs knowingness and just want to indicate his correctness and say everyone is after you DM. As Obama has recently said we are at War with Al Qaeda. I will momentarily hold the hat of President (President of what I do not Know) and officially declare we are at WAR with DM and his minions. I will now step down-that was alot of weight to carry even for a moment-my hair what is left is getting greyer just from holding the Presidency momentarily.

  102. ??????

    I read it twice and still don´t get it.

    Is a tale or a fantasy story?

    Do well my friend.

  103. Marty,

    Not sure whether I can post it here or if you wish to put it elsewhere…

    My apologies to all if it seems to be hijacking the thread here. I was talking to Thoughtful right after this site went down after discussion of Clear status.

    Told Thoughtful that I am very fortunate to not have any uncertainties on the subject.

    In Sept 78, I was working at WHQ (Winter Headquarters) in La Quinta, California. This was before the Int/Gold property was purchased and moved to. I had a review and what came up was “Went Clear” during an earlier NED End of Endless Int Rundown which my twin audited me on while in the RPF months ago.

    Dan K did the review and the folder went to the C/S and I waited for days. Not sure if he remembers this.

    One day at LRH’s house called Rifle, I opened the door to the Dining room for LRH as he crossed a courtyard from his Office to go eat lunch. All of a sudden, he looked at me and said: “Congratulations for going Clear!” and my jaw dropped and I was completely shocked, I don’t even remember if I acknowledged him.

    I went into the kitchen directly and got his lunch together. A Messenger immediately came in and asked me why I had that expression on my face. I told her the story about waiting the word from the C/S for days after the review.

    She came shortly afterward and told me with a twinkle in her eye: “LRH apologizes, but his lines are faster than Qual’s!” I really laughed and line charged quite a bit and was really in Cloud 9 for a while. It turned out that he had several PC folders from Qual for days and was checking them out right before the Dianetic Clear HCOB was issued, and mine was one of them.

    So, I’ve never had any doubts or reservations on my Clear status, as it came directly from the horse’s mouth! I am fortunate that there never has been any doubts or arbitraries on the subject for me.

  104. How about the security of cell phones, as a lot of us use those? Can those be hacked into as well?

  105. martyrathbun09

    Fishdaddy, I second you. Your analysis skills shine through once again.

  106. Sinar, this story as far as I’m concerned belongs anywhere you post it 🙂

    I enjoyed reading it!

  107. That was really Theta Sinar. We should have an area on the web site just for Theta comments like that. I had a few with the Old Man myself.

    I have talked with several people who told me there Clear stories- being invalidated. I tell you I couldnt believe it. It was so Anti what LRH would do. Invalidating the State of Clear is a high crime.

  108. And I “third” that Fishdaddy.

    Albert Einstein:
    Any power must be an enemy of mankind which enslaves the individual by terror and force, whether it arises under the Fascist or the Communist flag. All that is valuable in human society depends upon the opportunity for development accorded to the individual.

    statement, England, September 15, 1933

  109. Old Timer,

    When I read your first four paragraphs, I thought, “Wow, he really got the essence of Scientology and never allowed his understanding to be alloyed by all the added unnecessary BS.” I consider myself a pretty good evaluator, but even I bought into DM’s BS to at least some degree, enough to support “command intention” until I finally had the big cognition.

    But it looks like along with your grasp of the essence of Scn, you’ve also bought a big load of false data. To start with, there’s no reason to despair, and there’s certainly no need to support a raving lunatic SP. The whole bridge, delivered with good tech, is available outside the church, and with no added inapplicable suppression.

    Next, I think it would really help your ability to evaluate if you could control your imagination. DM is no good hat. That is evident 1000 times over from all the available data. If all we knew about was the evil he has wrought upon his own staff, we would know he was a first class SP. But we know much more than that. We know he is destroying the subject, altering the subject, crashing the stats, lying as a standard operating basis, and suppressing the public, if not as graphically as he suppresses his own staff.

    Yes, DM is running “an incredibly show” — except that it’s just a show, a PR extravaganza. A lie.

    You said that “Scientology will never make it . . . unless the PR around the subject is turned around.” But it’s DM’s suppressive rule that is the major source of the devastating PR. How could he be anything but an SP?

    I think you have the wrong stable datum, which is preventing you from seeing the scene as it is. The tech and its intention is the correct stable datum, not the church.

    You seem to consider it perfectly okay to handle a group’s bad PR by assigning blame to a scapegoat, whether or not that person is the real why. With that, you’ ve bought some destructive false data. Only the truth truly ever handles anything. And since we have only the best intentions toward mankind, the truth is nothing to be afraid of, even when it would expose the bad deeds of our own group.

    Cat Daddy said “. . . when PR replaces the Truth, Faith is lost.” I have to agree — what true Scientologist would not?

  110. I am not a plant, Sam. C of S is known to file legal actions and have PI’s spying on you. But I know no instance where they were convicted of hacking.

    If Anon or nobody in the orgs did it, Heather who you think did the hacking?

    An agency? But why?

  111. Fishdaddy,

    I hadn’t read your post when I wrote mine. You really nailed it. 🙂

  112. That would be my pleasure, Sam.

  113. Wow I concur with you and Fishdaddy!

    Add like to add that comparing Miscavige to Mary Sue is so wrong I can’t even find an analogy!

    Mary Sue made some errors but she saw the big picture. Miscavige on the other hand is an egotistical ,megalomanic, narcissistic, as Fishdaddy says, sociopath!

    Practically everything he has done was for his own self aggrandizement, including perverting ‘Freedom’ magazine for this purpose as well!

    The man is unbelievably vain!

    Whatever else he is.

    He belongs nowhere near any executive position in Scientology as he is actively contributing to the destruction of the subject!

    I’m sorry you can’t see this fact Old Timer.

  114. DM is no OT and no hero, Oldtimer, and I doubt you are an oldtimer or an OT. LRH would send DM packing.

  115. I wanted to show expression of power. I have searched hard and long before I took the Liberty to post it for if Marty would not have chosen to post it I would of understand for it may not be his choich of music.

    Diana a nice Freezone Lady said this:

    What a spectacular concert!

    And the singer! What power! I loved it…wow! wow!!!

    Anon…I am probably coming to England in the spring…I’d love to go to one of her concerts…


    Maybe she has to travel through to Holland for this Band is from my country. Murray I am guilty as charged for adicting you to them.

    They alsoo perform in America on occasion.

  116. Davs A,
    A “head on a spike” by public authorities might be a first step to bring “the Church” into alignment. But there needs to be an on source governing body to restore Dn & Scn to its place as an applied philosphy that assist people to improve with courses and processing by friendly
    high toned trainrd staff.
    Scn management is AWOL

  117. Excellent point, Pirate. We need to continue exposing the most suppresive things the church is doing under DM. Screwing up the tech and delivering overt products hasn’t gotten as much attention as DM’s suppressive style of managing. Continuing to expose the perversion of the tech will really presss buttons. So we can continue to look forward to magnificent displays of HE&R.

  118. Along these same lines, lunamoth, we could probably run out a lot of the 3D engram by letting people tell about the invalidation of their wins and the numerous other ways in which out-tech has been perpetrated upon them (at high expense).

  119. Old Timer,
    I’m writing this via fishdaddy’s comment for two reasons.

    First, your apparent position as DM’s apologist is mis-guided and ill-advised considering facts, which fishdaddy has pointed up. Not to mention the wealth of fact available these days.

    Second, the convuluted explanation of the withhold of the upper levels by DM is truly ‘fanciful’.

    There ARE research materials for the levels above VIII from LRH.

    Look, if it took DM over two decades to release the ACC’s when those lectures were ready to release for those two decades (see Thoughtful’s recent write-up on this on Scn-cult), imagine the counter-intention he has to releasing the materials LRH left on the levels above VIII.

    Geez Old Timer, do yourself a favor and read the Data Series, newly, if you’ve read them before.

  120. Thought provoking


    This was said more in the context of an expression.

    The church has suppressed the overall native tone level of Scientologists. The initial steps taken to inspect data, because you have been told not to do it all your life, can be a bit intimidating. Once one recognizes the data is actually truth, the fear vanishes and one can be in valence and uptone.

    Being in fear is not my native state (or anyones else’s). I love Scientology! It has been the foundation of my life for over thirty years! For a few years I couldn’t even talk about it to anyone. Finding this blog and having theta comm with other Scientologists has been absolutely exhilarating for me.

  121. Murray,
    DM’s inval of Clears and OTs is so egregiously suppressive I can hardly believe that he went this far. This is indeed a stunning revelation. It is beyond any pale. It is utterly suppressive. He did it. Oh, my, God! This is intolerable.

  122. Hi Fishdaddy,

    I always like your analysis too. You bring things to the proper perspective very concisely.


  123. Hi Sam,

    I liked your view on indicating the correct SP.

    I agree with that view. The essence of all these problems are PTSness, and other peoples non confront of the PTS situation. I see people at different stages of de-PTSing themselves.
    Handle or disconnect


  124. Mickey,

    Where did they find this stuff in Grandmas trunk in the attic??

    By the way, I just found Ron’s lost last OT folder and his last cognition was to Declare DM and he had a floating TA!


  125. “The answer is to actually live the principles you espouse( …) actually become what you say you are.”

    That gave me goosebumps. A Great Truth, beautifully said. It echoes Krishnamurti:
    “The means ARE the end.”

  126. Fair enough travelagent – thank you for clarifying that. I respect that your word is enough.

  127. You said it exactly right Alex

  128. It’s not even true!! Back in the day — my ex owned nearly all these “never before released” ACC lectures. They were on reel to reel. Most scn were not interested in reel to reel lectures and didn’t collect them. My ex did it was one of the largest collections of LRH lectures in the world. More than most orgs.

    So – for heaven’s sake — don’t believe all you read from the corporate church.

    My ex no longer has this collection … having sold it years ago. It exists somewhere though.

    And someone in London also owns a huge reel to reel collection — which would include many if not all these ACCs


  129. becomingAware

    I worked with DM for some years although not as close as some of you have. My personal experiences are in sync with what Fishdaddy states.

  130. Yes I think you have your finger on the trigger here T41.

    We nattered and nattered about Dave’s ….er….unique …….management style, but when we started discussin’ Clear, Marty’s sight got nuked.

    So obviously that is a hot button for sure.

  131. I’m “Eponymous” because I’m afraid to actually get involved in what, in the end, is not my fight. I’m here to listen, learn, and share a few thoughts, but honestly, I’m not using my name because I don’t want to get harassed. All of you who are putting yourselves at risk to do right have my sincere respect.

  132. Thought provoking

    Great win, Sinar! Love to hear stories of people with Ron.

  133. Exactly, RJ. We have to keep flattening that button, and similar ones, and be prepared for the explosions until the TA is run out of the subject. The more the explosions, the more TA we’re running off, the better!

  134. Well yes of course they are sanctimonious hypocrites from our view, but I doubt they think so.

    So much that is written about “them” is from the view that “they” did something bad to “us”.

    No, “we” did something and it ended up a cluster fuck. We being us who see the light, and them those who don’t.

    So when people write about how evil DM is or how badly the church screwed them over, it is an expression of their BPC. Fine. That is handleable. And when it is handled the problem still remains, the lack of idea scene.

    It them becomes incumbant upon us, who see the light to create that. The considerations of those still under the spell of DM notwithstanding.

    Besides postulates, what actions could we take that create the situation where “they” CAN communicate? (well they already do, with PI’s and Tommy Davis…) But how can we create the situation where they can come uptone in their comm?

    Or shall we WAIT for them to cognite? Is that a process?

    As a meta process, a group process, is there a way to bring up tone the “other side” even if they act like they dont want it.

    I have always felt that it was the responsibility of the more aware, more uptone people to help those below.

    So they have crimes. Do we hate them for it? Or create a path that they can confront, to clean themselves up.


    I suspect it would be some analog of very basic processes, objectives or such.

    What lines are there that we can use to put some basic KRC in place with them.

    Or even with the prime terminal of our problem, Miscavige.

    If the basis of any process is a command, delivered, and a response, then acknowledgement, and objectives are oriented towards familiarizing a being with their environment, how could this be applied to Miscavige, in the real current situation?

    The poor guy is so massively in overwhelm, what is safe for him? What can he communicate with?

    I don’t know, just thoughts. I doubt it would be on any line I have, and maybe it is down to communicating via lawsuits and protests, but I am not fond of that tone level.

  135. Handle or disconnect.

    I see disconnection as a non confront, a temporary solution to a PT situation.

    Really, handle is the only solution.

    It is my belief that you can not disconnect entirely from other spiritual beings, and thus never “de-PTS” yourself terminatedly. At some point you will need to handle.

    At some point on the path to “full OT” what ever that may be, perhaps a person will be able to “handle” any suppression simply by spotting it and acknowledging it to themselves. Blow by inspection so to speak.

    At a lower level, indicating the suppression to others or having it indicated, would do the trick.

    And even lower some sort of disconnection is needed.

    But it is the unconfronted that is our “case”, those moments of trauma that we momentarily lost the ability to fully experience, that haunt us still.

    I would like to think that the best solution is to experience as much as possible, and bypass as little as possible.

  136. Sam,
    My you are after my own heart aren’t you. Your list of goofball actions by DM’s brownshirts are hilarious, though tragic in the perversion of any rationality. Even balogna has more sense than this. (So much so in comparison I may not eat any more ‘Newfie steak’ and would rather see slices holding the posts that these less-than-meatheads are attempting).

    And yes, you need to be more serious, because this lightness of being is infectious and…well who knows who else will catch it!

  137. Dave A,
    I understand the idea of simply motivating on what DM has wrought. I can distinguish between ‘random, carping criticism when not borne out in fact’ and factual evaluation of outpoints.

    You ask what can be done. Well, the question is what is the problem? The problem is there is a real SP self-appointed as the head of the Scientology structure. He’s not into trying to resolve the issues, exactly as LRH points out in the above PR Series 18. What is the appropriate tool to handle an SP, when they continue to commit present time, continuous destructive acts?

    It’s the long arm of ethics/justice. Scientology ethics/justice.

    That’s the tool. When it bites, when the ethics go in, for real, then one can get a tech result and handle the overwhelmed state that this SP is in. That is, if he will even allow it which at this point is not a certainty. Some people are hard to help.

    Steel up. This cycle isn’t for the faint of heart. It isn’t for those dramatizing evil purposes either.

  138. Dave A,
    You are absolutely right, there are ample technical materials to enable a being to free themselves from the adverse effects of suppression.

    There are ample materials on how to handle SPs too. Both areas need to be addressed in one’s progress on this road to truth.

  139. Eponymous,
    I understand. It is after all a crime to be there and communicate.

    I hate to burst your bubble of anonymity and spectatorism, but you are involved. You my dear person, have put a foot on the road to truth. Can’t take it back. The only way to go is ALL the way. Welcome.

    As P Henry astutely points out on his blog, it takes a great deal of courage and tenacity to discover the truth about self. I think you have that courage.

  140. OldTimer,

    I may not have been in Scientology this life time as long as you have been. But I can only see from your comment that you are not a good example of a Scientologist since you can not see the difference between Right and Wrong, Evil and Good. It could be that you many have major MUs in your Scientology study or you are extremely PTS to DM.

    You are definitely very far off of the whole subject of scientology and what this LRH Tech is all about.
    As Jim Logan suggested, Please study the data Eval series and WAKE UP man!

  141. In the Tibetan Buddhist tradition there is a practice called:



    Meditators do this and often whole groups of meditators will practice tonglen together. Although, one need not be a meditator OR meditate to do this practice.

    In an nutshell: it’s quite the reverse of our natural inclination. You BREATHE in the pain, suffering, trauma, upset (whatever negative) of a person and breathe OUT towards that person, a feeling of health, wellbeing etc.

    It is often remarked when a someone does this for the “benefit” of someone who is sick etc. the person might recover or have a gentler transition during the death process. And it is the person doing the Tonglen for the other(s) who experiences feeling less — worry, upset, hate etc for the person they are practicing for.

    So perhaps as something quite different: if those of us so inclined on this board would take a few moments every day to breath IN the fear, terror, etc of those still stuck within scn and breathe OUT towards them the happiness, joy and freedom you now feel — perhaps some space would open up around those still stuck AND they might start to see.

    You cannot see anything when your vision is smack up against the object. You need SOME distance/space.

    More importantly, those who frequent this board might not inadvertently start to become hardened and possibly bitter against those who were once their group.


  142. Man is basically good, so is David Miscavige, and so is Marty Rathbun.

    Marty Rathbun committed a lot of overts, and is now making amends. That I totally respect, and believe me, I respect that more than I respect DM for continuing doing wkatever he is doing. The respect here is very low for the moment.

    And don’t tell me that Marty did what he did because he was PTS to DM. Marty doesn’t seem to be the PTS type to me. He did what he did because he believed it to be the right thing to do in the moment. Sorry for the evaluation Marty.

    If David Miscavige has broken the law, then please let the law handle that. Press charges for Gods sake, and get it ower with. If he is guilty he will go to jail. That’s that.

    And I will still claim my right to help the poor fellow if it goes that far, and if he wants my help, which is pretty doubtfull.

    Even David Miscavige can reform. Marty did. And the Church can for sure.


  143. Eponymous,

    I’m not using my name either, for the same reason. But I think it’s probably only church members (or ones who have been) who are likely to get harassed. While I certainly understand your not wanting to use your name, I would be surprised if anyone would harass you if you were to make yourself known. For those of us who are Scientologists, it’s another story.

  144. Theo Sismanides

    ha ha thanks winsmexico! THE point being Jim Logan beating the drum now as we move over the ramparts!!! OLE !!!! This is a BIG Fiesta now!

  145. Old Timer,
    Fair enough. Thanks for the further info on your viewpoint.

  146. Marty, these illegal actions shows DM’s desperation. Desperation: the act or fact of despairing. Despair: loss of hope. To lose, give up or be without hope. (Random House).

  147. G. Schutte
    It’s possible to hack into your voicemail but if you choose a good password, you should be OK. Don’t go with your birth date etc, or anything else that can be guessed. Choose a random password that is not connected to any private information.

  148. Carl Sagan:

    One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we’ve been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. The bamboozle has captured us. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back.

  149. Eponymous,

    I understand. A rose by any other name smells as sweet;)

    Besides, pen names and Net names serve other purposes than the fear of harassment. They can protect loved ones, or one’s other duties, general privacy.

    The desire to avoid being harassed is not only fear-driven but can be the best way to avoid a battle but win the war.

    Your desire to know and understand is fighting the battle. Love of life, human rights, truth, a better world and actions to those ends fight the battle.

    Thank you for being here.
    Thank you for your interest.

  150. Thanks.

    Totally duplicated.

    Let´s carry on with this theta comm.

  151. Yea.

    Jim Logan rules!

  152. Wow now they are reduced to chines schooling movie quotes.
    That is the quote that Samuel Jackson so eloquently delivers in “Pulp Fiction”.

    I guess it is ok to chinese school that since John Travolta is in that movie.
    What’s next the crew at CCI chinese schooling-

  153. yourfriendtoo

    Do you mean DM stated there is no Past Life clears??? WOW!! I wondered why I was called near 2004, to do a little program to correct a little point….
    Didn’t LRH declared SP one ED in the earlys 60’s or end of 50’s because he denied PLs??? How can somebody run an incident if you can’t run PL’s? Can you get to the basic?
    And per my knowledge I am a past life clear. I have no doubts or any reservation on my state of clear, as I have no doubts on being an OT in this life.

  154. Theo Sismanides

    In celebration of a major win in Greece, today. Dedicated to all of us by a true freedom fighter from Greece I just got it from him/her (ha ha) !!!!!

  155. Well, the charlaton hardly ever GIVES it back, that’s for sure.

    As far as never GETTING it back, history is full of examples that it YOU WILL GET IT BACK if you don’t stop trying. Barrack Obama is not a slave in the deep south, Martin Luther King’s children helped elect him president of the United States.

    Failure is when you just stop trying. In which case, who’s fault is it if you don’t get your own freedom back?

  156. Its the power given and the evidence rejected that are the componants that fit the situation that is going on in the Church of David.In this case we have to keep pointing at the charlatan from the outside untill all follow the line of our finger and really LOOK close at COB.

  157. Just attempted to visit Scientology-cult but all I got was a comm about data base error. Then I tried Rediscover Scn and the same. Anyone have any data about this?

  158. Old Auditor’s contrarian spirit reminds me of an Old Timer I met years ago in a NOTs lounge who lived on welfare in a trailer somewhere.

    He’d save up his checks and show up for sessions every now and again because, I was pretty sure, he needed help in recalling where he buried the loot after robbing a bank in Arizona in the mid 19th Century.

    He was hardly accepted by the Scientology community yet the old buzzard had every right to be there, squeezing the cans like the rest of us.

    OA’s point is that there are no clean hands in this mess, and in that he’s right.

    You can’t be PTS if you recognize with whom you are dealing and have not compromised your integrity.

    This is the real trick of the SP, to get you to compromise yourself.

    The first time you saw a unit of RPFers running in unison in sad silence did you not instinctively know that they needed your help?

    But you did not give it. Neither did I, and so our integrity become compromised.

    Slowly other acceptable truths justified actions we knew were not kosher. This is the woof and warp of the SP. The gradient scale of succumb.

    Ethics presence is what’s now needed. Hold your space and don’t let your anchor points be driven inward.

    Fight the good fight with clean hands and you can’t lose.

  159. “Unreality is the result of invalidation by force. Hit a being hard enough, ARC break him hard enough and everything goes unreal.

    “As knowingness returns, that unreality fades away and leaves him knowing more and more about who he is, where he is and why.”

    – LRH on the Road to OT

    This is the path on which we journey.

  160. Such wisdom.

  161. Thought provoking

    I think you meant Old Timer on your post, not Old Auditor, correct?

  162. Thought provoking

    I just tried both sites and they came up fine for me.

  163. I just experienced the same thing.

  164. Mickey, “Lost” is a bunch of hogwash. It’s a PR spin in the upgrade and rerelease of these lectures. If you were to compare the list of lectures given at the back of What Is Scientology? from 1992 to the ACCs re-released at New Years you’d find all the same lectures. These things have been lying around on reel to reel take for decades. Make no mistake, the new package is a serious upgrade with better glossaries and transcripts and the sound quality is probably a lot better. A lot of work has gone into sound restoration over the years by Russ Greilich, Nick Cancilla & Co. in the Audio Dept at Gold. The Dictionary Project in R Comps has done much better glossaries. Also, some of these ACCs were released already on cassettes years ago. So, the angle of “lost tech” is better stated “unavailable” because these lectures weren’t available in many languages and probably are now, unless the release was English-only. It’s a shame that DM has to degrade the announcement by parsing words for some reason known best only to himself when the release, as I’ve stated above, is actually a tremendous accomplishment and should be validated simply for what it is. Another example of “perfect being the enemy of the good.”

  165. Old Timer,

    By that logic, Osama Bin Laden is basically good too. He is, of course, but that fact has nothing to do with evaluation of isnesses and with justice. Marty has proven himself to be theta, sane, and working for the good of the group and mankind many times over. DM has only proven that he’s a monumental SP. He should be treated like any monumental SP unless and until he proves himself to be otherwise (which in my book will require good acts of comparable magnitude to his suppressive acts).

  166. Huck,
    The above quote is EXACTLY what I experienced in this life as a Scientologist and Sea Org member. The toughest one was the most rewarding. I’m more today than I’ve ever been. That quote is perfect. Thank you!

  167. WH,

    Very cool. Now that’s a theta approach to averting a games condition, but without being a theetie weetie one. 🙂

  168. Huck

    My “wisdom comment” was intended for the comm regarding going PTS when you compromise your integrity.

    My command of the blogosphere leaves s/g to be desired.

  169. Yes, Thought, I did mean Old Timer though he’s not – at least I don’t think he is – the Old Timer who was trying to remember where he left the loot in Arizona.

    Whilst remembering this, it occurred to me that the Old Man was busily amassing funds when he knew his body’s lifespan was nearing its end. I wonder what he was planning?

    Also, I neglected to mention what a beautifully theta story Sinar told about attesting to Clear.

  170. Huck,

    “Fight the good fight with clean hands and you can’t lose” is certainly the rigtht spirit. But the issue really isn’t whether we all have spotless hands, as I’m sure we all know we don’t. All of us who ever supported DM in his destructive acts, tacitly or otherwise, contributed something to the wrong side of the ledger.

    The issue is what to do about a raving SP at the head of the church, pretending to run it in the interest of mankind. The first thing to do about it is to call a spade a spade, and not a pussy cat who has made a few mistakes.

    It’s also not a a matter of PTSness, as most of us on this side of the fence are no longer PTS. It’s a matter of how to keep all dynamics moving on up a little (or a lot) higher.

    LRH wasn’t very easy on SP’s, you know.

  171. The fact is pretty much everything that Miscavige has “released” so far had always been available. Saint Hill had a full collection of these early lectures on Ampex Reels back in the ’60’s then much of this collection was transfered to the Apollo.

    Their main objective though was to make the lectures that consist of the Levels and SHSBC available to orgs and SHs, so they could train auditors. An activity it seems most “Scientology” Organizations have all but forgotten.

    That said there were many difference Congresses and ACCs available for public tape plays, that is until an RTC mission scooped them all up in the late ’80’s!

    I was auditing at AOLA and not only did they take the lectures but they went through all PC folders that had ever been Programed by the Ol’ man and pulled them from the folders, leaving a photocopy in its place. I mean these cats were thorough!

    They absconded not only with AOs collection but all PAC Orgs, Franchise and Field Auditor collections, then they introduced the “Standard Tech Cassette Deck” and got rid of all the Reel to Reels in the course rooms which was in ’91 when Miscavige “released” the basics the first time.

    So now twenty years later he’s claiming that this technology was somehow “lost” and had never been “released” before!

    Oh pauleeeeze!!!!!

  172. Yes if you put PTS and SP terms aside one can still look and see who is running the show.

  173. Huckleberry

    Sorry to say, but I am not looking for loot from some bankrobbery.

    It’s much worse. I am looking for my invisible spacecraft that was left behind me 6000 years ago in Argentina. I was attacked by savages and killed. When I woke up next lifetime I couldn’t find the damn thing. Can anybody help?

    Huckleberry, you are so damned right about my intentions, I feel you are the first to understand me fully at this blog.

    If I just left the Church and said “Davey’s an SP” I would get accepted here.

    But I don’t want to, I have a group, and I worked 35 years to make it, and it has never done me anything bad, why the hell should I leave?

    Blame, shame, regret and anger is all sooooooo lowtoned.

    Greatness is to love ones fellows despite all reasons not to, and it is much higher toned.

    And I just love David Miscavige for all the good he did. He did a lot of chit too, and therefore he should go, but I am not the only one to decide, some agreement from the universe has to step in too.

    Reread my posts. For those who simply don’t get it I will repeat my message:

    I am staying in my Church.

    I am communicating to proper terminals, that I have the opinion that David Miscavige should step down.

    I am on strike. I have stopped supporting my Church finansially and morally, untill this situation is resolved.

    I am all my 8 dynamics. Thereby I am the Church either I am in or out. I have to take responsibility for all my dynamics. How the hell can I take responsibility if I blow an area? It is a lot different for those who were kicked out, and who were injust treated. I sort of envy them, because they have no choice but doing what they are doing.

    I really don’t see the difficulty in understanding my viewpoints, but obviously a lot does.

    In very short. I want a better management, and I want reform. Isn’t that what we all want?

    And I can utter my opinion to proper terminals without getting harrassed or SP declared.

    At least somebody should get the cognition that it’s not ALL THAT BAD.

    Times are a-changin’. Bob Dylan.

    Come gather ’round people
    Wherever you roam
    And admit that the waters
    Around you have grown
    And accept it that soon
    You’ll be drenched to the bone.
    If your time to you
    Is worth savin’
    Then you better start swimmin’
    Or you’ll sink like a stone
    For the times they are a-changin’.

    Come writers and critics
    Who prophesize with your pen
    And keep your eyes wide
    The chance won’t come again
    And don’t speak too soon
    For the wheel’s still in spin
    And there’s no tellin’ who
    That it’s namin’.
    For the loser now
    Will be later to win
    For the times they are a-changin’.

    Come senators, congressmen
    Please heed the call
    Don’t stand in the doorway
    Don’t block up the hall
    For he that gets hurt
    Will be he who has stalled
    There’s a battle outside
    And it is ragin’.
    It’ll soon shake your windows
    And rattle your walls
    For the times they are a-changin’.

    Come mothers and fathers
    Throughout the land
    And don’t criticize
    What you can’t understand
    Your sons and your daughters
    Are beyond your command
    Your old road is
    Rapidly agin’.
    Please get out of the new one
    If you can’t lend your hand
    For the times they are a-changin’.

    The line it is drawn
    The curse it is cast
    The slow one now
    Will later be fast
    As the present now
    Will later be past
    The order is
    Rapidly fadin’.
    And the first one now
    Will later be last
    For the times they are a-changin’.

    Enjoy your life, I am so happy for the time being, because I know that the future will bring us so much joy and fun. Wellcome to 2010.

    Old Timer

  174. Thanks for checking Thought provoking and Andy. About an hour after posting I tried again and this time no problem. Just one of those unaswered anomalies. Whenever and if ever I have any problem with getting on an independents site I immediately do a “grand tour” (my collection of independent sites in favorites) to do an integrity check. When I couldn’t access Scn-cult and Rediscover Scn last night that’s what I did and all was well.

    Note: I’ve posted a new blog:

  175. Old Timer,
    As far as loving Dave goes, well, let me put it this way; I’ve done the FPRD on all 8 dynamics, given and received. I’ve done various tailor-mades too, including one on art which was nice since I play drums. I have had life changing gains in Scientology, one of which is the ability to distinguish a valence, a false identity, a mocked up identity. The nature of a being means there may be some color added to the basic goodness.

    In the case, technically, of an SP, that color is of a polarity such that it can stick one to it by resisting what we call ‘evil’. So, I approach this valence in a sort of ‘null’. Hate doesn’t fly, but I’m not be a lovin’ neither.

    In the really bad ones, there is some good. Just as in really good ones, there is some bad. You need two to get any flow in this universe.

    When it comes right down the basic being, the nature of theta is such that I can’t imagine not having a fundamental love for the character, its ethos being what it is, all that is positive.

    It is my postulate that some day we’ll see that ethos that is being that mocks up Dave Miscavige and all the rest that goes with that valence.

    In the meantime, you’re right, he’s gotta go from that post he made up.

    I’ve made my position very clear over the past year or two of writing on the interweb. It is summed up by LRH in the estate planning expressed in the Charter for CST: any Church of Scientology, including RTC and CST, is fine by me, as long as it is espousing and applying Scientology. The twain are not necessarily ‘coterminal’ as LRH points out in the mentioned Charter. It is my intention to see that they remain as close as possible. It is also my intention to distinguish the two, always, since they aren’t the same.

    Yes, here’s to a flourishing and prospering new day.

  176. T41, my point is not about actions past; we can’t change those.

    If you have clean hands now, see what is there for what it is, see those around you for who they are, and do the right thing, no matter how dangerous, and you can’t lose. You may not necessarily win but you could never lose.

    Secondly, I don’t share Old Timer’s viewpoint on Miscavige, whom I knew from the very first time I met him was bad news. I could see the madness in his eyes but then he slapped me on the back, made a joke and I laughed along because he was, after all, COB and every day after that I denied my knowingness and justified the insanity to myself in myriad ways.

    But Old Timer has a different viewpoint; I’m acknowledging that he does have that right, not that I agree.

  177. Old Timer:

    You sound like a Holy Christianer. May God bless you.


  178. Old Timer,
    Add to para 5 in my comment ‘the’ in the phrase ‘that is the being that mocks up Dave’.

  179. JLo, I had such a huge blow out when I read that reference. There’s another thought in Road to OT which really impinged, too, which was – paraphrasing – people survive all kinds of high-force incidents, like car accidents, and remember who they are, so can you imagine how much force needs to be smashed into a being to get them to forget everything?

    I see the dwindling spiral as playing the same game, over and over, though in faster, shorter sequences and with ever growing losses.

    It is, indeed, a tough universe where only the Tiger’s survive.

  180. They are a hardy breed back East.

  181. Thought provoking

    “Blame, shame, regret and anger is all sooooooo lowtoned.

    Greatness is to love ones fellows despite all reasons not to, and it is much higher toned.”

    I think you’ll find that there is no disagreement in this concept with the majority of posters but at the same time you need to consider that some people have BPC on the subject or personal experience that shows that DM is NOT a great guy. What you are seeing is a spade being called a spade. The 14 year old who carjacks you at gunpoint isn’t a poor confused little boy – he’s a criminal! So is DM, read what LRH says about handling criminals.

    “How the hell can I take responsibility if I blow an area? It is a lot different for those who were kicked out, and who were injust treated. I sort of envy them, because they have no choice but doing what they are doing.”

    Good luck in handling things through the church. Others before you have tried, see posted KRs. The biggest barrier to handling DM is Dm himself. You cannot force case change, it has to be self determined and DM is no where near ready to handle his case. As far him stepping down, it will never happen. See the Chart of Human Eval.

    I left the church several years ago and it had nothing to do with the reports on DM, I was clueless about him at that time. It was only after hearing from very credible non Scientology sources that there was a big problem in top management that I looked at the SP Times articles so that I could dead agent the reports that I had gotten. But, the evidence was overwhelming, there really was a problem. My speaking out has been one of principle. This was my group, how was I ever going to feel good about my progress up the bridge while others sufferd. Simply, I couldn’t so I made the choice to discontinue my fully support and to do everything I could to help those who could not help themselves.

    “At least somebody should get the cognition that it’s not ALL THAT BAD.”

    If you had actually done a full investigation of what has been going on over the last 30 years, you would not say this…unless you had an ethics blind spot. Or, unless you we’re very reasonable. My only loyalty is to LRH and preserving the tech of Scientology as HE intended.

  182. Glad to have been of service, luna.

    I cognited long ago on the insidiousness of the SP and the mechanism they use. In the beginning they masquerade as friends, working very hard to earn your trust so they can set you up. When the moment is right, they have you do something which you know is counter-survival. But it’s usually a small infraction so you do it because you feel that you would let them down and they are counting on you, etc etc.

    Every day after that is a slow decomposition of your ethics presence. It doesn’t happen all at once; PTSness is a gradient.

    Their cleverness lies in the fact that they are quite convinced that everyone around them’s an Indian and they’re the only cowboy so for them it’s a matter of survival.

    They must be very good actors and very convincing and very deceitful to avoid suspicion and they typically are.

    Some are better than others but they all play their game in precisely the same way.

    The point is, though, that all of this cleverness counts for nada if you don’t allow them to compromise your integrity. They can’t take what’s not given by you. So, in the end, don’t fear the SP; know their little game and laugh when they attempt to lure you into their tangled web.

  183. I too am one of those people. It’s actually been better than I had expected. I wasn’t quite ready to blow my cover but just the confronting of this possibility seems to be giving me case gain.

    I may just route myself to ethics yet and interview the I&R.

  184. OT, funny you should say Argentina, as I have quite a bit of track down there, too. I had such an affinity for B.A. despite never having been there this lifetime and after half-a-dozen trips (all pulled in) I love it even more. Maybe I hid your ship because I didn’t want to leave?

    Anyway, my friend, I understand your unwillingness to desert the group you’ve been part of for 35 years. I, too, think of them as my group. My issue, though, is that it’s being run by a madman who isn’t getting any saner.

    Nothing wrong with you making this known from within the Church. I’d be interested in hearing how your communications on COB are being received?

    One last thing, it’s “not all that bad” because of the goodness of the many beings within Scientology.

  185. Old Timer,

    Thank you for declaring your position with such clarity! I admire your loyalty and your willingness to disagree, and that you will not alloy your own affinities within the church in order to have more affinity on this forum.

    You and disagree on only one point, I think, and that is I believe that in dm we have truly met a genuine, dyed-in-the-wool suppressive.

    All my training in Scienotology tells me this: my friends of 30 years, and many other fine people within the church, are sliding into a world of pain by way of their association with and failure to spot an SP in whom they are investing terrific power.

    By numerous accounts, the justice system and the network of lines and terminals that LRH policy established within the organization are breaking down under the strain of a suppressive
    ruler. This happens in an organization, to some degree, under normal circumstances, but is countered by the constant re-creation of the organization by the properly functioning group.

    The church as a group can no longer function properly. What little functioning is still occurring is degrading more and more quickly as more policy is altered, ignored or violated, as more of the highly trained admin and tech terminals are expelled or leave.

    The organization, like a human body, has lost its ability to heal itself, and like a cancer the accumulated damage is now impairing it’s ability to function, and death is imminent without immediate surgery. The suppressive
    must be excised to give the organization a fighting chance, but at his point I don’t know if even that would guaranty survival of “the patient.”

    I have very good certainty on the tech of suppression, having applied it very successfully on many occasions. In my opinion, the patient (the group still inside the church) has not been convinced of the urgency of the operation, so to speak. The patient is likely to die before the surgery can save it.

    What you find on this site and a few others (Leaving Scientology, Scientology-cult, Rediscover Scienotology) is essentially the thetan leaving the body, and cogniting that it can operate on a much higher level, with greater freedom, closer to native state, without the encumbrances of the body.

    You may certainly stay with the body and try to heal it from inside, but the attention or this blog is clearly on healing the spirit.

  186. Re: Old Timer
    I do support his right to his opinions.
    I doubt that DM joined the SO with the sole intention of taking over and making all the changes he has. We allowed his ethics to go unchecked and share our own responsibility in this. The current scene is right out of ‘Ethics, Justice and the Dynamics’ where a being seeks to do himself in in an effort to bring ethics in on himself. What is currently happening in the courts, on TV and the web is justice.

    This blog, among others and reaching out are working on making up the damage on our end but I feel we still have more to do.

    There are still so many in the church that need help to see past the PR. Ethics are pretty heavy in the orgs once again and many are too afraid to look.

    Change is needed as we all agree, but the change from the inside may be best. I ask questions and hear others asking other questions, which has surprised me. There is a growing awareness that something is not quite right. This includes staff who by now must be incredibly frustrated by the releases, changes and demands from DM.

    There is still value in the organization and it may take a quiet coup-people asking questions, talking and withdrawing their support that may allow new management to recover that legacy that was so meaningfully left to us.

    Loyal to LRH.

  187. “Blame, shame, regret and anger is all sooooooo lowtoned.”

    DM blames and is blamed
    DM shames and is shamed
    DM regrets nothing but makes you regret
    DM angers and is angered

    This makes us LOOK at regret closer. I can not see regret in DM. If he had regret his actions would support that. They do not.

    Remorse for evil or un-etchical deeds wich go against life and “livingness” as you will is key.

    I am not talking about false remores. The remorse that you have when you get caught or are stopped in your tracks and kow when your game is over.

    I am talking about the remorse or regret you FEEL when you KNOW you did another living being harm or injustice.

    “Greatness is to love ones fellows despite all reasons not to, and it is much higher toned.”

    I agree but DM is NO fellow of mine. I see everybodies DM is a paranoid psychopath and raise you a hypocryt.

    Hannah Arendt:

    What makes it so plausible to assume that hypocrisy is the vice of vices is that integrity can indeed exist under the cover of all other vices except this one. Only crime and the criminal, it is true, confront us with the perplexity of radical evil; but only the hypocrite is really rotten to the core.

    “And I just love David Miscavige for all the good he did.”

    Turned your belief-system into a Dog and Pony show with him as Showmaster and destroyed many reputations, childhoods, lives, families and livelyhoods(Bad Karma) in the process.

    “He did a lot of chit too, and therefore he should go, but I am not the only one to decide, some agreement from the universe has to step in too.”

    The Universe be damned, I am going after his ass I want him to awnser for the Human Right abuses purpetrated under HIS leadership.

    Oh and the little Issue of poluting the enviroment: The Dutch Anilles: In this case Bonaire

    “At least somebody should get the cognition that it’s not ALL THAT BAD.”

    Slave labor, Human traficking, coerced abortions, 14 hour workdays, disconnection.

    In very short. I want a better management, and I want reform. Isn’t that what we all want?

    A compleet Overheal is what is needed. Go along with dylan. Get rid of military and covert branches. Give your belief-system back to the public Scientoligists and make it a Democracy in wich each vote count or each “Thetan”counts if you will.

    I almost suspect you are a musician yourself.

    If you get DMs hands of the helm it will not be a day to earlty.

    with regards, CD

  188. Ever considered this: The Ethic are out of Ethics.

    When that happens you have Cruelty.

  189. Huck,

    Got it. We all denied our own knowingness to one extent or another. But I think most of us participating in this blog do see things for what they are now. Which means that, as you said, we can’t lose . That is, as long as we see what we see and don’t invalidate our knowingness.

  190. BC Boy,

    DM understood long ago that power is assumed. You don’t wait for someone to say you are in charge, you say you are and then get rid of anyone who opposes you. Hence, the basic on the chain is the illegtimacy of his assuming power. From there, he could have done the right thing but he instead chose to consolidate his power; power is the end game, not “Clearing the Planet”. This is why I hold little hope for a quiet coup from the inside.

  191. Well I always had a thing for old-timers and people with gray hair, (not that you have gray-hair Old Timer.)

    Listen, with the excellent comments from fishdaddy and others, lets face it.

    You got it right;
    “I have never for one second considered myself being anything else than independent.”

    Well dam, me too. But, by definition, we are a gung-ho group. If you ever seen one.

    And David Mr. Miscavage isn’t taking Scientology as his personal monopoly, no more.

    It was never his. It’s OURS.

    This guy failed so incredibly, it is indescribable.

    You have a great heart. From it, speak the truth.

    Knock-off all the crap. This is time.

    Take a deep moment and peaceful time to reflect on all your experiences; dig in those books. note your LRH quotes. Take the necessary time…

    Exactly how did LRH see the future??


    Old Timer, its going to make you young again.

  192. “Here then is the cycle of a group receiving an engram…. The emergency status of the situation has to do with compressed-time”

    Big wow. Isn’t this…DM’s astute MO??

  193. I am still counting on that quiet coup.

    The Scientology Orgboard has a department 3, inspections and reports, perception. As I see the universe that department momentarily is outsourced to the land of Texas. When time is right it will go back to its proper place.

    Int. management., where it belongs.

    But for the time being Texas will do.

    Old Timer

  194. Old Timer,
    Good observation. I’ll add to it that we each have a Dept 3, Perception. The universe is us.

  195. Hi Huckleberry,

    I agree with what you say.

    I don’t expect it to occur without help from the outside. This site is fantastic and seems to resonate to all who read it.

    Getting people to at least look is the first step and start asking questions. Attacking DM while give him more reason to circle the wagons and raise more money.

    My own spouse stated that there are problems on the inside and my spouse is totally behind DM.

    If ever there was sign of life in a dead body-that was it for me.

  196. Re: quiet coup. It’s a matter of letting them know there’s enough momentum on the outside as a fallback.

  197. I started to question the CO$ when I was sitting in the course room in the Chicago Org. I looked around at an almost empty room in a building that was falling apart. I thought to myself if an OT can postulate & make them stick, why isn’t anyone making this building nicer and this roomful. Why are there not orgs all over and more public and more exceptance of Scientology. When I would pose these questions I would just get the answer “It’s the SP”. I was always confussed, but now I understand. It was the SP, COB, DM. One in the same. Right under all those little lambs noses. With really OT’s on the outside I believe that we independents can really make this all go right.

  198. This post prompted me to email you. I suppose as a measure of support and as a protest. Freedom of speech is very important to me and I’ve agreed with the suppression for too long. Now I am disagreeing with it and I do feel freer. Thank you Marty.

  199. You are doing a truly great job, Marty. You are having an effect, however right now you are still basically in the phase of placing seeds. When harvest time comes, and it will come, the Conman of the Board and his robots might never be the same again 🙂

    And you will be aware that such and similar “treatments” of perceived enemies have been going on for decades. Many of these “enemies” had been mishandled by the “church” one way or another ( disconnection, severe out tech, gross injustices, fair game etc. ). Those guys were actually whistleblowers, and some of them did “Protest PR” per the LRH reference on it.

    You wrote : “During my tenure in the church there was one standard we nearly always adhered to”.

    The key word being “nearly always”. That’s what they still are doing ! Just remember that they had been throwing just eggs at you. They have been far more rough to some other opponents ! And you will not see all the man hours and huge $$$ bundles devoted to the “crusade” against you. Most of their actions will be not far out of the frame of law, no matter how troublesome they are.

    Lots of postulates of lots of good people are with you !

    Han Solo

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